Obama sets a food stamp record...AGAIN.

[longhornfan1234]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/12/09/food-stamp-use-reaches-another-high-in-september-47-7-million-participants/

:facepalm



What's a shame is the shit the obese slobs that are a large part of food stamp nation are allowed to buy... frozen pizza, frozen nuggets, and cases of Big Red.

[nathanjizzle]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/12/09/food-stamp-use-reaches-another-high-in-september-47-7-million-participants/

:facepalm



What's a shame is the shit the obese slobs that are a large part of food stamp nation are allowed to buy... frozen pizza, frozen nuggets, and cases of Big Red.

your quite judgmental arnt you? its nice that the government can help those in a bad position, yes some abuse it, but most need it. Keep people that cant support themselves going out and committing crimes in your neighborhood right?

Texas, California, and Florida were the states with the most recipients,

[bagelred]

:facepalm Doesn't Obama know we need this money for wars? :facepalm

[Loneshot]

Did you know you can't receive them if you are a student? I find that to be complete BS as if anyone needs them, it would be student struggling to make something better of themselves. Instead they have to choose between food and education.

[SCdac]

Regardless of any kind of blame game or fault, this statistic is troubling...

1970's: 1 out of 50 on food stamps

Now: 1 out of 6.5 on food stamps

:(

[longhornfan1234]

your quite judgmental arnt you? its nice that the government can help those in a bad position, yes some abuse it, but most need it. Keep people that cant support themselves going out and committing crimes in your neighborhood right?

Texas, California, and Florida were the states with the most recipients,
I have no issue with helping people who need help...and want to help themselves. I think the idea of welfare, in of itself though, is awful. There should be job skills training, interviewing, and assistance in finding employment. Food stamps should provide you basic needs such as milk, different meats, breads, vegetables, fruits and rice. Nothing less.

[Kobe 4 The Win]

It's Bush's fault just like everything else. :D

[FatComputerNerd]

It's Bush's fault just like everything else. :D

sarcasm detected and approved

[Nanners]

I have no issue with helping people who need help...and want to help themselves. I think the idea of welfare, in of itself though, is awful. There should be job skills training, interviewing, and assistance in finding employment. Food stamps should provide you basic needs such as milk, different meats, breads, vegetables, fruits and rice. Nothing less.


smh at morons like this guy acting like every food stamp recipient is some unemployed obese slob.

truth is, the vast majority of food stamp recipients work shitty minimum wage jobs. the single largest segment of food stamp recipients is not unemployed people, but WALMART EMPLOYEES. also, children make up an enormous segment of people on food assistance.

you are a fvcking idiot

[MMM]

hmm @ blaming the government. There are many reasons why America and other industrial nations are in the situations they are in. Start looking at some of the daily poor decisions you make and work the way up. Yes the Government has contributed to the problem that we find our selves in but overall it is our collective flaws that have lead us down this path. Whether it is "greedy bankers" or "lazy welfare recipients" or just down right stupidity of the majority of the population.

[longhornfan1234]

smh at morons like this guy acting like every food stamp recipient is some unemployed obese slob.

truth is, the vast majority of food stamp recipients work shitty minimum wage jobs. the single largest segment of food stamp recipients is not unemployed people, but WALMART EMPLOYEES. also, children make up an enormous segment of people on food assistance.

you are a fvcking idiot

Children cannot get food stamps, their parents have to get it.

Please show the resource you used for the Wal-Mart reference.

No, not all food stamp recipients are bums, but many are.

[boozehound]

Children cannot get food stamps, their parents have to get it.

Please show the resource you used for the Wal-Mart reference.

No, not all food stamp recipients are bums, but many are.
Its well documented that walmart encourages their employees to get on public assistance, right down to corporate memos in the break room.

Also, I was on food stamps once. As a graduate student with a wife and small child, it was of invaluable help at that time of my life. Honestly, how old are you? You seem to have a very sheltered worldview and limited life experience.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Feeding hungry people. What an asshole.

[longhornfan1234]

Its well documented that walmart encourages their employees to get on public assistance, right down to corporate memos in the break room.

Also, I was on food stamps once. As a graduate student with a wife and small child, it was of invaluable help at that time of my life. Honestly, how old are you? You seem to have a very sheltered worldview and limited life experience.

That's not what he said, though. I'm 22.

[DukeDelonte13]

would you rather live in a country that has welfare and social programs or a country that has slum villages with huge populations? I love the belief that if you take away welfare poor people will magically disappear or they will magically find work.

[longhornfan1234]

would you rather live in a country that has welfare and social programs or a country that has slum villages with huge populations? I love the belief that if you take away welfare poor people will magically disappear or they will magically find work.

LOL, churches and private charities would cover the loss of welfare.

[Loneshot]

LOL, churches and private charities would cover the lost of welfare.
:biggums:

[boozehound]

That's not what he said, though. I'm 22.
well, if you want the numbers, just type how many walmart employees receive foodstamps into google. and you will find that walmart employees are the largest group on healthcare assistance and foodstamps in every state with available data.

So, we let these companies operate by paying their employees so little that they all qualify for federal assistance (effectively subsidizing walmarts labor costs) and you have the audacity to call those on assistance the leeches?

SMFH at you. Still planning on staying on your parent's health insurance until age 26 while lambasting the affordable care act? Typical republican hypocrite. The reddest states have the highest federal $ coming back to them and the largest % of citizens on public assistance. Now, the curb federal spending governors of those states are scared shitless that the fiscal cliff will cause them to lose billions in funding. what kind of funding? oh yeah, federal funding.

[Real Men Wear Green]

LOL, churches and private charities would cover the lost of welfare.
And I'm sure you've seen studies and statistics that show churches hand out all of this money to feed the hungry. There's nothing funny about your ignorance. Just admit that you don't care about the less fortunate. Lot's of people are callous, don't worry, you aren't alone.

[DukeDelonte13]

LOL, churches and private charities would cover the loss of welfare.



:oldlol: ahh the mind of a child. So full of wonder and hope.

[Math2]

:oldlol: ahh the mind of a child. So full of wonder and hope.

Instead of having people choose to give to the poor, Democrats think they should force them too. The mind of a child, hopes that that can be sustained.

[MMM]

Instead of having people choose to give to the poor, Democrats think they should force them too. The mind of a child, hopes that that can be sustained.

Republicans believe in "forcing people to give to other" as well.

[Derka]

Its well documented that walmart encourages their employees to get on public assistance, right down to corporate memos in the break room.

Also, I was on food stamps once. As a graduate student with a wife and small child, it was of invaluable help at that time of my life. Honestly, how old are you? You seem to have a very sheltered worldview and limited life experience.

If by "well documented" you mean "made up by some union person or anti-corporate dickhole with an agenda", I'll believe it. Source this with a photo of a corporate memo in a break room saying this. Eight years I've spent in and out of many different Walmart stores and such a foolish thing has NEVER been on a break room wall in the dozens of stores I've spent time in.

[IcanzIIravor]

If by "well documented" you mean "made up by some union person or anti-corporate dickhole with an agenda", I'll believe it. Source this with a photo of a corporate memo in a break room saying this. Eight years I've spent in and out of many different Walmart stores and such a foolish thing has NEVER been on a break room wall in the dozens of stores I've spent time in.

Politifact take on this (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/dec/06/alan-grayson/alan-grayson-says-more-walmart-employees-medicaid-/)

I didn't see anything about corporate memo's encouraging this and didn't bother to dig for it.

[MMM]

Instead of having people choose to give to the poor, Democrats think they should force them too. The mind of a child, hopes that that can be sustained.

On sustainability it shocks me that any American can make a point about what can be sustained. The entire American economy is built on unsustainable consumption.

[Derka]

Politifact take on this (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/dec/06/alan-grayson/alan-grayson-says-more-walmart-employees-medicaid-/)

I didn't see anything about corporate memo's encouraging this and didn't bother to dig for it.

That part sounds like complete shit to me.

Walmart's no angel, but they're certainly not the devil that organized labor and the media like to make them out to be. Labor's interest in Walmart has exactly squat to do with helping associates and everything to do with one thing only: 1.4 million people in the US forking up union dues; people who are already underpaid and won't be guaranteed any substantial pay raise due to any union effort.

[Nanners]

On sustainability it shocks me that any American can make a point about what can be sustained. The entire American economy is built on unsustainable consumption.

this guy right here.... i like this guy

[Droid101]

Regardless of any kind of blame game or fault, this statistic is troubling...

1970's: 1 out of 50 on food stamps

Now: 1 out of 6.5 on food stamps

:(
So... before "Trickle Down" economics were implemented in the early 80's, everyone was better off?

http://bearsharkaxe.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/you-dont-say.jpg

[DukeDelonte13]

That part sounds like complete shit to me.

Walmart's no angel, but they're certainly not the devil that organized labor and the media like to make them out to be. Labor's interest in Walmart has exactly squat to do with helping associates and everything to do with one thing only: 1.4 million people in the US forking up union dues; people who are already underpaid and won't be guaranteed any substantial pay raise due to any union effort.


You don't know what unions actually do, do you?

[boozehound]

Politifact take on this (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/dec/06/alan-grayson/alan-grayson-says-more-walmart-employees-medicaid-/)

I didn't see anything about corporate memo's encouraging this and didn't bother to dig for it.
the memo may have been an isolated incident (and was from in house management IIRC). Regardless, there is a reason why the largest user of public assistance in every state with data are walmart employees. Biggest money maker in the world, and they are subsidizing their labor costs with govt assistance.

[boozehound]

That part sounds like complete shit to me.

Walmart's no angel, but they're certainly not the devil that organized labor and the media like to make them out to be. Labor's interest in Walmart has exactly squat to do with helping associates and everything to do with one thing only: 1.4 million people in the US forking up union dues; people who are already underpaid and won't be guaranteed any substantial pay raise due to any union effort.
you say this, but the union workers I know all have very good paychecks and great benefits. Meanwhile, walmart pays it employees substantially less than other similar businesses and there is no denying that its employees are the largest user of federal assistance in every state with data (about 24 IIRC). This isnt about demonizing anyone. Its about the facts behind a labor system that purposefully steers its employees to public assistance (and limits hours, etc) to provide what it wont.

[Derka]

You don't know what unions actually do, do you?

No, because I've been living under a rock for the last 30-odd years and haven't ever read a history book. Please Mr. Condescending Internet Person, tell me what unions do.

[boozehound]

No, because I've been living under a rock for the last 30-odd years and haven't ever read a history book. Please Mr. Condescending Internet Person, tell me what unions do.
uhm, 40 hour work week, child labor laws, OHSA, minimum wages, pensions, overtime laws are just a few of the things you should thank a union member for.

[Derka]

you say this, but the union workers I know all have very good paychecks and great benefits. Meanwhile, walmart pays it employees substantially less than other similar businesses and there is no denying that its employees are the largest user of federal assistance in every state with data (about 24 IIRC). This isnt about demonizing anyone. Its about the facts behind a labor system that purposefully steers its employees to public assistance (and limits hours, etc) to provide what it wont.

Walmart does not pay substantially less. At all. Source all the studies you want, I work in the industry and its just not true. I've seen the raw unpublished data with my own eyes year after year since I started working in retail. Compared to other big box retailers, wages are about the same. A person leaving Walmart to go do the same job at Target isn't taking a substantial pay raise to do so. Same situation for benefits and medical.

As for the studies Politifact sources, I'd need to see the raw data before I believe I'm not reading data that was intended to fit a pre-determined conclusion. The article itself says that most of the available data for fact-checking comes from less-than-objective sources. There's Facts and then there's "facts".

[Math2]

Republicans believe in "forcing people to give to other" as well.
How so.

[Math2]

uhm, 40 hour work week, child labor laws, OHSA, minimum wages, pensions, overtime laws are just a few of the things you should thank a union member for.

Not all of those are perfectly good.

Personally though, the government shouldn't set laws about whether there can be a union or not. They shouldn't limit their rights (Republicans), or strengthen their rights (Democrats). But they shouldn't complain at all when they get fired for striking. In fact, I enjoy it when they do.

[Derka]

uhm, 40 hour work week, child labor laws, OHSA, minimum wages, pensions, overtime laws are just a few of the things you should thank a union member for.

Sarcasm. Seriously.

We're not at the outset of the Industrial Revolution anymore. I say Walmart doesn't need a union and you come at me with child labor and OSHA? There's not a single Walmart associate who can't go to his/her store manager and say "I'm not paid enough to live and this is why I should be getting paid more" and not at the very least have a serious dialogue about the topic. Much like with a union, nothing's guaranteed. But I'll speak for myself over paying someone else to do it for me.

[Nanners]

Walmart does not pay substantially less. At all.


complete nonsense. wal mart treats the vast majority of their employees like shit, FACT.

you claim walmarts compensation is the same as most other big box retailers? compare walmart compensation with that of costco. costco is the perfect example of how a giant retailer can be successful and profitable while providing their employees with good health care and a good salary.

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2008/06/wage_against_the_machine.html

[Derka]

complete nonsense. wal mart treats the vast majority of their employees like shit, FACT.

compare walmart compensation with that of a company like costco. costco is the perfect example of how a giant retailer can be successful and profitable while providing their employees with good health care and a good salary.

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2008/06/wage_against_the_machine.html

:lol First line of the article. "Nearly everyone who's looked at Wal-Mart's practices as an employer—its union busting, sex discrimination, low wages, and minimal benefits—has concluded that it's America's retail bad guy." Obviously no agenda there whatsoever, amirite??

Every one of those things is provably untrue if you've actually worked for the company. But if random internet articles says its true, it must be. After all, people never lie on the internet or manipulate data to further an agenda or just be outrageous ***** in the name of increasing web traffic.

If you're just gonna cite what other people tell you, keep quiet. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Edit: Article's from 2008. Come on now.

[Derka]

Gonna duck out of this one before you all get mad or something.

lol, studies you found on the internet. And you people believe them. Classic!

Adios.

[Nanners]

:lol First line of the article. "Nearly everyone who's looked at Wal-Mart's practices as an employer—its union busting, sex discrimination, low wages, and minimal benefits—has concluded that it's America's retail bad guy." Obviously no agenda there whatsoever, amirite??

Every one of those things is provably untrue if you've actually worked for the company. But if random internet articles says its true, it must be. After all, people never lie on the internet or manipulate data to further an agenda or just be outrageous ***** in the name of increasing web traffic.

If you're just gonna cite what other people tell you, keep quiet. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Edit: Article's from 2008. Come on now.


lol, are you kidding me? unless i am going to come and spout anecdotal evidence like you i should keep quiet?

news flash:just because you work at walmart doesnt make you any more of an expert on big box retailers than any random scrub who works retail. seriously are you joking with your nonsense? studies on the internet >>>> some moron who claims to have worked at walmart.

The most recent data I can find puts the hourly wage for costco workers at $17 per hour, while the hourly wage for walmart employees is $10 per hour.

[Scoooter]

Gonna duck out of this one before you all get mad or something.

lol, studies you found on the internet. And you people believe them. Classic!

Adios.
Why are published studies less reliable than your anecdotes, which even you are admittedly unsure of?


Every one of those things is provably untrue if you've actually worked for the company.

[boozehound]

Sarcasm. Seriously.

We're not at the outset of the Industrial Revolution anymore. I say Walmart doesn't need a union and you come at me with child labor and OSHA? There's not a single Walmart associate who can't go to his/her store manager and say "I'm not paid enough to live and this is why I should be getting paid more" and not at the very least have a serious dialogue about the topic. Much like with a union, nothing's guaranteed. But I'll speak for myself over paying someone else to do it for me.
you do realize the 40 hour work week is from 1940? This isnt ancient history, but only 2 generations of laborers past. SMFH at you negating the impact of unions for a positive change for laborers.

[boozehound]

:lol First line of the article. "Nearly everyone who's looked at Wal-Mart's practices as an employer—its union busting, sex discrimination, low wages, and minimal benefits—has concluded that it's America's retail bad guy." Obviously no agenda there whatsoever, amirite??

Every one of those things is provably untrue if you've actually worked for the company. But if random internet articles says its true, it must be. After all, people never lie on the internet or manipulate data to further an agenda or just be outrageous ***** in the name of increasing web traffic.

If you're just gonna cite what other people tell you, keep quiet. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Edit: Article's from 2008. Come on now.
so your ****ing limited personal experience, with no data on your side at all, is more reliable than study after study showing that walmart employees use public assistance at a much higher rate than any other group (let alone other retail employees)? OK there. Keep defending your overlord.

[kentatm]

LOL, churches and private charities would cover the loss of welfare.


no.

not even close man.

[Real Men Wear Green]

To reply to a neg:
He's not feeding hungry people, tax payers are paying for people who may not work as hard to eat. Make your own money buy your own food. -Bano114Taxes pay for a lot of things that an individual tax payer may not like. Trillions of dollars, for example, have gone into Iraq and I know that if I was asked for fifty dollars a week (or whatever my contribution will end up being) to spend on Iraq I wouldn't have given it up. So when I hear Republicans whine about a program that is only 2% of the budget and is actually doing some good? Please. I will never apologize for supporting the feeding of the hungry, many of whom are single mothers, the elderly, and children.

[kentatm]

To reply to a neg:Taxes pay for a lot of things that an individual tax payer may not like. Trillions of dollars, for example, have gone into Iraq and I know that if I was asked for fifty dollars a week (or whatever my contribution will end up being) to spend on Iraq I wouldn't have given it up. So when I hear Republicans whine about a program that is only 2% of the budget and is actually doing some good? Please. I will never apologize for supporting the feeding of the hungry, many of whom are single mothers, the elderly, and children.


:applause:

[Balla_Status]

Its well documented that walmart encourages their employees to get on public assistance, right down to corporate memos in the break room.

Also, I was on food stamps once. As a graduate student with a wife and small child, it was of invaluable help at that time of my life. Honestly, how old are you? You seem to have a very sheltered worldview and limited life experience.

Great life choice dude. Not being able to support a kid and having one anyways. You put yourself in that hole.

[Balla_Status]

To reply to a neg:Taxes pay for a lot of things that an individual tax payer may not like. Trillions of dollars, for example, have gone into Iraq and I know that if I was asked for fifty dollars a week (or whatever my contribution will end up being) to spend on Iraq I wouldn't have given it up. So when I hear Republicans whine about a program that is only 2% of the budget and is actually doing some good? Please. I will never apologize for supporting the feeding of the hungry, many of whom are single mothers, the elderly, and children.

I get what you're saying but it doesn't mean people have to agree with rewarding people's mistakes. No matter how big or little.

[boozehound]

Great life choice dude. Not being able to support a kid and having one anyways. You put yourself in that hole.
Yep, and I was teaching idiots like you at your fabulous alma matter. But the lowballing of teachers and college instructors is another matter. I have never encountered such a poorly educated and oblivious student body. Have fun picking up chicks in Farmington. Not everyone is born with a silver spoon in your life, as you obviously were in your shitty Dallas suburbs. No wonder you have such a pathetic and money dominated view of life (IK IK you lived in PNG for a year!). Having to ask for help takes a lot of courage, but guess what? everyone needs a little help at some point in their life.

[Just2McFly]

Yep, and I was teaching idiots like you at your fabulous alma matter. But the lowballing of teachers and college instructors is another matter. I have never encountered such a poorly educated and oblivious student body. Have fun picking up chicks in Farmington. Not everyone is born with a silver spoon in your life, as you obviously were in your shitty Dallas suburbs. No wonder you have such a pathetic and money dominated view of life (IK IK you lived in PNG for a year!). Having to ask for help takes a lot of courage, but guess what? everyone needs a little help at some point in their life.
http://www.askipedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Morton_Ether_1846-640x420.jpg

[Real Men Wear Green]

I get what you're saying but it doesn't mean people have to agree with rewarding people's mistakes. No matter how big or little.
If you don't care about the less fortunate there's nothing to tell you because that's just your values. But the way I see things if we're going to have a government that collects money from the general population and spends it on projects that are supposed to be for the greater good then we should be feeding the hungry. To people like me, letting children go hungry is wrong, letting the elderly go hungry is wrong, and if yes, a few able-bodied adults get fed in the process of getting food to their kids that's an acceptable side-effect. Especially seeing as if you look at the budget programs like food stamps are not what's driving the debt.

[DonDadda59]

Yep, and I was teaching idiots like you at your fabulous alma matter. But the lowballing of teachers and college instructors is another matter. I have never encountered such a poorly educated and oblivious student body. Have fun picking up chicks in Farmington. Not everyone is born with a silver spoon in your life, as you obviously were in your shitty Dallas suburbs. No wonder you have such a pathetic and money dominated view of life (IK IK you lived in PNG for a year!). Having to ask for help takes a lot of courage, but guess what? everyone needs a little help at some point in their life.

Boozehound- The Father
Hawker- The Son
This Thread- The Holy Ghost

:bowdown:

[Balla_Status]

Yep, and I was teaching idiots like you at your fabulous alma matter. But the lowballing of teachers and college instructors is another matter. I have never encountered such a poorly educated and oblivious student body. Have fun picking up chicks in Farmington. Not everyone is born with a silver spoon in your life, as you obviously were in your shitty Dallas suburbs. No wonder you have such a pathetic and money dominated view of life (IK IK you lived in PNG for a year!). Having to ask for help takes a lot of courage, but guess what? everyone needs a little help at some point in their life.

No idea what any of that has to do with having the responsibility to govern oneself.

[Balla_Status]

If you don't care about the less fortunate there's nothing to tell you because that's just your values. But the way I see things if we're going to have a government that collects money from the general population and spends it on projects that are supposed to be for the greater good then we should be feeding the hungry. To people like me, letting children go hungry is wrong, letting the elderly go hungry is wrong, and if yes, a few able-bodied adults get fed in the process of getting food to their kids that's an acceptable side-effect. Especially seeing as if you look at the budget programs like food stamps are not what's driving the debt.

That's not what I said. I just believe that's the majority of people's issues with these systems are people taking advantage of it. And being forced to pay for it. And are people making decisions that are putting themselves in these positions?

[bdreason]

Obama didn't dig this hole.

[Nanners]

That's not what I said. I just believe that's the majority of people's issues with these systems are people taking advantage of it. And being forced to pay for it. And are people making decisions that are putting themselves in these positions?

im being forced to pay for the tax breaks that boost the profits for your companies like your employer. im being forced to pay for the war that secures resources that will boost the profits for your industry.

i would bet if you broke down the numbers, YOU receive more $$ in govt handouts than the average poor/lazy person. also, i would much rather pay for food for poor people, instead of continuing to have my tax money funneled into the pockets of shitheads like you.

if we are going to talk about wasteful spending, lets focus on the right areas

[boozehound]

No idea what any of that has to do with having the responsibility to govern oneself.
yet another failure of your sub-par, less than well-rounded education. Otherwise you have read important social theorists, who are the fathers of modern democracy, and realize the social contract is the only thing that truly makes us human. Hell, even dumb animals like chimps care for the weaker members of their troupe. Meanwhile, we have the largest income disparity in the modern age (significantly higher than any other industrialized country) and an incredibly large portion of our society deals with daily food insecurity despite these social safety nets. http://www.nokidhungry.org/problem/overview

[Real Men Wear Green]

That's not what I said. I just believe that's the majority of people's issues with these systems are people taking advantage of it. And being forced to pay for it. And are people making decisions that are putting themselves in these positions?
Welfare fraud is probably going to be a reality no matter what you do. A father whose kids are AFDC can still put up an ad on craigslist and get moving gigs, paid to paint under the table, etc. I believe in the highest possible standards of financial screening to limit this kind of abuse but you don't kill these programs just because some of the people on them are cheating.

Yes, people make life decisions that lead them to hard times. That doesn't mean their children should suffer for their mistakes, and depending on the decision that led them to tough times a lot of them don't deserve to suffer either.

[Balla_Status]

im being forced to pay for the tax breaks that boost the profits for your companies like your employer. im being forced to pay for the war that secures resources that will boost the profits for your industry.

i would bet if you broke down the numbers, YOU receive more $$ in govt handouts than the average poor/lazy person. also, i would much rather pay for food for poor people, instead of continuing to have my tax money funneled into the pockets of shitheads like you.

if we are going to talk about wasteful spending, lets focus on the right areas

Explain to me how you "pay" for a companies REDUCTION in the amount of taxes they pay to the government. You're not paying shit. Tax break =/= subsidy.

[MMM]

Obama didn't dig this hole.

Agreed, it was a hole dug collectively, by a lot of people that made a lot of poor decisions over decades.

I believe we all contributed to this hole and while I was not pleased with what the Government had to do as a fix I am aware that it was much better than the alternative. I think some people forget how bad 08 was and blaming Democrats for continuing the policies that were put in place in 08 is absurd.

[Nanners]

Explain to me how you "pay" for a companies REDUCTION in the amount of taxes they pay to the government. You're not paying shit. Tax break =/= subsidy.


you need this explained??

i pay taxes. then, the us government decides to give massive tax breaks to your industry... is it really too hard for you to connect the dots on that one?

the only difference between a tax break and a subsidy is the letters used in the word. bottom line, they are both free (taxpayer) money from the government. if you want to argue semantics, you should talk to primetime or something.

[Balla_Status]

yet another failure of your sub-par, less than well-rounded education. Otherwise you have read important social theorists, who are the fathers of modern democracy, and realize the social contract is the only thing that truly makes us human. Hell, even dumb animals like chimps care for the weaker members of their troupe. Meanwhile, we have the largest income disparity in the modern age (significantly higher than any other industrialized country) and an incredibly large portion of our society deals with daily food insecurity despite these social safety nets. http://www.nokidhungry.org/problem/overview

Oh, I've heard about the social contact. Doesn't mean I have to agree with it all the time.

I don't know what you meant about money-dominated view but I actually enjoy what I do. I just happen to get paid very well for it. I don't see the issue.

My brother works as an economics assistant (half grad student/half something else) and worked on a project in Chile where the government is trying to "push" citizens to start studying subjects that allow them to make more money so they can pay back the loans they receive from the government. Shouldn't people be a little more responsible and do some research about what jobs are available, salaries, job market for whatever they're studying? A "well-rounded" education (very relative term btw) is all well and good but if you're stuck paying back loans and then bitch about not being able to find a job (because you studied something that wasn't marketable to begin with), do you really have anything to stand on? Of course this can go in the "is college really for me" thread...

[Myth]

Did you know you can't receive them if you are a student? I find that to be complete BS as if anyone needs them, it would be student struggling to make something better of themselves. Instead they have to choose between food and education.

What are you talking about? I got food stamps for a short bit when I was in undergrad. All you have to do is sign up for work study. The amount of hours can be as minimal as possible (I worked an hour a week just to get food).

[Balla_Status]

you need this explained??

i pay taxes. then, the us government decides to give massive tax breaks to your industry... is it really too hard for you to connect the dots on that one?

the only difference between a tax break and a subsidy is the letters used in the word. bottom line, they are both free (taxpayer) money from the government. if you want to argue semantics, you should talk to primetime or something.

The government isn't giving any money to the industry...so how are they taking your tax money?


If I get a tax break for going to school, did someone else pay for that credit or did I just get a reduction in the amount of taxes I paid? A reduction.

A subsidy is a direct payment of actual tax money to something where a tax break is a REDUCTION in the amount of taxes someone paid. Not money paid to a company from taxes.

[bdreason]

The government isn't giving any money to the industry...so how are they taking your tax money?






Did you just claim the U.S. Government doesn't subsidize the Fossil-Fuel Industry? :oldlol:

[Nanners]

A subsidy is a direct payment of actual tax money to something where a tax break is a REDUCTION in the amount of taxes someone paid. Not money paid to a company from taxes.

:oldlol:

really? you dont see how these are basically identical?

[Balla_Status]

Did you just claim the U.S. Government doesn't subsidize the Fossil-Fuel Industry? :oldlol:

Find them.

And again, actual direct payments from the US government (subsidies).

Not tax deductions.

[Balla_Status]

:oldlol:

really? you dont see how these are basically identical?

They're used interchangeably but there's a difference whether you want to act like it or not. You just eat up the shit the media spews.

Like every other industry out there, they receive tax deductions. They receive absolutely no subsidies from the US government.

[longhornfan1234]

So, we let these companies operate by paying their employees so little that they all qualify for federal assistance (effectively subsidizing walmarts labor costs) and you have the audacity to call those on assistance the leeches?

SMFH at you. Still planning on staying on your parent's health insurance until age 26 while lambasting the affordable care act? Typical republican hypocrite. The reddest states have the highest federal $ coming back to them and the largest % of citizens on public assistance. Now, the curb federal spending governors of those states are scared shitless that the fiscal cliff will cause them to lose billions in funding. what kind of funding? oh yeah, federal funding.


You're taking what I said out of context.


Facts about Dem states:

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/eco_wel_cas_tot_rec-economy-welfare-caseloads-total-recipients

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/eco_wel_cas_tot_rec_percap-caseloads-total-recipients-per-capita

:no:

[Scoooter]

Fossil Fuel Subsidies in the US. (http://priceofoil.org/fossil-fuel-subsidies/)

[bdreason]

Find them.

And again, actual direct payments from the US government (subsidies).

Not tax deductions.


The government subsidies the Fossil-Fuel industry by giving them large tax credits in order to keep their business in the Country. The government does this with lots of industries, but it doesn't change the fact that the Government is collecting LESS tax revenue as a result of the subsidy.

[Balla_Status]

Fossil Fuel Subsidies in the US. (http://priceofoil.org/fossil-fuel-subsidies/)

Objective website. Nanners actually posted a legit study and I went through it...no subsidies like he claimed.

Those are tax breaks. Not subsidies.

[Balla_Status]

The government subsidies the Fossil-Fuel industry by giving them large tax credits in order to keep their business in the Country. The government does this with lots of industries, but it doesn't change the fact that the Government is collecting LESS tax revenue as a result of the subsidy.

Subsidy=/= tax break. Right...they collect less tax revenue but it's a result of a tax BREAK. Not a subsidy. You don't pay any money to the O&G industry. Trust me.

[Nanners]

fvcking hawker over here arguing semantics until he is blue in the face :oldlol:

hey moron....regardless of whether you want to call the handouts given to the fossil fuel industry tax breaks or subsidies.... for the US treasury, the bottom line is identical.

us taxpayers subsidize the profits of oil and gas companies. period. maybe its not a direct subsidy, but the numbers work out the same. and this is just monetary/tax subsidies, we havent even begun to talk about how the oil and gas industry externalizes their environmental and human health costs on to the US taxpayers.

[longhornfan1234]

no.

not even close man.

Before the Government started taxing people in order to provide "charity", the churches and private charities DID cover welfare (along with people relying on their own families).

[Balla_Status]

fvcking hawker over here arguing semantics until he is blue in the face :oldlol:

hey moron....regardless of whether you want to call the handouts given to the fossil fuel industry tax breaks or subsidies.... for the US treasury, the bottom line is identical.

us taxpayers subsidize the profits of oil and gas companies. period. maybe its not a direct subsidy, but the numbers work out the same. and this is just direct subsidies, we havent even begun to talk about how the oil and gas industry externalizes their environmental and human health costs on to the US taxpayers.

How much do your taxes increase when O&G companies receive tax breaks?

[Nanners]

How much do your taxes increase when O&G companies receive tax breaks?


really? what a fvcking stupid question.

or maybe its not a stupid question. like they say, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people.

heres a question: how much have your taxes increased due to obamacare being passed? how much have your taxes increased due to the expansion of food stamps and other entitlement programs during the obama presidency?

last time I checked, virtually nobody has seen a tax increase in decades, and the govt is perfectly happy to overspend and run trillion dollar deficits every year.


here is a much better question you could have asked me: how much *would* my taxes decrease if the US govt ended tax breaks for oil and gas companies, and instead gave those tax breaks to the poor and needy? well, if that were the case, my taxes wouldnt change at all, because I am not poor or needy.

[boozehound]

Oh, I've heard about the social contact. Doesn't mean I have to agree with it all the time.

I don't know what you meant about money-dominated view but I actually enjoy what I do. I just happen to get paid very well for it. I don't see the issue.

My brother works as an economics assistant (half grad student/half something else) and worked on a project in Chile where the government is trying to "push" citizens to start studying subjects that allow them to make more money so they can pay back the loans they receive from the government. Shouldn't people be a little more responsible and do some research about what jobs are available, salaries, job market for whatever they're studying? A "well-rounded" education (very relative term btw) is all well and good but if you're stuck paying back loans and then bitch about not being able to find a job (because you studied something that wasn't marketable to begin with), do you really have anything to stand on? Of course this can go in the "is college really for me" thread...


see, thats my point. My 4 yr old has heard of the social contract. the point is you have never read anything about it. How can you disagree or agree with something you dont understand/havent bothered to understand. The social contract underlies every aspect of our lives, something you take for granted.

And, no, a well-rounded education is not relative. It means a college education where you were exposed to the humanities, social sciences, life sciences, physical sciences, languages, and math. Try looking up the common core curriculum concept of Robert Hutchins. I would be willing to bet you havent read a single one of the Great Books and take the accumulated knowledge on which we rest our laurels for granted.

You looked at college as technical training (i.e. a tech school) and thats what you got out of it.

Not sure if you are talking to me, but I have no student loans and have a great job that I take great satisfaction in.

[boozehound]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/12/09/food-stamp-use-reaches-another-high-in-september-47-7-million-participants/

:facepalm



What's a shame is the shit the obese slobs that are a large part of food stamp nation are allowed to buy... frozen pizza, frozen nuggets, and cases of Big Red.
this is something I agree with. You shouldnt be able to buy soda and candy and all that shit with foodstamps. WIC is restricted to (relatively) healthy foods, why cant foodstamps.

[Hotlantadude81]

It feels like when conservatives say that they don't want to pay for other peoples "mistakes" that they're trying their best to ignore that these "mistakes" are often children and the children will suffer sometimes cause of shitty parents.

Do conservatives think the ones that are simply "freeloaders" will just shape up and get great jobs if we take away welfare? And if they don't?

Just screw the kid... Cause him/her was a mistake anyway because keeping kids alive only should be guaranteed if the child is in the woman's body.

[Hotlantadude81]

this is something I agree with. You shouldnt be able to buy soda and candy and all that shit with foodstamps. WIC is restricted to (relatively) healthy foods, why cant foodstamps.

I agree.

[Kblaze8855]

When 85-90% of the budget is used on other things im not thinking we need to look at potentially misused charity for the poor very soon when we list all our ills. If half of all food stamps arent needed its what....4% of the budget depending on the source? The poor dont need to be the first to get kicked to the curb. If not spent on poor kids and under(or even un) employed people its just spent on something else. It doesnt go back into the peoples pockets. Once its gone its gone.

**** it. Help the poor. Even if some dont need it as bad as they say. Greater good. Id rather help 6 that need it and 4 who dont than just 3 who need it.

[dunksby]

How the **** could you be against food stamps? Damn I can't believe how some here are so passionately apathetic toward the poor.

[bdreason]

So hawker's solution is everyone should only pursue career's that pay really well? This fukcing guy is so detached from reality it's hilarious. :oldlol:

[dunksby]

So hawker's solution is everyone should only pursue career's that pay really well? This fukcing guy is so detached from reality it's hilarious. :oldlol:
Don't you know? He happens to have a job he enjoys doing and it magically pays really well.

[Droid101]

Before the Government started taxing people in order to provide "charity", the churches and private charities DID cover welfare (along with people relying on their own families).
Yeah, they did such a great job!

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110511212436/zombie/images/1/1a/Shanty_town.jpg

[IcanzIIravor]

Before the Government started taxing people in order to provide "charity", the churches and private charities DID cover welfare (along with people relying on their own families).

Can you provide a link to the revisionist historical sites you get this information from?

[longhornfan1234]

Can you provide a link to the revisionist historical sites you get this information from?

Google is your friend. It's common knowledge. Get a valid education from a non-lib indoctrination center and then you will understand the nature of our history and the nobility of our God-believing people. Tell your lib professors to screw themselves. Before FDR started pushing through the New Deal, about 1 in 3 Americans belonged to Mutual Aid Societies, where they would help their fellow members and others in the community.

Those organizations are effectively gone after gov created welfare.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Google is your friend. It's common knowledge. Get a valid education from a non-lib indoctrination center and then you will understand the nature of our history and the nobility of our God-believing people. Tell your lib professors to screw themselves. Before FDR started pushing through the New Deal, about 1 in 3 Americans belonged to Mutual Aid Societies, where they would help their fellow members and others in the community.

Those organizations are effectively gone after gov created welfare.
And you know these societies were enough? Funny to see you spout bs about indoctrination centers when you're the one that was fooled by your sources into thinking Romney was winning. You don't know what you don't know, and that's why you persistently fail to spread your lack of knowledge.

[ALBballer]

you need this explained??

i pay taxes. then, the us government decides to give massive tax breaks to your industry... is it really too hard for you to connect the dots on that one?

the only difference between a tax break and a subsidy is the letters used in the word. bottom line, they are both free (taxpayer) money from the government. if you want to argue semantics, you should talk to primetime or something.

You also receive tax breaks like standard deduction, personal exemption and etc.

If you went to school you received a tax deduction in tuition and possibly tuition interest. If you own a home you receive a deduction in property taxes and mortgage interest. Theres a bunch more deductions the govt gives to subsidize peoples lifestyles that cause innefficiencies in the marketplace ie tuition costs, home values etc. B

Which deductions and credits are you speaking of? There are many deductions the govt gives which i dont agree with either take nol, research and devolpment, hiring credits.

As for rmwg just because wastless money was spent in iraq doesnt mske welfare spending ok. I hope you can see the fallacy in this argumen.

[Real Men Wear Green]

As for rmwg just because wastless money was spent in iraq doesnt mske welfare spending ok. I hope you can see the fallacy in this argumen.
See the fallacy? I can barely even read it...

[ALBballer]

See the fallacy? I can barely even read it...

Stop trying to divert the attention from my point to some spelling/grammar mistakes. Im typing from my phone..

Kthanxbi

[Real Men Wear Green]

Stop trying to divert the attention from my point to some spelling/grammar mistakes. Im typing from my phone..

Kthanxbi
It's not much of a point. I've already said why I support the food stamp program. I believe in feeding the hungry. I also pointed out the fact that it's a small part of the budget. Cutting ti will still leave us with massive deficits. You don't agree? Fine. But you haven't made much of a point.

"kthanxbi"

[Eat Like A Bosh]

So by feeding more people, Obama's an asshole? lol

[Hotlantadude81]

It's amazing at the beatings conservatives take, and yet they still comeback for more. :lol

[joe]

Dems/GOP love tossing around the word sustainability.. what is sustainable about this government? We can't even fund it.. we have to go into debt to pay our obligations.

To me it's clear, we have to give the power back to the states. We need more variation in this country, we can't have 1 central government ruling all of us to this degree. It just doesn't work.

[MMM]

Dems/GOP love tossing around the word sustainability.. what is sustainable about this government? We can't even fund it.. we have to go into debt to pay our obligations.

To me it's clear, we have to give the power back to the states. We need more variation in this country, we can't have 1 central government ruling all of us to this degree. It just doesn't work.

Isn't America already one of the most decentralized states on the planet??? When competing against Europe, China, India, etc. then pulling in the same direction to maximize outcomes makes sense to some degree.

As for sustainability, what is sustainable about any American governance system if the standard of American living is beyond normal means???

[Hotlantadude81]

Dems/GOP love tossing around the word sustainability.. what is sustainable about this government? We can't even fund it.. we have to go into debt to pay our obligations.

To me it's clear, we have to give the power back to the states. We need more variation in this country, we can't have 1 central government ruling all of us to this degree. It just doesn't work.

Sorry, I want thinks like gay marriage approved for ALL the states. Same for pot use even though I'm not a smoker myself. There are somethings I want states to be forced to comply with. Sometimes you have to drag people along. I'm not interested in waiting for the oldies to die out so that gay americans can finally be allowed to act like adults and get married if they want too. Nobody is going to reverse my mind on that. I'm very against banning things. When you have "the war on" you're usually setting yourself up for failure.

The War on poverty?

-Failure

The War on drugs?

-Failure

The War on terror?

-Failure

At the same time, that doesn't mean that I think we should destroy welfare, but reforms need to take place. The War on Terror is KILLING PEOPLE. It's killing our people, and non americans. The War on Drugs is putting a large number of people in prison.

Welfare? Yeah, it comes at a cost to americans also. But at the end of the day, it's putting food in people's mouth. And that's probably why even a guy like Ron Paul talks about The War on Drugs and The War on Terror more than he does welfare. Or at least, that is what I'm seeing. He and everyone else knows that the last two kill and throw people in prison needlessly.

So, I'm sorry... But I'm not wanting to wait for states to decide on things like pot because people are needlessly getting thrown in jail. Thousands of people. That is not something to be taken lightly, or something that we should just allow states to make up their mind on because there will be states in which it might not be made legal. Therefore, people will continue to get arrested and thrown in jail.

[Bigsmoke]

i actually tied to get a link card this year...

... they wouldnt give me one :coleman:


but they gave one of my friends one and he doesnt pay rent or anything. he lives with his mom :coleman:


maybe its times for a second try :D

[joe]

Sorry, I want thinks like gay marriage approved for ALL the states. Same for pot use even though I'm not a smoker myself. There are somethings I want states to be forced to comply with. Sometimes you have to drag people along. I'm not interested in waiting for the oldies to die out so that gay americans can finally be allowed to act like adults and get married if they want too. Nobody is going to reverse my mind on that. I'm very against banning things. When you have "the war on" you're usually setting yourself up for failure.

The War on poverty?

-Failure

The War on drugs?

-Failure

The War on terror?

-Failure

At the same time, that doesn't mean that I think we should destroy welfare, but reforms need to take place. The War on Terror is KILLING PEOPLE. It's killing our people, and non americans. The War on Drugs is putting a large number of people in prison.

Welfare? Yeah, it comes at a cost to americans also. But at the end of the day, it's putting food in people's mouth. And that's probably why even a guy like Ron Paul talks about The War on Drugs and The War on Terror more than he does welfare. Or at least, that is what I'm seeing. He and everyone else knows that the last two kill and throw people in prison needlessly.

So, I'm sorry... But I'm not wanting to wait for states to decide on things like pot because people are needlessly getting thrown in jail. Thousands of people. That is not something to be taken lightly, or something that we should just allow states to make up their mind on because there will be states in which it might not be made legal. Therefore, people will continue to get arrested and thrown in jail.

Your argument is backwards and misaligned. It's the federal government waging all of those wars you listed. States rights would be a great way to fight AGAINST that sort of garbage.

Right now we have 1 state handing down trash laws for 50 other states to follow. Imagine if the state of Texas made the rules for the rest of us? And whatever Texas did, we all had to follow it? That's what we have right now coming from Washington DC.

Washington DC wants to invade Iraq based on lies? 50 states have no say in the matter. Washington DC wants to wage war on drugs? All the states fund it. Washington DC wants to have 35% income taxes, states have no recourse.

Forget the fact that I'm a libertarian, this just sounds like the most cockamamie idea I've ever heard. For a country that likes to call itself "free" and talk about personal liberties, what is so free and personal about 1 city handing down dictates on 50 states to this degree?

[joe]

Isn't America already one of the most decentralized states on the planet??? When competing against Europe, China, India, etc. then pulling in the same direction to maximize outcomes makes sense to some degree.

As for sustainability, what is sustainable about any American governance system if the standard of American living is beyond normal means???

The standard of American living was beyond normal means in the past because we actually produced those standards. The output of our economy justified that kind of standard. It wasn't based on debt and central banking like it is today.

We were extremely decentralized, not the case anymore. There's been an enormous centralization of power, mostly in the executive branch.

[Nanners]

Your argument is backwards and misaligned. It's the federal government waging all of those wars you listed. States rights would be a great way to fight AGAINST that sort of garbage.

Right now we have 1 state handing down trash laws for 50 other states to follow. Imagine if the state of Texas made the rules for the rest of us? And whatever Texas did, we all had to follow it? That's what we have right now coming from Washington DC.

Washington DC wants to invade Iraq based on lies? 50 states have no say in the matter. Washington DC wants to wage war on drugs? All the states fund it. Washington DC wants to have 35% income taxes, states have no recourse.

Forget the fact that I'm a libertarian, this just sounds like the most cockamamie idea I've ever heard. For a country that likes to call itself "free" and talk about personal liberties, what is so free and personal about 1 city handing down dictates on 50 states to this degree?

i really dont know whether to laugh or cry.... first there is absurdity of the analogy that you base your post around, or the fact that you actually use the word "cockamamie".

"why let the state of washington dc decide all the rules"

is this real life?

[MMM]

The standard of American living was beyond normal means in the past because we actually produced those standards. The output of our economy justified that kind of standard. It wasn't based on debt and central banking like it is today.

We were extremely decentralized, not the case anymore. There's been an enormous centralization of power, mostly in the executive branch.

America remains one of the most decentralized nations in the world and the "leader of the free world" has less impact on decision making than his counterparts around the world.

Since you are an advocate of smaller government I just want to point out that centralizing certain aspects can actually result in reduction of redundancy and government.

As for sustainability It seems we have a different understanding of the word. As long as America (tiny minority) is addicted to consuming a large percentage of the worlds resources then sustainability will remain a large issue.

[joe]

i really dont know whether to laugh or cry.... first there is absurdity of the analogy that you base your post around, or the fact that you actually use the word "cockamamie".

"why let the state of washington dc decide all the rules"

is this real life?

Not state as in being 1 of 50. One state as in, one government.

Having 1 central government controlling an area as large as the US is absurdity. The 50 states lack the means to resist federal law. What the federal government says, goes- and that is a dangerous proposition whether you realize it or not.

And look who you're talking to... I'm not exactly a lover of state governments either. They do retarded, yes, COCKAMAMIE things all the time. Want to talk about dumb things state governments do? I'll be laughing at them with you. But that's even more reason to want to have 50 individualized states, to give the people more recourse if 1 state wants to engage in buffoonery. It's a lot easier to move from New York to Pennsylvania than to leave the country entirely.

[joe]

America remains one of the most decentralized nations in the world and the "leader of the free world" has less impact on decision making than his counterparts around the world.

Since you are an advocate of smaller government I just want to point out that centralizing certain aspects can actually result in reduction of redundancy and government.


In what ways do we have less impact on decision making around the world than our counterparts?

Regardless, I wasn't talking about our decision making around the world.. I'm talking about within our borders. Are we more decentralized than China? You're probably right.. but China isn't what we should aspire to. IMO



As for sustainability It seems we have a different understanding of the word. As long as America (tiny minority) is addicted to consuming a large percentage of the worlds resources then sustainability will remain a large issue.

I agree. The only caveat I'd add is that in the past, America rightfully enjoyed our high standard of living. I don't believe the American consumer society was always unsustainable. It was very sustainable when it was built on production, savings, capital, investment, etc. It is unsustainable today because it's built on debt and money printing.

[Hotlantadude81]

Your argument is backwards and misaligned. It's the federal government waging all of those wars you listed. States rights would be a great way to fight AGAINST that sort of garbage.

Right now we have 1 state handing down trash laws for 50 other states to follow. Imagine if the state of Texas made the rules for the rest of us? And whatever Texas did, we all had to follow it? That's what we have right now coming from Washington DC.

Washington DC wants to invade Iraq based on lies? 50 states have no say in the matter. Washington DC wants to wage war on drugs? All the states fund it. Washington DC wants to have 35% income taxes, states have no recourse.

Forget the fact that I'm a libertarian, this just sounds like the most cockamamie idea I've ever heard. For a country that likes to call itself "free" and talk about personal liberties, what is so free and personal about 1 city handing down dictates on 50 states to this degree?

My argument is NOT backwards. I know that feds don't want pot to be legal. I know that. Saying that I want government to force it to be legal in all states doesn't not mean that's what I think government does want. I know that. I know that want to crackdown. But I also have my doubts that it would be legal in every state if everything is just left to the states. And I'm tired of waiting on states to approve. Thousands of people are being locked up, and I'm tired of waiting for states to stop it.

So yes, I understand that government is currently working against my wishes. Just because I don't believe that no government is the answer, that doesn't mean I approve of what they're currently doing. Please don't mistaken me for a Democrat. I don't want states deciding on pot and gay marriage. Maybe I'm not a hardcore libertarian, but I am more libertarian than a lot of the democrats.

[MMM]

In what ways do we have less impact on decision making around the world than our counterparts?

Regardless, I wasn't talking about our decision making around the world.. I'm talking about within our borders. Are we more decentralized than China? You're probably right.. but China isn't what we should aspire to. IMO

I meant the Canadian or British Prime minster have more decision making powers than the American President. The American system gives too much power to congress/senate so much so that they can filibuster what the majority want.

Also there is nothing wrong with aspiring or emulating other countries if they are doing things correctly, that includes even China. The Chinese in some aspects are a great story, highest saving rates/lowest debt.

If you believe individual states can learn from each other in a decentralized union. Then couldn't America as a nation also learn from countries that have lower debt rates, lower crime rates, better health outcomes, and better k-12 education.


I agree. The only caveat I'd add is that in the past, America rightfully enjoyed our high standard of living. I don't believe the American consumer society was always unsustainable. It was very sustainable when it was built on production, savings, capital, investment, etc. It is unsustainable today because it's built on debt and money printing.

The world populations continues to skyrocket and putting increase strain on the world resources. I don't believe it truly matter if America was debt free if one American child consumes as much as 7 in developing nations.

[Cowboy Thunder]

Fun thread.

[russwest0]

Letting private charity replace welfare would do a hell of a lot good for this country. For starters, it'd separate the freeloaders from those who are in an unfortunate situation and want to work out of it.

[RedBlackAttack]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/12/09/food-stamp-use-reaches-another-high-in-september-47-7-million-participants/

:facepalm



What's a shame is the shit the obese slobs that are a large part of food stamp nation are allowed to buy... frozen pizza, frozen nuggets, and cases of Big Red.
You are a real piece of sh!t.