Deron Williams is a ****ing scrub. I can't stand him anymore.

[It's A VC3!!!]

I've reached my ****ing boiling point with Deron Williams. He constantly gets killed by every ****ing point guard in the NBA. Starter or backup, he gets killed by them. His offense is complete shit, he can't shoot or drive to the basket and turns the ball over more than any point guard in the NBA. Everything that can go wrong for Deron is going wrong and I am honestly fed up with him to the extreme. He's not a top 15 pg and it's putrid the type of shit performance he displays night in and night out. When Brook was out he was supposed to carry this team but it's clear that he's just a overrated piece of useless shit. At 13-10, 5 of the losses can be shouldered on Deron's lack of leadership and willingness to play basketball correctly on both ends of the floor. Avery Johnson needs to be fired immediately. If I see Kieth Bogans play one more damn time, I'm going to murder someone.:mad: :mad: :mad:

I cant correctly express my ****ing mood right now.:mad: :mad:

[HylianNightmare]

ya he hasn't looked good for a minute now

[Dictator]

Deron for Nash

[Michael_Wilbon]

Totally agree. He's really not that good.

[Collie]

System player

[Money 23]

ya he hasn't looked good for a minute now
What is it with him? There was a period from like 2007 - 2010 where he was amazing.

He fell off hard ever since that Jazz trade, where he seemingly gave up on Sloan in the 2011 season

[Rekindled]

dwill+humphris for Lin+Parsons+Patterson+Montiejunas

[StroShow4]

Avery Johnson needs to be fired immediately.

Let's think this one through for a minute. Do we really want him back on TV?

[General]

I mean damn... Gasol for Deron and Humpries?

[kmartshopper]

deron Williams is testing your patience

[Whoah10115]

He doesn't look right.

[TeamLAC]

System player
definition of dwill right there +1

[SCdac]

Haven't watched a ton of Nets games, but yeah, I miss Utah D-Will.

[kingBynum]

he had a no call backcourt violation against detroit that help your team win...so ungrateful

[Money 23]

All I can think of when I hear the name Deron Williams

Is D-Rose and Kyrie Irving destroying him.

[longhornfan1234]

I used to think Deron Willams was a top 10 player.:facepalm

[fsvr54]

Devin Harris + Johan Petro for Deron

[It's A VC3!!!]

He's a scrub. Plain and simple. For him to be putrid on every facet of the game is unacceptable. Scoring, defense, play making, turnovers, and probably worst of all, he has no ****ing leadership. I have never seen him get on players, or bring anyone together like Chris Paul does. People don't just forget how to play. This guy is a 20 and 10 player. He got his hundred million and decided to not give a **** anymore.:mad:

I'd rather have this Nets team rebuilding. This team isn't going anywhere in the playoffs anyways. Brook Softpez posts from 20 feet away from the basket and can't rebound, Joe is solid, Gerald is solid and so is our bench but it's useless. **** this, I'm even more irate.:banghead:

[Purch]

Weren't you the guy who said you're not supposed to limit a point like D-will.


I mean you seemed pretty confident that UTAH was the team using him not to his full potential. But I see a lot of freedom in Brooklyn but not a lot of production

[PJR]

He's playing hurt. He's got bone spurs in his ankle. That is a b*tch to play with. Look at what it did to Ray Allen at the tailend of last year. He's going to need immediate surgery after the season.

Bone spurs are what turned Penny Hardaway to mush.

[poido123]

He's a scrub. Plain and simple. For him to be putrid on every facet of the game is unacceptable. Scoring, defense, play making, turnovers, and probably worst of all, he has no ****ing leadership. I have never seen him get on players, or bring anyone together like Chris Paul does. People don't just forget how to play. This guy is a 20 and 10 player. He got his hundred million and decided to not give a **** anymore.:mad:

I'd rather have this Nets team rebuilding. This team isn't going anywhere in the playoffs anyways. Brook Softpez posts from 20 feet away from the basket and can't rebound, Joe is solid, Gerald is solid and so is our bench but it's useless. **** this, I'm even more irate.:banghead:

Got to look at the brightside, he helped Chicago win :lol:

Let's face it, the bulls are the better team and they took Care of the overrated nets. Sissys like Lopez deron and Joe are going to crumble come playoffs time, lots of stats but little heart.

[Rose]

He's playing hurt. He's got bone spurs in his ankle. That is a b*tch to play with. Look at what it did to Ray Allen at the tailend of last year. He's going to need immediate surgery after the season.

Bone spurs are what turned Penny Hardaway to mush.
You're right it wasn't his four knee surgeries, including coming back WAY too early from the first one.

[Purch]

The reality is that, the way Jerry limited D-Will, is the same way Pop limits tony. It doesn't mean that you're not giving them freedom, you're simply running sets that properly maximize their efficeny and production

[It's A VC3!!!]

Weren't you the guy who said you're not supposed to limit a point like D-will.


I mean you seemed pretty confident that UTAH was the team using him not to his full potential. But I see a lot of freedom in Brooklyn but not a lot of production

Do you have eyes? Does it look like Avery Johnson is capable of implementing successful offense? One of my two points in this thread is the need for a new coach. There is no way that the Nets can win shit with Avery as the coach. And as I said, Deron's problems extend way further than just scoring and passing. He turns the ball over than any other point guard in the league. His defense is just completely atrocious. Deron had freedom last year and put up 21/9. Now I have no answers for his shit play but to conclude that he's a pro gone scrub.

[Whoah10115]

The reality is that, the way Jerry limited D-Will, is the same way Pop limits tony. It doesn't mean that you're not giving them freedom, you're simply running sets that properly maximize their efficeny and production



This right is exactly what it is. Absolutely. Williams is pretty much a street-balling PG. Playing for Avery Johnson doesn't help anyone...and Joe Johnson at the 2 really clogs up a lot.

[Dictator]

He's probably needs to lose some weight. 210lbs for a 6'3pg?

[Whoah10115]

He's probably needs to lose some weight. 210lbs for a 6'3pg?


He's a naturally big guy tho...and I bet he weighs more than that.

[It's A VC3!!!]

And judging Joe' post game interview, he is pissed off at this loss. I appreciate his care level. Avery still saying happy cheery stuff. Just terrible. Hire Stan Van Gundy please, and bring his brother Jeff on the sidelines.

[SpecialQue]

But I thought Deron >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CP3?

[Euroleague]

Like I said over and over here, he totally sucked last year in Turkey and the NBA, and he sucks this year. He's lazy and out of shape.

[Money 23]

He's a naturally big guy tho...and I bet he weighs more than that.
That's the point. He's naturally big. Obviously the bone spurs don't help, and he's being a champ toughing it out.

But he's getting older, and he could carry that weight a few seasons ago and still be quick ... but much like other players (particularly PGs like B Davis) who were bigger PGs who carried more weight.

They need to lose weight in order to sustain longevity at the QUICKEST and FASTEST position in the sport.

[kmartshopper]

if euro league says he sucks that means he's good. Just not elite anymore.

[andremiller07]

That's the point. He's naturally big. Obviously the bone spurs don't help, and he's being a champ toughing it out.

But he's getting older, and he could carry that weight a few seasons ago and still be quick ... but much like other players (particularly PGs like B Davis) who were bigger PGs who carried more weight.

They need to lose weight in order to sustain longevity at the QUICKEST and FASTEST position in the sport.

Not really IQ and skills = longetivty look at Andre Miller and he doesn't even have a jumpshot 1/2 of Derons, hes just going through a ruff patch in his career he will be fine.

[k0kakw0rld]

D-Will is the BEST PG IN THE GAME PERIOD.

[Euroleague]

if euro league says he sucks that means he's good. Just not elite anymore.

If you rate players by what I say, that means you are my bitch.

[Money 23]

Not really IQ and skills = longetivty look at Andre Miller and he doesn't even have a jumpshot 1/2 of Derons, hes just going through a ruff patch in his career he will be fine.
Do you know how rare Andre Miller is though?

Andre Miller never based his game off things like quickness. It was all intelligence.

Deron Williams was a beast due to his quickness.

[andremiller07]

Do you know how rare Andre Miller is though?

Andre Miller never based his game off things like quickness. It was all intelligence.

Deron Williams was a beast due to his quickness.

Deron Williams is a highly intelligent player with 10 times the jumpshot and has the size and skills once he slows down to post people up much like Andre. I don't really see a little bit extra weight hurting him hes to talented his whole game is not based on athletic ability at all.

[magnax1]

He's always been bad at guarding quick PGs. I remember one time Jonny Flynn went off on him for like 30 points.
He's not a system player at all though. He's just not his old self. Maybe he'll be back to normal sometime, but it's impossible to say.

[kmartshopper]

If you rate players by what I say, that means you are my bitch.

oh shit u win this round, yea I'm mad

[bagelred]

Isn't he playing with bone spurs? That's probably the reason....he's playing injured and probably bothers him worse than he's telling everyone.

By the way, if he already has spurs, shouldn't be required to play for San Antonio?


:roll: :roll: Ya see what I did there? :roll: :roll: SPURS? :roll: :roll:





:ohwell:

[Meticode]

If you rank point guards on play thus far, there are a lot of them that are playing better than Williams right now. He's shooting below 39% from the field right now.

[niko]

He's hurting. And none of these role players doing so well would be there without him already signing. Do you think Lopez would pass to himself?

Wait till he misses a month and the Nets offense is Iso Joe refusing to pass to Lopez and then tell me how much he sucks.

[heyhey]

his rep is built off jerry sloan calling plays for him from the sideline all those years

system product that was arrogant enough to eschew the system.

[Sarcastic]

Deron Williams for Pau Gasol.

Get it done Mitch.

[MontaEllis24]

deron hasnt been the same ever since linsanity drilled him.:lol
he will be back just havin some bad outings

[Whoah10115]

He's lost weight but it's not the good kind. He's lost all the muscle in his body, it seems. He was always big, now he looks mopey...mopey? Yea, mopey.


Playing with Joe Johnson does not help...playing with Joe Johnson and Gerald Wallace and Evans/Humphries and Brook Lopez...while Avery Johnson is your coach? All quality players but the offense flows uglier than Boston's.

[qrich]

Deron/Humphries for Gasol/Blake/Duhon


Get 'er done!

[Spaulding]

Hes always been overrated

[NewYorkNoPicks]

Chris Paul has always been better


So glad Knicks got Melo instead of this guy.

[Fiasco]

But I thought Deron >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CP3?

He is. But Deron is injured right now.

[schism206]

He is. But Deron is injured right now.
He's got more talent, better stroke and a better PG body than CP3. But CP3 is smarter imo and a true competitor, and plays to his potential much more so than Williams. I remember watching the Jazz on occasion and he was good but he always seemed to fall short in situations when they needed him.

[DirkNowitzki41]

he's getting depressed cause he realized he made the wrong decision










:lol

[ProfessorMurder]

Nets fans, have fun with DWill, the overpaid Joe Johnson, and injured Lopez for the next few years.

[bdreason]

I think his ankle and wrist injuries must be worse than we know. I can't really see any other explanation for his performances this year. He didn't just start sucking, and he isn't a "system player".

[wang4three]

Calm the **** down. I'm a Nets fan and you're being an idiot. I really wish I could exile you from our fan base.

Deron's performance has been lacking, but calm your ass. People saying system player are retarded. Which player doesn't succeed in the right system?

[MJ(Mean John)]

Not a top 15 pg? Lol.

Oh really now?

The man is a top 3 pg (best pg when he's on his grind) and has legit game.


Okay, lets do this nash for dwill trade, straight up.

[midatlantic09]

Why expect much from an overweight PG?

[brandonislegend]

Irving > Dwill :)

[Graviton]

Not a top 15 pg? Lol.

Oh really now?

The man is a top 3 pg (best pg when he's on his grind) and has legit game.


Okay, lets do this nash for dwill trade, straight up.
This ain't 2010 bro, D-Will has been sucking last 2 seasons. No one went easy on Rose when he was playing injured.

Westbrook, CP3, Parker, Irving, Rondo, Holiday, Felton, Liliard have been playing better than him. The first 5 will always be better at this point.

[chazzy]

Let's not re-write his career based on his recent play

[Asiantastic]

His FG% is absolutely atrocious. Other than that, he's basically averaging the same that he has his whole career.

But yeah, he is playing awful right now for someone who was considered the best point guard at one time by some people.

[Graviton]

His FG% is absolutely atrocious. Other than that, he's basically averaging the same that he has his whole career.

But yeah, he is playing awful right now for someone who was considered the best point guard at one time by some people.
His FG% isn't his biggest issue, his defense is. Almost every ****in point guard he has faced has bended him over and pounded his fatass. He is like a statue, makes Derek Fisher look like Gary Payton.

[Clutch]

His FG% isn't his biggest issue, his defense is. Almost every ****in point guard he has faced has bended him over and pounded his fatass. He is like a statue, makes Derek Fisher look like Gary Payton.
Raymond Felton looked like trash in both games against the Nets so I disagree.
He chucked us out of the first game and almost did it again but Kidd and Melo saved the day.

[brandonislegend]

This ain't 2010 bro, D-Will has been sucking last 2 seasons. No one went easy on Rose when he was playing injured.

Westbrook, CP3, Parker, Irving, Rondo, Holiday, Felton, Liliard have been playing better than him. The first 5 will always be better at this point.

Conley too.

[bluechox2]

He's suffering from wrist injury so obviously his touch will be off

[Graviton]

Conley too.
Curry as well.

[Sharmer]

Looks like he could work on his conditioning, he's not lean enough.

[Y2Gezee]

I'm sure this is a prisoner of the moment thing, and once DWill strings together 4 or 5 straight quality games you can find VC3 and other Net/Jazz fans being found somewhere debating for the millionth time that he's better than Chris Paul/Rondo/ best player in New York (WTF were some of you thinking...Chris Broussard?)

Deron William's injury isn't helping him, but bottom line is he's not an ELITE player. He's a perennial allstar caliber player, but he's not a Chris Paul type effective superstar player. He can fit into a system like Sloan's or would be great in a system like D'antoni's (so long as there is plenty of talent around him). He's up and down. He isn't consistently timely in games. I mean, when the offense is clicking he can fall in and play great along with it. But, when things are bogged down he doesn't go get a string of gritty baskets vs great D or make other plays that spark runs consistently.

Definitely has never single handedly carried an offense for a long stretch the way guys like Melo/Lebron/Wade/Paul have and certainly not come out with a great record. I didn't think last year would be so bad for them/him. This year's team during the stretch without Brook? (They were still pretty loaded).

I've never thought him to be a top 10 player even. A prime example of why stats aren't everything, he doesn't pass the eyeball test.

[Bigsmoke]

i think he's hurt

[Blue&Orange]

wan't he supposed to have surgery and miss a couple of months but instead he is playing through it?

I think i remember nets fans talking about it.

[The GM]

isn't he playing with an injured ankle that needs surgery? It's pretty obvious he's hurt the way he's playing cause his scoring and defense have fallen off drastically but props to him for being a leader and playing through a serious injury unlike a certain Brook "broken feet" Lopez.

[talamo]

Curry as well.

Might as well toss in George Hill

[Go Getter]

I've seen D Will in person several times. He is far from over weight. Crazy how scrubs get on the net and get to talking stupid about shit they don't know.



Some guy said he lost weight but not the good kind. How in the **** can you tell without a physical examination?

[Foster5k]

LMAO!! Trying to blame the Nets struggles on DWill. He is the best player on the team by far. Hell, if you guys don't want him, many teams would LOVE to have this guy as their starting point guard.

Stop trying to blame everything on DWill. Guy is a baller and has always been. Not to mention he playing injured. Who the Nets got besides DWill that is worth watching?

[It's A VC3!!!]

He's lost weight but it's not the good kind. He's lost all the muscle in his body, it seems. He was always big, now he looks mopey...mopey? Yea, mopey.


Playing with Joe Johnson does not help...playing with Joe Johnson and Gerald Wallace and Evans/Humphries and Brook Lopez...while Avery Johnson is your coach? All quality players but the offense flows uglier than Boston's.

I wouldn't agree with this because the Nets were 11-4 at one point and playing their best basketball. Brook got injured and the Nets need to get back to playing good basketball. This Nets team can be really good. And that's not my opinion, they have showed that. I think we need to move Hump back to the starting lineup because he can't play off the bench and Evans can play well off the bench or as a starter. And Joe has been stellar this year. His first 5-10 games were sub-par but that's to be expected playing with an entirely new team and figuring out roles.

Despite setback injuries, Deron needs to play better. If he can't shoot, then he should focus on passing and get 10+ assists every game. This isn't playoff time, so it's fine for now but shooting .388 and .299 from 2 and 3 is just atrocious and he should get surgery now and be healthy for playoff time.

[Whoah10115]

I wouldn't agree with this because the Nets were 11-4 at one point and playing their best basketball. Brook got injured and the Nets need to get back to playing good basketball. This Nets team can be really good. And that's not my opinion, they have showed that. I think we need to move Hump back to the starting lineup because he can't play off the bench and Evans can play well off the bench or as a starter. And Joe has been stellar this year. His first 5-10 games were sub-par but that's to be expected playing with an entirely new team and figuring out roles.

Despite setback injuries, Deron needs to play better. If he can't shoot, then he should focus on passing and get 10+ assists every game. This isn't playoff time, so it's fine for now but shooting .388 and .299 from 2 and 3 is just atrocious and he should get surgery now and be healthy for playoff time.


Johnson has been good because he's good but he hasn't been stellar. The reason the Nets played well is they simply have too many good players to not play well. But Johnson doesn't clog the offense. I'm not claiming that as the reason why Williams hasn't been himself, but it doesn't help.


Honestly, how long would an operation for bone spurs keep him out? I would look to have it now.

[It's A VC3!!!]

Honestly, how long would an operation for bone spurs keep him out? I would look to have it now.

They said it would be 1-2 months. If this is how he performs due to it, he needs to get the operation immediately. We can't have Deron shooting 30% during the playoffs.

CJ Watson is serviceable player and can be a good starter. I just can't stand anymore crap shooting nights from Deron any longer. He's already fed me up completely and he shows no signs of improving with this injury.

[Whoah10115]

I've seen D Will in person several times. He is far from over weight. Crazy how scrubs get on the net and get to talking stupid about shit they don't know.



Some guy said he lost weight but not the good kind. How in the **** can you tell without a physical examination?



It's an observation that I think I'm allowed to make. If I'm wrong, so be it.


He's big and has always been big. It looks like he shed a lot of weight but that included muscle. He's a little flabby. I've seen him with no shirt. His body size has decreased but he's not any quicker or faster or more athletic. In fact, he doesn't have the same spring in his step. The lack of spring may relate to his ankle, so I won't judge that. He looked good physically when I saw him in person but I think he could build up muscle.


Look at Love. Every noticed how much weight he lost last year. He lost some muscle too. And this year he has clearly strengthened and filled out that lost weight. D-Will shed some weight a couple years ago (and more this year) but hasn't seemed to fill it out.

[Whoah10115]

They said it would be 1-2 months. If this is how he performs due to it, he needs to get the operation immediately. We can't have Deron shooting 30% during the playoffs.

CJ Watson is serviceable player and can be a good starter. I just can't stand anymore crap shooting nights from Deron any longer. He's already fed me up completely and he shows no signs of improving with this injury.



Watson may very well be the best backup PG in the NBA. The Bulls had the best record in the league for most of the season, with him filling in for the MVP. He was terrific.

[Y2Gezee]

Like a month or 2 for that surgery. He should have it probably.

He'll still be overrated though...just sayin.

[LikeABosh]

Him and Boozer where system players in Utah. They both suck ass now. Deron is a mediocre athlete, opposing PGs can take him off the dribble at will. Isn't he shooting like 37% since coming to the Nets? :oldlol: I always laughed when people compared him to CP3

[miggyme1]

Yall tripping.deron williams and cp3 both struggle against the more explosive pgs. Rose,westbrook etc. So that argument is irrelevant! Didnt dwill score 55 in a game last year? I dont giv a damn who it was against!

Didnt ray allen play like shit last year with bone spurs?????? Il wait


Isnt dwill the same guy that made the olympics? Ill wait

Isnt dwill the same guy alot of people want to play alongside? ( joe johnson, dwight howard)

I think dallas wanted him

Yall stupid this dude will be fine. Just because he aint been in the playoffs in a few years yall want to write him off. Dont do it u dumb fcuking bums

[NYCPG]

Of course he's not that good, and its a shame that hes your franchise player. Nets will never be a contender with the way the team is constructed right now.

[niko]

They said it would be 1-2 months. If this is how he performs due to it, he needs to get the operation immediately. We can't have Deron shooting 30% during the playoffs.

CJ Watson is serviceable player and can be a good starter. I just can't stand anymore crap shooting nights from Deron any longer. He's already fed me up completely and he shows no signs of improving with this injury.
The net beat writers put it an 2 to 3 months. 1 or 2 I'd think they do it now

[Kujo]

He seems out of shape to me. Plus, obviously the bone spurs must be affecting his play.

[IGotACoolStory]

He seems like he misses and owes his career to Jerry Sloan.

[bagelred]

We don't KNOW if the bone spurs are affecting his play, we are just speculating.

Anyway, at this point, he's not going to have surgery until the Nets season is over.....so useless to talk about that.

[BlazersDozen]

How can anyone expect any player to perform at the top of their game with any type of injury? That's just selfishness especially since it deals with one of the two most important parts of the body in this game which is his lower body and someone else said earlier that he also has problems with his wrist which would really affect a point guard more than any other player.

I don't stay up on the Nets because I feel like they're not out to win championships but to just win popularity and money but if these injuries are legit then I see no point in being mad at the guy. Be mad at the coach who is still making him a main cog in your offense instead of making him more into a distributor and cut down his minutes.

[joshwake]

He hasn't been the same ever since he hurt his wrist. Also don't think the ankle injury was any good for him (duh). I had one just like it and it literally took years to feel normal, still gives out once in a while.

[Blue&Orange]

He hasn't been the same ever since he hurt his wrist. Also don't think the ankle injury was any good for him (duh). I had one just like it and it literally took years to feel normal, still gives out once in a while.
Melo was horrible last year after the wrist injury.

[ChuckOakley]

Raymond Felton looked like trash in both games against the Nets so I disagree.
He chucked us out of the first game and almost did it again but Kidd and Melo saved the day.
Every PG but Felton has pretty much had great games against us. Even B.Knight and M.Teague the last two games. No excuse for his defense. He can't guard quicker guards and he's supposed to be in his prime.. not in his 30's like when we said this about Kidd.

[It's A VC3!!!]

Every PG but Felton has pretty much had great games against us. Even B.Knight and M.Teague the last two games. No excuse for his defense. He can't guard quicker guards and he's supposed to be in his prime.. not in his 30's like when we said this about Kidd.

This right here was the tipping point for me. Watching M. Teague, a rookie, get to the basket and shoot clutch jumpers in the fourth quarter was extremely grueling. Then Knight having 22/5/5 is again unacceptable. It's been happening all year and I have reached my temper with Deron. Across the board there is not one good thing ANYBODY can say about Deron right now. If this is largely related to his injury he needs to get surgery immediately. We can't have him shooting 30% and getting 4 turnovers every game in the playoffs.

[gigantes]

He hasn't been the same ever since he hurt his wrist. Also don't think the ankle injury was any good for him (duh). I had one just like it and it literally took years to feel normal, still gives out once in a while.
this is probably what we should fear most as nets fans-- that the d-will that we spent a fortune on will never be the same player again. hopefully that's a stinking lie, but then it would hardly be the first time that happened in sports.


i also agree with a poster from last page that observed that these nets are built to entertain and to make money. that's basically the case, even though the owner is so filthy rich that he's not trying to personally make himself any money on this. but my point is, with all the big names, the bar got set a lot higher than our actual chances of winning a championship. one should always try to be positive in life, but there's also such a thing as buying in a little too strongly. what about just trying to enjoy being a good / very good team once again?


re: "the bench sucks,"
actually, from some metrics i saw the other day, it's one of the most effective benches in the league. one of the highest +/-'s in the league for the top five reserves as a unit, for example. i mean, many of these bargain basement signings have worked out incredibly well, such as blatch, watson, stack and evans. pretty damn fortunate because there was almost no cap money after the starters got their chips (minimum $10M each/yr). so the problem moreso seems to be the four starters besides lopez- all seem to be playing below their career efficiencies. or avery johnson. whatever. but something else besides the bench.

[gigantes]

oh, it just hit me. it's so obvious.... how could any nets fan have missed this?

his last name is williams.

there. mystery solved.

[I.R.Beast]

What is it with him? There was a period from like 2007 - 2010 where he was amazing.

He fell off hard ever since that Jazz trade, where he seemingly gave up on Sloan in the 2011 season
his jumpshot hasn't been the same since his wrist injury the year he got traded.

[Nets fan 93]

his jumpshot hasn't been the same since his wrist injury the year he got traded.
He had a nice jumpshot last season. He's injured. The Nets need to shut him down. He's not gonna heal if he keeps playing with that wrist and tweaking it.

[brandonislegend]

The last time he played on USA he looked so as fk too, I remember him getting blown by on every single play like Derek Fisher.

[Go Getter]

Watson may very well be the best backup PG in the NBA. The Bulls had the best record in the league for most of the season, with him filling in for the MVP. He was terrific.
I saw him almost every week for a few years and he looked to be in good shape. I think youre over analyzing. Dude is a top level athlete....he's slumping, but considering the situation the Nets are doing ok.

[niko]

He's not playing as well as he can but he's not a scrub. That's pretty ridiculous. If i was a Net fan i'd be more worried about JJ. He's only played well when he is allowed to be total iso. Melo level pre Woodson total selfish I AM TAKING THE SHOT AND YOU WILL ENJOY IT iso. Which makes the offense all more iso and stops the ball movement. (It's actually very Melo like from last year, it's masked when he has a good game and makes some shot down the stretch but they'd be better off if him and Deron fit together better.)

[Rubio2Gasol]

He's not playing as well as he can but he's not a scrub. That's pretty ridiculous. If i was a Net fan i'd be more worried about JJ. He's only played well when he is allowed to be total iso. Melo level pre Woodson total selfish I AM TAKING THE SHOT AND YOU WILL ENJOY IT iso. Which makes the offense all more iso and stops the ball movement. (It's actually very Melo like from last year, it's masked when he has a good game and makes some shot down the stretch but they'd be better off if him and Deron fit together better.)

That is JJ tho :confusedshrug: they knew what they were getting.

[Whoah10115]

I saw him almost every week for a few years and he looked to be in good shape. I think youre over analyzing. Dude is a top level athlete....he's slumping, but considering the situation the Nets are doing ok.


I agree but it's better to him at his best. CJ Watson covering him for 2 months will get them thru and everyone will be better off in the end.

[Whoah10115]

He's not playing as well as he can but he's not a scrub. That's pretty ridiculous. If i was a Net fan i'd be more worried about JJ. He's only played well when he is allowed to be total iso. Melo level pre Woodson total selfish I AM TAKING THE SHOT AND YOU WILL ENJOY IT iso. Which makes the offense all more iso and stops the ball movement. (It's actually very Melo like from last year, it's masked when he has a good game and makes some shot down the stretch but they'd be better off if him and Deron fit together better.)



While I haven't been a Carmelo fan the last few years, it's hilarious to realize that Johnson had the offensive freedom that Anthony does...that's why I always laugh at people who say "I think Harden could be better than peak Joe Johnson".


And I was thinking about it the other day...he's like Rudy Gay, with better handles and a better jumpshot and less talent. He should be playing SF...tho not on the Nets.

[red1]

we'll take him off your hands. landry fields for dwill?

[Jolokia]

Deron for Derrick Williams + Ridnour

He can back up Rubio

[Papaya Petee]

Nets fans, have fun with DWill, the overpaid Joe Johnson, and injured Lopez for the next few years.
Seeing the past 5 years of this teams history, I think they should be satisfied with those 3.

[It's A VC3!!!]

He's not playing as well as he can but he's not a scrub. That's pretty ridiculous. If i was a Net fan i'd be more worried about JJ. He's only played well when he is allowed to be total iso. Melo level pre Woodson total selfish I AM TAKING THE SHOT AND YOU WILL ENJOY IT iso. Which makes the offense all more iso and stops the ball movement. (It's actually very Melo like from last year, it's masked when he has a good game and makes some shot down the stretch but they'd be better off if him and Deron fit together better.)

I am ecstatic with Joe and love the signing. After getting acclimated to the system, he is putting up 19.1 points per game on 47% shooting over his last 9 games. Who cares is a lot of his points are iso or not. At the end of the day he needs to be doubled and have the opposing teams best perimeter defender guarding him. He commands a ton of attention and has come up clutch game after game in these last 9 games specifically. And he's not as iso as Melo because he is also averaging 4 apg and doesn't EVER force shots. Literally, if Joe misses a shot, its because it just didn't go in and not because he forced it like Melo used to do.

[niko]

I am ecstatic with Joe and love the signing. After getting acclimated to the system, he is putting up 19.1 points per game on 47% shooting over his last 9 games. Who cares is a lot of his points are iso or not. At the end of the day he needs to be doubled and have the opposing teams best perimeter defender guarding him. He commands a ton of attention and has come up clutch game after game in these last 9 games specifically. And he's not as iso as Melo because he is also averaging 4 apg and doesn't EVER force shots. Literally, if Joe misses a shot, its because it just didn't go in and not because he forced it like Melo used to do.

I don't know what you watch if you think he's not playing primarily iso ball. And i really hope you are comparing him to Melo of last yaer because Melo this year vs. Joe this year in terms of ball movement is a joke. And Melo is a much better player, it makes more sense for Melo to iso than for JJ.

[It's A VC3!!!]

I don't know what you watch if you think he's not playing primarily iso ball. And i really hope you are comparing him to Melo of last yaer because Melo this year vs. Joe this year in terms of ball movement is a joke. And Melo is a much better player, it makes more sense for Melo to iso than for JJ.

He clearly does play iso ball, but according to you I should hate him more then Deron because of it? As I said earlier, Joe over his last 9 is averaging 19.1 PPG on 47 % shooting. And yes Melo is a better player but his iso last year was the worst ever because Melo forced shots for the sake of getting up a shot. Joe doesn't do that. He won't force a shot for the sake of shooting. 9/10 of his shots are great looks. Some of his iso ball can also be attributed to Deron's lack of play. If Deron could free up space and get Joe more easy looks, it would make the offense better. Right now Joe is our second best player behind Brook. There isn't a Nets fan disappointing with him.

[niko]

He clearly does play iso ball, but according to you I should hate him more then Deron because of it? As I said earlier, Joe over his last 9 is averaging 19.1 PPG on 47 % shooting. And yes Melo is a better player but his iso last year was the worst ever because Melo forced shots for the sake of getting up a shot. Joe doesn't do that. He won't force a shot for the sake of shooting. 9/10 of his shots are great looks. Some of his iso ball can also be attributed to Deron's lack of play. If Deron could free up space and get Joe more easy looks, it would make the offense better. Right now Joe is our second best player behind Brook. There isn't a Nets fan disappointing with him.

That's not true, i know lots of Net fans who complain about him. You don't give Deron credit for the things he does. Do you think the offense runs so smoothly at times on its own?

I get he's underachieving, but you talk like he sucks. He does not suck.

[It's A VC3!!!]

That's not true, i know lots of Net fans who complain about him. You don't give Deron credit for the things he does. Do you think the offense runs so smoothly at times on its own?

I get he's underachieving, but you talk like he sucks. He does not suck.

Right now he sucks. No fan in their right mind can dispute that. He hasn't lost all of his talent but right now he is washed up due to a lot of reasons. System, injuries, mental, whatever it may be he is not playing good right now. I know deep inside he is still top tier pg Deron Williams. Which is why I have said for him to undergo surgery to repair everything and possibly find him a better coach. I would love Jerry Sloan but it's a long shot.

[gigantes]

That's not true, i know lots of Net fans who complain about [Joe Johnson].
nets fans can be as impatient and childish as all other sports fans. i don't know why you keep talking about "nets fans saying this" or "nets fans saying that" and acting like it makes a shred of difference. mob mentality is never the best way to arrive at an informed decision IMO.

regardless, joe brings good things to the table even when his shot isn't falling. he has high barbecue, smart and effective defense, and is a good team player. deron is very stupidly playing this season injured, was never a great defender at his best, and is a mediocre leader from the one position that demands leadership, i.e. PG.

he still has miles to go and fires to be lit before he becomes a jason kidd IMO.

[niko]

nets fans can be as impatient and childish as all other sports fans. i don't know why you keep talking about "nets fans saying this" or "nets fans saying that" and acting like it makes a shred of difference. mob mentality is never the best way to arrive at an informed decision IMO.

regardless, joe brings good things to the table even when his shot isn't falling. he has high barbecue, smart and effective defense, and is a good team player. deron is very stupidly playing this season injured, was never a great defender at his best, and is a mediocre leader from the one position that demands leadership, i.e. PG.

he still has miles to go and fires to be lit before he becomes a jason kidd IMO.
my point was that ITS A VC3 is making these blanket statements about Net fans. Basically that they all think JJ is great and Deron sucks. That's false. That's not how i formed an opinion, i've seen all the Net games. JJ is better lately (clearly a crapload better) but when he goes into iso mode it doesn't always benefit the offense. It's as i said a lot like Melo of last year moreso than this year, it looks real good when it's working, but when it's not it hurts the offense.

I know Deron has not played well but this thread basically sounds like he's dragging the Nets down. When things are humming on offense, he's clearly a part of it, and when Brook is getting the ball in nice positions to do things, he's clearly part of that.

I'm surprised Deron is getting scapegoated so much, that's all. I'd take him any day.

[niko]

I'm going to remove myself from this argument as team's fans know their players better but the title of this thread remains a huge overreaction.

[gigantes]

my point was that ITS A VC3 is making these blanket statements about Net fans. Basically that they all think JJ is great and Deron sucks. That's false. That's not how i formed an opinion, i've seen all the Net games. JJ is better lately (clearly a crapload better) but when he goes into iso mode it doesn't always benefit the offense. It's as i said a lot like Melo of last year moreso than this year, it looks real good when it's working, but when it's not it hurts the offense.

I know Deron has not played well but this thread basically sounds like he's dragging the Nets down. When things are humming on offense, he's clearly a part of it, and when Brook is getting the ball in nice positions to do things, he's clearly part of that.

I'm surprised Deron is getting scapegoated so much, that's all. I'd take him any day.
fair enough. well said. and you should stick around in such threads IMO. you've done a better job of weighing factors than i first supposed. (my bad, i guess)

[It's A VC3!!!]

I'm going to remove myself from this argument as team's fans know their players better but the title of this thread remains a huge overreaction.

I've tried looking it up but it seems are there is no definite answer. Will Carmelo play on Wednesday? The Nets would likely easily win without Melo in the lineup. Especially with Brook coming back. You know the Nets should have won if it weren't for the JR Smith no call illegal screen with one minute to go and the Reggie Miller "kick" no call by Kidd.:lol

[Whoah10115]

I'm sorry but I have a hard time understanding being ecstatic with Joe Johnson. Iso ball better get you more than 19.1PPG.


And I just checked...a solid 20 FT attempts in those 9 games. There's nothing special about that. Iso ball for 19.1PPG, on 16.4 FGA's a game...and that's his high peak so far?


Nothing that impressive there.