Sorry Lakers fans, Shaq DID carry the team to 3-peat

[PistolPete44]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

[red1]

crazed kobe-basher

[TheMarkMadsen]

Pistol Pete got carried during his 3.. Oh wait that's right Pistol Pete carried himself to all those losses

[red1]

he did carry the team but he is one of the GOAT and kobe wasn't in his prime untill the latter 2/3rds of the 3-peat yet so what do you expect

[MetsPackers]

Why say sorry? This is a well known fact

Shaq and PJax repeated this several times during the 3peat, which the Kobe stans wouldn't know because they didn't watch any of that

[TheMarkMadsen]

Kobe average 25 5 5 in the playoffs during that 3 peat.

How is that being carried


If your favorite player average 25 5 5 in the playoffs during a 3 peat would you act like he was carried?

[Segatti]

The originality of insidehoops trolls amazes me.

[DMV2]

5 rings > 4 rings :pimp:

[tpols]

Kobe average 25 5 5 in the playoffs during that 3 peat.

How is that being carried


If your favorite player average 25 5 5 in the playoffs during a 3 peat would you act like he was carried?
Shaq didn't carry anything. That was a two man team.

It's not like lebron and Wade last year where Wade had 22/5/5 and Bron had 30/8/8.. Both kobe and Shaq were putting up 30 a game and Shaq was was putting up great rebounding and passing numbers for a big man while kobe was putting up great rebounding and assist totals for a guard. Shaq was getting exposed with hack a Shaq to slow the offense while kobe was closing series out against Damn near every team in the west.

[Purch]

Why say sorry? This is a well known fact

Shaq and PJax repeated this several times during the 3peat, which the Kobe stans wouldn't know because they didn't watch any of that
Only Kobe stans say otherwise.

Shaq was easily the most domiant player in the leauge all three years

[MetsPackers]

Shaq didn't carry anything. That was a two man team.

It's not like lebron and Wade last year where Wade had 22/5/5 and Bron had 30/8/8.. Both kobe and Shaq were putting up 30 a game and Shaq was was putting up great rebounding and passing numbers for a big man while kobe was putting up great rebounding and assist totals for a guard. Shaq was getting exposed with hack a Shaq to slow the offense while kobe was closing series out against Damn near every team in the west.

Nah, it kinda was like that, stan
Kobe about 25 5 4
Shaq about 30 14 3 2.5
^ As number 1 option and main focus of defense

MANY times during the 3peat Shaq said in interviews "I am the man, this is my team." PJaz said multuple times "SHaq is the man, this is his team"

And guess what? Bryant never said otherwise! WHy? BEcasue its the truth

As stated earlier and as you will see throughout this thread, only Kobe stans will try to contest this

Funny thing is, Kobe himself wasn't arguing :roll:

BTW Kobe only averaged 30 in the playoffs once during the threepeat and it was against the worst teams they played during that stretch. The other years: 21ppg and 26ppg he was nowhere near as effective as Shaq

[tpols]

Nah, it kinda was like that, stan
Kobe about 25 5 4
Shaq about 30 14 3 2.5
^ As number 1 option and main focus of defense

MANY times during the 3peat Shaq said in interviews "I am the man, this is my team." PJaz said multuple times "SHaq is the man, this is his team"

And guess what? Bryant never said otherwise! WHy? BEcasue its the truth

As stated earlier and as you will see throughout this thread, only Kobe stans will try to contest this

Funny thing is, Kobe himself wasn't arguing :roll:

BTW Kobe only averaged 30 in the playoffs once during the threepeat and it was against the worst team they played during that stretch. The other years: 21ppg and 26ppg he was nowhere near as effective as Shaq
There were only 3 runs. :oldlol: only one run? What does that mean..

Obviously kobe wasn't close to Shaq in 2000.. That's mostly Shaq. But the 2001 and 2002? Kobe averaged 29/7/6 and 26/5/5.

That's 27-28/6/6 over 2 championships. What guard has ever put up those numbers won a ring and been granted zero credit?

Go ahead and list the guards who have put up those numbers with first team all defense and won a ring.. I want a list.

[flipogb]

nobody was carried , I support Kobe but I have no problem with Shaq's MVP trophies he deserved them. The finals mvp is that , its for the Finals and Shaq was always the main advantage there based on the teams they played

[CAstill]

Nah, it kinda was like that, stan
Kobe about 25 5 4
Shaq about 30 14 3 2.5
^ As number 1 option and main focus of defense

MANY times during the 3peat Shaq said in interviews "I am the man, this is my team." PJaz said multuple times "SHaq is the man, this is his team"

And guess what? Bryant never said otherwise! WHy? BEcasue its the truth

As stated earlier and as you will see throughout this thread, only Kobe stans will try to contest this

Funny thing is, Kobe himself wasn't arguing :roll:

Nah you're pretty dumb and shouldn't be speaking on the matter.
It was Shaq's team and that's why Kobe never argued :confusedshrug:
That has nothing to do with who was the the best player during the 3peat
which is arguable which makes the notion of Shaq carrying Kobe stupid.
Shaq was instrumental to winning but he wasn't winning the ring by himself.
The top Western conference teams had his number. Kobe was the catalyst
for the rings.

[MetsPackers]

There were only 3 runs. :oldlol: only one run? What does that mean..

Obviously kobe wasn't close to Shaq in 2000.. That's mostly Shaq. But the 2001 and 2002? Kobe averaged 29/7/6 and 26/5/5.

That's 27-28/6/6 over 2 championships. What guard has ever put up those numbers won a ring and been granted zero credit?

Go ahead and list the guards who have put up those numbers with first team all defense and won a ring.. I want a list.

None of that has anything to do with the fact that Shaq was the man, and was clearly FMVP all three times. Nobody's saying Kobe deserves zero credit, just that he doesn't deserve as much as Shaq. It's easy to put up big numbers when the defense has to deal with the MDE in the paint and you're facing some of the worst finals teams of all time.

Were Kobe's numbers impressive? Yes. But was Shaq clearly more important to the team than Kobe? By far. This is indisputable, and what this thread is about; not how many guards have put up X/X/X

Shaq was option 1, Kobe was option 2
Not 1A 1B as stans wish was true

[tpols]

None of that has anything to do with the fact that Shaq was the man, and was clearly FMVP all three times. Nobody's saying Kobe deserves zero credit, just that he doesn't deserve as much as Shaq. It's easy to put up big numbers when the defense has to deal with the MDE in the paint and you're facing some of the worst finals teams of all time.

Were Kobe's numbers impressive? Yes. But was Shaq clearly more important to the team than Kobe? By far. This is indisputable, and what this thread is about; not how many guards have put up X/X/X

Shaq was option 1, Kobe was option 2
Not 1A 1B as stans wish was true
Shaq did deserve all three fmvps. Kobe didn't even play well in any of those finals.. But guess what? The thread title says Shaq CARRIED the Lakers. Shaq didn't carry anything. Kobe handled all of the perimeter duties.. Being the teams best help defender, perimeter on ball defender, the teams best playmaker/assist man, the teams best perimeter scorer, the teams closer, etc. He was pulling a SHITLOAD of weight.

Not to mention the Lakers biggest opponents weren't the sixers or nets in the finals. . Those were among their weakest opponents they faced winning 8 out of 9 games. The spurs and kings were in those years and kobe had monster series in the Lakers toughest battles. LOL at Shaq carrying anything. More like he got to hog all of the glory against La weaker opponents because he was older and the man and had giant mismatches against Todd mccoulough Jason Collins and a 190 lb dikembe mutmbo.

[tpols]

Were Kobe's numbers impressive? Yes. But was Shaq clearly more important to the team than Kobe? By far. This is indisputable, and what this thread is about; not how many guards have put up X/X/X

Shaq was option 1, Kobe was option 2
Not 1A 1B as stans wish was true
Shaq was more important because he had one of the greatest peaks ever.. But carry? That implies a grossly uneven disparity in importance. Which of course is a total joke.

Kobe during those two years was considered without argument a top 3-5 player in the league. No top 5 player in the league who has won a ring while having that title has EVER seen more disrespect than kobe has for his earlier rings.

[KG215]

Why is OP apologizing to Lakers fans? Legit Lakers fans don't give a shit who "carried" the team to the three championships. They're just happy about the three championships. OP should be apologizing to Kobe stans.

[Vertical-24]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

I can't even recall any Laker fan saying anything remotely like that. You're trying to generalize a group of people who aren't really here :oldlol:

No Laker fan says that Shaq stole FMVPs from Kobe, all we say is that he didn't "carry" Kobe like so many of you haters try to imply. Kobe was an integral part to all of our championship runs and that's the point we try to get across. I don't think any rational Laker fan would say that Shaq wasn't the man. By the 2001 season however, it could be argued that it became much more of a 1a-1b situation though.

[MetsPackers]

OK
II'I'll agree there was no carrying involved
As long as it's agreed that Shaq was Batman to Kobe's Robin

I'm not even sure why i've argued this far, there's no talking to stans, especially one's with Kobe and Jordan pictured together in their avi's
Everything i'm saying is well known fact, so i'm not sure why i'm even defending it

[tpols]

OK
II'I'll agree there was no carrying involved
That's all the threads about. :cheers:

Although I am biting on a very obvious troll thread.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

I can't even recall any Laker fan saying anything remotely like that. You're trying to generalize a group of people who aren't really here :oldlol:

No Laker fan says that Shaq stole FMVPs from Kobe, all we say is that he didn't "carry" Kobe like so many of you haters try to imply. Kobe was an integral part to all of our championship runs and that's the point we try to get across. I don't think any rational Laker fan would say that Shaq wasn't the man. By the 2001 season however, it could be argued that it became much more of a 1a-1b situation though.
:lol OP is a fcking clown.

[longtime lurker]

Agreed. It's obvious Shaq won those championships by himself especially considering the fact that he was swept out of the playoffs back to back years prior despite still having all star teammates. OP's argument is airtight.

[I<3NBA]

there's nothing surprising about this. only Kobe d1ckriders ever think Kobe carried Shaq or that they were at least equal. :lol

[KOBE143]

Shaq dominated against weak east team

Kobe dominated against tough west team (Where the real championship happened)

[Big#50]

Shaq dominated against weak east team

Kobe dominated against tough west team (Where the real championship happened)
Why do stans always say this? Kobe feasted on the Spurs weak backcourt. He played good against the Kings, but Shaq still played better. Shaq was the best player on those teams by a big margin.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kobe's playoff stats during the 3peat

pts-reb-ast-stl-blk fgm/fga
bold indicates leader on the team

2000 WCQF
1: 23-7-5-0-0 11/22
2: 32-4-1-2-0 12/20
3: 35-3-2-2-0 13/25
4: 34-6-4-2-0 13/30
5: 17-2-6-0-3 7/16
2000 WCSF
1: 25-6-1-3-3 8/17
2: 15-4-6-2-2 6/11
3: 25-5-2-2-2 8/20
4: 23-3-5-2-0 10/20
5: 17-1-3-1-0 6/16
2000 WCF
1: 13-3-6-1-1 4/9
2: 12-2-4-1-2 2/9
3: 25-7-7-2-1 11/18
4: 18-4-7-2-3 5/15
5: 17-5-4-0-2 4/13
6: 33-2-6-4-3 12/24
7: 25-11-7-0-4 9/19
2000 Finals
1: 14-3-5-1-2 6/13
2: 2-1-4-0-1 1/3
3: DNP
4: 28-4-5-1-2 14/27
5: 8-5-3-2-0 4/20
6: 26-10-4-1-2 8/27

2001 WCQF
1: 28-6-7-0-0 9/20
2: 25-3-7-3-0 8/11
3: 22-4-9-2-0 9/23
2001 WCSF
1: 29-4-5-0-0 10/23
2: 27-9-5-1-1 9/19
3: 36-7-4-2-0 10/22
4: 48-16-3-2-1 15/29
2001 WCF
1: 45-10-3-1-1 19/35
2: 28-7-6-2-1 11/24
3: 36-9-8-1-0 14/27
4: 24-2-11-2-1 10/19
2001 Finals
1: 15-3-5-1-3 7/22
2: 31-8-6-2-2 11/23
3: 32-6-3-2-0 13/30
4: 19-10-9-1-1 6/13
5: 26-12-6-1-1 7/18

2002 WCQF
1: 34-7-3-2-3 10/28
2: 19-6-5-2-0 5/21
3: 25-4-7-2-2 9/19
2002 WCSF
1: 20-2-4-0-0 8/18
2: 26-4-6-3-0 12/25
3: 31-6-6-0-1 15/31
4: 28-7-3-1-0 10/27
5: 26-8-5-1-0 10/20
2002 WCF
1: 30-6-5-2-2 12/26
2: 22-6-2-1-1 9/21
3: 22-2-3-2-2 8/24
4: 25-4-2-2-3 12/26
5: 30-5-3-1-0 11/29
6: 31-11-5-0-0 10/20
7: 30-10-7-2-0 10/26
2002 Finals
1: 22-3-6-1-0 6/16
2: 24-8-3-2-1 9/15
3: 36-6-4-1-2 14/23
4: 25-6-8-2-0 7/16

2002 Playoffs - 2nd Half Scoring
97 Field Goals, 17 3PT Field Goals

2002 Playoffs - 4th Quarter Scoring
52 Field Goals, 12 3PT Field Goals

Kobe also led the Lakers in second half and 4th quarter scoring in the 2001 Playoffs, but most of those games were not close so I didn't include them.

Kobe was the leading scorer in 8/16 games in the 2001 Playoffs and 10/19 games in the 2002 Playoffs.

[bluechox2]

i remember back in the days when there was this one stretch when shaq went down, lakers lost a whole bunch of games with kobe chucking alot and laker and shaq stans kept shiting on kobe. and when shaq came back, they started winning

[MetsPackers]

i remember back in the days when there was this one stretch when shaq went down, lakers lost a whole bunch of games with kobe chucking alot and laker and shaq stans kept shiting on kobe. and when shaq came back, they started winning

As do all basketball fans who watched the Lakers 3peat. But when talking to these stans, it almost appears as if they never watched any of the games and only look at boxscores and don't consider impact. Hmmmm

[Mr. Jabbar]

Since this is a troll thread:

Shaq was able to win 3 rings with kobe and zero with Lebron. :bowdown:

[Artillery]

Shaq dominated against weak east team

Kobe dominated against tough west team (Where the real championship happened)

Kobe was guarded by 6'3 Antonio Daniels with 38 year old 6'3 Terry Porter as his backup. Sean Elliot was in the final year of his career and battling kidney disease all year. The only young swingman on SA(Derek Anderson) was injured in first round against the Mavs.

Very impressive beasting on short, decrepit, old men. :applause:

[Big#50]

Kobe's playoff stats during the 3peat

pts-reb-ast-stl-blk fgm/fga
bold indicates leader on the team

2000 WCQF
1: 23-7-5-0-0 11/22
2: 32-4-1-2-0 12/20
3: 35-3-2-2-0 13/25
4: 34-6-4-2-0 13/30
5: 17-2-6-0-3 7/16
2000 WCSF
1: 25-6-1-3-3 8/17
2: 15-4-6-2-2 6/11
3: 25-5-2-2-2 8/20
4: 23-3-5-2-0 10/20
5: 17-1-3-1-0 6/16
2000 WCF
1: 13-3-6-1-1 4/9
2: 12-2-4-1-2 2/9
3: 25-7-7-2-1 11/18
4: 18-4-7-2-3 5/15
5: 17-5-4-0-2 4/13
6: 33-2-6-4-3 12/24
7: 25-11-7-0-4 9/19
2000 Finals
1: 14-3-5-1-2 6/13
2: 2-1-4-0-1 1/3
3: DNP
4: 28-4-5-1-2 14/27
5: 8-5-3-2-0 4/20
6: 26-10-4-1-2 8/27

2001 WCQF
1: 28-6-7-0-0 9/20
2: 25-3-7-3-0 8/11
3: 22-4-9-2-0 9/23
2001 WCSF
1: 29-4-5-0-0 10/23
2: 27-9-5-1-1 9/19
3: 36-7-4-2-0 10/22
4: 48-16-3-2-1 15/29
2001 WCF
1: 45-10-3-1-1 19/35
2: 28-7-6-2-1 11/24
3: 36-9-8-1-0 14/27
4: 24-2-11-2-1 10/19
2001 Finals
1: 15-3-5-1-3 7/22
2: 31-8-6-2-2 11/23
3: 32-6-3-2-0 13/30
4: 19-10-9-1-1 6/13
5: 26-12-6-1-1 7/18

2002 WCQF
1: 34-7-3-2-3 10/28
2: 19-6-5-2-0 5/21
3: 25-4-7-2-2 9/19
2002 WCSF
1: 20-2-4-0-0 8/18
2: 26-4-6-3-0 12/25
3: 31-6-6-0-1 15/31
4: 28-7-3-1-0 10/27
5: 26-8-5-1-0 10/20
2002 WCF
1: 30-6-5-2-2 12/26
2: 22-6-2-1-1 9/21
3: 22-2-3-2-2 8/24
4: 25-4-2-2-3 12/26
5: 30-5-3-1-0 11/29
6: 31-11-5-0-0 10/20
7: 30-10-7-2-0 10/26
2002 Finals
1: 22-3-6-1-0 6/16
2: 24-8-3-2-1 9/15
3: 36-6-4-1-2 14/23
4: 25-6-8-2-0 7/16

2002 Playoffs - 2nd Half Scoring
97 Field Goals, 17 3PT Field Goals

2002 Playoffs - 4th Quarter Scoring
52 Field Goals, 12 3PT Field Goals

Kobe also led the Lakers in second half and 4th quarter scoring in the 2001 Playoffs, but most of those games were not close so I didn't include them.

Kobe was the leading scorer in 8/16 games in the 2001 Playoffs and 10/19 games in the 2002 Playoffs.
Those are awesome stats. But Shaq was still the better player by a big margin. He demanded triple teams at times. It isn't even close.

[longtime lurker]

Those are awesome stats. But Shaq was still the better player by a big margin. He demanded triple teams at times. It isn't even close.

Yet he had to be hidden on the bench in the last seconds of close games :bowdown:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kobe was guarded by 6'3 Antonio Daniels with 38 year old 6'3 Terry Porter as his backup. Sean Elliot was in the final year of his career and battling kidney disease all year. The only young swingman on SA(Derek Anderson) was injured in first round against the Mavs.

Very impressive beasting on short, decrepit, old men. :applause:
Okay?

Shaq has atleast 50 pounds on EVERYBODY :oldlol:
That isn't an advantage IN THE POST? Try guarding a guy that is 50 pounds heavier than you in the post and backing down on you.

01 Spurs had the #1 defense in the NBA (98.0 DRtg).

[MetsPackers]

Okay?

Shaq has atleast 50 pounds on EVERYBODY :oldlol:
That isn't an advantage IN THE POST? Try guarding a guy that is 50 pounds heavier than you in the post and backing down on you.

01 Spurs had the #1 defense in the NBA (98.0 DRtg).

I bet Duncan guarded Kobe the whole time




:yaohappy:




Oh wait, he was probably on Shaq...

[Deuce Bigalow]

Those are awesome stats. But Shaq was still the better player by a big margin. He demanded triple teams at times. It isn't even close.
In 2000 yes. We are talking about the 3peat though. 2001 and 2002 are part of the 3peat.

[Artillery]

Okay?

Shaq has atleast 50 pounds on EVERYBODY :oldlol:
That isn't an advantage IN THE POST? Try guarding a guy that is 50 pounds heavier than you in the post and backing down on you.

01 Spurs had the #1 defense in the NBA (98.0 DRtg).

They had the number #1 defense because of TD/DRob - so yeah, their post defense was elite. Which makes what Shaq was doing against them even more impressive.

Shaq vs Twin Towers
Kobe vs short/decrepit/old scrubs

Of course, Kobe was going to thrive in those conditions.

[Deuce Bigalow]

I bet Duncan guarded Kobe the whole time




:yaohappy:




Oh wait, he was probably on Shaq...
Huh?

The Spurs TEAM in 2000-01 had the #1 defense in the league.

[tpols]

They had the number #1 defense because of TD/DRob - so yeah, their post defense was elite. Which makes what Shaq was doing against them even more impressive.

Shaq vs Twin Towers
Kobe vs short/decrepit/old scrubs

Of course, Kobe was going to thrive in those conditions.
And when he tore your defensive specialist Bruce Bowen in later years a new asshole? :oldlol: Kobe's had the spurs by the balls his whole career.

[longtime lurker]

I have a feeling most people in this thread have no idea about the what's implied by the word "carried"

[tpols]

Funny how kobe desperately needed Shaq to win but Shaq never won anything without a dominant top 10-20 all time player (Wade and kobe). Doesn't go both ways does it? :oldlol:

[Deuce Bigalow]

They had the number #1 defense because of TD/DRob - so yeah, their post defense was elite. Which makes what Shaq was doing against them even more impressive.

Shaq vs Twin Towers
Kobe vs short/decrepit/old scrubs

Of course, Kobe was going to thrive in those conditions.
Shaq: 7'1", listed at 325 lbs (more than that IRL)
Robinson: 7'1" listed at 235 lbs (probably more than that)
Duncan: 6'11", listed at 255 lbs

Shaq might of had one hundred pounds on each defender.

But that isn't an advantage, discrediting great performances only counts against Kobe.

[Michael_Wilbon]

The originality of insidehoops trolls amazes me.

You're an unoriginal troll on here. It's quite obvious.

[tpols]

Shaq: 7'1", listed at 325 lbs (more than that IRL)
Robinson: 7'1" listed at 235 lbs (probably more than that)
Duncan: 6'11", listed at 255 lbs

Shaq might of had one hundred pounds on each defender.

But that isn't an advantage, discrediting great performances only counts against Kobe.
Wait dude.. What about Todd mcallough and Jason Collins? Those dudes were gods. And mutmbo who Shaq had like 200 lbs on and was allowed to elbow in the face and get and 1s out of it? Fvcking beasts:bowdown:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Wait dude.. What about Todd mcallough and Jason Collins? Those dudes were gods. And mutmbo who Shaq had like 200 lbs on and was allowed to elbow in the face and get and 1s out of it? Fvcking beasts:bowdown:
They weren't guarding Kobe, so they are elite defenders.

[STATUTORY]

Funny how kobe desperately needed Shaq to win but Shaq never won anything without a dominant top 10-20 all time player (Wade and kobe). Doesn't go both ways does it? :oldlol:

couldn't even get it done with penny

[General]

Kobe didn't need a top 5 player in the league to win a championship. Kobe was a top 3 player in 2001. Kobe is above Shaq in the all-time list. Most haters here will disagree, but most of the general public already believes it.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Of course Shaq did. On that Lakers team there were only two types of players: Shaq and Role Players. Kobe just turned out to be the role player who was given the responsibility to score from time to time to relieve Shaq's pressure, nothing more nothing less. It was Shaq's one man show, Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry. Without Kobe, Lakers still win Champs with a decent SG. Without Shaq, first round exit at best. For everyone on that Lakers team, their 3 rings were Shaq's gifts.

[Vienceslav]

Of course Shaq did. On that Lakers team there were only two types of players: Shaq and Role Players. Kobe just turned out to be the role player who was given the responsibility to score from time to time to relieve Shaq's pressure, nothing more nothing less. It was Shaq's one man show, Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry. Without Kobe, Lakers still win Champs with a decent SG. Without Shaq, first round exit at best. For everyone on that Lakers team, their 3 rings were Shaq's gifts.
False , despite most of the times being in a role there is a few games/series where Kobe is as vital part of the team as Shaq.
WCF against Spurs in 2001 for example,Kobe closes out a game against Indiana if i remember correctly and wins a game where Shaq fouls out against Sacramento.
You are just being mad that Nets lost to one of the best teams ever in the Finals.
There is no need to be upset.

[Kiddlovesnets]

False , despite most of the times being in a role there is a few games/series where Kobe is as vital part of the team as Shaq.
WCF against Spurs in 2001 for example,Kobe closes out a game against Indiana if i remember correctly and wins a game where Shaq fouls out against Sacramento.
You are just being mad that Nets lost to one of the best teams ever in the Finals.
There is no need to be upset.

:facepalm
Kobe was never as vital as Shaq from 00-02, not even close...
:no:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Of course Shaq did. On that Lakers team there were only two types of players: Shaq and Role Players. Kobe just turned out to be the role player who was given the responsibility to score from time to time to relieve Shaq's pressure, nothing more nothing less. It was Shaq's one man show, Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry. Without Kobe, Lakers still win Champs with a decent SG. Without Shaq, first round exit at best. For everyone on that Lakers team, their 3 rings were Shaq's gifts.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=olqGddqhhHw

Your team took a broom up the ass.

[Kiddlovesnets]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=olqGddqhhHw

Your team took a broom up the ass.

The reason why Kobe got this many points is that Nets were triple-teaming Shaq, though still not able to stop him in any way. In most times it was one player guarding Kobe, and in some occasions he was unguarded. Nets could have easily stopped Kobe with more efforts, but then you had Shaq scoring 50ppg. Funny Shaq still outperformed Kobe and won FMVP when he was so heavily guarded while Kobe was left open in about half of the times he took a shot.

[The-Legend-24]

Shaq was so dominant that he won before Kobe became a starter.

Oh wait...

[Cladyclad]

Kobe was just as important as Shaq even in his worst statistical Finals. Kobe misses game 3 of the Finals. Lakers lose. Shaq fouls out in game 4 with the Lakers down. Kobe takes over force OT. Kobe dominates in ot. Lakers win.Series is now 3-1 instead of 2-2. Its no tellin wat the Pacers could have done if they tied that series. Because the next game the Pacers beat the ish out the Lakers. So i say to people who act like Kobe was afterthought must not have watched those Nba Finals. Without Kobe that series i dont think the Lakers win. Numbers lie sometimes.

[Rubio2Gasol]

The reason why Kobe got this many points is that Nets were triple-teaming Shaq, though still not able to stop him in any way. In most times it was one player guarding Kobe, and in some occasions he was unguarded. Nets could have easily stopped Kobe with more efforts, but then you had Shaq scoring 50ppg. Funny Shaq still outperformed Kobe and won FMVP when he was so heavily guarded while Kobe was left open in about half of the times he took a shot.

Because Kerry Kittles with Jason Kidd / Kenyon Martin doubling on you or switching onto you half the time is "unguarded".

You might want to actually watch the vid.

[Cladyclad]

Because Kerry Kittles with Jason Kidd / Kenyon Martin doubling you half the time is "unguarded".

You might want to actually watch the vid.


Exactly. People didnt watch these games. They just looked at box scores.

No coach in their right mind send the double off Kobe's man. Kobe was rarely unguarded that series if ever. Now i would admit he got single coverage at times. But Kobe is lived at the perimeter. Its almost impossible to double him anyways. Once again Kobe ,Lebron, & Jordan haters watch the games. These stupid threads are gettin out of hand.

[Rubio2Gasol]

People can argue all this garbage about who was more important to the team and what not, that's fine. Shaq was the most dominant player in the game, Kobe if you take those years cumulatively - probably the best wing. A top 3 player in the league.

How you idiots can sit here and try to say he has two rings is beyond me lol.

[Artillery]

And when he tore your defensive specialist Bruce Bowen in later years a new asshole? :oldlol: Kobe's had the spurs by the balls his whole career.

Just stating the facts, brah. Nothing impressive about Kobe beasting on short/fat/old men. Everybody knows those first three rings are sidekick rings.

[Artillery]

:facepalm
Kobe was never as vital as Shaq from 00-02, not even close...
:no:

Yup. This is revisionist history perpetuated by mouthbreathers like tpols, Deuce Bigalow, etc.

[tpols]

Just stating the facts, brah. Nothing impressive about Kobe beasting on short/fat/old men. Everybody knows those first three rings are sidekick rings.
What facts have you stated again? Giving your opinion on the quality of the spurs backcourt wouldn't constitute a fact? Lol at 'facts'. Love when idiots toss around that word without actually fulfilling its terms.

You want a fact? 27/6/6 over two rings with first team all D. There's a fact for you. More people in this thread have disagree with your stance than not.. You're in the minority here. Smarten up.

[longtime lurker]

People can argue all this garbage about who was more important to the team and what not, that's fine. Shaq was the most dominant player in the game, Kobe if you take those years cumulatively - probably the best wing. A top 3 player in the league.

How you idiots can sit here and try to say he has two rings is beyond me lol.

This x100. This is the same sad story of these haters on ISH. It's mind boggling how stupid these guys are and they just post the same mindless crap when their arguments are ever questioned.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

Because Kerry Kittles with Jason Kidd / Kenyon Martin doubling on you or switching onto you half the time is "unguarded".

You might want to actually watch the vid.
:lol

[Rasheed1]

Kobe was not a role player during the 1st 3peat...

but he was not on par with Shaq either

the reason the Lakers had a 3peat was because Shaquille Oneal was on the team..

he was the player that destroyed defenses, and forced them to collapse in order to defend him.. Once the defense starts collapsing, shots open up for people like kobe and fisher & rice, horry


I wouldnt say kobe was just another role player, but I will say that lakers never even make those finals if they dont have a player the caliber of shaquille on the team..

Kobe was a good player, but he couldnt do the things Shaq could do to a defense


not even close

[The Iron Fist]

Of course Shaq did. On that Lakers team there were only two types of players: Shaq and Role Players. Kobe just turned out to be the role player who was given the responsibility to score from time to time to relieve Shaq's pressure, nothing more nothing less. It was Shaq's one man show, Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry. Without Kobe, Lakers still win Champs with a decent SG. Without Shaq, first round exit at best. For everyone on that Lakers team, their 3 rings were Shaq's gifts.
If kobes role was basically the same as horrys, shouldn't there be a Lakers 3peat from 97-99 based on your logic?

[Ne 1]

Why is Kobe discredited for winning with Shaq, but Magic is never discredited for winning with Kareem? Also, Kobe proved he he can win without Shaq. The whole without Shaq talking points officially ended June 14th 2009.

[DKLaker]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Stats????? Listen moron, I was at the games courtside and Kobe was just as important as Shaq. Shaq couldn't make free throws, hit 3's, bring the ball up the floor or penetrate and dish....not to mention Kobe was as important outside defensively as Shaq was inside. Kobe was the closer

[dabulls23]

http://lakerholicz.com/shaq-needed-kobe-too/2012/09/01

[NumberSix]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:
Who has ever said that?

[La Frescobaldi]

Who has ever said that?

nobody ever did. OP is

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/2012/03/copyright-troll.jpg

[lakerspng]

anyone who thinks the Lakers would have won those 3 championships without Kobe, never watched the games.

Had the never drafted Kobe and stuck with Eddie Jones, a all-star 2 guard at the time... they probably would have won 1 with Shaq, 2 if they were lucky. What Kobe did throughout the Western Conference playoffs in that 3-peat, was legendary. They do not make the finals without Kobe in 01 and 02, flat out. and they probably don't beat the Pacers in 00, without Kobe's overtime heroics when Shaq fouled out in regulation... this is not even considering the comeback Kobe led against Portland to even get the team to the finals in 00.

Shaq was the man, Kobe was just as impactful. Without the other, neither wins. together they were magical. Move on.

[Glide2keva]

i remember back in the days when there was this one stretch when shaq went down, lakers lost a whole bunch of games with kobe chucking a lot and laker and shaq stans kept shitting on kobe. and when shaq came back, they started winningI remember that too. I still happens that Kobe will chuck his team right out of the game.

[Euroleague]

Actually, the refs carried them to that 3-peat.

[BallsOut]

Sorry Pistol Pete fans, OP is a phagg0t

[Deuce Bigalow]

I remember that too. I still happens that Kobe will chuck his team right out of the game.
Team Record - Regular Season
When Kobe plays
784-407
.658 W-L%

When Kobe scores 30+ points
263-139
.654 W-L%

When Kobe scores 40+ points
77-39
.664 W-L%

When Kobe scores 50+ points
17-7
.708 W-L%

Team Record - Playoffs
When Kobe plays
135-85
.614 W-L%

When Kobe scores 30+ points
57-31
.648 W-L%

When Kobe scores 40+ points
10-3
.769 W-L%

When Kobe scores 50+ points
0-1
.000 W-L%

Team Record - Finals
When Kobe plays
23-14
.622 W-L%

When Kobe scores 30+ points
9-4
.692 W-L%

When Kobe scores 40+ points
1-0
1.000 W-L%

[SacJB Shady]

anyone who thinks the Lakers would have won those 3 championships without Kobe, never watched the games.

Had the never drafted Kobe and stuck with Eddie Jones, a all-star 2 guard at the time... they probably would have won 1 with Shaq, 2 if they were lucky. What Kobe did throughout the Western Conference playoffs in that 3-peat, was legendary. They do not make the finals without Kobe in 01 and 02, flat out. and they probably don't beat the Pacers in 00, without Kobe's overtime heroics when Shaq fouled out in regulation... this is not even considering the comeback Kobe led against Portland to even get the team to the finals in 00.

Shaq was the man, Kobe was just as impactful. Without the other, neither wins. together they were magical. Move on.



Shaq did win without Kobe though. Wade.

[SpecialQue]

People on ISH are so eager to roll around in a field filled with dogshit. Why even try to come up with arguments in this thread? OP is pretty much an infant crapping in his diaper just so you'll give him some attention after you notice the smell.

[CAstill]

anyone who thinks the Lakers would have won those 3 championships without Kobe, never watched the games.

Had the never drafted Kobe and stuck with Eddie Jones, a all-star 2 guard at the time... they probably would have won 1 with Shaq, 2 if they were lucky. What Kobe did throughout the Western Conference playoffs in that 3-peat, was legendary. They do not make the finals without Kobe in 01 and 02, flat out. and they probably don't beat the Pacers in 00, without Kobe's overtime heroics when Shaq fouled out in regulation... this is not even considering the comeback Kobe led against Portland to even get the team to the finals in 00.

Shaq was the man, Kobe was just as impactful. Without the other, neither wins. together they were magical. Move on.


I agree with your post but I'm a little confused. You say Shaq with Eddie Jones instead of Kobe would have won one possibly two if lucky, then you
go on to explain why the Lakers would of won zero without Kobe. Shaq had both at one point lol. Lakers win zero with Shaq and other players. I agree
that Shaq did the most heavy lifting in 00 but no one would beat that Portland team if it wasn't for bryant being able to do what he did.

[lakerspng]

I agree with your post but I'm a little confused. You say Shaq with Eddie Jones instead of Kobe would have won one possibly two if lucky, then you
go on to explain why the Lakers would of won zero without Kobe. Shaq had both at one point lol. Lakers win zero with Shaq and other players. I agree
that Shaq did the most heavy lifting in 00 but no one would beat that Portland team if it wasn't for bryant being able to do what he did.

I think the Lakers would probably have still won in 00 if they had Eddie Jones and no Kobe. Who knows, they may not have been down 16 to Portland in the 4th. If not 00, then in 01 they may have won with Eddie... or 02. I don't think it's likely though, Kobe's performances in the 01 and 02 playoffs were just amazing and very few guards in history would even come close to what he did for 1 series, what to speak of the entire Western conference playoffs against teams like the Spurs, the Kings , the Blazers, etc. There are just too many variables to accurately say it would have gone one way or the other. The facts we do know, Kobe and Shaq, along with great contributions from a number of solid vets, won 3 straight rings. That's all that matters to me.

[JellyBean]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

We did? Hmm that is interesting.

[KungFuJoe]

Shaq was finals MVP, no doubt. But carried through the playoffs? HELL NO.

Spurs. That's all I gotta say about that. Spurs.

Also keep in mind that the West completely dominated the East in terms of talent. The finals back then was a formality during the Lakers 3peat...it was pretty much whoever won the west was gonna be champ.

[CAstill]

I think the Lakers would probably have still won in 00 if they had Eddie Jones and no Kobe. Who knows, they may not have been down 16 to Portland in the 4th. If not 00, then in 01 they may have won with Eddie... or 02. I don't think it's likely though, Kobe's performances in the 01 and 02 playoffs were just amazing and very few guards in history would even come close to what he did for 1 series, what to speak of the entire Western conference playoffs against teams like the Spurs, the Kings , the Blazers, etc. There are just too many variables to accurately say it would have gone one way or the other. The facts we do know, Kobe and Shaq, along with great contributions from a number of solid vets, won 3 straight rings. That's all that matters to me.


I'm reading your post and you still contradict yourself.
Kobe was the only one in the league who could see Blazers, Spurs, Kings
in the years mentioned. Shaq and Eddie win zero. Simple as that.
All three of those teams had the Lakers number just Not Kobe's.

[Rubio2Gasol]

None of that has anything to do with the fact that Shaq was the man, and was clearly FMVP all three times. Nobody's saying Kobe deserves zero credit, just that he doesn't deserve as much as Shaq. It's easy to put up big numbers when the defense has to deal with the MDE in the paint and you're facing some of the worst finals teams of all time.

Were Kobe's numbers impressive? Yes. But was Shaq clearly more important to the team than Kobe? By far. This is indisputable, and what this thread is about; not how many guards have put up X/X/X

Shaq was option 1, Kobe was option 2
Not 1A 1B as stans wish was true

Have to disagree with this.

Finals in these years was practically a formality for the Western Conference winner. The real series were those series in the West and Kobe more than pulled his weight in them.

He was just flat out better in some.

It was a duo.

End of debate.

[Kiddlovesnets]

If kobes role was basically the same as horrys, shouldn't there be a Lakers 3peat from 97-99 based on your logic?

You apparently have forgotten that there was a player called Michael Jordan from 97-98. In 99 they had a horrible coach Kurt Rambis.

[BlueandGold]

Shaq "carried" the Lakers in 00-02 just like Kareem or Wilt "carried" the Lakers in the 70s and 80s. All 3 dominated the paint but wouldn't have even come close to winning their rings without the backcourt help of West, Goodrich, Magic, Worthy and Bryant.

The irony here is that Bryant actually had the least help as far as the backcourt while Magic had Cooper and Worthy while West had Goodrich and Baylor.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Shaq "carried" the Lakers in 00-02 just like Kareem or Wilt "carried" the Lakers in the 70s and 80s. All 3 dominated the paint but wouldn't have even come close to winning their rings without the backcourt help of West, Goodrich, Magic, Worthy and Bryant.

The irony here is that Bryant actually had the least help as far as the backcourt while Magic had Cooper and Worthy while West had Goodrich and Baylor.

Its such an insult to compare 00-02 Kobe to prime West, Goodrich and Magic. Kobe did not enter his prime until 2006, before 03 he was just a role player.

[CAstill]

Its such an insult to compare 00-02 Kobe to prime West, Goodrich and Magic. Kobe did not enter his prime until 2006, before 03 he was just a role player.

You must love hating Kobe lol.
He was better and proved it.
A role player isn't slaying the West by himself lol.
He was the best player in the world before he even hit
his prime :rockon:

[Kiddlovesnets]

He was the best player in the world before he even hit
his prime :rockon:

:facepalm

[Deuce Bigalow]

Its such an insult to compare 00-02 Kobe to prime West, Goodrich and Magic. Kobe did not enter his prime until 2006, before 03 he was just a role player.
http://defenestradordeornitorrincos.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/facepalm.gif

[chazzy]

Its such an insult to compare 00-02 Kobe to prime West, Goodrich and Magic. Kobe did not enter his prime until 2006, before 03 he was just a role player.
What did Kobe do to the Nets in 02?

[Kiddlovesnets]

What did Kobe do to the Nets in 02?

Didnt you read my earlier post? The Nets were triple-teaming Shaq, Kobe was either guarded by the player he matched up or simply left open. Are you telling me that 24 year old Kobe couldnt hit wide-open shots? Even so Shaq still managed to outperform Kobe in that series and won FMVP.

[BlueandGold]

Its such an insult to compare 00-02 Kobe to prime West, Goodrich and Magic. Kobe did not enter his prime until 2006, before 03 he was just a role player.
Blatantly trolling? np.

[La Frescobaldi]

Shaq "carried" the Lakers in 00-02 just like Kareem or Wilt "carried" the Lakers in the 70s and 80s. All 3 dominated the paint but wouldn't have even come close to winning their rings without the backcourt help of West, Goodrich, Magic, Worthy and Bryant.

The irony here is that Bryant actually had the least help as far as the backcourt while Magic had Cooper and Worthy while West had Goodrich and Baylor.

While Baylor is not valid in that comment (he was DNP injured in '71 playoffs, and retired after just 9 games in '72) I do think you have made a great point right here.

Shaq had Penny in the 90s but couldn't quite make it all the way against that brilliant Chicago team or the Rockets - if they had somebody of Goodrich caliber at the other G? it's hard to say what would have happened.

Jerry & Gail was a dangerous combo for sure, and Magic had COOPS!! Interesting that in each case one of the guards was high level defense.

Fisher I don't think ever took NBA defensive team honors, but he was real strong defender and acted as Lakers' free safety to stop a lot of breakaway touchdowns... and Bryan Shaw had real important minutes all through those Shaq years. But we're not talking about GG or Coops level

[CAstill]

:facepalm

You're a clown and he was. Deal with it.
Shaq getting FMVP was made by scheme and respect.
Kobe was the best player on the planet and your nets
didn't triple team Shaq, gtfoh. :coleman:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Where's the triple team? I thought Kobe was left open?

http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/673859_o.gif

[CAstill]

He's talking about when his nets lost in the finals
He's a clown.

[Extempo]

Sorry dumbass, I'm a Laker fan and I've been watching this team for years, through many championships and Shaq DID NOT carry the team to 3-peat.

Kobe is the one who destroyed the Spurs and Kings, who were the REAL great teams we faced in the playoffs during the 3-peat, not the WEAK eastern conference teams that Shaq used to beat up on. Popovich himself said they didn't know what to do with Kobe, look up his quotes.

Shaq wasn't even our go to guy in the clutch, that was mostly Kobe, then Horry, Fish, and others.

This thread is dumb.

[CAstill]

It's funny how every laker fan that claimed to watch
the 3peat years instantly denies Shaq carrying anything lol.
Good to see actual fans who watched the games post.

[red1]

Where's the triple team? I thought Kobe was left open?

http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/673859_o.gif
that crossover was dirty

[PistolPete44]

HAHA all the Shaq- bashers appeared

[PistolPete44]

Sorry dumbass, I'm a Laker fan and I've been watching this team for years, through many championships and Shaq DID NOT carry the team to 3-peat.

Kobe is the one who destroyed the Spurs and Kings, who were the REAL great teams we faced in the playoffs during the 3-peat, not the WEAK eastern conference teams that Shaq used to beat up on. Popovich himself said they didn't know what to do with Kobe, look up his quotes.

Shaq wasn't even our go to guy in the clutch, that was mostly Kobe, then Horry, Fish, and others.

This thread is dumb.

"Lakers fans always said Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe"
This statement is really true :roll:
I hope cancer get your mom

[red1]

"Lakers fans always said Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe"
This statement is really true :roll:
I hope cancer get your mom
c'mon son

[scandisk_]

"Lakers fans always said Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe"
This statement is really true :roll:
I hope cancer get your mom

That's fcukin low man, oh wait you're a 12 year old.

[Deuce Bigalow]

PistolPete44....RG?

Lol at this guy putting up a Wilt avy thinking he's some kind of historian but writes like a 12 year old.

[AlphaWolf24]

Hey OP....

- It's not just Kobe stans that said it....

- nearly everyone said it.....including the Lakers Captain

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=383sFr1IkcI&list=UUjBhx3Gfd1vhiMCiyYmLh1g&index=2

[scandisk_]

PistolPete44....RG?

ISH Can Never Have Enough of RG's sock-puppet accounts.

[CAstill]

"Lakers fans always said Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe"
This statement is really true :roll:
I hope cancer get your mom


What goes around come around
Don't be saying stupid stuff you'll regret.

Shaq didn't steal any FVMP's from Kobe. Period.

[The Iron Fist]

You apparently have forgotten that there was a player called Michael Jordan from 97-98. In 99 they had a horrible coach Kurt Rambis.
You apparently forgot Shaq is mde. Or does mde only exist for three years?

[PistolPete44]

What goes around come around
Don't be saying stupid stuff you'll regret.

Shaq didn't steal any FVMP's from Kobe. Period.
go talk to those kobetards on page 5 you moron

[CAstill]

go talk to those kobetards on page 5 you moron

I just read the whole page no one said it
unless you're talking about and disputing the
post that claims Kobe was the closer which was true so........
You're the moron here.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Kobe was not carried to those 3 rings, but he was not as good or valuable as Shaq at the time. He was the best player in the Spurs series in '01 and '02, however. Kobe was also the second best player in the '01 and '02 playoffs, and many considered him the second best player in the entire league at the time. The only reason I'm hesitant to agree is because Duncan was in the league. Either way, Kobe's performances during the '01 and '02 playoffs was better than some championship team's first option which is why you can't just judge rings as "first option rings" or "second option rings" without context. The consensus during these years was that Shaq was the best player in the league, but if you try using that to discredit Kobe then you also have to remember that the consensus was that Kobe was the second best player in the league starting around the 2001 playoffs. The gap was much larger in 2000, but Kobe was still a top 10 player, imo, and probably the best shooting guard in the league. This was not a typical team because there was no 3rd all-star caliber player, or even really a 3rd scoring option save for 2000 with an aging Glen Rice in that role putting up 12/4/2, 41% in the playoffs. This left plenty of room for Kobe to play his game and produce like a first option himself with Derek Fisher or Rick Fox as the closest thing the team had to a 3rd option in 2001 and 2002. Neither were scoring options. The offense went through Shaq first, but Kobe didn't have to take a backseat like Wade has the last 2 seasons because there's no Chris Bosh, much less a Ray Allen now as well, and because Kobe was improving, not declining like Wade.

[CAstill]

:facepalm
whatever makes you sleep well at night lol
Kobe was better in every playoff series straight up.
Shaq was schematically induced to win FMVP
and that's why Kobe was never robbed of any FMVPs
They we're rightfully Shaq's but he was't the best player
nor was he the Lakers most important nor do stats show
who the best is. Like the other laker fan mentioned before
I was at the games, I saw first hand what was going on.
Kings had Shaqs number and so did Timmy and Co.
Shaq and any other player in the league would of lost
to those specific teams at that time, especially the Kings.
That's what It will always come down to.
The fact that during the 3peat only 3 teams
we're good enough to be champions.
Blazers in 00, Kings in 01, 02 and Spurs in 02.
Those teams fear and blame KOBE not Shaq.
Kobe is the reason the Kings don't have a ring.
The reason Duncan didn't rip off a dynasty,
and the Reason why Shaq got 3.

[Darius]

Why do people keep making these posts?

It's like telling people the sky is blue. It's absolutely obvious and you aren't going to convince anyone that disagrees because they are, essentially, mentally deranged.

[CAstill]

Why do people keep making these posts?

It's like telling people the sky is blue. It's absolutely obvious and you aren't going to convince anyone that disagrees because they are, essentially, mentally deranged.

Only the sky isn't blue, it's a complex spectrum of colors that bends
light in different ways given the time of day and the person viewing
the spectrum could lead to different perceptions of colors based
on how they were raised. Basically you're wrong and Shaq didn't
carry squat. If i remember correctly he said " he wasn't going to baby sit"
:roll:
Hate on.......

[Force]

It amazes me how badly people want to change history. Shaq carried the team no doubt and was by far the team and the entire leagues MVP. Stealing Finals MVP's? LOL, Kobe was nowhere near getting one of those awards. Prime Shaq was absolutely unfair to the rest of the league.

[DKLaker]

It amazes me how badly people want to change history. Shaq carried the team no doubt and was by far the team and the entire leagues MVP. Stealing Finals MVP's? LOL, Kobe was nowhere near getting one of those awards. Prime Shaq was absolutely unfair to the rest of the league.

Team wouldn't have won anything without Kobe, it's idiotic to say otherwise.
Shaq and Kobe were equals.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

2000

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF at home vs Portland

Kobe 25 points 11 rebounds 7 assists 20.3 GameScore
Shaq 18 points 9 rebounds 5 assists 14.6 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200006040LAL.html

2001

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 5 of the Finals on the road vs Philly

Kobe 26 points 12 rebounds 6 assists 21.9 GameScore
Shaq 29 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 21.8 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200106150PHI.html

2002

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF on the road vs Sacramento

Shaq 35 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 25.8 GameScore
Kobe 30 points 10 rebounds 7 assists 24.1 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200206020SAC.html

Average GameScore:

Kobe: 22.1
Shaq: 20.7

:confusedshrug:

[Thorn]

I think my favorite part of this thread is the "Sorry Lakers fans" part. As if Laker fans are sorry Shaq was wrecking teams during the threepeat.

[Mach_3]

Jesus i didn't realize there were so many kobe stans on this website :roll:

[Nevaeh]

2000

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF at home vs Portland

Kobe 25 points 11 rebounds 7 assists 20.3 GameScore
Shaq 18 points 9 rebounds 5 assists 14.6 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200006040LAL.html

2001

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 5 of the Finals on the road vs Philly

Kobe 26 points 12 rebounds 6 assists 21.9 GameScore
Shaq 29 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 21.8 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200106150PHI.html

2002

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF on the road vs Sacramento

Shaq 35 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 25.8 GameScore
Kobe 30 points 10 rebounds 7 assists 24.1 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200206020SAC.html

Average GameScore:

Kobe: 22.1
Shaq: 20.7

:confusedshrug:


Why don't you just post each of their stat lines for the entire series during those specific years, instead of just isolated games?


http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/images/smilies/confusedshrug.gif

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Why don't you just post each of their stat lines for the entire series during those specific years, instead of just isolated games?


http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/images/smilies/confusedshrug.gif

Good point. lol

And why on Earth was game 5 (2001 finals) more important than game 3? :confusedshrug:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Why don't you just post each of their stat lines for the entire series during those specific years, instead of just isolated games?


http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/images/smilies/confusedshrug.gif

Because I don't think all playoff games are equally vital in terms of securing a championship. Do you? Nothing is stopping you from posting whatever you think it is I'm missing..

[Leviathon1121]

2000

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF at home vs Portland

Kobe 25 points 11 rebounds 7 assists 20.3 GameScore
Shaq 18 points 9 rebounds 5 assists 14.6 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200006040LAL.html

2001

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 5 of the Finals on the road vs Philly

Kobe 26 points 12 rebounds 6 assists 21.9 GameScore
Shaq 29 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 21.8 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200106150PHI.html

2002

Most critical game of the playoffs Game 7 of the WCF on the road vs Sacramento

Shaq 35 points 13 rebounds 2 assists 25.8 GameScore
Kobe 30 points 10 rebounds 7 assists 24.1 GameScore

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200206020SAC.html

Average GameScore:

Kobe: 22.1
Shaq: 20.7

:confusedshrug:

2009

Most critical game of playoffs Game 7 of WCSF

Pau 21 points 18 rebounds 1 assist

Kobe 14 points 7 rebounds 5 assists

:confusedshrug:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Good point. lol

And why on Earth was game 5 (2001 finals) more important than game 3? :confusedshrug:

Well comparatively there is no game that game equates to the elimination games of 2000 and 2002 since the Lakers were so dominant. So I went with the final win to secure the championship. :confusedshrug:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Well comparatively there is no game that game equates to the elimination games of 2000 and 2002 since the Lakers were so dominant. So I went with the final win to secure the championship. :confusedshrug:

They were playing w/ house money, though. Win or lose, they still lead the series and go back home for 2 games.

Going into game 3 the series was tied a game a piece ... w/ 3 games at Philly. HUGE difference.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

2009

Most critical game of playoffs Game 7 of WCSF

Pau 21 points 18 rebounds 1 assist

Kobe 14 points 7 rebounds 5 assists

:confusedshrug:

Game stopped being vital when the Lakers came into halftime with a 20 point lead allowing Phil Jackson to give Kobe only 33 minutes of playing time (his lowest of any postseason game) :confusedshrug:

[Deuce Bigalow]

2009

Most critical game of playoffs Game 7 of WCSF

Pau 21 points 18 rebounds 1 assist

Kobe 14 points 7 rebounds 5 assists

:confusedshrug:
:roll:

That was a blowout.

[Leviathon1121]

Game stopped being vital when the Lakers came into halftime with a 20 point lead allowing Phil Jackson to give Kobe only 33 minutes of playing time (his lowest of any postseason game) :confusedshrug:

Why are you suddenly so concerned about context? You have never believed in it before, why now? All I posted were facts, you know, just like you do. :confusedshrug:

[Cladyclad]

2009

Most critical game of playoffs Game 7 of WCSF

Pau 21 points 18 rebounds 1 assist

Kobe 14 points 7 rebounds 5 assists

:confusedshrug:


This is the bull i talk about. Another person who didnt watch the games. Just search the net looking at box scores. But in the end falling flat on his face.

[Leviathon1121]

This is the bull i talk about. Another person who didnt watch the games. Just search the net looking at box scores. But in the end falling flat on his face.

I did not fall flat on my face, I knew exactly what I was posting. It simply went WAY over your head is all.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Why are you suddenly so concerned about context? You have never believed in it before, why now? All I posted were facts, you know, just like you do. :confusedshrug:

I've always been a big fan of context. Strength of competition and difficulty of defense faced are some of the contextual themes that I post about frequently.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

They were playing w/ house money, though. Win or lose, they still lead the series and go back home for 2 games.

Going into game 3 the series was tied a game a piece ... w/ 3 games at Philly. HUGE difference.

Just my opinion but home court advantage wasn't important to the 2001 Lakers in the postseason. It is for most teams but they were undefeated on the road. It didn't matter.

[Deuce Bigalow]

I did not fall flat on my face, I knew exactly what I was posting. It simply went WAY over your head is all.
Foot posted games that were close in 00 and 02. You posted a game that was basically over at halftime.

[Leviathon1121]

Foot posted games that were close in 00 and 02. You posted a game that was basically over at halftime.

He does not believe in context, everyone here knows this. It is funny watching you rush to his aid though. Kobe fans :roll:

[pauk]

Why do you say sorry? Its a fact afterall... Shaq was the man there...

[Deuce Bigalow]

Why do you say sorry? Its a fact afterall... Shaq was the man there...
Kobe was the leading scorer in 4/8 series, 18/35 games, second half scoring, and 4th quarter scoring in the 2001 and 2002 Playoffs. It was a two man team the last two years of the 3peat, like a Magic/Kareem duo in 80, 82, and 85.
Shaq carried the Lakers in 2000, like Magic did in 87-88.

[Big#50]

Revisionist history. Most Stans were just kids from 2000-2002.
As a die hard Lakers fan during that time, you should know that team was all Shaq's. The attention he demanded goes way beyond the stats. He deflated teams hopes before even scoring one basket. The guy was a monster beyond anything the league witnessed. He killed frontlines single handedly. Kobe was along for the ride doing his thing. Just like every superstar has had a player that gives him that help he needs. Kobe was that guy. Amazing player feeding off the big man. Kobe stepped up more than once, he's a great player, that's what they do. In no way was he as important to the success they had. It was Shaq 75/25. Stop this bullshit. They were not equals. Phil Jackson called it Shaq's team. Kobe himself said he was tired of being a sidekick. Los Angeles as a city knew it was Shaq's team. The NBA knew. Other teams knew. Stans need to know. Stop making Shit up. Kobe is a top ten player. One of the best ever. No need to try to push him down our throats.

[PJR]

Revisionist history. Most Stans were just kids from 2000-2002.
As a die hard Lakers fan during that time, you should know that team was all Shaq's. The attention he demanded goes way beyond the stats. He deflated teams hopes before even scoring one basket. The guy was a monster beyond anything the league witnessed. He killed frontlines single handedly. Kobe was along for the ride doing his thing. Just like every superstar has had a player that gives him that help he needs. Kobe was that guy. Amazing player feeding off the big man. Kobe stepped up more than once, he's a great player, that's what they do. In no way was he as important to the success they had. It was Shaq 75/25. Stop this bullshit. They were not equals. Phil Jackson called it Shaq's team. Kobe himself said he was tired of being a sidekick. Los Angeles as a city knew it was Shaq's team. The NBA knew. Other teams knew. Stans need to know. Stop making Shit up. Kobe is a top ten player. One of the best ever. No need to try to push him down our throats.

:applause:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

He does not believe in context, everyone here knows this. It is funny watching you rush to his aid though. Kobe fans :roll:

When I point out that Jordan played against weak defenses , that's context.
When I point that Kobe faced elite defensive teams in the Finals, thats context.
When I point that unlike other NBA legends Kobe Bryant won multiple rings with just 1 Hall of Fame teammate, that's context.
When I point out that Lebron's first trip to the Finals was the weakest path to the Finals in history, that's context.
When I point out that 21 year old Kobe was the best player in the most crucial game of the playoffs to bring home that first title thats context.

You need to look up the meaning of the word. :confusedshrug:

[eliteballer]

Shaq was the man in 2000(besides Game 7 vs Blazers..) but they were equal from there on...Shaq was too big of a liability late in games.

[tpols]

Kobe was not carried to those 3 rings, but he was not as good or valuable as Shaq at the time. He was the best player in the Spurs series in '01 and '02, however. Kobe was also the second best player in the '01 and '02 playoffs, and many considered him the second best player in the entire league at the time. The only reason I'm hesitant to agree is because Duncan was in the league. Either way, Kobe's performances during the '01 and '02 playoffs was better than some championship team's first option which is why you can't just judge rings as "first option rings" or "second option rings" without context. The consensus during these years was that Shaq was the best player in the league, but if you try using that to discredit Kobe then you also have to remember that the consensus was that Kobe was the second best player in the league starting around the 2001 playoffs. The gap was much larger in 2000, but Kobe was still a top 10 player, imo, and probably the best shooting guard in the league. This was not a typical team because there was no 3rd all-star caliber player, or even really a 3rd scoring option save for 2000 with an aging Glen Rice in that role putting up 12/4/2, 41% in the playoffs. This left plenty of room for Kobe to play his game and produce like a first option himself with Derek Fisher or Rick Fox as the closest thing the team had to a 3rd option in 2001 and 2002. Neither were scoring options. The offense went through Shaq first, but Kobe didn't have to take a backseat like Wade has the last 2 seasons because there's no Chris Bosh, much less a Ray Allen now as well, and because Kobe was improving, not declining like Wade.And ShaqAttack3234 drops knowledge again. :applause:

Anyone divertting from this more than a little bit is either on the stan end of the spectrum or a bitter hater.

[Money 23]

Kobe was not carried to those 3 rings, but he was not as good or valuable as Shaq at the time. He was the best player in the Spurs series in '01 and '02, however. Kobe was also the second best player in the '01 and '02 playoffs, and many considered him the second best player in the entire league at the time. The only reason I'm hesitant to agree is because Duncan was in the league. Either way, Kobe's performances during the '01 and '02 playoffs was better than some championship team's first option which is why you can't just judge rings as "first option rings" or "second option rings" without context. The consensus during these years was that Shaq was the best player in the league, but if you try using that to discredit Kobe then you also have to remember that the consensus was that Kobe was the second best player in the league starting around the 2001 playoffs. The gap was much larger in 2000, but Kobe was still a top 10 player, imo, and probably the best shooting guard in the league. This was not a typical team because there was no 3rd all-star caliber player, or even really a 3rd scoring option save for 2000 with an aging Glen Rice in that role putting up 12/4/2, 41% in the playoffs. This left plenty of room for Kobe to play his game and produce like a first option himself with Derek Fisher or Rick Fox as the closest thing the team had to a 3rd option in 2001 and 2002. Neither were scoring options. The offense went through Shaq first, but Kobe didn't have to take a backseat like Wade has the last 2 seasons because there's no Chris Bosh, much less a Ray Allen now as well, and because Kobe was improving, not declining like Wade.
[/thread]

:pimp:

[Rasheed1]

Revisionist history. Most Stans were just kids from 2000-2002.
As a die hard Lakers fan during that time, you should know that team was all Shaq's. The attention he demanded goes way beyond the stats. He deflated teams hopes before even scoring one basket. The guy was a monster beyond anything the league witnessed. He killed frontlines single handedly. Kobe was along for the ride doing his thing. Just like every superstar has had a player that gives him that help he needs. Kobe was that guy. Amazing player feeding off the big man. Kobe stepped up more than once, he's a great player, that's what they do. In no way was he as important to the success they had. It was Shaq 75/25. Stop this bullshit. They were not equals. Phil Jackson called it Shaq's team. Kobe himself said he was tired of being a sidekick. Los Angeles as a city knew it was Shaq's team. The NBA knew. Other teams knew. Stans need to know. Stop making Shit up. Kobe is a top ten player. One of the best ever. No need to try to push him down our throats.

Yes indeed.. every word of it..

Shaq drove coaches crazy because he ruins your defensive scheme. Its mandatory for somebody to collapse on him immediately. the lakers had multiple guys who could feed off of Shaq's dominance, but it all hinged on him.. None of it works if teams dont have collapse soo hard on this guy everytime he touches the ball.. he was a great passer and made teams pay. His dominance and how it ruined the opponents defense cannot be overstated.

[Money 23]

Yes indeed.. every word of it..
Everything but the 75/25 of Shaq's importance to Bryant. In 2000, I will give it that ... but not 2001 and 2002. If I had to assign arbitray numbers displaying their level of importance, the guesstimates would be as so:

2001 = Shaq 55% Kobe 45%
2002 = Shaq 60% Kobe 40%

[The Iron Fist]

Revisionist history. Most Stans were just kids from 2000-2002.
As a die hard Lakers fan during that time, you should know that team was all Shaq's. The attention he demanded goes way beyond the stats. He deflated teams hopes before even scoring one basket. The guy was a monster beyond anything the league witnessed. He killed frontlines single handedly. Kobe was along for the ride doing his thing. Just like every superstar has had a player that gives him that help he needs. Kobe was that guy. Amazing player feeding off the big man. Kobe stepped up more than once, he's a great player, that's what they do. In no way was he as important to the success they had. It was Shaq 75/25. Stop this bullshit. They were not equals. Phil Jackson called it Shaq's team. Kobe himself said he was tired of being a sidekick. Los Angeles as a city knew it was Shaq's team. The NBA knew. Other teams knew. Stans need to know. Stop making Shit up. Kobe is a top ten player. One of the best ever. No need to try to push him down our throats.
Where are the Shaq led titles in 97-99?

[Nevaeh]

Yes indeed.. every word of it..

Shaq drove coaches crazy because he ruins your defensive scheme. Its mandatory for somebody to collapse on him immediately. the lakers had multiple guys who could feed off of Shaq's dominance, but it all hinged on him.. None of it works if teams dont have collapse soo hard on this guy everytime he touches the ball.. he was a great passer and made teams pay. His dominance and how it ruined the opponents defense cannot be overstated.

This is what made Larry Brown such a genius during the 2004 Finals. He actually stopped collapsing on Shaq, and decided instead to trap Kobe, knowing he wouldn't be expecting it. I guess he figured that after Kobe hit that big shot in game 2, that he couldn't afford to let Kobe get hot, along with Shaq being his usual self.

This move pretty much "exposed" this version of the Lakers a bit, because the perimeter guys weren't getting those great "looks" anymore.

[eliteballer]

You're kidding yourself if you think those Lakers were the same team as the championship Lakers.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

You're kidding yourself if you think those Lakers were the same team as the championship Lakers.

or that any other defense from 00-02 was on par with the 2004 Pistons.

[Nevaeh]

or that any other defense from 00-02 was on par with the 2004 Pistons.

Shaq seemed to do alright against them.

:confusedshrug:

[Big#50]

Where are the Shaq led titles in 97-99?
If you watched basketball in those days, you would know how much Shaq blew up in 2000. 97-99 Shaq was not as good as 2000 Shaq. Not even close. His defense was great in 2000. There's such as a thing as elevating your game. Becoming a more complete player. I don't know if you know that. He Lakers supporting cast sucked in the playoffs those seasons.
Where was Kobe in the playoffs in 05? Where was Kobe's rings without a great big man in 06 in 07? What happened when his big man stopped trying in 2011 and 2012? See how stupid you sound?

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Shaq seemed to do alright against them.

:confusedshrug:

Shaq and Kobe had great playoff series against a lot of elite defenses. Sometimes both at the same time. That's why when we compare defenses we don't just look at how two of the greatest players of all time played against them but rather the entire regular season and post season.

[AlphaWolf24]

- By 2001 Kobe was the best allaround player in the NBA....and arguably the best player ( with Shaq being viewd as the most dominant??) in the NBA

- Kobe was just as important to LA as Shaq.....Kobe's ability to get his shot and close games all while running the triangle and playing top shelf Defense was just as important If not more then Shaq.

- Kobe showed this time and time against vs the tru elite teams....especially in the real Finals ( WCFinals)

- anyone arguing this....or the fact that anyone carried anyone is just a Blind man who can't recognize

- Troll Fed.........in the 1,000,000th Kobe bashing thread of the year.

[Kiddlovesnets]

- By 2001 Kobe was the best allaround player in the NBA....and arguably the best player ( with Shaq being viewd as the most dominant??) in the NBA

- Kobe was just as important to LA as Shaq.....Kobe's ability to get his shot and close games all while running the triangle and playing top shelf Defense was just as important If not more then Shaq.

- Kobe showed this time and time against vs the tru elite teams....especially in the real Finals ( WCFinals)

- anyone arguing this....or the fact that anyone carried anyone is just a Blind man who can't recognize

- Troll Fed.........in the 1,000,000th Kobe bashing thread of the year.

:facepalm

[AlphaWolf24]

:facepalm


http://i495.photobucket.com/albums/rr320/BruceBlitz/AlphaWolf-2173769_596_800_zpsa88ae143.jpg


- what are you palming about?....

-Kobe was arguably the best player in the NBA...

- go away if you can't recognize son..

[Nevaeh]

http://i495.photobucket.com/albums/rr320/BruceBlitz/AlphaWolf-2173769_596_800_zpsa88ae143.jpg


- what are you palming about?....

-Kobe was arguably the best player in the NBA...

- go away if you can't recognize son..

Dude, Kobe didn't even finish Top 5 in MVP voting during the 00-01 season.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif

What YOU need be recognizing is how to use a search engine to find out sh!t before posting.

[Kiddlovesnets]

http://i495.photobucket.com/albums/rr320/BruceBlitz/AlphaWolf-2173769_596_800_zpsa88ae143.jpg


- what are you palming about?....

-Kobe was arguably the best player in the NBA...

- go away if you can't recognize son..

You mad? It was Shaq's team, Lakers won because of that magnificent Shaq one man show. Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry during Lakers 3-peat.
:lol

[AlphaWolf24]

Dude, Kobe didn't even finish Top 5 in MVP voting during the 00-01 season.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif

What YOU need be recognizing is how to use a search engine to find out sh!t before posting.


- you were still swimming with your brothers in 2001....you basketball illiterate M@fuka..:oldlol:

- You using MVP voting?....everyone who watched the game back then said Kobe was a top 1- 3 player in the NBA...obviously you didn't

- By your own worthless criteria...AI was better then Shaq and Kobe....Nash was way better then Kobe in 06?

- watch the games and quit using search engines on the interwebz ......you don't rate to talk hoop about this ...


(thumps chest)...next

[AlphaWolf24]

You mad? It was Shaq's team, Lakers won because of that magnificent Shaq one man show. Kobe's role was not much more important than Robert Horry during Lakers 3-peat.
:lol

Shaq's team?...that's why he got booted...


http://www.celticstown.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/shaq-kendrick-perkins-500x254.jpg

http://lakers.topbuzz.com/gallery/d/280651-2/Laker+fan+with+Back2Back+without+Shaq+sign+during+ the+Lakers+Championship+Parade+2010.JPG


burn slow ma *****

[Nevaeh]

- you were still swimming with your brothers in 2001....you basketball illiterate M@fuka..:oldlol:

- You using MVP voting?....everyone who watched the game back then said Kobe was a top 1- 3 player in the NBA...obviously you didn't

- By your own worthless criteria...AI was better then Shaq and Kobe....Nash was way better then Kobe in 06?

- watch the games and quit using search engines on the interwebz ......you don't rate to talk hoop about this ...


(thumps chest)...next

You said that Kobe was THE "best all around player" in 2001. "Best Players" are usually in the top 5 in MVP voting, top 3 if they're really good. He was bested in voting by his own teammate that year, yet you're still on that "revise history" crusade of yours. Your boy was number 9 in MVP voting, behind even Karl "already a 15 year veteran" Malone.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif

[AlphaWolf24]

You said that Kobe was THE "best all around player" in 2001. "Best Players" are usually in the top 5 in MVP voting, top 3 if they're really good. He was bested in voting by his own teammate that year, yet you're still on that "revise history" crusade of yours. Your boy was number 9 in MVP voting, behind even Karl "already a 15 year veteran" Malone.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif


- Not true at all.....at 22 years old.(same age as Kobe in 2001)..Michael Jordan was 6th in mvp voting ......there was not 5 better players then MJ in 1985.

- you are using the MVP agenda to push that Kobe wasn't not the best allaround player......he was......and he was arguably the best player in the NBA with Shaq and AI being he real only tru rivals.

- again...was Steve Nash a better player then Kobe,Shaq,Wade or Lebron in 2006???...just because his MVP criteria said it?

- Derek Rose was better then Durant,Lebron ,Kobe and Wade?

- 17 years and you still got yo jimmies rustled...:D

come on son

[Kiddlovesnets]

Shaq's team?...that's why he got booted...


http://www.celticstown.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/shaq-kendrick-perkins-500x254.jpg

http://lakers.topbuzz.com/gallery/d/280651-2/Laker+fan+with+Back2Back+without+Shaq+sign+during+ the+Lakers+Championship+Parade+2010.JPG


burn slow ma *****

lol you are talking about an old Washed-up Shaq and a prime Kobe during Lakers 2 titles run from 08-10. I was referring to Lakers three-peat from 00-02, with prime Shaq and role-player Kobe. Learn how to read before posting, can you?

[chazzy]

You said that Kobe was THE "best all around player" in 2001. "Best Players" are usually in the top 5 in MVP voting, top 3 if they're really good. He was bested in voting by his own teammate that year, yet you're still on that "revise history" crusade of yours. Your boy was number 9 in MVP voting, behind even Karl "already a 15 year veteran" Malone.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif
He was probably top 3 that year when you factor in his playoff run

[Dbrog]

Revisionist history. Most Stans were just kids from 2000-2002.
As a die hard Lakers fan during that time, you should know that team was all Shaq's. The attention he demanded goes way beyond the stats. He deflated teams hopes before even scoring one basket. The guy was a monster beyond anything the league witnessed. He killed frontlines single handedly. Kobe was along for the ride doing his thing. Just like every superstar has had a player that gives him that help he needs. Kobe was that guy. Amazing player feeding off the big man. Kobe stepped up more than once, he's a great player, that's what they do. In no way was he as important to the success they had. It was Shaq 75/25. Stop this bullshit. They were not equals. Phil Jackson called it Shaq's team. Kobe himself said he was tired of being a sidekick. Los Angeles as a city knew it was Shaq's team. The NBA knew. Other teams knew. Stans need to know. Stop making Shit up. Kobe is a top ten player. One of the best ever. No need to try to push him down our throats.

:applause:

[funnystuff]

- you were still swimming with your brothers in 2001....you basketball illiterate M@fuka..:oldlol:

- You using MVP voting?....everyone who watched the game back then said Kobe was a top 1- 3 player in the NBA...obviously you didn't

- By your own worthless criteria...AI was better then Shaq and Kobe....Nash was way better then Kobe in 06?

- watch the games and quit using search engines on the interwebz ......you don't rate to talk hoop about this ...


(thumps chest)...next
What an insult. :applause:

[TheBigVeto]

Shaq and Stern carried the Lakers.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Shaq and Stern carried the Lakers.

:cheers:
Future rep.

[miles berg]

Obviosuky Shaq did.

Bet Lakers ams miss that guy, team was a lot better when he was around.

Guys like Shaq & Magic are rare, Lakers fans were lucky to have two of them in their history.

[Rasheed1]

This is what made Larry Brown such a genius during the 2004 Finals. He actually stopped collapsing on Shaq, and decided instead to trap Kobe, knowing he wouldn't be expecting it. I guess he figured that after Kobe hit that big shot in game 2, that he couldn't afford to let Kobe get hot, along with Shaq being his usual self.

This move pretty much "exposed" this version of the Lakers a bit, because the perimeter guys weren't getting those great "looks" anymore.


good post... LB actually did the same thing against the Lakers when he was 76ers coach.

Trap the ball handlers and slow up the offense so Shaq doesnt have time to keep re-posting like he liked to do.

We shut kobe down in the first game, but Shaq tore mutombo a new one and we didnt have the talent to execute the plan.. Plus our guys were injured and falling apart. By the time we got to here to philly, Shaq was still killing us and kobe had adjusted and so did horry and fisher too. We simply couldnt match that firepower.

You are right though, Detroit did have the talent and Brown used that strategy to a tee

[Rysio]

false. it was closer to 1a 1b thing than anything and kobe wasnt even in his prime yet. while shaq was at his peak. :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[AlphaWolf24]

lol you are talking about an old Washed-up Shaq and a prime Kobe during Lakers 2 titles run from 08-10. I was referring to Lakers three-peat from 00-02, with prime Shaq and role-player Kobe. Learn how to read before posting, can you?


- so prime Shaq was already washed up after 2004???...wow...he fell outta his prime in 2 years:rolleyes:

- Fact is He was the nearly the same player from 1993 - 2008.......he just didn't have Kobe there to make look as Great.

[red1]

I can verify that kobe was considered a top 3 player by many during those runs. A lot of analysts were saying that the best and second best in the league were on the same team for 01 and 02. The difference is that shaq was in his prime and kobe was young and just coming into his prime, thus saying that shaq carried the team is not an unfair statement.

[Ne 1]

He was the nearly the same player from 1993 - 2008

:facepalm

[hawke812]

I hate how Lakers fans say Shaq stole the FMVPs from Kobe Bryant.
Did you even compare their stats during the 3-peat ?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

I respectively disagree.

Being carried means a team won in spite of someone's performance during the game(s).

The Lakers 3-Peated because of Kobe+Shaq, not because of Shaq + in spite of Kobe.

It is a team game. Stop your obvious troll attempts at the best looking guy in the NBA.

[SYM86]

But Kobe did Carried Shaq every 4th quarter during the 3-peat! if Kobe can't win without shaq there's no way Shaq can win without kobe. that's why they're the perfect dual for each other.

[Kiddlovesnets]

- so prime Shaq was already washed up after 2004???...wow...he fell outta his prime in 2 years:rolleyes:

- Fact is He was the nearly the same player from 1993 - 2008.......he just didn't have Kobe there to make look as Great.

lol your stupidity was entertaining. You used a pic of 2010 Shaq with Celtics to illustrate how bad Shaq was, it had little to do with prime Shaq from 99-05.

And nope, without Kobe Shaq could be even better. From 93 to 98 there was a god called Michael Jordaon, in 99 they had a horrible coach called Kurt Rambis. And can you explain why Lakers reign ended shortly after Kobe was entering his prime?

[TheBigVeto]

5 rings > 4 rings :pimp:

http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg
http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg
http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg

If that is so, 7 rings > 6 rings -> Horry > Michael Jordan.

[TheBigVeto]

Shaq dominated against weak east team

Kobe dominated against tough west team (Where the real championship happened)

http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpghttp://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpghttp://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg

[The Iron Fist]

lol your stupidity was entertaining. You used a pic of 2010 Shaq with Celtics to illustrate how bad Shaq was, it had little to do with prime Shaq from 99-05.

And nope, without Kobe Shaq could be even better. From 93 to 98 there was a god called Michael Jordaon, in 99 they had a horrible coach called Kurt Rambis. And can you explain why Lakers reign ended shortly after Kobe was entering his prime?
How far did the Lakers get in the 97-99 playoffs? If your excuse that shaq has no titles in those years is because of Jordan, surely shaq should have at least made it to the finals right?

Bulls are in the ec. LA is in the wc.


Find a new excuse pal.

[Money 23]

I can verify that kobe was considered a top 3 player by many during those runs. A lot of analysts were saying that the best and second best in the league were on the same team for 01 and 02. The difference is that shaq was in his prime and kobe was young and just coming into his prime, thus saying that shaq carried the team is not an unfair statement.
But Shaq didn't "carry" them. By the 2001 season, even if it was "Shaq's Team" and even if he was the most dominant in the sport ...

The lines were certainly starting to get blurred by that season, given Kobe's insane improvement over his 2000 season.

By 2003, things were even more balanced in terms of who was the best player on those Lakers teams. Kobe wasn't being carried.

He was supplying significant help. As 2nd option, he mashes over Scottie Pippen's production in comparison.

And that's with defense from 2000 - 2003 that is very comparable to the best defense Pippen ever played. And given Kobe was their clutch time player, as opposed to say the Bulls whose best player was also their closer.

It's difficult to call Kobe a normal sidekick in 2001 and 2002. And it's kind of blasphemous to say he had to be carried by someone else. Don't get me wrong, those rings don't hold as much weight for him individually as his 2009 and 2010 do ... but there is a way to meet in the middle between Kobe stan and Kobe haters arguments in regards to the balance of power on the Lakers in those seasons between Shaq and Kobe.

Now, 1999 - 2000? Kobe was CLEARLY a sidekick. A very good one, but definitely and significantly inferior to Shaq.

[ThaRegul8r]

Clearly a thread designed to incite Kobe fans. Pointless.

[The Iron Fist]

Clearly a thread designed to incite Kobe fans. Pointless.
All it did was make Kobe haters look stupid.

[Odinn]

Thread title is misleading. Actual Lakers fans know that.
Sorry Kobe-stans, Shaq did carry the team to 3-peat. Much more accurate this one.

[rsoares28]

Why is this thread 13 pgs long? if no one replies the insanity stops there and is localized around the OP.

[Jacks3]

How can a sperms fan say that after the way he shit on your team in 2001 and 2002?

Especially 2001. 33/7/7/2 on 59% TS including a 45/10 game. God damn.

:oldlol:

[PistolPete44]

haha, kobe stans like jacks3, The Iron Fist, Alphawolf are clearly trying to say Shaq was the sidekick, pathetic

[mikek85]

Dd you guys even watch the games? Shaq was dominant and clearly leading the team. He was f,ckin people up with his post game, rebounding, and elbows :rockon: :rockon: