This is what Kobe should have been for the last decade.

[Clifton]

This is just beautiful.

Playing like this, Kobe is my favorite player, perhaps ever.

I understand he's playing a terrible defense - I could probably do this on Luke Ridnour too - but he's been doing this for more than a week, and we all know Kobe's good enough to do this to anyone.

Kobe's been a top ten passer and ballhandler for almost his whole career. Even at his most selfish, I would even say top 5. He's just made poor decisions based on impatience and ego. He'll go for stretches playing intelligent ball, but never consistently, to my satisfaction. Could this possibly be a permanent change in approach?

Kobe's been trying to be Jordan all this time, when he should have been trying to be Magic.

[9erempiree]

It's like looking at a beautiful girl.

[LebronairJAMES]

This is just beautiful.

Playing like this, Kobe is my favorite player, perhaps ever.

I understand he's playing a terrible defense - I could probably do this on Luke Ridnour too - but he's been doing this for more than a week, and we all know Kobe's good enough to do this to anyone.

Kobe's been a top ten passer and ballhandler for almost his whole career. Even at his most selfish, I would even say top 5. He's just made poor decisions based on impatience and ego. He'll go for stretches playing intelligent ball, but never consistently, to my satisfaction. Could this possibly be a permanent change in approach?

Kobe's been trying to be Jordan all this time, when he should have been trying to be Magic.
:coleman:

[LebronairJAMES]

It's like looking at a beautiful girl.
says the *** with the *** avi

[Whoah10115]

This is just beautiful.

Playing like this, Kobe is my favorite player, perhaps ever.

I understand he's playing a terrible defense - I could probably do this on Luke Ridnour too - but he's been doing this for more than a week, and we all know Kobe's good enough to do this to anyone.

Kobe's been a top ten passer and ballhandler for almost his whole career. Even at his most selfish, I would even say top 5. He's just made poor decisions based on impatience and ego. He'll go for stretches playing intelligent ball, but never consistently, to my satisfaction. Could this possibly be a permanent change in approach?

Kobe's been trying to be Jordan all this time, when he should have been trying to be Magic.



I really don't disagree with this. He wouldn't be my favorite player ever, but he'd be one of my favorites. And people think he's not a high IQ player...he's got an ego and is petulant.


He's probably the 7th best player of all-time...but I could be disappointed in the fact that I think he could have been a top 3 player.

[j3lademaster]

It's like looking at a beautiful girl.
You look at Kobe as you would a beautiful girl? I like Kobe as a player too but... Oh my.

[Clifton]

And people think he's not a high IQ player...he's got an ego and is petulant.
He might have the highest IQ of anyone in the NBA. Every time he theorizes on the game, it's clear he's got a hell of an intellect. But then he goes out there and shoots 7 for 29 and you're like, well what was the point of all that film-watching and sound theorizing if you're still shooting your team out of games and discouraging all your teammates with your obvious disapproval and mistrust?

[Clifton]

See the Lakers look great now - 56 with 8:00 left in the 2nd - but what happens when they miss a few open shots in a row? When Gasol drops a couple more passes? How does Kobe respond? That'll be the real test.

[tmacattack33]

:oldlol:

LA's on a 15-0 run right now with Kobe on the bench.

Minnesota has went 1-11 since Kevin Love went out Jan 4...they aren't just bad right now, they are terrible.

[kentatm]

Yea it's really awesome that he is incapable of playing off the ball making the Lakers' acquisition of Nash a complete waste turning him into a spot up shooter.:rolleyes:

[Clifton]

LA's on a 15-0 run right now with Kobe on the bench.

Minnesota has went 1-11 since Kevin Love went out Jan 4...they aren't just bad right now, they are terrible.
Obviously Kobe's not going to lead a 3pt barrage like this every night. But the point is that Kobe's not just passing to guys when they're open... he's actually putting pressure on the defense *while* waiting for guys to get in a position to score. And then giving them ball just at the right time, in the right place. And if he's doing that the Lakers can't help but win - against anyone. He's actually using the IQ we all know he has. Sure he's doing it against a JV team *tonight*... but he's been doing this to good teams too.

[Clifton]

Yea it's really awesome that he is incapable of playing off the ball making the Lakers' acquisition of Nash a complete waste turning him into a spot up shooter.
If you had Magic Johnson on your roster, would you complain that he wasn't playing off-ball enough?

Kobe playing at his most intelligent is not as good as that, but he's close. I prefer Kobe in the high post playmaking to unsuccessful D'Antoni pick and roll basketball with a 39 yo Nash and no pick and roll big men.

Nash as a spot up shooter is going to shoot 45-50% from 3... I'll take that anytime

[RidonKs]

i still don't see it. lakers have been fun to watch but it's not like kobe has flicked a switch and completely transformed his mentality. the switch he flipped is tactical, not strategic. it's preconceived, proactive instead of reactive... "okay, now i have to play like this"

and he's always been a tremendous player with this severely flawed mindset. he's flat out BAD at adjusting within the flow of the game. it doesn't come naturally to him and it never has. not like it does for duncan or lebron, stars who you know will make the right decision just about every trip down the floor, as the situation demands.

i dunno how you guys define basketball iq but i see it as a pseudonym for intuition on the floor. it's the x factor that made jason kidd an all time great. and it has very little to do with off the court analysis by definition, because like you said, if it doesn't come to bear in the actual game, what the hell good is it?


it's like, giving the ball up to a teammate on a breakaway... you can see that as kobe trying to instill confidence and solidarity in the locker room or whatever. but if we consider his history, it's 99% more likely to be just kobe yet again overcompensating for his perceived flaw as a pure gunner.

which is ironically his one real flaw.

[tmacattack33]

There was a possession there where he had an open three, turned it down, posted up his guy (ridnour i believe...a shorter defender who is definitely not able to guard kobe) and had a good opportunity to shoot, but still didn't and just waited and passed it.


This gimmick can't last and if it does it's not the best for the team. He's actively trying to rack up assists or prove people wrong.

When the shot is there, you shoot it...you dont wait until the defender recovers so then you can pass it :oldlol:

[RidonKs]

There was a possession there where he had an open three, turned it down, posted up his guy (ridnour i believe...a shorter defender who is definitely not able to guard kobe) and had a good opportunity to shoot, but still didn't and just waited and passed it.
he just passed up an open baseline layup to kick to his covered teammate at the top of the circle......

[tmacattack33]

See?

Kobe just had a lay-up there (7:40 or remaining in the 3rd quarter) and he dished it back out towards the top of the key to Earl Clark.

That was seriously one of the most awkward plays i've ever seen. :oldlol:

[Money 23]

he just passed up an open baseline layup to kick to his covered teammate at the top of the circle......
That's Kobe in his petulant, "I'm proving you wrong", passive-aggressive style of play which is really a back hand to himself, teammates, and coaches.

He did it in a game under Phil in the 2001 season where he deliberately passed up wide open shots. I believe against the Kings.

It goes back to as you described Kobe's flawed approach. He doesn't react on the fly, everything is pre-meditated and contrived.

[Clifton]

and he's always been a tremendous player with this severely flawed mindset. he's flat out BAD at adjusting within the flow of the game. it doesn't come naturally to him and it never has. not like it does for duncan or lebron, stars who you know will make the right decision just about every trip down the floor, as the situation demands.
You're right. And great post in general.

I do think that, aside from Kobe undergoing a total conversion of heart, and being a real human being, and playing like one... this awkward Kobe is >>> the gunner.

[ShaqAttack3234]

What would be ideal for Kobe is a balance between the 2 approaches. 2008 is a perfect example, the roster overachieved because he was individually dominant when he had to be, played both ends, and made his teammates better. The 2001 playoffs are the other example of Kobe at his best in terms of approach and all around game.

[red1]

i still don't see it. lakers have been fun to watch but it's not like kobe has flicked a switch and completely transformed his mentality. the switch he flipped is tactical, not strategic. it's preconceived, proactive instead of reactive... "okay, now i have to play like this"
This is dead on. His unselfish play has been helping his teammates play better but you can tell he is not a natural pointguard, not because of a lack of skill because he definitely has the skill but because it seems like he makes up his mind before he even catches the ball. Sitting at home I can tell whether or not he is going to pass or shoot before the play

[Money 23]

What would be ideal for Kobe is a balance between the 2 approaches. 2008 is a perfect example, the roster overachieved because he was individually dominant when he had to be, played both ends, and made his teammates better. The 2001 playoffs are the other example of Kobe at his best in terms of approach and all around game.
Yes, bro. Totally right. The 2008 season, and 2001 playoffs. Was Kobe just being himself, playing HIS game.

Because in those seasons he let the game come to him. Instead of being contrived, preconceived, forced or trying to adapt to a post MJ legacy.

[tmacattack33]

Kobe went to the basket again and didn't look for his shot and ended up passing it to Clark who wasn't even open.

This is just getting weird now (I know you weren't talking about this...but instead were talking about when Kobe had 4 good passes in the 1st quarter...but yeah). I don't see how you could look at this and say it's good for the team.

They are lucky they are playing Minnesota without Kevin Love. These wasted possessions wouldn't cut it against a good or even average team.

[tmacattack33]

And yeah i agree with the above...in the 2009 playoffs he had a great scoring game combined with a good passing game and it was something i never seen from him.

I don't really remember 2001 of his much...i mostly watched the eastern playoffs and wasn't even that hardcore of a bball fan at that point.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Yes, bro. Totally right. The 2008 season, and 2001 playoffs. Was Kobe just being himself, playing HIS game.

Because in those seasons he let the game come to him. Instead of being contrived, preconceived, forced or trying to adapt to a post MJ legacy.

I think the 2008 season and 2001 playoffs were also dictated by what happened before. Kobe was frustrated after his incredible individual play in '06 and '07, and receiving criticism, hence the trade demand. I do think it was good for Kobe to get those seasons "out of his system" because I think on some level, he did want to see how much he could score and how far he could take a team virtually by himself. Playing for Team USA also motivated him, he lost 20 pounds to take pressure off his knee, regain quickness and be a defensive stopper, and that carried into the 2008 season. Playing harder defensively also set the tone for getting more guys involved because it was a necessity.

In 2001, he had been criticized by Phil and feuded with Shaq while the Lakers underachieved early in the season. I think Kobe going down and the Lakers going 11-3 without him caused him to change his approach in that case.

2002 was also a good year in this regard, but I mention it less than the other two because he was less spectacular. He seemed to be pushing himself more in '08 season and '01 playoffs, but not in a bad way. But he played an excellent all around game in 2002 and did exactly what he had to do. He took over when they needed him to without forcing it, particularly late in games vs the Spurs. In fact, at one point in the playoffs, Phil told Kobe to look for his own shot more early in games. Even after the 56 in 3 quarters vs Memphis, it didn't seem like he let that get to his head.

I'll throw '09 in there as well. It's pretty much to his '08 what his '02 is to his '01.

[upside24]

Not fond of the PASSive Kobe. I understand he is doing the right thing shooting less and allowing Pau and Dwight to enjoy playing is beneficial for the team chemistry but I admire Kobe aggressively scoring with beautiful shooting form and footwork.

He is turning down too many opportunities to score and in the Suns game he kept giving MWP the ball for brick after airball.

The wait for the double and look for cutters is not Kobe trying to scorch the defense for 40, it's attract defensive attention and let an inferior scorer try and convert.

I admire him for stepping out of what defines him and becoming something different but I hope he remembers he is only player on that team who can bury any defense with points when he's on.

[KingLeBronJames]

ISH is bi-polar. Kobe is sharing the ball but they can't make anything. Just hogged the ball, Kobe.

[3peated]

If you had Magic Johnson on your roster, would you complain that he wasn't playing off-ball enough?

Kobe playing at his most intelligent is not as good as that, but he's close. I prefer Kobe in the high post playmaking to unsuccessful D'Antoni pick and roll basketball with a 39 yo Nash and no pick and roll big men.

Nash as a spot up shooter is going to shoot 45-50% from 3... I'll take that anytime


nash chose to sign in la because he wanted a ring. nash knew what he was doing, why blame LA for that?

edit: i guess it cut out the person u quoted.

[KingLeBronJames]

Not fond of the PASSive Kobe. I understand he is doing the right thing shooting less and allowing Pau and Dwight to enjoy playing is beneficial for the team chemistry but I admire Kobe aggressively scoring with beautiful shooting form and footwork.

He is turning down too many opportunities to score and in the Suns game he kept giving MWP the ball for brick after airball.

The wait for the double and look for cutters is not Kobe trying to scorch the defense for 40, it's attract defensive attention and let an inferior scorer try and convert.

I admire him for stepping out of what defines him and becoming something different but I hope he remembers he is only player on that team who can bury any defense with points when he's on.
Kobe shooting less is not making much of a difference.

[RRR3]

I really like the way Kobe's been playing, but he should still look to score a lot, since he's one of the best scorers ever and still is a top scorer in the league. I've caught limited snippets of the game today, but it seemed like he may be forcing the issue today at least, as others have said.

[selrahc]

Kobe is arguably GOAT, and that scares people. They will hate on him whether he shoots more or passes more.

[The-Legend-24]

Kobe, the only player in NBA history that gets shitted on for either shooting or passing.

:roll:

[Legends66NBA7]

What would be ideal for Kobe is a balance between the 2 approaches. 2008 is a perfect example, the roster overachieved because he was individually dominant when he had to be, played both ends, and made his teammates better. The 2001 playoffs are the other example of Kobe at his best in terms of approach and all around game.

That would be good, no doubt. He won't able to play the same level of defense obviously, but the all-around game is definitely reasonable.

[Smoke117]

:oldlol:

LA's on a 15-0 run right now with Kobe on the bench.

Minnesota has went 1-11 since Kevin Love went out Jan 4...they aren't just bad right now, they are terrible.

This.

[tmacattack33]

So he actively tried to rack up assists, and he gets the ball more than anyone in the league besides Durant and Lebron, and yet he could only get 8 assists against the T-Wolves.

Not sure if that's an accomplishment or proof that his passing vision is average at best.

[chazzy]

So he actively tried to rack up assists, and he gets the ball more than anyone in the league besides Durant and Lebron, and yet he could only get 8 assists.

Not sure if that's an accomplishment or proof that his passing vision is average at best.
What about the back to back 14 assist games?

[Jacks3]

How could you watch the last 5 games and think he has average passing vision? Dude has thrown so many sick interior passes for easy layups and dunks. No, the problem is that he's not a freaking PG. It doesn't come naturally to him (Duh). It's pathetic that the best player on the team can't even take play to his greatest strength BY FAR, which is scoring the ball. Dude is a top 5 scorer in history. And he has to go out there and completely change his game just so his teammates can feel more "involved" so that they can play defense.

:facepalm

[tmacattack33]

What about the back to back 14 assist games?

Those were good.

These last two games were bad for him.

So like I said, he's average.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Those were good.

These last two games were bad for him.

So like I said, he's average.

how can kobe be average when hes the best player in the league? :confusedshrug: makes no sense

[chazzy]

Those were good.

These last two games were bad for him.

So like I said, he's average.
lol

[Jacks3]

So like I said, he's average.
You're an idiot.

[game3524]

How could you watch the last 5 games and think he has average passing vision? Dude has thrown so many sick interior passes for easy layups and dunks. No, the problem is that he's not a freaking PG. It doesn't come naturally to him (Duh). It's pathetic that the best player on the team can't even take play to his greatest strength BY FAR, which is scoring the ball. Dude is a top 5 scorer in history. And he has to go out there and completely change his game just so his teammates can feel more "involved" so that they can play defense.

:facepalm

Exactly.

The guy who should be adjusting is Howard. It is a pity Jim Buss screwed up by hiring Pringles instead of Phil,because he is the only one I think who could have gotten Dwight to play like Bynum did near the end of the 2010-11 season.(focus on defense and put-backs).

[tmacattack33]

how can kobe be average when hes the best player in the league? :confusedshrug: makes no sense

I was talking about his passing skills.

And no overall he's not the best, wtf, lol.

[tmacattack33]

How could you watch the last 5 games and think he has average passing vision? Dude has thrown so many sick interior passes for easy layups and dunks. No, the problem is that he's not a freaking PG. It doesn't come naturally to him (Duh). It's pathetic that the best player on the team can't even take play to his greatest strength BY FAR, which is scoring the ball. Dude is a top 5 scorer in history. And he has to go out there and completely change his game just so his teammates can feel more "involved" so that they can play defense.

:facepalm

When you get your number called on as much as he does, and are actively turning down shots to prove people wrong or whatever he is doing, I would sure hope you would be able to find some cutters and slashers for open lay-ups a few times.

For him to not reach double digit assists in this strange "I'm not shooting anymore and I'm getting assists" situation twice is pretty telling.

[Jacks3]

When you get your number called on as much as he does, and are actively turning down shots to prove people wrong or whatever he is doing,
Oh yeah. That's exactly what he's doing. It can't be him simply trying to get his teammates more engaged. No, it's all him trying to prove people wrong. :rolleyes:

LOL. It's hilarious how you people think you know what's going on inside the dude's head. When it he was scoring 30+ a night it was him going for the scoring title. Now it's him trying to prove people wrong. SMH. :facepalm

For him to not reach double digit assists in this strange "I'm not shooting anymore and I'm getting assists" situation twice is pretty telling.
Who gives a shit if he doesn't hit double-digits or not? He had 9 in his previous game and 8 tonight with his teammates missing a TON of easy baskets he created for them. In the previous three games he had 14,14, and 11. That's an average of 11.2 APG. lol @ average passing ability. Seriously, watch the games. :facepalm

[Heavincent]

Those were good.

These last two games were bad for him.

So like I said, he's average.

:oldlol:

[RRR3]

So he actively tried to rack up assists, and he gets the ball more than anyone in the league besides Durant and Lebron, and yet he could only get 8 assists against the T-Wolves.

Not sure if that's an accomplishment or proof that his passing vision is average at best.
Kobe forced it some today, but you sound like a hater bro.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Oh yeah. That's exactly what he's doing. It can't be him simply trying to get his teammates more engaged. No, it's all him trying to prove people wrong. :rolleyes:

LOL. It's hilarious how you people think you know what's going on inside the dude's head. When it he was scoring 30+ a night it was him going for the scoring title. Now it's him trying to prove people wrong. SMH. :facepalm

Who gives a shit if he doesn't hit double-digits or not? He had 9 in his previous game and 8 tonight with his teammates missing a TON of easy baskets he created for them. In the previous three games he had 14,14, and 11. That's an average of 11.2 APG. lol @ average passing ability. Seriously, watch the games. :facepalm

There's no reasoning with him...Let godbe be the judge when his day comes.

[game3524]

Calling Kobe an average play-maker is laughable.

He isn't Lebron or anything, but for a 2-guard.....he is pretty damn good.

[Heavincent]

http://d22zlbw5ff7yk5.cloudfront.net/images/uncaptioned-jBFcfQR-51098adb85343.gif

"Average at best"

[RRR3]

http://d22zlbw5ff7yk5.cloudfront.net/images/uncaptioned-jBFcfQR-51098adb85343.gif

"Average at best"
I'm honestly more impressed Dwight held on to the ball.

[Heavincent]

I'm honestly more impressed Dwight held on to the ball.

You and me both. Must be hard to catch anything with those stone hands.

[tmacattack33]

Calling Kobe an average play-maker is laughable.

He isn't Lebron or anything, but for a 2-guard.....he is pretty damn good.

Never said play-maker. I said passing vision.

Jason Kidd right now has the same passing vision he always had, but he's not even close to the same play-maker anymore since he can't penetrate and do as much with the ball anymore.

[Mr. Jabbar]

I'm honestly more impressed Dwight held on to the ball.

seriously, both impresive feats right there :bowdown:

[game3524]

Never said play-maker. I said passing vision.

Jason Kidd right now has the same passing vision he always had, but he's not even close to the same play-maker anymore since he can't penetrate and do as much with the ball anymore.

That is is even dumber.

Kobe has excellent court vision, some of the passes he has made this past couple of weeks have been outstanding.

[tmacattack33]

That is is even dumber.

Kobe has excellent court vision, some of the passes he has made this past couple of weeks have been outstanding.

Saying he has excellent court vision is dumber. He doesn't see plays before they happen like anyone with excellent vision.

In that gif posted, he was going to Dwight there no matter what.

In that play, Dwight was open. Tonight, he did the same pass to Earl Clark twice off of lay-up passes. Earl wasn't open. They were terrible passes which shoulda been lay-up attempts.

[RRR3]

Saying he has excellent court vision is dumber. He doesn't see plays before they happen like anyone with excellent vision.

In that gif posted, he was going to Dwight there no matter what.

In that play, Dwight was open. Tonight, he did the same pass to Earl Clark twice off of lay-up passes. Earl wasn't open. They were terrible passes which shoulda been lay-up attempts.
There were 3 defenders in front of Kobe, hardly an easy pass to Dwight :rolleyes:

[game3524]

Saying he has excellent court vision is dumber. He doesn't see plays before they happen like anyone with excellent vision.

In that gif posted, he was going to Dwight there no matter what.

In that play, Dwight was open. Tonight, he did the same pass to Earl Clark twice off of lay-up passes. Earl wasn't open. They were terrible passes which shoulda been lay-up attempts.

His pass to Jamison near the end of the game says otherwise.

[Heavincent]

Saying he has excellent court vision is dumber. He doesn't see plays before they happen like anyone with excellent vision.


Yes he does. He's great at finding the open man when he's being doubled. Been doing it his entire career.

Where have you been for the past 17 years? :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

That is is even dumber.

Kobe has excellent court vision, some of the passes he has made this past couple of weeks have been outstanding.
This.

[Heavincent]

There were 3 defenders in front of Kobe, hardly an easy pass to Dwight :rolleyes:

Threading the needle between two 7 footers with another guy's hand in your face, all while you're flying through the air.

Elementary pass. You learn that shit in middle school.

[tmacattack33]

His pass to Jamison near the end of the game says otherwise.

That was a good pass.

I just feel that he was forcing passes all game and has been for the past few games...every time he drove he passed it to a big man or back out to the top of the key ...and if you keep doing that eventually your big man will happen to be open one play and will get an easy dunk and it'll look good.


But i gotta go, and ill be watching the next LA game hoping to see Kobe try to get assists again.

[G-Funk]

Tmacattack33 u got to be one of dumbest poster here. Just stop it

[kentatm]

Kobe is arguably GOAT, and that scares people. They will hate on him whether he shoots more or passes more.


:oldlol:

no

[Heilige]

This is just beautiful.

Playing like this, Kobe is my favorite player, perhaps ever.

I understand he's playing a terrible defense - I could probably do this on Luke Ridnour too - but he's been doing this for more than a week, and we all know Kobe's good enough to do this to anyone.

Kobe's been a top ten passer and ballhandler for almost his whole career. Even at his most selfish, I would even say top 5. He's just made poor decisions based on impatience and ego. He'll go for stretches playing intelligent ball, but never consistently, to my satisfaction. Could this possibly be a permanent change in approach?

Kobe's been trying to be Jordan all this time, when he should have been trying to be Magic.


What about the way Kobe played in the 2007-2008 season? I think the way he played that season was even better than he is playing now. He had the right approach to the game in that season.

[DatAsh]

How could you watch the last 5 games and think he has average passing vision?

That one the other night where he drove baseline and threw it through three defenders by the hoop to Dwight for a dunk was one of the best I've ever seen.


It's pathetic that the best player on the team can't even take play to his greatest strength BY FAR, which is scoring the ball. Dude is a top 5 scorer in history. And he has to go out there and completely change his game just so his teammates can feel more "involved" so that they can play defense.


I agree, but it is somewhat obvious that this is what is going on. The other guys have looked so much more active both offensively and defensively these past few games. Guys are moving and cutting without the ball on offense, instead of just standing there. On defense, Dwight's actually looking like a DPOY again.

Why they can't seem to do that normally, when Kobe's shooting 22+ times a game is another issue, probably a coaching one. I kind of think Kobe's just in the mindset of trying to build confidence and chemistry right now, and that he'll eventually start to raise his shot attempts. I do think he should look to balance this out a bit more, similar to the way Lebron is playing, but I'm just happy for wins at this point.

Hopefully the other guys can continue to play this way. That's the real crux here.

[Rysio]

thank god he didnt. would be one boring decade. :sleeping

[game3524]

That one the other night where he drove baseline and threw it through three defenders by the hoop to Dwight for a dunk was one of the best I've ever seen.



I agree, but it is somewhat obvious that this is what is going on. The other guys have looked so much more active both offensively and defensively these past few games. Guys are moving and cutting without the ball on offense, instead of just standing there. On defense, Dwight's actually looking like a DPOY again.

Why they can't seem to do that normally, when Kobe's shooting 22+ times a game is another issue, probably a coaching one. I kind of think Kobe's just in the mindset of trying to build confidence and chemistry right now, and that he'll eventually start to raise his shot attempts. I do think he should look to balance this out a bit more, similar to the way Lebron is playing, but I'm just happy for wins at this point.

Hopefully the other guys can continue to play this way. That's the real crux here.

To me that just shows how much of a whiny bitch Dwight Howard truly is. I can at least understand Pau's frustration, even though I don't agree with it. But Dwight has no reason to complain since he leads the league in touches by a center and it isn't Kobe or Pringles fault he fumbles the ball away every time.

[MMM]

Kobe should be capable of getting teammates involved and staying in rhythm so if he is needed down the stretch he has multiple options that would be capable of closing out the game. With that being said I have to agree with the posters who feel Kobe plays with an agenda coming into a game and doesn't make the necessary adjustments.

[Money 23]

Threading the needle between two 7 footers with another guy's hand in your face, all while you're flying through the air.

Elementary pass. You learn that shit in middle school.
Stop being so defensive. We're all acknowledging Kobe is quite the play maker and passer. The ABILITY is there, it's the contrived approach, pre-planned style of play when you're deliberately passing up shots to appease criticism of your game, then it's a problem.

Why must Kobe always be SO extreme? He's either chucking, or dishing to the point of not taking easy shots for himself (an admitted elite scorer) ... that's a problem.

Why is there no middle road with his game where he meets the ultimate balance between playmaker and scorer? When his teammates need to be lifted, get them involved. Score on call when needed. He did it in the OKC game to perfection. But then it seems like in order to seek the trend of praise, he says to himself he's getting it just because he's passing.

Either Kobe is doing some kind of social experiment with media perception, or he's what any sane Kobe fan has known all along, he's so self aware to the point that everything he does in response to how he is perceived is controlled and contrived down to the very details.

Just play the game. Score when needed, shoot when open, when the right pass is there, make it. Basketball need not be that complicated as Kobe sometimes makes it on himself. It's like the ridiculous fadeaway or forced shot he takes with multiple defenders draped all over him, when the right basketball play is staring him in the face. Sometimes I think he does it for his PERCEPTION as opposed to the right basketball play.

It's like sometimes he's being theatrical, just in order to create a mythic persona around himself (probably a post Jordan narrative effect that he's playing towards for media sake) as opposed to just being the best basketball player.

The ability is there. It's his mentality and approach that has ALWAYS held Kobe back to reaching his full potential. Which is scary considering how great he is even with his flawed approach.

A real Bryant fan would be able cede these flaws, if you truly comprehend his game within not just the sexy-ness of his skills, but from an innate basketball intuition.

[G-Funk]

Kobe should be capable of getting teammates involved and staying in rhythm so if he is needed down the stretch he has multiple options that would be capable of closing out the game. With that being said I have to agree with the posters who feel Kobe plays with an agenda coming into a game and doesn't make the necessary adjustments.
DUH THE AGENDA IS TO GET HIS TEAMMATES INVOLVED

[G-Funk]

The haters basketball IQ bar is set really low here

[KOBE143]

If Kobe actually did this for the last decade, we would probably seen a real triple double machine.. Dude is averaging almost triple double for the season..

Kobe avg for the last decade if he play this role

21ppg, 13apg, 9rpg, 60%TS

Seems decent to me.. :kobe:

[G-Funk]

Stop being so defensive. We're all acknowledging Kobe is quite the play maker and passer. The ABILITY is there, it's the contrived approach, pre-planned style of play when you're deliberately passing up shots to appease criticism of your game, then it's a problem.

Why must Kobe always be SO extreme? He's either chucking, or dishing to the point of not taking easy shots for himself (an admitted elite scorer) ... that's a problem.

Why is there no middle road with his game where he meets the ultimate balance between playmaker and scorer? When his teammates need to be lifted, get them involved. Score on call when needed. He did it in the OKC game to perfection. But then it seems like in order to seek the trend of praise, he says to himself he's getting it just because he's passing.

Either Kobe is doing some kind of social experiment with media perception, or he's what any sane Kobe fan has known all along, he's so self aware to the point that everything he does in response to how he is perceived is controlled and contrived down to the very details.

Just play the game. Score when needed, shoot when open, when the right pass is there, make it. Basketball need not be that complicated as Kobe sometimes makes it on himself. It's like the ridiculous fadeaway or forced shot he takes with multiple defenders draped all over him, when the right basketball play is staring him in the face. Sometimes I think he does it for his PERCEPTION as opposed to the right basketball play.

It's like sometimes he's being theatrical, just in order to create a mythic persona around himself (probably a post Jordan narrative effect that he's playing towards for media sake) as opposed to just being the best basketball player.

The ability is there. It's his mentality and approach that has ALWAYS held Kobe back to reaching his full potential. Which is scary considering how great he is even with his flawed approach.

A real Bryant fan would be able cede these flaws, if you truly comprehend his game within not just the sexy-ness of his skills, but from an innate basketball intuition.


Where the hell do u come up with these theories and then have the nerve to claim them as facts???

Also, cause 17pts 11assist, 9 rbs on 50% is not working...not balanced enought right?


**** some ppl are stupid

[KungFuJoe]

Kobe is rondo 2.0. Passing on good shots to pad his assists. He ain't fooling anyone who isn't a fool.

[The Iron Fist]

Kobe won more rings playing HIS way, than any other player of his era. If he had played like you want him to,

he'd be 1 and 2 in the finals with more losses than wins.

[KungFuJoe]

Kobe won more rings playing HIS way, than any other player of his era. If he had played like you want him to,

he'd be 1 and 2 in the finals with more losses than wins.

Kobe had the skills and ability and the TEAM to play his way and win.

He doesn't anymore...

[The Iron Fist]

Kobe had the skills and ability and the TEAM to play his way and win.

He doesn't anymore...
Had?


HAD??

Try looking up things in context. Kobe has been playing excellent all season. Whether its scoring or passing.

[pauk]

I agree.

[Clifton]

Kobe won more rings playing HIS way, than any other player of his era. If he had played like you want him to,

he'd be 1 and 2 in the finals with more losses than wins.
No he wouldn't. He'd have 6 rings at the very least, and I would say 7. He's a great player and has played with other great players for the majority of his career. But he hasn't been approaching the game the right way to maximize his ability.

And yes Kobe is awkward and forced in his playmaking... but if he does this for 20 games, his team will win most of them, and he will get better and more natural as a playmaker.

[The Iron Fist]

No he wouldn't. He'd have 6 rings at the very least, and I would say 7. He's a great player and has played with other great players for the majority of his career. But he hasn't been approaching the game the right way to maximize his ability.

And yes Kobe is awkward and forced in his playmaking... but if he does this for 20 games, his team will win most of them, and he will get better and more natural as a playmaker.
Prove it.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kobe's had stretches of this throughout his career

01 WCQF - 25.0 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 7.7 apg
01 WCF - 33.3 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 7.0 apg
08 WCSF - 33.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 7.2 apg
09 Finals - 32.4 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 7.4 apg
10 WCF - 33.7 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 8.3 apg

[funnystuff]

OP is Bigalows alt.


Nothing to see here.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

DUH THE AGENDA IS TO GET HIS TEAMMATES INVOLVED

Na his agenda is appeasing people on ISH and the like so they'll approve of him.

Yes, he's making a conscious effort. He wants his teammates to get good looks and be engaged. He's doing exactly what people always complain about him not doing and now there's still something wrong because it's not "natural" enough. :oldlol:

He's just doing what he can to help the team succeed because he wants to win. I don't see why that's such a surprise to people. Kobe has always added something or tweaked his game if he felt it could improve his chances of winning.

[Mr. Jabbar]

I agree.

negged

[SpecialQue]

:kobe:

[dajadeed]

Kobe's had stretches of this throughout his career

01 WCQF - 25.0 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 7.7 apg
01 WCF - 33.3 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 7.0 apg
08 WCSF - 33.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 7.2 apg
09 Finals - 32.4 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 7.4 apg
10 WCF - 33.7 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 8.3 apg
The 01 WCF was something I'll never forget.

LA sweeps the first two rounds and everyone is talking about how they were now going to be tested. They're starting out on the road. They go on to win both games in San Antonio, punctuated by the clutch Kobe rebound and putback.

San Antonio goes to LA to get clobbered for two games that were as exciting as a high school team playing a middle school team.

Kobe and Shaq were just toying with the league then. It was amazing to watch.

[Deuce Bigalow]

The 01 WCF was something I'll never forget.

LA sweeps the first two rounds and everyone is talking about how they were now going to be tested. They're starting out on the road. They go on to win both games in San Antonio, punctuated by the clutch Kobe rebound and putback.

San Antonio goes to LA to get clobbered for two games that were as exciting as a high school team playing a middle school team.

Kobe and Shaq were just toying with the league then. It was amazing to watch.
That was the 02 series in game 4. The 01 series everything was a win by a large margin. I think it might be the largest average margin of victory in a series ever.

[Rubio2Gasol]

They were not beating Boston in 08 regardless of what Kobe did. If you're arguing they could have won in 04 - perhaps - but Payton was a much much bigger problem than Kobe that series. Kobe had the right attitude early in his career. He played with his instincts and he always made his man commit.

Someone like him should never sit there and distribute. Leave that for a point guard. Attack the defense then make your reads./

[Clifton]

Prove it.

hey were not beating Boston in 08 regardless of what Kobe did. If you're arguing they could have won in 04
Yeah.

They had prime Kobe, prime Shaq, and Karl Malone. They should have won that year. The Pistons did have an awesome team defense, but they also had a matchup nightmare at the center position. Ben Wallace at no point in his career could handle Shaq. His one on one defense wasn't that great to begin with but he was flat out not big enough.

If Kobe had done "awkward distributing Kobe" who picks his spots but otherwise feeds the ball to Shaq whenever he can, he's dunking on someone every trip down. Instead he spent all 5 games busily trying to shoot over Tayshaun Prince's long ass arms and missing. The team never developed any rhythm (even in the game 2 they miraculously won) and it was Kobe's fault that time.

The thing is a distributing, smart Kobe would still drop 22 to 25 on you easily. Teams would be forced to stop doubling him and he'd get lots of opportunities one on one at the FT line-extended, where he is at his most accurate and dangerous. It'd take much less work but his scoring would still be elite.

[SwayDizzle]

Kobe is el maestro of adjusting to increase his chances of winning. His analysis of the game is unparalleled. Kobe is the perfect example of the student surpassing the master.

[Money 23]

http://d22zlbw5ff7yk5.cloudfront.net/images/uncaptioned-jBFcfQR-51098adb85343.gif
:biggums: