Contrived, Preconceived Stat Padding (Kobe v.s. LeBron)

[Money 23]

Tonight, LeBron shot a stunning 13-14 from the field.

But on closer inspection, he was deliberately passing up shots to maintain a field goal percentage. Thus, contrived. We all know of his "competition" w/ teammate Wade to see who has the best field goal percentage every game.

When a player is passing up quality shots in order to pad a field goal percentage, isn't that just as bad for a team as say the recent crucifixion of Kobe Bryant for ... basically being phony in recent games passing up shots to pad assist totals, at the expense of quality shots for himself.

It's the same forged agenda, just different purposes. But no one has a problem when LeBron does it.

Hmmm ... No one else takes issue with this contradiction? Or fan hypocritical behavior and reception of the performances?

:biggums:

[RoboticWang]

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lrtank3t5y1r0o9kzo1_500.gif

[tazb]

Jordan stan mad LeBron is coming for that #1 spot :roll:

[jimmy77x]

NB4 very angry Lebron nut huggers :lol how dare you acuse their lord of stat padding :lol

edit too late

[Hoiids]

He didn't force jumpers.
Isn't that what his naysayers have been telling him to do for his WHOLE career?
So now that he is listening, it is bad?

idontfollowdumblogic

[LikeABosh]

If by deliberately passing up shots you mean setting up teammates for easy buckets, ok.
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/29156002.jpg

[DaSeba5]

Why can't you people just give the man some credit? I mean my God get the fvck over it. I don't like Kobe, but I don't make thousands of butthurt threads about him.

[RRR3]

There is an ongoing late-night pageant put on by the Kobe Kidz Kindergarten Klub featuring a full-length production entitled "How Great is our GawdBe". Noted Kobe Kidz such as Mr. Jibber Jabber, Dunce "****ing ***" Thinkin' Slow, The Iron Brain, Alphamutt, and the rest of the Kobe Krew are all in attendance. Thus, they are unable to currently demean LeBron, but will assuredly be on later to criticize him.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

didn't watch the game but tbh lets say he takes 10 more shots makes 4 of them 3 2 pointers 1 3 pointer he ends up with 17/24 40 points. people would be giving him even more props. so it's not like he is getting more credit than he would have otherwise.

edit: btw i like the way kobe has been playing and have not complained about him stat padding.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

i want to see this game now to see how deliberate the pass up of shots was.

[Heavincent]

LeBron is coming for that #1 spot :roll:

Yeah, sure he is.

[AlonzoGOAT]

Can't remember kobe passing up shots and producing like this scoring wise. I like this lebron a lot more. No more contested jumpers and more crashing in the paint.

[lebeast666]

Lol Lebron been trying things out these last two games. Tonight it was his post game work. Why would he force up shots against Bobcats in a game where it didnt really look like Bobcats would win it. Shits a playground out there right now till the postseason

[Money 23]

LOL @ people acting like I'm mad or even hating on LeBron for this admitted stunning performance. I'm being objective.

I'm just saying, there is a similar agenda between players. Bron has admitted to passing up shots before to protect his FG percentage. Or regretting taking shots.

That isn't ORGANIC basketball. No matter how you cut it, or how nice the performance was.

[Screamingdoom]

Come on we're always complaining that he takes too many outside jumpers when he can dominate inside and that's what he did. Let him be.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Stat padding against the Bobcats. :applause: Good sh!t, Bron. You're DA BESS!

[RoboticWang]

Skip Bayless: LeBron not dominant enough to have a perfect game, he just can't mentally reach the level of a Kobe or Jordan..

[LikeABosh]

LOL @ people acting like I'm mad or even hating on LeBron for this admitted stunning performance.

I'm just saying, there is a similar agenda between players. Bron has admitted to passing up shots before to protect his FG percentage. Or regretting taking shots.

That isn't ORGANIC basketball. No matter how you cut it, or how nice the performance was.
"organic baskedball" :oldlol:. You're trying to hard bud. Give it up

[LikeABosh]

Stat padding against the Bobcats. :applause: Good sh!t, Bron. You're DA BESS!
I guess when you'r just too good and put up video game numbers haters call it "stat padding". :lol

[Money 23]

"organic baskedball" :oldlol:. You're trying to hard bud. Give it up
You mean "too" right? You just started watching bball in 2010 when the big three super friends came together.

Your opinion means nadda to me, rookie.

[pauk]

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/9048/cuban2.gif

[DaSeba5]

You mean "too" right? You just started watching bball in 2010 when the big three super friends came together.

Your opinion means nadda to me, rookie.

Is that really your argument?

[Money 23]

Is that really your argument?
My argument is in the original post. Read, Sebass.

When you play the game with an agenda to pad stats, whether it be Kobe and his assists lately.

Or LeBron and his field goal percentage. It's phony, and contrived. Passing up shots to protect a field goal percentage isn't natural basketball. Especially from a star player.

That's my argument. It's not me hating on either Kobe or LeBron, just pointing out something that doesn't sit well with me as a fan.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

I guess when you'r just too good and put up video game numbers haters call it "stat padding". :lol

Guy passed up shots to fluff his shooting %'s. Hell, even some of his BIGGEST fans thought it was obvious:


Is LeBron's goal to have a perfect shooting game today? He's passing up a lot of shots in this qtr.


I get that feeling too.


Wade looks uninterested and Bron looks too invested in trying to have a perfect shooting game since its blatantly obvious hes only taking easy shots.

[LikeABosh]

You mean "too" right? You just started watching bball in 2010 when the big three super friends came together.

Your opinion means nadda to me, rookie.
Not even worth dealing with if your gonna resort to this bullshit.

[LikeABosh]

My argument is in the original post. Read, Sebass.

When you play the game with an agenda to pad stats, whether it be Kobe and his assists lately.

Or LeBron and his field goal percentage. It's phony, and contrived. Passing up shots to protect a field goal percentage isn't natural basketball. Especially from a star player.

That's my argument. It's not me hating on either Kobe or LeBron, just pointing out something that doesn't sit well with me as a fan.
But I thought Lebron had no jumper and needed to just live in the paint?

[Legends66NBA7]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but haven't James and Wade spoken to the media about their goals on trying to get over 50%fg during each game this season ?

[GreatGreg]

How do you criticize LeBron after a game like this? How? :facepalm

[2010splash]

No need to grasp at straws and nit-pick over something so meaningless. Passing up shots to find higher percentage opportunities to score? Gee... what a selfish thing to do.

LeBron is now shooting .555 FG%. Let that sh-t sink in homeboy.

Back to back MVP again. Give him 4 in 5 years. 2013 Finals MVP too.

:bowdown:

[LikeABosh]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but haven't James and Wade spoken to the media about their goals on trying to get over 50%fg during each game this season ?
What a terrible goal to have. How dare they want to be efficient basketball players. ****ing pathetic!

[Just2McFly]

So he scores 30+ and people are complaining that he passed up shots?

:roll: :roll:

[Jolokia]

It was a very good game for Lebron. Not a great game in my eye test. I do agree he was maintaining that % when he realized he was like 8-8. Still managed to go 13/14, which is very impressive. Cut down some of those forced passes that resulted in turnovers, and it would've been a perfect game. I honestly thought he could've just scored 40-50 points over 60% and shut the Cats down early. Didn't need to go 200% today though guarded by a rookie lightweight and an undersized Henderson since the Kidd was out. He got the W so that's all that matters. The real tests are coming up.

[LikeABosh]

31 points on 93%, how dare he want to spread the wealth and get his teammates involved. He could have scored every ****ing time vs. those bum ass players being thrown at him.

[Legends66NBA7]

What a terrible goal to have. How dare they want to be efficient basketball players. ****ing pathetic!

Um, is it true or not ?

I remember reading about it on ISH. Never said anything about their intent about it... only thing I find odd is speaking about it to the media.

[Gotterdammerung]

Unlike some people, I watched the game (though I was reading and typing on the other screen) and I saw LBJ post up quite a few times.

Instead of taking contested jumpers or heat check threes, he was utilizing his size advantage (the Bobcats put a smaller, albeit quicker defender on him) on the block, and showed a couple of nice moves - very smooth and organic. :applause:

[Heavincent]

What a terrible goal to have. How dare they want to be efficient basketball players. ****ing pathetic!

Constantly worrying about your FG% ****s with your head though.

[Money 23]

But I thought Lebron had no jumper and needed to just live in the paint?
Read to me where I ever said that, kiddo. Bron has a respectable jumper, but yes he's better when attacking.

Look, take LePecker out of your mouths. You're all turning into little pauks. He did this against the Bobcats, and was visibly protecting his FG percentage.

I'm not hating on LeBron. Jesus, Kobe stans say I hate on Kobe, LeBron stans say I hate on LeBron.

I've banged the drum for both these guys when it's been DESERVED. I'm being objective. I'm neither a fanboy of either of these guys. They both have flaws in either their character, intangibles, or approach that bothers me down to my core.

LeBron and Wade have admitted of having a personal contest in regards to their field goal percentage. They have admitted to passing up shots to protect it, and regretting shots they did take in order to protect it.

That isn't basketball. That isn't keeping the win in mind. That's PERSONAL AGENDA. The same type that LeBron stans claim Kobe selfishly pursues at the expense of his teammates.

The only guy in this thread I respect who doesn't have his head up Bron's ass who can see things objectively is kuniva_daMIGHTY. Contrived field goal percentage protection is just as fake as Kobe passing up shots over Luke Ridinour in order to force and pad assist numbers.

[AlonzoGOAT]

Unlike some people, I watched the game (though I was reading and typing on the other screen) and I saw LBJ post up quite a few times.

Instead of taking contested jumpers or heat check threes, he was utilizing his size advantage (the Bobcats put a smaller, albeit quicker defender on him) on the block, and showed a couple of nice moves - very smooth and organic. :applause:
This. OP is acting like the games are even comparable with kobe where he has multiple shots kobe should be taking and scoring under 15 points. LeBron was aggressive to the rim and I like that better than shooting multiple contested Js.

[LikeABosh]

Read to me where I ever said that, kiddo. Bron has a respectable jumper, but yes he's better when attacking.

Look, take LePecker out of your mouths. You're all turning into little pauks. He did this against the Bobcats, and was visibly protecting his FG percentage.

I'm not hating on LeBron. Jesus, Kobe stans say I hate on Kobe, LeBron stans say I hate on LeBron.

I've banged the drum for both these guys when it's been DESERVED. I'm being objective. I'm neither a fanboy of either of these guys. They both have flaws in either their character, intangibles, or approach that bothers me down to my core.

LeBron and Wade have admitted of having a personal contest in regards to their field goal percentage. They have admitted to passing up shots to protect it, and regretting shots they did take in order to protect it.

That isn't basketball. That isn't keeping the win in mind. That's PERSONAL AGENDA. The same type that LeBron stans claim Kobe selfishly pursues at the expense of his teammates.

The only guy in this thread I respect who doesn't have his head up Bron's ass who can see things objectively is kuniva_daMIGHTY. Contrived field goal percentage protection is just as fake as Kobe passing up shots over Luke Ridinour in order to force and pad assist numbers.
Lebron can do what ever the **** he wants with the ball because he's the best player in the world. Lets look at the facts. He scored 31 points, shot 93%, still got 8 assists, and the Heat won. Just respect the ****ing performance and shutup.

[Gotterdammerung]

LeBron and Wade have admitted of having a personal contest in regards to their field goal percentage. They have admitted to passing up shots to protect it, and regretting shots they did take in order to protect it.

If that's the entire substance of your argument, then there's nothing to see here, except a classic poisoning in the well.

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk34/stingrays01/Misc%20Picks%20and%20Avatars/nakedgunFrankDrebin-Nothingtoseeher.gif

Please disperse, nothing to see here. :oldlol:

[tmacattack33]

Tonight, LeBron shot a stunning 13-14 from the field.

But on closer inspection, he was deliberately passing up shots to maintain a field goal percentage. Thus, contrived. We all know of his "competition" w/ teammate Wade to see who has the best field goal percentage every game.

When a player is passing up quality shots in order to pad a field goal percentage, isn't that just as bad for a team as say the recent crucifixion of Kobe Bryant for ... basically being phony in recent games passing up shots to pad assist totals, at the expense of quality shots for himself.

It's the same forged agenda, just different purposes. But no one has a problem when LeBron does it.

Hmmm ... No one else takes issue with this contradiction? Or fan hypocritical behavior and reception of the performances?

:biggums:

:facepalm

No.

If Lebron ended up 8 for 9 on FG's for 16 points and 8 assists then we could talk.

But he ended up 13 for 14 for 31 points, with 8 assists and 8 rebounds. There is no way you could possibly hate on that...:wtf:

[GreatGreg]

Honestly, watching the Kobe and LeBron stans go at each other is like watching hardcore mainstream Fox News and MSNBC pundits at each other's necks. It's painful to see and both sides are so damn annoying.

[Graviton]

Don't forget the 5 turnovers, he didn't even get an assist/turnover ratio of 2, that's not usual Lebron. The fact he gave up some open looks and forced passes is supported by the data at hand.

Though I don't get why it's an issue, this was a pointless regular season game vs the Bobcats, Lebron was just toying with them. In the playoffs he won't care about FG% and will make the best decision every time.

This was a lot more fun than OKC blowing a team out then sitting Durant/Westbrook in the 4th and hurting their stats. When everyone uses those numbers to criticise players, it's no wonder Lebron is stuffing that shit so no one can nitpick anything about his game. People forget these players are even better than their stats suggest.

[Mr. Jabbar]

OP makes a great point. Lebron is the biggest stat padding loser in the game. Its sickening to see how he plays the whole game looking at his fg%, he has said this himself. No wonder ppl praising him for these "accomplishments" are pre-teens who started watching the game 1 or 2 seasons ago and know nothing about greatness.

Disagreeing with this means you are 12 years old, and will get you negged.

[Pointguard]

Tonight, LeBron shot a stunning 13-14 from the field.

But on closer inspection, he was deliberately passing up shots to maintain a field goal percentage. Thus, contrived. We all know of his "competition" w/ teammate Wade to see who has the best field goal percentage every game.

When a player is passing up quality shots in order to pad a field goal percentage, isn't that just as bad for a team as say the recent crucifixion of Kobe Bryant for ... basically being phony in recent games passing up shots to pad assist totals, at the expense of quality shots for himself.

It's the same forged agenda, just different purposes. But no one has a problem when LeBron does it.

Hmmm ... No one else takes issue with this contradiction? Or fan hypocritical behavior and reception of the performances?

:biggums:

You're looking at it from a negative standpoint.

On a team with two or more stars its best that they emphasize quality shots moreso than pushing the issue. You emphasize quality because you got quality players. If one player sacrifices forced shots, its better for the other two players as they are more aware of ball movement, with their patience and turning down dubious shots, it almost assures that another player will get a better shot. As a point guard you are told to take quality shots and limit the quantity. Traditional point guards Chris Paul and Deron William are good examples of this. Its a floor balance priority if you have three guys that can score. Its why Magic was one of the games best winners and is the games best team player.

Rose is the exception. He was on a team where guys could not create very well from themselves and his quantity of shots caused enough chaos to keep teams off balance, with hopes of others capitalizing off of it. Kyrie is in the same position. Floor balance is not the priority, but breaking the defense down is mandatory.

Kobe had created an imbalance by emphasizing quantity over quality. Both Gasol and DH felt left out. But look at what is happening now.

Lebron and Wade talked about it knowing that Durant and Westbrook don't have the maturity to pull it off, and with hopes they might do the copycat thing. They might take the bait but they aren't wise enough to do it effectively at this stage.

[Magic 32]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBseRlgoSLc

In the Finals > vs the Bobcats

[Whoah10115]

This guy just made a thread about how Lebron is so good he doesn't even get calls anymore, but he's being called a hater?



He at least looks to make basketball points. The Lebron "stans" are just as bad as the Kobe ones. Both sides are incredibly annoying and beyond shitty for basketball discussion. And attempting to be logical is such a pile of shit.


I've been called a Kobe fan the last couple weeks. A few months ago I was getting called a Lebron fan. That just means both of your sides are ****in stupid.


Good use of the word "organic".

[Legends66NBA7]

I've been called a Kobe fan the last couple weeks. A few months ago I was getting called a Lebron fan. That just means both of your sides are ****in stupid.

Same shit happened to me and some of these losers actually anonymous neg you and call you names like "Kobetard" or "LeBrontard"...

Definitely agree with the last sentence.

[TMT]

It was analyzed earlier this season how Lebron was passing up taking long shots at the end of quarters just to protect his field goal percentage. Much like Rondo avoiding contact because he didn't want to go to the line, imo. But I only caught the end of the fourth of the game tonight so I couldn't honestly say.

[MJ23forever]

http://www.albany.com/byesline/check%20my%20stats2.jpg

[ProfessorMurder]

If by deliberately passing up shots you mean setting up teammates for easy buckets, ok.

You all say Rondo is statpadding when he does that. So either Rondo isn't or LeBron is.

[thesage]

Wait. Did the Heat lose?

[Lebron23]

Wait. Did the Heat lose?


They beat the Bobcats.

[knicksman]

lebron has been a statpadder throughout his career thats why hes not as impactful as the durants, shaq, dirk, cp3 of this league. it took 6 years for him to make his team contenders while durant only takes 3.

[BoutPractice]

Who cares what your reason is for acting a certain way on the court...
The only thing that matters is whether whatever you're doing works.
Clearly, by any objective measure, what LeBron's doing out there works.

Maybe Brian Scalabrine plays the game in a selfless, "organic" manner, but ultimately it doesn't mean anything because he sucks compared to his peers, and guys like Kobe and LeBron, no matter how "contrived" their game, don't. It's as simple as that, really.

[TylerOO]

lebron has been a statpadder throughout his career thats why hes not as impactful as the durants, shaq, dirk, cp3 of this league. it took 6 years for him to make his team contenders while durant only takes 3.

LeBron never had a player of Westbrook, Harden, or even Ibakas caliber. Idiot.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Guy gets 31 8 and 8, shoots a great percentage, team wins, and yet we have people coming with criticism. Anything can get hated on. Anything.

[LikeABosh]

lebron has been a statpadder throughout his career thats why hes not as impactful as the durants, shaq, dirk, cp3 of this league. it took 6 years for him to make his team contenders while durant only takes 3.
Lebron took his team to the playoffs in the 3rd season of his career and led them to the finals in his 4th. Just like Durant you stupid ****

[Pacers4ever]

Guy gets 31 8 and 8, shoots a great percentage, team wins, and yet we have people coming with criticism. Anything can get hated on. Anything.
This I'd understand if they lost or lebron completely took a notch down in scoring in order to help his FG% but he didn't. He scored 30+ points, got his team mates some buckets, and won the ****ing game.

[KOBE143]

People forget dude has 5TO.. He rather want to have a TO than taking a shot.. Thats equivalent to 5 missed shot.. So LeBron in reality has 13/20 fg.. Perfect game my ass..

[Pacers4ever]

Lebron took his team to the playoffs in the 3rd season of his career and led them to the finals in his 4th. Just like Durant you stupid ****
And the retarded knicks fan completely ignores durant had harden and westbrook on his side who sometimes out performed him in the playoffs and the finals. LeBron wishes he had those kind of players to rely on at that early age.

[Pacers4ever]

People forget dude has 5TO.. He rather want to have a TO than taking a shot.. Thats equivalent to 5 missed shot.. So LeBron in reality has 13/20 fg.. Perfect game my ass..
and still so much better than kobe's career fg % and if we added his TO's oh my goodness

[Real Men Wear Green]

This I'd understand if they lost or lebron completely took a notch down in scoring in order to help his FG% but he didn't. He scored 30+ points, got his team mates some buckets, and won the ****ing game.
Trolls will now criticize a player for taking the shots he thinks he has a good chance of making and passing up the ones he doesn't think are high-percentage. They are thinking their way into stupidity.

[Da KO King]

Trolls will now criticize a player for taking the shots he thinks he has a good chance of making and passing up the ones he doesn't think are high-percentage. They are thinking their way into stupidity.
I like this and will be borrowing it. :oldlol:

[LBJ 23]

Samurai Swoosh are you back to your old-self? Will ISH be flooded again with your stupid comments about Lebron like 1 or 2 years ago?

People, it's not like Lebron was passing up shots for Birdman to shoot jumpers or anything like it. He was passing up shots indeed, but to Bosh for his midrange jumper(which is usually money), to Battier, Allen for 3(who wouldn't though?), to Wade and Bosh under/around the basket for easy layups/dunks. Damn, these passes lead to very high percentage shots from his teammates which can only benefit his team. It's surely better than him taking tough fadeaway jumpers, sure it's nice to see, but not very effective.

People please be smart, you're critizing player for playing almost perfect game of basketball.

[STATUTORY]

Samurai Swoosh are you back to your old-self? Will ISH be flooded again with your stupid comments about Lebron like 1 or 2 years ago?

People, it's not like Lebron was passing up shots for Birdman to shoot jumpers or anything like it. He was passing up shots indeed, but to Bosh for his midrange jumper(which is usually money), to Battier, Allen for 3(who wouldn't though?), to Wade and Bosh under/around the basket for easy layups/dunks. Damn, these passes lead to very high percentage shots from his teammates which can only benefit his team. It's surely better than him taking tough fadeaway jumpers, sure it's nice to see, but not very effective.

People please be smart, you're critizing player for playing almost perfect game of basketball.

by doing that isn't he admitting that he's a worse shooter than Bosh, Allen, or Battier? I thought according to his fans that he's the best shooter in the game... :facepalm

[LBJ 23]

by doing that isn't he admitting that he's a worse shooter than Bosh, Allen, or Battier? I thought according to his fans that he's the best shooter in the game... :facepalm

Ask any rational lebron fan and all of them will tell you he's worse shooter than players you mentioned/nor is he the best shooter in the game.

Even better, find me one poster saying this. I think it's clear you're talking out of your ass and making shit up...

Typical Kobetard

[RoundMoundOfReb]

by doing that isn't he admitting that he's a worse shooter than Bosh, Allen, or Battier? I thought according to his fans that he's the best shooter in the game... :facepalm
Allen and bosh are better shooters obviously. wide open battier shot > contested lebron shot. Lebron is a great spot up shooter not great at pulling up off the dribble.