What would you trade for Paul George?

[InspiredLebowski]

This is basically just a thought experiment, trying to gauge non-Pacers fans opinion. George is pretty clearly getting the max on his next contract and will be a Pacer.

But I asked the question on another Pacer specific forum and, in a vacuum where contracts and location don't matter, clearly Durant and Lebron are no brainers. Then some debate for guys like Kyrie, Harden, Griffin, Rose (depending on the knee), CP3, a healthy Dwight.

So what would give up, pretending you don't have to match contracts or anything.

[qrich]

Of course Indy turns this down but Bledsoe + Butler + Thompkins + Odom + 2 Firsts for George + Mahinmi (or any other bad contracts they might feel that they might have.

[9erempiree]

Don't know but he's definitely not a max contract guy and I like George.

[The Choken One]

No.

I'd try to shit out Granger, though.

[AirTupac]

Ron Artest, Duhon, Morris, EBanks and Pau Gasol and if you want Mike D'Antoni.

[InspiredLebowski]

Don't know but he's definitely not a max contract guy and I like George.He unquestionably is.

[irondarts]

Don't know but he's definitely not a max contract guy and I like George.
He's absolutely a max contract guy. He's an amazing player on both ends of the court.

[bdreason]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine/?tradeId=a8c5yj4

[Fudge]

I love Russ, but i would actually think this one over if it was offered by Indy.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine/?tradeId=akarfx9

OKC:
George Hill/Reggie Jackson
Paul George/Kevin Martin
Kevin Durant/Ronnie Brewer
Serge Ibaka/Tyler Hansbrough
Kendrick Perkins/Nick Collison

Indiana:
DJ Augustin
Russell Westbrook/Lance Stephenson
Danny Granger/Gerald Green
David West/Perry Jones
Roy Hibbert/Ian Mahinmi

[Clippersfan86]

Comon man :facepalm . No way in hell George is even considered in a trade for tier one players at their position like CP3 or Griffin. I think his value is fantastic and he would probably net an all star but not superstars or borderline superstars.

George is a tier 3 player in the 20-25 range in terms of top players.

[Rekindled]

Don't know but he's definitely not a max contract guy and I like George.

any gm that dare to offer him less than the max needs to be fired immediately and never taken seriously ever again

[Clippersfan86]

Paul gets the max only because if his team doesn't throw it at him, 3 other teams will. Same reason guys like Hibbert got the max.

[9erempiree]

any gm that dare to offer him less than the max needs to be fired immediately and never taken seriously ever again

Sorry but a max contract guy to me is a franchise player. A player the team builds around.

By today's standards and GM's dishing out crazy amount of money, it wouldn't surprise me if he gets the max.

Again, GM's are fools.

[KeyNote]

2 Firsts and whoever my 2nd/3rd options are + a couple of expiring

kid is legit

[andremiller07]

Tyreke Evans & Jason Thompson/Marcus Thornton

[wally_world]

Paul gets the max only because if his team doesn't throw it at him, 3 other teams will. Same reason guys like Hibbert got the max.

This.

He's a terrific player, but i dont believe in giving max contracts to players who cant takeover offensively. PG has a chance to develop into that player, but as of right now he isnt.

[Dro]

This.

He's a terrific player, but i dont believe in giving max contracts to players who cant takeover offensively. PG has a chance to develop into that player, but as of right now he isnt.
Then obviously, you haven't seen many Pacer games this year...He's definitely getting the max...The guy is only 22 years old...But this is par for the course...When a guy starts getting a lot of pub, people usually try to knock him down a notch...Not saying you are but thats what happens...

[Clippersfan86]

Then obviously, you haven't seen many Pacer games this year...He's definitely getting the max...The guy is only 22 years old...But this is par for the course...When a guy starts getting a lot of pub, people usually try to knock him down a notch...Not saying you are but thats what happens...

Again people are forgetting who used to get max contracts. It's only a trend in the last 3 years it seems where teams hand out max deals like candy. As Wally said a max deal to me is a franchise player. George shouldn't get far from max because he's already fantastic and has wonderful upside at just 22 like you said.

Let the guy make an all star team or an All NBA team before we talk about max deal though...

[Rekindled]

Again people are forgetting who used to get max contracts. It's only a trend in the last 3 years it seems where teams hand out max deals like candy. As Wally said a max deal to me is a franchise player. George shouldn't get far from max because he's already fantastic and has wonderful upside at just 22 like you said.

Let the guy make an all star team or an All NBA team before we talk about max deal though...

he is on the allstar team this year. do u even watch the nba?

[Clippersfan86]

he is on the allstar team this year. do u even watch the nba?

My bad he was (I forgot he drained those 3's). I kept calling him Durant east because he was chucking like crazy. Nonetheless he hasn't done enough yet to justify it.

[9erempiree]

First off George needs to make a couple more all star games, do some commercials and get a shoe contract before he should get a max deal.

He needs to be able to sell out arenas before Indy dumps all that money into him. He needs to be able to get back the organization's investment.

[InspiredLebowski]

I really don't think some of you guys understand that not every max contract is the same.

[longtime lurker]

Then obviously, you haven't seen many Pacer games this year...He's definitely getting the max...The guy is only 22 years old...But this is par for the course...When a guy starts getting a lot of pub, people usually try to knock him down a notch...Not saying you are but thats what happens...

You think Hibbert was worth the max because I can guarantee you a year ago people were saying the exact same thing. Max contract players should be reserved for transcendent players and just because some idiot GM's overpay doesn't mean that's a players worth. If some moron started paying 100 dollars for a banana that doesn't mean the actually value of bananas is worth 100 dollars

[InspiredLebowski]

You think Hibbert was worth the max because I can guarantee you a year ago people were saying the exact same thing. Max contract players should be reserved for transcendent players and just because some idiot GM's overpay doesn't mean that's a players worth. If some moron started paying 100 dollars for a banana that doesn't mean the actually value of bananas is worth 100 dollarsThere's not a single Pacers fan that thinks Hibbert was worth the max. But there's 99.5% of them that realized it's the name of the game and w/o him we're back to an also-ran.

Either way, the scenarios are nowhere near the same. The ceilings of the two are nowhere, I mean NOWHERE, near the same. Paul George is a top 25ish player right now, at 22 years old.

[stephanieg]

If some moron started paying 100 dollars for a banana that doesn't mean the actually value of bananas is worth 100 dollars

It does mean that. Goods don't have a Platonic price floating in outerspace. And if you get enough so called morons acting this way you can get a bubble.

[Myth]

Wesley Matthews and a top 3 protected pick from the Blazers.

[wally_world]

Then obviously, you haven't seen many Pacer games this year...He's definitely getting the max...The guy is only 22 years old...But this is par for the course...When a guy starts getting a lot of pub, people usually try to knock him down a notch...Not saying you are but thats what happens...

Dude im a huge PG fan, if he's really what you Pacers fan are making him out to be, they wouldnt be scoring as many ppg as the Orlando Magic. He's not a #1 option who can carry the scoring load of a team, and i feel a max player has to do that.

He WILL be getting thet max, if you see what i quoted and what i agreed on. Im just saying he's not worthy of it, just like ALOT of players in this league arent.

[hawkfan]

I really don't think some of you guys understand that not every max contract is the same.

How much do you count as max?
How long?

The Hawks offered Josh Smith a 3 years, 47 million, the max they can offer now. In the off-season he wants 5 years, 94 million.

Is Josh worth 19 million per season for 5 years? No.
Is he worth 16 million per 4 or 5 years? Yes.

So what do you mean by max for George?
He certainly isn't worth a Russell Westbrook contract, unless he can get his team into the Finals. But then the Pacers gave Hibbert a max deal, and he isn't worth that.

[Burgz V2]

DeMar+fillers+1st rounder

would be an immediate upgrade able to play the 2 and 3 interchangeably. Would be a BEAST duo with Rudy

[B4llin]

I would trade my whole team for him if i was the clippers....lol jks

TBH the pacers got lucky and PG has made them a very exciting team. Can't wait to see him become better and better

[Clippersfan86]

"Mini max" is 13 mill a year to start. The only players who qualify for the starting salary of 17 mill or w/e on a typical backloaded contract (Regular max deal) are "Derrick Rose" rule players or veterans getting their second max deal and beyond. So far only Rose and Griffin have qualified for the "Derrick Rose Rule". Which means they either..

A. Won an MVP
B. Started for two all star teams
C. Made an All NBA team

In the life of their original contract.

Anyways even 13 mill a year, I'm not sure Paul is worth it. Although like we all agree he WILL get it no doubt due to how the market works now with shitty owners now. Some dipshit lotto team will throw him max and force the Pacers to match.

[B4llin]

Paying Paul George the Max based on his potential to become a superstar is worth it though, similar to how harden was.

He IS an all star remember

way more than upside eric gordon is, or other similar players who have gotten the max.

OT: Clpps fan if you didnt have CP3 what kind of contract would you expect the clippers to offer Bledsoe to stay with them? Assuming there weren't any other free agent PG's available come contract time? If he was getting CP3's minutes now, even he would demand a pretty huge contract come contract time, he even will now just because of his potential.

[Clippersfan86]

I'd hope for the Clippers to pay Bledsoe 7-8 mill a year tops. Supposedly cap guys are predicting he will get offered 10 mill a year.

[LbloodOjunkieG]

I would trade anyone on the Bucks for him. That's not saying much, but you asked. :cheers:

[InspiredLebowski]

How much do you count as max?
How long?

The Hawks offered Josh Smith a 3 years, 47 million, the max they can offer now. In the off-season he wants 5 years, 94 million.

Is Josh worth 19 million per season for 5 years? No.
Is he worth 16 million per 4 or 5 years? Yes.

So what do you mean by max for George?
He certainly isn't worth a Russell Westbrook contract, unless he can get his team into the Finals. But then the Pacers gave Hibbert a max deal, and he isn't worth that.I mean his maximum contract that the CBA will allow. Five years and ~80 million would be his max, unless shit gets crazy and he wins MVP next season. Which is the exact same contract as Westbrook (and Harden). If someone thinks either of those players is worth that money there is absolutely no reason to think George isn't worth it (after next season) besides not seeing him play enough. Paul George is right now, today, a top 25 player in the NBA with a full year to go before a new deal needs to even be discussed.

[B4llin]

I'd hope for the Clippers to pay Bledsoe 7-8 mill a year tops. Supposedly cap guys are predicting he will get offered 10 mill a year.

And you dont think George is worth 3 more mil than the clips back up PG? Who is only 1 year older and an all star? Plus giving George the max, they can get rid of Danny Granger for a solid peice. The Pacers surely lucked out.

[hawkfan]

I mean his maximum contract that the CBA will allow. Five years and ~80 million would be his max, unless shit gets crazy and he wins MVP next season. Which is the exact same contract as Westbrook (and Harden). If someone thinks either of those players is worth that money there is absolutely no reason to think George isn't worth it (after next season) besides not seeing him play enough. Paul George is right now, today, a top 25 player in the NBA with a full year to go before a new deal needs to even be discussed.

He'll definitely get the same contract that Batum and Gordon got, 4 years, around 55 million (however much it is adjusted upward when he signs).

Will the Pacers give him the fifth year? Doubt it.

[Rubio2Gasol]

He unquestionably is.

Maybe from the standpoint of Supply vs Demand. But I wouldn't give him a max contract if I was a GM.

I'm actually a huge fan.

But If I'm giving him the max I need 2 superstars in place.

[hawkfan]

I'd hope for the Clippers to pay Bledsoe 7-8 mill a year tops. Supposedly cap guys are predicting he will get offered 10 mill a year.

Utah can offer him 3 years, 30 million. They need help at the point guard.
So does Sacramento. With the new owners, maybe they will pay.
Doubt Bledsoe will be there next year.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

I would give up A LOT. i love his game. Complete player. Not sure anything from the raps would interest the pacers though.

[Phenith]

At his age and the way he is developing, there is NO WAY the Pacers consider trading this guy for anything other than an insanely good deal. It's just not happening, he is the kind of guy that every team would love to have if they could get him.

[3peated]

mwp Jodie Meeks and Jordan hill for George and both hansbros

[irondarts]

mwp Jodie Meeks and Jordan hill for George and both hansbros
lol

[ralph_i_el]

Sorry but a max contract guy to me is a franchise player. A player the team builds around.

By today's standards and GM's dishing out crazy amount of money, it wouldn't surprise me if he gets the max.

Again, GM's are fools.

but Paul George looks like he can be a franchise player and he's still getting better. He has such a huge impact on D too, not to mention how well he's shot from 3. Great athlete, great size, great attitude. His play has at least earned the lowest max that they give you when you come off a rookie deal.

he's a young improving all star. Plus he is a great defensive matchup for big scoring wings like Lebron, Melo, Durant, Kobe which is super important if the pacers want to win a championship.


I feel like most people don't understand what "Max contract" entail. If he's coming off his rookie deal a "Max deal" is significantly less than the "Max" for someone coming of their second or third deal. That's why we're always hearing about these "Max" deals when really there are different levels of "Max"

[Dro]

You think Hibbert was worth the max because I can guarantee you a year ago people were saying the exact same thing. Max contract players should be reserved for transcendent players and just because some idiot GM's overpay doesn't mean that's a players worth. If some moron started paying 100 dollars for a banana that doesn't mean the actually value of bananas is worth 100 dollars
No Hibbert is NOT worth the max but like Lebowski said, every max contract is not the same...If the Pacers wanted to keep Hibbert, they had to give him the max, period, because the Blazers offered him that and Hibbert is a huge part of this team, regardless of his offensive struggles....

George has the potential to be a much more impactful player than Hibbert on BOTH ends...of course he's going to get the max...Anyway, he sent the Pacers staff a letter of his appreciation the other day and gave all the Pacers employees a nice gift...The guy isn't going anywhere so they'll give him the max..

[Dro]

Dude im a huge PG fan, if he's really what you Pacers fan are making him out to be, they wouldnt be scoring as many ppg as the Orlando Magic. He's not a #1 option who can carry the scoring load of a team, and i feel a max player has to do that.

He WILL be getting thet max, if you see what i quoted and what i agreed on. Im just saying he's not worthy of it, just like ALOT of players in this league arent.
If you think the Pacers scoring issues are because of that, then again, you haven't seen many Pacer games or don't understand the type of horrible offense Vogel runs....George goes on scoring tears, I know you've seen him do that. I've keep saying, this team can score with anybody if Vogel played a different, more uptempo system, like they did last year when they were top 10 in offense...Oh and its like people keep talking about the scoring, yet seemingly forgetting they have been missing they're leading scorer and a guy who averages 22 ppg for his career....

And I mean, if a lot of players are getting the max, and we know the league has LONG since moved in this direction, then why is the issue even being discussed anymore? Are we gonna go through every NBA team and pick out guys with undeserving contracts because we'd probably be talking about 75% of every teams' roster...

[code green]

Pierce, Bradley, Sully, and a 1st. I'd hate seeing Pierce in another uniform, but Paul George would make it a little more bearable.

EDIT: Add Rondo and DJ Augustin to the trade if it isn't enough.

[chips93]

guys that i wouldnt trade for george;
bron
kd
cp3
kyrie
russ

those are the only no-brainers that i wouldnt trade away, to get george.

[alenleomessi]

paul and deandre for george and hibbert

[Money 23]

Not sure, I'm not exactly on his hype train. He's yet to really impress me.

[Whoah10115]

Again people are forgetting who used to get max contracts. It's only a trend in the last 3 years it seems where teams hand out max deals like candy. As Wally said a max deal to me is a franchise player. George shouldn't get far from max because he's already fantastic and has wonderful upside at just 22 like you said.

Let the guy make an all star team or an All NBA team before we talk about max deal though...



This really isn't that true. Big contracts were not handed out the way you suggest. They've been handed out a lot throughout the history of the NBA.

[Rubio2Gasol]

I think you give out Max deals to a guy like George (I'm assuming it's going to be a lower end max in the region of 15 million a year or less) If you're certain you have at least one other superstar to compliment him with.

Problem is Roy Hibbert also got a max and Granger is getting stupid money so I dunno if they got the cap space to do that. Max contracts need to be for something - for a plan - not just be given out to keep your guy.

[Whoah10115]

I think you give out Max deals to a guy like George (I'm assuming it's going to be a lower end max in the region of 15 million a year or less) If you're certain you have at least one other superstar to compliment him with.

Problem is Roy Hibbert also got a max and Granger is getting stupid money so I dunno if they got the cap space to do that. Max contracts need to be for something - for a plan - not just be given out to keep your guy.



You gotta make a trade. Obviously, if the Pacers could package some stuff (include a third team or more teams, if necessary) to net Eric Gordon, and then Eric Gordon stayed healthy...that obviously is ideal.


But I don't think you need another superstar....you just need overall quality.

[LikeABosh]

Lebron's sneakers and headband

[ChuckOakley]

Anyone but Lopez on the Nets and of course he's worth the 4/58 max he will get. He's the fourth best SF in the game behind some dudes named Lebron, Durant and Melo.

Meanwhile there is a reason the Pacers are the 2nd best team in the East despite missing who was their franchise player as of 4 months and Hibberts poor play.

BTW I love watching CF86 troll this thread as he realizes there's another team being taken seriously as a potential contender and top 5 team.

[DuMa]

George is worth the max and more. He is STILL flying under the radar which is impressive because his game is very complete on both sides of the ball. theres nothing he cant do except prove he can win in the playoffs.

[Dro]

George is worth the max and more. He is STILL flying under the radar which is impressive because his game is very complete on both sides of the ball. theres nothing he cant do except prove he can win in the playoffs.
Id still say he needs to work on his ball-handling although he has improved that a TON, his passing, he still throws some careless passes sometimes, and his post game. Other than that, I agree with you....

[Phenith]

I don't think it's been mentioned, but let's not lose sight of the fact he is 22 years old (23 in may) and only in his 3rd year, he is one of the rare cases where a high potential player is actually approaching/achieving his potential and he is still improving.

[ThickassGlasses]

guys that i wouldnt trade for george;
bron
kd
cp3
kyrie
russ

those are the only no-brainers that i wouldnt trade away, to get george.

Replace Goatbrook with Rose and add Harden and this is the correct answer. Maybe toss in their Marc Gasol as well, but that's very, very close.

[BankShot]

I'd consider a package built around Kevin Love if it means we could resig
n pekovic

[KrizMiz]

easy - paul for kobe and dwight!

[FindingTim]

Paul George is the real deal, and he will only get better.
There are only a handful of players with a higher trade value:
Lebron
Durant
Kyrie
Rose
Griffin
CP3

I think he has pretty similar value to James Harden and Stephen Curry, but a higher ceiling.

call me crazy, but I think George has more value than Westbrook, Carmelo, Marc Gasol, Dwight Howard, Parker, Aldridge, Rondo, Love, Horford... I don't necessarily think Paul George is a better player than those guys, but I think if they were offered straight up, Indiana would respectfully decline.

John Wall is an interesting one. If you think he will blossom into a superstar, I could see his value being as high as George... but George has been stellar this year, and his ceiling is arguably just as high- if not higher- than Wall's.

[boozehound]

Tyreke Evans & Jason Thompson/Marcus Thornton
everyone on the pistons not named drummond or monroe. Granted, that still wouldnt get it done.