1984 Larry Bird vs. 2012 LeBron James

[Lebron23]

Who's the better player? Bird won his first NBA Finals MVP in 1984 while LeBron won his first Finals MVP last year. Both Bird and LeBron won the Regular Season MVP.


Larry Bird



http://cdn101.iofferphoto.com/img/item/146/122/867/VGD6YlhbvGOWlCR.jpg

Regular Season

24.0 ppg on 49.2 FG%, 11.0 rpg, 6.6 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.9 bpg

Playoffs

27.5 ppg on 52.4 FG%, 11.0 rpg, 5.9 apg, 2.3 spg, 1.2 bpg

Finals

27.4 ppg on 48.6 FG%, 14.0 rpg, 3.6 apg, 2.1 spg, 1.1 spg

Celtics beat the Bullets, Knicks, Bucks, and Lakers in the playoffs.


LeBron James

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/si/2012/writers/ian_thomsen/06/20/lebron-james-kevin-durant-dream-team-charles-barkley/lebron-durant-p1.jpg

Regular Season

27.1 ppg on 53.2 FG%, 8.0 rpg, 6.2 apg, 1.9 spg, 0.8 bpg

Playoffs

30.3 ppg on 50 FG%, 9.7 rpg, 5.3 apg, 1.9 spg, 0.7 bpg

Finals

28.6 ppg on 47.4 FG%, 10.0 rpg, 7.4 apg, 1.6 spg, 0.4 bpg

Miami beat the Knicks, Pacers, Celtics and Thunder in the playoffs.

[ripthekik]

How about 2011 LeBron James

[NumberSix]

The king

[Deuce Bigalow]

Bird. 2012 was a lockout season (not that it doesn't count).
Bird's team beat the Showtime Lakers while Lebron's team beat the Thunder.

[D-Wade316]

The king
EASILY

[Kingwillball]

And This YEar Lebron Numbers In regular season even BETTER will see about Playoffs.

[Lebron23]

The king


Larry Legends thinks that LeBron just had the greatest playoffs run in NBA History.

http://www.complex.com/sports/2012/07/larry-bird-thinks-lebron-james-had-the-best-playoff-run-in-nba-history

[Money 23]

Bird's team beat the Showtime Lakers while Lebron's team beat the Thunder.
Thunder of 2012 were really nice, one of the best trios of all-time in my opinion. Very talented. It would be foolish to underrate that team.

But given the lock out which crippled a lot of teams due to injuries who didn't have freak genetic experiment athletes on their team (LeBron) ...

And like you said superior rebounding numbers, slightly less volume scoring, comparable assist numbers and the fact they beat an ALL TIME great Laker squad. I'm going with Larry Legend.

Maybe, 2013 LeBron will have a more separation in terms of stats and performance in the next playoffs.

[Round Mound]

1985-86 Bird Should Be The One in the Conversation. As an Impact Player...Lebron is Better but as a Team Player Bird Was the Best Ever.

[Pushxx]

MJ, Bird, Wilt, and Shaq have the best peaks ever.

Sure there are guys just below like KG, LeBron, and Hakeem, but those four have the best peaks in NBA history.

LeBron has still more to play of course, but the rules that benefit perimeter play in today's NBA make a big difference when it comes to Bird and MJ's peaks.

[Kingwillball]

MJ, Bird, Wilt, and Shaq have the best peaks ever.

Sure there are guys just below like KG, LeBron, and Hakeem, but those four have the best peaks in NBA history.

LeBron has still more to play of course, but the rules that benefit perimeter play in today's NBA make a big difference when it comes to Bird and MJ's peaks.


Lebron Will Join that Top Line if He is at this Level another 2 or 3 seasons.

[diamenz]

bird is the better team player imo, and worked better off the ball. a whole hell of a lot better off the ball. he was also a much more fluid player with better fundamentals.

i think lebron would take bird one on one though.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Stats are comparable, both had some good team mates around but this says it all




Celtics beat the Bullets, Knicks, Bucks, and Lakers in the playoffs.

Miami beat the Knicks, Pacers, Celtics and Thunder in the playoffs.

Plus Bird won mvp in a league with Magic, prime King, Moses, Kareem, Isiah, Erving, Dantley, Moncrief..

Also 1984 wasn't a lockout season and can't forget the tougher rules

[ripthekik]

Larry Legends thinks that LeBron just had the greatest playoffs run in NBA History.

http://www.complex.com/sports/2012/07/larry-bird-thinks-lebron-james-had-the-best-playoff-run-in-nba-history
best run.. against the worst opponents ever???:oldlol:
look at the east teams they play..:roll:

[Pacers4ever]

Thunder of 2012 were really nice, one of the best trios of all-time in my opinion. Very talented. It would be foolish to underrate that team.

But given the lock out which crippled a lot of teams due to injuries who didn't have freak genetic experiment athletes on their team (LeBron) ...

And like you said superior rebounding numbers, slightly less volume scoring, comparable assist numbers and the fact they beat an ALL TIME great Laker squad. I'm going with Larry Legend.

Maybe, 2013 LeBron will have a more separation in terms of stats and performance in the next playoffs.
He didn't actually say that and shouldn't when you factor the difference in pace between both leagues and in case you didn't know, it was faster in 1984.

[Money 23]

He didn't actually say that and shouldn't when you factor the difference in pace between both leagues and in case you didn't know, it was faster in 1984.
Well Mr ISH #1 LeBron Stan ... he didn't say that, correct. The small difference in pace and the according rebound correlation isn't enough for me to place Bron's run over it considering Bird took out Magic / Kareem's Lakers in the Finals.

[Pushxx]

He didn't actually say that and shouldn't when you factor the difference in pace between both leagues and in case you didn't know, it was faster in 1984.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=po1M--HaINA

[Harison]

Bird for me. Just by pure talent, mentality and impact. Not even speaking about Bird didnt even need refs protection like LBJ does.

[LeBird]

One led his team to the championship over arguably the greatest team of all time, the other beat a bunch a kids - albeit, very talented kids.

[NumberSix]

Stats are comparable, both had some good team mates around but this says it all



Plus Bird won mvp in a league with Magic, prime King, Moses, Kareem, Isiah, Erving, Dantley, Moncrief..

Also 1984 wasn't a lockout season and can't forget the tougher rules
Oh, you mean the tougher defensive rules in an era where nobody even played any defence? The same era that routinely had games in the 130's-140's in the finals? :confusedshrug:

[NumberSix]

Well Mr ISH #1 LeBron Stan ... he didn't say that, correct. The small difference in pace and the according rebound correlation isn't enough for me to place Bron's run over it considering Bird took out Magic / Kareem's Lakers in the Finals.
Uhhh, hello? :hammerhead:

[Kovach]

He didn't actually say that and shouldn't when you factor the difference in pace between both leagues and in case you didn't know, it was faster in 1984.
Mind if we factor Parish and McHale as well?

[Nash]

Lebron has an edge in the stats but who's better defensively?

[SHAQisGOAT]

Oh, you mean the tougher defensive rules in an era where nobody even played any defence? The same era that routinely had games in the 130's-140's in the finals? :confusedshrug:

:rolleyes:

Or you can also go the other way around and say that they've played greater offense, that today nobody plays good offense nowadays

[SHAQisGOAT]

He didn't actually say that and shouldn't when you factor the difference in pace between both leagues and in case you didn't know, it was faster in 1984.

Don't get why people never look at this thing called TRB%, LeBron never came close to Bird and Larry played with better rebounders

Look at the numbers Bird posted as a 35 year old badly injured beat up player, Cs at the average pace of 95.8, without even being the main ball handler

Plus look at that vid posted above

[NumberSix]

:rolleyes:

Or you can also go the other way around and say that they've played greater offense, that today nobody plays good offense nowadays
Yeah, if they were shooting 70%, sure. They weren't. The offensive efficiency wasn't any better. Just more possessions due to nobody playing any defense.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Also Bird's defense value is underrated

Celtics were one of the worst defensive teams in the league, just one of worst teams period, then with Bird they posted the best record and became one of the best defensive teams in the league. That's with the same players from the year before, Bird played a big role as far as that

1st in DWS 4 times, 7 times in the top 10
Top 10 in DRtg 6 times
1.7 steals, 0.8 blocks for his career

He had great defensive impact, amazing team defender, terrifc basketball IQ, quickest hands, good post defender, didn't have the speed or lateral quickness but could hold his own on the perimeter on-ball

He was mainly a PF who had to play SF for many years though, so he had to adjust on the defensive end

[SHAQisGOAT]

Yeah, if they were shooting 70%, sure. They weren't. The offensive efficiency wasn't any better. Just more possessions due to nobody playing any defense.

You're confusing me and even yourself now, just stop :facepalm

[NumberSix]

You're confusing me and even yourself now, just stop :facepalm
Really dude? :wtf:

It's not even remotely complicated. If you find this a difficult concept to grasp, I don't even know how to make it any simpler.

[NumberSix]

:rolleyes:

Or you can also go the other way around and say that they've played greater offense, that today nobody plays good offense nowadays
Soooooo......... Lemme get this straight......


You're saying because defensive rules are weaker these days, nobody plays good offence anymore? Offensive efficiency has LOWERED? :wtf:


So, what? If they brought back hand checking, LeBron would being shooting an even higher percentage and have more assists?

How in the world does that make any sense? :confusedshrug:

[SHAQisGOAT]

Soooooo......... Lemme get this straight......


You're saying because defensive rules are weaker these days, nobody plays good offence anymore? Offensive efficiency has LOWERED? :wtf:


So, what? If they brought back hand checking, LeBron would being shooting an even higher percentage and have more assists?

How in the world does that make any sense? :confusedshrug:

Me? I was just making assumptions off of basically nothing like you previously

[NumberSix]

Me? I was just making assumptions off of basically nothing like you previously
:facepalm

[Magic 32]

Any playoff run achieved in the post-98 eastern conference era must be diminished IMO.

The lack of depth has been unprecedented. Perimeter players like Lebron, AI, Kidd, Vince and T-mac have all benefited from the lack of quality teams.

[ILLsmak]

Yeah, if they were shooting 70%, sure. They weren't. The offensive efficiency wasn't any better. Just more possessions due to nobody playing any defense.


This IS confusing, though. If you are implying the reason they shot more is because nobody played D, one would think that they would get better shots (which would equal more efficiency.)

I think it's amazing that they scored so much back then. The NBA went through some dark ages where no one could hit 100 for awhile, too. I think we are going back toward high scoring. It's all about rule adjustments. They aren't giving as many FTs now, either.

I'd say that team D is better now, but in terms of being a superstar and/or 1 on 1 D... it's no contest. Stars get more ridiculous calls and you can't stop anyone 1v1. That's why you see people shooting so many wide open 3s.

-Smak

[j3lademaster]

This IS confusing, though. If you are implying the reason they shot more is because nobody played D, one would think that they would get better shots (which would equal more efficiency.)

I think it's amazing that they scored so much back then. The NBA went through some dark ages where no one could hit 100 for awhile, too. I think we are going back toward high scoring. It's all about rule adjustments. They aren't giving as many FTs now, either.

I'd say that team D is better now, but in terms of being a superstar and/or 1 on 1 D... it's no contest. Stars get more ridiculous calls and you can't stop anyone 1v1. That's why you see people shooting so many wide open 3s.

-SmakHow is it confusing? At any level of play good defenses force you to take longer to set up your offense. He's implying that since the efficiency of the 80's was equal to that of today's, it's easier to get quality looks back then due to the higher amount of possessions. I swear like 5 guys on this board actually play bball.

However, even though I think the D is slightly better now than the 80's, the difference in possessions stems mostly from better midrange shooting, ball movement, and team play. NBA now is spend 15 seconds of the clock trying to iso your superstar, making long range shooters that much more valuable to stretch the floor to iso easier.

[Whoah10115]

Bird actually averaged 10.1RPG that season, not 11. James was at 7.9.


They're pretty even statistically. Bird outrebounds by a significant margin and Bird averaged more assists, surprisingly enough. James averages more points on better FG% and gets to the line more, tho Bird is the better FT shooter. Bird didn't shoot the 3 much then and didn't have a great year. People disregard that the 3point line was not the weapon it is now.


As far as rebound numbers...the great Pacers fan does not take into consideration that Bird has a higher rebounding percentage.


Altogether, this is actually tough. Since we're talking about last year then we're talking about LeBron's best defensive performance. Bird actually made the All-Defensive Team, but James is definitely the better defender. Bird has had better years, tho maybe not better playoff runs...85 is the best statistical season (maybe 88 as well) and 86 is the absolute all-around of Larry Bird, along with maybe the best team ever and a remarkable run.


I will give the Edge to Larry, but this one is actually close.

[Champ]

Yeah, if they were shooting 70%, sure. They weren't. The offensive efficiency wasn't any better. Just more possessions due to nobody playing any defense.

You're leaving out the fact that offenses emphasized pushing the ball through mid-court in transition in the 80s to greater extent than teams do today.

That also accounted for the increased pace, and I would argue, made for better, more dynamic offense.

[Champ]

How is it confusing? At any level of play good defenses force you to take longer to set up your offense. He's implying that since the efficiency of the 80's was equal to that of today's, it's easier to get quality looks back then due to the higher amount of possessions. I swear like 5 guys on this board actually play bball.

However, even though I think the D is slightly better now than the 80's, the difference in possessions stems mostly from better midrange shooting, ball movement, and team play. NBA now is spend 15 seconds of the clock trying to iso your superstar, making long range shooters that much more valuable to stretch the floor to iso easier.

See my point on pushing the ball up the court.