04 Detroit Pistons vs 13 Miami Heat Which Team Wins the East?

[Foster5k]

2004 Detroit Pistons

One of the greatest defensive teams, in NBA history, the 04 Detroit Pistons. A team that took down the seemingly unbeatable duo Kobe plus Shaq in the 2004 NBA Finals, to win the NBA Championship. Coached by Larry Brown, this team showed the world that they could win it all without a super star. Truly, one of the greatest teams ever assembled in the NBA.

Versus

2013 Miami Heat

A team that seems destined to break the NBA consecutive wins streak. Many people consider this team to be one of the most stacked teams in NBA history. They have it all. The greatest player in the NBA. Lebron James. A super star guard in Dwayne Wade. An all-star foward in Chris Bosh. Lights out shooters like Ray Allen and Shane Battier, etc. A team that has already proved to the world they could go the distance by winning the NBA Championship in 2012.

The match up is set. It's the Eastern Conference Finals. The 2004 Detroit Pistons versus the 2013 Miami Heat. Only one team can survive. Who wins?

[SilkkTheShocker]

2013 Heat in 6. But I would love to have seen Wade/Hamilton go at it for a 7 game series.

[crisoner]

That be a great match up.

I'm leaning towards Heat though.

[Remix]

I'm leaning towards the Pistons..I think it would come down to 7 games but the chemistry they had was nuts. Plus it would be different with someone in the middle who can actually contest LeBron/Wade's drives.

[inclinerator]

wait until the heat season actually ends

[Remix]

LOL looking up some stuff from the 03-04 season and get this

Eastern Regular Season:
1. Indiana 61-21
2. Detroit 54-28
3. NJN 47-35
4. Miami 42-40
5. NOH 41-41
6. Milwaukee 41-41
7. NYK 39-43
8. Boston 36-46

Western:
1. Minnesota 58-24
2. SAS 57-25
3. LAL 56-26
4. Sacramento 55-27
5. Dallas 52-30
6. Memphis 50-32
7. Houston 45-37
8. Denver 43-39

(Utah 42-40, Portland 41-41, GS+SEA 37-45) <- All better records than Boston

[Haymaker]

Pistons would beat the Heat in 6. Too much D and a perfectly shared offense. Ball don't lie. :pimp:

[Suckafree]

Wow. .500 was good enough for a 5 seed back then.

[Breezy]

Which rules are you using? 2004 rules or 2013 rules?

Whichever team gets to use their own times rules.

[willds09]

pistons would hands down:facepalm

[Bandito]

The Pistons case closed. Not only did the have the perfect team with the perfect chemistry, they also had more heart than the Heat. That team beat the best team in the world (albeit Karl being injured, they kinda luck out) of the time in 5.

While it wouldn't go as easy as the Heat has crazy chemistry I have faith that team could beat this team of titans.

Also they almost beat a stacked Spurs the next year another team that 'has' a lot of heart.

[Pushxx]

Sheed and Big Ben would shit on Miami.

[imnew09]

Sheed and Ben Wallace in the paint, Lebron/Wade wont be able to put up all the flashy moves/dunks they're having this season.


I'll go with Pistons.

[Papaya Petee]

Heat in 5. Wade has always shred the Pistons in the playoffs, and Lebron would dominate Prince. Pistons win a game and keep it close cause of their bigs.

[willds09]

Heat in 5. Wade has always shred the Pistons in the playoffs, and Lebron would dominate Prince. Pistons win a game and keep it close cause of their bigs.
what happen in 05?:roll:

[Rake2204]

But I would love to have seen Wade/Hamilton go at it for a 7 game series.Wade and Hamilton did go at it in a seven game series (2005). And then they went at it in a six game series (2006). I don't have statistics off hand and I can't remember how to look at just one series worth of statistics on basketballreference so I don't remember how that matchup went in '05. However, in '06 I think Wade went crazy. I don't even really remember seeing it as a "Wade vs. Hamilton" type of thing. It was more just Rip doing Rip things and Wade becoming a superstar.

I think a case could be made for either team in this hypothetical. If that '04 club caught Miami playing like they're playing now, that'd be a problem for the Pistons because even with Ben and Sheed in the middle, that Detroit team still sometimes had problems handling the likes of Wade and LeBron back then.

Then again, Detroit had a lot of All-Stars everywhere. And I guess we're talking about '13 Wade who is still great, but maybe not as great as he was in '06. Detroit would theoretically have a sizable advantage up front and Chauncey Billups would likely have the upper hand at point. And it was nice having Mehmet Okur come off the bench with the two pitbulls Lindsey Hunter and Mike James (not to mention Corliss Williamson).

I think it'd be a heck of a battle one way or another.

[bdreason]

Guess I'm the only one who thinks that '04 Pistons team is one of the worst NBA Champs of the past 30+ years. Not that they weren't a good team, but the Eastern Conference was a joke at the time, and the Lakers handed them that series by self-imploding.

[HPye7]

i think detroit in 7

[PJR]

what happen in 05?:roll:

Wade's rib injury happend.

And I'll take the Heat. Bosh as a stretch 5, would often pull Ben Wallace out of the paint, thus clearing the path for dribble penetration and paint touches for James and Wade. Negating the most important competent of that Detroit core, which was their rim protection.

The Heat are far too diverse offensively for Detroit.

[Trentknicks]

Sheed and Big Ben would shit on Miami.
Healthy Sheed and Chandler effectively did earlier this year.

[rmt]

13 Heat. 04 Pistons were more suited to defend teams whose best players were dominant big men (Shaq, Duncan). Lebron would have his way with Prince and Rip vs Wade wouldn't work too well for the Pistons either. Rasheed kinda shied away from working in the post (not that he couldn't do it) and that's what's needed to beat the 13 Heat.

Shaq and Duncan championship teams would beat 13 Heat. Can't see Bosh/Birdman/Anthony containing a Prime Shaq or Duncan.

[Trentknicks]

Wade's rib injury happend.

And I'll take the Heat. Bosh as a stretch 5, would often pull Ben Wallace out of the paint, thus clearing the path for dribble penetration and paint touches for James and Wade. Negating the most important competent of that Detroit core, which was their rim protection.

The Heat are far too diverse offensively for Detroit.
Except Sheed's a stretch 4 with elite defense who would be guarding him in that instance :hammerhead:

Not to mention Sheed manning the middle would be sufficient against drives anyway.

[KOBE143]

2004 Piston

They're already proven champions.. They beat the Lakers in a very close finals series with prime Shaq, Young Mamba, Old Malone and Payton.. Do people here believes that the heat stand a chance against the 2004 Piston aka the best defensive team of all time? You're stupid if you think so.. Even the 2004 Lakers and Spurs would whoop their assess pretty easily.. The stupidity in this thread is beyond retarded.. :facepalm

[Papaya Petee]

2004 Piston

They're already proven champions.. They beat the Lakers in a very close finals series with prime Shaq, Young Mamba, Old Malone and Payton.. Do people here believes that the heat stand a chance against the 2004 Piston aka the best defensive team of all time? You're stupid if you think so.. Even the 2004 Lakers and Spurs would whoop their assess pretty easily.. The stupidity in this thread is beyond retarded.. :facepalm

Please stop, you're so delusional and stupid it's pathetic. Go outside. First off, they destroyed the 2004 Lakers, nothing CLOSE.

The Heat are easily better then the 2003-2004 Lakers. Wade has light up the Pistons for years in the playoffs, unlike Kobe who got shut down. Bosh is a stretch so it gives lanes for LeBron and Wade to murder them. Miami's shooters are lights out. Great offense beast great defense every time, and lets not act like Miami is bad at defense, as they are elite come playoff time.

Heat 4-1, maybe 4-2

[KOBE143]

Please stop, you're so delusional and stupid it's pathetic. Go outside. First off, they destroyed the 2004 Lakers, nothing CLOSE.

The Heat are easily better then the 2003-2004 Lakers. Wade has light up the Pistons for years in the playoffs, unlike Kobe who got shut down. Bosh is a stretch so it gives lanes for LeBron and Wade to murder them. Miami's shooters are lights out. Great offense beast great defense every time, and lets not act like Miami is bad at defense, as they are elite come playoff time.

Heat 4-1, maybe 4-2
:facepalm

You know Wade is not the same player as back then plus he didnt dominate the 2004 piston.. It was the 2006 Piston that he light up who were considered by most people as washed up team that time..

2004 Piston >>>>>>>>>>> 05, 06,07 Piston >>>> 13 Heat....

[Baller1986]

Miami in 7 post 2006 NBA rules.

[atljonesbro]

**** the heat

[Indian guy]

'04 Pistons are just about the weakest champion of the last 30+ years. They had an all-time D, but were woefully limited on offense and were lucky to even make the Finals after being stretched to the limit against NJ and Indiana. There's simply no way a team as well rounded and star-dominant as Miami is losing to them. Heck, weaker versions of the Heat('11 and '12) have beaten superior versions of the '04 Pistons in Boston and Chicago over the last few years.

Miami in 6 max.

[MMM]

'04 Pistons are just about the weakest champion of the last 30+ years. They had an all-time D, but were woefully limited on offense and were lucky to even make the Finals after being stretched to the limit against NJ and Indiana. There's simply no way a team as well rounded and star-dominant as Miami is losing to them. Heck, weaker versions of the Heat('11 and '12) have beaten superior versions of the '04 Pistons in Boston and Chicago over the last few years.

Miami in 6 max.
The Celtics(11-13) and Bulls are not superior versions of the Pistons. In particular I think the 04 Pistons are a superior 11-13 Celtics which has given the Heats some fits.

[LEFT4DEAD]

I dont know if this is a serious question.
First of all, Detroit's defense was suited to stop elite big mans since Duncan and Shaq were the main threats back than.
Second, Wade and Lebron are probably the best performers back in those days against these Pistons. Wade has been destroying them every year. Performances against Pistons in 05 and 06 are next to greatest of all time, and if not for that injury in 05, Wade would beat them with just past his prime Shaq two years in a row.

On the other hand Lebron destroyed them even more than Wade. Game 5, do I need to say more. And add to that one of the best mid range shooters in the game Bosh, so many great shooters from the 3 point line in Allen, Battier, Chalmers, Lewis, Miller etc etc + elite defense that they can play anytime.
Really, Heat would have destroyed 04 Pistons and its not even close. 5 games at most.

[chazzy]

On the other hand Lebron destroyed them even more than Wade. Game 5, do I need to say more.
Yes, you should mention that it was 3 years later and that Ben Wallace guy was playing for another team. That 07 series has little relevance in this comparison

[LEFT4DEAD]

Yes, you should mention that it was 3 years later and that Ben Wallace guy was playing for another team. That 07 series has little relevance in this comparison
Didnt he average about 27 on 50% in 06 season in semis against that team, and remember, he was the only guy to stop on that Cavs team. And that before Wade literally destroyed them in the East finals. Im big fan of that team, but there is no way they could stop Miami's trio + elite shooting. You are reaching here.

[chazzy]

Didnt he average about 27 on 50% in 06 season in semis against that team, and remember, he was the only guy to stop on that Cavs team. And that before Wade literally destroyed them in the East finals. Im big fan of that team, but there is no way they could stop Miami's trio + elite shooting. You are reaching here.
Reaching what? Just pointed something out about using that 07 series in this comparison

[Bigsmoke]

the Heat

[Rake2204]

Reaching what? Just pointed something out about using that 07 series in this comparisonYeah, there's something to be said for that. The '04 Pistons varied a lot more from their '05 and '06 teams (and '07) than we may realize. 2004 was just about the precipice of Detroit's run, and not just because they were champions. I'd say it was their hottest spot of primes, with every starter still in their 20's and Ben Wallace still near the tip top of his abilities (though maybe not quite as impressive as he was in '03).

Moreover, Detroit did add Antonio McDyess in subsequent years, but it was a recovering, older McDyess and I'm not sure any team beyond '04 was ever as deep as that championship squad. Mehmet Okur, Elden Campbell, Corliss Williamson, Mike James, and Lindsey Hunter all played valuable roles and all except Hunter (who was 35 by 2006) were lost after '04.

As such, instead of employing a trapping, smothering defense that went ten deep in '04, we were looking at guys like Maurice Evans, Tony Delk, and the Carlos' (Delfino and Arroyo) who just weren't of the same ilk. Larry Brown still employed an effective defensive strategy in '05 (before Flip Saunders took over in '06) but without the depth, there was at least a little bit of a let up.

On the other hand, I also believe Dwyane Wade is less deadly than he was in '05 and '06. I am not saying he's washed up or anything close. Rather, I just think he was on a complete other level at that point in his career and he's at least kind of come back down to Earth. Now, he's in his 30's and he'd be facing two prime, extremely well conditioned backcourtmen on the other side. And again, that doesn't mean he'd be at a disadvantage, but I do not see him dominating to the extent his did in '06 (and at times in '05).

[f0und]

'05 pistons were basically the same as the '04 pistons. same coach, same starting 5. the biggest difference is the '06 team which regressed a bit in defense but improved a bit in offense.

either way, wade has his way with the '05 and '06 team. though '13 wade isnt the same athlete as '05-'06 wade, i still dont think he'd have a problem. what made wade succeed against those pistons team while kobe failed was that wade played a much smarter game. and he's a smarter player today than he was 7 years ago.

[Rake2204]

'05 pistons were basically the same as the '04 pistons. same coach, same starting 5. the biggest difference is the '06 team which regressed a bit in defense but improved a bit in offense.

either way, wade has his way with the '05 and '06 team. though '13 wade isnt the same athlete as '05-'06 wade, i still dont think he'd have a problem. what made wade succeed against those pistons team while kobe failed was that wade played a much smarter game. and he's a smarter player today than he was 7 years ago.I believe Wade's ability to succeed in '05 and '06 went well beyond intelligence. The Detroit Pistons competed against a lot of players who played smart games. I do not believe '13 Wade would experience the same level of success against an '04 Pistons team as he may have in his mid 20's.

Further, I believe the lack of one of the most dominant inside forces of all-time (Shaquille O'Neal) also changes many aspects of how these teams would matchup. Dwyane Wade went big against Detroit in '06, but I think the Heat's victory largely had to do with the fact O'Neal was averaging 22ppg and 11rpg in that series on 65% shooting. Chris Bosh is outstanding, but certainly would not demand the same defensive commitment from Detroit's front line, perhaps allowing for a different set of defensive schemes focused more of limiting an attack largely stemming from the perimeter (James and Wade) as opposed to attempting to contain both inside and out.

Also, I feel it's worth noting that Wade averaged 25ppg on 44% shooting in the '05 series, and the Pistons prevailed. In '06, Ben Wallace's last year in Detroit and many of the Pistons two years older (and now over 30), LeBron James averaged 26ppg on 44% shooting and the Pistons once again won the series.

Clearly, having both of those players on the same team (along with Chris Bosh) creates a new set of issues. But it's not as if Wade and James cake walked through the Pistons in every single matchup during those mid-2000's series, particularly while the Pistons' window was still a little open.

[f0und]

I believe Wade's ability to succeed in '05 and '06 went well beyond intelligence. The Detroit Pistons competed against a lot of players who played smart games. I do not believe '13 Wade would experience the same level of success against an '04 Pistons team as he may have in his mid 20's.

Further, I believe the lack of one of the most dominant inside forces of all-time (Shaquille O'Neal) also changes many aspects of how these teams would matchup. Dwyane Wade went big against Detroit in '06, but I think the Heat's victory largely had to do with the fact O'Neal was averaging 22ppg and 11rpg in that series on 65% shooting. Chris Bosh is outstanding, but certainly would not demand the same defensive commitment from Detroit's front line, perhaps allowing for a different set of defensive schemes focused more of limiting an attack largely stemming from the perimeter (James and Wade) as opposed to attempting to contain both inside and out.

Also, I feel it's worth noting that Wade averaged 25ppg on 44% shooting in the '05 series, and the Pistons prevailed. In '06, Ben Wallace's last year in Detroit and many of the Pistons two years older (and now over 30), LeBron James averaged 26ppg on 44% shooting and the Pistons once again won the series.

Clearly, having both of those players on the same team (along with Chris Bosh) creates a new set of issues. But it's not as if Wade and James cake walked through the Pistons in every single matchup during those mid-2000's series, particularly while the Pistons' window was still a little open.

wade's numbers in '05 are kinda misleading. leading up to the ECF, wade was having an outstanding playoff run. even though he was only in his second year, he was putting up playoff numbers only matched by legends. after sweeping the first two rounds, the big question became how he would handle the same pistons squad that humiliated kobe and the lakers the year before. since the first two rounds were cake, this was to be the first real test.

in game 1, wade had a terrible game and everyone was ready to claim that whatever they did to kobe, they are going to do to wade. but in the second game, wade figured the defense out and scored 40. from then on, the pistons no longer looked like the feared vaunted defense. and wade had success against them as if they were just another team, doing whatever he wanted. that is until wade suffered the rib injury. his numbers went back down and the the heat lost in 7.

[Rake2204]

wade's numbers in '05 are kinda misleading. leading up to the ECF, wade was having an outstanding playoff run. even though he was only in his second year, he was putting up playoff numbers only matched by legends. after sweeping the first two rounds, the big question became how he would handle the same pistons squad that humiliated kobe and the lakers the year before. since the first two rounds were cake, this was to be the first real test.

in game 1, wade had a terrible game and everyone was ready to claim that whatever they did to kobe, they are going to do to wade. but in the second game, wade figured the defense out and scored 40. from then on, the pistons no longer looked like the feared vaunted defense. and wade had success against them as if they were just another team, doing whatever he wanted. that is until wade suffered the rib injury. his numbers went back down and the the heat lost in 7.Ah yes, I forgot about the rib injury. I still maintain Wade's ability and impact in '05 and '06 would dwarf what he'd be able to do against Detroit as a 30+ year old player in 2013. And again, I also feel Shaquille O'Neal's presence played a significant role in Wade's run. Wade was great enough on his own, let alone when the opposition had to only keep a partial eye on the perimeter so they could concentrate on trying to get around a behemoth like O'Neal.

Through and through, I still have a tough time deciding who'd win this series either way. We can talk about James and Wade, but I think it'd come down to what kind of series their support would have. Did LeBron James play a huge role in Miami's title last year? Definitely. But would they have won were it not for, say, Shane Battier stepping up and going bonkers? I'm not so sure. Similarly, when the Heat triumphed over Detroit in '06, it wasn't just about Wade and O'Neal, but James Posey stepping up, and Jason Williams going crazy in the clincher (hitting something like 10 shots in a row).

The '04 Pistons appeared well versed in neutralizing portions of an opponent's gameplan that they knew could be affected. They didn't put all their eggs in one basket and decide to try to do whatever possible to shut down Shaquille O'Neal. They kind of accepted their fate there. O'Neal was going to be O'Neal. Instead, Detroit seemed content in single covering O'Neal while looking to reduce or eliminate the potential threats posed by the unsung folks who'd won games for LA leading up to that point: Derek Fisher, Robert Horry, Kareem Rush, etc.

As such, in an '04/'13 matchup, I think LeBron James would have a chance of nearly leading the Heat to victory on his own on any given day (as he did in game 5 in '07). But just as often, I think it may come down to the supporting cast, not just James, Wade and Bosh. And if Larry Brown and company were able to limit the effectiveness of Allen, Miller, Chalmers, Battier and company, I think Detroit would clearly have an opportunity to win this series.

Either way, it'd be a battle of style and system. It'd be a running Heat team that's won 23 straight against a Pistons team who held five consecutive opponents to 69 points or less, finished the regular season 20-4, took down the previous year's NBA finalist (the Nets, who took San Antonio to six games in '03), defeated the #1 seeded Pacers, and then destroyed the Lakers dynasty in the Finals.

[Rysio]

lebrick lead teams are not capable of beating teams with great team work(see 2011 finals for best proof). lebron ball only works against old ass teams who should've retired 5 years ago or against young teams who just try to win on talent alone like okc tried last year.

pistons in 4.

[HiphopRelated]

Heat in 5 or 6

Wade loved playing the Pistons.

[Micku]

what happen in 05?:roll:

Wade got injured. If he didn't then they would have more of a chance to beat them. This Heat team is better than any team the Pistons ever faced in the playoffs. Tho the Pistons had a great rim protectector and their defense is one of the best if not the best, you have to take into account the rule changing.

But I got the Heat on this one.

[NumberSix]

Lol @ every Kobe tard picking Detroit.


Obvious is obvious.

[LikeABosh]

Stars win in the playoffs. Proven time and time again.

[DMAVS41]

Heat.

People prop up the 04 Pistons a little too much to compensate for the Lakers getting smoked.

[Foster5k]

After seeing how they lost to Chicago, I'm taking the 04 Pistons. Remember this thread was made before the Bulls ended Miami's streak. 04 Pistons would of smashed the Bulls.

Now, I'm not saying Miami will not will the championship. I'm just saying the 04 Pistons is the better over-all team, in my opinion.