Charles Barkley Turns 50

[Round Mound]

http://th04.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2012/333/c/1/sir_charles_barkley_34_by_31andonly-d5mfld8.jpg

http://doubledribble.wordpress.com/2013/02/22/charles-barkley-turns-50-best-power-forward-ever/

[B]Charles Barkley Turns 50

[AngelEyes]

I commend your persistence.

[Round Mound]

I commend your persistence.

Statistical Proof :confusedshrug:

[NumberSix]

Ring counting idiots who were 5 years old when Chuck was a Rocket are the only people who don't think he's the best.

[Round Mound]

Ring counting idiots who were 5 years old when Chuck was a Rocket are the only people who don't think he's the best.

[B]Exactly :applause: . I Wish Barkley Would Have Retired in 1996 So People Wouldn

[Deuce Bigalow]

http://images.wildammo.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/5301748815_a6b87be193_o.gif

[9erempiree]

Barkley is hard to judge as a PF. He put up great stats for the future generations to read.

Those that have seen him play can say he failed the eye-test. Watching him play it seems like he puts up empty stats. Was never a good leader and wasn't very clutch.

The man played for 3 freaking teams, unheard of for anyone that is considered the best.

This is why I don't value Shaq much, he played for 6 teams. That's almost journeyman status.

[AngelEyes]

Barkley is hard to judge as a PF. He put up great stats for the future generations to read.

Those that have seen him play can say he failed the eye-test. Watching him play it seems like he puts up empty stats. Was never a good leader and wasn't very clutch.

The man played for 3 freaking teams, unheard of for anyone that is considered the best.

This is why I don't value Shaq much, he played for 6 teams. That's almost journeyman status.

Are you on medication?

[dh144498]

even if you take away all of Tim Duncan's chips and MVPs, he is still better/greater than Barkley. Stay salty.

[9erempiree]

even if you take away all of Tim Duncan's chips and MVPs, he is still better/greater than Barkley. Stay salty.

I would have to agree. Barkley was a better scoring version of Charles Oakley. There games are pretty much similar and they were pretty much role players. Barkley was a great player but his attitude and leadership made him stand out less. He was more of a great role player.

Can't lead a team worth damn.

You have to play like a leader to be considered the best in the game.

[brandonislegend]

People that have to use statistical proof are in denial, watch the games it's like saying statically Westbrook is the best PG in the game when in reality cp3 and tony parker are on another level. Or like saying Dwight Howard is a better center than Marc gasol this year because he has better stats

[NumberSix]

even if you take away all of Tim Duncan's chips and MVPs, he is still better/greater than Barkley. Stay salty.
Might as well have Shaq at #1 if we're counting centers.

[dh144498]

Might as well have Shaq at #1 if we're counting centers.

he's a pf. No one has ever said Shaq was a pf. tim Duncan was always talked about as a PF.

[NumberSix]

People that have to use statistical proof are in denial, watch the games it's like saying statically Westbrook is the best PG in the game when in reality cp3 and tony parker are on another level. Or like saying Dwight Howard is a better center than Marc gasol this year because he has better stats
Westbrook and Dwight actually don't have better stats.

[dh144498]

Westbrook and Dwight actually don't have better stats.

Dwight has better stats, Westbrook and CP3 are a wash.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Defence? Haven't watched enough of him but I don't think he was anywhere near the level of KG/Duncan?

[NumberSix]

Dwight has better stats, Westbrook and CP3 are a wash.
Maybe if you only pay attention to scoring and rebounds. All defensive metrics this season have Marc Gasol as the best defensive center in the league.

[9erempiree]

Defence? Haven't watched enough of him but I don't think he was anywhere near the level of KG/Duncan?

Decent help defender he was but he lacked the quickness to actually have to cover quicker guys and he was short for a player his height and couldn't guard the true PF.

That's why I said Barkley is like an anomaly. Very hard to judge him but by no means is he even considered a GOAT PF.

[9erempiree]

When I think of Barkley, I mostly think about the disappointments in his career. Never did anything memorable besides his MVP season but there were more heartaches. He is a choker.

Bullets comeback in 86 playoff while Barkley was choking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7p1E7X929k

Sprewell getting nasty on Barkley. I brought this up because it basically sums up his interior defense.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GvuEzhfLX4

Hardaway on Barkley...lack of movement on defense

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF-fmqWPTpE


Let's not forget the Piston's sweep. He revived his career in Phoenix due to his 3pt shooting in which he developed.

[Round Mound]

[B]9erempiree You Have To Be On Medication or Stupid To Say The Things You Are Saying. I

[tpols]

:applause: a lot of cool info. Seems like Barkley lack of humbleness did him in.

[9erempiree]

:applause: a lot of cool info. Seems like Barkley lack of humbleness did him in.

Work ethic and his mentality did him in. His attitude on the court changed the game. There would be times when he got a technical or flagrant in crucial times of games that would determine the outcome.

As good as he was, he was nowhere near the best.

He played for 3 teams that were championship level teams and he couldn't win in all 3 occasions. These were different teams too. He had his chance.

[brandonislegend]

Maybe if you only pay attention to scoring and rebounds. All defensive metrics this season have Marc Gasol as the best defensive center in the league.

Marc Gasol blks 1.7 stls 0.9

Dwight Howard blks 2.4 stls 1.1

He has better stats unless you are going into advanced stats.

[Round Mound]

I think of Barkley, I mostly think about the disappointments in his career. Never did anything memorable besides his MVP season but there were more heartaches. He is a choker.

You Are About To Get In My Ignore List :facepalm :rolleyes:

Bullets comeback in 86 playoff while Barkley was choking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7p1E7X929k

[B]That Was Barkley 1st Year as Total Starter and The Sixers Had Lost Moses For The Play-Offs and Andrew Toney Suffered a Career Endking Injury, He Never Played the Same Again. Dr J Was 35 Years Old and Had Lost All Steps as a Player. Also, This Was The 80s and It Was an Era of Great Teams Unlike the 90s, 00s and 10s.

[U]Barkley

[9erempiree]

Barkley is going to be remembered for his commentating if he keeps this up. I am watching the NCAA tourney and him and Kenny are very good on national television.

I'm glad they left the TNT antics over at TNT. CBS will help them be more serious.

[9erempiree]

[QUOTE=Round Mound]I think of Barkley, I mostly think about the disappointments in his career. Never did anything memorable besides his MVP season but there were more heartaches. He is a choker.

You Are About To Get In My Ignore List :facepalm :rolleyes:

Bullets comeback in 86 playoff while Barkley was choking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7p1E7X929k

[B]That Was Barkley 1st Year as Total Starter and The Sixers Had Lost Moses For The Play-Offs and Andrew Toney Suffered a Career Endking Injury, He Never Played the Same Again. Dr J Was 35 Years Old and Had Lost All Steps as a Player. Also, This Was The 80s and It Was an Era of Great Teams Unlike the 90s, 00s and 10s.

[U]Barkley

[AngelEyes]

[QUOTE=Round Mound]I think of Barkley, I mostly think about the disappointments in his career. Never did anything memorable besides his MVP season but there were more heartaches. He is a choker.

You Are About To Get In My Ignore List :facepalm :rolleyes:

Bullets comeback in 86 playoff while Barkley was choking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7p1E7X929k

[B]That Was Barkley 1st Year as Total Starter and The Sixers Had Lost Moses For The Play-Offs and Andrew Toney Suffered a Career Endking Injury, He Never Played the Same Again. Dr J Was 35 Years Old and Had Lost All Steps as a Player. Also, This Was The 80s and It Was an Era of Great Teams Unlike the 90s, 00s and 10s.

[U]Barkley

[TheBigVeto]

Barkley is hard to judge as a PF. He put up great stats for the future generations to read.

Those that have seen him play can say he failed the eye-test. Watching him play it seems like he puts up empty stats. Was never a good leader and wasn't very clutch.

The man played for 3 freaking teams, unheard of for anyone that is considered the best.

This is why I don't value Shaq much, he played for 6 teams. That's almost journeyman status.

http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg


http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh600/Rodman2124/kobeclutch.gif


U Mad Kobetards?
Kobetards are phaggits
Kobe isn't a great player, FACT

[bukowski81]

I love Barkley, and although i don think he is the best power forward ever, he does have a case.

[Round Mound]

It's very unfortunate that you have to ignore me because you don't agree with my opinion. I wish life was that easy where you can put people on an ignore list because you don't agree with them.

Like I mentioned earlier, Barkley puts up empty stats and no matter what stats you have mentioned, those were series' that he lost.

You can bring up his series' average but it just proves my point of how his production never led to the success of his team.

Empty Stats? The Sixers Beat the Bullets in 1986 Dummy! They Lost to the Bucks the Next Series! and in that 1994 Series they Swept the Warriors While Barkley Averaged 37 PPG and Empty Stats Yea! :roll:

YOU ARE A TROLL AND NEVER WATCHED BARKLEY PLAY IN HIS PRIME! EVER!

WATCH THIS AND LEARN ABOUT SIR CHARLES YOU ROOKIE!: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTMFTQFvO_8

[9erempiree]

I love Barkley, and although i don think he is the best power forward ever, he does have a case.

Case? Maybe.

The OP insisted he is the best when being the best at that position didn't produce anything for the team.

It seems that Oakley could have played the same role as Barkley.

[DatAsh]

I'd say Barkley was the best offensive power forward to play, and one of the best offensive players ever, but defense is what forces me to put Duncan on top.

[bukowski81]

Case? Maybe.

The OP insisted he is the best when being the best at that position didn't produce anything for the team.

It seems that Oakley could have played the same role as Barkley.

Barkley is a much much better player than Oakley

[Round Mound]

I'd say Barkley was the best offensive power forward to play, and one of the best offensive players ever, but defense is what forces me to put Duncan on top.

[B]That Sounds More Like a Fan With Some Brains :applause:. True Barkley Wasn

[9erempiree]

[QUOTE=Round Mound][B]That Sounds More Like a Fan With Some Brains :applause:. True Barkley Wasn

[Bernie Nips]

I can't believe it took me to the third page to realise I was reading two of the worst people in the world arguing with each other.

I hate myself.

[Round Mound]

Better passer than Duncan? Yes.

Better rebounder? No way. Duncan is a much better rebounder than Charles.

:oldlol:

[B]What

[Legends66NBA7]

That's cool and all, but Tim Duncan is still the GOAT PF.


People that have to use statistical proof are in denial, watch the games it's like saying statically Westbrook is the best PG in the game when in reality cp3 and tony parker are on another level.

Yeah, the bold is just stupid too. Infact, I don't even think Westbrook's stats are better than Paul's.


I can't believe it took me to the third page to realise I was reading two of the worst people in the world arguing with each other.

I hate myself.

:oldlol:

[Round Mound]

Barkley was a Better Scorer, Post Player, Shooter, Rebounder, Passer and Floor Defender.

Duncan Was a Better Rim Protector, Post Defender and Shot Blocker

[kNicKz]

Barkley is hard to judge as a PF. He put up great stats for the future generations to read.

Those that have seen him play can say he failed the eye-test. Watching him play it seems like he puts up empty stats. Was never a good leader and wasn't very clutch.

The man played for 3 freaking teams, unheard of for anyone that is considered the best.

This is why I don't value Shaq much, he played for 6 teams. That's almost journeyman status.

So you credit Bark
ley for playing for multiple teams and discredit shaq for playing for multiple teams in the same post. Troll fail

[RobertdeMeijer]

More advanced stats:

According to Statistical Plus/Minus, Barkley would have the best prime of a PF, ahead of Duncan, Malone, Garnett and Dirk

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=1654


I still believe his playstyle was too self-centred. I honestly think he did not make the Dream Team better, even though he scored the most points.

[ThunderStruk022]

Decent help defender he was but he lacked the quickness to actually have to cover quicker guys and he was short for a player his height and couldn't guard the true PF.

That's why I said Barkley is like an anomaly. Very hard to judge him but by no means is he even considered a GOAT PF.
What in the f*** does this mean?

[Round Mound]

More advanced stats:

According to Statistical Plus/Minus, Barkley would have the best prime of a PF, ahead of Duncan, Malone, Garnett and Dirk

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=1654


I still believe his playstyle was too self-centred. I honestly think he did not make the Dream Team better, even though he scored the most points.

He Lead the Team in Scoring With Few Attempts Per Game and a 70% FG and in Dream Team 2 He Lead them Again in Points, FG% (81% FG) and Rebounding.

How Can a Player that Shoots Just 14-16 FGAs PG Be Self Centered?

Kobe, Jordan, Wilkins, Iverson etc Where More Self Centered by a Large Margin! They Shot Like 20-25 FGAs PG!

He is Just the Best PF of his Time. His Rebounding and Play-Making Off the Post and Away From It, Was Asoume Too.

[bootsy]

One of the most overrated players ever.

[Round Mound]

One of the most overrated players ever.

All Advanced Stats Have Barkley in The Top 7 All Time Among Great Players, Yet 20 Year Old Kids Locate Him as a Top 20 Player. Infact, Its the Other Way Around, THEE MOST UNDERRATED GREAT OF ALL TIME

[Young X]

KG is statistically better than Barkley, Duncan, or Malone. :pimp:

[Rubio2Gasol]

Used to give Jordan a decent workout.

[Round Mound]

KG is statistically better than Barkley, Duncan, or Malone. :pimp:

Advanced Stats :no:

[nycjeff45]

man, i always remember that game when he had that big ass knob on his eye shooting that free throw dude is a fcking beast ...

[Young X]

Advanced Stats :no:
24/14/5/2.2 blks/1.5 stls on 50% > Duncan, Barkley, Malone statline.

[Round Mound]

24/14/5/2.2 blks/1.5 stls on 50% > Duncan, Barkley, Malone statline.

Advanced Stats Do Not = Raw Stats.

Play-Off Numbers and FG% Please...

[Big#50]

LOL @ him being a better passer than Duncan.
Barkley was one of a kind. One of toughest covers in basketball. Him not trying on defense at times really bothers me. Basketball greats play both sides of the ball.
Hakeem
MJ
Duncan
Are probably alone in this category though.

[Round Mound]

[B]Barkley

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Great thread. I agree. :applause:
Chuck was the best power forward of all time, maybe not the greatest, but the best.

[Round Mound]

Great thread. I agree. :applause:
Chuck was the best power forward of all time, maybe not the greatest, but the best.

If You Do a Skill for Skill Contest Between All PFs...Barkley is Easily The Greatest Powerforward Ever

[RoundMoundOfReb]

If You Do a Skill for Skill Contest Between All PFs...Barkley is Easily The Greatest Powerforward Ever
Yeah I mean if people want to rank based on accolades/titles he's not #1 but in terms of actual skill i'd say he is.

[Round Mound]

Yeah I mean if people want to rank based on accolades/titles he's not #1 but in terms of actual skill i'd say he is.

http://smallbiztrends.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/true-false2.jpg

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

In his prime, I don't think there was EVER a PF that could scorer like Charles. Checkout his numbers in the 1987-88 season; dude actually had a year very much like Durant's: 28ppg on 66% TS (not big on TS%, but a lot of people here LOVE this metric :oldlol:)

For about four more seasons, he averaged ~28ppg on 64% TS AND in his MVP season w/ Phoenix, he added ~26ppg at 60% TS. :applause:

[Round Mound]

In his prime, I don't think there was EVER a PF that could scorer like Charles. Checkout his numbers in the 1987-88 season; dude actually had a year very much like Durant's: 28ppg on 66% TS (not big on TS%, but a lot of people here LOVE this metric :oldlol:)

For about four more seasons, he averaged ~28ppg on 64% TS AND in his MVP season w/ Phoenix, he added ~26ppg at 60% TS. :applause:

:applause: [B]More Impressive To Me Is How a 6

[Anaximandro1]

Stats need to be put in context to understand them.

1) The Spurs averaged 90-95 ppg during Duncan's prime,instead of 110 ppg.

2) Duncan was willing to share the ball during the RS and ready to take over the playoffs (usually after the first round).



Duncan is statistically better than Barkley ... or Bird.


2002-03 Regular Season - Spurs averaged 95.8 pt

MVP Duncan 23.3 pt,12.9 rb,3.9 as,2.9 blk on 51.3% FG


2003 Playoffs (Final 15 games) - Spurs averaged 95.7 pt (won NBA Title)

Duncan 27.5 pt,16.1 rb,5.4 as,3.5 blk on 54.3% FG (Final 15 games)


1992-93 Regular Season - Suns averaged 113.4 pt

MVP Barkley 25.6 pt,12.2 rb,5.1 as,1.0 blk on 52.0% FG


1993 Playoffs (Final 15 games) - Suns averaged 107.0 pt (lost NBA Finals)

Barkley 27.1 pt,13.9 rb,4.5 as,0.9 blk on 49.5 % FG (Final 15 games)


1985-86 Regular Season - Celtics averaged 114.1 pt

MVP Bird 25.8 pt,9.8 rb,6.8 as,0.6 blk on 49.6 % FG


1986 Playoffs (Final 15 games) - Celtics averaged 112.0 pt (won NBA Title)

Bird 25.4 pt,9.6 rb,8.3 as,0.5 blk on 51.4 % FG (Final 15 games)


More...


1998-99 Regular Season - Spurs averaged 92.8 pt

Duncan 21.7 pt,11.4 rb,2.4 as,2.5 blk on 49.5% FG


1999 Playoffs (Final 13 games) - Spurs averaged 88.4 pt (won NBA title)

Duncan 24.6 pt,11.7 rb,2.7as,2.5 blk on 52.5% FG (Final 13 games)


1980-81 Regular Season - Celtics averaged 109.9 pt

Bird 21.2 pt,10.9 rb,5.5 as,0.8 blk on 47.8 % FG


1981 Playoffs (Final 13 games) - Celtics averaged 100.6 pt (won NBA Title)

Bird 21.5 pt (Final 13 games)


Bird Playoffs 21.9, 14.0 rb,6.1 as,1.0 blk on 47.0 % FG -> Celtics averaged 103.4


Gregg Popovich after winning game 5 of the 1999 NBA Finals
(http://www.nba.com/encyclopedia/finals/1999_duncan_sprewell.html)[QUOTE]Duncan has more than talent. He also has the intangible qualities of leadership, exuding a quiet confidence that makes his teammates believe in him.

[Round Mound]

Stats need to be put in context to understand them.

1) The Spurs averaged 90-95 ppg during Duncan's prime,instead of 110 ppg.

2) Duncan was willing to share the ball during the RS and ready to take over the playoffs (usually after the first round).



Duncan is statistically better than Barkley ... or Bird.








More...






Gregg Popovich after winning game 5 of the 1999 NBA Finals
(http://www.nba.com/encyclopedia/finals/1999_duncan_sprewell.html)

An Old 33-36 Year Old Barkley With No Mobility, No Leaping Ability, Back Injured and Knee Injured Did Outplay 97-00 Duncan in 8 Matches Played Where Hakeem Missed 4 of Those Games. Duncan Was Better Those Years Than Today and a Passed Prime Barkley Totally Outplayed Duncan While Playing Lesser Minutes.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=barklch01&p2=duncati01

Barkley: 34.5 MPG/17.0 PPG/47.2% FG/11.8 RPG/2.4 APG/1.9 SPG/0.5 BPG/2.0 TOVs PG/3.0 PFsPG/

Duncan: 38.5 MPG/16.0 PPG/46.4% FG/10.0 RPG/4.0 APG/0.3 SPG/1.6 BPG/2.3 TOVsPG/3.6 PFs PG/

What Could a 22-30 Year Old Barkley Done Against Duncan?

Leave It To You Imagination