2013 Draft Combine Discussion + general prospect talk

[Grinder]

It's always fun to see who the best athletes in the draft are and who ends up with the best "measurements".

- Rudy Gobert is the tallest player (in shoes) at 7'2" and also has the longest wingspan at 7'8.5"

- Shane Larkin has the highest max vert with an astonishing 44" and also is the fastest and one of the most agile players at the combine. He's under 6" tall but those are Nate Robinson-like numbers. Nate had a 43.5" max vert in the combine.

- Victor Oladipo had a max vert of 42" and is 6'4" with a 6'9" wingspan

- Michael Carter-Williams is 6'6" and has a 41" vertical which is incredible for a big point guard

- Cody Zeller measured just over 7" in shoes but has a 6'11" wingspan. He's testing out awesome athletically so far. His 35.5" standing vert is the highest of any player over 6'9" in the past decade in the combine. He also had a 37.5" max vert and was the fastest and most agile of the centers.

- Shabazz Mohammed measured 6'6" in shoes with a 6'11" wingspan and has a 37" max vert.

Chad Ford is tweeting out a lot of these numbers and it's also televised on ESPNU.

[Shade8780]

Was surprised with MCW's vertical when I saw it on Twitter.

[NYK-Bball]

Was surprised with MCW's vertical when I saw it on Twitter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7k5xT4ADEk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1hotF3-qzM

[qrich]

How's Norvel Pelle doing?

[steve]

CJ Leslie's killer lane agility time surprised me a good bit. That might actually convince people he can guard 3s in the NBA and raise his stock a fair amount.

[KyrieTheFuture]

You're forgetting Gobert has a 9' 7" standing reach which the most insane thing I've ever heard

[steve]

You're forgetting Gobert has a 9' 7" standing reach which the most insane thing I've ever heard

Ford tweeted that Gobert's vertical numbers were disappointing, but honestly, I'd be more interested in his spring and lane agility times because is leaping ever really going to be an issue with him?

[Rekindled]

HOW the fck does cody zeller at 7'0 have the highest standing verticle, and he is white to boot.

[waseem780]

anyone know Hamed Haddadi's wingspan and standing reach? Its probably near Rudy Gobert's.

[RedBlackAttack]

- Victor Oladipo had a max vert of 42" and is 6'4" with a 6'9" wingspan

I heard Ben McLemore also had a 42" vert. Those guys were the two highest. Pretty impressive for McLemore, imo... He seems to have the total package for a 2 guard, from a size/athleticism standpoint.

[tikay0]

I hope the Bulls pick either Ledo/Whitey/Rice.

[outbreak]

I know shabazz lied about his age once, but he looks about 35!:lol

[Shade8780]

Remember at the start of the season people were comparing Shabazz to James Harden and some people, Kobe? They were so wrong, looking back now :lol I still think he'll turn out pretty good, but more like a prime Michael Redd at best.

[qrich]

Bazz's stock has fallen so low that he might end up being considered a steal :oldlol:

[RedBlackAttack]

Bazz's stock has fallen so low that he might end up being considered a steal :oldlol:
He's on the verge of falling out of the lottery, me thinks.

[Johnny Jones]

Shane Larkin's 44-inch max vertical is the highest at the NBA Draft Combine in 12 years

[qrich]

He's on the verge of falling out of the lottery, me thinks.

If he does, I'd love it if the Clips would try to trade Bledsoe to the Bucks for #15 and Udoh?

He would be a great fit next to Paul.



No one has updates on Norvel Pelle? :banghead:

[IGotACoolStory]

I think Bazz is a legit starter in this league (3rd option on a playoff team) so it will be interesting to see how far he falls. Bottom end of the lottery + and, imo, someone is getting very good value. ...With the thought process that his supposed attitude problems aren't career endangering.

I wouldn't trust Zeller's athletic measurables. He's played enough basketball to the point where we know when he uses them and when he doesn't.

Gobert's measurements are insane. Is he Alexis Ajinca or...?

Otto Porter measures nice for a SF.

Noel weighs 206? :oldlol:

[dbk123]

If the team who gets the first pick drafts Noel over mclemore I will ****ing lmao.

[RedBlackAttack]

If the team who gets the first pick drafts Noel over mclemore I will ****ing lmao.
Noel didn't exactly have a bad day. A smidge under 7-feet with a 7-4 wingspan and 9-2 standing reach?

Yes please.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Size always goes over wing players unless they're franchise players and its been beaten into people's heads that there aren't any. I'm sure someone will surprise us. Personally I want Otto Porter because he's not undersized. Rudy Gobert is the most intriguing prospect to me (last year it was Drummond) I'm curious to see if he can play without getting thrown around.

[veilside23]

so mclemore's vert is 42" ... good enough for slam dunk contest ;)

[Grinder]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKf46OeCQAAL5bS.jpg

[RedBlackAttack]

Impressive numbers from Zeller.

[outbreak]

Everything I've read says Shabazz impressed today and his stock has risen. Yeah he isn't what people thought last year but he's going high anyway. Steven Adams impressed alot was hitting mid range jumpers consistently. Oladipo and mclemore both look very solid too. Dipo was hitting 3s

[Lebron23]

http://www.nbadraft.net/2013-nba-draft-combine-measurements

[hangintheair]

Just Curious I did see Tim Hardaway Jr in every category, in what round was he projected?

I'm sensing a steal if someone draft him ALA Isaiah Thomas

[D-Rose]

Heard lots about Oladipo and teams loving him...him and McLemore would be a cool rivalry. Would be awesome if they and Beal and Waiters from last year develop into SG stars.

The measurements for the French 7 footer are UNREAL. holy crap.

[hangintheair]

Heard lots about Oladipo and teams loving him...him and McLemore would be a cool rivalry. Would be awesome if they and Beal and Waiters from last year develop into SG stars.

The measurements for the French 7 footer are UNREAL. holy crap.

He really is long
http://content.draftexpress.com/gallery/RudyGobert/1339445228.jpg

[chips93]

I wouldn't trust Zeller's athletic measurables. He's played enough basketball to the point where we know when he uses them and when he doesn't.

this, except it applies to most prospects

id put very little stock. in the athletic measurements. iirc chris kaman had a better sprint time than chris paul.

[DuMa]

I really like tony snell

[RedBlackAttack]

I knew Otto Porter was long, but damn...

6-8.5 w/shoes. 7-1.5 wingspan. 8-9.5 reach.

Those are some crazy numbers for a SF.

[D-Rose]

Yahoo Sports has an article up that says Noel is looking to return by Christmas! Put his debut on the schedule :D

[D-Rose]

Team in the lottery that intrigues me the most going forward is Cleveland. Like holy shit, they look like the Thunder circa 2009 with all the genius picks in the lottery being stacked up.

[RedBlackAttack]

Team in the lottery that intrigues me the most going forward is Cleveland. Like holy shit, they look like the Thunder circa 2009 with all the genius picks in the lottery being stacked up.
General consensus seems to be, unless they land the No. 1 pick, Cavs are going to take Otto Porter.

Then again, consensus never mattered to Chris Grant before. This time last year, Dion Waiters wasn't on anyone's radar that high.

Still, I love those measurements today by Porter to go along with his motor and skillset. He has the potential to be an elite, versatile defender.

The No. 19 pick that we got from the Lakers should be interesting too.

[D-Rose]

General consensus seems to be, unless they land the No. 1 pick, Cavs are going to take Otto Porter.

Then again, consensus never mattered to Chris Grant before. This time last year, Dion Waiters wasn't on anyone's radar that high.

Still, I love those measurements today by Porter to go along with his motor and skillset. He has the potential to be an elite, versatile defender.

The No. 19 pick that we got from the Lakers should be interesting too.
Porter definitely seems like a good fit in Cleveland.

Are you buying the whole draft Noel and tank another year talk? I think it's BS...I'm thinking Cavs will be looking to make the 8 seed, finally try and put a healthy year together and develop the talent that's there.

You think they need to make any sort of a deal or FA signing to bring in experienced star players?

[RedBlackAttack]

Porter definitely seems like a good fit in Cleveland.

Are you buying the whole draft Noel and tank another year talk? I think it's BS...I'm thinking Cavs will be looking to make the 8 seed, finally try and put a healthy year together and develop the talent that's there.

You think they need to make any sort of a deal or FA signing to bring in experienced star players?
I do believe (and hope) that Noel is a serious consideration depending on where we fall in the lottery. I don't buy the "tank another season" talk, though. They will make a run at the playoffs next year, one way or the other.

There is lots of talent already beginning to mature on that roster and Mike Brown will bring the kind of defensive principles with him that have been missing the last two years.

I'm not even sure the team has to make any FA splashes to compete for the playoffs.

You will have Varejao coming back next year. Kyrie and Tristan in year three. Waiters and Zeller in year two.

Plus, whoever we bring in this year. If it's Noel.... Yeah, he won't be contributing anything for at least the first half of the year, but we still have another top 20 pick in a draft that looks pretty deep to me.

The Cavs' starting lineup last year had an average age of under 22 for the majority of the season. There will be a pretty big jump next year, I think, assuming guys can stay healthy (a big "if" with Kyrie and Varejao being key players).

[KyrieTheFuture]

I'm not to sure the Cavs take Noel with #1 even if they get. Might trade back because we can't afford to take Noel IMO if we want Thompson as our long term 4. Porter is my preferred pick and I have no idea who I want at 19...Dieng? Steven Adams? I'd like to trade varejao so a new 5 would be cool.

Edit: With Noel we could be an elite defensive squad almost immediately under Mike Brown but...that's not a whole lot of scoring potential.

[RedBlackAttack]

I'm not to sure the Cavs take Noel with #1 even if they get. Might trade back because we can't afford to take Noel IMO if we want Thompson as our long term 4. Porter is my preferred pick and I have no idea who I want at 19...Dieng? Steven Adams? I'd like to trade varejao so a new 5 would be cool.
Varejao should absolutely not be traded unless the deal is right. His contract is just too good to give up "just because," imo.

There was a time when I didn't think a defensive center would be a good match with Tristan in the frontcourt, but with TT's massive strides last year on the offensive end, it is no longer something I fear. Tristan is going to end up being a good offensive player, I think, and it all depends on what Grant & Co. think of Noel.

Something tells me Mike Brown would love to have a rim protector, though, and god knows we need one in the worst way. If we land the No. 1 pick, I think it would be incredibly stupid to take a lesser player or move out of the spot due to "fit."

I mean, I can see not taking a PG, SG or PF, because those spots are pretty well locked up for the future. However, we actually need an elite center prospect. I think Zeller will end up being a nice option off of the bench. If they feel Noel is an elite prospect, you take him and don't think twice, imo.

[CarlosBoozer]

hi buffbill

[KyrieTheFuture]

Varejao should absolutely not be traded unless the deal is right. His contract is just too good to give up "just because," imo.

There was a time when I didn't think a defensive center would be a good match with Tristan in the frontcourt, but with TT's massive strides last year on the offensive end, it is no longer something I fear. Tristan is going to end up being a good offensive player, I think, and it all depends on what Grant & Co. think of Noel.

Something tells me Mike Brown would love to have a rim protector, though, and god knows we need one in the worst way. If we land the No. 1 pick, I think it would be incredibly stupid to take a lesser player or move out of the spot due to "fit."

I mean, I can see not taking a PG, SG or PF, because those spots are pretty well locked up for the future. However, we actually need an elite center prospect. I think Zeller will end up being a nice option off of the bench. If they feel Noel is an elite prospect, you take him and don't think twice, imo.

I can buy that. I'm pretty happy with wherever we land I think we can get a solid prospect. I don't want to trade Varejao just to trade him but I'm assuming we could get a nice package for him no :confusedshrug:

[BuffaloBill]

hi buffbill



creep

[RedBlackAttack]

I can buy that. I'm pretty happy with wherever we land I think we can get a solid prospect. I don't want to trade Varejao just to trade him but I'm assuming we could get a nice package for him no :confusedshrug:
One would think, but I also believe if something really great was offered, he would already be gone. With his getting injured the last two seasons, I'm not sure his trade stock is high enough to make offers incredibly appealing.

[CarlosBoozer]

creep
:(

[Burgz V2]

I think Carter-Williams just shot up the draft board.

[HarryCallahan]

I really like tony snell

Mmmhmm. He's not very high on most boards, but I consider him a really nice prospect.

[Xiao Yao You]

If he does, I'd love it if the Clips would try to trade Bledsoe to the Bucks for #15 and Udoh?

He would be a great fit next to Paul.

Doubt they trade him before Paul signs unless it's something they think will be worth losing Bledsoe for even if Paul leaves. Jazz at 14 might be a more likely trade partner though if they do. They were talking Bledsoe at the trade deadline and they need him more. Bucks still might bring back Jennings and Ellis.


Gobert's measurements are insane. Is he Alexis Ajinca or...?

Petro?

[Johnny Jones]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LxIJOtfVgg&noredirect=1


^ Zeke Marshall workout. Looks like a poor man's Tim Duncan.


Could be a solid 2nd round pick for somebody.

[Grinder]

this, except it applies to most prospects

id put very little stock. in the athletic measurements. iirc chris kaman had a better sprint time than chris paul.

You might not put much stock into it but nearly every single year there's a guy that ends up going in the first round because of a great combine showing when he had no business being drafted (Mason Plumlee, Joe Alexander).


I think Bazz is a legit starter in this league (3rd option on a playoff team) so it will be interesting to see how far he falls. Bottom end of the lottery + and, imo, someone is getting very good value. ...With the thought process that his supposed attitude problems aren't career endangering.

I wouldn't trust Zeller's athletic measurables. He's played enough basketball to the point where we know when he uses them and when he doesn't.

Gobert's measurements are insane. Is he Alexis Ajinca or...?

Otto Porter measures nice for a SF.

Noel weighs 206? :oldlol:

I think it's no surprise that Zeller is fairly athletic from watching him play. He has a very good second jump which is why he had some explosive put backs at IU. He also scored a lot of points just by running the floor hard and beating everyone down the court. The reason he struggles against length isn't because he lacks athleticism but because of his lack of length.


From what I've seen of Gobert, he's nothing like Ajin

[chips93]

There was a time when I didn't think a defensive center would be a good match with Tristan in the frontcourt, but with TT's massive strides last year on the offensive end, it is no longer something I fear. Tristan is going to end up being a good offensive player, I think, and it all depends on what Grant & Co. think of Noel.

do you actually think tristan will ever become a shooter? i hear cavs people talk about him getting a mid range jumpshot, but we heard that he worked on it all summer long, and when it came to the regular season, id say he took 10 jumpers all year, maybe.

i cant remember a guy who had absolutely no jumper, becoming a decent shooter. serge ibaka shot 75% from the line, the year before he showed that he had a mid-range jumper.

and if neither of you bigs can shoot a lick, you're gonna have trouble on offense. i hope im wrong, because the defensive potential of tristan-nerlens, is scary.

[Burgz V2]

It'd shock me to see Shabazz fall out of the top 10. Despite all the flak he's getting, he's one of the few guys in the draft that can come in right away and score a lot of points at the NBA level.

Plus he's one of the few in that range that are actually doing the drills. I think that will go a long way with GMs, risky move but he wants to show he can play.

He didn't shoot it very well but from what I saw he was really competing with other players especially defensively in the 1 on 1 drills.

[el gringos]

1- Noel - 6/11 pf. Could go at any pick in the top 3-4
2- mcLemore 6-5 sg
3- olynyk 7-0 pf/c
4- Bennett 6-7 pf
5- mcCollum 6-3 pg
6- Zeller 7-0 pf/c
7 -shabazz 6-6 sg
8- Adams 7-0 c
9- Goodwin 6-5 pg/sg
10- Len 7-1 c

[Rekindled]

1- Noel - 6/11 pf. Could go at any pick in the top 3-4
2- mcLemore 6-5 sg
3- olynyk 7-0 pf/c
4- Bennett 6-7 pf
5- mcCollum 6-3 pg
6- Zeller 7-0 pf/c
7 -shabazz 6-6 sg
8- Adams 7-0 c
9- Goodwin 6-5 pg/sg
10- Len 7-1 c

wtf , where is oladipo, and porter. both will go top 5 for sure. and lol@ zelle,adams and goodwin in top 10.

[Twiens]

When do the bench press numbers come out?

[Grinder]

Plus he's one of the few in that range that are actually doing the drills. I think that will go a long way with GMs, risky move but he wants to show he can play.

He didn't shoot it very well but from what I saw he was really competing with other players especially defensively in the 1 on 1 drills.

Yep. He didn't quite live up to the hype and playing in Howland's system along with being suspended for the first few games of the season surely didn't help. He's got a really high motor and is relentless on the offensive end. My issue with him is that he has tunnel vision when the ball is in his hands. He offers nothing in terms of passing and getting others involved.

I feel like people are starting to focus more on what he can't do rather than what can do which is score at a high level and play gritty man to man defense.


I think Kelly Olynyk is a big steal outside the top 10. I love watching him play. His feel for the game is unbelievable. He never seems rushed and always makes great decisions with the ball. His offensive game is also more refined than any other big in the draft.

[Johnny Jones]

I think Kelly Olynyk is a big steal outside the top 10. I love watching him play. His feel for the game is unbelievable. He never seems rushed and always makes great decisions with the ball. His offensive game is also more refined than any other big in the draft.
He reminds me of a young Dirk.

[Twiens]

Im a huge Olynyk fan. I think he should bulk up and play center though rather than try to matchup with the athletes at PF.

[Burgz V2]

Yep. He didn't quite live up to the hype and playing in Howland's system along with being suspended for the first few games of the season surely didn't help. He's got a really high motor and is relentless on the offensive end. My issue with him is that he has tunnel vision when the ball is in his hands. He offers nothing in terms of passing and getting others involved.

I feel like people are starting to focus more on what he can't do rather than what can do which is score at a high level and play gritty man to man defense.


I think Kelly Olynyk is a big steal outside the top 10. I love watching him play. His feel for the game is unbelievable. He never seems rushed and always makes great decisions with the ball. His offensive game is also more refined than any other big in the draft.

Shabazz is a victim of the hype tbh. No one really knows what a guy's tendencies are until they play in college. The way his year started and the DNA of that team especially didn't help. He couldn't have played in a more toxic environment so his maturity level was always going to be in question. He's an NBA scorer though and he has a high work rate. He can be a two way player in the league which is rare nowadays and he will most likely have a long career which is still exceptional even if he's not a perennial allstar.

With Olynyk, his dad is a college coach here in Canada, so it's natural for him to have the basketball IQ that he does. He needs the right situation though. He's not a lunch pail guy, he's a guy that kills with finesse. If he gets drafted to a team that expects him to be an interior defender, he's just not that guy. Paired with a defensive specialist big man like a Tyson Chandler he will flourish. He is a 5 with a 4's skill set so his biggest adjustment will be having to find his way defensively. I just don't think he can guard the quicker 4's in the league, and he's not strong enough to guard guys like Gasol and Hibbert at the 5.

[waseem780]

OKC shuld draft Ollynk

[noob cake]

this, except it applies to most prospects

id put very little stock. in the athletic measurements. iirc chris kaman had a better sprint time than chris paul.

Barnes is an counter example of this. He used none of his athleticism in college; he looked like a scrub who couldn't even dominate college players. he measured well and started slow. During the past few months, he is just starting to get it.

[Grinder]

According to Chad Ford, DJ Stephens measured out with a 46" vertical. I knew he was an amazing leaper but that's in the Vince Carter territory. :eek:

[chips93]

Barnes is an counter example of this. He used none of his athleticism in college; he looked like a scrub who couldn't even dominate college players. he measured well and started slow. During the past few months, he is just starting to get it.


thats a great point