Wait so Lebron shot 44% against the Bulls

[longtime lurker]

I wasn't able to follow the series closely but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling. Also to all the nerds that think FG% is the only indicator of success have to say about this? Was Lebron inefficient? Was he a detriment to his team should he have passed up all those shots to the Birdman or Norris Cole?

Lebron was the best player in the series and this is not a thread to hate on him I'm just trying to figure out the contradictions on this site

[KyrieTheFuture]

They won.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Melo shot under 40% before yesterday you troll. I think thats worse than 44%

[JerryWest]

Who the f*ck cares, they beat the bulls in 5! That's actually amazing that he shot that bad yet won in the end :roll:

[AintNoSunshine]

I wasn't able to follow the series closely but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling. Also to all the nerds that think FG% is the only indicator of success have to say about this? Was Lebron inefficient? Was he a detriment to his team should he have passed up all those shots to the Birdman or Norris Cole?

Lebron was the best player in the series and this is not a thread to hate on him I'm just trying to figure out the contradictions on this site

:roll: That's about your boy Kobe's career average

[DonDadda59]

:roll: That's about your boy Kobe's career average

Came here to post this. It's only noteworthy because Lebron did it. If those other guys he named had, no one would bat an eye because it's their career average :lol

Just goes to show what kind of standard the truly great ones are held to :applause:

[longtime lurker]

They won.

Kobe and Westbrook have shot around that too and won yet they still get shit on.

[longtime lurker]

Came here to post this. It's only noteworthy because Lebron did it. If those other guys he named had, no one would bat an eye because it's their career average :lol

Just goes to show what kind of standard the truly great ones are held to :applause:

Nope it's note worthy because according to insidehoops FG% is the only thing that matters. Lebron shooting 44% isn't actually relevant to whether the Heat win or lose

[raprap]

LBJ's lack of mid range shot hurt him in that series. Now I know he has improved his mid range shot but for some reason, he did not have any confidence to shoot it.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Kobe and Westbrook have shot around that too and won yet they still get shit on.
Because he wasn't taking "ill advised shots"

[longtime lurker]

Because he wasn't taking "ill advised shots"

So if the Heat had lost how much blame would go on the FG% and how much blame would be on his teammates?

[HoopsFanNumero1]

So if the Heat had lost how much blame would go on the FG% and how much blame would be on his teammates?

If the Heat lost, most of the blame would go on Lebron. That's how it always is.

[Ne 1]

Why is everyone so enamored with field goal percentage these days? Why wasn't DeAndre Jordan and Tyson Chandler all of your favorite players over the past 2 years then?

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Wait, there are people who think FG% is the ONLY means to an end? That's news to me.

[secund2nun]

Came here to post this. It's only noteworthy because Lebron did it. If those other guys he named had, no one would bat an eye because it's their career average :lol

Just goes to show what kind of standard the truly great ones are held to :applause:

+1

24 points on 44% fg, 16 shots per game, 8 apg, 7 rpg, 2 spg, 2.6 turnovers per game is a bad series for Lebron. That is how good he is.

[longtime lurker]

If the Heat lost, most of the blame would go on Lebron. That's how it always is.

I doubt it. You'll have the guys that troll constantly and that's never going to change, but how much blame would go on his FG% or lack of efficiency?

[longtime lurker]

Wait, there are people who think FG% is the ONLY means to an end? That's news to me.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=300463

[Heavincent]

Came here to post this. It's only noteworthy because Lebron did it. If those other guys he named had, no one would bat an eye because it's their career average :lol

Just goes to show what kind of standard the truly great ones are held to :applause:

Yeah, because Kobe isn't a top 10 player of all time or anything, right? :confusedshrug:

[Kblaze8855]

In 09 Lebron put up 39/8/8 on 49% shooting hit a walkoff game winning three one game and had one of the most dominant 4th quarters ive ever seen in another and still got laughed at for the loss. He loses hes blamed no matter what.

[Rose'sACL]

Why is everyone so enamored with field goal percentage these days? Why wasn't DeAndre Jordan and Tyson Chandler all of your favorite players over the past 2 years then?
because they didn't score as much a lebron.
There is a reason Jordan is considered GOAT. He scored a lot on 50% fg.Same reason why iverson is not though of as even a top 20 player of all time. if lebron was scoring 20ppg on the same fg% as his regular season fg% of this season, no one would call him the best player in the league.

[HoopsFanNumero1]

I doubt it. You'll have the guys that troll constantly and that's never going to change, but how much blame would go on his FG% or lack of efficiency?

Personally, I'd give him the the majority of the blame. For the most part, the role players did well. Cole and Bosh were exceptional. Wade was disappointing but he has an injury excuse. So if the Heat lost, imo Lebron should have gotten most of the blame.

[BlazersDozen]

I wasn't able to follow the series closely but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling. Also to all the nerds that think FG% is the only indicator of success have to say about this? Was Lebron inefficient? Was he a detriment to his team should he have passed up all those shots to the Birdman or Norris Cole?

Lebron was the best player in the series and this is not a thread to hate on him I'm just trying to figure out the contradictions on this site

He barely shot & half the time he did, he ended up on the free throw line. He also almost averaged a triple double.

[DonDadda59]

Yeah, because Kobe isn't a top 10 player of all time or anything, right? :confusedshrug:

Jury's still out on that one. If Bron wins another ring this year, I think a lot of people who have Bean in the 9-10 position will pluck him out to make room.

But let's get back on topic... Looks like Kobe's career average.

[Heavincent]

Jury's still out on that one. If Bron wins another ring this year, I think a lot of people who have Bean in the 9-10 position will pluck him out to make room.


And most people have him higher than that.

[LikeABosh]

I wasn't able to follow the series closely but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling. Also to all the nerds that think FG% is the only indicator of success have to say about this? Was Lebron inefficient? Was he a detriment to his team should he have passed up all those shots to the Birdman or Norris Cole?

Lebron was the best player in the series and this is not a thread to hate on him I'm just trying to figure out the contradictions on this site
WTF are you talking about? 44% is what Melo Kobe and Westbrook average for the entire season. He had an off series, not a big deal. Still made a big impact and the Heat won in 5.

[Ne 1]

Actually, Kobe's efficiency has always been excellent given his usage and volume. The league average for SG's is around 42-43%, Kobe hovered around 45-47% for most of his career, but you guys have it (wrongfully) drilled in your head that he's a an inefficient chucker. He's performed better than nearly every guard.

[DonDadda59]

And most people have him higher than that.

Nah.

[Ne 1]

:roll: That's about your boy Kobe's career average

Well I'm sure all Kobe can think about whilst polishing his 5 rings is his FG% :oldlol:

[aj1987]

He took only 16 shots a game. Carmelo took 25.

[Heavincent]

Nah.

Yah.

[Rose'sACL]

Actually, Kobe's efficiency has always been excellent given his usage and volume. The league average for SG's is around 42-43%, Kobe hovered around 45-47% for most of his career, but you guys have it (wrongfully) drilled in your head that he's a an inefficient chucker. He's performed better than nearly every guard.
he is clearly the second best SG of all time behind Jordan. He is also ranked 8-12 on most knowledgeable basketball fans' all time list which is pretty good. Lebron hasn't entered top 10 yet.

[DonDadda59]

Yah.

Maybe in LA. But let's be real here. And stop trying to derail the thread here.

The topic was Lebron's shooting percentage and I'd like to get a counter argument to this statement- Looks like Kobe's/Melo's/Westbrook's career average.

[Inactive]

And most people have him higher than that.Children don't count.

[ripthekik]

:roll: That's about your boy Kobe's career average
and this is the post that brings Kobe into a thread about Lebron again. And people on ISH wonder why it always become Lebron vs Kobe in threads? Here's your answer. Insecure lebron fanboys.

[RRR3]

and this is the post that brings Kobe into a thread about Lebron again. And people on ISH wonder why it always become Lebron vs Kobe in threads? Here's your answer. Insecure lebron fanboys.
This is so backwards it's not even funny.

[Ne 1]

Nah.


http://i44.tinypic.com/2yzj7d0.jpg

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2uy0xw5.jpg

[L3B120N J4M35]

but when lebron goes from 56% to 44% thats inefficient and it sucks.

[mehyaM24]

Nah.

this. top 20 at best. he ain't shit without shaq or bigmen in general.

Pau to coldbe after his arrival: "step aside bitch...daddy's here." lmfao!!!!

[aj1987]

http://i44.tinypic.com/2yzj7d0.jpg

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2uy0xw5.jpg
People are stupid!:facepalm

[ripthekik]

this. top 20 at best. he ain't shit without shaq or bigs in general.

Pau to coldbe after his arrival: "step aside bitch...daddy's here." lmfao!!!!
and what is lebron without wade or bosh :roll: :roll: :roll:

[L3B120N J4M35]

this. top 20 at best. he ain't shit without shaq or bigmen in general.

Pau to coldbe after his arrival: "step aside bitch...daddy's here." lmfao!!!!

thats why pau's record without kobe in playoffs is at like 0-20. :roll:

[RRR3]

I didn't see Wilt play, but I'm pretty damn sure there aren't six better players than him in NBA history.

[BoutPractice]

We all know popular vote is what should determine a player's value...

Anyway, going back to FG%. There is a difference (lost if you only focus on stats) between the best scorer on the floor having a low FG% because the defense is bothering him into bad shots or because he's intentionally shooting bad shots even though he could get higher percentage looks for himself.

[aj1987]

and what is lebron without wade or bosh :roll: :roll: :roll:
A two time MVP, who averaged 28/7/7 on 48%. Also took his team to the finals at age 22, while on a scrub team. I would say that he was doing something right.

[tpols]

From 56-57 to 44.. Damn. That's a huge dropout and shows that you can't really protect FG as much in the playoffs.

That's what great defenses do though.

[mehyaM24]

and what is lebron without wade or bosh :roll: :roll: :roll:

shaq and LeBron didn't tweet to defend themselves about somebody being superior to them like sidekick boy :lol ....phil actually respects their games ..lmaoo

[Dave3]

and this is the post that brings Kobe into a thread about Lebron again. And people on ISH wonder why it always become Lebron vs Kobe in threads? Here's your answer. Insecure lebron fanboys.
No, the original post brought Kobe into this thread.


but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling

What were you saying about why it becomes a Kobe vs. LeBron debate?

[ripthekik]

A two time MVP, who averaged 28/7/7 on 48%. Also took his team to the finals at age 22, while on a scrub team. I would say that he was doing something right.
and other than producing chokes year after year, did he win anything?


shaq and LeBron didn't tweet to defend themselves about somebody being superior to them like sidekick boy :lol ....phil actually respects their games ..lmaoo
lebron wasn't even in the conversation while kobe is being compared to the GOAT lmaooo :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Ne 1]

There is a reason Jordan is considered GOAT. He scored a lot on 50% fg.

Well actually if you compare Kobe & Jordan's eFG% vs the league averages during their time, Kobe is actually more efficient than Jordan was, although it's marginal.


he is clearly the second best SG of all time behind Jordan.

And Jordan is regraded by many people as the greatest player ever. Is not being as good as Jordan a bad thing? Saying Kobe isn't Jordan really isn’t saying anything, its just ignoring who he is because of who he is not.


He is also ranked 8-12 on most knowledgeable basketball fans

I'd say most knowledgeable fans have him 5 at best and at worst 10. There's really no consistent/logical criteria for ranking Kobe lower than 10. Anyone who does have him lower than 10 has no clue on how to evaluate a players legacy (looking at peak play, overall career stats, awards/records/accomplishments, championships, longevity, impact on teams during prime years, amongst other things.) Kareem, Jordan, Russell and Wilt I'd say are all undeniably better, but after them he has a case. IMO he isn't, but from a career standpoint Kobe at best is arguably top 5. But this like anything else in sports l this is of course subjective and a matter of personal opinion.

If ranking by tiers it goes like this IMO:

First tier (strong GOAT candidates): Kareem, Jordan, Russell, Wilt

Second tier: (weak GOAT candidates): Bird, Magic, Shaq

Third tier: (Top 5 at best candidates): Kobe, Hakeem, Duncan

Fourth tier (weak top 10 candidates): Moses, Dr. J, Jerry West, LeBron James

[RRR3]

and other than producing chokes year after year, did he win anything?


lebron wasn't even in the conversation while kobe is being compared to the GOAT lmaooo :roll: :roll: :roll:
LeBron choked on the Heat, we're talking about Cavs LeBron. try to keep up.

[tpols]

No, the original post brought Kobe into this thread.



What were you saying about why it becomes a Kobe vs. LeBron debate?
Kobe against the Cs dropped off from like 46-47 percent to 41-42.

Lebron against the Bulls here dropped off from 56+ to 44.

Way bigger dropoff but that's because kobe never protected his FG to inflate it against inferior competition. He always took the shots he wanted to no matter the opponent.

[aj1987]

and other than producing chokes year after year, did he win anything?
What did Kobe win without Shaq/Gasol/Odom/Bynum?

[DonDadda59]

http://i44.tinypic.com/2yzj7d0.jpg

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2uy0xw5.jpg

:oldlol:

And you agree with this ranking? What a complete joke. Do you seriously believe Kobe should be ranked higher than Kareem? What argument could you make with a straight face to do that?

Note the date too. This was just after Bean's legendary 6-24 game 7 performance, so he was the flavor of the month. Do the same poll this June and I'm sure some idiots trapped in the moment will rank Lebron #2 all time in an online poll.

You have to be smoking some serious new age crack to rank Bean that high.

[DonDadda59]

Again, let's try to stay on point here people. I still have yet to find anyone address the issue...

That looks like Kobe's/Westbrook's/Melo's career average. :confusedshrug:

[ripthekik]

LeBron choked on the Heat, we're talking about Cavs LeBron. try to keep up.
cavs bron choked plenty too, oh nvm, you didn't watch lebron before he joined the big 3 i guess? :oldlol:


What did Kobe win without Shaq/Gasol/Odom/Bynum?
Without Shaq?
He led his team to 2 championships with only 1 star in Pau, and 2 scrubs Odom and Bynum. Check Bynum's stats.

Let's reverse it. What did Gasol/Odom/Bynum do without Kobe, collectively? :oldlol:

Only the other hand.. Wade without Lebron... :applause:

[Dave3]

Kobe against the Cs dropped off from like 46-47 percent to 41-42.

Lebron against the Bulls here dropped off from 56+ to 44.

Way bigger dropoff but that's because kobe never protected his FG to inflate it against inferior competition. He always took the shots he wanted to no matter the opponent.
In actuality, LeBron just missed a ton of easy shots he usually makes. He missed a lot at the rim, easy layups/post shots that he usually makes. He shot ~50%+ against the Celtics and Pacers last year so it's not like he all of a sudden can't score against good/tough defense. He just had a series where he missed shots he usually makes.

[RRR3]

cavs bron choked plenty too, oh nvm, you didn't watch lebron before he joined the big 3 i guess? :oldlol:


Without Shaq?
He led his team to 2 championships with only 1 star in Pau, and 2 scrubs Odom and Bynum. Check Bynum's stats.

Let's reverse it. What did Gasol/Odom/Bynum do without Kobe, collectively? :oldlol:

Only the other hand.. Wade without Lebron... :applause:
Only idiots like you think LeBron didn't do an amazing job with the Cavs. Another thing, how come you never posted about LeBron until he won a ring? Seriously, you NEVER posted about him prior to 2012. Six years without mentioning him, now he's all you talk about it. :confusedshrug:

[tpols]

Again, let's try to stay on point here people. I still have yet to find anyone address the issue...

That looks like Kobe's/Westbrook's/Melo's career average. :confusedshrug:
That's below Kobe's average.

And the point is the dropoff. Goes to show how inflated brons regular season FG really is.

[RRR3]

LeBron shot 50% in the playoffs last year, and his jumper was atrocious for most of the playoffs :confusedshrug:

[asdf1990]

Only idiots like you think LeBron didn't do an amazing job with the Cavs. Another thing, how come you never posted about LeBron until he won a ring? Seriously, you NEVER posted about him prior to 2012. Six years without mentioning him, now he's all you talk about it. :confusedshrug:

he is just mad lebron is about to go past kobe on the GOAT list before turning 30

[Heavincent]

Maybe in LA.

You're in denial.



The topic was Lebron's shooting percentage and I'd like to get a counter argument to this statement- Looks like Kobe's/Melo's/Westbrook's career average.

It's also not too far off from Lebron's career postseason FG% (47%). Kobe's career playoffs shooting percentage is 45%. Not that big of a difference :confusedshrug:

[RRR3]

LeBron's playoff FG% is brought down by two years (07 and 08) in which he shot about 41%. Other than that, 48%, 51%, 50%, 47%, 50%, and 52% so far this year.

[Dave3]

That's below Kobe's average.

And the point is the dropoff. Goes to show how inflated brons regular season FG really is.
Dude, what inflation?
Since his prime, this is how his FG% looks

2009 season - 49% playoffs - 51%
2010 season - 50% playoffs -50%
2011 season - 51% playoffs - 46% (the year that everyone got on him for choking)
2012 season - 53% playoffs 50%
2013 season - 57% playoffs (so far which is a small sample anyways) 52%

Let's at least wait until the playoffs are done instead of calling his FG% inflated based on 5 games.

[ripthekik]

Only idiots like you think LeBron didn't do an amazing job with the Cavs. Another thing, how come you never posted about LeBron until he won a ring? Seriously, you NEVER posted about him prior to 2012. Six years without mentioning him, now he's all you talk about it. :confusedshrug:
I never said he didn't do an amazing job. He did good, but he also choked.

Prior to 2012 what was there to talk about this guy? He deserved his no-ring status.. it was all fair and the way it was supposed to be.

[aj1987]

Without Shaq?
He led his team to 2 championships with only 1 star in Pau, and 2 scrubs Odom and Bynum. Check Bynum's stats.
Odom averaged a double-double on nearly 50. Bynum was pretty good for the minutes he played. Lets not forget about Ron Artest in '10.


Let's reverse it. What did Gasol/Odom/Bynum do without Kobe, collectively? :oldlol:
They wouldn't have done shit. They needed Kobe and Kobe needed them.

Once again, the original question was "what did Kobe do without big men"
Your reply "what did Lebron do without Wade/Bosh"
So, what DID Kobe do without big men?

[Dave3]

You're in denial.




It's also not too far off from Lebron's career postseason FG% (47%). Kobe's career playoffs shooting percentage is 45%. Not that big of a difference :confusedshrug:
A 2% drop off - the exact same for LeBron.

[RRR3]

I never said he didn't do an amazing job. He did good, but he also choked.

Prior to 2012 what was there to talk about this guy? He deserved his no-ring status.. it was all fair and the way it was supposed to be.
Ignoring the second part of my post I see :rolleyes:

Yeah, who the hell would have won a ring on those Cavs teams?

[Raymone]

FG% is meaningless. Nobody cares about it anymore.

[Ne 1]

And you agree with this ranking? What a complete joke. Do you seriously believe Kobe should be ranked higher than Kareem? What argument could you make with a straight face to do that?

Note the date too. This was just after Bean's legendary 6-24 game 7 performance, so he was the flavor of the month. Do the same poll this June and I'm sure some idiots trapped in the moment will rank Lebron #2 all time in an online poll.


I personally don't, but baksetball is subjective and a matter of personal opinions, and anyway the difference between great players honestly isn't as immense as some people make it out to be.

Also, nobody besides detractors with an agenda care or harp on the fact that Kobe was 6-24 from the field. Nobody seems to remember in the deciding game of the '96 Finals that Jordan shot 5-19, shot 15-35 in '97 and '98 (and in '98 vs Jazz accumulated just ONE rebound and assist despite playing 45 minutes not to mention Game 7 Eastern Conference Finals vs the Pacers that same year he shot 9-25) Dirk went 9-27 in '11, Duncan went 10-27 in '05, Hakeem shot 10-25 vs the Knicks in game 7 of the '94 Finals.

I do agree with people being prisoners of the moment though. But that proves the majority of people do have him ranked higher than 10 as you claimed nobody does.

[ripthekik]

So, what DID Kobe do without big men?
First, regarding Bynum, you sure we're talking about the same guy? The same guy that averaged 6 points 5 rebounds in the finals? :oldlol:

As for this question, how unfair is it, and how stupid do you think I am to answer it? For Lebron, I actually focused on specifically 2 players- Wade and Bosh.

For Kobe, you focused on BIG MEN. Which team in NBA history didn't win with a big man, even if it was just for defending/rebounding purposes? :oldlol: You might as well ask me, What did Kobe do without 4 teammates? :roll:

So to be fair, you can ask what did Kobe did without Shaq, or what did Kobe do without Pau. And both those questions are answerable.

You see the difference? Kobe actually answered the question of what he could do without Shaq, while Lebron has yet to answer what he can do without Wade/Bosh.

[tpols]

Dude, what inflation?
Since his prime, this is how his FG% looks

2009 season - 49% playoffs - 51%
2010 season - 50% playoffs -50%
2011 season - 51% playoffs - 46% (the year that everyone got on him for choking)
2012 season - 53% playoffs 50%
2013 season - 57% playoffs (so far which is a small sample anyways) 52%

Let's at least wait until the playoffs are done instead of calling his FG% inflated based on 5 games.
The previous years are fine.. Never said anything about inflation there.

But he shot 57 percent in the regular season and is now at 51 percent for the playoffs after shooting extremely well against the worst team to make the playoffs in the bucks.

His FG will be under 50 percent by the end of the playoffs and I'm willing to bet on it.

That 57 was extremely inflated and is unattainable when it can't be protected in the playoffs against superior comp.

[Heavincent]

45% and 47%...the difference between being great and being truly great.

[aj1987]

First, regarding Bynum, you sure we're talking about the same guy? The same guy that averaged 6 points 5 rebounds in the finals? :oldlol:
Didn't he play like 15 minutes a game?


As for this question, how unfair is it, and how stupid do you think I am to answer it?
You see the difference? Kobe actually answered the question of what he could do without Shaq, while Lebron has yet to answer what he can do without Wade/Bosh.
Let me rephrase. What did Kobe ever do without a HOF big man?

[Deuce Bigalow]

http://i44.tinypic.com/2yzj7d0.jpg

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2uy0xw5.jpg
Here is two other lists.

(#1 Votes)Points

[K Xerxes]

In 09 Lebron put up 39/8/8 on 49% shooting hit a walkoff game winning three one game and had one of the most dominant 4th quarters ive ever seen in another and still got laughed at for the loss. He loses hes blamed no matter what.

This...

From now on, LeBron will be crucified if his team loses in any series for the forseeable future. It's the commonly held view that LeBron and his team are too good to lose, and any failure leads back to LeBron's inability to dominate every game.

[Ne 1]

Yeah, who the hell would have won a ring on those Cavs teams?

Well we'll never know now how far that Cavs team could have gone in 2010 because of the odd turn of events after Game 3 against Boston with LeBron visibly pouting/quitting.

They were up 2-1 and if LeBron played even close to his usual level, the Cavs in all likelihood win the series. The Celtics deserve some credit, but Lebron just seemed off and he played like garbage in the last 3 games. He didn't seem like himself at all. I don't know if he was looking towards the summer, or if the Delonte rumor was true, but he really looked visibly distracted.

[tpols]

45% and 47%...the difference between being great and being truly great.
Don daddas a clown with an agenda.. You might as well not argue.

[RRR3]

Kobe 4th, Shaq 11th. Obviously a list with a lot of credibility.

[ripthekik]

Didn't he play like 15 minutes a game?

Thanks for making my point. How important is this guy that played 15 minutes.. and according to you.. what can Kobe do without this guy :oldlol:


Let me rephrase. What did Kobe ever do without a HOF big man?
Still too broad. You can do this for every single NBA Champion. What did Shaq do without a HOF guard? etc etc etc. We have to be specific. Isn't that the best? The broader you go.. the more you can apply to anyone else.. the closer it gets to the question, what did he do without 4 teammates? That's why we go into specific players.

Again, Kobe won with 2 different teams and proved all haters like you wrong. Someone like you would probably constantly spam what did Kobe do without Shaq prior to 2009. He shut you up the 2 years he won, and won with FMVP.

Now.. what has Lebron done with Wade and Bosh?

[RRR3]

Well we'll never know now how far that Cavs team could have gone in 2010 because of the odd turn of events after Game 3 against Boston with LeBron visibly pouting/quitting.

They were up 2-1 and if LeBron played even close to his usual level, the Cavs in all likelihood win the series. The Celtics deserve some credit, but Lebron just seemed off and he played like garbage in the last 3 games. He didn't seem like himself at all. I don't know if he was looking towards the summer, or if the Delonte rumor was true, but he really looked visibly distracted.
IDK I didn't watch that series. How would they beat the Lakers though if they had advanced?

[Dave3]

The previous years are fine.. Never said anything about inflation there.

But he shot 57 percent in the regular season and is now at 51 percent for the playoffs after shooting extremely well against the worst team to make the playoffs in the bucks.

His FG will be under 50 percent by the end of the playoffs and I'm willing to bet on it.

That 57 was extremely inflated and is unattainable when it can't be protected in the playoffs against superior comp.
You said "goes to show how his regular season FG% really is" and used 5 games as your premise. That's very different than "it will go down and show that his FG% was inflated after all"

At this point though, you have nothing but 5 games vs. 5 years.

[All Net]

He was below par but not like he had to play his best...he didn't need to play great or go all out.

[tpols]

You said "goes to show how his regular season FG% really is" and used 5 games as your premise. That's very different than "it will go down and show that his FG% was inflated after all"

At this point though, you have nothing but 5 games vs. 5 years.
I said his regular season FG is inflated.. talking about this year. 57 percent. Never mentioned his FG for other years.

Do you agree that if his FG dips below 50 for the playoffs after being 57+ for the regular season that it would have been inflated then?

If we can't agree on that, there's no point in moving forward.

[DonDadda59]

You're in denial.

Yeah, I'm in denial... but Bean is ranked higher than KAJ... ok :oldlol:


It's also not too far off from Lebron's career postseason FG% (47%). Kobe's career playoffs shooting percentage is 45%. Not that big of a difference :confusedshrug:

Bron has shot over 50% in increasing fashion for the past 4 seasons with a peak of 57% and a career average of 49%. Bean has a career high of 47% in 17 seasons and a career average of 45%... that's the 3rd greatest player ever according to that random poll at his absolute best :oldlol:

http://cdn.hiphopwired.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/cmon_son.jpg?w=120&h=60&crop=1

[Dave3]

I said his regular season FG is inflated.. talking about this year. 57 percent. Never mentioned his FG for other years.

Do you agree that if his FG dips below 50 for the playoffs after being 57+ for the regular season that it would have been inflated then?

If we can't agree on that, there's no point in moving forward.
Yeah, "if" which it hasn't thus far. That's my point though. You're talking in hypothetical as of right now. That's all I'm saying.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Yeah, I'm in denial... but Bean is ranked higher than KAJ... ok :oldlol:



Bron has shot over 50% in increasing fashion for the past 4 seasons with a peak of 57% and a career average of 49%. Bean has a career high of 47% in 17 seasons and a career average of 45%... that's the 3rd greatest player ever according to that random poll at his absolute best :oldlol:

http://cdn.hiphopwired.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/cmon_son.jpg?w=120&h=60&crop=1
Bill Russell is GOAT to some and top 5 for most, but wasn't his career FG% 44?

[mehyaM24]

magic and shaq are laughing at kobes finals mvp total hahahaha!.....kobe 2nd on his own team in mvps....nash is cracking up :oldlol:

[tpols]

Yeah, "if" which it hasn't thus far. That's my point though. You're talking in hypothetical as of right now. That's all I'm saying.


Bron isn't shooting over 50 against Indy or Memphis.. And if he even came close to 57 I can honestly say I'd be shocked.

People were talking Bron like he was prime Shaq in the regular season with that efficiency. Difference is shaq kept that in the playoffs.. Because it wasn't inflated.

Bron already dropped off 5+ percent and his hardest competition to is still ahead of him.

[aj1987]

Thanks for making my point. How important is this guy that played 15 minutes.. and according to you.. what can Kobe do without this guy :oldlol:
As I said, he was pretty solid the minutes he played.



Still too broad. You can do this for every single NBA Champion. What did Shaq do without a HOF guard? etc etc etc. We have to be specific. Isn't that the best? The broader you go.. the more you can apply to anyone else.. the closer it gets to the question, what did he do without 4 teammates? That's why we go into specific players.
Not broad at all. Kobe needs a terrific big man to win. He couldn't win shit with scrub teammates. Lebron went further than Kobe, with scrubs as teammates. He won two MVP's as well.


Again, Kobe won with 2 different teams and proved all haters like you wrong. Someone like you would probably constantly spam what did Kobe do without Shaq prior to 2009. He shut you up the 2 years he won, and won with FMVP.
You're stupid if you think I'm a Kobe hater. I cheered for the Lakers in the '08/'09/'10 playoffs, once Miami got knocked out. The only point I'm trying to make here is that Lebron is every bit as good and arguably better than a prime Kobe.


Now.. what has Lebron done with Wade and Bosh?
He won a championship and is on the path to repeat. If you mean what he did without them, we took a team that would've won maybe 20-30 games to the NBA finals. The team won 60+ games twice as well. He won two MVP's and was the scoring champ. Averaged 28/7/7 on 48%. Replace Lebron with Kobe on those Cav's teams and I doubt that they'd win more than 45 games.

[DonDadda59]

Bill Russell is GOAT to some and top 5 for most, but wasn't his career FG% 44?

11 championships obviously goes a long way (which is why I have no clue why people put Bean in top 10 lists but not John Havlicek, but I digress. If Russell had been better offensively, then he would be undisputed GOAT.

[Heavincent]

Bron has shot over 50% in increasing fashion for the past 4 seasons with a peak of 57% and a career average of 49%. Bean has a career high of 47% in 17 seasons and a career average of 45%... that's the 3rd greatest player ever according to that random poll at his absolute best :oldlol:


But there's only a 2% difference between them in the playoffs (you know, when it actually matters) :confusedshrug:

[Deuce Bigalow]

magic and shaq are laughing at kobes finals mvp total hahahaha!.....kobe 2nd on his own team in mvps....nash is cracking up :oldlol:
Magic? The same Magic that has Kobe tied with him for GOAT Laker? Shaq? The same Shaq that called Kobe the GOAT Laker?

Lol

[RRR3]

But there's only a 2% difference between them in the playoffs (you know, when it actually matters) :confusedshrug:
I already mentioned it's brought down a lot by two years when LBJ shot terribly. His career's far from over, he'll get it higher than 47% I believe. He also scores more PPG in the playoffs than Kobe for what it's worth :confusedshrug:

[ripthekik]

Not broad at all. Kobe needs a terrific big man to win. He couldn't win shit with scrub teammates. Lebron went further than Kobe, with scrubs as teammates. He won two MVP's as well.

You constantly brag about this finals trip. Do you realize it was in the East? Look at the teams back then.. and even now.. I don't think a trip to the finals is that much to brag about when you take into account context.

Most of the years, it's just one competitive series, then you get into the finals. Like this year- Bucks, Bulls with 3 starters injured. 1 series then you get into the finals. How's that tough? Dwight took his team to the finals too.

[mehyaM24]

Magic? The same Magic that has Kobe tied with him for GOAT Laker? Shaq? The same Shaq that called Kobe the GOAT Laker?

Lol

ever heard of public relations?... doubt it. :lol

[Rose'sACL]

Bron isn't shooting over 50 against Indy or Memphis.. And if he even came close to 57 I can honestly say I'd be shocked.

People were talking Bron like he was prime Shaq in the regular season with that efficiency. Difference is shaq kept that in the playoffs.. Because it wasn't inflated.

Bron already dropped off 5+ percent and his hardest competition to is still ahead of him.
He shot over 50% against both indiana and celtics last year in the playoffs.Both of them had pretty good defense and indiana had one of the best defenses in post season. i know last year's playoffs don't count because it was a shortened season for every team other than heat.

[Segatti]

For a guy who cares so much about his fg%, that's pretty low.

[tpols]

He shot over 50% against both indiana and celtics last year in the playoffs.Both of them had pretty good defense and indiana had one of the best defenses in post season. i know last year's playoffs don't count because it was a shortened season for every team other than heat.
Indy looks a lot better this year.. And Bron had wade to take off pressure with his playmaking/scoring duties from the perimeter. Wade is really hurt right now or out of sync.. He just can't provide those same explosions, though maybe he'll bounce back.

And if Memphis or Spurs make the finals he's got another defensive juggernaut on his hands. 57 just isn't possible. There will be a big dropoff when it's all said and done.

[mehyaM24]

He shot over 50% against both indiana and celtics last year in the playoffs.Both of them had pretty good defense and indiana had one of the best defenses in post season. i know last year's playoffs don't count because it was a shortened season for every team other than heat.

dont bother debating with kobetards..pretty much every debate I felt like I was watching coldbe getting knocked around by Chris child's.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view2/1267594/kobe-vs-childs-o.gif

It looks like the ref is holding Kobe back ....but he's really just asking him what side item he wants with combo child's just served him. Lmfao!!!!

[tpols]

For a guy who cares so much about his fg%, that's pretty low.
Well, that's the thing. When the games really matter and Bron has to focus 100 percent to get his team the win he can't pick and choose his spots as much. He has to give it on every possession no matter if the conversion rate is lower.

[KingBeasley08]

What's wrong with 44%? That's about what Kobe averages :confusedshrug:

[Rose'sACL]

Indy looks a lot better this year.. And Bron had wade to take off playmaking/scoring duties from the perimeter. Wade is really hurt right now or out of sync.. He just can't provide those same explosions, though maybe he'll bounce back.

And if Memphis or Spurs make the finals he's got another defensive juggernaut on his hands. 57 just isn't possible. There will be a big dropout when it's all said and done.
who the **** thinks he is going to shoot 57% in playoffs?
both indiana and cletics had great defenses last year. no matter what you say they had top defenses in the league and he played really well. wade admitted that he got going against indiana because lebron kept feeding him till he got into rhythm.
Even Jordan wasn't able to keep his FG% the same into post season most of the time.
The only players who can maintain it whole scoring a lot are centers.

[tazb]

Kobe's shooting an astonishing 0%

[ripthekik]

Kobe's shooting an astonishing 0%
someone sucks at math :roll: :roll:

[secund2nun]

Indy looks a lot better this year.. And Bron had wade to take off pressure with his playmaking/scoring duties from the perimeter. Wade is really hurt right now or out of sync.. He just can't provide those same explosions, though maybe he'll bounce back.

And if Memphis or Spurs make the finals he's got another defensive juggernaut on his hands. 57 just isn't possible. There will be a big dropoff when it's all said and done.

So you are ignoring that Bosh was out against Indy last season and is now fully healthy this season?

[DonDadda59]

But there's only a 2% difference between them in the playoffs (you know, when it actually matters) :confusedshrug:

It all matters.


What's wrong with 44%? That's about what Kobe averages :confusedshrug:

I'm saying doe.

And I'm going to have a good laugh when new polls come out in June putting Bron in the top 2-5 all time range and then watching the hilarious irony ensue. Gonna be a good time :applause:

[aj1987]

You constantly brag about this finals trip. Do you realize it was in the East? Look at the teams back then.. and even now.. I don't think a trip to the finals is that much to brag about when you take into account context.
You can compare them all you want. The fact still remains that Miami has owned pretty much every team in the league. They lost 3-4 games in the last couple of months, FFS. They're what, 46-3? That's pretty amazing, considering that outside the big 3 and Allen, most of the teams in the league wouldn't touch any of the players and their contracts.


Most of the years, it's just one competitive series, then you get into the finals. Like this year- Bucks, Bulls with 3 starters injured. 1 series then you get into the finals. How's that tough? Dwight took his team to the finals too.
Dwight is a 3 time DPOY. He might be offensively limited a little bit, but the dude can defend. He was injured and still put up 17/13 on 58%.
Kevin Garnett was injured in '09. Are you going to hold it against Kobe? I'm sure that if KG played, the Celtics would've won in '09. Even in '10, the Celtics would've won if Perkins didn't get injured. You're the one who bitches about the refs, so 2002? According to your .5 ring logic, your boy Kobe has 0 rings. 2 by Shaq, 1 thanks to the refs, and another 2 due to injuries.

Injuries are a part of the sport and Miami has an injured Wade. Played without Bosh and an injured Wade last year.

Only one competitive series? Down 2-1 against Indiana. Down 3-2 against Boston. Down 1-0 against OKC.

[secund2nun]

Lebron shot 44% and that is a terrible shooting performance for him but even then he had 24 points on 16 shots per game against chicago. A terrible shooting performance for Kobe is like 35%. Overall Lebron is still shooting 52% in the playoffs. Lol at the haters.

[tpols]

who the **** thinks he is going to shoot 57% in playoffs?
both indiana and cletics had great defenses last year. no matter what you say they had top defenses in the league and he played really well. wade admitted that he got going against indiana because lebron kept feeding him till he got into rhythm.
Even Jordan wasn't able to keep his FG% the same into post season most of the time.
Have you been following what was being talked about?

I said Lebron's regular season FG was severely inflated. He shot 57 percent for the season. That's like prime Shaq efficiency.

His FG for the playoffs will likely, based on previous years and future competition and current progress, be 7+ percent lower.

Go look up MJ, or Kobe or wade or anyone other superstars dropoffs in FG from regular season to playoffs. I don't think youll find over 5 percent. Because that's a huge dropoff. 7 percent or more is even crazier.


And that's not to say LeBron had a bad playoffs. If he shoots 48 or 49 or 50 and does what he normally does impacting the game in every aspect, he will have had a GREAT playoffs.

But it will still show that his regular season efficiency was overrated. Anyone watching the games saw him protecting it. He abandoned halfcourt shots.. Took bets with teammates on how high he could take that number. And people still deny it's inflation.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Bron wont be held to the same standard, because this is out of the norm. What is he? A 48-49% shooter in the postseason? :confusedshrug:

[DonDadda59]

But it will still show that his regular season efficiency was overrated. Anyone watching the games saw him protecting it. He abandoned halfcourt shots.. Took bets with teammates on how high he could take that number. And people still deny it's inflation.

How do you 'inflate' 57% shooting for an entire season? By not shooting half court shots?

Come on man, now you're just reaching.

[tpols]

So you are ignoring that Bosh was out against Indy last season and is now fully healthy this season?
Bosh doesn't create.. He doesn't relieve pressure off Lebron in the same way wade does. He's a finisher and a spot up shooter. Bosh's real value comes in his replacement value over Miamis other big men. His defense, rebounding, etc. are very important against teams like indy, but he won't impact brons efficiency by that much.

[Ne 1]

IDK I didn't watch that series. How would they beat the Lakers though if they had advanced?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200912250LAL.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201001210CLE.html

[branslowski]

45% is actually good for a jump shooter idiots. Neway, won't get into it...guess Ray Allen and Reggie Miller can't shoot either :rolleyes:

[branslowski]

It all matters.



I'm saying doe.

And I'm going to have a good laugh when new polls come out in June putting Bron in the top 2-5 all time range and then watching the hilarious irony ensue. Gonna be a good time :applause:

Wat irony? If he wins again he should be in top 5 imo...Kobe is at 7, LeBron would be at 5...Showing how greater these players are compared to the yesteryear players.

[leMVP]

How was his free throw percentage?

i think he cleared the 85%

[secund2nun]

Bosh doesn't create.. He doesn't relieve pressure off Lebron in the same way wade does. He's a finisher and a spot up shooter. Bosh's real value comes in his replacement value over Miamis other big men. His defense, rebounding, etc. are very important against teams like indy, but he won't impact brons efficiency by that much.

He spaces the floor and makes it easier for Lebron to score in the paint. Also he puts less scoring burden on Lebron. Lebron will still be able to reach 50% fg per game against Indy, which is what the poster I quoted was denying, saying Indy is a lot better this year, but Miami and Lebron himself is a lot better this year with Bosh and a improved Lebron plus Birdman and Allen.

[DonDadda59]

Wat irony? If he wins again he should be in top 5 imo...Kobe is at 7, LeBron would be at 5...Showing how greater these players are compared to the yesteryear players.

Completely disagree. But, the ironic thing is that the same people pushing ridiculous polls that have Bean ranked higher than Kareem will be up in arms once the new flavor of the month polls are out come June.

[branslowski]

Completely disagree. But, the ironic thing is that the same people pushing ridiculous polls that have Bean ranked higher than Kareem will be up in arms once the new flavor of the month polls are out come June.

Kareems higher than Kobe on my list...F*ck a poll, I used career stats and accomplishments...And if Bron wins another title along with the finals Mvp, he boost up major spots in my list..

[DMAVS41]

Have you been following what was being talked about?

I said Lebron's regular season FG was severely inflated. He shot 57 percent for the season. That's like prime Shaq efficiency.

His FG for the playoffs will likely, based on previous years and future competition and current progress, be 7+ percent lower.

Go look up MJ, or Kobe or wade or anyone other superstars dropoffs in FG from regular season to playoffs. I don't think youll find over 5 percent. Because that's a huge dropoff. 7 percent or more is even crazier.


And that's not to say LeBron had a bad playoffs. If he shoots 48 or 49 or 50 and does what he normally does impacting the game in every aspect, he will have had a GREAT playoffs.

But it will still show that his regular season efficiency was overrated. Anyone watching the games saw him protecting it. He abandoned halfcourt shots.. Took bets with teammates on how high he could take that number. And people still deny it's inflation.

Inflating your fg% could be translated to this;

Making shots.

LOL...of course his fg% in the regular season is going to be better given his historic efficiency combined with the caliber of defenses he has played and is going to have to play the rest of the way.

I just love the "inflated" talk as if it is a bad thing to make more shots. ROFL...

[Doranku]

Nah.

Most casual fans consider him top 5 from my experience. You have to remember that fans who post on message boards, discuss all-time rankings regularly, etc. are in the minority of fans out there.

Just look at that TNT poll for best player of the decade. You make that argument on here, and Duncan or Shaq would easily trump Kobe. But Kobe won that vote by a landslide.

[Ne 1]

Inflating your fg% could be translated to this;

Making shots.

LOL...of course his fg% in the regular season is going to be better given his historic efficiency combined with the caliber of defenses he has played and is going to have to play the rest of the way.

I just love the "inflated" talk as if it is a bad thing to make more shots. ROFL...

Lebron admitted himself he likes to pad his stat, he even has competition with Wade about FG%

He almost never takes bailout shots, he just passes it to another teammate. He's way too concerned with his stats.

Many times you will see him rather other players take the bail out shot rather him, because he does not want to hurt his FG%. He is the best player of their team, he should be the one talking it cause has has the better chance of making it. Be real gino, you know Bron likes to pad his stat.. He even has check my stats shirt printed.

http://www.albany.com/byesline/check%20my%20stats2.jpg

[LBJ 23]

Inflating your fg% could be translated to this;

Making shots.

LOL...of course his fg% in the regular season is going to be better given his historic efficiency combined with the caliber of defenses he has played and is going to have to play the rest of the way.

I just love the "inflated" talk as if it is a bad thing to make more shots. ROFL...


Also, when he was ''inflating'' his FG% the most, his team was almost unbeatable and made a historic run. I don't see how that's a bad thing.

And like you said, he was just making shots. Especially his jumper was money during that hot streak. Plus it was clear that a lot of times he wasn't giving his 100% on defense to save energy for more efficient offense. In bulls series or last year Thunder series that wasn't the case and consequently his jumper was off.

[Leftimage]

25,7,7 on 44% shooting = subpar playoff series for who?

Jordan?

Lebron?

Who else would this stat line be considered a subpar series for?

No other two players in league history.

It goes without saying, look beyond the stat sheet and you'll see he played game-changing defense every minute he was on the floor.

[Ne 1]

This is why I wasn't overly impressed with LeBron's February FG% ... he cherry picked a lot of shots, had significant help from Wade who was balling. It wasn't like he was tearing it up on a FG hot streak on jumpers, putting up major volume scoring numbers.

I think it was one of the most overrated streaks in recent memory. He was totally visibly protecting those percentages at times, too. Which isn't the most altruistic competitive shot selection with just getting buckets or keeping the ultimate win in mind.

These same LeBron stans who overly critique Kobe for gunning for volume scoring numbers at the expense of his efficiency, LeBron committed essentially the same selfish agenda but the opposite extreme.

LeBron was protecting FG% at the expense of shots when he was hot, or make able shots that could help culminate in a win or a LEGITIMATE high scoring/high percentage hot streak that didn't seem contrived or protected.

I like high scoring games, or high efficiency games when it comes about ORGANICALLY. Taking the best shots possible while trying to win the game. Not accomplishing mini feats in a game that only reflect personal agendas IE Kobe scoring as much as he wants to ... or LeBron and Wade's little FG% protection competition.

[tmacattack33]

I wasn't able to follow the series closely but if this had been Melo Kobe or Westbrook this board would have been flooded with threads trolling. Also to all the nerds that think FG% is the only indicator of success have to say about this? Was Lebron inefficient? Was he a detriment to his team should he have passed up all those shots to the Birdman or Norris Cole?

Lebron was the best player in the series and this is not a thread to hate on him I'm just trying to figure out the contradictions on this site

Umm...

1. This indeed was a "bad" series for Lebron. It was probably his worst series since 2011. And many people on here have said this.

2. Nobody goes nuts when Melo, Westbrook, or Kobe shoot 44%. It's when they shoot 41%-42% or below that people go nuts.

3. Scoring isn't even Lebron's best trait on offense. Passing is.





I hope I answered your question and I would hope your confusion is now gone. You're welcome.

[seanclayton]

Dat Kobe efficiency.

[LBJ 23]

This is why I wasn't overly impressed with LeBron's February FG% ... he cherry picked a lot of shots, had significant help from Wade who was balling. It wasn't like he was tearing it up on a FG hot streak on jumpers, putting up major volume scoring numbers.

I think it was one of the most overrated streaks in recent memory. He was totally visibly protecting those percentages at times, too. Which isn't the most altruistic competitive shot selection with just getting buckets or keeping the ultimate win in mind.

These same LeBron stans who overly critique Kobe for gunning for volume scoring numbers at the expense of his efficiency, LeBron committed essentially the same selfish agenda but the opposite extreme.

LeBron was protecting FG% at the expense of shots when he was hot, or make able shots that could help culminate in a win or a LEGITIMATE high scoring/high percentage hot streak that didn't seem contrived or protected.

I like high scoring games, or high efficiency games when it comes about ORGANICALLY. Taking the best shots possible while trying to win the game. Not accomplishing mini feats in a game that only reflect personal agendas IE Kobe scoring as much as he wants to ... or LeBron and Wade's little FG% protection competition.


All what you're saying would make sense if Miami was struggling during that Lebron's high FG% streak. But Miami was almost unbeatable during that streak and won 27 games in a row which was 2nd logest streak in NBA history. You do realize that?

We can say that he was maybe playing the ultimate style of winning basketball. He was taking shots which he had the most chance of making and that was really effective for him and his teammates because it was obvious that that kind of play was really suitable for his teammates also. Noone was really struglling when Lebron was playing the way he did and that resulted in a winning basketball.

[bdreason]

44% is solid for Westbrook or Melo. :oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

I'll say it again.

Until I see a player turn down shots that he should definitely take to protect his fg% and hurt the team....making more shots is just a net positive...always.

Having a competition with a teammate about which player can make the most shots is a hell of a lot better than having a contest to see which player can score the most points.

Hell, I'm a former coach and I love that idea. Prize to the player with the highest fg% at the end of the game.

The criticism would make sense if Lebron was just passing up shots all the time. Which he hasn't done since the 11 Finals.

If a player is going to score over 25 ppg on high efficiency...what is the problem if he only takes the shots he can make? Shit...you guys act like Lebron is out there not trying to win while his team just rattled off one of the best regular seasons ever, the 2nd longest win streak ever, and his team is 8-1 in the playoffs.

Come off it.

[bdreason]

oops wrong thread.

[#number6ix#]

you guys sure do love to argue for lebron and kobe like they're your family or something... We can all agree that both are talented once in a generation players...Lets enjoy the rest of the playoffs :cheers:

[Pointguard]

Indy looks a lot better this year.. And Bron had wade to take off pressure with his playmaking/scoring duties from the perimeter. Wade is really hurt right now or out of sync.. He just can't provide those same explosions, though maybe he'll bounce back.

And if Memphis or Spurs make the finals he's got another defensive juggernaut on his hands. 57 just isn't possible. There will be a big dropoff when it's all said and done.
Its not inflated if he faces the top three defenses in the league and they might make it a priority to stop him. Nobody in the league faces the top defenses in the league for 13 -17 games in a row and expects to maintain their 57% average. You have to have some middle teams and bad defensive teams.

[Vertical-24]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200912250LAL.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201001210CLE.html

I remember that season-series. Kobe shot like sh*t :oldlol:

LeBron dominated both games. I still think L.A. would have adjusted and beat the Cavs in 7. Would have been a hell of a series. Shaq back in LA, suited up to get a chip over his old coach/team/most notable teammate. We would finally have Mamba vs. The King. Would have been pretty epic.

[Remix]

Lebron shoots 60% - he's the GOAT lololol@melo and kobes sht fg%

Lebron shoots 44% - who cares about fg% anyways

anyways I wanna know what Brons % was for shots outside of the paint. I bet it was in the low 20s, he couldnt make sht. Take away all of his easy transitions dunks annd his fg% isnt very impressive

[ralph_i_el]

well he was also averaging 10 Ft's a game and 8 assists...

[Dave3]

Take away all of his easy transitions dunks annd his fg% isnt very impressive
You should be an NBA coach. Can't believe no one's thought of that.:rolleyes:

Don't you think maybe they can't take away those shots? You can't take away the shots he wants. That's why he's the best.

[Magic 32]

I'm not going to count the Bucks series as playoffs games.

He is playing subpar. Period.

[Human Error]

+1

24 points on 44% fg, 16 shots per game, 8 apg, 7 rpg, 2 spg, 2.6 turnovers per game is a bad series for Lebron. That is how good he is.
This. Guys like Kobe and Carmelo would be considered as basketball gods had they averaged these numbers in a playoff series. For Lebron this is a bad series.

[Magic 32]

This. Guys like Kobe and Carmelo would be considered as basketball gods had they averaged these numbers in a playoff series. For Lebron this is a bad series.

http://oi44.tinypic.com/2z6h8gk.jpg
http://oi41.tinypic.com/156rcqe.jpg
http://oi40.tinypic.com/ip2pv9.jpg

[pauk]

Lebron did that on ~16 FGA... not 30 FGA (dunno, but wouldnt be surprised if Melo shot that much)... then there is the passing, rebounding and defense part which allowed Lebron to impact anyways..... but the even more significant difference here is that Lebron was able to step up when they needed him, he averaged 11 PPG (52-35-88) in the 4th quarter against Bulls, more than anybody in any series....

Lebron is not Carmelo, Lebron is a guy that can kill you offensively without scoring a single basket (if his teammates dont brick to much that is).... Carmelo is a guy that when his shot is not falling he cant impact the game any other way... and he wasnt either able to step up when they needed him in the 4th....

[SamuraiSWISH]

Jimmy B locked his ISO game up BIG TIME

[Magic 32]

more significant difference here is that Lebron was able to step up when they needed him, he averaged 11 PPG (52-35-88) in the 4th quarter against Bulls, more than anybody in any series....

Lebron is a guy that can kill you offensively without scoring a single basket (if his teammates dont brick to much that is)

Playing that card is dangerous with Lebron's history.

[Leftimage]

Lebron shoots 60% - he's the GOAT lololol@melo and kobes sht fg%

Lebron shoots 44% - who cares about fg% anyways

anyways I wanna know what Brons % was for shots outside of the paint. I bet it was in the low 20s, he couldnt make sht. Take away all of his easy transitions dunks annd his fg% isnt very impressive

Ya I bet prime Shaq also had unimpressive fg% if you took away his ''easy'' baskets.

It's called being physically unstoppable. A trait that at time seems almost frowned upon by Kobe stans... and yet Jordan and Shaq supporters are fine with it.

As for your question, Lebron's jumper was ok. He just missed many many layups he would usually make. It happens against teams who play him tough, mostly the Bulls and to a lesser extent, Pacers.

[NumberSix]

Some series are defense oriented and some are offense oriented.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

44% is not a terrible percentage at all

[Trollsmasher]

His jumper was off and the Bulls played excellent help defense.

[Bandito]

When did 44% FG became bad?

[TheMan]

Overall, Jimmy Butler did a good job on LBJ considering it's LeBron we're talking about and Jimmy Buckets youth/inexpirience. The kid is only gonna get better and it looks as though he's the real deal.

[TheBigVeto]

http://i44.tinypic.com/2yzj7d0.jpg

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2uy0xw5.jpg

So many kobetards in the world!

[360crazy]

Lebron shoots 60% - he's the GOAT lololol@melo and kobes sht fg%

Lebron shoots 44% - who cares about fg% anyways

anyways I wanna know what Brons % was for shots outside of the paint. I bet it was in the low 20s, he couldnt make sht. Take away all of his easy transitions dunks annd his fg% isnt very impressive

Why would you want to shoot outside of the paint, if you can get to the rim? :wtf: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

U dudes amaze me with your logic.

[360crazy]

This is why I wasn't overly impressed with LeBron's February FG% ... he cherry picked a lot of shots, had significant help from Wade who was balling. It wasn't like he was tearing it up on a FG hot streak on jumpers, putting up major volume scoring numbers.

I think it was one of the most overrated streaks in recent memory. He was totally visibly protecting those percentages at times, too. Which isn't the most altruistic competitive shot selection with just getting buckets or keeping the ultimate win in mind.

These same LeBron stans who overly critique Kobe for gunning for volume scoring numbers at the expense of his efficiency, LeBron committed essentially the same selfish agenda but the opposite extreme.

LeBron was protecting FG% at the expense of shots when he was hot, or make able shots that could help culminate in a win or a LEGITIMATE high scoring/high percentage hot streak that didn't seem contrived or protected.

I like high scoring games, or high efficiency games when it comes about ORGANICALLY. Taking the best shots possible while trying to win the game. Not accomplishing mini feats in a game that only reflect personal agendas IE Kobe scoring as much as he wants to ... or LeBron and Wade's little FG% protection competition.

So pretty much you're saying Lebron should of took bad shots? I'm not getting anything else out of your post but he should of took bad shots. Like Kobe right... (which reflects in his fg%) and the team chemistry being disrupted. U got to be kidding me dude.

[tazb]

So many kobetards in the world!

Lmao this. 3rd my ****ing ass.

[Nevaeh]

Well actually if you compare Kobe & Jordan's eFG% vs the league averages during their time, Kobe is actually more efficient than Jordan was, although it's marginal.



Damn n!gga!! Are you under contract to post this bullsh!t line every other month, for the lifetime that you're on ISH or something?

:oldlol:

Well, since you love quoting sh!t from other peeps so damn much:



NOT.....EVEN....CLOSE

Jordan vs. league eFG% from 1988-1997, full seasons:


53.7%......48.9%
54.6%......48.9%
55.0%......48.9%
54.7%......48.7%
52.6%......48.7%
51.5%......49.1%
52.5%......49.9%
51.6%......49.3%

Kobe from 2002-2009:

47.9%......47.7%
48.3%......47.4%
46.8%......47.1%
48.2%......48.2%
49.1%......49.0%
50.2%......49.6%
50.3%......49.7%
50.2%......50.0%



Jordan's average difference = 4.23% higher.
Kobe's average difference = 0.33% higher.


What you smoking troll??? :biggums:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=256829&page=2

[Sharmer]

Lebron going to destroy the Pacers, Chicago got a way with a lot of dirty play.

[Magic 32]

Lebron going to destroy the Pacers, Chicago got a way with a lot of dirty play.

http://scoophunters.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Michael-Jordan.jpg

[Sharmer]

http://scoophunters.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Michael-Jordan.jpg

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q750/Vicsatre/oie_293202uSjmU2Di_zps81826696.gif (http://s1357.photobucket.com/user/Vicsatre/media/oie_293202uSjmU2Di_zps81826696.gif.html)

[ripthekik]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2588879/lebronchokes.gif

[plowking]

Jimmy B locked his ISO game up BIG TIME

Yeah, him and Noah, and Boozer and Gibson, who met him at the ring every time Lebron blew by him. :oldlol:

If there is anything I took away from that series, its how overrated Butler got. I actually thought he was a better defender before the series.

[plowking]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2588879/lebronchokes.gif

Great defense by the whole Bulls team. Can't sag off Lebron like you can Kobe, like most teams do.

[chosen_wun]

Butler did a good job.

But LeBron is never really worried about his intial defender. Its once he gets past Butler he then has to brace himself for the 2nd layer of defense. So a lot of the time he will size up Butler, see the help d (2nd layer) and then elect to kick it back out because he knows whats waiting for him at the rim. People think he is forced to do this because of Butler's godly on-ball defense but that isnt the case.

Now LeBron's first step is not so explosive, naturally because of his size. So then he has to start from 27-30 ft out in order to get a full course of speed and blow past his defender. The problem with that is he is then giving the help D more time to prepare by starting his move so far out.

Again Butler did his job, but its not so black and white. There were other factors that played into LeBron's struggles.

Other times

[Ne 1]

So pretty much you're saying Lebron should of took bad shots? I'm not getting anything else out of your post but he should of took bad shots.

No. His actual BEST game of the entire streak and most impressive was against OKC when he said to hell with the FG% protection, played the game the right, natural, organic way ... he had his most proving performance. Hitting shots, that he should be taking v.s. OKC when no one else was getting things done. And he out played Durant and shined as the best player in the game.

He played with that game 6 last year against Boston with that mentality. When Bron plays "**** it" I want to win mode, and does things naturally without being too self aware of stupid shit like FG% WHILE IN GAME ... he is right there with MJ as the best player I've ever seen.

Problem is his mentality. He rarely plays like this .... that game on the road in OKC was his only truly impressive game of that entire February streak that got so over hyped and overrated because it was contrived performances.

[All Net]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2588879/lebronchokes.gif

And you wonder why your threads get deleted?

[HoopsFanNumero1]

No. His actual BEST game of the entire streak and most impressive was against OKC when he said to hell with the FG% protection, played the game the right, natural, organic way ... he had his most proving performance. Hitting shots, that he should be taking v.s. OKC when no one else was getting things done. And he out played Durant and shined as the best player in the game.

He played with that game 6 last year against Boston with that mentality. When Bron plays "**** it" I want to win mode, and does things naturally without being too self aware of stupid shit like FG% WHILE IN GAME ... he is right there with MJ as the best player I've ever seen.

Problem is his mentality. He rarely plays like this .... that game on the road in OKC was his only truly impressive game of that entire February streak that got so over hyped and overrated because it was contrived performances.

Did you just copy SamuraiSwish's entire comment? :facepalm

And he had plenty of good performances in the streak. Just off the top of my head, the comebacks against the Knicks, Cavs, and Celtics.

[chosen_wun]

All this dude ever does is copy peoples comments :lol

He should have read it over though, because in the middle it states that LeBron is the best player up there with Jordan, and I know the Kobe stan would never agree with that.

[Greg Oden 50]

LeBron is the most overrated player since Kobe Bryant at 2009 :banana:

[K Xerxes]

There are times when LeBron's game is quite contrived, but he only does this when his team is winning comfortably. For example, he may drop 20 points in the first half, but by the second half he is far more focused on passing or just generally putting on a show. I don't know what's so bad about that as long as it is ultimately ending up in a win.

When he is required, he will do whatever it takes to win games. Even when he isn't shooting well, he understands that he should pass, rebound and defend. When he is shooting well and the game is huge, he will dominate on that part (game 6).

[NattyPButter]

when did shooting 44% become bad?

[ripthekik]

And you wonder why your threads get deleted?
If I make a thread that is relevant, what does all of this matter? Threads should be judged by their content, not the OP.

[pauk]

There are times when LeBron's game is quite contrived, but he only does this when his team is winning comfortably. For example, he may drop 20 points in the first half, but by the second half he is far more focused on passing or just generally putting on a show. I don't know what's so bad about that as long as it is ultimately ending up in a win.

When he is required, he will do whatever it takes to win games. Even when he isn't shooting well, he understands that he should pass, rebound and defend. When he is shooting well and the game is huge, he will dominate on that part (game 6).

This.


One more thing... Shooting 44% on very low FGA while focusing in on everything else to impact the game is different than 44% FG on ~30FGA, that is 17 missed shots, 17 wasted offensive possessions.... while not doing anything else... That is very detrimental to the outcome of the game...

[All Net]

If I make a thread that is relevant, what does all of this matter? Threads should be judged by their content, not the OP.

If your threads were purely about basketball there would be no problem. The problem is you post these topics to troll/bait and annoy people. Which is not something that we want on here.

You hate Lebron? fine, if you talk purely about basketball and make legit points your threads/posts won't get deleted. Thats what it comes down to.

Troll/Agenda based threads will always be removed. There isn't some agenda against you and there are no mods who love Lebron. Even though you think otherwise. It would be the same if the agenda was against any other player.