ISH Posters and their fixation with a referee conspiracy

[Kews1]

Honestly all these fools who constantly moan and bitch about referees and David Stern fixing games are ****ing fools. Do you know how hard it is to referee a game at full speed without the ability to use replays except for the last 2 minutes? All of you ****er's who sit on your couch and think that because you can make perfect calls through the use of replays and conversely think that the ref's are purposely making those calls wrong to benefit one team or the other but in reality their just making mistakes? Of course they make the wrong calls, sometimes those wrong calls will benefit one team more than the other. Im sure some games (a drastic minority) in history have been fixed, but to think that every game is predetermined is just ridiculous , your such children GTFOH STFU. :facepalm

[Jameerthefear]

Yeah but they are missing OBVIOUS calls. You think that 24 second mess this series was a tough call to make? No. They are paid over 100k a year. The fans should keep complaining.

[Purch]

The whining from Heat fans after game 4, followed by the encore performance by people whining about the refs after game 5

[NumberSix]

Miami Heat. BULLY.

[DaSeba5]

The whining from Heat fans after game 4, followed by the encore performance by people whining about the refs after game 5

The irony is that even though Heat fans were pissed about that game and were annoying, people started to make troll threads to troll those Heat fans, and it just made them more annoying than the Heat fans who were whining in the first place. It made this place a clusterfvck of annoying trolls after game 4.

[b0bab0i]

http://i746.photobucket.com/albums/xx110/etakor365/Knicks/nba_where_flop_happens_zps75258a70.gif

[Sumter15]

There's no consistency. People in general are more willing to overlook bad calls if they benefit the team they like (or when they go against a team they don't like). Then they try to point out the hypocrisy on one side without noticing their own hypocrisy.

Personally the complaining about refs is freaking annoying, no matter who does it.

[chips93]

its sad to me, that there are fans out there who cant just enjoy the game, instead deciding to complain during literally every gaem thread about officiating.

they are missing out

[LongLiveTheKing]

http://i746.photobucket.com/albums/xx110/etakor365/Knicks/nba_where_flop_happens_zps75258a70.gif
This is really ironic when I looked at your avi.

[Jameerthefear]

This is really ironic when I looked at your avi.
:roll:

[b0bab0i]

This is really ironic when I looked at your avi.
Thats CP3 on the new logo. :rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

[Xsatyr]

The refereeing has been garbage for the past couple years and it's getting worse. Fans are going to complain, it's only natural. I think everyone just wants consistency.

[Lebron23]

Honestly all these fools who constantly moan and bitch about referees and David Stern fixing games are ****ing fools. Do you know how hard it is to referee a game at full speed without the ability to use replays except for the last 2 minutes? All of you ****er's who sit on your couch and think that because you can make perfect calls through the use of replays and conversely think that the ref's are purposely making those calls wrong to benefit one team or the other but in reality their just making mistakes? Of course they make the wrong calls, sometimes those wrong calls will benefit one team more than the other. Im sure some games (a drastic minority) in history have been fixed, but to think that every game is predetermined is just ridiculous , your such children GTFOH STFU. :facepalm


Most of these guys are a bunch of F@gs. Maybe they need to apply as an NBA Referee.

This is actually a good series way better than that boring Western Conference Finals.

[TheReal Kendall]

I just want the refs to be consistent. I don't have a horse in this race but the refs have been ruining the game of bball for me.

[NumberSix]

I just want the refs to be consistent. I don't have a horse in this race but the refs have been ruining the game of bball for me.
No you don't. You want them to be decidedly against Miami.

[BasedTom]

This is really ironic when I looked at your avi.
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[Straight_Ballin]

Honestly all these fools who constantly moan and bitch about referees and David Stern fixing games are ****ing fools. Do you know how hard it is to referee a game at full speed without the ability to use replays except for the last 2 minutes? All of you ****er's who sit on your couch and think that because you can make perfect calls through the use of replays and conversely think that the ref's are purposely making those calls wrong to benefit one team or the other but in reality their just making mistakes? Of course they make the wrong calls, sometimes those wrong calls will benefit one team more than the other. Im sure some games (a drastic minority) in history have been fixed, but to think that every game is predetermined is just ridiculous , your such children GTFOH STFU. :facepalm

Has the game dramatically change from 5 years ago? I ask because the quality of officiating has gotten worse and worse each year. I realize stern needs to progressively fix games over a course of time to make it less obvious, but watch the calls in this game to ECF games of the last 4 years and the shitty calls this year are >>>>> than subsequent years.

Good try, but your post couldn't be further from the truth.

[tpols]

http://i746.photobucket.com/albums/xx110/etakor365/Knicks/nba_where_flop_happens_zps75258a70.gif
ROFL

No one thinks its fixed.. just dumbass refs being dumbasses.

Honestly, they have been god awful.. on both sides. The past two games they have crushed momentum for both teams numerous times.. theyre literally retarded.

And Bird man allowed to DECK Hansborough, and then get in his face like hes about to start a fight when kid did nothing wrong lol.. HE was the one that got decked and that somehow pissed Birdman off. Like.. WTF?

And then the one ref was holding birdman back and tweety was trying to fight through the ref to get at hansborough who was chilling not going at him.

If theres no game 6 suspension there Im gonna lose my shit.

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

Miami is like 15-3 or something ridiculous with Dan Crawford as ref

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

from 2012

Heat in Playoffs Since 2004

Dan Crawford games All Others
Heat W-L 13-3 (.813) 48-40 (.545)
vs. Spread 11-4-1 (.719) 41-44-3 (.483)
PPG diff +6.4 +1.6
Foul diff PG -0.3 -0.9
FTA diff PG +1.9 +2.7

[305Baller]

Does Tim "Vegas" Donaghy ring a bell ?

[poido123]

The NBA has been fixed and tainted since the Jordan era?

The first 4 games mean jackshit in the scheme of things, whether one team was getting favourable calls or the other. If you saw bad ones in pacers favour, dont you think that acts as a pretty good smokescreen for whats about to happen after game 4?

Some people need to think outside the square a bit, the NBA has never been the same since it became big business.

2002 was proven to be rigged, similar situation actually. Miami has the star power and ratings, much like those laker teams. Pacers were like the kings in that they had a fanbase, but nowhere near what Lakers had.

Game 5 was always gonna be miami's. pacers had double the foul count to Miami for most of the game. On top of that, Dan Crawford who has one of the league's worst records in favour of the Heat team was reffing this pivotal game, coincidence? I think not.

Look, its unfortunate that people are very sceptical of conspiracies and dismiss anything like one. But I have clearly stated why i believe it to be the case(with evidence) and of course I will get flamed for being a hater or whatever else.

I love basketball, but this f*ggot flopping league catering big business superstars has taken away alot of the things I used to love about watching the NBA.

[Straight_Ballin]

The NBA has been fixed and tainted since the Jordan era?

The first 4 games mean jackshit in the scheme of things, whether one team was getting favourable calls or the other. If you saw bad ones in pacers favour, dont you think that acts as a pretty good smokescreen for whats about to happen after game 4?

Some people need to think outside the square a bit, the NBA has never been the same since it became big business.

2002 was proven to be rigged, similar situation actually. Miami has the star power and ratings, much like those laker teams. Pacers were like the kings in that they had a fanbase, but nowhere near what Lakers had.

Game 5 was always gonna be miami's. pacers had double the foul count to Miami for most of the game. On top of that, Dan Crawford who has one of the league's worst records in favour of the Heat team was reffing this pivotal game, coincidence? I think not.

Look, its unfortunate that people are very sceptical of conspiracies and dismiss anything like one. But I have clearly stated why i believe it to be the case(with evidence) and of course I will get flamed for being a hater or whatever else.

I love basketball, but this f*ggot flopping league catering big business superstars has taken away alot of the things I used to love about watching the NBA.

Dont worry, I'm sure some Stan will be along soon enough to contradict your claim with hearsay rather than solid evidence and proof.

[oh the horror]

It isn't just ISH though. You're starting to hear the comments from analysts as well.

[Shepseskaf]

There was a very good thread a few weeks ago on how refs influence games. They can't "rig" them, but on certain occasions a specific team is given every single advantage the officials can provide, in a systematic and deliberate manner.

People who go on rants about how 'conspiracy theorists' are fools are ironically fools themselves. The evidence has been piling up for decades that something is very corrupt with NBA officials.

[305Baller]

Its not only in Basketball, it happens in all sports where there are human referees that can (consciously or not) put their "stamp" in the game.

[poido123]

There was a very good thread a few weeks ago on how refs influence games. They can't "rig" them, but on certain occasions a specific team is given every single advantage the officials can provide, in a systematic and deliberate manner.

People who go on rants about how 'conspiracy theorists' are fools are ironically fools themselves. The evidence has been piling up for decades that something is very corrupt with NBA officials.

It's hard to get mostly young teenagers and early 20 guys on ISH to understand this concept. Many of whom only started watching basketball in the last 10 years. So their experience of the NBA, is the one that is catered to stars and soft officiating.

If they had of grown up watching the 80's 90's basketball, they might have had quite a different view on how the game has changed so much, particularly during the end and after Jordan's reign. It's hilarious that these guys dismiss any notion of a conspiracy or rigged games/series, when they have known nothing different to the type of basketball that is played today.

[plowking]

Miami is like 15-3 or something ridiculous with Dan Crawford as ref

So pretty much on point with their normal winning percentage? :roll:

[plowking]

The NBA has been fixed and tainted since the Jordan era?

The first 4 games mean jackshit in the scheme of things, whether one team was getting favourable calls or the other. If you saw bad ones in pacers favour, dont you think that acts as a pretty good smokescreen for whats about to happen after game 4?

Some people need to think outside the square a bit, the NBA has never been the same since it became big business.

2002 was proven to be rigged, similar situation actually. Miami has the star power and ratings, much like those laker teams. Pacers were like the kings in that they had a fanbase, but nowhere near what Lakers had.

Game 5 was always gonna be miami's. pacers had double the foul count to Miami for most of the game. On top of that, Dan Crawford who has one of the league's worst records in favour of the Heat team was reffing this pivotal game, coincidence? I think not.

Look, its unfortunate that people are very sceptical of conspiracies and dismiss anything like one. But I have clearly stated why i believe it to be the case(with evidence) and of course I will get flamed for being a hater or whatever else.

I love basketball, but this f*ggot flopping league catering big business superstars has taken away alot of the things I used to love about watching the NBA.


All of Jordan's rings were fake and helped by the referees. What now?

[dannysc305]

True story OP. Does anybody on this forum play streetball? And voluntarily tried to officiate a heated game before because a couple ******* kept stopping the game and calling ticky tacky fouls? that ish is hard af.I was telling my brother while we were watching the game imagine how hard it is to make some of these calls REAL TIME. FULL SPEED. NBA PLAYOFF LEVEL TEMPO. NO REPLAY. 50/50. ARENA FULL OF PEOPLE GOING APE SHIT ON YOU. THE PRESSURE. THE FANS. THE COACHES. THE PLAYERS. THE MEDIA. Its a tough job man alot of the times at the Park I cant even make the basic calls like a borderline out of bounds, who touched it last, etc.

[poido123]

All of Jordan's rings were fake and helped by the referees. What now?

...nice troll.

[poido123]

So pretty much on point with their normal winning percentage? :roll:

Deny, deny, deny. You're like a politician.

[Kews1]

Nobody denies that games have probably been fixed in the past. But an overwhelming majority of the time its just the refs making a bad call. Complain about the call itself all you want. But most of the time thats where it ends, most of the time the refs are not fixing there calls in favor of one team or another their just making the call the believe to be correct. When people consistently claim that teams are being screwed by refs because they think they have proof based on the past, or because there is a large free-throw difference or any other reason, it just diminishes what the teams are doing. More often then not the best team wins, the reason the best team wins is not because the refs tilt the game in their favor but because they are simply better. :rant

[iamgine]

Sometimes there are calls that is just bizarre. A referee 5 foot away didn't call any foul but a referee 60 feet away calls it even though the players back are turned and he can't possibly see the action as clear as the nearer ref.

[Kews1]

Has the game dramatically change from 5 years ago? I ask because the quality of officiating has gotten worse and worse each year. I realize stern needs to progressively fix games over a course of time to make it less obvious, but watch the calls in this game to ECF games of the last 4 years and the shitty calls this year are >>>>> than subsequent years.

Good try, but your post couldn't be further from the truth.

Your an idiot, how would Stern fixing more games but it less obvious isnt that itself self-contradictory. Your just writing anything, where is your proof that the officiating is getting worse, do you really have anything to back up what your saying as factual, or do you just like to believe that in your own world you can see something that everybody else cant.

[plowking]

...nice troll.

If you honestly think Jordan was a saint and earned everything, clearly you're not too much older than the crowd you're insulting.
If you can't remember the murmurs and backlash Jordan got from opposing fans after the refereeing in the 96 finals, then lol.

That was as bad a series as I've ever seen. Couldn't touch Jordan. Yet you never hear about it because of how beloved Jordan was. There are plenty more too, but not nearly as bad.


Deny, deny, deny. You're like a politician.

What am I denying. Its on point with their winning percentage this season, and this is some kind of conspiracy? :oldlol:

[poido123]

All of Jordan's rings were fake and helped by the referees. What now?

You actually believe that?

Please tell me you're trolling.. :roll:

While I agree jordan had help at times from the refs, most stars do, he didn't need it.

Leflop James and this big business orientated league, guys are being propped up to be the next Jordan or money making machine like Jordan was, only that the reffing has changed the rules, have changed to cater for the big business stars and teams and you wouldn't dare explain or address the 2002 debacle and explain why this Heat team is any different with the systematic reffing.

Jordan helped by referees? Sure. Rings were fake? Comon man, try getting someone in here to agree with you on ISH :lol: Comon I dare you :roll:

[Kews1]

Sometimes there are calls that is just bizarre. A referee 5 foot away didn't call any foul but a referee 60 feet away calls it even though the players back are turned and he can't possibly see the action as clear as the nearer ref.

Agreed, but is it not true that the most important aspect of making the decision is actually the angle at which you are in relation to the play not the distance. If we agree that generally the ref's are not at an extreme distance at which their eyesight inhibits their ability then for instance even if somebody is 60 feet away they may be in a better position to make a call, e.g seeing a block/contest from side on to see if their is arm contact rather than seeing it from the back and not always being able to see contact. Or another example would be being horizontally aligned to the backboard to see if the ball hits the backboard and is a goal tend rather than being directly in front of it.

[poido123]

Agreed, but is it not true that the most important aspect of making the decision is actually the angle at which you are in relation to the play not the distance. If we agree that generally the ref's are not at an extreme distance at which their eyesight inhibits their ability then for instance even if somebody is 60 feet away they may be in a better position to make a call, e.g seeing a block/contest from side on to see if their is arm contact rather than seeing it from the back and not always being able to see contact. Or another example would be being horizontally aligned to the backboard to see if the ball hits the backboard and is a goal tend rather than being directly in front of it.

If the 2002 thing happened, why do you wholeheartedly think fixed games/series are still not happening now? How do you know for sure?

[plowking]

You actually believe that?

Please tell me you're trolling.. :roll:

While I agree jordan had help at times from the refs, most stars do, he didn't need it.

Leflop James and this big business orientated league, guys are being propped up to be the next Jordan or money making machine like Jordan was, only that the reffing has changed the rules, have changed to cater for the big business stars and teams and you wouldn't dare explain or address the 2002 debacle and explain why this Heat team is any different with the systematic reffing.

Jordan helped by referees? Sure. Rings were fake? Comon man, try get someone in here to agree with you on ISH :lol: Comon I dare you :roll:

How f*cking stupid are you that you can't see you're being mocked?

How much of a retard are you that you think this series is rigged? Were our 12 free throws today too much for your over-complaining, whining, bitch made ass? How many did you want us to receive? Less than double digits as a team?
Was it too much for you that we outshot the Pacers from the field, from 3pt land, had less turnovers, more steals, more blocks, more assists, 7 more made field goals?
What calls you incompetent sooky c*nt? Did we really get too many? How about we don't shoot a f*cking free throw next time?

****ing ****. Eat a bag of d!cks you wanker.

[Kews1]

If the 2002 thing happened, why do you wholeheartedly think fixed games/series are still not happening now? How do you know for sure?

I dont know for sure, none of us can definitively say that it is one way or the other without being David Stern or the referees himself. But, you cannot systematically fix games,because it is illegal (Obviously this itself dosnt stop people) and if this was an ongoing reoccurring phenomenon then it would have been absolutely discovered and brought to the attention of the public. The government and the sporting and anti-corruption control bodies would have known about it. WHY? Because players and referees would have come forward and let it be known that that is the case. Now Tim Donaghy you may say came forward and let it be known, well i hardly take the word of one to be absolute fact he probably has a point on a minute scale but not one the reaches the entire ongoing NBA game scheudal. Plus Donaghy was betting on point spread, this means he was putting money the the score or score differential which its a completely individual thing, its him doing things for his own benefit and not the league. He was fired and went to jail - OF COURSE HE WANTS TO DISCREDIT THE LEAGUE AND DOWNPLAY HIS OWN DISCREPANCIES. If there is match fixing then it means that people are in on it, referees, players, coaches, media etc. If its really true then many people would have said something. People just play join the dots, people want to believe that because they see one thing and their explanation fits that it means its true when it dosnt, people are naturally suspicious but that dosnt make those suspicious warranted. .

[Legends66NBA7]

Nothing is fixed.

The End.

[AintNoSunshine]

After the calls at the end of gm4, my eyes automatically censor out everything that implies the ref helping Miami. I'm not going to believe any of it.

[poido123]

How f*cking stupid are you that you can't see you're being mocked?

How much of a retard are you that you think this series is rigged? Were our 12 free throws today too much for your over-complaining, whining, bitch made ass? How many did you want us to receive? Less than double digits as a team?
Was it too much for you that we outshot the Pacers from the field, from 3pt land, had less turnovers, more steals, more blocks, more assists, 7 more made field goals?
What calls you incompetent sooky c*nt? Did we really get too many? How about we don't shoot a f*cking free throw next time?

****ing ****. Eat a bag of d!cks you wanker.

Pacers had double the foul count for most of the game, I called it before this game started the fix was in. Like the first 4 games mattered, because that's what you and the other Heat f*ggots like to point out :facepalm:

You have analysts pointing out ref bias and something is fishy and I should listen to you a Heat fan? :lol:

Key game 5, 2-2.

Like I know you understand momentum, but you give no credit to it since you only like to point to the stats and say that's what happened after Heat won. I could also point out that, the league has been brought into disrepute before, yet Im crazy to think there is no more fixing in the game? F*ck you stupid ignorant c*nt.

I'd be ashamed to support a team full of flopping, traitorous cheats who are catered for by the league.

[Ai2death]

You actually believe that?

Please tell me you're trolling.. :roll:

While I agree jordan had help at times from the refs, most stars do, he didn't need it.

Leflop James and this big business orientated league, guys are being propped up to be the next Jordan or money making machine like Jordan was, only that the reffing has changed the rules, have changed to cater for the big business stars and teams and you wouldn't dare explain or address the 2002 debacle and explain why this Heat team is any different with the systematic reffing.

Jordan helped by referees? Sure. Rings were fake? Comon man, try getting someone in here to agree with you on ISH :lol: Comon I dare you :roll:


Don't pay any attention to PLOWKING, dudes a flat out troll... or just blindly obsessed by his love for the heat or lebron.
Not every game is fixed, but come playoffs, the refs calls do tend to get alot worse and bizarre.
Also there's the inconsistencies. As everyones already pointed out, Nazr and Birdman.
All I know is, In my opinion, I've noticed some calls that appear to be a blatent form of rigging, however, we will not know how much it will effect the out come until this 7 game series is over.

[Ai2death]

Pacers had double the foul count for most of the game, I called it before this game started the fix was in. Like the first 4 games mattered, because that's what you and the other Heat f*ggots like to point out :facepalm:

You have analysts pointing out ref bias and something is fishy and I should listen to you a Heat fan? :lol:

Key game 5, 2-2.

Like I know you understand momentum, but you give no credit to it since you only like to point to the stats and say that's what happened after Heat won. I could also point out that, the league has been brought into disrepute before, yet Im crazy to think there is no more fixing in the game? F*ck you stupid ignorant c*nt.

I'd be ashamed to support a team full of flopping, traitorous cheats who are catered for by the league.

I'm ashamed to even watch the nba knowing the face of the league is a mental midget and one of the biggest floppers to play the game for his size and athletic qualities, plus his arrogance. Pfffttt... Given.. not earned.

[Kews1]

I'm ashamed to even watch the nba knowing the face of the league is a mental midget and one of the biggest floppers to play the game for his size and athletic qualities, plus his arrogance. Pfffttt... Given.. not earned.

This shit again :coleman:

[ripthekik]

I'm ashamed to even watch the nba knowing the face of the league is a mental midget and one of the biggest floppers to play the game for his size and athletic qualities, plus his arrogance. Pfffttt... Given.. not earned.
correct.

[plowking]

Pacers had double the foul count for most of the game, I called it before this game started the fix was in. Like the first 4 games mattered, because that's what you and the other Heat f*ggots like to point out :facepalm:

You have analysts pointing out ref bias and something is fishy and I should listen to you a Heat fan? :lol:

Key game 5, 2-2.

Like I know you understand momentum, but you give no credit to it since you only like to point to the stats and say that's what happened after Heat won. I could also point out that, the league has been brought into disrepute before, yet Im crazy to think there is no more fixing in the game? F*ck you stupid ignorant c*nt.

I'd be ashamed to support a team full of flopping, traitorous cheats who are catered for by the league.

Lebron fouled out at the end of game 4 with an off the ball OFFENSIVE foul after hitting a huge 3. Heat with a chance to tie it or take the lead. Is that momentum?
Calling an offensive foul on Bron again in the 3rd quarter right at the end and having Stephenson nail a 3 pointer to extend the lead as the 3rd quarter ends. Momentum changer?
Paul George receiving 3 free throws on a jumpshot 5 feet behind the 3 point line. Is that a momentum changer?

Key game? Game 5? Its the playoffs, they're all key you knob.

Double the foul count? 19 to 11... All the fouls on their least important players. Hill and Stephenson who played like shit. Who cares about the fouls? So what, they stopped the game and gave the Heat an inbound? Holy shit, rigging... :rolleyes:

You're a wanker, who is being a little sour puss c*nt because you're team is shit, and a team you despise shat on your team. Get over it. Aren't you in your twenties? Move on you wanker.

[plowking]

I'm ashamed to even watch the nba knowing the face of the league is a mental midget and one of the biggest floppers to play the game for his size and athletic qualities, plus his arrogance. Pfffttt... Given.. not earned.

F@ggot.

Simple posts like this is the only way to deal with you idiots.

[Kews1]

correct.

your not invited to my thread. :coleman:

[ripthekik]

your not invited to my thread. :coleman:
f your thread.
Refs came through in the beginning of the 3rd to stop pacers from having any run at all. PG got his 4th early. Pacers big men stopped getting calls. It gave an open path to Lebron. Anyone watching would know.

[Lebron23]

I'm ashamed to even watch the nba knowing the face of the league is a mental midget and one of the biggest floppers to play the game for his size and athletic qualities, plus his arrogance. Pfffttt... Given.. not earned.


He already won a championship while 6'1" Rose is still afraid to return in the NBA. Get the F*ck out of here. LeBron is greater than your favorite NBA Player, and he's not a coward B1tch like Rose.

[Kews1]

f your thread.
Refs came through in the beginning of the 3rd to stop pacers from having any run at all. PG got his 4th early. Pacers big men stopped getting calls. It gave an open path to Lebron. Anyone watching would know.

sure sure :hammerhead:

[Shepseskaf]

I dont know for sure, none of us can definitively say that it is one way or the other without being David Stern or the referees himself. But, you cannot systematically fix games,because it is illegal (Obviously this itself dosnt stop people) and if this was an ongoing reoccurring phenomenon then it would have been absolutely discovered and brought to the attention of the public. The government and the sporting and anti-corruption control bodies would have known about it. WHY? Because players and referees would have come forward and let it be known that that is the case.
This is naive, idealistic logic from someone who obvious doesn't know how the world really works.

No one directly associated with the NBA -- owners, players or referees -- would benefit from "coming forward" and outing a corrupt system. They're all very comfortable with the way things are now. Money is flowing and everyone is paid.

Plus, while the blatant influencing the outcomes of games is very obvious to just about anyone watching, it would be difficult to prove because of compartmentalization, in that every participant in the corruption is only given a certain amount of information. No one but the head honchos would know the big picture, and the chances of one of them testifying is slim to none.

That's how crime syndicates are able to avoid prosecution, because the bit players can't provide enough evidence to convict the one's in control.

[Kews1]

This is naive, idealistic logic from someone who obvious doesn't know how the world really works.

No one directly associated with the NBA -- owners, players or referees -- would benefit from "coming forward" and outing a corrupt system. They're all very comfortable with the way things are now. Money is flowing and everyone is paid.

Plus, while the blatant influencing the outcomes of games is very obvious to just about anyone watching, it would be difficult to prove because of compartmentalization, in that every participant in the corruption is only given a certain amount of information. No one but the head honchos would know the big picture, and the chances of one of them testifying is slim to none.

That's how crime syndicates are able to avoid prosecution, because the bit players can't provide enough evidence to convict the one's in control.

Its not naive, your just automatically assuming the worst, you work you way backwards into a system of trying to prove its happening when the logical starting point is that it is not happening. Calling somebody naive because you try to push an agenda of "the world is a mean place" is just bullshit. Trying to push agenda of you dont understand the realities so im going to try and make you seem out of touch with reality. Dont be so foolishly predictable.

And no there are owners who would not just sit back and accept dirty practices. For instance the teams which are really in it to win and the team's who lose money. You think the teams who lose money would be willing to be pawns in a system where the teams with the biggest following have the scales tilted in their favor which in turn leads to them losing money? And what about the players who are screwed out of a chance to win. It isnt a system that benefit's everyone your wrong and its wrong to put that out and assume that.

[poido123]

Lebron fouled out at the end of game 4 with an off the ball OFFENSIVE foul after hitting a huge 3. Heat with a chance to tie it or take the lead. Is that momentum?

Heat were up 2-1. Smokescreen to make you believe like the series is not rigged. Irrelevant.

Calling an offensive foul on Bron again in the 3rd quarter right at the end and having Stephenson nail a 3 pointer to extend the lead as the 3rd quarter ends. Momentum changer?

You're totally ignoring the point I'm making, the series going 6 games is what the league wanted. Now they want Heat through.


Paul George receiving 3 free throws on a jumpshot 5 feet behind the 3 point line. Is that a momentum changer?

Key game? Game 5? Its the playoffs, they're all key you knob.

Not really, if the refs are on your side, the first 4 means little.



Double the foul count? 19 to 11... All the fouls on their least important players. Hill and Stephenson who played like shit. Who cares about the fouls? So what, they stopped the game and gave the Heat an inbound? Holy shit, rigging... :rolleyes:

You're a wanker, who is being a little sour puss c*nt because you're team is shit, and a team you despise shat on your team. Get over it. Aren't you in your twenties? Move on you wanker.


A f*ggot Heat fan who will do anything to deflect from a valid point. Your boy Lequeen is the biggest bitch-made star the league has seen.

Comon Lequeen, flop some more, go on, its good for the team :facepalm:

[plowking]

[/B]

A f*ggot Heat fan who will do anything to deflect from a valid point. Your boy Lequeen is the biggest bitch-made star the league has seen.

Comon Lequeen, flop some more, go on, its good for the team :facepalm:

Exactly. I'll just enjoy the win.


F@ggot.

[Shepseskaf]

Its not naive, your just automatically assuming the worst, you work you way backwards into a system of trying to prove its happening when the logical starting point is that it is not happening. Calling somebody naive because you try to push an agenda of "the world is a mean place" is just bullshit. Trying to push agenda of you dont understand the realities so im going to try and make you seem out of touch with reality. Dont be so foolishly predictable.

And no there are owners who would not just sit back and accept dirty practices. For instance the teams which are really in it to win and the team's who lose money. You think the teams who lose money would be willing to be pawns in a system where the teams with the biggest following have the scales tilted in their favor which in turn leads to them losing money? And what about the players who are screwed out of a chance to win. It isnt a system that benefit's everyone your wrong and its wrong to put that out and assume that.
Obviously, you don't realize it, and won't acknowledge it, but virtually everything you just posted is incorrect.

I'm not pushing an "agenda", I'm watching the evidence right in front of my eyes. The widespread allegations of crooked NBA refs didn't just spring up overnight.

NFL and baseball refs make boneheaded mistakes on occasion, but there is no general consensus of an organized conspiracy, as there definitely is with the NBA. Why is that?

As inept a commissioner as Goodell is, I firmly believe he would immediately take steps to correct even the appearance of game influencing by refs. Stern has not done so for over three decades. What does that tell you?

The owners enjoy revenue sharing, and other such benefits, and will do nothing to change the current system.

Whether you choose to face up to it, or not, there are obvious, glaring problems with NBA officiating and nothing is being done to correct them.

[Ai2death]

He already won a championship while 6'1" Rose is still afraid to return in the NBA. Get the F*ck out of here. LeBron is greater than your favorite NBA Player, and he's not a coward B1tch like Rose.

Won? I think you mean gift wrapped..

And as for Rose being my favorite player? His not, but one thing he is, is more man then LeBitch.
You would never see Rose leave his team to team up with 2 other all stars to ring chase. He'd make players come to him.

You're excused for your dillusion cause I know once the heat is no longer the top team, you won't be a fan of theirs any longer.

[monkeypox]

Yeah some facts that people need to understand:

1. Stern actually doesn't have that much control over the refs. They have their own union and it's really hard for Stern to fine of suspend anyone. Senior refs have the most power. They're actually secretly fined and suspended, all without interference from the league.

2. Most people who complain don't even know the very rules they're complaining about. Just go into any thread about something as simple as traveling and you'll get 20 different versions of what traveling is.

3. Refs aren't there to make every call. They're there to specifically see if one player or team is breaking the rules to gain an unfair advantage. Their goal is to police these rules while affecting the flow of the game as little as possible. Their mantra is game control and it's very fluid. A certain amount of contact earlier in the game might be let go, but if the game gets really physical and guys are starting to get out of control, that same amount of contact becomes a foul. Everything is context based.

4. Donaghy, an admitted dirty ref, never fixed the outcome of games, only random prop bets. Which may have influenced the outcome, but his shenanigans were never directed at the outcome. Furthermore, in his tell all book he never mentions the league telling him how to officiate games. He has no reason to cover up game fixing in the league, yet the best he can come up with is a senior ref saying "well we know who the league wants to win, yuk yuk." and refs being told which fouls to look out for. Some think that's shady but every game gets reviewed after it's over and the next crew is told to look out for anything specific. Like if X team is starting to use lots of moving screens, the next crew might get a note to watch for moving screens. A vast majority of these notes come from fellow refs, but on few occasions they come from the league office. This is probably the most influence the league has over the refs.

5. anything can be made to look like a conspiracy after the fact. It's possible this year that we may end up with a Pacers Spurs finals, which will probably be the lowest viewed finals of all time. Yet I'm sure if that happens, people can invent reasons why it makes sense. I've seen some convoluted scenarios detailing every single one of the Spurs titles, despite the drastically low ratings their games bring.

[Shepseskaf]

Yeah some facts that people need to understand:

1. Stern actually doesn't have that much control over the refs.
Stopped reading right there.

Are you some kind of NBA troll paid to convince gullible people that nothing is wrong with the current refereeing system?

If you don't understand that Dictator Stern is in complete control of everything that happens in the league, then you don't understand anything at all.

[poido123]

Exactly. I'll just enjoy the win.


F@ggot.


Cheating scum. Your fanbase are the worst on here and that's not just me sayin that.

I put an asterisk on anything the Heat have done since Lequeen quit on the Cavs and straight into an armchair ride...

You should know better. I think it would be better for you guys if you just openly admitted to what everyone else sees and get off the Heat's nuts for a while.

Lebron openly admitting flopping(cheating), exposed refs and fixed series games(tim donaghy 2002) are just proof of what I have been saying and making you look really stupid for calling me dumb :facepalm: *****t.

[Kews1]

Stopped reading right there.

Are you some kind of NBA troll paid to convince gullible people that nothing is wrong with the current refereeing system?

If you don't understand that Dictator Stern is in complete control of everything that happens in the league, then you don't understand anything at all.

Its common that referees and the control organisation are kept separate for the exact reason that they cant manipulate things :facepalm

[poido123]

Yeah some facts that people need to understand:

1. Stern actually doesn't have that much control over the refs. They have their own union and it's really hard for Stern to fine of suspend anyone. Senior refs have the most power. They're actually secretly fined and suspended, all without interference from the league.

I don't know what's worse.

They also may be known to be "company men"

2. Most people who complain don't even know the very rules they're complaining about. Just go into any thread about something as simple as traveling and you'll get 20 different versions of what traveling is.

I think you're refering to the travelling incident of Wade. For anyone who has seen that, it is difficult to determine one way or another, but according to some known refs, it wasn't a travel.

3. Refs aren't there to make every call. They're there to specifically see if one player or team is breaking the rules to gain an unfair advantage. Their goal is to police these rules while affecting the flow of the game as little as possible. Their mantra is game control and it's very fluid. A certain amount of contact earlier in the game might be let go, but if the game gets really physical and guys are starting to get out of control, that same amount of contact becomes a foul. Everything is context based.

Ok, this is the key point and that is why reffing can influence a result. If you can control a game's physicality by calling a game more closely, then that means the refs can control when and what time of a game to influence the momentum of a game. So really, this point only highlights what I've been saying.

4. Donaghy, an admitted dirty ref, never fixed the outcome of games, only random prop bets. Which may have influenced the outcome, but his shenanigans were never directed at the outcome. Furthermore, in his tell all book he never mentions the league telling him how to officiate games. He has no reason to cover up game fixing in the league, yet the best he can come up with is a senior ref saying "well we know who the league wants to win, yuk yuk." and refs being told which fouls to look out for. Some think that's shady but every game gets reviewed after it's over and the next crew is told to look out for anything specific. Like if X team is starting to use lots of moving screens, the next crew might get a note to watch for moving screens. A vast majority of these notes come from fellow refs, but on few occasions they come from the league office. This is probably the most influence the league has over the refs.

Not true.

http://lakernation.com/ex-referee-tim-donaghy-claims-nba-is-fixed-to-feds/?w3tc_preview=1

This was from one of his trials, but interesting to read.


5. anything can be made to look like a conspiracy after the fact. It's possible this year that we may end up with a Pacers Spurs finals, which will probably be the lowest viewed finals of all time. Yet I'm sure if that happens, people can invent reasons why it makes sense. I've seen some convoluted scenarios detailing every single one of the Spurs titles, despite the drastically low ratings their games bring.

Well no, neither of those teams have the marketability or superstar fandom like the Heat?

The Spurs one would be dumb, they are hardly anything like the Heat as an example :facepalm:

[InfiniteBaskets]

You know what we should do as posters who believe the league is corrupt? We should continue watching the NBA games that we believe are rigged and dedicate our time to posting and talking about NBA topics.


That'll show David Stern and all the owners of the league.

[Shepseskaf]

Its common that referees and the control organisation are kept separate for the exact reason that they cant manipulate things :facepalm
:roll:

You keep coming out with these "how it should be" comments that clearly don't deal with reality.

It should be "common" for sports officials and the controlling organization to be kept separate, but it doesn't always work out that way. In this case, it definitely doesn't.

Maybe you'll understand more when you move out of mom's basement and find out how life really works.

[KingBeasley08]

Cheating scum. Your fanbase are the worst on here and that's not just me sayin that.

I put an asterisk on anything the Heat have done since Lequeen quit on the Cavs and straight into an armchair ride...

You should know better. I think it would be better for you guys if you just openly admitted to what everyone else sees and get off the Heat's nuts for a while.

Lebron openly admitting flopping(cheating), exposed refs and fixed series games(tim donaghy 2002) are just proof of what I have been saying and making you look really stupid for calling me dumb :facepalm: *****t.
da fuq is wrong with this guy? :wtf:

does he actually think game 5 was rigged? what an idiot :lol

[HoopsFanNumero1]

Cheating scum. Your fanbase are the worst on here and that's not just me sayin that.

I put an asterisk on anything the Heat have done since Lequeen quit on the Cavs and straight into an armchair ride...

You should know better. I think it would be better for you guys if you just openly admitted to what everyone else sees and get off the Heat's nuts for a while.

Lebron openly admitting flopping(cheating), exposed refs and fixed series games(tim donaghy 2002) are just proof of what I have been saying and making you look really stupid for calling me dumb :facepalm: *****t.

Seriously, what the **** is wrong with you? i always see you randomly appear out of nowhere and start bitching like a little kid any time a call favors the Heat, but when it's the other way around, you're nowhere to be seen.

[Goldrush25]

Pacers had double the foul count for most of the game, I called it before this game started the fix was in. Like the first 4 games mattered, because that's what you and the other Heat f*ggots like to point out :facepalm:

You have analysts pointing out ref bias and something is fishy and I should listen to you a Heat fan? :lol:

Key game 5, 2-2.

Like I know you understand momentum, but you give no credit to it since you only like to point to the stats and say that's what happened after Heat won. I could also point out that, the league has been brought into disrepute before, yet Im crazy to think there is no more fixing in the game? F*ck you stupid ignorant c*nt.

I'd be ashamed to support a team full of flopping, traitorous cheats who are catered for by the league.

You support the league though, even though you claim rampant cheating? You're more of a fool than anyone else then.:confusedshrug:

[cltcfn2924]

Obviously, you don't realize it, and won't acknowledge it, but virtually everything you just posted is incorrect.

I'm not pushing an "agenda", I'm watching the evidence right in front of my eyes. The widespread allegations of crooked NBA refs didn't just spring up overnight.

NFL and baseball refs make boneheaded mistakes on occasion, but there is no general consensus of an organized conspiracy, as there definitely is with the NBA. Why is that?

As inept a commissioner as Goodell is, I firmly believe he would immediately take steps to correct even the appearance of game influencing by refs. Stern has not done so for over three decades. What does that tell you?

The owners enjoy revenue sharing, and other such benefits, and will do nothing to change the current system.

Whether you choose to face up to it, or not, there are obvious, glaring problems with NBA officiating and nothing is being done to correct them.

Absolutely correct. In fact more has been done to protect the mirage. "Don't dare say anything about my referees". "I know where the bodies are buried". This is the most corrupt commissioner the sports world has ever seen.

[DaSeba5]

Cheating scum. Your fanbase are the worst on here and that's not just me sayin that.

I put an asterisk on anything the Heat have done since Lequeen quit on the Cavs and straight into an armchair ride...

You should know better. I think it would be better for you guys if you just openly admitted to what everyone else sees and get off the Heat's nuts for a while.

Lebron openly admitting flopping(cheating), exposed refs and fixed series games(tim donaghy 2002) are just proof of what I have been saying and making you look really stupid for calling me dumb :facepalm: *****t.

You're easily becoming one of the worst posters here. Calm the fvck down.

[monkeypox]

Stopped reading right there.

Are you some kind of NBA troll paid to convince gullible people that nothing is wrong with the current refereeing system?

If you don't understand that Dictator Stern is in complete control of everything that happens in the league, then you don't understand anything at all.

You're wrong. When the NBA fined a ref publicly the union threw a fit and fought to have it drastically reduced. Also I never said there was nothing wrong. A big part of the reason why things are bad is because the refs have to much autonomy and profess to be self policing. Every time the NBA publicly states a ref got the call wrong after a game it's a shot at the refs. The refs desperately want to keep the feeling of authority over the players, at least that's why they say they need to keep their fines internal. Multi millionaires naturally don't want to listen to someone who gets paid like 90k a year.

[greymatter]

The ones bitching that it's a conspiracy are mainly comprised of a bunch of whiny Knicks, Bulls, and Kobe-stan retards. Knicks/Bulls tards are still salty over Lebron spurning them for Miami and basically bitch about "cHeat" and "superteams" when they themselves basically wouldn't hesitate to demand that their team's GM do the same thing if they had the cap space. Kobe-tards live their lives revolving around hoping Lebron's resume doesn't supersede Kobe's.

[chazzy]

How f*cking stupid are you that you can't see you're being mocked?

How much of a retard are you that you think this series is rigged? Were our 12 free throws today too much for your over-complaining, whining, bitch made ass? How many did you want us to receive? Less than double digits as a team?
Was it too much for you that we outshot the Pacers from the field, from 3pt land, had less turnovers, more steals, more blocks, more assists, 7 more made field goals?
What calls you incompetent sooky c*nt? Did we really get too many? How about we don't shoot a f*cking free throw next time?

****ing ****. Eat a bag of d!cks you wanker.
Let's not act like you don't whine hard about the refs whenever the Heat lose

[Shepseskaf]

You're wrong. When the NBA fined a ref publicly the union threw a fit and fought to have it drastically reduced. Also I never said there was nothing wrong. A big part of the reason why things are bad is because the refs have to much autonomy and profess to be self policing. Every time the NBA publicly states a ref got the call wrong after a game it's a shot at the refs. The refs desperately want to keep the feeling of authority over the players, at least that's why they say they need to keep their fines internal. Multi millionaires naturally don't want to listen to someone who gets paid like 90k a year.
So, the union threw a fit? :oldlol: That doesn't have a thing to do with the fact that Stern controls all. Every point made in your post couldn't be more wrong.

But I'll play the devil's advocate -- say Stern isn't in total control. Are you going to tell me that a group of lower-level employees (the refs) independently made the decision to blatantly influence any number of high profile games? You're saying that obviously favoring one team over the other is all the refs idea?

First of all, if this was the case, and it was against Stern's interests, he would be looking at a bunch of out-of-control employees who were making the league look bad. It would be well within Stern's power to immediately remedy the situation. That hasn't happened, so what does that tell you?

More to the point, a group low-level employees would never dare to pull the things they have without knowing they have support at the highest levels. Otherwise, it would be a recipe for getting fired -- quickly.

So, on every level, what you've posted makes zero sense.

[kshutts1]

I never base judgement of a ref on a replay... video evidence is always easier than real-time in determining the outcome of a play.

All I ask for a ref is that they do a better job than I do when calling plays while I watch the game on my 19" tv (24 sec violation, ball off Lebron's thigh in last night's game, easy plays like that).

Secondly, I want some consistency. Was Lebron's offensive-foul-pick an illegal screen? Yes, it was. But so are 95% of the screens set!! Either don't call the one against Lebron, or call ALL of them.

And lastly, don't necessitate flopping. Nazr got tossed because Lebron fell when he was pushed. Birdman got a tech but, as the announcers were saying, if T had fallen (flopped) down, then Bird probably would have been tossed. It's disgusting that that is hypothetical truth. Don't rely on outcome to dictate punishment, rely on action.

As an aside.... the rules for technical fouls should be changed.
-- First technical foul and the player is taken out of the game. They may substitute in at the next dead ball (if Lebron gets a tech, his coach would likely be willing to burn a TO to get him back in instantly. If Birdman does... maybe not so much. But either way, this provides real punishment beyond the FT)

-- Second technical and player is tossed and fined appropriately (% of income, as opposed to flat rate).

-- Double technical results in both teams shooting. It will slow the game down ever so slightly (not enough 2xT to really affect the time of game, though) but gives an obvious benefit to the player/team that actually works on FT shooting, which is a skill.

[Kews1]

:roll:

You keep coming out with these "how it should be" comments that clearly don't deal with reality.

It should be "common" for sports officials and the controlling organization to be kept separate, but it doesn't always work out that way. In this case, it definitely doesn't.

Maybe you'll understand more when you move out of mom's basement and find out how life really works.

Seriously your such a fool. :facepalm

[JMT]

The part that both amuses and amazes me is that the people who cry conspiracy and fix the loudest avidly watch the games.

If they truly believe that it's fixed and still watch, they're the equivalent of WWE fans. Actually, the youngest WWE fans don't think it's fixed, so the NBA conspiracy nuts are worse.

[Solefade]

Cheating scum. Your fanbase are the worst on here and that's not just me sayin that.

I put an asterisk on anything the Heat have done since Lequeen quit on the Cavs and straight into an armchair ride...

You should know better. I think it would be better for you guys if you just openly admitted to what everyone else sees and get off the Heat's nuts for a while.

Lebron openly admitting flopping(cheating), exposed refs and fixed series games(tim donaghy 2002) are just proof of what I have been saying and making you look really stupid for calling me dumb :facepalm: *****t.

Jesus Christ, you bitch about LeBron and the Heat everyday. Get a life dude.

[InfiniteBaskets]

The part that both amuses and amazes me is that the people who cry conspiracy and fix the loudest avidly watch the games.



This.

[longtime lurker]

Honestly all these fools who constantly moan and bitch about referees and David Stern fixing games are ****ing fools. Do you know how hard it is to referee a game at full speed without the ability to use replays except for the last 2 minutes? All of you ****er's who sit on your couch and think that because you can make perfect calls through the use of replays and conversely think that the ref's are purposely making those calls wrong to benefit one team or the other but in reality their just making mistakes? Of course they make the wrong calls, sometimes those wrong calls will benefit one team more than the other. Im sure some games (a drastic minority) in history have been fixed, but to think that every game is predetermined is just ridiculous , your such children GTFOH STFU. :facepalm

It's hard to enjoy the game when the officiating is heavily one sided for one team. That Dan Crawford stat doesn't lie. And referees just don't make the wrong calls they are flat out horrible and are often inconsistent with previous calls they've made.

[knicksman]

How f*cking stupid are you that you can't see you're being mocked?

How much of a retard are you that you think this series is rigged? Were our 12 free throws today too much for your over-complaining, whining, bitch made ass? How many did you want us to receive? Less than double digits as a team?
Was it too much for you that we outshot the Pacers from the field, from 3pt land, had less turnovers, more steals, more blocks, more assists, 7 more made field goals?
What calls you incompetent sooky c*nt? Did we really get too many? How about we don't shoot a f*cking free throw next time?

****ing ****. Eat a bag of d!cks you wanker.

ARe heat fanboys really that stupid. People are already aware of free throw attempts so they go for the less obvious which are fouls that doesnt need free throws like those offensive fouls that can change the momentum.

[knicksman]

actually the ones who doesnt believe the games are fixed when a whistle blower already exposes it and the nba admitting one of the series being fixed, are the ones who are fools esp when these refs are still in the nba.

[Goldrush25]

actually the ones who doesnt believe the games are fixed when a whistle blower already exposes it and the nba admitting one of the series being fixed, are the ones who are fools esp when these refs are still in the nba.

So patronizing a corrupt league when you supposedly know that the league is corrupt, is somehow more intuitive than patronizing a league that you don't believe to be corrupt? Not following your logic.

Guys claim fix yet they still watch the games. Doesn't make any sense to me. If I thought the league was rigged I wouldn't watch it anymore. If it is rampant (like people say every Heat game that is close is rigged) all you're doing is ensuring it will continue.

[HeatFanSince88]

So patronizing a corrupt league when you supposedly know that the league is corrupt, is somehow more intuitive than patronizing a league that you don't believe to be corrupt? Not following your logic.

Guys claim fix yet they still watch the games. Doesn't make any sense to me. If I thought the league was rigged I wouldn't watch it anymore. If it is going on all you're doing is ensuring it will continue.

Its just an excuse people bitch about when their team gets ****ed. They either blame the refs or they'll point to injuries.

[poido123]

Jesus Christ, you bitch about LeBron and the Heat everyday. Get a life dude.

Heat are currently playing in a series. There are no other games being played.

I post in other threads too. I have an interest in the purity of the sport,? What Lebron, the Heat and the league is doing is anything but in the best interest of the game.

[Goldrush25]

Heat are currently playing in a series. There are no other games being played.

I post in other threads too. I have an interest in the purity of the sport,? What Lebron, the Heat and the league is doing is anything but in the best interest of the game.

Purity of the league? You already think it's rigged. So if you watch it and continue to consume the product, you're consenting to it.

[poido123]

You know what we should do as posters who believe the league is corrupt? We should continue watching the NBA games that we believe are rigged and dedicate our time to posting and talking about NBA topics.


That'll show David Stern and all the owners of the league.

So people who suspect the game is corrupt(proof of this)should just shutup and and ignore the game that they love?

I don't see what you expect me to do.

[plowking]

Let's not act like you don't whine hard about the refs whenever the Heat lose

I complain about calls here and there like everyone. I don't claim rampant conspiracies that the league has it in for my team or any other team. And I mockingly cry out about the refs in plenty of the game threads to get retards on here whining even harder.

[Shepseskaf]

The part that both amuses and amazes me is that the people who cry conspiracy and fix the loudest avidly watch the games.

If they truly believe that it's fixed and still watch, they're the equivalent of WWE fans. Actually, the youngest WWE fans don't think it's fixed, so the NBA conspiracy nuts are worse.
What I find amusing and amazing is the sheer stupidity of comments like this.

Basketball is the best game in the world, and despite the knowledge that the NBA is run by the most crooked commissioner in sports history, many people like to watch the skills that the best players in the world can display.

It should also be noted that not every game features blatant 'influencing' attempts by the refs. Some are officiated perfectly; some are badly reffed, but without the apparent attempt to favor one team over another.

Is this really so hard to figure out?

In the apparent zeal to disclaim anything resembling a 'conspiracy' its a shame that otherwise sensible people can bury their heads in the sand and ignore the clear evidence discerned by their own eyes.

Sad and pathetic.

[plowking]

ARe heat fanboys really that stupid. People are already aware of free throw attempts so they go for the less obvious which are fouls that doesnt need free throws like those offensive fouls that can change the momentum.

Go on. Point them out. We'll all wait for your expert analysis. Which fouls were they in game 5.

Point them out to me.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

actually the ones who doesnt believe the games are fixed when a whistle blower already exposes it and the nba admitting one of the series being fixed, are the ones who are fools esp when these refs are still in the nba.
link?

[knicksman]

So patronizing a corrupt league when you supposedly know that the league is corrupt, is somehow more intuitive than patronizing a league that you don't believe to be corrupt? Not following your logic.

Guys claim fix yet they still watch the games. Doesn't make any sense to me. If I thought the league was rigged I wouldn't watch it anymore. If it is rampant (like people say every Heat game that is close is rigged) all you're doing is ensuring it will continue.

if you love someone, you want to change her so your love would continue. Only people who doesnt love NBAdoesnt want change and instead find another one. Theres only one basketball league and I believe basketball can be on the tier of NFL if its not for stern.

[poido123]

Seriously, what the **** is wrong with you? i always see you randomly appear out of nowhere and start bitching like a little kid any time a call favors the Heat, but when it's the other way around, you're nowhere to be seen.

Well you make an inaccurate account of what I actually do. I have stated there has been bad calls happen early in the series against Miami and the Pacers. I have also made the point that it means jackshit in the whole context of a series.

After game 4 is where I knew it would get fishy. This series was meant to go 6 for money reasons. I stated before the game that the Pacers would have a significantly higher foul count to the Heat and I was right. Wade, James, and Bosh had a combined 1 Foul going into half time :lol: For most of the game, Pacers had double the fouls.

Dan Crawford just so happens to be reffing game 5 a pivotal game, so if there was any doubt in Heat losing he would step in.

I mean, what more can I say? I think the series is tainted.

[knicksman]

Go on. Point them out. We'll all wait for your expert analysis. Which fouls were they in game 5.

Point them out to me.

Look at the start of third quarter, you fool.

[Goldrush25]

What I find amusing and amazing is the sheer stupidity of comments like this.

Basketball is the best game in the world, and despite the knowledge that the NBA is run by the most crooked commissioner in sport history, many people like to watch the skills that the best players in the world can display.

It should also be noted that not every game features blatant 'influencing' attempts by the refs. Some are officiated perfectly; some are badly reffed, but without the apparent attempt to favor one team over another.

Is this really so hard to figure out? In their zeal to disclaim anything resembling a 'conspiracy' is a shame that otherwise intelligent people can bury their heads in the sand and ignore the evidence of their own eyes.

Sad and pathetic.

I don't think it's stupid at all. In my opinion, if the notion that the league is rife with corruption isn't enough to turn you away, and you readily admit that you still watch the games regardless, you lose any right to be outraged by it. You accept whatever the NBA gives you. If you don't like it, stop watching.

Same type of people that blame the cigarette companies for getting lung cancer.:oldlol:

[plowking]

Look at the start of third quarter, you fool.

Show me the bad calls. Which ones?

[poido123]

You support the league though, even though you claim rampant cheating? You're more of a fool than anyone else then.:confusedshrug:

I love the game enough to speak out about corruption and tainted series/games. Its been happening since the jordan era, I will go as far as to say that maybe even Jordan's pushoff was part of something fishy...

I can't exactly pinpoint when it started happening, but I suspect somewhere around near the end of Jordan's second retirement.

I know alot of you don't give Tim Donaghy claims the time of day, but for what its worth, the refs he has mentioned in his book are still current refs in the league. You can't tell me those guys didn't know what's up when 2002 was happening.

[Shepseskaf]

I don't think it's stupid at all. In my opinion, if the notion that the league is rife with corruption isn't enough to turn you away, and you readily admit that you still watch the games regardless, you lose any right to be outraged by it. You accept whatever the NBA gives you. If you don't like it, stop watching.

Same type of people that blame the cigarette companies for getting lung cancer.:oldlol:
:facepalm

You don't "lose" any rights to be outraged if you feel that some games are not fairly officiated. It is my hope that some day the situation will be rectified, but in the meantime, I still enjoy watching basketball.

Do people "lose" the right to be outraged by the actions of a given government just because they feel its corrupt? Life isn't fair or just, and sometimes you have to adjust to things that you might not like.

And, maybe you haven't kept up with news about the tobacco industry but they ended up paying out millions of dollars because of the damage some of their products have caused.

[Legends66NBA7]

Damn, didn't think this thread would catch so much feelings.

[Goldrush25]

:facepalm

You don't "lose" any rights to be outraged if you feel that some games are not fairly officiated. It is my hope that some day the situation will be rectified, but in the meantime, I still enjoy watching basketball.

Do people "lose" the right to be outraged by the actions of a given government just because they feel its corrupt? Life isn't fair or just, and sometimes you have to adjust to things that you might not like.

And, maybe you haven't kept up with news about the tobacco industry but they ended up paying out millions of dollars because of the damage some of their products have caused.

LOL.

The NBA is a consumer product that you choose to consume. It is not a dictatorship or anything analogous to government. You don't have to put up with the corruption if you don't want to. Just stop watching. Easy peasy.

[tpols]

Of course there's a level of corruption in the nba.. Ref's went to JAIL for this shit.

Whenever there's the potential to make a lot of money behind the scenes.. People are going to do it. Business takes the good nature out of everything.

Whether it's, banks blowing up their worths with fake assets raking in investors money and Cashin out before the collapse or people betting money on slanted games or even higher ups relying on the success of particular individuals to make $$$.. There gonna put their two cents in and strike deals.

Basketball is also probably the easiest sport to rig. So many points are scored and the refs can directly decide when to give a team of their choosing free points.. And they do it all game long. :oldlol:

[Shepseskaf]

LOL.

The NBA is a consumer product that you choose to consume. It is not a dictatorship or anything analogous to government. You don't have to put up with the corruption if you don't want to. Just stop watching. Easy peasy.
:facepalm :facepalm

Do you not have the ability to comprehend what I just posted?

This is why ISH is going down the toilet. Too many idiots.

[Goldrush25]

:facepalm :facepalm

Do you not have the ability to comprehend what I just posted?

This is why ISH is going down the toilet. Too many idiots.

You tried to make an analogy to government in reference to the NBA, and I'm the idiot?:oldlol:

Dude you're way in over your head here. Either come with a cogent retort, or it's time for you to stop posting tonight.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

You tried to make an analogy to government in reference to the NBA, and I'm the idiot?:oldlol:

Dude you're way in over your head here. Either come with a cogent retort, or it's time for you to stop posting tonight.
:lol

[Shepseskaf]

You tried to make an analogy to government in reference to the NBA, and I'm the idiot?:oldlol:

Dude you're way in over your head here. Either come with a cogent retort, or it's time for you to stop posting tonight.
The analogy I made is very clear to anyone with half a brain. Obviously, that doesn't include you.

I'm not the one who's in over his head. Leave mommy's computer alone before you get a spanking for reading big words on the screen.

[tpols]

You tried to make an analogy to government in reference to the NBA, and I'm the idiot?:oldlol:

Dude you're way in over your head here. Either come with a cogent retort, or it's time for you to stop posting tonight.
Government<<<nba.. At least nba has to have some respect for their customers.

[Rose'sACL]

So people who suspect the game is corrupt(proof of this)should just shutup and and ignore the game that they love?

I don't see what you expect me to do.
you are not suspecting at all. You are sure of it. Anyone can read your posts here and can clearly see that you are sure it is fixed. Watching something when you are sure that it is fixed is a pretty idiotic thing to do.
I don't watch WWE. If i bitched about WWE being fixed while watching it whenever it is aired then people would call me an idiot too.
Also, stop telling others that you post in other threads, pretty much every post i see from you is related to heat.

[bmd]

You're on the internet. The internet is filled with impressionable young people and idiots who live in fantasy land and are quick think everything is a conspiracy.

Just as an example... there was a thread a couple weeks back where the OP was saying Jeff Van Gundy isn't calling the game with Mike Breen... Hubie Brown was there instead.

Everybody in the thread was speculating that they fired Van Gundy and replaced him with Hubie. They were coming up with all these idiotic ideas about why he was "fired".

It wasn't until about page 3 when a guy finally chimed in and said "couldn't he just be missing one game for personal reasons like he's sick or something"?

It amazed me that not a single person's first thought was something simple like "maybe he's sick." Everybody automatically jumped to wild conclusions.

That thread is the internet in a nutshell.

[Shepseskaf]

That thread is the internet in a nutshell.
Except that the JVG situation was just a one-time thing.

There are volumes of information that indicates biased officiating is a reality, and not just speculation.

[poido123]

you are not suspecting at all. You are sure of it. Anyone can read your posts here and can clearly see that you are sure it is fixed. Watching something when you are sure that it is fixed is a pretty idiotic thing to do.
I don't watch WWE. If i bitched about WWE being fixed while watching it whenever it is aired then people would call me an idiot too.
Also, stop telling others that you post in other threads, pretty much every post i see from you is related to heat.

If you're gonna call me out, at least read the posts in here that i wrote.

Miami and pacers are the only teams playing atm. There are no other games. What do you think most people are going to talk about right now? Exactly.

Now you are comparing WWE with professional basketball, and you expect me to see the comparison there? :lol:

First of all, WWE is organised entertainment, it is fake and everyone knows it(apart from naive kids). The NBA is a professional sport that is supposed to be called fairly, and I'm pointing out that it has changed since the Jordan era and is treated more like an entertainment(suppose the only comparison to WWE) for the viewer moreso than a professional sport. When you have superstars on teams, the league sees it in its best interest to look after these teams to rake in the money. This changed noticeably after the Jordan era because the NBA and Stern know that the big teams with the big players having success draws in big money. The thing about the Heat is, alot of people want to see them lose for various reasons, so on top of having superstars they have villains, perfect combination for making money.

[knicksman]

if you dont want change then clearly you just dont love the game. You just love MIami.

[knicksman]

Really only idiots wouldnt think the league is corrupt when instead of investigating the refs for donaghy exposure, they give them the power to tech and fine everyone. Stern instead protect the refs. LOL

[Rose'sACL]

If you're gonna call me out, at least read the posts in here that i wrote.

Miami and pacers are the only teams playing atm. There are no other games. What do you think most people are going to talk about right now? Exactly.

Now you are comparing WWE with professional basketball, and you expect me to see the comparison there? :lol:

First of all, WWE is organised entertainment, it is fake and everyone knows it(apart from naive kids). The NBA is a professional sport that is supposed to be called fairly, and I'm pointing out that it has changed since the Jordan era and is treated more like an entertainment(suppose the only comparison to WWE) for the viewer moreso than a professional sport. When you have superstars on teams, the league sees it in its best interest to look after these teams to rake in the money. This changed noticeably after the Jordan era because the NBA and Stern know that the big teams with the big players having success draws in big money. The thing about the Heat is, alot of people want to see them lose for various reasons, so on top of having superstars they have villains, perfect combination for making money.
stop writing shit. most people who complain about NBA being rigged talk about Jordan ERA being the start of it. At least be consistent. You are a bulls fan and it is clear that you are biased because if you say that it has been rigged since the time jordan started winning, his rings wouldn't mean much.
So many players used to complain that you can't breath on jordan without foul being called but ofcourse you just decided that after jordan completed his second 3peat, league started rigging the games because Poido123 on ISH will have tough time as he is a bulls fan and those are the only championships bulls have won.

[Kews1]

Really only idiots wouldnt think the league is corrupt when instead of investigating the refs for donaghy exposure, they give them the power to tech and fine everyone. Stern instead protect the refs. LOL

Tim Donaghy was fixing the point spread for his own benefit. Of course he is looking to discredit the league. Its not that same thing as fixing a game specifically for the benefit of one team. Dont be so foolish, the Donaghy thing proves nothing other than the fact the Donaghy was a cheat.

[Shepseskaf]

Tim Donaghy was fixing the point spread for his own benefit. Of course he is looking to discredit the league. Its not that same thing as fixing a game specifically for the benefit of one team. Dont be so foolish, the Donaghy thing proves nothing other than the fact the Donaghy was a cheat.
Uh huh.... and no one else knew what Donaghy was up to, not even the refs that he was working with during games?

And Donaghy was the ONLY ref in the history of the game to try and "profit" by making bogus calls?

You have the nerve to call other people "foolish"? You better look in the mirror to find a fool.

[Derka]

It's all pretty shitty, but its been consistently bad every season. And I understand that they don't have an easy job, but obvious things get missed and then they stuff they made up to try and balance it out and its just silly.

Also, these refs let ego and showmanship get the better of their judgement far too often.

[poido123]

stop writing shit. most people who complain about NBA being rigged talk about Jordan ERA being the start of it. At least be consistent. You are a bulls fan and it is clear that you are biased because if you say that it has been rigged since the time jordan started winning, his rings wouldn't mean much.
So many players used to complain that you can't breath on jordan without foul being called but ofcourse you just decided that after jordan completed his second 3peat, league started rigging the games because Poido123 on ISH will have tough time as he is a bulls fan and those are the only championships bulls have won.

Again, you try to pass me off as a Jordan stan, when I have mentioned that Jordan's pushoff against the Jazz may of been fishy and the start of corrupt officiating. I also pointed out that I'm not entirely sure when the league turned wrong, but it certainly is there and I can see it.

The Jordan era IMO was the time that it did start. Did Jordan really need help? I dont think so, but Im sure he got help. When big business took over, the league had to protect the money and the superstars and i can see the relationship between the two.

The current refs consist of guys that Donaghy eluded to. Dan Crawford has an unbelievable record playing with the Heat :lol: But seriously, influencing games is happening in the league and something might come out when Stern has moved on...

[Rose'sACL]

Again, you try to pass me off as a Jordan stan, when I have mentioned that Jordan's pushoff against the Jazz may of been fishy and the start of corrupt officiating. I also pointed out that I'm not entirely sure when the league turned wrong, but it certainly is there and I can see it.

The Jordan era IMO was the time that it did start. Did Jordan really need help? I dont think so, but Im sure he got help. When big business took over, the league had to protect the money and the superstars and i can see the relationship between the two.

The current refs consist of guys that Donaghy eluded to. Dan Crawford has an unbelievable record playing with the Heat :lol: But seriously, influencing games is happening in the league and something might come out when Stern has moved on...
Joey crawford has a real horrible record as far as heat is concerned during the playoffs. also, if rigging is happening, it is not because of stern and it will keep happening till nba exists. Stern has only done good for NBA and if rigging is happening then he can't stop it as it must be for a lot of money and it doesn't matter who is commissioner, it will keep happening. Lots of really bad people from outside must be involved for rigging to happen.

[knicksman]

Tim Donaghy was fixing the point spread for his own benefit. Of course he is looking to discredit the league. Its not that same thing as fixing a game specifically for the benefit of one team. Dont be so foolish, the Donaghy thing proves nothing other than the fact the Donaghy was a cheat.

LMAO theres no donaghy in the kings lakers series and only idiots wouldnt suspect the league is corrupt when theres an owner in cuban constantly complaining about the refs and even phil jackson agrees with it. But no these keyboard warriors are better analysts.

[wakencdukest]

Why is no one mentioning 2 of the smallest market teams going to the western conference finals and it being a sweep? Is there not millions upon millions to be made by having 2 big market teams go 7 games? What happens if Indy wins this series and you have 2 small market teams in the finals? Would the conspiracy theory still be valid?