Hakeem: Dwight is "Very Raw"

[Inferno]

“As good as he is right now, he’s still very raw. But he has all the tools so I’m like a kid in a candy store. That’s why we give him the fundamentals of these moves. There’s a rhythm. And once he sees it, then it’s easier to emulate and then incorporate with power. He has the power. Now we’re adding finesse to the power.

“The best big men in the game – they’re game-changers. That’s what he is. And he’s in the right situation where the coach understands it, he demands it, and Dwight can give it.”

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/08/15/olajuwon-describes-dwight-howard-as-very-raw/

10 years and still raw...

[bagelred]

I see him as Very Smackdown.....

[Is He Ill]

Seriously, if the guy hasn't picked it up by now he probably never will. He has already peaked, it's only downhill from here. Dwight relies on his physical gifts way too much and his offensive game is pitiful. After Hakeem teaches him the fundamentals of the moves, he will probably just forget them within a few months and revert back to what he's been doing up until this point.

[buddha]

and he is still the best center in the NBA by a country mile :facepalm

[COnDEMnED]

Countdown till Rockets fans are pulling their hair out? I probably give it 2 seasons. First season failures will be blamed on a new team with a new system, that's a given, end of season 2 is when things will start to set in.

[9erempiree]

Everyone feeling sorry for Dwight and his pathetic post game.

Imagine all the great centers in history getting together to help you. That's not refining your game. That's sympathy.

:facepalm

[kNicKz]

Seriously, if the guy hasn't picked it up by now he probably never will. He has already peaked, it's only downhill from here. Dwight relies on his physical gifts way too much and his offensive game is pitiful. After Hakeem teaches him the fundamentals of the moves, he will probably just forget them within a few months and revert back to what he's been doing up until this point.

You're acting like learning a couple post moves is like learning quantum physics. Dwight can pick up some skills by working his ass off. If he wants to be great he will be in the gym every day with mchale and hakeem getting it down. Will he? Probably not, but it is definitely possible to improve your game 10 years into your career. Many players have

[Is He Ill]

You're acting like learning a couple post moves is quantum physics. Dwight can pick up some skills by working his ass off. If he wants to be great he will be in the gym every day with mchale and hakeem getting it down.

That's the thing. He's obviously an elite rebounder and shot blocker, but those will be the first things to go once he starts deteriorating physically(if he hasn't already). It's not like shot blockers and rebounders aren't available for a cheaper price. He would be well worth the money if his offense was better.

[boozehound]

You're acting like learning a couple post moves is like learning quantum physics. Dwight can pick up some skills by working his ass off. If he wants to be great he will be in the gym every day with mchale and hakeem getting it down. Will he? Probably not, but it is definitely possible to improve your game 10 years into your career. Many players have
the point is that hes been in the league 10 years and has hardly picked up any post fundamentals that come naturally to him in game. This is not some 3rd year player coming into his own here. We will see if working with hakeem makes a huge difference, but it cant hurt.

[SCdac]

Improving his moves will totally help his game, can't fault the guy for putting himself in the right positions to improve... but I think it's questionable whether he can significantly improve his innate finesse, dexterity, and control of the ball. Being "raw" at 27 going on 28 just doesn't seem right for somebody playing ball since 15 years old. What you see from Dwight in 09-11 is what you get IMO.

[COnDEMnED]

You're acting like learning a couple post moves is like learning quantum physics. Dwight can pick up some skills by working his ass off. If he wants to be great he will be in the gym every day with mchale and hakeem getting it down. Will he? Probably not, but it is definitely possible to improve your game 10 years into your career. Many players have
Possible to teach him how to make free throws? Wonder why someone hasn't done that for him since he got in the league. Oh yeah, because it's all in his mind. He mind ****s himself. Teaching him post moves doesn't do any good if he's just going to mind **** himself.

[Jameerthefear]

imo if dwight just improves his freethrows and play in the post like he did in '11, then houston would be a contender.

[Dragonyeuw]

He can learn the technical points, but when you saw Hakeem down low, it was more than just the technical ability. There was a fluidity to his movements, instincts that really can't be taught.

[fpliii]

I think his best bet is to pick up on their footwork. Don't focus on chaining moves, etc. this offseason since both will be with the team for a while. No easy task since it's probably one of the hardest things to learn (in no small part due to the fact that you have to change what is natural to you).

[Ron Jeremy]

I see him as Very Smackdown.....
:applause:

[9erempiree]

I think his best bet is to pick up on their footwork. Don't focus on chaining moves, etc. this offseason since both will be with the team for a while. No easy task since it's probably one of the hardest things to learn (in no small part due to the fact that you have to change what is natural to you).

I agree that he should work on his footwork first and foremost. The funniest thing I have heard is that they are teaching him how to "chain moves" like he's going to bust out some crazy Street Fighter move. :oldlol:

[KG215]

I think his best bet is to pick up on their footwork. Don't focus on chaining moves, etc. this offseason since both will be with the team for a while. No easy task since it's probably one of the hardest things to learn (in no small part due to the fact that you have to change what is natural to you).
I also think great footwork is something you're sort of just born with. I mean obviously you have to work at it and develop it to some extent; but I also think some players just have "it"; they have the instincts, dexterity, feel, etc. for a devastating array of post moves.

But, Dwight is working with arguably the two est in that regard in NBA history, so I'm sure he'll pick-up something.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Translation: He ****ing sucks

We know Hakeem, we know.

[IGOTGAME]

All he needs is two moves that he really gets and he could score 25 a game. He needs to stop with all is extra shit. Get a jump hook over each shoulder and then start working on an up and under or spin move. Most of the latter is intuitive and he seems to just not get it.

[fpliii]

I agree that he should work on his footwork first and foremost. The funniest thing I have heard is that they are teaching him how to "chain moves" like he's going to bust out some crazy Street Fighter move. :oldlol:

lol pretty much. He's a season or two away from that. I was pretty pissed off he left at first, but I think this sets LA up pretty well for the loaded draft (I don't think Wiggins is in the cards, but a top 5 pick and Randle or Parker would be huge). I guess he did what he had to do since he hasn't maximized his physical talent, but we'll see if he's able to deliver in Houston.


I also think great footwork is something you're sort of just born with. I mean obviously you have to work at it and develop it to some extent; but I also think some players just have "it"; they have the instincts, dexterity, feel, etc. for a devastating array of post moves.

But, Dwight is working with arguably the two est in that regard in NBA history, so I'm sure he'll pick-up something.

Pretty much. I think they need to spend this summer/training camp/season to rebuild his basics. It actually might be too late and impossible to develop the "instincts, dexterity, feel, etc." you mentioned, but as you said if anyone can teach him it's those two guys.

[ZenMaster]

Possible to teach him how to make free throws? Wonder why someone hasn't done that for him since he got in the league. Oh yeah, because it's all in his mind. He mind ****s himself. Teaching him post moves doesn't do any good if he's just going to mind **** himself.

It's not just in his mind, he has horrible form on free throws and all other shots which is why he can't shoot from anywhere on the court.

[KyleKong]

and he is still the best center in the NBA by a country mile :facepalm

This. Big men are at such a weak era right now.

[SamuraiSWISH]

He can learn the technical points, but when you saw Hakeem down low, it was more than just the technical ability. There was a fluidity to his movements, instincts that really can't be taught.
Dude moved like a guard or perimeter player with his footwork.

:pimp:

[Levity]

"theres a rhythm"

spot on quote by hakeem.

For those that actually watched Dwight, both with orlando and the lakers, its obvious that he lacks that rhythm when the ball is given to him with his back to the basket. His moves are often stagnated and clumsy. Can he develop this so called "rhythm"? Hard to say. its like teaching someone who cant dance at all, how to dance. Sometimes it works, often times its fruitless.

[9erempiree]

They should bring in Yao, just in case those two can't get it done.

:oldlol:

[K Xerxes]

Dude moved like a guard or perimeter player with his footwork.

:pimp:

His godly footwork is because he played soccer as a kid. Soccer hones agility, skills and quick movements. Howard would struggle to dribble past an ant with the footwork he has.

It's too late to get anywhere near Hakeem or McHale. His best hope is average footwork. Combine that with his athleticism power, and he can become a decent post player, which is all he needs to be a top 3 player in the game in all honesty.

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/08/15/olajuwon-describes-dwight-howard-as-very-raw/

10 years and still raw...

its pathetic .....he is a mental midget ...thats why he is never going to win anything...period

[Heavincent]

We've been saying it for like a decade now. "Dwight's gonna be an absolute animal when he develops a post game"

Still hasn't happened. Hakeem confirmed what we already know: Dwight's post moves are stiff and clumsy, and that's probably never gonna change significantly.

[noob cake]

I better see some progress because having the #1/2 NBA post player in NBA history tutoring him should mean something.

[Beatlezz]

I see him as Very Smackdown.....

More like Sunday Night Heat.

[jstern]

I'm 6 minutes into this Hakeem documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nB3iIviCIMg and in comparison to Dwight, it's so interesting how Hakeem started on his offense during a summer, because he was new to basketball, and was able to learn fundamentals so much better than Howard. He worked hard.

I do applaud Dwight for putting himself in the right situation to learn though. Just has to work hard and focus.

[jlip]

Saying Dwight is "very raw" is different from saying that some 19 year old rookie is raw. Dwight average ~23ppg just two seasons ago. So it's not as if he has to learn how to score in the NBA. He just simply needs to learn a few moves that will improve his offensive game allowing him to be an effective 25ppg scorer.

[Flash31]

More like Sunday Night Heat.

more like Saturday Night Velocity

[boozehound]

Saying Dwight is "very raw" is different from saying that some 19 year old rookie is raw. Dwight average ~23ppg just two seasons ago. So it's not as if he has to learn how to score in the NBA. He just simply needs to learn a few moves that will improve his offensive game allowing him to be an effective 25ppg scorer.
again, you people are acting like no one has ever tried to show him a post move before. at this point, he is what he is.

[PickernRoller]

What else is new?

[andremiller07]

I also think great footwork is something you're sort of just born with.
This, it's like being a great passer same thing.

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

I'm 6 minutes into this Hakeem documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nB3iIviCIMg and in comparison to Dwight, it's so interesting how Hakeem started on his offense during a summer, because he was new to basketball, and was able to learn fundamentals so much better than Howard. He worked hard.

I do applaud Dwight for putting himself in the right situation to learn though. Just has to work hard and focus.

he can learn whatever the fcuk he wants...he wont use in real game because he is scared of the consequences of not making that shot...

lol fcuk that...i prefer bynum who jacks up 3pt shot in game to check his range then this mental midget

[bdreason]

Some people simply can't dance. Doesn't matter how many classes they take, they will never be good dancers.

[G-train]

To the haters, you can improve your post game at age 50, let alone age 27.

I would say Hakeems definition of raw is that his post talents haven't been fully tapped.

But we are talking about a guy that can average 18-20 ppg with a multitude of injuries, and 23 per game while healthy.

That's an effective scorer at the 5. He has moves already, just potential for more. Regardless of age. The only thing that would hold him back with age is his body, not his skills.

[G-train]

Some people simply can't dance. Doesn't matter how many classes they take, they will never be good dancers.

He can dance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slOlB_LfB-o

It's about a little refining, then application - and most of the game application is mental, the ability to focus and read the defence.

[sportjames23]

and he is still the best center in the NBA by a country mile :facepalm


Sad, ain't it? Never thought I'd see the center position sink so low in the NBA.

[COnDEMnED]

To the haters, you can improve your post game at age 50, let alone age 27.

I would say Hakeems definition of raw is that his post talents haven't been fully tapped.

But we are talking about a guy that can average 18-20 ppg with a multitude of injuries, and 23 per game while healthy.

That's an effective scorer at the 5. He has moves already, just potential for more. Regardless of age. The only thing that would hold him back with age is his body, not his skills.
The guys got a handful of years left in the league, you really see a post game being learned in time to use it in his final 4 or 5 years? Once his athleticism fades, what good is he? Dwight peaked years ago.

[TheBigVeto]

Everyone feeling sorry for Dwight and his pathetic post game.

Imagine all the great centers in history getting together to help you. That's not refining your game. That's sympathy.

:facepalm

He's still better than Kobe though.

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

To the haters, you can improve your post game at age 50, let alone age 27.

I would say Hakeems definition of raw is that his post talents haven't been fully tapped.

But we are talking about a guy that can average 18-20 ppg with a multitude of injuries, and 23 per game while healthy.

That's an effective scorer at the 5. He has moves already, just potential for more. Regardless of age. The only thing that would hold him back with age is his body, not his skills.

Watched him all season long last yr... Dude had ZERO post moves... Turns the ball over or clanks it over the board...he is just a sophisticated kwame brown who plays defense like hell when he wants to

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

He's still better than Kobe though.

Retard making retard posts ... Nothing new

[MavsSuperFan]

You're acting like learning a couple post moves is like learning quantum physics. Dwight can pick up some skills by working his ass off. If he wants to be great he will be in the gym every day with mchale and hakeem getting it down. Will he? Probably not, but it is definitely possible to improve your game 10 years into your career. Many players have

And yet in 10 years dwight has refused to do so :confusedshrug:

[2LeTTeRS]

All he needs is two moves that he really gets and he could score 25 a game. He needs to stop with all is extra shit. Get a jump hook over each shoulder and then start working on an up and under or spin move. Most of the latter is intuitive and he seems to just not get it.

Have you even watched Dwight beyond his year in LA? He gets buckets using those moves consistently. Reading this thread would make you believe that all his points come off dunks.


Sad, ain't it? Never thought I'd see the center position sink so low in the NBA.


Where have you been the last 10 years or so? The center position is actually getting better nowadays.

[sportjames23]

Have you even watched Dwight beyond his year in LA? He gets buckets using those moves consistently. Reading this thread would make you believe that all his points come off dunks.




Where have you been the last 10 years or so? The center position is actually getting better nowadays.

Hell, it has no where to go but up from here.

The center position is a far fvcking cry from what it was even those 10 years ago, when we had prime Shaq, Duncan and Yao. And even that era has nothing on the 80s/90s with Ewing, Robinson, Olajuwon, Shaq, Mourning, Mutombo, Smits, Daugherty, etc.