View Full Version : The Omer Asik/Dwight Howard frontcourt era to begin against Dallas
spiegel
10-21-2013, 02:20 AM
It'll be interesting. Supposedly we'll start Dwight at the 4 spot and Omer at the 5.On defense this is the best frontcourt in the league but boy i hope Dwight has his skates on because the league is full of 4 who can stepout for the jumper or use picks to create space for themselves. We have Aldridge, Love, Dirk and the Andersons who can play stretch 4 and go inside.
I can see us playing lots of 2-3 zone with those two monsters guarding the paint and forcing teams into a 3 point of jump shot oriented game.
3peated
10-21-2013, 02:25 AM
those 2 don't belong on the same team, asik needs to be traded for a legit 4
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 02:30 AM
those 2 don't belong on the same team, asik needs to be traded for a legit 4You think Houston management and their grandmas don't all know this? But you can't move your "Dwight insurance" just yet. What if he starts acting out again and demands a trade? You can move Dwight for a decent package while still having a top 5 center.
3peated
10-21-2013, 02:31 AM
You think Houston management and their grandmas don't all know this? But you can't move your "Dwight insurance" just yet. What if he starts acting out again and demands a trade? You can move Dwight for a decent package while still having a top 5 center.
did you just call asik a top 5 center
no pun intended
10-21-2013, 02:33 AM
did you just call asik a top 5 center
lmao
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 02:35 AM
did you just call asik a top 5 centerDwight, Marc Gasol, Noah, Lopez, Asik... you can probably argue Cousins over him off pure talent and potential (but he certainly isn't as positively impactful as Asik yet). Dude averaged 10/11.7 last season, was 3rd in rebounding and played great D. Why this statement so ridiculous?
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 02:38 AM
lmaoAsik being a top 5 C is more laughable than 3peated thinking Dwight's mature enough to invest in, and trade Asik?
spiegel
10-21-2013, 02:38 AM
did you just call asik a top 5 center
Per minute Asik is one of the best rebounders in the league if not the best.He is also at worst a top 3 or 4 interior defensive anchors in the NBA. Dude was a 10 points 11 boards player in his first season as a starter. Essentialy he can only get better.
andremiller07
10-21-2013, 02:48 AM
Per minute Asik is one of the best rebounders in the league if not the best.He is also at worst a top 3 or 4 interior defensive anchors in the NBA. Dude was a 10 points 11 boards player in his first season as a starter. Essentialy he can only get better.
He's not a top 5 centre he's a good player but he has not got the talent/ability/impact of a top 5 nor will he ever.
spiegel
10-21-2013, 02:53 AM
He's not a top 5 centre he's a good player but he has not got the talent/ability/impact of a top 5 nor will he ever.
On defense he is easily a top 5 center. I never implied he was a top5 center either. But if you want to make that distinction, he is easily a top 5 defensive anchor in the league. Last sweason with Omer on the floor the Rockets had the second best Plus defensive rating in the league, when he sat, we had the 4th worst record.
its just an experiment to see how asik and dwight plays with each other against some real competition.
i really doubt mchale will use this frontcourt combo much in the reg season. for one thing it really shrinks the court for the wing guys to attack the paint since it will be so crowded with nonshooters asik and dwight in there... and i know dwight has been working on his jumpshot. trust me. its not there, it wont be there, and it will never be there.
andremiller07
10-21-2013, 02:56 AM
On defense he is easily a top 5 center. I never implied he was a top5 center either.
That I will agree with
3peated
10-21-2013, 02:57 AM
there are probably a dozen better centers than asik. houston had money to blow and overpaid him to be a starter, when honestly he should just be a back up to a real center.
bogut, gasol, noah, lopez, jefferson, cousins, gortat, monroe, horford, hibbert, shit even kaman is a more qualified starter than him.
spiegel
10-21-2013, 03:02 AM
there are probably a dozen better centers than asik. houston had money to blow and overpaid him to be a starter, when honestly he should just be a back up to a real center.
bogut, gasol, noah, lopez, jefferson, cousins, gortat, monroe, horford, hibbert, shit even kaman is a more qualified starter than him.
Only Hibbert, Gasol and bogut come close to having Asiks impact on the defensive end. just admit you are talking out of you'r rear end regarding Asik. You clearly havent watched him much as a Rocket.
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 03:05 AM
He's not a top 5 centre he's a good player but he has not got the talent/ability/impact of a top 5 nor will he ever.We'll just have to agree to disagree. When I think top 5 I think impact, and Asik's impact is definitely more than his stats alone imply. The Rockets in terms of rebounding and defense were completely different with Omer in and out of the game, and that's what c's do in this day and age. I mean, I wouldn't think it's completely ridiculous if you didn't have him top 5 and wanted to argue a healthy Bynum, etc are better; but it certainly isn't ridiculous to think he's a top 5 c last season in terms of impact (the only thing that matters- I mean after all, talent and ability is only there to make you a more impactful player, right?).
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 03:09 AM
Only Hibbert, Gasol and bogut come close to having Asiks impact on the defensive end. just admit you are talking out of you'r rear end regarding Asik. You clearly havent watched him much as a Rocket.He thinks Kaman RIGHT NOW is better... why are you even arguing with him?
qrich
10-21-2013, 03:09 AM
Should be interesting to see. A team with a stretch big will definitely have their ways of exploiting the Rockets on D, while on offense, most likely just packing it in.
As far as Asik being a top 5 center? Yeah, no.
3peated
10-21-2013, 03:11 AM
i also forgot to mention varejou and bynum, both better than asik.
get real dude
spiegel
10-21-2013, 03:12 AM
He thinks Kaman RIGHT NOW is better... why are you even arguing with him?
Yep.
3peated
10-21-2013, 03:14 AM
He thinks Kaman RIGHT NOW is better... why are you even arguing with him?
lol i list 10 people and 1 name doesnt fit, so i guess that means i dont know anything and i'm trolling
you guyssssssssssss
The JKidd Kid
10-21-2013, 08:23 AM
He thinks Kaman RIGHT NOW is better... why are you even arguing with him?
Everyone else he listed I would take over Asik in a second. The Kaman thing was really fvcking stupid.:lol
kuzdeen
10-21-2013, 08:38 AM
i'll go ahead and call a clippers and rockets wcc, unless OKC plays spoilers. :hammerhead:.. Houston's defense and offense is going to be hard to beat. ahem, dwight wins the DPOY almost every year... :hammerhead:, omer is tough to beat in the paint. on offense, a dwight/harden combo will be trouble for most teams.
2LeTTeRS
10-21-2013, 08:43 AM
there are probably a dozen better centers than asik. houston had money to blow and overpaid him to be a starter, when honestly he should just be a back up to a real center.
bogut, gasol, noah, lopez, jefferson, cousins, gortat, monroe, horford, hibbert, shit even kaman is a more qualified starter than him.
Are you serious? Gortat and Kaman are nowhere near as good as Asik and Bogut used to be, but the version that currently exists is not either. Monroe is more talented; but I see him as a 4 instead of a 5 (and he'll be playing that position this year).
Depending on how your team is constructed I'd say a good few teams would take him over guys like Jefferson, Horford and Cousins at the 5. All of those guys are obviously more talented, but in the current NBA its more valuable to have a center whose a defensive anchor than a scorer.
Also where's Tyson Chandler and Nikola Pekovic? They are better centers than about half the guys you mentioned.
Top C list
1. Dwight
2. Duncan
3. M. Gasol
4. Noah
5. Hibbert
6. Brook
7. Cousins
8. Pekovic
9. Chandler
10. Horford/Jefferson/Asik
bdreason
10-21-2013, 03:24 PM
Rockets were having sppacing issues in the preseason with just Dwight on the court. As a Warriors fan, I endorse the use of both Howard and Asik. :oldlol:
You think Houston management and their grandmas don't all know this? But you can't move your "Dwight insurance" just yet. What if he starts acting out again and demands a trade? You can move Dwight for a decent package while still having a top 5 center.
There's another center on your team who is also Top 5?
Mr Exlax
10-21-2013, 03:40 PM
It might be alright for us in stretches. Like 2 minutes here or there lol. This is gonna be baaaaaaad, but oh well. Maybe we'll jack a million 3s and Dwight and Asik will just be there to rebound and get putbacks.
spiegel
10-21-2013, 06:51 PM
There's another center on your team who is also Top 5?
You mean #1 right? Dwight is the best overall C in the game.
CanYouDigIt
10-21-2013, 07:11 PM
Rockets don't have to play Dwight big minutes since they have Asik to back him up. This allows Dwight to stay healthy throughout the season and Asik still gets his minutes, even if he doesn't start.
SCdac
10-21-2013, 07:22 PM
where has Asik been? .... hurt?
should be interesting. basketball rotations. what works, what doesn't. do defense react accordingly. etc, etc.
game starting soon on NBATV. MNF is a snoozer so NBA tonight
Lin starting tonight
cos88
10-21-2013, 08:18 PM
can't see howard going to the 3p line to guard strech 4s. maybe play them together for a couple of minutes in a game but that's all. let's say they play miami. bosh at center, battier at pf both in the corners, that would be fun :lol
no one playing any type of real defense in this game.
R.I.P.
10-21-2013, 08:28 PM
no one playing any type of real defense in this game.
Not true. That is the Mavs real defense. Probably Houston, too. :lol
It's A VC3!!!
10-21-2013, 09:49 PM
Great pass from Vince. Led to a wipe open three but that player who I have no idea who he is, missed it.
R.I.P.
10-21-2013, 09:56 PM
Dirk shut it down and went home. :lol
Dirty Dirk. point of emphasis
Swish41YoAzz
10-21-2013, 09:58 PM
Dirk shut it down and went home. :lol
:lol
ripthekik
10-21-2013, 10:31 PM
so did they play this duo together or what?
bdreason
10-21-2013, 10:32 PM
so did they play this duo together or what?
Yes, and it didn't work.
ripthekik
10-21-2013, 10:36 PM
Yes, and it didn't work.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
I hope there'll be some highlight video of it soon. Sounds hilarious
Kblaze8855
10-21-2013, 11:16 PM
It was nothing of note.
Watched some of it on ballstreams and im watching a bit more now. Lin had a nice drop off to Dwight for a dunk on a pick and roll with Asik in. Got a couple layups. Dwight contested Dirk outside and he missed. Couple plays later he seemed to forget Dirk could shoot and gave him a wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide open 3 that he missed.
They were on some hungry hungry hippos shit on the glass. Made some mental errors coaching could work out.
The rockets broadcaster said he felt it could be their best lineup a few minutes into it.
Just had some headscratching moments where Dwight seemed to forget he had the 4. The precious spacing was a virtual non issue in what I saw and I just jumped around the stream to moments they played together. Someone feels otherwise ill happily take another look. But it seemed fine to me.
As a bulls fan id feel worse playing them with both those guys in. Boozer and Taj can shoot.....but the team isnt gonna just....play off them.
They totally own the glass though. And when they work out the mental mistakes they will pretty much remove the paint as an option.
ripthekik
10-21-2013, 11:33 PM
It was nothing of note.
Watched some of it on ballstreams and im watching a bit more now. Lin had a nice drop off to Dwight for a dunk on a pick and roll with Asik in. Got a couple layups. Dwight contested Dirk outside and he missed. Couple plays later he seemed to forget Dirk could shoot and gave him a wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide open 3 that he missed.
They were on some hungry hungry hippos shit on the glass. Made some mental errors coaching could work out.
The rockets broadcaster said he felt it could be their best lineup a few minutes into it.
Just had some headscratching moments where Dwight seemed to forget he had the 4. The precious spacing was a virtual non issue in what I saw and I just jumped around the stream to moments they played together. Someone feels otherwise ill happily take another look. But it seemed fine to me.
As a bulls fan id feel worse playing them with both those guys in. Boozer and Taj can shoot.....but the team isnt gonna just....play off them.
They totally own the glass though. And when they work out the mental mistakes they will pretty much remove the paint as an option.
So you think it's a viable option?
I don't see Dwight being able to play the 4 spot for long. He'll eventually get pissed of staying outside the paint, he'll get burned by quick 4's, and his rebound will likely go down. I think it's best he stay in the paint to be effective.
Yes, and it didn't work.Wrong. It worked "okay".
This was their first time playing together, and Asik has been hurt so they haven't even been practicing together.
Considering all of that, it wasn't bad. It wasn't good, but it wasn't bad. Spacing wasn't bad.
There was some confusion on their parts, but that will come with practice playing together.
They just need more work.
Kblaze8855
10-21-2013, 11:45 PM
Playing the 4 wont take him out of the paint. Its going to barely change anything he does. He did....exactly what he always does. Well he also took a 15 foot bank but he did that in Orlando a good bit.
The only reason Dwight has not been a 4 his entire career is Darko not panning out in Orlando like it briefly looked like he would.
He had 17 rebounds in 20 something minutes.
Hes fine.
Dwight is like 6'9'' anyway. Hes not exactly Mark Eaton.
That lineup is gonna be out there plenty of time as anyone thinking it out assumed it would. You cant keep them both out for long.
They are gonna mix. Team will win 52-58 games and lose in the second or third round either way.
j3lademaster
10-21-2013, 11:46 PM
So you think it's a viable option?
I don't see Dwight being able to play the 4 spot for long. He'll eventually get pissed of staying outside the paint, he'll get burned by quick 4's, and his rebound will likely go down. I think it's best he stay in the paint to be effective.This. I don't doubt Dwight's physical ability to stay with quicker 4's, but when his rpg stat goes below double digits the whining's going to begin and it's going to be Asik's, McHale's, Houston's, the judge giving him extra pressure on his alimonies fault he's not an mvp candidate.
Kblaze8855
10-21-2013, 11:53 PM
Really....
Did you all not notice Dwight being a 4 in Orlando getting like 13 rebounds a game playing with Darko, battie, and Cato?
Why would he suddenly get less than 10 due to playing the 4 now?
Because his position on an ESPN graphic will say hes a PF and not a C while hes standing in the exact same place doing the exact same thing?
Playing stretch 4s dont stop other great rebounders. It wont stop him either.
And Asik will defend some 4s too. Not like he didnt do it on the Bulls.
Droid101
10-22-2013, 12:04 AM
bogut, gasol, noah, lopez, jefferson, cousins, gortat, monroe, horford, hibbert, shit even kaman is a more qualified starter than him.
Not amused.
http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/visual/whatshot/2813_Pekovic.jpg
spiegel
10-22-2013, 04:34 AM
I saw more then enough to see once Asik gets into the rhythem with Dwight things will workout. Dwight looked amazing as a PF. He defended the pick and roll really well and thrived in the 4 spot. I thougt he would struggle coming out of the paint but he is crazy agile for his size and can defend his man off the picks by the opposition. He is an incridible versatile defensive force.I think he finished with 15 points 17 boards 3 steals and tons of alterd shots in 29 minutes without even going into the second gear.
Asik while looking rusty, still alterd alot of shots and had 9 boards so he will improve with more game time. Against the Grizzlies,Pacers, Spurs and other big frontline this will be great.
Kblaze8855
10-24-2013, 08:15 PM
Anyone watching them vs the spurs now?
Pick and rolls out the ass. Dwight gets one for a nasty one hander. Then Asik gets one off the pick and roll that Diaw blocked.
They have blocked or altered 4 of the spurs 5 inside shots and the one that they didnt was a putback after one of them spooked Green into missing a layup.
Aside from Dwight just thugging Asik to steal his rebound over the back they look great together to me.
KungFuJoe
10-24-2013, 08:20 PM
Howard looks like shit. Like he never played ball before.
Three TOs already. All ugly ones too.
Kblaze8855
10-24-2013, 08:23 PM
Asik pulled a Stonehands Mutombo on that dumpoff from Dwight but yea...Dwight looks sloppy even by his standards.
KungFuJoe
10-24-2013, 08:24 PM
Hmm...that last one was a bad call. On the replay shows he didn't travel.
Shows that refs have ZERO respect for his game.
RidonKs
10-24-2013, 09:22 PM
dwight has four turnovers and every one was the result of an isolation on the right side against tim duncan where he backed in a few times with his right shoulder then drove left and got stripped. shameful shit.
he at least looks pretty mobile tonight against the spurs... it's in spurts and you can see him slack off occasionally, a few times huddling on the weakside instead of flashing, jogging back instead of going after offensive boards, etc. but more consistent than most of last season. his defensive awareness alone is elite, combine that with becoming more active and energized by his situation....
i've got a lot of faith in dwight coming into this season. i really think this is a perfect situation for him. great organization with a good coach, surrounded by a bunch of scorers. expectations are lower than they were last year. he should be more comfortable and i think by christmas he's gonna start to feel more comfortable and we're gonna see a lot out of him. he'll start to play with a lot more zeal.
i don't see a big problem with he and asik playing together, especially if one of their stretch four options steps up this season in the odd scenario that certain lineups are able to take advantage without getting crushed on the boards. casspi looks terrific tonight.
SamuraiSWISH
10-24-2013, 09:25 PM
i don't see a big problem with he and asik playing
Late game liability free-throw shooting?
noob cake
10-24-2013, 09:25 PM
Howard offense is pretty brutal, but at least he is a good outlet passer plus a massive intimidator on defense.
russwest0
10-24-2013, 09:28 PM
I hope they do this so much vs OKC.
Throw Durant at the 4 and epic lulz will be ensued
RidonKs
10-24-2013, 09:33 PM
Late game liability free-throw shooting?
maybe but only in rare situations. fouling dwight deep is always a scary option especially when he's healthy. he's no shaq or lebron but he run the massive risk of having him bust through and finish. i dont see it as all that significant tbh. it's not gonna be a make/break factor very often. if rockets are up and expecting fouls late, i expect asik will be put on the bench in favour of a superior shooter, dwight will just be setting screens.
Fudge
10-24-2013, 09:36 PM
Asik for PJ3, Perkins, and a draft pick. Done.
noob cake
10-24-2013, 09:36 PM
Spurs hadn't had a layup in a while. All jump shots.
the dwight asik frontcourt working tonight but spurs are playing passively in a way. dwight is getting his points via pick and roll though.
and hes also poaching rebounds from teammates. most noteably asik
Xsatyr
10-24-2013, 09:40 PM
Rockets put on a little run and now the Spurs have mentally checked out. I don't think we'll see the starters in the 4th.
Edit: Spurs are done for the night.
spiegel
10-25-2013, 01:25 AM
That 3rd quarter Dwight and Omer bullied Duncan and Splitter in the paint. Both those two were cleaning the glass on the offensive and defensive end and were altering shots which allowed Harden to start getting aggressive and he exploded as did Dwight on offense.
This was there only second game as a tandom so it will improve more and more. Dwight is averaging 15 points and 16 boards in 27 minutes with Omer.BTW, Omri Casspi is turning out to be one of the best steals of the offseason.
secund2nun
10-25-2013, 01:35 AM
I think it can work well, even if it's not ideal. The reason is that they would have insane rebounding and insane post defense. Also they have great outside shooting on the team and that combined with the great rebounding can make their offense pretty good. They will rebound everything in sight. Plus even though Howard's offense may suffer a bit when on the floor with Asik he will still get his.
Post defense, rebounding, and post offense is what wins titles.
spiegel
10-25-2013, 05:17 AM
Actually playing with a monster like Asik can help Dwight have more energy on offense as he knows he wont have to extert so much energy on D because Asik's post defense is on par with Dwight. Not as good as a help defender as Dwight, but his straightup post defense is insane.
All Net
10-25-2013, 06:04 AM
Going to be hard getting rebounds off them that's for sure.
East_Stone_Ya
10-25-2013, 06:55 AM
and dwight will start at PF then?
Mr Exlax
10-25-2013, 08:50 AM
That 3rd quarter Dwight and Omer bullied Duncan and Splitter in the paint.
I'm hoping like hell we do the same thing to Memphis. I know they're gonna be better than Duncan and Splitter, but we have some some big bodies. How do you think it's gonna turn out?
mugiwara
10-25-2013, 06:44 PM
I hope they do this so much vs OKC.
Throw Durant at the 4 and epic lulz will be ensued
wonder how durant will go when dwight posts him up.
All Net
10-25-2013, 06:45 PM
they are starting again tonight.
spiegel
10-25-2013, 07:24 PM
I'm hoping like hell we do the same thing to Memphis. I know they're gonna be better than Duncan and Splitter, but we have some some big bodies. How do you think it's gonna turn out?
The good thing about this is we are turning teams into a more premeter oriented offense. Teams will be scared to attack the basket with two elite post defenders in there. The Spurs were hesistent to attack the basket by 3 quarter time and were relying on shooting jumpers as the staple of there offense.
Mr Exlax
10-25-2013, 07:34 PM
The good thing about this is we are turning teams into a more premeter oriented offense. Teams will be scared to attack the basket with two elite post defenders in there. The Spurs were hesistent to attack the basket by 3 quarter time and were relying on shooting jumpers as the staple of there offense.
I think tonight will be our best test. They have two big men with low post moves. We have two bigger men who are gonna shut them down I hope lol. What time is it starting? Oh and is it on CSN?
spiegel
10-25-2013, 07:40 PM
Randolph and Gasol can stepout and hit the jumpers or in Gasol's case hit the 3. I think it will be a little tougher tonight but yeah those guys are bruisers so this matches us well. Should be on CSN like last night games was.
Meticode
10-25-2013, 07:40 PM
You think Houston management and their grandmas don't all know this? But you can't move your "Dwight insurance" just yet. What if he starts acting out again and demands a trade? You can move Dwight for a decent package while still having a top 5 center.
No, becuase they wouldn't be playingthe motherf*ckers together at all unless it's a end of game situation possibly and you're on defense for the last shot. Asik would come off the bench in all cases other than that with Howard on the floor.
Randolph and Gasol can stepout and hit the jumpers or in Gasol's case hit the 3. I think it will be a little tougher tonight but yeah those guys are bruisers so this matches us well. Should be on CSN like last night games was.
I would live with Gasol taking 3's all night :oldlol: .
Asik and Howard are quick enough to defend the mid range and not have to worry about either Zach or Gasol blowing by them.
spiegel
10-25-2013, 08:41 PM
Howard put fatass Gasol back into his place.:oldlol:
Nick Young
10-25-2013, 09:22 PM
Cant wait to see Dirk shitting on Dwight:rockon:
Funnyfuka
10-26-2013, 12:30 AM
there are probably a dozen better centers than asik. houston had money to blow and overpaid him to be a starter, when honestly he should just be a back up to a real center.
bogut, gasol, noah, lopez, jefferson, cousins, gortat, monroe, horford, hibbert, shit even kaman is a more qualified starter than him.
did you just say that gortat is better than asik? smh
spiegel
10-26-2013, 12:58 AM
Memphis was forced into shooting jumpers for 90% of the time Dwight and Asik were out there. They had a tottal of 5 made baskets when Asik and Dwight were out there for a quarter and half. The Rockets interior defense was huge.Asik also probably could have had 10 or more points in the 1st half had he not missed some wide open layups so he'll get his with defenses collapsing on Dwight. His 4 points came from Dwight passes.
As for Memphis, I think they will struggle against us and our elite interior defensive teams because if you take away their interior scoring, outside of Miller and Bayless, they have no good 3point shooters. They rely on Gasol and Randolph way to much.
SyRyanYang
10-26-2013, 05:36 AM
This frontcourt doesn't stand a chance against Spurs, Thunders, Warriors or the Heat in the unlike event that they get to the finals.
50/50 chance against the Clippers
Memphis is the only contender (sort of) that relies heavily on interior offense.
disel
10-26-2013, 05:52 AM
Reay twarp? the night before the same Rockets smashed the Spurs in San Antonio with the Spurs being forced into a jump shooting team. Not so smart now are you sheep molester.
Jameerthefear
10-26-2013, 06:08 AM
This frontcourt doesn't stand a chance against Spurs, Thunders, Warriors or the Heat in the unlike event that they get to the finals.
50/50 chance against the Clippers
Memphis is the only contender (sort of) that relies heavily on interior offense.
How does it not lol?
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