Is Rick Adelman transforming this years T-wolves into the Kings of the early 2000s?

[Yung D-Will]

I remember when Rick Adalmen first signed with Minny everyone labeled them as a team on the rise. However, because of injuies to Rubio, love, pek, Jj, B roy, and nearly everyone on that squad the deveopment was put to a hult, and their record disappointed many.

Fast foward to this year, and theyre finally healthy, and Adelman has had a chance to surround Love, Rubio, and Pek with high iq players that can play effectively in his system.

Now lets talk about Adelman, It seems like people have forgotten how excellent a coach he really is. This is the guy who coached Portland to the finals, constructed one of the most offensively dominant teams in the early 2000's in the sacremento kings, and took injury prone Houston teams to the playoffs that really didnt belong there. This is a coach who's been excellent at developing young players throught his career, and has one of the best coaching win perecents of all times. He has a proven system, that hes adapted to drastically different teams and levels of talent. I've never actually considered a guy like Doc Rivers a better coach than Adelman for his ability to adapt and win with a variety of different rosters.

Anyhow, offensively do you think this years Minny squad can get to the level of some of Ricks other teams?

[HomieWeMajor]

I predict a 60 win season for the Wolves within 3 years.

[Yung D-Will]

People really forget how elite an offense Adelman implements

[LakersDaBEst]

I think picking Kevin martin was really nice as well

[FireDavidKahn]

He's been doing it since he got here. The difference this year is that all the players are finally buying in and we brought it some very smart/good vets in Martin and Brewer. This team is legit and even more so once Bud comes back.

[Brook(lyn)Lopez]

This offense can lead to a lot of regular season wins.
Too bad the personnel is piss poor defensively.
It's not a good thing when your best defender is Ricky Rubio, and you have two defensive sieves in the starting line up.
They won't go far in the play offs for this reason unless they sacrifice scoring for at least passable defense.

[FireDavidKahn]

This offense can lead to a lot of regular season wins.
Too bad the personnel is piss poor defensively.
It's not a good thing when your best defender is Ricky Rubio, and you have two defensive sieves in the starting line up.
They won't go far in the play offs for this reason unless they sacrifice scoring for at least passable defense.
The context of that sentence makes it seem like you think Ricky is a bad defender, which he is far from. He is an upper echelon defender.

[Brook(lyn)Lopez]

The context of that sentence makes it seem like you think Ricky is a bad defender, which he is far from. He is an upper echelon defender.

I'm not, I know he's a great defender, but he's a point guard, and they traditionally have the least impact defensively out of all positions on the court, so to make up for the other poor defenders in the starting line up, he'd have to be a transcending defender at the point guard position and that would sacrifice some of his energy on the offensive end.

[Yung D-Will]

I think a big thing with Rick Adelman, is that even though hes an elite offensive coach, he still wants his teams to be above average defensively. He might not have great individual defenders but the team defensive schemes usally make his teams effective, on that end of the floor.

[andremiller07]

The Kings other than the PG spot were all more talented and better passing players than the current Twovles, but I can see what OP is trying to say though Rick is a elite coach.

[Yung D-Will]

The Kings other than the PG spot were all more talented and better passing players than the current Twovles, but I can see what OP is trying to say though Rick is a elite coach.
Ot: I pmed u like 2 days ago lol.

[andremiller07]

Ot: I pmed u like 2 days ago lol.
I didn't get anything man,you sure it was to me?

[La Frescobaldi]

This offense can lead to a lot of regular season wins.
Too bad the personnel is piss poor defensively.
It's not a good thing when your best defender is Ricky Rubio, and you have two defensive sieves in the starting line up.
They won't go far in the play offs for this reason unless they sacrifice scoring for at least passable defense.

remains to be seen. They are shutting down stars so far, which in this league, wins a lot of games. Now whether these guys are having off nights who knows. 3 games in there's no answer yet.

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

I predict a 60 win season for the Wolves within 3 years.
Shoot, I think they can hit 50 this season. ...if they stay healthy.

But funny coincidence, I was just talking to an online buddy of mine about this the other night, comparing this TWolves team to the early 00s Kings teams. Here's how I broke it down.

- Pek : Divac - Pek is more physical and technical. Divac is the better passer, which fits Adelman's O better. But Adelman's system needs a rebounder/middle clogger on D. While different styles, I like Pek better, even though Divac is the better fit for Adelman

- KLove : CWebb - KLove is basically a less athletic CWebb w/ less passing ability, but way better rebounding and range. It's almost a wash here in regards to Adelman's system. CWebb can pass, KLove can shoot. Both are needed for Adelman's O.

- Brewer : Christie - yeah Brewer is SF and Christie was SG, but I'll address that in a bit. Both players basically fit the role of defender/athletic slasher type. Though I think Christie was the better defender (not based on my opinion, based on the lack of games I've seen Brewer play - maybe a handful).

- KMart : Peja - here's the key, the shooting wing (SF or SG, doesn't matter). Peja was a better pure shooter, but KLove can fill that spot. Having the 2nd shooter in KMart is just icing on the cake. He can just chill in the corner and shoot like Peja did adding a supplemental shooting threat. While Bibby was a good shooter, he was handling the ball. And Hedo came off the bench, spelling Peja usually. Here, the TWolves have 2 off-ball shooters on the floor at the same time.

- Rubio : JDubb/Bibby - Rubio is a better JDubb. Bibby was probably more fundamentally sound, but Rubio is young and can develop. Rubio is basically the prototypical PG for Adelman's O

- Turiaf/Dieng/Cunningham/Williams : Keon Clark/Funderburke/Pollard - pretty similar bench bigs - got a defender, rebounder, poster, banger, etc. Advantage to TWolves for Derrick Williams range and athleticism.

- Budinger/Shabazz : Hedo/Gerald Wallace - Budinger fits the Hedo role of bench shooter, though is probably more athletic. Shabazz and Wallace are washes as Wallace was way underdeveloped and Shabazz is also unproven so far.

- JJ Barea : Bobby Jackson - the little spark plug off the bench. Wash.

The teams aren't carbon copies, obviously, though there are lots of similarities. So, while the Adelman Kings teams had better passing bigs, I think the TWolves team is better suited w/ the extra range, athleticism, and interior presence it has. Rubio makes up for the lack of passing bigs.

The one disadvantage the TWolves have is that they play in a much more stacked West than the Kings played in. I don't like the "era debate" in regards to individual play/skill/talent. But I definitely do acknowledge eras in regards to team accomplishments. And it was easier for the Kings.

[Yung D-Will]

Shoot, I think they can hit 50 this season. ...if they stay healthy.

But funny coincidence, I was just talking to an online buddy of mine about this the other night, comparing this TWolves team to the early 00s Kings teams. Here's how I broke it down.

- Pek : Divac - Pek is more physical and technical. Divac is the better passer, which fits Adelman's O better. But Adelman's system needs a rebounder/middle clogger on D. While different styles, I like Pek better, even though Divac is the better fit for Adelman

- KLove : CWebb - KLove is basically a less athletic CWebb w/ less passing ability, but way better rebounding and range. It's almost a wash here in regards to Adelman's system. CWebb can pass, KLove can shoot. Both are needed for Adelman's O.

- Brewer : Christie - yeah Brewer is SF and Christie was SG, but I'll address that in a bit. Both players basically fit the role of defender/athletic slasher type. Though I think Christie was the better defender (not based on my opinion, based on the lack of games I've seen Brewer play - maybe a handful).

- KMart : Peja - here's the key, the shooting wing (SF or SG, doesn't matter). Peja was a better pure shooter, but KLove can fill that spot. Having the 2nd shooter in KMart is just icing on the cake. He can just chill in the corner and shoot like Peja did adding a supplemental shooting threat. While Bibby was a good shooter, he was handling the ball. And Hedo came off the bench, spelling Peja usually. Here, the TWolves have 2 off-ball shooters on the floor at the same time.

- Rubio : JDubb/Bibby - Rubio is a better JDubb. Bibby was probably more fundamentally sound, but Rubio is young and can develop. Rubio is basically the prototypical PG for Adelman's O

- Turiaf/Dieng/Cunningham/Williams : Keon Clark/Funderburke/Pollard - pretty similar bench bigs - got a defender, rebounder, poster, banger, etc. Advantage to TWolves for Derrick Williams range and athleticism.

- Budinger/Shabazz : Hedo/Gerald Wallace - Budinger fits the Hedo role of bench shooter, though is probably more athletic. Shabazz and Wallace are washes as Wallace was way underdeveloped and Shabazz is also unproven so far.

- JJ Barea : Bobby Jackson - the little spark plug off the bench. Wash.

The teams aren't carbon copies, obviously, though there are lots of similarities. So, while the Adelman Kings teams had better passing bigs, I think the TWolves team is better suited w/ the extra range, athleticism, and interior presence it has. Rubio makes up for the lack of passing bigs.

The one disadvantage the TWolves have is that they play in a much more stacked West than the Kings played in. I don't like the "era debate" in regards to individual play/skill/talent. But I definitely do acknowledge eras in regards to team accomplishments. And it was easier for the Kings.
Excellent post

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

Excellent post
thanks.

I should clarify CWebb was a great rebounder himself, not like he was some chump rebounder. And Christie was an elite defender, so I'll safely assume his D is better than Brewer's, though again, I haven't seen a lot of Brewer (saw him once in person...destroyed the Kings w/ fast break dunks all night), but his name is rarely brought up in elite perimeter defender convos. But given Adelman's O system, not sure defense even matters...

[JimmyMcAdocious]

hm?

Divac > Pek (for Adelman's system) - I feel the passing ability from Divac (and Webber) was crucial for the system to run well.

Webber > Love - I think Webber has gotten underrated since he retired for some reason. Weird because his flashy type of game and the recent Fab 5 hype would make me think the opposite would happen. Love's ability to shoot does give him a favorable upside, tho.

Christie > Brewer (maybe...) - I actually haven't watched Brewer play for the Wolves this year. If he's the same as he was with Denver then this isn't even close. Crazy chucker, known for his defense who apparently didn't want to play defense.

Peja > Martin

Rubio = Bibby - I actually think Bibby is a better point guard for Adelman. Good passer, but can be effective off the ball for more effective ball movement. Leader, big shot maker... Bibby and Terry Porter were Adelman's two main PGs on his great teams and they are pretty similar. Neither play like Rubio. Rubio can be very good in this system, tho, and I just like Rubio so I give it an equal. He needs a jumper soon.

Bobby Jax > Barea - C'mon...


The Warriors offense would be amazing with Adelman. That seems more like his personnel.

[SoCalLakersFan1]

The Wolves have been flexing their new shooting arms, but remember that its their front line that can dominate teams. Chandler and Bargnani were pretty much forced out of the game because of Pek + Love.

[FireDavidKahn]

Kevin Love through 3 games: 29.7 PPG, 14.7 RPG, 3.7 APG, .500 FG, .381 3P%, .795 FT%, 13 FTA per game.

:bowdown:

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

Bobby Jax > Barea - C'mon...

in regards to skill, for sure. I called them a wash simply b/c they fill the same role. But yes, overall, BJax was probably better, though Barea is no pushover for the role.

Btw, true story, after BJax left and played for NO, I saw him at a club one night when NO was visiting. Like, my friend's gf's friend's sister, who was super fine, was dancing all over him, twerking on his crotch while he was just posted up on the wall. He wasn't haddin dat, completely just looking around looking bored as if she wasn't there. I always thought "man, what a badass dude to resist the temptation of hot groupies..." He probably hit it later, though. Damn, I'm horny now.

[Bigsmoke]

Shoot, I think they can hit 50 this season. ...if they stay healthy.

But funny coincidence, I was just talking to an online buddy of mine about this the other night, comparing this TWolves team to the early 00s Kings teams. Here's how I broke it down.

- Pek : Divac - Pek is more physical and technical. Divac is the better passer, which fits Adelman's O better. But Adelman's system needs a rebounder/middle clogger on D. While different styles, I like Pek better, even though Divac is the better fit for Adelman

- KLove : CWebb - KLove is basically a less athletic CWebb w/ less passing ability, but way better rebounding and range. It's almost a wash here in regards to Adelman's system. CWebb can pass, KLove can shoot. Both are needed for Adelman's O.

- Brewer : Christie - yeah Brewer is SF and Christie was SG, but I'll address that in a bit. Both players basically fit the role of defender/athletic slasher type. Though I think Christie was the better defender (not based on my opinion, based on the lack of games I've seen Brewer play - maybe a handful).

- KMart : Peja - here's the key, the shooting wing (SF or SG, doesn't matter). Peja was a better pure shooter, but KLove can fill that spot. Having the 2nd shooter in KMart is just icing on the cake. He can just chill in the corner and shoot like Peja did adding a supplemental shooting threat. While Bibby was a good shooter, he was handling the ball. And Hedo came off the bench, spelling Peja usually. Here, the TWolves have 2 off-ball shooters on the floor at the same time.

- Rubio : JDubb/Bibby - Rubio is a better JDubb. Bibby was probably more fundamentally sound, but Rubio is young and can develop. Rubio is basically the prototypical PG for Adelman's O

- Turiaf/Dieng/Cunningham/Williams : Keon Clark/Funderburke/Pollard - pretty similar bench bigs - got a defender, rebounder, poster, banger, etc. Advantage to TWolves for Derrick Williams range and athleticism.

- Budinger/Shabazz : Hedo/Gerald Wallace - Budinger fits the Hedo role of bench shooter, though is probably more athletic. Shabazz and Wallace are washes as Wallace was way underdeveloped and Shabazz is also unproven so far.

- JJ Barea : Bobby Jackson - the little spark plug off the bench. Wash.

The teams aren't carbon copies, obviously, though there are lots of similarities. So, while the Adelman Kings teams had better passing bigs, I think the TWolves team is better suited w/ the extra range, athleticism, and interior presence it has. Rubio makes up for the lack of passing bigs.

The one disadvantage the TWolves have is that they play in a much more stacked West than the Kings played in. I don't like the "era debate" in regards to individual play/skill/talent. But I definitely do acknowledge eras in regards to team accomplishments. And it was easier for the Kings.

Well if u put it that way...

[AintNoSunshine]

That's an interesting observation, but even if it's true it's a poor man's version, especially at the pg's position, Bibby's great P&R shooting ability was key to that King's team.

And minus the superstar he had in Chris Webber too, don't forget the NBA is a superstar's league

[Mr. Jabbar]

82-0

[andremiller07]

The Kings were that good even without Webber a superstar they were still an elite team with Miller and Divac running shit while Peja was a top 10 MVP candidate. I can't see the Wolves doing that if Love goes down.

[BarberSchool]

Shoot, I think they can hit 50 this season. ...if they stay healthy.

But funny coincidence, I was just talking to an online buddy of mine about this the other night, comparing this TWolves team to the early 00s Kings teams. Here's how I broke it down.

- Pek : Divac - Pek is more physical and technical. Divac is the better passer, which fits Adelman's O better. But Adelman's system needs a rebounder/middle clogger on D. While different styles, I like Pek better, even though Divac is the better fit for Adelman

- KLove : CWebb - KLove is basically a less athletic CWebb w/ less passing ability, but way better rebounding and range. It's almost a wash here in regards to Adelman's system. CWebb can pass, KLove can shoot. Both are needed for Adelman's O.

- Brewer : Christie - yeah Brewer is SF and Christie was SG, but I'll address that in a bit. Both players basically fit the role of defender/athletic slasher type. Though I think Christie was the better defender (not based on my opinion, based on the lack of games I've seen Brewer play - maybe a handful).

- KMart : Peja - here's the key, the shooting wing (SF or SG, doesn't matter). Peja was a better pure shooter, but KLove can fill that spot. Having the 2nd shooter in KMart is just icing on the cake. He can just chill in the corner and shoot like Peja did adding a supplemental shooting threat. While Bibby was a good shooter, he was handling the ball. And Hedo came off the bench, spelling Peja usually. Here, the TWolves have 2 off-ball shooters on the floor at the same time.

- Rubio : JDubb/Bibby - Rubio is a better JDubb. Bibby was probably more fundamentally sound, but Rubio is young and can develop. Rubio is basically the prototypical PG for Adelman's O

- Turiaf/Dieng/Cunningham/Williams : Keon Clark/Funderburke/Pollard - pretty similar bench bigs - got a defender, rebounder, poster, banger, etc. Advantage to TWolves for Derrick Williams range and athleticism.

- Budinger/Shabazz : Hedo/Gerald Wallace - Budinger fits the Hedo role of bench shooter, though is probably more athletic. Shabazz and Wallace are washes as Wallace was way underdeveloped and Shabazz is also unproven so far.

- JJ Barea : Bobby Jackson - the little spark plug off the bench. Wash.

The teams aren't carbon copies, obviously, though there are lots of similarities. So, while the Adelman Kings teams had better passing bigs, I think the TWolves team is better suited w/ the extra range, athleticism, and interior presence it has. Rubio makes up for the lack of passing bigs.

The one disadvantage the TWolves have is that they play in a much more stacked West than the Kings played in. I don't like the "era debate" in regards to individual play/skill/talent. But I definitely do acknowledge eras in regards to team accomplishments. And it was easier for the Kings.

Word. Best post I've seen on ISH since last season. :cheers:

[dgaras]

Shoot, I think they can hit 50 this season. ...if they stay healthy.

But funny coincidence, I was just talking to an online buddy of mine about this the other night, comparing this TWolves team to the early 00s Kings teams. Here's how I broke it down.

- Pek : Divac - Pek is more physical and technical. Divac is the better passer, which fits Adelman's O better. But Adelman's system needs a rebounder/middle clogger on D. While different styles, I like Pek better, even though Divac is the better fit for Adelman

- KLove : CWebb - KLove is basically a less athletic CWebb w/ less passing ability, but way better rebounding and range. It's almost a wash here in regards to Adelman's system. CWebb can pass, KLove can shoot. Both are needed for Adelman's O.

- Brewer : Christie - yeah Brewer is SF and Christie was SG, but I'll address that in a bit. Both players basically fit the role of defender/athletic slasher type. Though I think Christie was the better defender (not based on my opinion, based on the lack of games I've seen Brewer play - maybe a handful).

- KMart : Peja - here's the key, the shooting wing (SF or SG, doesn't matter). Peja was a better pure shooter, but KLove can fill that spot. Having the 2nd shooter in KMart is just icing on the cake. He can just chill in the corner and shoot like Peja did adding a supplemental shooting threat. While Bibby was a good shooter, he was handling the ball. And Hedo came off the bench, spelling Peja usually. Here, the TWolves have 2 off-ball shooters on the floor at the same time.

- Rubio : JDubb/Bibby - Rubio is a better JDubb. Bibby was probably more fundamentally sound, but Rubio is young and can develop. Rubio is basically the prototypical PG for Adelman's O

- Turiaf/Dieng/Cunningham/Williams : Keon Clark/Funderburke/Pollard - pretty similar bench bigs - got a defender, rebounder, poster, banger, etc. Advantage to TWolves for Derrick Williams range and athleticism.

- Budinger/Shabazz : Hedo/Gerald Wallace - Budinger fits the Hedo role of bench shooter, though is probably more athletic. Shabazz and Wallace are washes as Wallace was way underdeveloped and Shabazz is also unproven so far.

- JJ Barea : Bobby Jackson - the little spark plug off the bench. Wash.

The teams aren't carbon copies, obviously, though there are lots of similarities. So, while the Adelman Kings teams had better passing bigs, I think the TWolves team is better suited w/ the extra range, athleticism, and interior presence it has. Rubio makes up for the lack of passing bigs.

The one disadvantage the TWolves have is that they play in a much more stacked West than the Kings played in. I don't like the "era debate" in regards to individual play/skill/talent. But I definitely do acknowledge eras in regards to team accomplishments. And it was easier for the Kings.

ill tell you what i think tomorrow.

[stallionaire]

Wolves fans have been paitently waiting... This is the season we shock and awe.

[Purch]

Adelman's been emphasizing passing ability in Love's game ever since he got there (because his system requires bigs that can pass) and you're really seeing an increase in Love's assist numbers this year. Almost had a triple double last night

[Purch]

Also I think that having a pure pass first point guard, brings a different dynamic, that Adelman hasnt traditionally had

[SavageMode]

It's too bad todays modern day Tim Donaughy would rig it for the Lakers regardless.

[Purch]

7-4. .... scoring 108.5 points a game

[InspiredLebowski]

Pretty obvious that they're winning because they finally brought Robbie Hummel over. Dude's a champion.

Seriously, I haven't been happier to watch a dude get minutes in a long, long time.

[Purch]

Pretty obvious that they're winning because they finally brought Robbie Hummel over. Dude's a champion.

Seriously, I haven't been happier to watch a dude get minutes in a long, long time.
He seems to be one of the few guys Adelman trust off his bench along with JJ and Dante. Hes a very smart player from the little Ive seen from him, which is why he gets minutes over D-will. D-will just isn't smart enough to play in Adelman's system imho

[La Frescobaldi]

He seems to be one of the few guys Adelman trust off his bench along with JJ and Dante. Hes a very smart player from the little Ive seen from him, which is why he gets minutes over D-will. D-will just isn't smart enough to play in Adelman's system imho

exactly right. Williams has a lot of ability but doesn't fit. When he plays, the offense gets worse and worse until it just falls into confusion. Teammates running into each other, spacing all wrong, he gets the ball and just goes solo.

He's trade material for that reason alone. I was hopeful that the Wolves coaching staff could bring him along but to me he's a better fit somewhere else and wish him well... there.

[Nastradamus]

This team really does remind me of those teams. There are obviously some differences, but they have a good leader at the point, a dominant PF with a combination of big man and little man talents, a very good offensive oriented C, a very efficient outside shooter on the wing(Martin/Peja) and a defensive oriented player at the other wing spot(Brewer/Christie). Barea is not quite Bobby Jackson, but they do have similarities. The Wolves could use one more interesting bench threat.

[La Frescobaldi]

This team really does remind me of those teams. There are obviously some differences, but they have a good leader at the point, a dominant PF with a combination of big man and little man talents, a very good offensive oriented C, a very efficient outside shooter on the wing(Martin/Peja) and a defensive oriented player at the other wing spot(Brewer/Christie). Barea is not quite Bobby Jackson, but they do have similarities. The Wolves could use one more interesting bench threat.

I hoped it would be Alexey Shved. Dude can flame when his shot is dropping, but he seems to have the same trouble Derrick has. Shved might be a good fit for the Warriors but it seems like he's kinda lost interest maybe due to reduced minutes, or not starting or whatever. Real strong offense when he's on tho. If Wolves had somebody like Jamal or even Crash coming off the bench for 10 minutes? :eek:

[TaLvsCuaL]

Kevin Love are playing better than ever. Rubio is a magician and with Kevin martin and Brewer don't even need to score to have a impact in the game. Barea seems to controlling much better their crazy style of play. He is making much less mistakes this year. Cunningham is the ultimate role player.

I really love this team, a joy to watch. If they stay healthy will reach playoff for sure.

Derrick Williams and Shved should get more minutes. Too short rotation in my opinion.

[Purch]

This team really does remind me of those teams. There are obviously some differences, but they have a good leader at the point, a dominant PF with a combination of big man and little man talents, a very good offensive oriented C, a very efficient outside shooter on the wing(Martin/Peja) and a defensive oriented player at the other wing spot(Brewer/Christie). Barea is not quite Bobby Jackson, but they do have similarities. The Wolves could use one more interesting bench threat.
Well remember they get Chase and Turriaf back in a couple weeks, so with the addition of Hummel it might give them what they really need. ...consistancey

[La Frescobaldi]

Well remember they get Chase and Turriaf back in a couple weeks, so with the addition of Hummel it might give them what they really need. ...consistancey
a couple of weeks???? I thought Budinger was jacked up for a while & Turiaf has broken elbow which would mean months? man this is good news

[Purch]

Im not sure about Ronnie. Bud on the other hand is back running on treadmills, and shooting the ball. So people seem to be predicting somewhere mid December

[Purch]

I'd love too see a playoff matchup between them and the clippets. Great teams... Great matchups... two elite coaches