RUMOR: Amar'e Stoudemire for Gerald Wallace/Courtney Lee

[bagelred]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/9993989/new-york-knicks-continue-discuss-trade-packages-involving-iman-shumpert

Sources did say the Celtics would be willing to take on Stoudemire's contract if they could unload some of their longer deals, namely those of Wallace and Courtney Lee.

The Knicks may be reluctant to take Wallace back because they're hesitant to take on salary beyond the 2014-15 season.

Knicks can't do this. It would clog up cap space in summer 2015. Unless Knicks got a blue chip piece back....otherwise, Knicks can't do this.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Good for Boston. Clear out cap space and increase the tank.

[Darius]

A rejuvenated Gerald Wallace @ SF + Anthony @ PF would be an interesting combo.

[CanYouDigIt]

More egos in New York...



#T4NK4WIGGINS

oh wait..........

[rufuspaul]

A rejuvenated Gerald Wallace @ SF + Anthony @ PF would be an interesting combo.


The 2 worst frontcourt contracts in the league?

[Blue&Orange]

Shumpert and Rondo are missing in the title.

[bagelred]

Shumpert and Rondo are missing in the title.

Celtics aren't doing that. This seems to be a counteroffer by Celtics, meaning those guys are main pieces of trade.

[Shade8780]

Shumpert and Rondo are missing in the title.
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Anyway, I would like this trade. Wallace seems to love trash-talking about his teammates and coaches to the media, Lee is a scrub and Amare's contract is shorter than Wallace's is.

[iDunk]

I'd do it if its this:

Celtics send:
Avery Bradley
Gerald Wallace
Brandon Bass
Courtney Lee

Knicks send:
Amare Stoudemire
JR Smith
Raymond Felton

Knicks then proceed by waiving Chris Smith to make enough space for this trade to work.

Boston saves around 6-7 mil in 2015. Knicks gain 7-8 mil in 2015, but get a more balanced/younger defensive minded roster.

Bradley / Prigioni / Udrih
Shumpert / Lee /
Melo / Artest / Wallace
Bargnani / Bass
Chandler / K-Mart / Aldrich

[CanYouDigIt]

I'd do it if its this:

Celtics send:
Avery Bradley
Gerald Wallace
Brandon Bass
Courtney Lee

Knicks send:
Amare Stoudemire
JR Smith
Raymond Felton

Knicks then proceed by waiving Chris Smith to make enough space for this trade to work.

Boston saves around 6-7 mil in 2015. Knicks gain 7-8 mil in 2015, but get a more balanced/younger defensive minded roster.

Bradley / Prigioni / Udrih
Shumpert / Lee /
Melo / Artest / Wallace
Bargnani / Bass
Chandler / K-Mart / Aldrich

Boston must want to tank for the next 5 years.

[Nastradamus]

That'd be awful for NY. It shaves a year off salaries for Boston, so its worth it for them. They don't need Crash or Lee

[Shade8780]

I'd do it if its this:

Celtics send:
Avery Bradley
Gerald Wallace
Brandon Bass
Courtney Lee

Knicks send:
Amare Stoudemire
JR Smith
Raymond Felton

Knicks then proceed by waiving Chris Smith to make enough space for this trade to work.

Boston saves around 6-7 mil in 2015. Knicks gain 7-8 mil in 2015, but get a more balanced/younger defensive minded roster.

Bradley / Prigioni / Udrih
Shumpert / Lee /
Melo / Artest / Wallace
Bargnani / Bass
Chandler / K-Mart / Aldrich
JR Smith? Felton? Lol I wouldn't give up Bradley and Bass for them.

[PJR]

Knicks gonna Knick :oldlol:

[hawkfan]

Maybe the Knicks will ask for a young player or draft pick to take on Wallace's contract.

I've been saying a similar trade like this, except with Bass included instead of Lee.

But if the Knicks are going to move Shumpert for a big, then that would take care of that.

[STATUTORY]

:roll: back to the salary cap hell with no picks in upcoming draft days of isiah thomas

so much uncertainty in the world, it's good to know we can always count on the ineptitude of the knicks FO

[hawkfan]

Another deal could be:

Celtics get

Amare Stoudemire

Knicks get

Kris Humphries (expirer)
Gerald Wallace

The Knicks could keep Humphries and let him expire next summer, giving them salary cap and luxury tax relief. Or they could trade out Humphries this year and get another player.

[MetsPackers]

:facepalm :facepalm


brb burning all knicks merchandise if this happens


they just need to accept that they gave amare such a horrible contract that it's untradable without fvcking future rosters over. these ni66as always find some way to make things worse. give amare an allen houston contract then try to trade him when we're almost out of the woods to add another year of salary cap pain on

[Eric Cartman]

patience is a virtue and knicks give no ****s about it

[Haymaker]

Maybe the Knicks will ask for a young player or draft pick to take on Wallace's contract.

I've been saying a similar trade like this, except with Bass included instead of Lee.

But if the Knicks are going to move Shumpert for a big, then that would take care of that. Maybe Knicks could package Wallace/Shumpert for anything. Can they do that?

[hawkfan]

Another deal:

Knicks get

Courtney Lee
Brandon Bass
Gerald Wallace

Celtics get

Amare Stoudemire

The Knicks get three players to add to the rotation in Lee, Bass and Wallace.

[Sarcastic]

Classic Isiah move.

[hawkfan]

Maybe Knicks could package Wallace/Shumpert for anything. Can they do that?

If the Knicks want to take a chance on Eric Gordon and his injuries, that deal might work.

[longtime lurker]

For the love of God just let Amare's contract die Knicks!

[RoundMoundOfReb]

For the love of God just let Amare's contract die Knicks!
This. They're just prolonging their cap nightmare.

[STATUTORY]

For the love of God just let Amare's contract die Knicks!

haven't learned shit from the patrick ewing trade. we are a Isiah thomas MSG reunion away from repeating the last decade of Knicks futility

[imdaman99]

I would prefer wallace over amare with this team, but not at that contract. DO NOT WANT

[el gringos]

Amare, Felton, hardaway jr
For
Bradley, bass, Wallace, lee
Or
Wallace, lee, humphries, olynyk

[niko]

It was a Celtic counteroffer that has no more validity than the Knicks first Rondo reach. But don't let it stop everyone from being all bitchy and making complaints.

[Blue&Orange]

Knicks have one guaranteed contract for 2015, worth $2 millions.


There's ZERO chance Knicks trade Stat for $15 million in contracts for '15 in two irrelevant role players.

[bagelred]

I was thinking something like this with Orlando, but Knicks get Afflalo and Big Baby for Amar'e. But I don't think Orlando would do it. Knicks would have to throw in at least one other asset.

[bagelred]

Knicks have one guaranteed contract for 2015, worth $2 millions.


Although technically true, JR Smith and Felton both have player options....so....too early to tell if they pick them up. And Shumpert would be a RFA with cap hold.

[hawkfan]

hawkfan Trade Scenario (where amazing happens forever):

Knicks get

Gerald Wallace
Eric Gordon

Pelicans get

Courtney Lee
Brandon Bass

Celtics get

Amare Stoudemire

The Knicks get Wallace to add depth to the front court, and Gordon in the backcourt. Gordon didn't want to go back to New Orleans, so maybe a change of scenery to New York will wake him up.

The Pelicans get rid of Gordon and his big contract, clearing out minutes for Evans. They get two rotation pieces in Lee and Bass.

The Celtics clear out Wallace's contract for the summer of 2015.

[el gringos]

hawkfan Trade Scenario (where amazing happens forever):

Knicks get

Gerald Wallace
Eric Gordon

Pelicans get

Courtney Lee
Brandon Bass

Celtics get

Amare Stoudemire

The Knicks get Wallace to add depth to the front court, and Gordon in the backcourt. Gordon didn't want to go back to New Orleans, so maybe a change of scenery to New York will wake him up.

The Pelicans get rid of Gordon and his big contract, clearing out minutes for Evans. They get two rotation pieces in Lee and Bass.

The Celtics clear out Wallace's contract for the summer of 2015.
If Gordon's trade value is that bad they can't trade him

Knicks would want Ryan Anderson over Gordon.

[FireDavidKahn]

Wallace is terrible now.:oldlol:

[STATUTORY]

Wallace is terrible now.:oldlol:

so is amare :lol

[CelticBaller]

I'll do it. Have many years Amaree has left? 2?

[outbreak]

hawkfan Trade Scenario (where amazing happens forever):

Knicks get

Gerald Wallace
Eric Gordon

Pelicans get

Courtney Lee
Brandon Bass

Celtics get

Amare Stoudemire

The Knicks get Wallace to add depth to the front court, and Gordon in the backcourt. Gordon didn't want to go back to New Orleans, so maybe a change of scenery to New York will wake him up.

The Pelicans get rid of Gordon and his big contract, clearing out minutes for Evans. They get two rotation pieces in Lee and Bass.

The Celtics clear out Wallace's contract for the summer of 2015.

why do you keep trying to make up trade scenarios and label them as if people give a shit about your one sided trades? your trades are always terrible

[hawkfan]

why do you keep trying to make up trade scenarios and label them as if people give a shit about your one sided trades? your trades are always terrible

The New York Knicks have discussed numerous potential trade scenarios featuring guard Iman Shumpert to bolster their injury-depleted front line, but no deal is imminent, according to sources close to the process.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/9973173/new-york-knicks-discussing-iman-shumpert-trade-no-deal-imminent

hawkfan has made trade scenarios part of the NBA lexicon.

I came up with the original Stoudemire for Wallace deal originally, although my original other player was Brandon Bass, not Courtney Lee. So clearly, my trade scenario ideas are influencing NBA GMs.

hawkfan trade scenarios = where amazing happens forever.

[HylianNightmare]

would like to see it happen if it improves the knicks this year

[Jameerthefear]

I was thinking something like this with Orlando, but Knicks get Afflalo and Big Baby for Amar'e. But I don't think Orlando would do it. Knicks would have to throw in at least one other asset.
HELL no. Don't even suggest that again in my presence. Amare is the worst player with the worst contract in that trade.

[hawkfan]

It isn't simply the contract with Amare.
If he is healthy, Amare is simply not the player he was at the beginning of his career.
He is best suited for situational play, but mentally he still considers himself a superstar. And he is no longer a superstar.

He hasn't adjusted.
Really, now if he was to be effective, he should just come into games and focus on rebounding and defense.
Also he needs a point guard who can create shots for him, and right now he doesn't have that.

If Boston trades for Amare, they probably would buy him out and then he could sign somewhere else. No point in having a former superstar on the end of the bench complaining about his minutes and shots.

[salwan]

I would do it in a heartbeat as a celtics fan.

wallace is washed up, lee is nothing more than a rotation player.
we get rid of wallace's ugly contract.
and The Tank gets stronger

[hawkfan]

I would do it in a heartbeat as a celtics fan.

wallace is washed up, lee is nothing more than a rotation player.
we get rid of wallace's ugly contract.
and The Tank gets stronger

Realistically, if the Celtics and Knicks want this deal done, then Humphries and Wallace for Stoudemire, because Humphries expires after this season.

The Knicks could let Humphries expire after this season and then spend money on other players, or they could try to re-trade him out.

Humphries would actually be a good fit for the Knicks, since his game would fit in with Melo and AB, and then Chandler can come off the bench.

[DStebb716]

The 2 worst frontcourt contracts in the league?

How the **** is Melo a bad contract? ****ing stupid.

[NumberSix]

Wow. Boston is SERIOUS about tanking.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

Didn't someone suggest this trade on ISH a couple days ago?

[NumberSix]

How the **** is Melo a bad contract? ****ing stupid.
I would agree. Melo isn't a terrible contract. I don't think he's worth max money, but most big name players get paid a little more than they're worth.

[DStebb716]

I would agree. Melo isn't a terrible contract. I don't think he's worth max money, but most big name players get paid a little more than they're worth.

Well the max contract is kind of stupid. He's worth the max deal, but only because of the way it's valued.

[TheMarkMadsen]

I would agree. Melo isn't a terrible contract. I don't think he's worth max money, but most big name players get paid a little more than they're worth.


I think the only player from the 03 draft to never miss the playoffs and never average less than 20 poits per game deserves amazing deal

Lets not act if Melo was playing with 2 all stars/all NBA players that he wouldn't be in a better position than he currently right now.

Jr Smith is his 2nd option..

[MMM]

Do the knicks save financially in this deal because they don't pay the luxury tax???

[T-Time3]

Knicks gonna Knick :oldlol:
i lost it brah :roll:

[BlackVVaves]

Whoever thinks the Knicks are gonna give up Felton and JR Smith and walk away with Avery Bradley needs to discontinue the use of LSD.

[TheMilkyBarKid]

I think the only player from the 03 draft to never miss the playoffs and never average less than 20 poits per game deserves amazing deal

Lets not act if Melo was playing with 2 all stars/all NBA players that he wouldn't be in a better position than he currently right now.

Jr Smith is his 2nd option..
Lets not act like he's anywhere near the top player from the 03 draft

[ballup]

Did Hawksfan actually call something?

[bagelred]

HELL no. Don't even suggest that again in my presence. Amare is the worst player with the worst contract in that trade.

You realize Orlando is trying to tank right?

[Jameerthefear]

You realize Orlando is trying to tank right?
We can do that just fine without Amare's bigass contract. He's old and isn't worth shit. Just because we're tanking doesn't mean we want shit. Afflalo is worth good young pieces. Not shit.

[CelticBaller]

Wow. Boston is SERIOUS about tanking.
Irrelevancy and mediocrity sucks bro

[NumberSix]

I think the only player from the 03 draft to never miss the playoffs and never average less than 20 poits per game deserves amazing deal

Lets not act if Melo was playing with 2 all stars/all NBA players that he wouldn't be in a better position than he currently right now.

Jr Smith is his 2nd option..
LeBron: Rings
Darko: Ring
Melo: Cheerios
Bosh: Rings
Wade: Rings

[DStebb716]

The Knicks still want Rondo. The ONLY way I see them make that happen is if they do something like:

Amare, Shumpert, Felton and two firsts (have to come from like 2079)
for
Rondo, Wallace, Lee


That would take some mega convincing on NYs part, but it would help the Celtics clear the cap space they want to, and support the tank.

Knicks become (when rarely healthy):
Rondo/Prigi/Udrih
Smith/Hardaway JR
Melo/MWP
Bargnani/Martin
Chandler/Aldrich

[el gringos]

The Knicks still want Rondo. The ONLY way I see them make that happen is if they do something like:

Amare, Shumpert, Felton and two firsts (have to come from like 2079)
for
Rondo, Wallace, Lee


That would take some mega convincing on NYs part, but it would help the Celtics clear the cap space they want to, and support the tank.

Knicks become (when rarely healthy):
Rondo/Prigi/Udrih
Smith/Hardaway JR
Melo/MWP
Bargnani/Martin
Chandler/Aldrich
Can the Knicks even trade future 1sts? I thought there was some type of rule on amount of future picks that can be traded

[ballup]

Actually I was mistaken, it was wallace and bass not lee. If the trade doesn't relieve the logjam at the 4, then I wouldn't do it for the Celtics.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

The Knicks still want Rondo. The ONLY way I see them make that happen is if they do something like:

Amare, Shumpert, Felton and two firsts (have to come from like 2079)
for
Rondo, Wallace, Lee


That would take some mega convincing on NYs part, but it would help the Celtics clear the cap space they want to, and support the tank.

Knicks become (when rarely healthy):
Rondo/Prigi/Udrih
Smith/Hardaway JR
Melo/MWP
Bargnani/Martin
Chandler/Aldrich

The picks would have to be 2020 and 2022. It's just not happening, there's almost no value to that deal for the Celtics. It supports "the tank" but why throw away an all star in Rondo when we can just pair him with the young guys we have already?

I think if the Celts do any major move it'll be getting rid of Green.

[el gringos]

Celtics get amare, okafor

Nugs get Tyson chandler and shumpert

Suns get j McGee, Wilson chandler, faried, hardaway jr, Felton

Knicks get dragic, frye, green, humphries, Wallace, bass, lee

[longtime lurker]

Celtics get amare, okafor

Nugs get Tyson chandler and shumpert

Suns get j McGee, Wilson chandler, faried, hardaway jr, Felton

Knicks get dragic, frye, green, humphries, Wallace, bass, lee

:roll: :roll: and Knicks get away with absolute murder

[el gringos]

:roll: :roll: and Knicks get away with absolute murder
I thought lee, Wallace, humphries, green and frye were all considered bad contracts?

[longtime lurker]

I thought lee, Wallace, humphries, green and frye were all considered bad contracts?

The only bad contracts are Wallace and Lee. Green, Bass and Frye aren't bad contracts. And then you throw Dragic in there for kicks :oldlol: A trade that would make sense for both teams is Wallace and Humprhies for Amare, but Wallace's contract is just :(

[el gringos]

The only bad contracts are Wallace and Lee. Green, Bass and Frye aren't bad contracts. And then you throw Dragic in there for kicks :oldlol: A trade that would make sense for both teams is Wallace and Humprhies for Amare, but Wallace's contract is just :(
Throw in dragic? The whole trade for ny is for him. Is he really worth more than chandler, shumpert, hardaway jr, and Felton?

[ballup]

Do people think cap space is some kind of magical franchise changer? Throw away an all star and assets, don't fret, we got cap space in return.:rolleyes:

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Celtics get amare, okafor

Nugs get Tyson chandler and shumpert

Suns get j McGee, Wilson chandler, faried, hardaway jr, Felton

Knicks get dragic, frye, green, humphries, Wallace, bass, lee

I know Okafor and Amare earn a lot but the Celtics are sending out ridiculous levels of salary there. $42m going out...

[el gringos]

I know Okafor and Amare earn a lot but the Celtics are sending out ridiculous levels of salary there. $42m going out...
No that's not jeff green, it's Gerald green from the suns. Money incoming is within 2 mill of outgoing salary.

[DStebb716]

:roll: :roll: and Knicks get away with absolute murder

How? That trade is absolutely TERRIBLE for the Knicks. Just atrocious. Tyson Chandler alone is worth more than what they're getting.

[DStebb716]

Can the Knicks even trade future 1sts? I thought there was some type of rule on amount of future picks that can be traded

Every other year.

[DMAVS41]

Do people think cap space is some kind of magical franchise changer? Throw away an all star and assets, don't fret, we got cap space in return.:rolleyes:

It is if you want to be bad and can get picks in return as well.

Think about it this way. If the Celtics trade Rondo for a few future first rounder and cap relief...or something like that.

They are going to be worse in the short term...which improves their chances of getting better picks on their own. They will get more picks because of the trade...and they have cap flexibility for the future to do as they please.

It makes a lot of sense and is hugely valuable.

It just depends on what the goal of a franchise is. Take the Pelicans for example. They could have played for the future and tried to set the team up to win titles in 3 years. Instead, they opted to be a fringe playoff team over the next 3 years and then will look drastically different. All about goals.

And we all know the Celtics are about titles. So I think it's definitely smart to trade Rondo for picks and cap space.

[hawkfan]

If the Knicks do a Humphries (expirer) and Wallace deal, then:

1. Anthony will opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave;
2. Bargnani may opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave (he has a player option and he could get an Al Jefferson-style contract);
3. Humphries expires.

So that would give the Knicks a lot of cap space, and then they could trade out Tyson Chandler (as he would be entering the last year in 2015 of his contract), and then go into full rebuild mode starting in the 2014-2015.

This is all of bunch of big ifs, but this something the Knicks have to consider.

[niko]

If the Knicks do a Humphries (expirer) and Wallace deal, then:

1. Anthony will opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave;
2. Bargnani may opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave (he has a player option and he could get an Al Jefferson-style contract);
3. Humphries expires.

So that would give the Knicks a lot of cap space, and then they could trade out Tyson Chandler (as he would be entering the last year in 2015 of his contract), and then go into full rebuild mode starting in the 2014-2015.

This is all of bunch of big ifs, but this something the Knicks have to consider.
We could have exactly the same situation without brining in Wallace's contract and having more cap room.

[hawkfan]

We could have exactly the same situation without brining in Wallace's contract and having more cap room.

In summer 2015, the Knicks could pretty much clear out the deck. So yes, you're right.

But next summer 2014, AB and Melo can opt out, but Stoudemire's contract would still be on the books. Humphries expirer would give the Knicks 12 million more in cap space in the summer of 2014.

It depends what the Knicks want to do.

Of course, once Wallace gets into the last year of his deal, his contract becomes easier to trade out.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

If the Knicks do a Humphries (expirer) and Wallace deal, then:

1. Anthony will opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave;
2. Bargnani may opt out next summer in 2014 and may leave (he has a player option and he could get an Al Jefferson-style contract);
3. Humphries expires.

So that would give the Knicks a lot of cap space, and then they could trade out Tyson Chandler (as he would be entering the last year in 2015 of his contract), and then go into full rebuild mode starting in the 2014-2015.

This is all of bunch of big ifs, but this something the Knicks have to consider.

I don't know if the Celts would do a Humphries - Wallace for Stoudamire deal because Humphries is a good piece in a deal this year. At the deadline maybe, but NY will do a deal before then.

[hawkfan]

I don't know if the Celts would do a Humphries - Wallace for Stoudamire deal because Humphries is a good piece in a deal this year. At the deadline maybe, but NY will do a deal before then.

Yea, it also depends on what the Celtics want to do.
If they do a Humphries/Wallace-Stoudemire deal, they are focused on summer of 2015.

If they wanted to be players in the summer of 2014, the Celtics could move out Lee and Bass, who have reasonable contracts for money and length.

[niko]

In summer 2015, the Knicks could pretty much clear out the deck. So yes, you're right.

But next summer 2014, AB and Melo can opt out, but Stoudemire's contract would still be on the books. Humphries expirer would give the Knicks 12 million more in cap space in the summer of 2014.

It depends what the Knicks want to do.

Of course, once Wallace gets into the last year of his deal, his contract becomes easier to trade out.
If we did your deal AND Melo doesn't resign how much (if any) cap space do we have?

[ballup]

It is if you want to be bad and can get picks in return as well.

Think about it this way. If the Celtics trade Rondo for a few future first rounder and cap relief...or something like that.

They are going to be worse in the short term...which improves their chances of getting better picks on their own. They will get more picks because of the trade...and they have cap flexibility for the future to do as they please.

It makes a lot of sense and is hugely valuable.

It just depends on what the goal of a franchise is. Take the Pelicans for example. They could have played for the future and tried to set the team up to win titles in 3 years. Instead, they opted to be a fringe playoff team over the next 3 years and then will look drastically different. All about goals.

And we all know the Celtics are about titles. So I think it's definitely smart to trade Rondo for picks and cap space.
That trade mentioned earlier did not include any draft picks or any sort of assets. It was straight up dumping bad contracts to the Celtics.

Cap space is fine to trade for, but you need a reasonable goal for that cap space like a certain player entering free agency. Having cap space isn't always a good thing. You may end being forced to overpay a player because of it.

[hawkfan]

If we did your deal AND Melo doesn't resign how much (if any) cap space do we have?

About 44 million with Chandler; with Chandler moved out, about 30 million.

Enough to put some young players, tank and get the first round overall pick in summer 2015, and then have a bunch of cap space to sign young players.

[DStebb716]

The Knicks might be better off if Melo leaves. Melo is a legitimate franchise player, but the way they built around him and the bad contracts they have have failed him. Might as well tank, land Okafor in 2015 and hope for the best.