Rose/Westbrook in 2011

[moe94]

Why the double standard?

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/3040/kci8.jpg

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Stats vs Top 8 teams.

lol

[Bigsmoke]

Rose had his share of haters during his MVP year as well.

[Tking714]

In the flow of the game Rose was >>>>>>>> than Westbrook in everything except man-to-man defense

[russwest0]

Stats vs Top 8 teams.

lol

You're right, look at what Westbrook did vs the Heat in the playoffs, being the main reason they were still in those games. Meanwhile Rose shot his team out of those games.

That 43 point game with just 3 FTA (even though he was fouled everytime he stepped into the paint) was GOAT. Nothing like thats ever happened before. Not in the regular season, let alone the playoffs, let alone the FINALS.

GOATbrook

[FKAri]

In the flow of the game Rose was >>>>>>>> than Westbrook in everything except man-to-man defense

3pt shooting?
pulling up off the dribble?

[russwest0]

3pt shooting?
pulling up off the dribble?

rebounding?
leadership?

[Le Shaqtus]

3pt shooting?
pulling up off the dribble?

Lets not pretend like Westbrook is some elite shooter off the dribble. Most of the time I see him do it it's a brick.

[nathanjizzle]

Stats vs Top 8 teams.

rose 28.5 points and 7 assists

westbrook >20 and around 5 assists.

on 82games.com
simple rating 2010-2011
rose +7.9
westbrook +3.4

[NumberSix]

Westbrook > Rose. Past, present & future.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

rose 28.5 points and 7 assists

westbrook >20 and around 5 assists.
You realize I was mocking you, right?

[Tking714]

3pt shooting?
pulling up off the dribble?

Everything tangible and intangible

[TheReturn]

You realize I was mocking you, right?
Those stats still stand though.

[russwest0]

Everything tangible and intangible

truth

[KyrieTheFuture]

Stats vs top 8 teams might be one of the dumbest ways to evaluate players I've ever seen.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Those stats still stand though.
Lmao it's extremely arbitrary. Stupid as hell to use it as an argument.

[russwest0]

It should be renamed to "stats vs top 8 teams..... not including the playoffs"

[moe94]

It should be renamed to "stats vs top 8 teams..... not including the playoffs"
Too bad Rose had better stats in the playoffs, too.

[russwest0]

Too bad Rose had better stats in the playoffs, too.

My face when people believe this

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-EdAPiDpCJy4/Uge9FvibkcI/AAAAAAAAOfg/C_cluckW7YU/s400/Charlton+Heston+laughing.gif

[moe94]

My face when people believe this



Are you being silly?

They both shot under 40%, but Rose scored more points and did everything else better outside rebounding slightly worse. You act as if this is subjective.

[TheReturn]

Lmao it's extremely arbitrary. Stupid as hell to use it as an argument.
It is incredibly arbitrary, but that doesn't mean it's worthless. It shouldn't be your sole argument while comparing player A and player B, but being able to play against the top competition is definitely not a worthless feat.

[imdaman99]

Ever since then this comparison isn't fair anymore. Goatbrook crushes him due to health reasons.

[Go Getter]

Now imagine if RW was the only scorer on the team and opposing defenses were keyed in on him specifically every game.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Now imagine if RW was the only scorer on the team and opposing defenses were keyed in on him specifically every game.

Are you kidding me RW would be a 30ppg scorer without Durant

[Go Getter]

Are you kidding me RW would be a 30ppg scorer without Durant
Sure he would.:rolleyes:

I don't think you understand basketball. :facepalm

You really want a career 43% shooter (as a 2nd option) shooting that much?:oldlol:

[moe94]

Now imagine if RW was the only scorer on the team and opposing defenses were keyed in on him specifically every game.
30/4/7 season with Iverson numbers, easily.


Sure he would.:rolleyes:

I don't think you understand basketball. :facepalm

You really want a career 43% shooter (as a 2nd option) shooting that much?:oldlol:


Rose is shit in terms of efficiency, too. I'd say Westbrook gets Rose production, at worst, if he led his own team. I really hope you're not implying Rose is harder to guard than Westbrook.

[NumberSix]

Now imagine if RW was the only scorer on the team and opposing defenses were keyed in on him specifically every game.
That's a fair point, but you can also flip it. What if OKC had the #1 defense and #1 rebounding in the NBA. Opposing teams would have to struggle much harder on offense and the boards to the point that maybe they don't have as much energy to defend. Every part of the game counts.

Look, I'm kinda tired of Rose "bashing" and reading it in every thread, but it amazes me how Roses fans think things like having the best defensive and rebounding team with great depth around him counts for absolutely nothing.

[Go Getter]

30/4/7 season with Iverson numbers, easily.




Rose is shit in terms of efficiency, too. I'd say Westbrook gets Rose production, at worst, if he led his own team. I really hope you're not implying Rose is harder to guard than Westbrook.
Rose shot 49% for an entire season. Before this season there was never a question of who was the more efficient scorer. They had similar shooting numbers ONE year. I have no doubts that more attention/traps from defenses and no Durant to stretch the floor is somehow going to turn him into a better offensive player. He might score more but logic says his efficiency, defense, and other areas would suffer, no?

[moe94]

Rose shot 49% for an entire season. Before this season there was never a question of who was the more efficient scorer. They had similar shooting numbers ONE year. I have no doubts that more attention/traps from defenses and no Durant to stretch the floor is somehow going to turn him into a better offensive player. He might score more but logic says his efficiency, defense, and other areas would suffer, no?

Yeah, on 20 points.

Westbrook did 24 on 46%. You're acting like he's Brandon Jennings or something.



Look, I'm kinda tired of Rose "bashing" and reading it in every thread, but it amazes me how Roses fans think things like having the best defensive and rebounding team with great depth around him counts for absolutely nothing.

They believe Rose carried a bunch of scrubs to the best record in the NBA.

[Go Getter]

Yeah, on 20 points.

Westbrook did 24 on 46%. You're acting like he's Brandon Jennings or something.



They believe Rose carried a bunch of scrubs to the best record in the NBA.


You're putting words in my mouth. 49%>46% ESPECIALLY when you're the #1 option compared to the 2nd option with the best pure shooter in the league on your team.

And Rose did carry the team a lot of times. 62 wins is why he won the MVP. Best [reg season] player on the best team.

[moe94]

You're putting words in my mouth. 49%>46% ESPECIALLY when you're the #1 option compared to the 2nd option with the best pure shooter in the league on your team.

And Rose did carry the team a lot of times. 62 wins is why he won the MVP. Best [reg season] player on the best team.

I had no idea players keep their efficiency when their production rises. Oh wait, they never ever do.

20 PPG on 49% = 24 PPG on 46%

Westbrook gets his numbers, regardless of whether Durant is on the floor or not, so that is a terrible excuse.

[yobore]

Are you being silly?

They both shot under 40%, but Rose scored more points and did everything else better outside rebounding slightly worse. You act as if this is subjective.
Not going to look up the numbers and I'm sure it's partly mitigated by FT's, but this by itself is a terrible argument. If they take proportional amounts of shots and shoot the same percentage, give me the guy who scores 10 points on 40% shooting than the guy who 20 points on 40% shooting.

[Go Getter]

That's a fair point, but you can also flip it. What if OKC had the #1 defense and #1 rebounding in the NBA. Opposing teams would have to struggle much harder on offense and the boards to the point that maybe they don't have as much energy to defend. Every part of the game counts.

Look, I'm kinda tired of Rose "bashing" and reading it in every thread, but it amazes me how Roses fans think things like having the best defensive and rebounding team with great depth around him counts for absolutely nothing.
We're speaking on scoring/efficiency though. If Rose had Durant on his team and defenses didn't clog the lane and trap him his job on O would be much easier imho.

[Go Getter]

I had no idea players keep their efficiency when their production rises. Oh wait, they never ever do.

20 PPG on 49% = 24 PPG on 46%

Westbrook gets his numbers, regardless of whether Durant is on the floor or not, so that is a terrible excuse.
Yeah because playing with a HOF caliber shooter doesn't make a point guard's job any easier:facepalm

For a PG 49% and 20 points is better than 46% and 24 points....[my opinion]

[moe94]

Yeah because playing with a HOF caliber shooter doesn't make a point guard's job any easier:facepalm

For a PG 49% and 20 points is better than 46% and 24 points....[my opinion]

Show stats that prove Westbrook's play is affected in a drastic fashion with Durant off the floor and I'll gladly eat crow.

Also, your case would have merit if Rose was a great passer, and not primarily a scoring PG, like Westbrook.

[Go Getter]

Show stats that prove Westbrook's play is affected in a drastic fashion with Durant off the floor and I'll gladly eat crow.

Also, your case would have merit if Rose was a great passer, and not primarily a scoring PG, like Westbrook.


I'm a ball player/aficionado....I'm not going to look up stats for you. If you think having Durant on the team doesn't help RW then idk what to tell you or say to you.

If you are a Bull's fan and see Rose pass the ball to Deng, Bogans, and Hinrich for brick after brick you'd see my point. Rose's assist numbers would go up with Durant to pass the rock to.

[Pointguard]

That's a fair point, but you can also flip it. What if OKC had the #1 defense and #1 rebounding in the NBA. Opposing teams would have to struggle much harder on offense and the boards to the point that maybe they don't have as much energy to defend. Every part of the game counts.

Look, I'm kinda tired of Rose "bashing" and reading it in every thread, but it amazes me how Roses fans think things like having the best defensive and rebounding team with great depth around him counts for absolutely nothing.
Minny was a better rebounding team in 2011. Boston allowed fewer points per game in 2011. And if rebounding was such a big thing then why doesn't Miami address it? Bosh leads the team with 5.7 rebounds per game right now. Indiana isn't a great rebounding team either. All of the recent teams that won a lot (SA, Dallas, OKC, Boston) were not great rebounding teams.

And I never ever heard you say, or anybody here, ever say a player should go to a team 2nd in those categories over great talent. Miami was very close to being the top defensive team that year as well, with two of the games best offensive players. So it shouldn't Amaze you at all. Because you just recently came to the conclusion yourself and more than likely didn't believe it before.

[Pointguard]

Why the double standard?

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/3040/kci8.jpg
There is a reason Westbrook didn't get a vote that year and LaMarcus Eldridge, Ginobli and Zach Randolph got fifth place votes. And its because people watched the games and didn't go to the stats.

[Pointguard]

We're speaking on scoring/efficiency though. If Rose had Durant on his team and defenses didn't clog the lane and trap him his job on O would be much easier imho.
True.

Teams totally focused on Rose.

During Linsanity, Lin was MVP for about two weeks. Now that he is scouted, he comes off the bench. When scouting is designed to stop one player its light years harder on that one player. That's why the history of the league favors the duo or other players stepping up. Durant, who arguably could go for best offensive player ever, looked bad when Westbrook went down. It's a world of a difference when you are the primary vs the secondary in terms of scouting and stopping a player. Its just totally crazy when there is a primary and the secondary is questionable game to game.

[moe94]

There is a reason Westbrook didn't get a vote that year and LaMarcus Eldridge, Ginobli and Zach Randolph got fifth place votes. And its because people watched the games and didn't go to the stats.
Wade got no votes, either so I guess that means Rose and the others were better players than Wade.

Westbrook was on Durant's team, of course he'd get no votes.

[Pointguard]

Wade got no votes, either so I guess that means Rose and the others were better players than Wade.

Westbrook was on Durant's team, of course he'd get no votes.
Rose had more attention and responsibility than Durant, much less Westbrook. He could be focused on, more so than Lebron, much less Wade. Those guys had it much easier than Rose and should have won more often.

[Kobe_6/8]

Now imagine if RW was the only scorer on the team and opposing defenses were keyed in on him specifically every game.


30/4/7 season with Iverson numbers, easily.




Sure he would.:rolleyes:

I don't think you understand basketball. :facepalm

You really want a career 43% shooter (as a 2nd option) shooting that much?:oldlol:

Westbrook > Rose

[Spurs5Rings2014]

Westbrook > Rose

:lol

[The Iron Sheik]

people said the same stupid shit about rose in 2011: that the only reason the bulls won 60 games was because of their defense even though noah missed like half the damn season. or that it was a bad thing that he was the only player in top 10 in both assists and scoring because "real" point guards...aren't supposed to score.

even now people say rose didn't deserve his mvp. it's ridiculous

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Moe da prophet. :bowdown:

Westbrook > Rose, then and now

[FreezingTsmoove]

Sure he would.:rolleyes:

I don't think you understand basketball. :facepalm

You really want a career 43% shooter (as a 2nd option) shooting that much?:oldlol:


Freaking retard

To my fans look at page 2 for my ether