Stocks are soaring

[-p.tiddy-]

http://money.cnn.com/2013/11/22/investing/stocks-markets/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


Stocks rose further into record territory Friday, as expectations that the Federal Reserve will keep buying bonds for the foreseeable future offset concerns the market is overheating.

The S&P 500 closed above 1,800 for the first time ever. The Dow Jones Industrial Average rose to a new all-time high above 16,000, a key level crossed for the first time this week. The Nasdaq rose nearly 0.5%, and is less than 10 points from 4,000, a level not seen since 2000.


yeah yeah yeah, I know...the stock market means nothing, we are close to another depression, buy gold, build a bomb shelter, the world is doomed

Just thought I would point out the market is breaking records right now...not saying everything is peachy

[tpols]

Markets go up and down.. stocks soar before they crash hard.. and after crashing hard they will start to rebuild.

I'm pretty sure everyone just wants stability.. not a volatile up and down type thing.

[-p.tiddy-]

Markets go up and down.. stocks soar before they crash hard.. and after crashing hard they will start to rebuild.

I'm pretty sure everyone just wants stability.. not a volatile up and down type thing.
it's been steadily going up since the 09 "recession"

IMO that is too long of a time to declare it is a "volatile up and down type thing"

[DonDadda59]

Corporations are experiencing record profits, have been for the last year+. The stock market is reflecting that. Unfortunately it's not translating to the rest of the population.

[-p.tiddy-]

Corporations are experiencing record profits, have been for the last year+. The stock market is reflecting that. Unfortunately it's not translating to the rest of the population.
it does though...employment rate and the market are similar

http://www.aei-ideas.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/spclaims31.jpg

[DonDadda59]

it does though...employment rate and the market are similar

http://www.aei-ideas.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/spclaims31.jpg

Those are just jobless claims. Many people have just plain dropped out of the job market/search after looking for long stretches of time (sometimes over a year) and don't show up in statistics. The employment rate and hiring figures have been tepid while the stock market is hitting record highs and corporations are reporting record earnings... yet not hiring at a rate that would reflect those gains. The record highs in the markets and corporate earnings have not yielded record hiring/employment numbers and all time low unemployment rates.

[-p.tiddy-]

Those are just jobless claims. Many people have just plain dropped out of the job market/search after looking for long stretches of time (sometimes over a year) and don't show up in statistics. The employment rate and hiring figures have been tepid while the stock market is hitting record highs and corporations are reporting record earnings... yet not hiring at a rate that would reflect those gains. The record highs in the markets and corporate earnings have not yielded record hiring/employment numbers and all time low unemployment rates.
unemployment has been steadily going down since 2009 just as the market has been steadily going up :confusedshrug:

don't over complicate this...in general, American business doing well does translate to Americans doing well

http://floatingpath.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/US-Unemployment-Rate-July-2013.png

[LJJ]

unemployment has been steadily going down since 2009 just as the market has been steadily going up :confusedshrug:

don't over complicate this...in general, American business doing well does translate to Americans doing well


As you can see in your graph, the unemployment rate is not dropping at anywhere near the rate the stock market is rising. Donny has a point.

[-p.tiddy-]

the rates are similar in relation to each other...the Dow can go up forever because of inflation, while unemployment is a % of the population

they are on different types of scales


my point was that when the market goes up and down, joblessness does as well

just because unemployment isn't at "record lows" doesn't mean it isn't being affected in a positive way by our business' doing well

[-p.tiddy-]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-fgLE-MOwu-U/TxXefyNCzUI/AAAAAAAAN7M/UxMtpuqySf4/s1600/stock%2Bmarket%2Bvs%2Bweekly%2Bclaims.png


unemployment rates and the market do follow each other

[DonDadda59]

unemployment has been steadily going down since 2009 just as the market has been steadily going up :confusedshrug:

The markets haven't been 'steadily' going up, they're booming, experiencing record #s, as are corporate profits. The same can't be said for the job market and


don't over complicate this...in general, American business doing well does translate to Americans doing well

Nothing complicated about it. Not even the most optimistic person out there is going to say with a straight face that a mid 7% unemployment rate and c. 200K (on good months) job growth and millions just plain dropping out of the work force is 'Americans doing well'. Come on.

[INDENT]Corporate profits hit record as wages get squeezed

Just four years after the worst shock to the economy since the Great Depression, U.S. corporate profits are stronger than ever.
In the third quarter, corporate earnings were $1.75 trillion, up 18.6% from a year ago, according to last week'si gross domestic product report. That took after-tax profits to their greatest percentage of GDP in history.

But the record profits come at the same time that workers' wages have fallen to their lowest-ever share of GDP.

"That's how it works," said Robert Brusca, economist with FAO Research in New York, who said there is a natural tension between profits and the cost of labor. "If one gets bigger, the other gets smaller."

Profits accounted for 11.1% of the U.S. economy last quarter, compared with an average of 8% during the previous economic expansion. They fell as low as 4.6% of GDP during the recession.

"Corporate profits took a big hit in the recession like everything else, but they've seen a massive bounce back," said Heidi Shierholz, an economist with the Economic Policy Institute, a liberal think tank. "Wages are determined by what's going on in the labor market and we haven't seen a big bounce back there."

Related: Why wages aren't rising

A separate government reading shows that total wages have now fallen to a record low of 43.5% of GDP. Until 1975, wages almost always accounted for at least half of GDP, and had been as high as 49% as recently as early 2001.
But overall economic growth has greatly outpaced growth in hourly wages and job creation since the end of Great Recession, so workers' share of the economic pie has dropped steadily. That's despite the fact that modest hiring by employers lifted total wages to a record $6.88 trillion in the third quarter.

"It's not because bad capitalists are keeping all the money," said Brusca. He said that businesses with high labor costs have either gone under or moved offshore.

Related: Most profitable companies

Shierholz said she doesn't think it's bad that business profits have risen. But the downward pressure on wages is hurting consumers' ability to spend, and thus the need for businesses to hire more people.
" have a capacity to employ more people, but it makes no sense to hire more people until you have demand for your stuff," she said.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/12/03/news/economy/record-corporate-profits/

[B]Mortgage rates fall amid weak economic data

NEW YORK (CNNMoney)

[LJJ]

No one is saying there isn't any relation, but the growth of the stock market is very extreme and the decline in unemployment is very trivial. They should correlate stronger than that.

[-p.tiddy-]

Don, the market has been going up at a steady pace since 2009 to hit the current record highs...it didn't just suddenly spike up over night...

and since 2009 unemployment has been steady going down...doesn't mean that it is "doing awesome" or anything like that...but you could say that the fact that our businesses have been steadily doing better it has caused unemployment to lessen.

[-p.tiddy-]

No one is saying there isn't any relation, but the growth of the stock market is very extreme and the decline in unemployment is very trivial. They should correlate stronger than that.
IDK...sounds like that is what Don is getting at

[DonDadda59]

Don, the market has been going up at a steady pace since 2009 to hit the current record highs...it didn't just suddenly spike up over night...

and since 2009 unemployment has been steady going down...doesn't mean that it is "doing awesome" or anything like that...but you could say that the fact that our businesses have been steadily doing better it has caused unemployment to lessen.

Again... corporations posting record profits has coincided with worker's wage being at an all time low percentage of the GDP, and the percentage of people in the workforce is at an all time low. The drop in the unemployment rate has as much (maybe more) to do with the latter- people dropping out of the workforce after not being able to find work, than it has to do with corporations making record profits.

No one in their right mind would try to argue, as you have, that Americans as a whole are 'doing well' and that the stock market reflects that. That's completely erroneous and shows a complete disconnect with reality. The President himself would laugh in your face if you tried to make that argument in his presence.

[Raymone]

Don, you really like to make a habit out of being entirely wrong. First Trayvon being completely innocent and not injuring Zimmerman, and now the capital markets being completely disconnected from employment trends and the economy at large. Yeah, no correlation, right.

[-p.tiddy-]

Again... corporations posting record profits has coincided with worker's wage being at an all time low percentage of the GDP, and the percentage of people in the workforce is at an all time low. The drop in the unemployment rate has as much (maybe more) to do with the latter- people dropping out of the workforce after not being able to find work, than it has to do with corporations making record profits.

No one in their right mind would try to argue, as you have, that Americans as a whole are 'doing well' and that the stock market reflects that. That's completely erroneous and shows a complete disconnect with reality. The President himself would laugh in your face if you tried to make that argument in his presence.
Reading comprehension Don

[DonDadda59]

Don, you really like to make a habit out of being entirely wrong. First Trayvon being completely innocent and not injuring Zimmerman, and now the capital markets being completely disconnected from employment trends and the economy at large. Yeah, no correlation, right.

A) Who the f*ck are you? :confusedshrug:

B) I never said Trayvon didn't very lightly injure big Z while trying to get away from the pursuing murderer. You gonna send him fan mail/nudes while he's behind bars for abusing yet another woman (what's he up to now? That's 2 in the past 2 months)

C) Show me where I said the numbers are completely disconnected.

D) Negged.

[DonDadda59]

[QUOTE=-p.tiddy-]Reading comprehension Don

[tpols]

A separate government reading shows that total wages have now fallen to a record low of 43.5% of GDP.
How can you ignore this tiddy? It's like you want to just keep the notion you had when you make this thread and are too stubborn to accept reality when its served right in front of you lol... The stock profits are NOT going to your average american.. theyre going to guys at the heads of businesses who are scared to expand and increase their expenses while they rake in relatively more money because of it.


If it's working you cant really blame them because their bottomline is making money but as a representation of how most americans are doing your stats dont mean a damn thing.

[-p.tiddy-]

Don read the OP...last sentence

"Whether" we are or aren't "doing well" is semantics...ask the people who live in the Congo if Americans are "doing well"...semantics

Tpols, I'm not trying to saying everything is amazing...but the market going up is a reflection of our spending and the companies we work for. Its a "good thing"...not a bad thing.


If I remember correctly there are 7 major indicators of how the economy is doing and the stock market is one of those indicators.

[-p.tiddy-]

Many "average Americans" are stock holders BTW... own 401ks or just dabble on their own... you're just young.

Are your parents working Americans? Ask them if they own any stocks.

Just because the top 5% own the majority doesn't mean the rest of it going up doesn't benifit us.

[ZenMaster]

Many "average Americans" are stock holders BTW... own 401ks or just dabble on their own... you're just young.

Are your parents working Americans? Ask them if they own any stocks.

Just because the top 5% own the majority doesn't mean the rest of it going up doesn't benifit us.

Not just the majority, the top 10% own around 86% of US stocks if I remember correctly.

[-p.tiddy-]

Not just the majority, the top 10% own around 86% of US stocks if I remember correctly.
which is all relative because they probably own 86% of money period.

I honestly thought it was worse than that...I thought it was more like the top 5% own 90% of everything

[kNicKz]

Not just the majority, the top 10% own around 86% of US stocks if I remember correctly.
^^^

Liberal policies are for the people

:roll: :roll: :roll:

I hope to shoot dice with John Kerry and Dick Cheney on a private jet some day