Is James Harden Overrated??

[Black and White]

I've been thinking about this for while after ESPN ranked him in the top 5 or something and then a recent thread suggesting someone would take him over Carmelo leads me to ask, is he overrated?? Where do you rank him in the league right now??? I honestly would take these 10 players before even considering Harden (in no order):

LeBron
Durant
Westbrook
Paul George
CP3
LaMarcus
Anthony Davis
Carmelo Anthony
Tony Parker
Dwight Howard

(Can't put Kobe yet because he has only played 2 games but i still think he is better than Harden)

Then there are some players that i would rather take going forward:

Cousins, Drummond, Curry, Lillard etc.

Whats your guys ranking on him? Do you think he is overrated?

[andremiller07]

As much as I hate his game the fact last season he took a team with somewhat limited talent to the Playoffs in the West kind of makes it hard to overrate him. His team is doing well again this season so can he really be that overrated?

[russwest0]

Does anyone here remember Corey Maggette in his prime?

Thats James Haren :lol :lol :lol

[outbreak]

Does anyone here remember Corey Maggette in his prime?

Thats James Haren :lol :lol :lol

Didn't maggette only make the play offs once? Harden took a bits and pieces team and regardless of his play style they became a winning team. If he was putting up good stats but still losing I'd say he's over rated but the team went from losing to winning once he joined.

[Black and White]

As much as I hate his game the fact last season he took a team with somewhat limited talent to the Playoffs in the West kind of makes it hard to overrate him. His team is doing well again this season so can he really be that overrated?

I can see what you saying there and yea he played well, but is there really any case for him over the 10 players i listed???

[Sarcastic]

As much as I hate his game the fact last season he took a team with somewhat limited talent to the Playoffs in the West kind of makes it hard to overrate him. His team is doing well again this season so can he really be that overrated?

They were the 9 seed the year before. With him they got the 8 seed.

[Fudge]

They were the 9 seed the year before. With him they got the 8 seed.
Exactly. :lol

[andremiller07]

They were the 9 seed the year before. With him they got the 8 seed.
They had Dragic/Scola/Martin/Kyle Lowry/Sammy D and some other very solid players on that squad (rookie Parsons as well I think/PPat), making the playoffs in the West with Asik as your 3rd best player is not easy.

[Black and White]

The only reason I made this is because the general consensus is that Harden is a top 10 player (you can quote Kevin Durant on that) but i don't really see it, i mean if you take away all his stupid foul calls Monta Ellis is playing better.

[Sarcastic]

They had Dragic/Scola/Martin/Kyle Lowry/Sammy D and some other very solid players on that squad (rookie Parsons as well I think/PPat), making the playoffs in the West with Asik as your 3rd best player is not easy.

Ty Lawson should be top 10. He carried Denver to the 3 seed in the west.


Btw using "player x carried blah blah blah to yada yada yada" is an awful scale to measure players.

[steve]

They were the 9 seed the year before. With him they got the 8 seed.

Except they had a massive amount of player turnover (only two players from their top 9 in minutes played returned including none from the top 5) and Harden joined the team without the benefit of training camp. This was a team that most people had slated to finish at the bottom of the Western Conference before Harden joined the team.

[SCdac]

Does anyone here remember Corey Maggette in his prime?

Thats James Haren :lol :lol :lol

reminds me more of prime Michael Redd (25-27 ppg)

http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/EXID1192/images/nba_g_redd_268.jpg

Both lefties, both shot alot of threes

[Quizno]

Ty Lawson should be top 10. He carried Denver to the 3 seed in the west.


Btw using "player x carried blah blah blah to yada yada yada" is an awful scale to measure players.
oh come on, he didn't "carry" that team. not even close. that was as well-balanced a team as you'll ever see. ty lawson was their best player but saying he carried them is just ridiculous

[mugiwara]

James Harden is like avoiding assassination because you stepped in dog shit. When you lean over to look at the sole of your shoe and see if you planted your foot in it you narrowly avoid the bullet. You weren't shot but you till have dog shit on your shoe.

[Sarcastic]

oh come on, he didn't "carry" that team. not even close. that was as well-balanced a team as you'll ever see. ty lawson was their best player but saying he carried them is just ridiculous

I was being sarcastic.

It's a team sport. No player has single handedly carried any team to anything. A player can lead a team, but even Wilt didn't carry his team when he scored 100.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Hes not top 10:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
he so inconsistent all he do is shoot 3 and drive for fouls. No midrange his passing is overrated cuz he turn it over like a muhufh and hes worst defender in NBA:roll:

[Quizno]

I was being sarcastic.

It's a team sport. No player has single handedly carried any team to anything. A player can lead a team, but even Wilt didn't carry his team when he scored 100.
oops

[Suguru101]

Hes not top 10:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
he so inconsistent all he do is shoot 3 and drive for fouls. No midrange his passing is overrated cuz he turn it over like a muhufh and hes worst defender in NBA:roll:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-EtNED8C4s9k/UiqZkW-vUjI/AAAAAAAACwQ/IF0NXo8r1fM/s1600/Terio-Vine.png

[Black and White]

James Harden is like avoiding assassination because you stepped in dog shit. When you lean over to look at the sole of your shoe and see if you planted your foot in it you narrowly avoid the bullet. You weren't shot but you till have dog shit on your shoe.

:roll: :roll:

[The JKidd Kid]

Ty Lawson should be top 10. He carried Denver to the 3 seed in the west.


Btw using "player x carried blah blah blah to yada yada yada" is an awful scale to measure players.

Denver's unfair altitude advantage carried them to the 3rd seed. Just look at their home and away record, by far the biggest difference in the league.

[bdreason]

The only reason I made this is because the general consensus is that Harden is a top 10 player (you can quote Kevin Durant on that) but i don't really see it, i mean if you take away all his stupid foul calls Monta Ellis is playing better.


Harden is slightly overrated and Monta is definitely underrated.

My only problem with Harden's game is I question the consistency of a style of play that revolves around 3 pnt and FT shooting, especially in a playoff environment.

[bballbball]

He's very solid but his game is ugly at times. His foot has been ****ed all season but he's trying to play through it and not mention it.

[Black and White]

He's very solid but his game is ugly at times. His foot has been ****ed all season but he's trying to play through it and not mention it.

Oh really?? I didn't know much about his foot injury at all. What happened?

[KungFuJoe]

It's Haren.

James has no D.

[Lateralus]

It's Haren.

James has no D.

Stfu dude. He has been playing great D these last couple of games. Hell, the only reason why he was playing a little worse than usual was due to his banged up foot...can't really stand in front of someone without it bothering you.


But can't really get anything out of these LOFers.

[Lateralus]

Oh really?? I didn't know much about his foot injury at all. What happened?

Yeah, it was badly banged up and bruised to hell. That was the reason he missed those games, but he played through it before they decided to sit him and you could tell something was wrong but he will never admit it.

[Black and White]

Yeah, it was badly banged up and bruised to hell. That was the reason he missed those games, but he played through it before they decided to sit him and you could tell something was wrong but he will never admit it.

He still needs to work on his midrange game tho, because his iso game isn't great and he will need it in the playoffs

[YouGotServed]

No, if anything he's underrated. He's the best shooting guard in the league by far. He also led his team to the playoffs last year, in the Western conference. Not only that, Houston finished like 2 games behind the 6th seed.

Before the season started, many predicted Houston to finish last or close to last in their conference. To imply Harden didn't will his team into the playoffs is revisionist history. Laughable even. Harden is not overrated, he is underrated.

[Lateralus]

No, if anything he's underrated. He's the best shooting guard in the league by far. He also led his team to the playoffs last year, in the Western conference. Not only that, Houston finished like 2 games behind the 6th seed.

Before the season started, many predicted Houston to finish last or close to last in their conference. To imply Harden didn't will his team into the playoffs is revisionist history. Laughable even. Harden is not overrated, he is underrated.

:applause:

[moe94]

Harden is not overrated, he is underrated.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-lVu1KU0Un6w/T9-s6ed9cRI/AAAAAAAAxg4/pl6qY9VwaYg/s1600/bart+moves.gif

Preach, brotha.

[DMAVS41]

Think he's properly rated. Probably the best sg in the game with Wade doing what he's doing down in Miami on his rest plan...

But Harden is a hard guy to judge...he's kind of like Melo. He's like somewhere between the 10th and 35th best player in the league...

[Black and White]

Think he's properly rated. Probably the best sg in the game with Wade doing what he's doing down in Miami on his rest plan...

But Harden is a hard guy to judge...he's kind of like Melo. He's like somewhere between the 10th and 35th best player in the league...

I would say Harden lies around 12-15th best player i think.

Your right, he is so hard to judge

[Funnyfuka]

he s not overated ...he was a killer in OKC, it s just that he fitted there better than he does in houston. Also since howard joined he s a shell of his former self for some reasons.

[Black and White]

No, if anything he's underrated. He's the best shooting guard in the league by far. He also led his team to the playoffs last year, in the Western conference. Not only that, Houston finished like 2 games behind the 6th seed.

Before the season started, many predicted Houston to finish last or close to last in their conference. To imply Harden didn't will his team into the playoffs is revisionist history. Laughable even. Harden is not overrated, he is underrated.


Can you make a case for Harden over the 10 players i mentioned tho?

[DMAVS41]

I would say Harden lies around 12-15th best player i think.

Your right, he is so hard to judge

I was kind of joking going to 35th, but yea...my point is that it's tough to get his actual value.

The playoffs will show that. Last year is too early to judge. This year is when it starts. It's like with Melo...you know he's not great because was a weak ass playoff performer. Doesn't lead a team well, plays like shit, and rarely wins...

Harden could be him...or he could be better...just not sure.

[Black and White]

I was kind of joking going to 35th, but yea...my point is that it's tough to get his actual value.

The playoffs will show that. Last year is too early to judge. This year is when it starts. It's like with Melo...you know he's not great because was a weak ass playoff performer. Doesn't lead a team well, plays like shit, and rarely wins...

Harden could be him...or he could be better...just not sure.

Yea agreed, hes probably on Melos level somewhere, he sits outside the top 10, i will see how he goes in the playoffs, that will show us how good he is

[MiseryCityTexas]

Ranking Anthony Davis over Harden is going a lil bit too far right now.

[YouGotServed]

Can you make a case for Harden over the 10 players i mentioned tho?


Sure I can. Harden is better than half the players you mentioned. A. Davis though? :oldlol:

[Legends66NBA7]

He's not overrated or underrated.

Still needs to be a consistent playoff performer, though.

[spiegel]

You know the guy is playing on a busted wheel. Look at numbers in the last 5 games after he cameback from the injury and say he is overrated. He is averaging 29 points 6 boards 6 assists on 48% shooting. Even his defense in the last two games has been good.

[spiegel]

he s not overated ...he was a killer in OKC, it s just that he fitted there better than he does in houston. Also since howard joined he s a shell of his former self for some reasons.
25 points 5 boards 6 assists a game is a shell? You know he is playing on a busted feet right?

[poido123]

You know the guy is playing on a busted wheel. Look at numbers in the last 5 games after he cameback from the injury and say he is overrated. He is averaging 29 points 6 boards 6 assists on 48% shooting. Even his defense in the last two games has been good.

He never plays 'Good' defense.

Good defense and Harden do not match.

[spiegel]

He never plays 'Good' defense.

Good defense and Harden do not match.
Considering he shutdown Harrison Barnes and Aaron Affalo in consecutive games, yes he played pretty "good defense ".

[Mr Exlax]

He never plays 'Good' defense.

Good defense and Harden do not match.

If you had saw the last 2 games then you wouldn't be talking out of your ass right now. Just go watch the games and come back. The man has been playing with a messed up foot damn near all season. I think he should take a little more time off, but since he's been back he's looked good and since Dwight talked about effort Harden has been going all out on both ends of the floor.

[Nick Young]

As much as I hate his game the fact last season he took a team with somewhat limited talent to the Playoffs in the West kind of makes it hard to overrate him. His team is doing well again this season so can he really be that overrated?
Limited talent? Asik was one of the best defensive centers last year, Parsons is really good near allstar level starter, and dont forget Linsanity.

[KungFuJoe]

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/assets/3536845/Harden_bad_2.gif

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/11/08/2013-11-0814_26_00.gif

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1905447/Harden_bad_defense_6.gif

[The Macho Man]

He's a good offensive player, that's it

[AirFederer]

Okc ftw :lol

[Black and White]

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/assets/3536845/Harden_bad_2.gif

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/11/08/2013-11-0814_26_00.gif

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1905447/Harden_bad_defense_6.gif

:roll: :roll: These are terrible

[moe94]

:roll: :roll: These are terrible

He straight up didn't even try in the middle one. Even Bargs puts his hands in the air and jumps in place to have the illusion of effort.:facepalm

[Black and White]

He straight up didn't even try in the middle one. Even Bargs puts his hands in the air and jumps in place to have the illusion of effort.:facepalm

Exactly, ballwatching at its finest, the top one is the worst tho, he just moves around looking like he doesnt care.

[scm5]

I realize Harden is pretty amazing offensively, but damn... that defense. If you were a contender, would you be able to live with that defense?

[bmd]

Harden's game is not flashy. But it is efficient.

He isn't going to wow you with moves like Kobe or Carmelo.

His game is getting to the rim. He either will make the layup, or draw the foul. So he makes a lot of free throws.

If he isn't doing that, he's shooting the 3, because he's a good 3 point shooter.



So his game is layups, free throws, and 3's. Not very flashy, and people confuse that with being "overrated".

But if you look at his stats, his TS% is fantastic because he is a very efficient scorer. He helps his team.


His defense has been questionable this year, but he was also battling a very swollen/bruised foot. He missed several games because it wasn't healing while playing. Since he's returned, his defense is better than it was. But he certainly needs to continue to put more effort on that end like he has the past few games.

[scm5]

Harden's game is not flashy. But it is efficient.

He isn't going to wow you with moves like Kobe or Carmelo.

His game is getting to the rim. He either will make the layup, or draw the foul. So he makes a lot of free throws.

If he isn't doing that, he's shooting the 3, because he's a good 3 point shooter.



So his game is layups, free throws, and 3's. Not very flashy, and people confuse that with being "overrated".

But if you look at his stats, his TS% is fantastic because he is a very efficient scorer. He helps his team.


His defense has been questionable this year, but he was also battling a very swollen/bruised foot. He missed several games because it wasn't healing while playing. Since he's returned, his defense is better than it was. But he certainly needs to continue to put more effort on that end like he has the past few games.

He's always been a poor defender though.

I think he's overrated because people generally look at his stats and put him near the top of lists.

25/5/5 is impressive at 60% TS.

However, defensively he's a liability and he's not consistent. He'll have a great game and follow it up with a dud.

[riseagainst]

He's always been a poor defender though.

I think he's overrated because people generally look at his stats and put him near the top of lists.

25/5/5 is impressive at 60% TS.

However, defensively he's a liability and he's not consistent. He'll have a great game and follow it up with a dud.

9 FTA a game.

:roll:

[moe94]

9 FTA a game.

:roll:

Let's knock a player for being able to draw fouls and make them, a legit skill.

Let's also knock players that are sent to the lines precisely because they're awful shooters.

Let's just hate because we want to hate.

[scm5]

9 FTA a game.

:roll:

I don't see a problem with Harden's FTA's. He earns most of them.

[riseagainst]

Let's knock a player for being able to draw fouls and make them, a legit skill.

Let's also knock players that are sent to the lines precisely because they're awful shooters.

Let's just hate because we want to hate.

no, it's called flopping and flailing like magikarp when he drives to the basket.

Watch the games.

[bmd]

He's always been a poor defender though.

I think he's overrated because people generally look at his stats and put him near the top of lists.

25/5/5 is impressive at 60% TS.

However, defensively he's a liability and he's not consistent. He'll have a great game and follow it up with a dud.He's as consistent as any other player. And he usually steps his game up for big games.

Defense has to improve, but it was much worse this year than before. And I'm assuming it is because of his foot injury that he wasn't giving effort on that end. Past two games you could tell he was hustling on defense, and he was playing well. So he's certainly capable.

[bmd]

no, it's called flopping and flailing like magikarp when he drives to the basket.

Watch the games.There is a difference between flopping and selling contact.

As a former college player, we were taught to sell the contact.

Most foul calls on Harden are legit calls. He usually gets hacked across the arms, and to sell it, he throws his head back or whatever.

Flopping is trying to get a foul call when no foul was actually committed.

Sometimes I think it works against him because the ref sees him throwing his head back and assumes he is "flopping" and refuses to call a foul even though on the replay you can see he actually was fouled. But in the end it probably evens out.

[Black and White]

He's as consistent as any other player. And he usually steps his game up for big games.

Defense has to improve, but it was much worse this year than before. And I'm assuming it is because of his foot injury that he wasn't giving effort on that end. Past two games you could tell he was hustling on defense, and he was playing well. So he's certainly capable.

Im not doubting he isn't efficient or anything, the only reason I made this thread about him being overrated is because of where people have generally been ranking him in terms of the top players, Kevin Durant said Harden is a top 10 player, but i just don't see it, can i ask you, where does Harden rank? i put him between 12-15th.

[disel]

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/assets/3536845/Harden_bad_2.gif

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/11/08/2013-11-0814_26_00.gif

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1905447/Harden_bad_defense_6.gif
Harden>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>lin . face lin *** licker.still acting like you a rockets fan?.

[KungFuJoe]

Go troll someone else disel. What the **** is disel anyways? You trying to be Diesel but can't ****ing spell?

[mugiwara]

There is a difference between flopping and selling contact.

As a former college player, we were taught to sell the contact.

Most foul calls on Harden are legit calls. He usually gets hacked across the arms, and to sell it, he throws his head back or whatever.

Flopping is trying to get a foul call when no foul was actually committed.

Sometimes I think it works against him because the ref sees him throwing his head back and assumes he is "flopping" and refuses to call a foul even though on the replay you can see he actually was fouled. But in the end it probably evens out.

Ahh so he does flop :applause:

But yeah i agree with you, when i get fouled in games i can't help but let out a big 'Pau' yell. I wish i didn't though, its kinda embarrassing. What I don't like about selling the contact is that those who do sell it and are accustomed to getting to the line often complain when they don't get the calls, thats my beef. Ive seen Wade, Durant and Harden all scream like hungry little fledglings for 50/50 calls which i can't stand. Also when players sell the hit to such an extent that they have no chance of making what could be an and1 or a no call. Though Harden is amazing around the basket on those drives, finishing and floating the ball over and through defenders.

[Black and White]

Go troll someone else disel. What the **** is disel anyways? You trying to be Diesel but can't ****ing spell?

:roll: :roll:

[Euroleague]

Is the sky blue?

[Black and White]

Is the sky blue?

Is VSpan good? :confusedshrug:

[moe94]

Go troll someone else disel. What the **** is disel anyways? You trying to be Diesel but can't ****ing spell?
ether :biggums:

[Euroleague]

Is VSpan good? :confusedshrug:

He's a hell of a lot better than James Harden. That's for DAMN SURE.

[Black and White]

He's a hell of a lot better than James Harden. That's for DAMN SURE.

Are you sure about that??? They both played for Houston, who played better?

[moe94]

Are you sure about that??? They both played for Houston, who played better?

Euroleague is the most delusional poster on this site, without question. Consider what that means when you take into account ALL the posters here.

[Black and White]

Euroleague is the most delusional poster on this site, without question. Consider what that means when you take into account ALL the posters here.

Thats means alot, ive seen him get burnt several times on this forum, does he really think Vspan is NBA quality???

[moe94]

He's either the most deluded dude ever (not buying it, his beliefs are too comical)

or

He's got the most extensive and laid out trolling gimmick of all time (just as insane to believe)

I'm not even sure he exists.

[Black and White]

He's either the most deluded dude ever (not buying it, his beliefs are too comical)

or

He's got the most extensive and laid out trolling gimmick of all time (just as insane to believe)

I'm not even sure he exists.

How does he get away with posting Euroleague crap in the NBA section????

[The JKidd Kid]

Euroleague is the most delusional poster on this site, without question. Consider what that means when you take into account ALL the posters here.
:roll: :roll: :roll:

[The JKidd Kid]

How does he get away with posting Euroleague crap in the NBA section????

Cause the threads are hilarious.:lol

[Black and White]

Cause the threads are hilarious.:lol

He must defend his point no matter how stupid they seem

[Euroleague]

Are you sure about that??? They both played for Houston, who played better?

Spanoulis

[Black and White]

Spanoulis

Lol now i know your just trolling

[ABfor3]

Harden gets so much disrespect on this thread and I'm not just saying that as a Rocket fan, I'm saying that from a basketball fan perspective. I've seen almost every game this year besides maybe 2? Harden has been playing on a messed up foot, mind you..he's the first option on this team so his teammates expect him to put up big numbers..anyone who has played basketball for a team knows it's tough to score consistently while giving it your all on defense. Harden is an offensive threat, his team doesn't need him to be a defensive player of the year candidate.. And his defense has been damn good as of late so I'm assuming his foot is all but healed up. Another thing is he hasn't been with this group of guys for much long, he came into the Rockets organization Last year without going into training camp, basically playing the whole year trying to build chemistry while still posting up 25/5/6 and putting his team into the playoffs without any real chemistry. Same thing this year, he has to incorporate a big man superstar in Howard to his game and learn to play with him effectively. Harden is definitely not overrated, he's the best SG in the league.

[oh the horror]

^ from a basketball fan perspective with the James Harden avatar.



Bro he's overrated.

[ABfor3]

^ from a basketball fan perspective with the James Harden avatar.



Bro he's overrated.

Yeah its so easy to say someones overrated without stating a reason, or give any stats to backup your argument? lol at your logic bro. Exactly why i said coming from a basketball perspective because obviously im a rockets fan.

[Black and White]

Harden gets so much disrespect on this thread and I'm not just saying that as a Rocket fan, I'm saying that from a basketball fan perspective. I've seen almost every game this year besides maybe 2? Harden has been playing on a messed up foot, mind you..he's the first option on this team so his teammates expect him to put up big numbers..anyone who has played basketball for a team knows it's tough to score consistently while giving it your all on defense. Harden is an offensive threat, his team doesn't need him to be a defensive player of the year candidate.. And his defense has been damn good as of late so I'm assuming his foot is all but healed up. Another thing is he hasn't been with this group of guys for much long, he came into the Rockets organization Last year without going into training camp, basically playing the whole year trying to build chemistry while still posting up 25/5/6 and putting his team into the playoffs without any real chemistry. Same thing this year, he has to incorporate a big man superstar in Howard to his game and learn to play with him effectively. Harden is definitely not overrated, he's the best SG in the league.


Paul George :confusedshrug:

[SmackOrH.A.K]

They were the 9 seed the year before. With him they got the 8 seed.
that team was totally different. the only returning players were parsons and greg smith

[moe94]

Paul George :confusedshrug:
Exceptions are the norm? How many truly two way players are in the league, would you say?

[Black and White]

Exceptions are the norm? How many truly two way players are in the league, would you say?

Your right, there would only be a handful, George, LeBron, Cp3, rondo, Durant (to some extent) to name a few

[SacJB Shady]

I don't like Harden because I don't like his beard or body and he gets so many free throws but in terms of effectiveness he is a top 5 player or so. Hate to admit it, but he does his thing.

[Miss Bella]

Exceptions are the norm? How many truly two way players are in the league, would you say?

But calling someone top 5 and underrated you'd expect him to be a two way player or am I missing something?

James Harden is way below average as a defender, he makes Melo look like a a great defender.

He is a top 5 offensive player. He isn't a top 10 player.

If we look at players regarded as top 10 players we won't find anyone with such huge deficiencies defensively.

To name few of them:
LeBron - Great defender
Durant - Very good defender
Westbrook - One of the best one-on-one
George - Great defender
Howard - Great defender although his problem is offense
Paul - Very good defender
LaMarcus Aldridge - Not a liability
Kevin Love- Much improved defender and is the best finisher of defense.(Rebounding)
Tim Duncan - One of the best

Maybe Kyrie and Steph but are they really top 10 except for what ESPN thinks?

[Black and White]

But calling someone top 5 and underrated you'd expect him to be a two way player or am I missing something?

James Harden is way below average as a defender, he makes Melo look like a a great defender.

He is a top 5 offensive player. He isn't a top 10 player.

If we look at players regarded as top 10 players we won't find anyone with such huge deficiencies defensively.

To name few of them:
LeBron - Great defender
Durant - Very good defender
Westbrook - One of the best one-on-one
George - Great defender
Howard - Great defender although his problem is offense
Paul - Very good defender
Marc Gasol - Great at both ends
Kevin Love- Much improved defender and is the best finisher of defense.
Tim Duncan - One of the best
Kobe Bryant - I don't know last season was bad but but not Harden bad.

Maybe Kyrie and Steph but are they really top 10 except for what ESPN thinks?

This

[Jameerthefear]

But calling someone top 5 and underrated you'd expect him to be a two way player or am I missing something?

James Harden is way below average as a defender, he makes Melo look like a a great defender.

He is a top 5 offensive player. He isn't a top 10 player.

If we look at players regarded as top 10 players we won't find anyone with such huge deficiencies defensively.

To name few of them:
LeBron - Great defender
Durant - Very good defender
Westbrook - One of the best one-on-one
George - Great defender
Howard - Great defender although his problem is offense
Paul - Very good defender
Marc Gasol - Great at both ends
Kevin Love- Much improved defender and is the best finisher of defense.
Tim Duncan - One of the best
Kobe Bryant - I don't know last season was bad but but not Harden bad.

Maybe Kyrie and Steph but are they really top 10 except for what ESPN thinks?
what? Kobe, Marc, and Duncan are not top 10. Harden and CUrry are definitely top 10 players.

[Le Shaqtus]

Spanoulis

Reported for lying.

[Black and White]

what? Kobe, Marc, and Duncan are not top 10. Harden and CUrry are definitely top 10 players.

Harden is not a top 10 player, he is just outside the list, Curry maybe.

[Jameerthefear]

Harden is not a top 10 player, he is just outside the list, Curry maybe.
they both are. Marc Gasol and Kobe are definitely not top 10. That isn't arguable. That's just the truth

[Miss Bella]

what? Kobe, Marc, and Duncan are not top 10. Harden and CUrry are definitely top 10 players.

I can agree with Gasol and Kobe, but Timmy? no he is definitely top 10.

Tim Duncan is being matched for his age come playoff time his numbers will be up again and not to mention his great defense. I'd take him over Harden and Curry.

I also forgot to mention LaMarcus Aldridge I'd take him over Harden also. He isn't a defensive beast but he is big and isn't a liability defensively.

[Black and White]

they both are. Marc Gasol and Kobe are definitely not top 10. That isn't arguable.

I never said they were top 10 players (although Kobe might get back in).

LeBron
Durant
George
CP3
Westbrook
Aldridge
Howard
Love
Melo
Dirk
Duncan

are all better than Harden imo

[Miss Bella]

I never said they were top 10 players (although Kobe might get back in).

LeBron
Durant
George
CP3
Westbrook
Aldridge
Howard
Love
Melo
Dirk
Duncan

are all better than Harden imo

Maybe not Dirk, only because of age. His rebounding isn't there anymore even though it never was a strength but he is reaching Bargs levels. His scoring is still great but the same goes for Harden.

Yes Melo also, Harden should be ranked around 15-20.

Also the man on my avatar, he is severely underrated and is the best offensive center in the league. I'd take him over HArden .

[Black and White]

Maybe not Dirk, only because of age. His rebounding isn't there anymore even though it never was a strength but he is reaching Bargs levels. His scoring is still great but the same goes for Harden.

Yes Melo also, Harden should be ranked around 15-20.

Also the man on my avatar, he is severely underrated and is the best offensive center in the league. I'd take him over HArden .

Thats a fair point, I would still perfer Dirk over Harden (age is a factor tho), and yes to Brook Lopez but then there is so many other players that I would have over Harden going forward aswell, Anthony Davis, Drummond, Lillard, Rondo (little biased but i believe he will be better than Harden when he gets back), Cousins, Hibbert, Kyrie (better offensive player than Harden), Curry etc.

[Miss Bella]

Thats a fair point, I would still perfer Dirk over Harden (age is a factor tho), and yes to Brook Lopez but then there is so many other players that I would have over Harden going forward aswell, Anthony Davis, Drummond, Lillard, Rondo (little biased but i believe he will be better than Harden when he gets back), Cousins, Hibbert, Kyrie (better offensive player than Harden), Curry etc.

My god can't believe I forgot Davis:facepalm Andre is still too raw offensively. I guess the game of picking players you'd take over Harden is as hard as naming all the states, you can never get all of them.

[Black and White]

My god can't believe I forgot Davis:facepalm Andre is still too raw offensively. I guess the game of picking players you'd take over Harden is as hard as naming all the states, you can never get all of them.

Yea its hard to think of all the players in the league at once, Harden gets a little overrated on the offensive end tho, his game consists of 3 point shooting and driving, he has no iso game and no midrange game, no go to moves etc, which is why i give the nod to Drummond instead because i think his ceiling is higher, I mentioned Davis right at the start and people disagreed with me

[BoutPractice]

There's a difference between top 10 regular season performers and top 10 players. The top 10 regular season performers so far would probably look like this: LeBron, Durant, Paul, George, Aldridge, Love, Curry, Harden, Dwight and Davis. Come playoff time however, we're usually quickly reminded that guys like Duncan and Dirk are top 10 players, as is Kobe.

[ABfor3]

Thats a fair point, I would still perfer Dirk over Harden (age is a factor tho), and yes to Brook Lopez but then there is so many other players that I would have over Harden going forward aswell, Anthony Davis, Drummond, Lillard, Rondo (little biased but i believe he will be better than Harden when he gets back), Cousins, Hibbert, Kyrie (better offensive player than Harden), Curry etc.
Dirk, hell but Duncan is arguable. Even at his age, TD still manages to put up effective numbers on both ends of the floor. You're trolling if you would rather take Lillard and Rondo ahead of Harden, Lillard is a horrible defender, and Harden passes the ball better than him. Rondo has is not an offensive threat unless he has great scorers around him, cause he's a hell of a passer. All defenses have to do is take away his drive and let him shoot. The rest you named are understandable from a franchise standpoint because big men do win championships.

[Black and White]

Dirk, hell but Duncan is arguable. Even at his age, TD still manages to put up effective numbers on both ends of the floor. You're trolling if you would rather take Lillard and Rondo ahead of Harden, Lillard is a horrible defender, and Harden passes the ball better than him. Rondo has is not an offensive threat unless he has great scorers around him, cause he's a hell of a passer. All defenses have to do is take away his drive and let him shoot. The rest you named are understandable from a franchise standpoint because big men do win championships.

I never said Lillard and Rondo were better than Harden, i said i would rather take them going forward, thats all.

[The JKidd Kid]

I never said they were top 10 players (although Kobe might get back in).

LeBron
Durant
George
CP3
Westbrook
Aldridge
Howard
Love
Melo
Dirk
Duncan

are all better than Harden imo

Definitely not Dirk and IDK about Melo. This is coming from someone who dislikes Harden.

[Black and White]

Definitely not Dirk and IDK about Melo. This is coming from someone who dislikes Harden.

I would def take Melo, hes having a bad season, thats all, but his game is leagues ahead of Hardens.

[ABfor3]

I would def take Melo, hes having a bad season, thats all, but his game is leagues ahead of Hardens.
Leagues ahead of harden yet has never went far into the playoffs? We've seen all Melo can do , he's not getting any younger. Harden just turned
24, dude has time to improve his game.

[Black and White]

Leagues ahead of harden yet has never went far into the playoffs? We've seen all Melo can do , he's not getting any younger. Harden just turned
24, dude has time to improve his game.

I agree with you, Harden has the advantage of having plenty of time to improve his game, he will pass Melo next year i reckon, just at the moment id rather have Melo on my team, fair?

[Cone]

I still take dirk over harden in the playoffs

[moe94]

I agree with you, Harden has the advantage of having plenty of time to improve his game, he will pass Melo next year i reckon, just at the moment id rather have Melo on my team, fair?

Melo at 22 is likely better than Harden will ever be, statistically.

[Unstoppabull]

Yes.