Mavs win oh well Dirk Nowitzki > Kevin Love [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

k0kakw0rld

12-30-2013, 11:35 PM

Love is better now he isnt half the player prime Dirk was
Dirk took garbage to the finals and even worse garbage to 67 wins in a stacked conference
He is better.

Better offensive player, better rebounder both below average defenders.
Dirk is just a proven clutch player in the playoffs.
It's just a matter of being in a better system and organization. No way prime dirk gets this team to the playoffs.

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:35 PM

Yes ISH :facepalm
Whatever helps you sleep at night.

First of all. Love was clearly better tonight...nobody is saying otherwise.

And Love is better so far this year, but the gap is absolutely not huge. Something is missing from Love.

I don't see how Love makes his teammates any better. Which isn't really even a knock, but just means he's not suited to carry a team without another superstar.

Calm down...

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:36 PM

He is better.

Better offensive player, better rebounder both below average defenders.
Dirk is just a proven clutch player in the playoffs.
It's just a matter of being in a better system and organization. No way prime dirk gets this team to the playoffs.

You gone done it now...

You have no idea what you are talking about. Love is honestly marginally more valuable than current Dirk.

Prime Dirk? ROFL...he'd be winning near 60 with a team like this at his peak.

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:37 PM

He is better.

Better offensive player, better rebounder both below average defenders.
Dirk is just a proven clutch player in the playoffs.
It's just a matter of being in a better system and organization. No way prime dirk gets this team to the playoffs.

You're obviously a young kid.

Dirk in his prime took MUCH worse to the playoffs. Such disrespect from this nikkuh GTFO :rockon:

Dont ever compare a prime Dirk to kevin love. God damn

b1imtf

12-30-2013, 11:38 PM

1>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>0

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:39 PM

He is better.

Better offensive player, better rebounder both below average defenders.
Dirk is just a proven clutch player in the playoffs.
It's just a matter of being in a better system and organization. No way prime dirk gets this team to the playoffs.

wait wtf. Did you just say Love is a better offensive player? :biggums:

Btw, Dirk is easily a better defender, he atleast tries. Dont forget Dirk averages 10+ boards a game in the playoffs, how bout Love?

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:42 PM

wait wtf. Did you just say Love is a better offensive player? :biggums:

Btw, Dirk is easily a better defender, he atleast tries. Dont forget Dirk averages 10+ boards a game in the playoffs, how bout Love?

This is where "empty stats" come from...

I don't agree with that label at all, but to claim Kevin Love is currently better than Dirk ever was...well...just deserves it

:facepalm

magnax1

12-30-2013, 11:43 PM

Dirk is almost at his 2011 levels statistically per 36. Not sure he can play 40 mpg in the playoffs now though.
EDIT:Not saying he's better than Love right now. Though Im not sure Love is a whole lot better.

NoGunzJustSkillz

12-30-2013, 11:43 PM

First of all. Love was clearly better tonight...nobody is saying otherwise.

And Love is better so far this year, but the gap is absolutely not huge. Something is missing from Love.

I don't see how Love makes his teammates any better. Which isn't really even a knock, but just means he's not suited to carry a team without another superstar.

Calm down...
neither was dirk unless we're talking about that fluke playoffs run he had a couple years back.

plowking

12-30-2013, 11:43 PM

First of all. Love was clearly better tonight...nobody is saying otherwise.

And Love is better so far this year, but the gap is absolutely not huge. Something is missing from Love.

I don't see how Love makes his teammates any better. Which isn't really even a knock, but just means he's not suited to carry a team without another superstar.

Calm down...

That line is a crock of shit, and has been in basketball lingo for so long. Whats he gonna do? Make Rubio learn how to shoot?

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:44 PM

neither was dirk unless we're talking about that fluke playoffs run he had a couple years back.

Fluke? :oldlol: Pathetic Laker fan

Dirk in 2011 wasnt any different than other playoff Dirks. He just finally had a decent supporting cast with a good defensive center.

****ing retard. god damn

fpliii

12-30-2013, 11:44 PM

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:45 PM

Dirk is almost at his 2011 levels statistically per 36. Not sure he can play 40 mpg in the playoffs now though.

Yep. Dirk still has a huge impact on the game. Not to mention he is averaging 22 points a game on nearly 50/40/90

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:47 PM

neither was dirk unless we're talking about that fluke playoffs run he had a couple years back.

He was carrying teams to 50 plus wins for 11 straight seasons without other superstars.

This is Love's what...6th year? Dude hasn't been on a team to win over 31 games yet.

To compare him to ****ing Kevin McHale is insulting...let alone Dirk

Seriously...are you people all like 15 years old?

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:48 PM

I'm considered to be a bit of a Dirk "hater", but I think this is going a bit far if we're putting KLove in the same level as him in his prime.

Nowitzki at his best was a beast. 3rd GOAT PF IMO, ridiculous offensive force, especially when he got his post game down pat.

You are not a hater if you rank Dirk as the 3rd best PF ever. That is higher than most.

Who do you have 2nd? I'm just curious...

fpliii

12-30-2013, 11:49 PM

You are not a hater if you rank Dirk as the 3rd best PF ever. That is higher than most.

Who do you have 2nd? I'm just curious...

KG and Duncan 1/2 (go back and forth). Don't want to get into a big back-and-forth about it though, not trying to hate. :cheers:

magnax1

12-30-2013, 11:49 PM

Yep. Dirk still has a huge impact on the game. Not to mention he is averaging 22 points a game on nearly 50/40/90
Indeed. It'll be interesting to see what he can do in the playoffs. Their D sucks too much to really make it out of the first round probably, but maybe they could make a trade? Maybe even Asik? Idk what for but I think that'd put them into the top 5 or 4 in the west.

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:50 PM

KG and Duncan 1/2 (go back and forth). Don't want to get into a big back-and-forth about it though, not trying to hate. :cheers:

I was just curious...I actually go back and forth on Dirk vs KG all time. I just hate when people say it's not close.

And I can't really rank Pettit because I didn't see him play.

:cheers:

NoGunzJustSkillz

12-30-2013, 11:51 PM

Indeed. It'll be interesting to see what he can do in the playoffs. Their D sucks too much to really make it out of the first round probably, but maybe they could make a trade? Maybe even Asik? Idk what for but I think that'd put them into the top 5 or 4 in the west.
pretty sure mavs are trying to gun for a free agent this year or next. pretty sure trading for asik could ruin that.

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:51 PM

Indeed. It'll be interesting to see what he can do in the playoffs. Their D sucks too much to really make it out of the first round probably, but maybe they could make a trade? Maybe even Asik? Idk what for but I think that'd put them into the top 5 or 4 in the west.

I concocted a 4 team deal that actually include Love going to the Warriors and Asik coming to Dallas.

Let me find it real quick...

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kaopjms

And Minny would get a pick. Love is leaving for sure imo, he's opting out after next season and leaving. Might as well trade him now...

NoGunzJustSkillz

12-30-2013, 11:52 PM

He was carrying teams to 50 plus wins for 11 straight seasons without other superstars.

This is Love's what...6th year? Dude hasn't been on a team to win over 31 games yet.

To compare him to ****ing Kevin McHale is insulting...let alone Dirk

Seriously...are you people all like 15 years old?
cuban obviously agrees with me considering he been trying to get a superstar to team with dirk for years. best he could do was monte :applause:

k0kakw0rld

12-30-2013, 11:55 PM

You gone done it now...

You have no idea what you are talking about. Love is honestly marginally more valuable than current Dirk.

Prime Dirk? ROFL...he'd be winning near 60 with a team like this at his peak.
I disagree...First of all you are talking out of your ass...no way Prime Dirk wins 60 games with this team wtf are you smoking? Why? Nash & Kidd >>>> Rubio buffs said. Now **** outa here. Now lemme start by talkin stats...Dirk's ppg career high in the regular season is....drum roll...26.8 ppg...Kevin is on pace to destroy that this year. Kevin Love is already a better offensive player than Dirk is. Kevin love grabs far more rebounds than Dirk ever did. Defensively Dirk has/had no impact what so ever. Both clutch Kevin Love just never had the chance to be I the playoffs yet. His time will come and will pro all y'all fools wrong.

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:55 PM

Indeed. It'll be interesting to see what he can do in the playoffs. Their D sucks too much to really make it out of the first round probably, but maybe they could make a trade? Maybe even Asik? Idk what for but I think that'd put them into the top 5 or 4 in the west.

Mavs fans having been wanting a Asik trade for the last couple of months, but it seems they dont have the assets and/or that Houston wont want to help out a division rival.. or somehow landing Ariza and Gortat from the Wizards.

Either way, the team as constructed isnt really going anywhere. They are probably a defensive big away from being a 2nd tier contender.

magnax1

12-30-2013, 11:55 PM

pretty sure mavs are trying to gun for a free agent this year or next. pretty sure trading for asik could ruin that.
Idk what they can get honestly. Melo? I like Melo, but Melo+Dirk is a bit weird. They're pretty damn similar.

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:56 PM

cuban obviously agrees with me considering he been trying to get a superstar to team with dirk for years. best he could do was monte :applause:

yes. it would have been much better to have a superstar. who would deny that?

the difference is that Dirk was better...and wasn't struggling to .500 records in his prime with the kind of help Love has.

This team is way better than Love fans let on. When they play with energy they are really good. As a superstar...you take the blame. Just the way it is.

Nobody is asking for anything other than a ****ing playoff berth...jesus

fpliii

12-30-2013, 11:56 PM

I was just curious...I actually go back and forth on Dirk vs KG all time. I just hate when people say it's not close.

And I can't really rank Pettit because I didn't see him play.

:cheers:

In terms of actual level of play it's close I think, I'd just take KG 10 times out of 10 to start a team because I'm a defense guy. I can respect someone else taking Dirk 10 out of 10 times as well.

Pettit, Hayes, Barkley are perhaps next in some order, then your McHales, Malones, etc. I don't keep a GOAT list though, just speculating about who I'd pick to start a team.

NoGunzJustSkillz

12-30-2013, 11:56 PM

I concocted a 4 team deal that actually include Love going to the Warriors and Asik coming to Dallas.

Let me find it real quick...

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kaopjms

And Minny would get a pick. Love is leaving for sure imo, he's opting out after next season and leaving. Might as well trade him now...
who's draft picks do the rockets get?

DirkNowitzki41

12-30-2013, 11:56 PM

cuban obviously agrees with me considering he been trying to get a superstar to team with dirk for years. best he could do was monte :applause:

Maybe because Dirk is 35 years old?

How stupid are you?

:coleman:

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:57 PM

Idk what they can get honestly. Melo? I like Melo, but Melo+Dirk is a bit weird. They're pretty damn similar.

melo would be a horrid fit....unless we also got asik.

DMAVS41

12-30-2013, 11:57 PM

who's draft picks do the rockets get?

a future warriors pick.

magnax1

12-30-2013, 11:58 PM

christian1923

12-30-2013, 11:59 PM

Lol at the people sayin dirk carried garbage teams? His teams were always very good

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:00 AM

I disagree...First of all you are talking out of your ass...no way Prime Dirk wins 60 games with this team wtf are you smoking? Why? Nash & Kidd >>>> Rubio buffs said. Now **** outa here. Now lemme start by talkin stats...Dirk's ppg career high in the regular season is....drum roll...26.8 ppg...Kevin is on pace to destroy that this year. Kevin Love is already a better offensive player than Dirk is. Kevin love grabs far more rebounds than Dirk ever did. Defensively Dirk has/had no impact what so ever. Both clutch Kevin Love just never had the chance to be I the playoffs yet. His time will come and will pro all y'all fools wrong.

nah man...you are talking out of your ass.

prove who wrong? I like Love...I have no doubt that if he had an awesome team he'd make the playoffs.

but he should be able to get this team to the playoffs.

you obviously didn't watch prime Dirk....and this is where the stats thing comes in. for starters, Dirk is way better on defense than Love...his length alone is a major advantage.

But I don't want to debate facts with you. Nobody with any knowledge of the game or respect is even thinking about that shit at this point.

Some day maybe...but Love has to improve his own game and prove he can do it in the playoffs

magnax1

12-31-2013, 12:00 AM

melo would be a horrid fit....unless we also got asik.
I dont think Asik magically makes Melo a better fit. Honestly, he kind of clogs the lane and more than anyone else on the perimeter Melo scores in by driving and posting up in the halfcourt.

Micku

12-31-2013, 12:02 AM

I don't understand why the Wolves are struggling to stay over .500. They have talent. Top 10 in offense and defense. Good coach and they have talent, tho I hear they are inconsistent, Kevin Love with the numbers he is putting up should be able to lead them to the playoffs. The Suns have less talent, and look at them.

This team reminds me of Memphis back in the day. They also had talent, but they weren't doing anything. They made the playoffs in 2011 or whatever and they upset the Spurs and didn't really look back after that.

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:02 AM

That's actually a pretty good trade for everyone. A bit meh for Houston, but Marion is an interesting addition for them.

Here is why I like it for Houston. They get better this year...Marion fits in perfectly...Dalembert is a fine backup for like 15 minutes a game...and Barea needs a new fit and at least he's proven

But the real kicker is that they also shed 16.8 million of Lin/Asik that are on the books for next year...so they can go out and really improve the team this summers ad Marion is expiring and Bert has a team option.

So imo..it makes them better this year and then gives them a chance to improve this summer...while also opening up money for when they need to sign/extend Parsons.

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:03 AM

I dont think Asik magically makes Melo a better fit. Honestly, he kind of clogs the lane and more than anyone else on the perimeter Melo scores in by driving and posting up in the halfcourt.

Oh of course...I was just saying at least then we have an elite defensive center to make up for what would be the worst 1 through 4 defense in the league by far

Ellis, Calderon, Dirk, Melo....holy shit that would be a joke

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:04 AM

Lol at the people sayin dirk carried garbage teams? His teams were always very good

Of course not. Nobody actually thinks Dirk had garbage. But this wolves team is not garbage either. It's actually quite good and they have a proven coach.

I just can't imagine a healthy prime Dirk missing the playoffs with this team...

k0kakw0rld

12-31-2013, 12:10 AM

nah man...you are talking out of your ass.

prove who wrong? I like Love...I have no doubt that if he had an awesome team he'd make the playoffs.

but he should be able to get this team to the playoffs.

you obviously didn't watch prime Dirk....and this is where the stats thing comes in. for starters, Dirk is way better on defense than Love...his length alone is a major advantage.

But I don't want to debate facts with you. Nobody with any knowledge of the game or respect is even thinking about that shit at this point.

Some day maybe...but Love has to improve his own game and prove he can do it in the playoffs

You can't go to the playoffs when your starting point guard averages almost less points then assists :facepalm There is no denying Dirk's greatness. The man is/was great period. Other than his length what does he have defensively? NOTHING.\ Ok we get it he is part of the greats. Love has to prove himself bla bla bla. NO WAY IN HELL DIRK's REACHING THE PLAYOFFS WITH RUBIO AS A STARTING POINT GUARD. GIVE LOVE PRIME KIDD & NASH and he will reach the playoffs. Rubio/JJ barea are both garbage.

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:13 AM

You can't go to the playoffs when your starting point guard averages almost less points then assists :facepalm There is no denying Dirk's greatness. The man is/was great period. Other than his length what does he have defensively? NOTHING.\ Ok we get it he is part of the greats. Love has to prove himself bla bla bla. NO WAY IN HELL DIRK's REACHING THE PLAYOFFS WITH RUBIO AS A STARTING POINT GUARD. GIVE LOVE PRIME KIDD & NASH and he will reach the playoffs as well.

Dude...Rubio is not as bad as you claim.

And he got to the playoffs without both Nash and Kidd...you realize that...right?

On defense? Dirk was actually quicker to spots than Love, way better at contesting shots and stripping guys driving to the basket, better post defender.

Love is better at taking charges though.

No, it's not just time, Love's game right now is not as good as Dirk's was. And I need to at least see 1 winning season before I even spend another minute thinking about it...especially with this team and coach.

eklip

12-31-2013, 12:33 AM

Mavs made it to .500 last year with a guard rotation of Mike James (waived by the Bulls), Collison (backup for the Clippers) and Mayo (not starting for the worst team in the league) and with a center rotation of Kaman (doesn't get many minutes on a bad laker team), Elton Brand (sits on the bench for the Hawks) and Wright (good player but undersized center).

They were on a 50 win pace once Dirk was fully healthy after the surgery.

He would definitely make the playoffs with Love's teammates in his prime.

KyrieTheFuture

12-31-2013, 12:35 AM

Dirk makes Love look like kendrick perkins in terms of offensive ability.

DMAVS41

12-31-2013, 12:39 AM

04mzwach

12-31-2013, 01:05 AM

Love simply makes more of an impact than Dirk now and I believe he can keep it up. Let's not forget, Dirk had Nash blah blah. In 5 more years, we'll have a rough estimate of where Love sits. Until then, nobody knows a damn thing. We have Love this year and last year pretty much which is a very small sample size. We have Dirk's years and years. We can live in the moment though and say Love showed out.