Are stats overrated?

[ABfor3]

Think about it, you have all time greats like Big O who averaged a triple double a whole season, but obviously the level of competition was so bad back in the 60s. We have Wilt who scored 100 points a game against a bunch of guys no taller than 6'5.. Do stats truly justify how great a player is? Discuss

[moe94]

Relative to era, bro. If you're propping up the almighty "eye test" then you're infallible and every argument bounces off you.

[Legends66NBA7]

When their all in context, they definitely justify how a great a player is. Especially when you produce in the playoffs at high level.

[PickernRoller]

Yes they are.

Top 10 words Lebron stans hate the most:

1. 5 rings
2. Kobe
3. Dirk
4. Cleveland
5. Empty Stats
6. Asterisk Rings
7. 4th quarter
8. clutch
9. Context
10. Weak Era

[moe94]

That was much more than 10 words, you retard. When Jabbar, poido, and rip are busy, do they send you? You're like the bootleg troll who destroys himself on the regular.

[russwest0]

Yes they are.

Top 10 words Lebron stans hate the most:

1. 5 rings
2. Kobe
3. Dirk
4. Cleveland
5. Empty Stats
6. Asterisk Rings
7. 4th quarter
8. clutch
9. Context
10. Weak Era

but his reglar season efficecny tho... :oldlol: :oldlol:

[Crafty]

Yes they are.

Top 10 words Lebron stans hate the most:

1. 5 rings
2. Kobe
3. Dirk
4. Cleveland
5. Empty Stats
6. Asterisk Rings
7. 4th quarter
8. clutch
9. Context
10. Weak Era
10 words?

[HoopsFanNumero1]

Not surprised some people here can't count

[ABfor3]

Relative to era, bro. If you're propping up the almighty "eye test" then you're infallible and every argument bounces off you.
Yeah but even this era we have guys like Kyle Korver shooting insane percentages beyond the arc, some posters believe he's the best shooter in the game, by looking at his stats it's almost hard to argue but that's what I'm trying to discuss, just because his stats say hes shooting that well does it truly mean he's the best (not saying he is) or can we say they're are better shooters from actually watching a player even though he doesn't put up good stats like Korver or anybody else.

[zoom17]

10 words?

:oldlol:

[ABfor3]

That was much more than 10 words, you retard. When Jabbar, poido, and rip are busy, do they send you? You're like the bootleg troll who destroys himself on the regular.
Bootleg troll :roll: :roll:

[PickernRoller]

That was much more than 10 words, you retard. When Jabbar, poido, and rip are busy, do they send you? You're like the bootleg troll who destroys himself on the regular.

I don't give a sh1t about correctness if that's what you're asking, Yes. Doesn't deviate from the bitterness it causes you. Circle jerking is the only thing left for your kind. Visible a few posts in.:oldlol: :oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

Yes they are.

Top 10 words Lebron stans hate the most:

1. 5 rings
2. Kobe
3. Dirk
4. Cleveland
5. Empty Stats
6. Asterisk Rings
7. 4th quarter
8. clutch
9. Context
10. Weak Era

Lebron fans don't care about rings/kobe anymore. I've been propping Kobe and hard on Lebron lately because that is what this site needs, but Lebron has already proved to be a better player than Kobe ever was....and now he has two finals mvp's and two rings. It's just a matter of time before Lebron's career ranks higher than Kobe and everyone without a huge bias knows it

As for stats being over-rated...not really...you just have to look at everything...and I mean everything. Individual stats can be over-rated and anything without context is of course silly

but stats are generally great...by the way, winning is a stat as well...so take the Kevin Love stuff. His individual stats are great, but you have to take the time to dive into everything...and factor in team success...etc. And I'd bet you would accurately rank Love after doing all that.

It's the people that just list 26/13/4...ZOMG! that are the problem...

[Marchesk]

I've been propping Kobe and hard on Lebron lately because that is what this site needs


:coleman:

[moe94]

:coleman:
:roll:

[Mr. Jabbar]

it depends.. when ppl approach me "hey mr. jabbar, what do you think about these stats?" i always recommend applying a dose of common sense before jumping to conclusions. take lebron for example, his fg% is inflated by avoiding tough/last second shots like the plague, he carefully picks easy dunks. you can compare with his fg% during the 2007 finals when he had no choice but to take the shots, not a pretty sight

[moe94]

Jabbar, he had no chance in those Finals and he's a much much much better player now. You talk about context yet throw it completely out the window. You act as if opposition lets him torch them. He did a layup when he could have done a contested shot between 2 players? How awful.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Jabbar, he had no chance in those Finals and he's a much much much better player now. You talk about context yet throw it completely out the window. You act as if opposition lets him torch them. He did a layup when he could have done a contested shot between 2 players? How awful.

yes he is a better player now but the premise still holds true..his fg% wouldn't be damn near what it is had he take over games during the 4th aka kobe mode.

another example of common sense in boxscores, finals game 7 lal vs celtics. kobe 6-24, untrained eye will bash him but hold your breath, see how the rest of the lakers shoot...ok celtics were playing stellar defense, then he wasn't detrimental to the team with his shooting, what won the game then? after carefully watching the game (eye-test) you realize stiff defense where kobe exceled and hustle rebounding (15) is what won the game...notice pau gasol shot 6-16 (and was 3-12 at halftime). artest, the hero of the hour, was 7-18 from the field. bynum played limited minutes, but at 1-5, he also struggled while he was on the court. odom was 3-8. farmar, shann brown and vujacic combined to shoot 0-6. only fisher, at 10 points on 4-6 from the field , had a good shooting night for the lakers.

[riseagainst]

Yes they are.

Top 10 words Lebron stans hate the most:

1. 5 rings
2. Kobe
3. Dirk
4. Cleveland
5. Empty Stats
6. Asterisk Rings
7. 4th quarter
8. clutch
9. Context
10. Weak Era


:roll: :roll:

[andremiller07]

Yes stats in general are overrated and the introdiction of advanced stats has made it even worse.

[Dr.J4ever]

Yes, stats are overrated here on ISH and in the media. Stats are used to hype players and create fan interest. Since not all teams can be successful, the NBA has learned to create interest in players instead, so they would never have to rely on teams winning for the continued popularity of the NBA.

Think about it. If the NBA hyped teams only the winning teams in particular, then how would you create fan interest in the other losing franchises? Answer: hype the players and their stats.

As I have said here, the point of playing team basketball is to win, and not to create stats. There are many positive or negative things that happen on a court that stats don't measure. Besides the usual intangibles, picks and passes that lead to assist passes are only some of the things not measured by stats.

[joeyjoejoe]

When their all in context, they definitely justify how a great a player is. Especially when you produce in the playoffs at high level.

I agree but here's a question who should be ranked higher player a. Who generally plays at a very high level in the playoffs but has little success or player b. Who plays at a mediocre level but has more success say two or three rings because I keep hearing these very well thought out arguments which consist of such points as 3>>1

[mehyaM24]

yes he is a better player now but the premise still holds true..his fg% wouldn't be damn near what it is had he take over games during the 4th aka kobe mode.

another example of common sense in boxscores, finals game 7 lal vs celtics. kobe 6-24, untrained eye will bash him but hold your breath, see how the rest of the lakers shoot...ok celtics were playing stellar defense, then he wasn't detrimental to the team with his shooting, what won the game then? after carefully watching the game (eye-test) you realize stiff defense where kobe exceled and hustle rebounding (15) is what won the game...notice pau gasol shot 6-16 (and was 3-12 at halftime). artest, the hero of the hour, was 7-18 from the field. bynum played limited minutes, but at 1-5, he also struggled while he was on the court. odom was 3-8. farmar, shann brown and vujacic combined to shoot 0-6. only fisher, at 10 points on 4-6 from the field , had a good shooting night for the lakers.

I'm supposed to be impressed by Kobes 15 reboundss? Lmao. We all saw the game. Epic choke job. Lebron had 27/19/10 when the Cavs were eliminated by Boston. Kobe? 23 pts,15 rbs,3 assists......handed the finals MVP on the same day. :oldlol:

I swear he is lucky he's always had superior teammates. Now that LeBron has his though? Kobe ain't winning another one...

[fpliii]

Depends. Basic counting stats you'll find in a box score and shit linear weights formulas are. Everything else isn't (particularly rate stats like TS%, TRB%, BLK%, and stuff from play-by-plays like RAPM, though basic +/- isn't useful).

PPG, APG, SPG, PER, WS, and individual ORtg/DRtg are pure trash, don't bother with them (for reasons we've discussed countless times on this board).

[Genaro]

Yes they are. Nothing beats the eye test.

[Mr. Jabbar]

I'm supposed to be impressed by Kobes 15 reboundss? Lmao. We all saw the game. Epic choke job. Lebron had 27/19/10 when the Cavs were eliminated by Boston. Kobe? 23 pts,15 rbs,3 assists......handed the finals MVP on the same day. :oldlol:

I swear he is lucky he's always had superior teammates. Now that LeBron has his though? Kobe ain't winning another one...

why would you quote something you didn't read or respond to?

negged.