If Paul Pierce retired after this season..

[ABfor3]

Where do you rank him all time, as in NBA history and In Celtics History?
Discuss

[Black and White]

All time? Not too sure

Celtics history? probably around #4-6

[ABfor3]

All time? Not too sure

Celtics history? probably around #4-6
4 -6?
So you're saying there's been 5 other guys better than Pierce?
I think his consistency ranks him no less than top 3 plus bringing a championship to Boston.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

He's not in front of Bird, Russell, or Hondo.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

He's not in front of Bird, Russell, or Hondo.

Arguable. I'd say he's 3-5 somewhere.

All time? Top 60 or so.

[Black and White]

4 -6?
So you're saying there's been 5 other guys better than Pierce?
I think his consistency ranks him no less than top 3 plus bringing a championship to Boston.

It's hard because there have been so many great Celtics, Bird, Russell, McHale, Hondo, Cousy etc. I'm def not putting him ahead of Bird or Russell.

[cos88]

russell
bird
hondo

then i think he's in the same category as sam jones, kevin mchale, bob cousy and dave cowens.

somewhere between 4 and 7 probably.


you can also make a case for his as a top 50 player, 45-55 to be more realistic, next to guys like alonzo mourning, tmac, iverson or dominique.

[MP.Trey]

4 -6?
So you're saying there's been 5 other guys better than Pierce?
I think his consistency ranks him no less than top 3 plus bringing a championship to Boston.
I have:

Larry Bird
Bill Russell
John Havlicek
Kevin McHale
Maybe Bob Cousy

All over Pierce personally. Celtics history is just too rich for Pierce to get a top 3 ranking. Top 5, maybe.

[It's A VC3!!!]

Paul Pierce gets so much respect. He's a great player but he only turned into a winner because of Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen. Without those two players he would have never been a champion. Almost like my man Vince Carter. Vince had so many great statistical seasons, like Pierce, but never had his two night in shining armor players arrive at his door step.

Even with that said Pierce did show up in the finals and throughout the post-season run and had a heck of a post-season unlike Vince Carter with the Magic, although Vince was 32 years old at the time. My post above wasn't meant to bash Pierce as he has been very consistent for a long time and has always showed up in the big moments. He's definitely top 60 though.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Paul Pierce gets so much respect. He's a great player but he only turned into a winner because of Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen. Without those two players he would have never been a champion. Almost like my man Vince Carter. Vince had so many great statistical seasons, like Pierce, but never had his two night in shining armor players arrive at his door step.

Even with that said Pierce did show up in the finals and throughout the post-season run and had a heck of a post-season unlike Vince Carter with the Magic, although Vince was 32 years old at the time. My post above wasn't meant to bash Pierce as he has been very consistent for a long time and has always showed up in the big moments. He's definitely top 60 though.

Vince is only 9 months older and Pierce ruined him in the 2010 ECF. Ended that discussion there.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Shouldn't the Pierce/Carter thing be dead by now? There are excuses to be made for why Carter comes up short. There is not, however, any argument to be made for Carter having had a better career unless you're really impressed by that Dunk Contest performance.

[Alan Ogg]

Definitely behind:

Bill Russell
Larry Bird
John Havlicek
Bob Cousy
Dave Cowens

[Uncle Drew]

4 -6?
So you're saying there's been 5 other guys better than Pierce?
I think his consistency ranks him no less than top 3 plus bringing a championship to Boston.
Russell, Bird, McHale, Parish, Cousy, Havlicek, Cowens, Dennis Johnson, Sam Jones, KC Jones, Jo Jo White. It was hard enough for PP to make the top 10 (he definitely does, though), but top 3.... I'd say he's more 5-7ish.

[It's A VC3!!!]

Pierce fans must be morons. I say one legitimate case about him while praising him yet they get all childish for no apparent reason.:oldlol:

Oh gosh, never cease to amaze me.

[Pushxx]

1. Bird
2. Russell
3. Hondo

4. Pierce
5. Cowens
6. McHale

Then you have a mix of Cousy, Parish, Sam Jones, and a couple others. Tenure, post-career impact, and off-the-court impact cause a lot of variation.

[moe94]

Russell, Bird, McHale, Parish, Cousy, Havlicek, Cowens, Dennis Johnson, Sam Jones, KC Jones, Jo Jo White. It was hard enough for PP to make the top 10 (he definitely does, though), but top 3.... I'd say he's more 5-7ish.

As far as careers go, only Bird and Russell are clearly ahead. In fact, he's the clear cut favorite for number 3. :confusedshrug:

[QuebecBaller]

1. Bird
2. Russell
3. Hondo
Antoine Walker :D
4. Pierce
5. Cowens
6. McHale

Then you have a mix of Cousy, Parish, Sam Jones, and a couple others. Tenure, post-career impact, and off-the-court impact cause a lot of variation.

http://nba247365.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/toine_pierce.jpg

[Pushxx]

Employee #8 :bowdown:

[imdaman99]

Pierce is a top 50 Net :rockon:

[Real Men Wear Green]

Pierce fans must be morons. I say one legitimate case about him while praising him yet they get all childish for no apparent reason.:oldlol:

Oh gosh, never cease to amaze me.
You would be the idiot who brought up VC in a thread that had nothing to do with him whatsoever.

[barkleynash]

I say Danny Ainge might bring Paul back after he expires this year on a relatively cheap deal to allow him to retire a celtic. I think that would be honourable. He can be a sixth man, help mentor the young guys and start the rebuild and retire as a celtic.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I say Danny Ainge might bring Paul back after he expires this year on a relatively cheap deal to allow him to retire a celtic. I think that would be honourable. He can be a sixth man, help mentor the young guys and start the rebuild and retire as a celtic.
Pierce will be resigned at some point to retire his jersey. But if Pierce desires to continue his career after this season I don't think he'll want an entire season of rebuilding. Now that he's no longer a career Celtic I don't think he'll want to return unless Ainge manages to bring in superstars and it looks like they can challenge the Heqat. Doing that in one summer is extremely unlikely.

[Figlo]

10th SF of all time if you ask me:

Larry Bird
Julius Erving
John Havlicek
Elgin Baylor
Rick Barry
Scottie Pippen
James Worthy
Dominique Wilkins
Tracy Mcgrady
Paul Pierce

Beats out: Dantley, Hill, King, English, Mullin.
Will beat out Pierce when their career is over: LeBron, KD, Melo, Paul George(sg?)

[moe94]

10th SF of all time if you ask me:

Larry Bird
Julius Erving
John Havlicek
Elgin Baylor
Rick Barry
Scottie Pippen
James Worthy
Dominique Wilkins
Tracy Mcgrady
Paul Pierce

Beats out: Dantley, Hill, King, English, Mullin.
Will beat out Pierce when their career is over: LeBron, KD, Melo, Paul George(sg?)

Good post. LeBron is absolutely top 10 SF all time already, though. Who are you dropping? T-Mac a SF? You can say he's a SG, too. Drop his ass.

[Real Men Wear Green]

10th SF of all time if you ask me:

Larry Bird
Julius Erving
John Havlicek
Elgin Baylor
Rick Barry
Scottie Pippen
James Worthy
Dominique Wilkins
Tracy Mcgrady
Paul Pierce

Beats out: Dantley, Hill, King, English, Mullin.
Will beat out Pierce when their career is over: LeBron, KD, Melo, Paul George(sg?)McGrady had a little higher peak but it absolutely didn't last long enough. The 32ppg season he had at age 23 is above any of Pierce's seasons but after that he went steadily downhill and from 29 on he wasn't even a good player. Pierce kills him in longevity and durability.

[Figlo]

McGrady had a little higher peak but it absolutely didn't last long enough. The 32ppg season he had at age 23 is above any of Pierce's seasons but after that he went steadily downhill and from 29 on he wasn't even a good player. Pierce kills him in longevity and durability.

You've got a point, T-mac's one of my favorite players of all time and his recent retirement is probabaly why i put him up that high lol.

[L.Kizzle]

1. Bird
2. Russell
3. Hondo

4. Pierce
5. Cowens
6. McHale

Then you have a mix of Cousy, Parish, Sam Jones, and a couple others. Tenure, post-career impact, and off-the-court impact cause a lot of variation.
When did Pierce become greater than Bob Cousy? Cousy is in most people's top 25-30 greats of All-Time, and some rank him higher. P-Dub is lucky to sniff top 60-70 All-Time.

[L.Kizzle]

McGrady had a little higher peak but it absolutely didn't last long enough. The 32ppg season he had at age 23 is above any of Pierce's seasons but after that he went steadily downhill and from 29 on he wasn't even a good player. Pierce kills him in longevity and durability.
Even with his much shorter peak, he's managed to own him in All-NBA appearances and has a few less All-Star appearances.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Even with his much shorter peak, he's managed to own him in All-NBA appearances and has a few less All-Star appearances.
And no playoff series victories...well, I guess you can say he won some series as a Spur if you want to be technical but he didn't actually play. So to recap, we have only one season that is significantly better than Pierce's best. For most of McGrady's peak he and Pierce are on the same level with Pierce doing more in the postseason even before KG joined him. And then you have McGrady's precipitous decline while Pierce remained one of the best at his position until last season. In the end there's no case to be made for McGrady having a better career. He had a better peak and it wasn't for very long.

[L.Kizzle]

And no playoff series victories...well, I guess you can say he won some series as a Spur if you want to be technical but he didn't actually play. So to recap, we have only one season that is significantly better than Pierce's best. For most of McGrady's peak he and Pierce are on the same level with Pierce doing more in the postseason even before KG joined him. And then you have McGrady's precipitous decline while Pierce remained one of the best at his position until last season. In the end there's no case to be made for McGrady having a better career. He had a better peak and it wasn't for very long.
McGrady was better between 2000-2005. 2006 they were both injured. P-Dub was better in 07 and 08. McGrady was basically done after 2008 playing his last few seasons for the Knicks, Pistons, Hawks and Spurs.

Put P-Dub on those early 2000 Magic squads and he's not doing much better.

[Pushxx]

When did Pierce become greater than Bob Cousy? Cousy is in most people's top 25-30 greats of All-Time, and some rank him higher. P-Dub is lucky to sniff top 60-70 All-Time.

Despite revolutionizing some of basketball, I'm not a big Cousy guy. He should be below Pierce, Cowens, and McHale. :D I can see it both ways, of course.

[CelticBaller]

top 5

[Real Men Wear Green]

McGrady was better between 2000-2005. 2006 they were both injured. P-Dub was better in 07 and 08. McGrady was basically done after 2008 playing his last few seasons for the Knicks, Pistons, Hawks and Spurs.Even if McGrady was better from 00-05 the difference between them was small. Since 2008 Pierce's edge has been massive, to the point where McGrady wasn't even close to Pierce's level.


Put P-Dub on those early 2000 Magic squads and he's not doing much better.
We'll never know either way. What's more important than this hypothetical argument is the fact that Pierce has led his teams to multiple playoff victories while T-Mac hasn't led a team anywhere in the postseason. It's not his fault, it's not entirely fair, but it is a fact. That's a huge hole for a player to have in his resume. Pierce has easily had the better career.

[moe94]

Pierce has easily had the better career.

How is this even a debate?

[IncarceratedBob]

You Could Make The Argument That Hes Better A Celtic Than Larry Bird. Bird Ran Like A Bitch To The Pacers, He Is Not A True Celtic.

But All Time I Think Hes Top 15 Sf All Time, Roughly. Celtic Top 5 Maybe

[Alan Ogg]

Cowens had a dominant stretch of being a top 5 player 4 years in a row including an MVP (that should have gone to Kareem), and was a monster contributor on two championships (putting up 20/13 and 21/16 in those playoff runs). When was Pierce a top 5 player?