will Peyton Manning eventually go down as the greatest quarterback of all time?

[riseagainst]

if not, then speaking purely from peak play, where does he rank?

:confusedshrug:

[-p.tiddy-]

Montana is #1 even after Peyton wins this one...but Peyton has probably locked up the #2 spot over Brady now

[CelticBaller]

Yeah, as Brady's 1B

[DonDadda59]

Yeah, as Brady's 1B

Eli Manning owns Brady's soul. Keeps it in a jar on the mantle over his fire place.

[Budadiiii]

Peyton is the GOAT. He's a better individual player than Montana and did much more with much less.

I'm sure Joe would admit to it as well.

[CelticBaller]

Eli Manning owns Brady's soul. Keeps it in a jar on the mantle over his fire place.
Didn't know QBs played defense, for that matter he own Rodgers,Favre and every NFC east QBs soul

[Cold soul]

Peyton wins it all this year, he will be 2nd all-time only to Montana.

[DonDadda59]

Didn't know QBs played defense, for that matter he own Rodgers,Favre and every NFC east QBs soul

Fine, the Giants D line and Tom Coughlin own Tom Brady's soul. You happy now? :lol

[KingBeasley08]

Peyton Manning already is the greatest quarterback of all time

[CelticBaller]

Fine, the Giants D line and Tom Coughlin own Tom Brady's soul. You happy now? :lol
They own mine 2, 5 Superbowls in 11 years, my dream ruined by the retarded Manning

[highwhey]

They own mine 2, 5 Superbowls in 11 years, my dream ruined by the retarded Manning
fvcking mouth breather

[-p.tiddy-]

Peyton Manning already is the greatest quarterback of all time
just need to make sure he doesn't throw a pick-6 for the loss in the 4th first or that will make those 5 MVPs shrink up real quickly

he would go down as one of the biggest choke artists ever...

[Patrick Chewing]

Montana overrated as usual :rolleyes:

[Budadiiii]

just need to make sure he doesn't throw a pick-6 for the loss in the 4th first or that will make those 5 MVPs shrink up real quickly

he would go down as one of the biggest choke artists ever...
Yah he'd probably join your boy Romo if that happened, even though Romo only has one playoff win and will never sniff a Super Bowl.

[KingBeasley08]

http://207.58.151.151/forum/showthread.php?t=250994

Been sayin this shit for as long as I can remember. In terms of pure QB ability, Manning is already GOAT. He also has enough accolades and accomplishments to take that spot

[Crystallas]

In a decade after Peyton retires, he will be socially penalized for playing in an era where QBs are given the most favorable rules, unless the NFL continues down this path, and crates an even more favorable rule set for passing.

[Rasheed1]

I personally think brady is better, but Peyton is pretty great himself.. Not the all-time best though

[Jameerthefear]

Manning already is the greatest QB ever.
This.

[Heavincent]

Peyton Manning is the GOAT...





































if you ignore Joe Montana's existence.

[Heavincent]

Joe Montana playoff resume:

45 TD 21 INT
5,772 passing yards
Y/A: 7.8
4 super bowls (16-7 record)

Peyton Manning:

36 TD 22 INT
6,408 passing yards
Y/A: 7.6
1 super bowl (11-11 record)

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

After next Sunday's W, he's definitely better than Brady.

[Just2McFly]

Peyton Manning already is the greatest quarterback of all time
This.

[Rasheed1]

So Dan Moreno isn't even a top 10 QB of all time based off of superbowl wins, right?


Dan Moreno? No, he is not top 10 anything

[Heavincent]

So Dan Moreno isn't even a top 10 QB of all time based off of superbowl wins, right?

That's not my main point. My point is that he's the greatest post season QB ever.

[GOBB]

John Elway is the GOAT to me. Really when it comes to the GOAT QB, a select few are in line to be argued for such a status. Obviously people will disagree, but the arguments for GOAT usually is discussed among a select few great QBs.

[CelticBaller]

John Elway is the GOAT to me. Really when it comes to the GOAT QB, a select few are in line to be argued for such a status. Obviously people will disagree, but the arguments for GOAT usually is discussed among a select few great QBs.
This

No one sits on top alone

[Patrick Chewing]

Joe Montana playoff resume:

45 TD 21 INT
5,772 passing yards
Y/A: 7.8
4 super bowls (16-7 record)

Peyton Manning:

36 TD 22 INT
6,408 passing yards
Y/A: 7.6
1 super bowl (11-11 record)

Greatness is not defined solely by your Playoff appearances and wins. Believe it or not, it's a different league with much better competition than it was during Montana's era which wasn't that long ago.

[MMM]

Manning is top 5 to me along with Brady, Elway, Montana, and Moreno.

Just rating their arms I think Moreno is the Greatest with Manning and Elway being close behind. There is more to QB play than that doe, overall I prefer Elway with Moreno being close behind.

[PHX_Phan]

All things considered, Peyton's impact and how he operates as a QB, I have him as the best. Even if Brady knocked him out in the AFC Championship game and won another ring, I'd still have Peyton over him.

[bdreason]

He's no Joe Montana.

[Cold soul]

John Elway is the GOAT to me. Really when it comes to the GOAT QB, a select few are in line to be argued for such a status. Obviously people will disagree, but the arguments for GOAT usually is discussed among a select few great QBs.

John Elway is one of my favorite athletes ever, but I still wouldent rank him over Peyton. Elway made me an Broncos fan in late 1996. Elway was so awesome to watch and Broncos were never out of any game ever with him behind center. The 6-3 215 Pound QB earned his nickname as "Captain Comeback" during the drive and all the other great comebacks. Elway dragged three below average teams to the Super Bowl that had no business being there. The Broncos finally got Elway to the promised land with TD, Sharpe, Rod Smith, Eddie Mac, on defense Atwater, Pryce, Neil Smith, etc. I was so damn happy when Elway went out on top with those two rings no better way to finish his HOF career than that. I really hope Broncos beat Seahawks in the SB it's only two more weeks. The game will be tough, especially with the weather playing a factor.

[CelticBaller]

All things considered, Peyton's impact and how he operates as a QB, I have him as the best. Even if Brady knocked him out in the AFC Championship game and won another ring, I'd still have Peyton over him.
Brady's 07-08 season was a prime example of how lethal he was at reading defenses/QB field work.
Brady has the regular season stats, playoffs and rings . Can't hate on that

[PHX_Phan]

Brady's 07-08 season was a prime example of how lethal he was at reading defenses/QB field work.
Brady has the regular season stats, playoffs and rings . Can't hate on that

He also had weapons like Moss and Welker, one of the best coaches in football and one of the best front offices, too.

I like how ranking one player above Brady is considered hating on the guy by his fans.

[atljonesbro]

Manning is definitely the GOAT lol. People with their nostalgia smh.

[-p.tiddy-]

My top-10 list...SB Era only
(SB era only, Unitas, Starr, Graham, etc prime years were pre-SB era)

1. Joe Montana
2. Peyton Manning
3. Tom Brady
4. Steve Young
5. John Elway
6. Dan Marino
7. Roger Staubach
8. Troy Aikman
9. Brett Favre
10. Drew Brees


that's what I got

This changes for me by very small amounts each year it seems...Bradshaw now replaced by Brees for me, didn't view Brees as top-10 all time until I just now thought about it

[-p.tiddy-]

Rodgers>
than Brees? not yet

but Rodgers will likely be top-5 all time when he retires...possibly even #1 overall

he is the only QB that has a legit shot of taking down Montana

[-p.tiddy-]

Fun fact Rodgers already has 23 more tds than aikman in 5 and a half years. Also about 100 less picks. Also no Irvin/Smith/HOF line

Aikman:yaohappy:
that is amazing...but times have changed obviously, and Troy only played 12 years due to concussion

Troy's post season > Rodgers as of right now



but yeah I am sure Rodgers will jump Troy right after another SB run

[-p.tiddy-]

Rodgers is flat out amazing...he probably has had the best starting 5 1/2 years in the history of the NFL, in fact I am sure he has...he is the all time leader in passer rating

but Troy had 3 amazing post season runs though where he was just surgical, ELITE in every way, and that counts the most here I think, that's why Montana is #1 in my book, he was flawless when it mattered the most

Troys post season is enough to have him over Rodgers for now IMO...but I could easily view that differently in just a couple years

[Rameek]

Montana, Elway, Unitas, Marino, Moon, Unitas
Then you can put in the Brady, Manning, Favre, Staubach etc etc...

It cant be solely about championships because its a team game.

[LeGOAT]

Troy Aikmen was a fvcking schlub. No body would care about him if it wasn't for those three Superbowl rings. What is Eli Manning a all time great too?.

[-p.tiddy-]

you mean "Aikman"? :rolleyes:

unfortunately I do think Eli will eventually get in the HOF aka an "all time great"...probably not first ballot like Troy though

anyone old enough to have watched both knows Troy was better and very much "elite" during his prime, with or without rings

[LeGOAT]

you mean "Aikman"? :rolleyes:

unfortunately I do think Eli will eventually get in the HOF aka an "all time great"...probably not first ballot like Troy though

anyone old enough to have watched both knows Troy was better and very much "elite" during his prime, with or without rings
Comparing him to Eli was a bit much. He still doesn't belong any near the likes of Montana, Elway, Manning, Brady, Marino.

[-p.tiddy-]

Comparing him to Eli was a bit much. He still doesn't belong any near the likes of Montana, Elway, Manning, Brady, Marino.
I put him at #8 overall and all the guys you just listed in front of him...maybe you missed the last page


Aikman is still a first ballot HOFer like those guys though, suggesting that he is some "schlub" unworthy of top-10 mention is ridiculous

[CelticBaller]

He also had weapons like Moss and Welker, one of the best coaches in football and one of the best front offices, too.

I like how ranking one player above Brady is considered hating on the guy by his fans.
Oh so are we forgetting all the prow bowlers manning has this season?
What about Brady 11 season? He had moss there to bail him out?

GTFO, Brady became under appreciated af this year.

[Clyde]

I have Brady as #1.

He's done more with less.

Every other guy has had a career with superstars.

Brady had Moss for 2 years.

The list of players he's had to throw to over the years make me puke.

[CelticBaller]

I have Brady as #1.

He's done more with less.

Every other guy has had a career with superstars.

Brady had Moss for 2 years.

The list of players he's had to throw to over the years make me puke.
Maybe on offense, but he has the GOAT coach and he had great defensive teams the years he won the Superbowls. He is obviously the biggest reason the team wins but remember that football is a team game

[Heavincent]

You know, you could make a very good argument that Aikman was the weak link of the Cowboys offense...that's how great they were.

[-p.tiddy-]

You know, you could make a very good argument that Aikman was the weak link of the Cowboys offense...that's how great they were.
"the weak link"? uh, no you couldn't

Aikman was the concensus #1 overall pick coming out of college...and he lived up to that pick, he was very good, one of the best players on the team, and the leader of the team as well

[KingBeasley08]

"the weak link"? uh, no you couldn't

Aikman was the concensus #1 overall pick coming out of college...and he lived up to that pick, he was very good, one of the best players on the team, and the leader of the team as well
Aikman has no business being in the top ten

Manning, Brady, Montana, Elway, Favre, Young, Unitas, Marino, Brees, Staubauch

That's just off the top of my head too

[-p.tiddy-]

Aikman has no business being in the top ten

Manning, Brady, Montana, Elway, Favre, Young, Unitas, Marino, Brees, Staubauch

That's just off the top of my head too
"no business"? :facepalm

I mean even if you have him out of your top-10 he couldn't possibly be far behind, maybe 1 or 2 spots at most...

my list was SB era only...Unitas prime years were pre-SB

[Cold soul]

Oh so are we forgetting all the prow bowlers manning has this season?
What about Brady 11 season? He had moss there to bail him out?

GTFO, Brady became under appreciated af this year.

As a Manning fan Brady has had munch less offensive weapons for his career than Peyton when comes to that side of the ball. Manning in Indy had Harrison, Wayne, Stokley, Clark, James, Garcon, with the Broncos DT, Welker, Julius, Decker, and Moreno. On top of great offensive lines Pro Bowl/All-pro type players on both teams. Brady on the other hand was blessed with all-time great defenses in his earlier career (2000's) that helped him win those three rings, he was more of game manager at that point. Brady started his postseason record (10-0), but I'd say Brady didn't become an elite QB up until 2005-2006 season. Brady back in those days was clutch in 4th quarters with game winning drives that set up Adam Vinatieri for the win during the SB years.

In any event here are my top 5 QB's of all-time.

1) Montana
2) Brady
3) Manning
4) Elway
5) Marino

If Manning wins the Super Bowl in less than two weeks he moves up #2 on my list. Feel free to agree or disagree.

[-p.tiddy-]

that "Morneo" misspelled on purpose because of earlier?

we already had an "Aikmen" in this thread



if you don't know these guys names by heart then you obviously didn't give them much attention while they played an any opinion you have on them should probably be void

[CelticBaller]

If only rodgers receivers didn't drop everything in the playoffs:(
My 2nd favorite QB next to Brady :cheers:
#12>>>>

[Cold soul]

that "Morneo" misspelled on purpose because of earlier?

we already had an "Aikmen" in this thread



if you don't know these guys names by heart then you obviously didn't give them much attention while they played an any opinion you have on them should probably be void

Yeah, I saw Marino play during his later years not the beginning unfortunately just like Elway also. Many people have said Marino was the best thrower of the football they ever saw play. Yes, it was misspelled earlier my bad. It's harder to type on mobile phone IMO than a computer.

[Jackass18]

Montana is over-glorified to an almost crazy degree. Peyton is already the GOAT, but as I've said, there's like 7-8 guys you could put at #1. It all comes down to what you value and how much you value things.

[Jackass18]

Troys post season is enough to have him over Rodgers for now IMO...but I could easily view that differently in just a couple years

Rodger's post season QB rating = 103.1
Aikman's post season QB rating = 88.3



Aikman has no business being in the top ten

He's probably not even a top 20 QB in the SB era unless you overvalue SB trophies and/or are a Cowboys fan. Aikman ahead of Favre is laughable, but we're talking about a gigantic homer here, though.

[-p.tiddy-]

He's probably not even a top 20 QB in the SB era unless you overvalue SB trophies and/or are a Cowboys fan. Aikman ahead of Favre is laughable, but we're talking about a gigantic homer here, though.
:oldlol:

you're a Skin's fan, if Aikman isn't in your top-20 then you are without question the one being a "gigantic homer"

there are only 23 modern era QBs in the HOF...Troy is one of them

would love to see your top-20 list where players like Moon, Kelly, Blanda, Namath, Bradshaw, Fouts, etc are all above Troy, because that is what you would have to do to get him out of your top-20

[KingBeasley08]

:oldlol:

you're a Skin's fan, if Aikman isn't in your top-20 then you are without question the biased one

there are only 23 modern era QBs in the HOF...Troy is one of them

would love to see your top-20 list where players like Moon, Kelly, Blanda, Namath, Bradshaw, Fouts, etc are all above Troy, because that is what you would have to do to get him out of your top-20
Now that I think about it, Rodgers has to be higher. He's better in his short tenure than Aikman ever was. I initially thought otherwise cause of longevity but Aikman only played 11 years. Rodgers has already been playing for 6 seasons

[-p.tiddy-]

Now that I think about it, Rodgers has to be higher. He's better in his short tenure than Aikman ever was. I initially thought otherwise cause of longevity but Aikman only played 11 years. Rodgers has already been playing for 6 seasons
in Rodger's short tenure he is better than anyone ever was...

this all has to be based around career acheivments...and thus far Rodgers isn't quite top-10 yet, he is close though with that MVP


do you think that if Rodgers retired today he would be a 1st ballot guy like Troy?

[-p.tiddy-]

next guy in line is Warner IMO...not Rodgers

[tpols]

When I think of 90s Cowboys I think Emmit, Deion, and Irvin before Aikman.. They were all better players at their positions than Aikman was at his.

[niko]

Aikman played in the era you could keep teams together, none of the guys today will ever have that stacked a team because they'd have to break it up due to salary constraints. It's not his fault that he had great teammates.

[-p.tiddy-]

ha, this same claim comes up an time any of them are "rated"

guess they all suck because they had each other

[zoom17]

Aikman played in the era you could keep teams together, none of the guys today will ever have that stacked a team because they'd have to break it up due to salary constraints. It's not his fault that he had great teammates.

Marino would have won many rings with that cowboys Team.

[-p.tiddy-]

I have Marino rated above Troy


Troy was just clutch as fck though...would love to see a top-20 SB era list without Troy...that shit would be a hoot

[Cold soul]

Montana is over-glorified to an almost crazy degree. Peyton is already the GOAT, but as I've said, there's like 7-8 guys you could put at #1. It all comes down to what you value and how much you value things.

Not really 4-0 in SB 12 TD to zero INT is flat out domination on the biggest stage, 3 SB MVPs could of been four. Montana is #1 guy I would take in postseason over anyone current or past QB.

[christian1923]

Joe Montana is the GOAT cause he called Steve Young a Fa99ot.

[knickballer]

I don't know why people say Aikman had average stats but don't use the same stats when comparing Elway who often gets mentioned as the goat despite having very pedestrian stats..

[GOBB]

John Elway is one of my favorite athletes ever, but I still wouldent rank him over Peyton. Elway made me an Broncos fan in late 1996. Elway was so awesome to watch and Broncos were never out of any game ever with him behind center. The 6-3 215 Pound QB earned his nickname as "Captain Comeback" during the drive and all the other great comebacks. Elway dragged three below average teams to the Super Bowl that had no business being there. The Broncos finally got Elway to the promised land with TD, Sharpe, Rod Smith, Eddie Mac, on defense Atwater, Pryce, Neil Smith, etc. I was so damn happy when Elway went out on top with those two rings no better way to finish his HOF career than that. I really hope Broncos beat Seahawks in the SB it's only two more weeks. The game will be tough, especially with the weather playing a factor.

Most of what you said is why I have Elway as my GOAT. :cheers:

Manning is in my top 3.

[-p.tiddy-]

I don't know why people say Aikman had average stats but don't use the same stats when comparing Elway who often gets mentioned as the goat despite having very pedestrian stats..
Aikman had great stats for that era

I would say passer rating is 10-15 points lower on average back then...when CBs could actually play physical

so a 90.0 rating passer back then should probably be seen as 100.0 - 105.0 rating today

something like that

[Jackass18]

:oldlol:

you're a Skin's fan, if Aikman isn't in your top-20 then you are without question the one being a "gigantic homer"

there are only 23 modern era QBs in the HOF...Troy is one of them

Aikman was a game manager with great accuracy. He won a lot because he played on stacked teams. Look at his first SB winning team. 9 of the 11 starters on offense were multi time PB'ers, and they had the #1 defense. He had the great luxury of an incredible OL, Smith to hand it off to, and to throw to 'The Playmaker'.


would love to see your top-20 list where players like Moon, Kelly, Blanda, Namath, Bradshaw, Fouts, etc are all above Troy, because that is what you would have to do to get him out of your top-20

I said he wouldn't be top 20, then I noticed you said SB era, so I changed it to probably wouldn't be. Here's a list:

Manning
Brady
Montana
Young
Marino
Favre
Elway
Brees
Cunningham
Dawson
Fouts
Jurgensen
Kelly
Moon
Staubach
Tarkenton

Then, you have ones that are arguable:

Rodgers
Rivers
Warner
Anderson
Griese
Bradshaw
Esiason
Some might even try to make a case for guys like Gannon, Gabriel, McNair, McNabb, Krieg, and Roethlisberger

[-p.tiddy-]

I said he wouldn't be top 20, then I noticed you said SB era, so I changed it to probably wouldn't be. Here's a list:

Manning
Brady
Montana
Young
Marino
Favre
Elway
Brees
Cunningham
Dawson
Fouts
Jurgensen
Kelly
Moon
Staubach
Tarkenton

Then, you have ones that are arguable:

Rodgers
Rivers
Warner
Anderson
Griese
Bradshaw
Esiason
Some might even try to make a case for guys like Gannon, Gabriel, McNair, McNabb, Krieg, and Roethlisberger
so you have ALL of those 15 QBs in red over Aikman? :wtf: ...and then the rest you listed are 'arguable'?

are you fckin kidding me with that?

Jim Kelly himself would snicker at that...

Ken Anderson > Esiason

Phillip Rivers??? wtf is his name even doing on here?...McNabb?? McNabb has absolutely no shot at the HOF, much less a 1st ballot guy like Troy

Dave Krieg? :facepalm



this is the worst NFL related opinion you have ever thrown out...I really hope you're just trolling me with this shit

[Jackass18]

Not really 4-0 in SB 12 TD to zero INT is flat out domination on the biggest stage, 3 SB MVPs could of been four. Montana is #1 guy I would take in postseason over anyone current or past QB.

Montana also did have some bad games in the playoffs. If you want a QB for the SB, then yeah, Montana is probably the guy. He was said to be extremely calm even under tremendous pressure. I just don't place that much value on a single game (the Super Bowl). Also, winning takes the entire team. Did Montana play on defense and special teams in those SB victories? Not to mention he played on stacked teams. Steve Young actually had a higher winning % on the 49ers than Montana did. He also had a higher QB rating, as well.


I don't know why people say Aikman had average stats but don't use the same stats when comparing Elway who often gets mentioned as the goat despite having very pedestrian stats..

He was a gunslinger who didn't have many weapons offensively to work with for about 2/3rds of his career, so his earlier stats don't look great. But, his stats aren't pedestrian at all. He's 4th in career passing yards, 7th in TDs, 6th in completions, 3rd in game-winning drives along with some pretty good rushing numbers for a QB.

[Jackass18]

so you have ALL of those 15 QBs in red over Aikman? :wtf: ...and then the rest you listed are 'arguable'?

are you fckin kidding me with that?

Jim Kelly himself would snicker at that...

Ken Anderson > Esiason

Phillip Rivers??? wtf is his name even doing on here?...McNabb?? McNabb has absolutely no shot at the HOF, much less a 1st ballot guy like Troy

Dave Krieg? :facepalm



this is the worst NFL related opinion you have ever thrown out...I really hope you're just trolling me with this shit

The only case you can make with Aikman is 3 SB trophies. You can't make any real argument outside of that for him. Go ahead and try. The problem is you put waaaaaay too much emphasis on the SB while I don't. And, why do you put so much emphasis on the HOF? There are players who aren't in that are much better than players who are in. It shows favoritism for certain positions and puts a lot of value on SBs.

Here's some quick numbers for Aikman and Krieg
Krieg QB rating = 81.5
Aikman QB rating = 81.6
pro reference has a decent thing called approximate value
Krieg weighted career AV = 97
Aikman weighted career AV = 97
Krieg career AV = 138
Aikman career AV = 122

If Krieg played on stacked teams and won 3 SBs, then he'd be in the HOF, too. But yeah, let's pretend that Aikman didn't have an incredible OL, Smith, Irvin, a fairly good TE and FB, and a wonderful defense. He's a winner! McNabb won a lot, too, but you want to hate on him just because he couldn't get a SB ring. If McNabb played for the Cowboys, then you'd be singing a much different tune about him...

[-p.tiddy-]

are u fcking kidding me with this shit? Did you even watch the two of them play?

compare their post season numbers...:lol

Krieg is a just a 3x ProBowler...that's his resume, no HOF, no post season success, no All Pro teams, NOTHING...much less 1st ballot Hall of Fame


the team's Dave Krieg played for:

Seattle Seahawks
Kansas City Chiefs
Detroit Lions
Arizona Cardinals
Chicago Bears
Tennessee Oilers

that should tell you enough about Krieg right there

[Jackass18]

Pro bowls? They're decent, but they can also be popularity contests. Aikman went to some PBs with some pretty mediocre numbers. Also, Favre went to nearly twice as many as Aikman and yet you have Aikman ahead of him. Post season success? Aikman was better there, but he also played on stacked teams unlike Krieg. Dilfer went 5-1 in the postseason, so he's ahead of Krieg? Barry Sanders went 1-5 in the postseason, so does that mean a lot of RBs are better than him? Krieg had 0 All-Pros? So, the same amount as Aikman? Krieg has more game-winning drives, more completions, yards, nearly 100 more TDs, and a higher YPA. Krieg had Largent and Warner for about 5 seasons, but what did he have outside of that? And yes, I watched him play. I grew up on '80s football. He's kind of one of those forgotten QBs nowadays.

Does this mean Theismann is arguable since he has more All-Pros, MVPs, a good postseason record, better QB rating in the postseason, and a SB ring?

[Lakers Legend#32]

Not with his playoff record should Manning be considered the greatest.

[zoom17]

Not with his playoff record should Manning be considered the greatest.

:facepalm