Iverson is more skilled than Kobe Bryant

[Derivative]

Iverson, despite being 7 inch shorter than Kobe, averages more PPG than Kobe and more assists per game than Kobe.

Kobe might rank higher all time, but Iverson is a more skilled player than Kobe. Deal with it:pimp: :pimp:

[Joyner82reload]

Yep, nothing like a sub 50 TS% scorer taking 25+ shots per game :rolleyes:

[KobesFinger]

Iverson, despite being 7 inch shorter than Kobe, averages more PPG than Kobe and more assists per game than Kobe.

Kobe might rank higher all time, but Iverson is a more skilled player than Kobe. Deal with it:pimp: :pimp:

I'll bite. Stats =/= skill

[Derivative]

Yep, nothing like a sub 50 TS% scorer taking 25+ shots per game :rolleyes:


Lol a Kobe stan bring up TS? I thought Kobe stans are allergic to efficiency?

[moe94]

lol @ Iverson having poor TS% or efficiency compared to Kobe

Kobe: 35/5/4.5 on 45%, 56 TS%
Iverson: 33/3/7.4 on 45%, 54 TS%

Huge disparity. That's also 30 year old Iverson.

[215Philly]

:no:

[Joyner82reload]

lol @ Iverson having poor TS% or efficiency compared to Kobe

Kobe: 35/5/4.5 on 45%, 56 TS%
Iverson: 33/3/7.4 on 45%, 54 TS%

Huge disparity. That's also 30 year old Iverson.

I'm not even a Kobe stan, I never even liked Kobe. But let's just look at primes. 2001-2008 for Iverson, 2003-2011 for Kobe.

Iverson 30.1/3.9/6.3 52.2 TS%
Kobe 29.0/5.8/5.3 56.1 TS%

4 TS% is a major jump. That's the difference between chucking and slightly above average efficiency.

And LOL @ cherrypicking 1 season. Let's just look at T-Mac's 2003 season and ignore all of the other garbage efficiency seasons he had. :rolleyes:

[moe94]

I'm not even a Kobe stan, I never even liked Kobe. But let's just look at primes. 2001-2008 for Iverson, 2003-2011 for Kobe.

Iverson 30.1/3.9/6.3 52.2 TS%
Kobe 29.0/5.8/5.3 56.1 TS%

4 TS% is a major jump. That's the difference between chucking and slightly above average efficiency.

And LOL @ cherrypicking 1 season. Let's just look at T-Mac's 2003 season and ignore all of the other garbage efficiency seasons he had. :rolleyes:

Still averaged more points, apparently.:confusedshrug:

And Iverson proved he could go toe to toe with Kobe, at his best. I'm not saying Iverson is more talented or a better player, but to write off Iverson is insane.

03 T-Mac was a beast. Cool career stats to glorify Kobe because of his consistency. I get that. 03 T-Mac was still a flat out beast. You're going to have to deal with this.

[Rolando]

I am no Kobe fan. However, he definitely is one of the most skilled players to ever play the game, as skilled as Jordan, just not quite as quick, not quite as athletic, and smaller hands.....In any case, more skilled than Iverson.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

of course he was more skilled. prime iverson was one of the best to ever lace them up. he was better than prime kobe and a bit more skilled. the gap isnt huge in any way tho

[Audio One]

Few in NBA history could match AI's balance and coordination. As ball-dominant as he was, not many during his era could play off the ball as effectively as he could. Not many were as deadly from the midrange, and pulled up and shot ever defenders, all on as consistent as a basis. Find me all the players that had as quick a release as his. Only Redd and Shuttlesworth come to mind. Outside of big men, not as many were as consistent shooting off the dribble, especially in traffic. NOBODY changed direction as quick as he could, and NOBODY THAT EVER PLAYED is ******* with his crossover :no: All his floaters, scoops, leaners, floaters, double-pumps, reverse layups, he could get up on yam it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jaa1n_idHO4

Nobody had his total package of seizure-inducing speed, deadly one-on-one ability, lightning quick transition speed, ability to change speed on the drop of a dime, and tight handles. Tony Parker can only DREAM of scoring in the amount of ways Iverson can


Allen Iverson would be on a Top 4 All-NBA Team. He's one of the 12 best perimeter players. If you concede that your PG through Small Forward would be handling the ball. He's also a Top 25-30 player All-Time. I'd take Wilt or Russell first, but Iverson was quicker than anyone that played and would get easy shots for legendary players. That's why he won 2 All-Star MVPs and should have won at least 2 NBA MVPs, 01 (which he won) and 2005, where he led the league in PPG, was 5th in Assists per game, and led the NBA in steals and minutes. Here's the funny thing, it'd be funnier if Billy King was selected 1st as best GM and/or team President. Iverson had to play for that idiot for the prime of his career. I'd take Iverson #10. He'd be my shooting guard if Oscar was the point guard. And Iverson is absolutely better than John Stockton, Gary Payton, and Ason Kidd. And Kobe and Wade and Dr. J. Jerry West, Michael Jordan, Oscar Robertson, Elgin Baylor, Hondo, and LeBron James, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird were the only perimeter players who were consistently better year in and year out and overall had better careers than Iverson.

Iverson and Jordan only 2 players to score at least 50 twice in same playoff series. Jordan, Wilt and Iverson only players with at least 3 50 point playoff games. Iverson most steals in a playoff game. Iverson 4 straight seasons Top 10 scoring and assists. Jordan and Iverson only players to lead the NBA in scoring and steals at least twice in the same season. Iverson and Jordan highest usage rate in a season Jordan 88 and Iverson 2001. Shaq and Duncan were the only players who were the better than Iverson from 97-2008, other than Jordan in 97-98. Iverson was always the best player on the court unless he was playing the Lakers in the late 90's, early 2000s, or the Spurs. And even then, he outplayed Shaq and Duncan at least a few times. If you weren't from Philly and didn't see Iverson play, you missed out because he was underrated and because of his off court issues and the fact that ESPN and David Stern hated him, he received some awful bias in the media. Kenny Smith and Charles Barkley used to argue the type of assists Iverson got, saying they weren't "real" assists. The NBA has the most moronic analysts because a lot of the ex-players barely can read at a 4th grade level and the others are bitter nerds who were never good at sports anyway.

[moe94]

Downplays Hakeem and Stockton but overrates Iverson. Wonderful.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mefwch5ASG1r66m5v.gif

[Audio One]

Yep, nothing like a sub 50 TS% scorer taking 25+ shots per game :rolleyes:

:lol
And of course we have jackasses like this one that didn't watch Iverson play, nor do they understand the game. With all the handchecking shit going on, Allen never had any shooters to space the floor for him. Philly management has been atrocious dating back to the Harold Katz days. The one time Allen gets a shooter he's stupidly traded to Utah. And we already saw what he could do once he had an actual sidekick (Anthony, broken-down C-Webb).

A.I @ his peak took down two top 10 players, undefeated at their physical apexes, won an MVP over said players plus another top-15 player at his apex, and after Jordan was the most menacing and intimidating player. During the golden era of 2's, and in a league with more star parity, Iverson was always right at the top with the best of em. The best players are the players that fans would pay most to see. They were Michael Jordan, Bean, Allen Iverson and LeBron James in the past 20 years. That's all you need to know. Like I said before, had he not been blackballed from the league, we'd be talking about his career much differently at the moment

[Audio One]

During the '01 Finals/post-season:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-UZzKiQ0K-8k/UQiBy20VSmI/AAAAAAAABEo/as-Sx81ubgQ/s1600/AIFinals.jpg

I will gladly take this, over:

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs7/2436260_o.gif

[I<3NBA]

give AI prime Shaq and they'd have more than 5 rings.

[riseagainst]

you'll know who doesn't know basketball just by reading who posted in this thread.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

give AI prime Shaq and they'd have more than 5 rings.
:applause: :applause:
easily and wouldnt have run him outta damn town too:facepalm
Prime Shaq and prime Iverson:eek:
shut down the league:coleman:

[Marlo_Stanfield]

you'll know who doesn't know basketball just by reading who posted in this thread.
that would be u:applause: :applause:

[Clyde]

One still plays in the NBA the other doesn't......

[ralph_i_el]

Iverson is the most skilled player ever probably. Doesn't mean he's better than anybody. Mindset+physical attributes matter

[Jailblazers7]

I could actually see AI and Shaq getting along really well as teammates. I think there would be a some "give me the damn ball" moments but that's going to happen regardless. A tension that really hurt the Shaq/Kobe relationship was that Kobe was Mr. Workaholic and felt that Shaq wasn't 100% committed.

[andgar923]

Yep, nothing like a sub 50 TS% scorer taking 25+ shots per game :rolleyes:

Kobe is an overall better player, but don't fool yourself into thinking AI isn't comparable to Kobe offensively.

AI and Kobe took the same type of shots, were guarded by the same defenders and AI actually saw more doubles for most of his career.

The main difference?

Kobe is listed at 6'6
AI at 6'0

And most will even argue that he's not even 6'0.

Give AI Kobe's height and his TS% skyrockets.

And as others mentioned, pair up prime AI and prime Shaq and they have at least 2 rings.

[KyrieTheFuture]

During the '01 Finals/post-season:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-UZzKiQ0K-8k/UQiBy20VSmI/AAAAAAAABEo/as-Sx81ubgQ/s1600/AIFinals.jpg



:eek: :eek: :eek:

[KyrieTheFuture]

One still plays in the NBA the other doesn't......
So Juwan Howard is one of the best players of all time?

[Milbuck]

No, he's not.

[andgar923]

:eek: :eek: :eek:

He was a little guy that attacked the rim. Even when he didn't attack the rim he always ended up on the floor. I can't even begin to imagine how much energy he must've used up.

One thing people don't realize is how strong NBA players are.

Having to go through screens alone will take a toll on one's body. Imagine getting bumped at his size almost every play will leave some wear and tear.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

I could actually see AI and Shaq getting along really well as teammates. I think there would be a some "give me the damn ball" moments but that's going to happen regardless. A tension that really hurt the Shaq/Kobe relationship was that Kobe was Mr. Workaholic and felt that Shaq wasn't 100% committed.
is that why he actively shot them out of a finals series in 04 when Shaq was averageing 27 on 63% while kobe shot 38 %??
Dat work ethic:bowdown:

[Clyde]

So Juwan Howard is one of the best players of all time?

He'd still probably start for the cavs.

[houston]

yea he had more talent than Kobe.

[avonbarksdale]

:P

[tpols]

Lebron averages more points and assists but 2013 Kobe's more skilled than he ever was.

[scm5]

Lettuce see Iverson's post game.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Lebron averages more points and assists but 2013 Kobe's more skilled than he ever was.
retard alert:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Mr. Jabbar]

If he's more skilled than Kobe I cannot possibly describe how much more skilled he is compared with bran


bran.

[TheMarkMadsen]

I love AI but if he was more skilled than Kobe Bryant (one of the more skilled players..ever) then he'd still be in the league, once he hit 32 he was basically done, AI relied so much on his speed and once he lost that it was basically over.

Kobe's skill has allowed him to adapt his play and be an alll NBA 1st team player while Iverson was already out of the league..and they came out in the same year..

[ImKobe]

Iverson, you mean the same guy that shot below 40% TWICE for an entire season? The same Iverson that Kobe owned in the Finals?

[knicksman]

well its the same for lebron having more skills yet kobe has the skills that matters for winning thats why he has 5 rings and doesnt disappear against diaw

[longtime lurker]

Hahahahaa no Iverson isn't more skilled than Kobe. Iverson had insane gifts such as his quickness, athleticism and large hands for a guy that was closer to 5'10. One of the greatest scorers of his generation and pound for pound one of the toughest players but no he's not close to being as skilled as Kobe.

[215Philly]

Iverson, you mean the same guy that shot below 40% TWICE for an entire season? The same Iverson that Kobe owned in the Finals?
:biggums: :hammerhead: :banghead:

[Doranku]

Kobe is an overall better player, but don't fool yourself into thinking AI isn't comparable to Kobe offensively.

AI and Kobe took the same type of shots, were guarded by the same defenders and AI actually saw more doubles for most of his career.

The main difference?

Kobe is listed at 6'6
AI at 6'0

And most will even argue that he's not even 6'0.

Give AI Kobe's height and his TS% skyrockets.

And as others mentioned, pair up prime AI and prime Shaq and they have at least 2 rings.

This is the dumbest thing I've read in a long time. But then again, what is to be expected from a dude who believes 50 year old Jordan could drop 50 in an NBA game? :oldlol:

[HoopsFanNumero1]

Iverson, you mean the same guy that shot below 40% TWICE for an entire season? The same Iverson that Kobe owned in the Finals?

:biggums:

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/VS/z%20Crazy%20Stat%20n%20Record/Allen%20Iverson/-EC95A4EC8DA8EB8C80_ECBD94EBB984_EC.jpg

[TheMarkMadsen]

:biggums:

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/VS/z%20Crazy%20Stat%20n%20Record/Allen%20Iverson/-EC95A4EC8DA8EB8C80_ECBD94EBB984_EC.jpg

Kobe had a weak game 1 and followed it up by averaging 27/9 the rest of the 4 games

[HoopsFanNumero1]

Kobe had a weak game 1 and followed it up by averaging 27/9 the rest of the 4 games

Well one was being double teamed and the other was, well...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-aKO5AO0NRiY/TegFLm7wXjI/AAAAAAAABFs/FFdk69buoFE/s1600/kobe-bryant-and-shaquille-oneal.jpg

Trolling aside, Iverson certainly didn't get "owned" by Kobe, wouldn't you agree?

[Levity]

:biggums:

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/VS/z%20Crazy%20Stat%20n%20Record/Allen%20Iverson/-EC95A4EC8DA8EB8C80_ECBD94EBB984_EC.jpg

lakers were also off for over a week while the sixers were still finishing up the ECF. yes, time off can help them get rested, but that much time off can also be detrimental to teams in the sense they need to find that rhythm and fire again

[hateraid]

Skill is not a direct correlation with efficiency or shooting percentage. Otherwise wouldn't Nash be more efficient than both of these players?

I have no problem saying AI is more skilled than Kobe

[HoopsFanNumero1]

lakers were also off for over a week while the sixers were still finishing up the ECF. yes, time off can help them get rested, but that much time off can also be detrimental to teams in the sense they need to find that rhythm and fire again

I've seen people use that excuse both ways.

[G-Funk]

If he's more skilled than Kobe I cannot possibly describe how much more skilled he is compared with bran


bran.
/thread

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

lakers were also off for over a week while the sixers were still finishing up the ECF. yes, time off can help them get rested, but that much time off can also be detrimental to teams in the sense they need to find that rhythm and fire again

Here are Shaq's highlights (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKICLZfKMG0) from that 'layoff' ...

[Y2ktors]

I love AI but if he was more skilled than Kobe Bryant (one of the more skilled players..ever) then he'd still be in the league, once he hit 32 he was basically done, AI relied so much on his speed and once he lost that it was basically over.

Kobe's skill has allowed him to adapt his play and be an alll NBA 1st team player while Iverson was already out of the league..and they came out in the same year..

:applause:

[Brad Lesnar]

Iverson doesn't even have a post game:facepalm

[HylianNightmare]

i freakin love AI but it's not even close, kobe is one of the most skilled wing players of all time, the footwork, post game, mid range game, ability to creat for himself with east... dude is just on another level

[bizil]

I don't know if AI is more skilled, but he's on that level or damn close. Let's face it, the main difference between the two is size. If AI, Isiah, Paul, or Tiny was 6'6 like Kobe, they would be just as good as Kobe or very close. A guy like Kobe can guard little guards very good for a guy 6'6. But those small guards don't really have as good of a chance to guard Kobe. It's hard for guards AI's size to be as devastating across the board as a MJ or Kobe strictly due to size and versatility. But don't get it twisted, I would take AI over most SG's PERIOD except for MJ, Kobe, Drexler, Wade, T-Mac, or West. And AI as we know will get his on anybody. He qualifies as a guy who can't stop but just hope to contain. Be it small guards guarding him or bigger wing players. U can count on one hand how many guards around his size can dominate a game like him.

Even though AI played SG and was epic at it, it's hard to compare him Kobe, TMac, Drexler, and Wade due to size. He can score, pass, and dominnate on their level, but it's the versatility and size that's the difference. It's almost like comparing Ali to Floyd in a sense. Skill level is even but a big gap in size is the main difference.

[HylianNightmare]

ai better at doing this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyHWyRka8to

[bizil]

Lebron averages more points and assists but 2013 Kobe's more skilled than he ever was.

In terms of scoring skillset, Kobe is more skilled than Lebron. Just like KD and Melo are. Bron can score just as good in terms of numbers and efficiency. But with guys on that level, the skillset can be the tiebreaker at times. Plus Kobe was as epic an all around player u could be as a 6'6 perimeter player on both sides of the rock. It's just that Bron is arguably the most versatile player in NBA history to go with his great scoring and passing.

[SpecialQue]

Goran gets banned and this ph@gg0t starts posting again. Surprised?

[andgar923]

This is the dumbest thing I've read in a long time. But then again, what is to be expected from a dude who believes 50 year old Jordan could drop 50 in an NBA game? :oldlol:

So do you think that if Kobe wasn't guarded by 7 footers for 90% of the time his fg% wouldn't drop?

AI was barely 6'0 with shoes on, being guarded by players 6'4-6'7 about 90% of the time. And thats just on jumpers, not including his drives to the bucket in traffic.

[tpols]

So do you think that if Kobe wasn't guarded by 7 footers for 90% of the time his fg% wouldn't drop?

AI was barely 6'0 with shoes on, being guarded by players 6'4-6'7 about 90% of the time. And thats just on jumpers, not including his drives to the bucket in traffic.
Kobe would run around 7 footers at the 3 pt line like they were nothing and lose them with off ball cuts just like iverson did to his taller and slower defenders.

Iverson didnt shoot low cuz he was short he shot low because he was a super chucker and always wanted to do things his way

[Tking714]

He was craftier, a better ball handler, and more athletic than Kobe idk about more skilled. Im an iverson fan.

Athleticism and ballhandling are king in this sport. This is the sole reason why Rose is so good.

[TheMarkMadsen]

So do you think that if Kobe wasn't guarded by 7 footers for 90% of the time his fg% wouldn't drop?

AI was barely 6'0 with shoes on, being guarded by players 6'4-6'7 about 90% of the time. And thats just on jumpers, not including his drives to the bucket in traffic.


Kobe would run around 7 footers if they tried to guard him on the perimeter..

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/signaturepics/sigpic219591_28.gif.pagespeed.ce.T8-R0uwbSR.gif

[Audio One]

I love AI but if he was more skilled than Kobe Bryant (one of the more skilled players..ever) then he'd still be in the league, once he hit 32 he was basically done, AI relied so much on his speed and once he lost that it was basically over.Kobe's skill has allowed him to adapt his play and be an alll NBA 1st team player while Iverson was already out of the league..and they came out in the same year..

:no:

Allen Iverson had just come off a season in which he averaged 26.4 PPG (3rd in the league), 7.1 apg, 2.0 spg and shot a career high 46% while sharing the rock with 'Melo. Iverson was 33 was not showing a single sign of slowing down, he swore his body could play till the age of 40, he still possessed a killer first step, jump shot was wetter than ever, he was playing smarter and more efficiently than ever!!

He get to Detroit, and sacrified his time and numbers like was asked of him. As soon as his numbers natrually take a dip because of this, he gets disrespected by being called "washed up" and being put behind Rodney Stuckey?? :biggums:

This carries over to Memphis, where he's benched behind Mike Conley after being told he was gonna start :no:

http://www.balldontstop.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ai-billups.jpg

He was LONG gone by this time, was this really necessary?? :biggums:

[Doranku]

So do you think that if Kobe wasn't guarded by 7 footers for 90% of the time his fg% wouldn't drop?

AI was barely 6'0 with shoes on, being guarded by players 6'4-6'7 about 90% of the time. And thats just on jumpers, not including his drives to the bucket in traffic.

Iverson was so good primarily because of his quickness and speed. There's no way he would be able to maintain that quickness and speed if he was 6'6". He would have to adapt his game, there's no definitive way you can say his TS% would skyrocket if you just tacked on 6+ inches to the dude's height.

[bizil]

Iverson was so good primarily because of his quickness and speed. There's no way he would be able to maintain that quickness and speed if he was 6'6". He would have to adapt his game, there's no definitive way you can say his TS% would skyrocket if you just tacked on 6+ inches to the dude's height.

But whose to say AI wouldn't have been quick and fast like MJ at 6'6? Plus AI would have posted up more too. U gotta look at it on both sides. MJ blew past pretty much anybody who guarded regardless of height. I could EASILY see AI doing the same at 6'6!

[TheMarkMadsen]

:no:

Allen Iverson had just come off a season in which he averaged 26.4 PPG (3rd in the league), 7.1 apg, 2.0 spg and shot a career high 46% while sharing the rock with 'Melo. Iverson was 33 was not showing a single sign of slowing down, he swore his body could play till the age of 40, he still possessed a killer first step, jump shot was wetter than ever, he was playing smarter and more efficiently than ever!!

He get to Detroit, and sacrified his time and numbers like was asked of him. As soon as his numbers natrually take a dip because of this, he gets disrespected by being called "washed up" and being put behind Rodney Stuckey?? :biggums:

This carries over to Memphis, where he's benched behind Mike Conley after being told he was gonna start :no:

http://www.balldontstop.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ai-billups.jpg

He was LONG gone by this time, was this really necessary?? :biggums:

what are you talking about.

[Audio One]

what are you talking about.

He was long gone from Denver, he had nothing to do with Denver whatsoever; this graphic was COMPLETELY UNECCESSARY. The league HATED Allen, and leadership in Detroit and Memphis already had their pre-conceived notions about him. Once they didn't get their way with him, they exploited his reputation, and tarnished his credibility, the league now labeling him "done" and selfish, a cancer, when it couldn't have been further from the truth

[JebronLames]

Don't like kobe, but he's much better than iverson.

[TheMarkMadsen]

He was long gone from Denver, he had nothing to do with Denver whatsoever; this graphic was COMPLETELY UNECCESSARY. The league HATED Allen, and leadership in Detroit and Memphis already had their pre-conceived notions about him. Once they didn't get their way with him, they exploited his reputation, and tarnished his credibility, the league now labeling him "done" and selfish, a cancer, when it couldn't have been further from the truth

oh yeah i agree, i thought you meant something else. I agree, the league didn't like him and he was rushed out unfairly..

however when he went back to Philly sadly you could tell he was done, and even tho he still had some good basketball left in the tank a year or two prior, he wasn't what he once was in terms of speed and quickness, and it became obvious how much he had relied on that in the past.

I love AI

[Audio One]

oh yeah i agree, i thought you meant something else. I agree, the league didn't like him and he was rushed out unfairly..

however when he went back to Philly sadly you could tell he was done, and even tho he still had some good basketball left in the tank a year or two prior, he wasn't what he once was in terms of speed and quickness, and it became obvious how much he had relied on that in the past.

I love AI

Yep, by the time he got back home, it was true. He took a month off after the Memphis fiasco, and gained weight to cushion his weary bones, as his injuries were finally catching up to him. His knee was deteriorating, and he was out-of-shape. Then of course his daugher becomes ill, and he rightfully prioritized his family, especially right considering none of his children were ever that sick. And during a time when he was playing under the horrible Princeton offense by Eddie Jordan, one of his last credible defenders in Stephen A Smith throws him under the bus, having come to the realization of the crappy hand he was dealt, it made the decision all the more easier.

Iverson is also absolutely better than the likes of Dirk Nowitzki and Scottie Pippen. Nobody would even be questioning this had circumstances been different for AI