NBA Doesn't Test for HGH

[eliteballer]

"I've been in the NBA for 22 years. I talk to players all the time. I talk to retired players. And I don't hear about it," Silver said. "I don't want to be naive. I mean, we don't have HGH testing in our league. It's something that we agreed we would do with the union, and we're waiting to agree what the appropriate procedures are."

Silver also said players have pushed for stricter testing for recreational drugs.

"A player would say, 'I'm not going to say this publicly, but the last thing I want to do is be a part of a team where I have teammates who are consuming whatever drugs and therefore aren't in an optimal position to contribute to our team,'" Silver said.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/10538140/adam-silver-open-changing-format-nba-playoffs-draft

So how are we supposed to believe players don't use it?

[Kblaze8855]

Who does believe players don't use it?

The question is....do you care?

I do in a way....but not all that much. It bugs me because of the edge it gives them on former players who had to do it closer to the right way(people were on things even in the 70s). But im not losing sleep.

I bet 20% of the NFL is or was on something.

[Akrazotile]

It aint gonna make your shot go in.

It aint gonna make your arms longer to grab rebounds.

Not sayin it might not make marginal difference in some ways or that guys arent using it. I just dont think it makes the kind of difference in bball that does in other sports.

Then again, nba players have been popped for steroids in recent years. No reason to think HGH isnt happening as well. I just dont see what the major benefits are really. But honestly I dont know a ton about HGH to begin with.

[tomSR.]

Do they test in MLB, NHL, NFL ?

[fpliii]

As long as it's being used for recovery from injuries (preferably in the offseason), I couldn't care less.

If and when it can be proven that HGH has legitimate long-term health risks, I'll support testing/banning.

[SpanishACB]

If and when it can be proven that HGH has legitimate long-term health risks, I'll support testing/banning.

so why do you think it's banned in the rest of the world? they naive or something?

USA's sports franchise model goes as far as to put money before things like this.

You know how many viewers Miami loses when Lebron can't play?

It's player fans, not team fans, you can't just ban a franchise player for using PEDs, it directly affects the ratings.

[fpliii]

so why do you think it's banned in the rest of the world? they naive or something?

USA's sports franchise model goes as far as to put money before things like this.

You know how many viewers Miami loses when Lebron can't play?

It's player fans, not team fans, you can't just ban a franchise player for using PEDs, it directly affects the ratings.
They're obviously erring on the side of caution. If something isn't definitely safe, why would it be approved?

Also, from my understanding HGH and its derivatives aren't very closely regulated, so there could be a contamination/impurity factor.

[CelticBaller]

Not surprising, just look at the heat

[MavsSuperFan]

As long as it's being used for recovery from injuries (preferably in the offseason), I couldn't care less.

If and when it can be proven that HGH has legitimate long-term health risks, I'll support testing/banning.
You don't thinking being huge and muscular helps get rebounds, driving to the basket and low post play?

Also HGH helps May make you more explosive, increasing your speed and jumping ability.

I think that's why it helps in track and field events like sprinting and high jump. Luckily the Olympics have the best testing.

[fpliii]

You don't thinking being huge and muscular helps get rebounds, driving to the basket and low post play?

Also HGH helps May make you more explosive, increasing your speed and jumping ability.

I think that's why it helps in track and field events like sprinting and high jump. Luckily the Olympics have the best testing.
Oh I agree that it does, and if the use is strengthening or recovery after working out, then I'm opposed.

If it was used ONLY for recovery from severe injuries, I'd definitely be behind it. Use would have to be approved by Silver or maybe some league-appointed arbitrator/doctor I think.

What I'm saying is, if it's gonna help a guy like DRose get back on the floor, and it can be shown that there aren't any severe health risks (this has yet to be seen), then why not let him use it? :confusedshrug:

Shit like the platelet rich therapy is pretty borderline, HGH isn't too far off depending on how it's used.

[SpanishACB]

They're obviously erring on the side of caution. If something isn't definitely safe, why would it be approved?



If you have no idea on the subject why go ahead and just make a wild assumption as if you knew what you were talking about?

Those are all considered PEDs for various reasons, in the rest of the world they abide to international organisms which employ doctors and scientists to provide a fair even ground (FIBA, FIFA, etc), they take into consideration medical facts when considering something a PED or a legit substance.

No such a thing in the independent body of the NBA, which, like I said, puts money first in favour of PEDS, frowned upon the rest of the international sports community. In the Olympics however, they conscientiously allowed team USA to not take these tests because they are also too seduced by the color of green (they rather USA performed, just for the viewers they attract)

The worst part of all is players being vocal about not wanting them, people like Paul and such, it's a real shame.

At the end of the day, USA public is much into the whole superhero crap, they pay to see inhuman athleticism, see they're favourite player etc... If they'll go as far as to change the rules of the sport to allow for better hero ball, why wouldn't they allow any kind of PED to allow their players to perform like real super heroes? Stans will grow in masses, just look how many casuls Miami has brought.

[Dresta]

What player is the snitchin asshole who's like 'i don't want a guy on ma team who takes drugs' - if it is done in their own time then what does it have to do with you? Asshole.

Said player shifting the focus cause he be abusing HGH.

[fpliii]

If you have no idea on the subject why go ahead and just make a wild assumption as if you knew what you were talking about?

Those are all considered PEDs for various reasons, in the rest of the world they abide to international organisms which employ doctors and scientists to provide a fair even ground (FIBA, FIFA, etc), they take into consideration medical facts when considering something a PED or a legit substance.

No such a thing in the independent body of the NBA, which, like I said, puts money first in favour of PEDS, frowned upon the rest of the international sports community. In the Olympics however, they conscientiously allowed team USA to not take these tests because they are also too seduced by the color of green (they rather USA performed, just for the viewers they attract)

The worst part of all is players being vocal about not wanting them, people like Paul and such, it's a real shame.

At the end of the day, USA public is much into the whole superhero crap, they pay to see inhuman athleticism, see they're favourite player etc... If they'll go as far as to change the rules of the sport to allow for better hero ball, why wouldn't they allow any kind of PED to allow their players to perform like real super heroes? Stans will grow in masses, just look how many casuls Miami has brought.
I'm not suggesting that there are no other benefits. I'm speaking purely of HGH as a tool for recovery. :confusedshrug:

I ask you, with an independent doctor/arbitrator/party evaluating players on a case-by-case basis, would be opposed to its use?

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Not surprising, just look at the heat
says a Patriots stan:roll: :roll: :facepalm

[Foster5k]

Let's just say, there are a lot of things going on behind the scenes that people do not know or want to know. The NBA is a business. As such, it will do anything, legally possible, to sustain, grow, etc.

I'm sure there a tons of NBA players using HGH, that and many other PEDs, to have and keep an edge over the competition. HGH would give players a great advantage. Do not be fooled. HGH enhances recovery times tremendously, resulting in enhanced performance, which otherwise would be a sub-par performance, since said player had to recovery without the aid of HGH.

However, there seems to be certain extraordinary individuals, in the NBA, that are extremely durable, play heavy minutes every night, elite offensively, elite defensively, incredible stamina, incredible speed, remarkable leaping ability, etc. These extraordinary individuals, like Lebron James, apparently do all this without the aid of any performance enhancers. These guys just have superior genetics in some form or fashion.

[salwan]

steve nash needs to take some :(

[Nuff Said]

What player is the snitchin asshole who's like 'i don't want a guy on ma team who takes drugs' - if it is done in their own time then what does it have to do with you? Asshole.

Said player shifting the focus cause he be abusing HGH.
You know how them white boys are

[KyrieTheFuture]

You know how them white boys are
Mike Miller is the druge dealer for the whole league. Birdman was a damn heroin addict. White people like drugs too.

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

It aint gonna make your shot go in.

It aint gonna make your arms longer to grab rebounds.

Not sayin it might not make marginal difference in some ways or that guys arent using it. I just dont think it makes the kind of difference in bball that does in other sports.

Then again, nba players have been popped for steroids in recent years. No reason to think HGH isnt happening as well. I just dont see what the major benefits are really. But honestly I dont know a ton about HGH to begin with.

This is a totally ridiculous thing to say. No Sh!t it doesn't make the basketball go in but it lets you train harder and recover faster.

It makes you more explosive, so when guys are tired and the ball is in the air you'll be able to jump and get those 50/50 balls because you have that extra edge.


The intelligence in this forum scares me.

[MavsSuperFan]

This is a totally ridiculous thing to say. No Sh!t it doesn't make the basketball go in but it lets you train harder and recover faster.

It makes you more explosive, so when guys are tired and the ball is in the air you'll be able to jump and get those 50/50 balls because you have that extra edge.


The intelligence in this forum scares me.
Also being stronger and able to jump higher would clearly help you get more rebounds.

It would also improve your FG percentage, as it would allow you to play better in the post.

The only thing it wouldnt help is long range shooting.

Might help on fast breaks too as it makes sprinters faster.

[TMT]

No doubt there's a good amount of players in the league on HGH, and some notable ones at that. But most likely the big names that would be on this list would mean negative cash flow for the league, not to mention bad publicity, if there were to be big suspensions as a result. Then there would be lost interest because of some of these big names which would also turn into some lost competitiveness within the league.

I'm all for clean competition, but I can understand why the league from a business perspective wouldn't want to test. I can see there being a pretty big scandal down the line in say 10-15 years though.

[FKAri]

Dwyane Wade is most definitely not on HGH. He just like storing nuts in his mouth.

[Dresta]

Also being stronger and able to jump higher would clearly help you get more rebounds.

It would also improve your FG percentage, as it would allow you to play better in the post.

The only thing it wouldnt help is long range shooting.

Might help on fast breaks too as it makes sprinters faster.
Strangely though, that is the one thing that is clearly better now than it has ever been. The average shooting ability in the league today seems far higher today than say 10-15 years ago even.

Makes me think if players are using now then they have been using for the past 30 years at least.

[inclinerator]

no wonder they kicked d fisher out as president

[kennethgriffin]

i said it before and i'l say it again

10-15 years from now people will look back at kobe as the ken griffey of the his era.. and lebron will be looked at as barry bonds

one might have allot more stats. but only one of them will be respected and inducted into the hall of fame when its all said and done

hgh is a huge problem and has turned guys like lebron into super human beasts.. a center/pf body thats faster than a point guard, jumps higher than a shooting guard and never gets hurt in 11 years while playing 40+ minutes a night

[ZoPunde]

Why is everybody insisting that players are using HGH without posting any reasons, evidence, arguements, or links?

:coleman:

[gts]

Also being stronger and able to jump higher would clearly help you get more rebounds.

It would also improve your FG percentage, as it would allow you to play better in the post.

The only thing it wouldnt help is long range shooting.

Might help on fast breaks too as it makes sprinters faster.
Actually it would help there, stronger legs over a long season would be a benefit for perimeter shooters, second night of back to backs when your legs normally take a hit

perimeter shooters would definitely benefit...

[ZoPunde]

hgh is a huge problem and has turned guys like lebron into super human beasts.. a center/pf body thats faster than a point guard, jumps higher than a shooting guard and never gets hurt in 11 years while playing 40+ minutes a night

You don't know that, you have absolutely NO evidence that LeBron used HGH or PEDs. It's all accusations and assumptions.

[MavsSuperFan]

You don't know that, you have absolutely NO evidence that LeBron used HGH or PEDs. It's all accusations and assumptions.
agreed, buts its one of the reasons the nba should adopt more rigorous olympic style testing. It would confirm the greatness of the current nba.

[jimmy77x]

You don't know that, you have absolutely NO evidence that LeBron used HGH or PEDs. It's all accusations and assumptions.

Mysterious Mouth Tumor removed. There wont be evidence of him being the HGH abuser he is until he retires, league makes too much money off of him now.

[dunksby]

You don't know that, you have absolutely NO evidence that LeBron used HGH or PEDs. It's all accusations and assumptions.
How the hell one could have evidence if the league doesn't test for it (I'm not singling out LBJ or any other player for that matter).

[kennethgriffin]

You don't know that, you have absolutely NO evidence that LeBron used HGH or PEDs. It's all accusations and assumptions.

if it smells like a turd. looks like a turd. and tastes like a turd.

chances are. you just ate a ****ing turd

i dont need scientific evidence to back up my conclusion on turd eating

the nba viewers have been eating turds for 11 years now...


and everyones full of shit now

[Eric Cartman]

Look at the competitive advantage big muscular guys like Yao Ming, Larry Bird, Kevin Durant, Allen Iverson and Reggie Miller got from all those performance enhancing jobs. Because everyone knows that in basketball you have to be big and strong to be any good.

[ILLsmak]

Actually it would help there, stronger legs over a long season would be a benefit for perimeter shooters, second night of back to backs when your legs normally take a hit

perimeter shooters would definitely benefit...

yea... wtf, why wouldn't it help? I think the truth is that they have some crazy smart people working on these drugs and while there is a long-term downside... and maybe some other possibilities, that they are probably as 'good' now as they've ever been in terms of producing the desired result.

Sucks that we're just gonna have to live with it. I do think that certain players have bodies that can benefit more from PEDS. I don't think shit is some magic potion. I think you need to have an amazing body to start with and they just push you over the edge to godlevel.

That's at least... my completely unfounded theory.

-Smak

[chocolatethunder]

Who does believe players don't use it?

The question is....do you care?

I do in a way....but not all that much. It bugs me because of the edge it gives them on former players who had to do it closer to the right way(people were on things even in the 70s). But im not losing sleep.

I bet 20% of the NFL is or was on something.
I would say more than 20% of basketball, baseball and football are using PEDs. Why not? If they can't test for it of course there are gonna be people who use it. I don't really care that much either. People are always looking for an edge. If it wasn't PEDs it would be something else.

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

Also the NBA doesn't test for Marijuana I heard...only like during offseason once or twice.

[eliteballer]

Yesalis trusts his eyes. Are NBA players as muscular as their NFL counterparts? No. But they're bigger, faster and stronger than their predecessors. More defined, too. "Just get a bunch of pictures of pro basketball players in the 1960s and 1970s," he says. "Look at how they've changed." In the early 1980s, Yesalis was a college strength coach. He remembers women's basketball players at major conference programs lifting weights. "Basketball players have been lifting for more than 30 years," he says. "The notion that they're bigger and stronger just because they started lifting weights is a bunch of crap. That can't explain it. You can't use that as an excuse."


"That makes no sense," says former Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative (BALCO) mastermind Victor Conte. "Look at the biceps of Tour de France riders. They're 9-10 inches [in circumference]. We know they use anabolic steroids, specifically testosterone. For the most part, these drugs -- meaning the whole category of anabolic steroids -- are recovery drugs. They are very powerful. Would they be a benefit to an NBA player? Absolutely."

Charles Yesalis, a Penn State emeritus professor and sports doping expert, concurs.

"Distance runners have been using anabolics and growth hormones in very small doses for years," he says. "Not to build muscle. But to help recuperate. The myth of [PEDs] making you muscle-bound is so over."

I believe NBA players are using steroids. Human growth hormone. Stimulants like Adderall. The blood-boosting drug erythropoietin (EPO). Anything and everything to get an edge. I believe players are doping in the summer and doping in season and doping during All-Star Weekend, stacking and micro-dosing, injecting and rubbing in cream.


"The sport of basketball emphasizes a specialized set of physical abilities -- particularly quickness, agility and basketball skill -- that are distinct from those required in a number of other sports. Accordingly, illicit substances that could assist athletes in strength sports [such as weightlifting and football], power sports [such as baseball], or endurance sports [such as cycling or marathon running], are not likely to be of benefit to NBA players."

Ahem. Conte tells a story. Back when he was helping athletes dope, he gave EPO to one of his female sprinters. (Conte declines to provide her name, but it's easy to infer he's talking about retired sprinter Kelli White.) White won two gold medals at the 2003 world championships. When she subsequently confessed to PED use during the height of the BALCO scandal, anti-doping scientists such as Don Catlin found one part of her drug cocktail baffling: why was a sprinter taking EPO, a drug that boosts endurance by increasing the blood's oxygen-carrying capacity?

"What they failed to ask was this: how long do you think these athletes train each day?" Conte says. "Hours and hours. And in the offseason, training for months and months, do you think that a deeper training load wouldn't help you? These are training drugs!"

When Conte first began studying the physiology of athletic performance, he says, he was particularly intrigued by Defense Department research on Navy SEALs, whose bodies and minds are subjected to extreme levels of strain and stress during intense training exercises. "They go through hand-to-hand combat, verbal abuse, sleep deprivation, underwater demolition," he says. "It depletes the body of nutrients and builds up metabolic waste products. I saw parallels with elite athletes."

Growth hormone, Conte says, could help NBA players maintain muscle mass over the course of a long, punishing season. Anabolic steroids accelerate muscle tissue repair and healing, which could help with recovery from both hard training and hard-luck injury. EPO boosts endurance not only by bringing more oxygen to muscles, but also by speeding up removal of metabolic waste, delaying the onset of fatigue.

"I have heard a lot of athletes in the NFL and track and field describe the effect of EPO with one word," he says. "It makes you like a machine. You just don't get tired. In basketball, you might not see the effect as much in the first and second quarter, but by the fourth quarter there's a huge edge. One guy has a body full of toxins that have built up. The other guy has a body that has accelerated the removal of those toxins. He's the one who will be able to make that quick move and get past his defender."

[QUOTE]If NBA players have ample incentives to use PEDs -- millions of guaranteed dollars at stake; the not-insubstantial fact that the drugs work -- they also have few disincentives. After all, federal lawmakers labeled the league's drug testing policy "inadequate," "pathetic" and "a joke" in 2005, and again blasted the NBA three years later. Last October, World Anti-Doping Agency director general David Howman said the league had "gaps" in its program -- gaps that ESPN.com's Henry Abbott identified as:

[AirFederer]

All American sports are drug infested, from HS level, college and pro level.
It has been like that for, like forty years.

The testing in pro sports is a joke.

People saying Peds doesn't help i bball should get their head examined.

They're all on it.

[JtotheIzzo]

It aint gonna make your shot go in.

It aint gonna make your arms longer to grab rebounds.

Not sayin it might not make marginal difference in some ways or that guys arent using it. I just dont think it makes the kind of difference in bball that does in other sports.

Then again, nba players have been popped for steroids in recent years. No reason to think HGH isnt happening as well. I just dont see what the major benefits are really. But honestly I dont know a ton about HGH to begin with.


Your last sentence is the truest.

Here is why it is a problem.

The NBA is a grind and teams that are well balanced and play the right way have a better shot to win (in a perfect world).

When you add HGH into the mix players are playing with the energy of someone who hasn't been through the battles, it is cheating, especially come playoff time.

Back in the 80s guys used to drop weight as the season went on, by the finals they looked like freakin Ethiopians, but nowadays, guys are straight swoll all the way through the finals and use the off season to drop weight.

This is counter-intuitive, but the NBA is wise to shut up about its drug use, look what cocaine did to the league.

Once the racist elements of the public look at the NBA like (and excuse my French) "a bunch of N*ggers on steroids" the league will take a huge hit.

Clean it up in house. But they gotta do it quick.

[deja vu]

The NBA would lose a shit ton of money and reputation when its stars are discovered to have used PEDs.

[BoutPractice]

If:
- there is no clear link between PED use and an unfair increase in performance (if in other words, some skinny ukrainian can still easily drop 50 on a half-android athlete in a basketball game... which I believe to be the case)
- there is no unfair barrier that prevents certain players from using PEDs
- players that use them have made the choice to do so as rational adults
- fans still enjoy the game as it is actually being played in front of them right now (they happily watch even as they suspect, in the back of their heads, that PED use is widespread)

I only see one problem with it: the lie. What they might be covering up isn't particularly scandalous once you think about it... it's the covering up that would be problematic (we hate lies and everything resembling them). Of course, the rationale is that if there was a truth to be learned, and the fans found out about it, the NBA's reputation would suffer and fans would no longer care as much as they do now... even though, in that scenario, the game would be exactly the same game they enjoy so much at this very moment (as always, we're first and foremost a bunch of hypocrites who love complaining about people giving us exactly what we want.) Their perspective on it is the only thing that would have changed...

[Vienceslav]

People and willfully gullible on this issue, they like to believe that these guys they are watching are athletic freaks(they are, but not to the extent you see without the use of drugs)that have been put on earth to entertain them and showcase what is possible.
People will go to such lengths to argue this that they will even come up with the slave breeding to create a superior specimens argument.
Anyone who has been working out for some time will know that gaining muscle becomes gradually a slow process, you can still achieve great results, but it's just a different league for people who hop on PEDs right away.
When on drugs you can lift your max twice a day, while naturally you will be lucky to do that every 3 days.
Just look at the difference between the 'natural' bodybuilders(who are all still on drugs, but have a different goal) and the real bodybuilders.
I'd say PED abuse is even bigger in the NFL, where almost everyone(at a skills position at least) has more muscle then their body could sustain if they relied only on their natural testosterone production.
All in all, I don't really care that people are on drugs, I watch the games to be entertained, it's just that when people argue the athletes are clean it really bugs me.
The recent case of Lance Armstrong being stripped of his Tour de France titles really helps to illustrate my point, if people who claim to be outraged by him taking drugs ever cared about cycling a bit, they would know that to even finish the whole tour you can't rely on your body alone for recovery.

[Oly BC]

The only thing it wouldnt help is long range shooting.

Archers in the olympics have been found taking ped. I'm sure there is some drug that increases concentration and muscle control or whatever is needed for long range shots.

[iznogood]

If:
- there is no clear link between PED use and an unfair increase in performance (if in other words, some skinny ukrainian can still easily drop 50 on a half-android athlete in a basketball game... which I believe to be the case)
- there is no unfair barrier that prevents certain players from using PEDs
- players that use them have made the choice to do so as rational adults
- fans still enjoy the game as it is actually being played in front of them right now (they happily watch even as they suspect, in the back of their heads, that PED use is widespread)

I only see one problem with it: the lie. What they might be covering up isn't particularly scandalous once you think about it... it's the covering up that would be problematic (we hate lies and everything resembling them). Of course, the rationale is that if there was a truth to be learned, and the fans found out about it, the NBA's reputation would suffer and fans would no longer care as much as they do now... even though, in that scenario, the game would be exactly the same game they enjoy so much at this very moment (as always, we're first and foremost a bunch of hypocrites who love complaining about people giving us exactly what we want.) Their perspective on it is the only thing that would have changed...
I like your point, but I'm not sure how do I feel about the ifs. Are you suggesting PEDs might not present an unfair increase in performance? I don't think the example you offer is good. If "some skinny ukrainian can still easily drop 50 on a half-android athlete in a basketball game" that doesn't demonstrate PEDs don't present an increase in performance. You just chose an example that works in your favour. How about the athletes that perform at higher level longer because the use of the PEDs? I feel like this shouldn't even be debatable, if PEDs weren't so efficient at what they do, athletes wouldn't use them.

My only concern about using PEDs is safety. I don't have a moral problem with the usage of PEDs if everybody has the same chance to use them, but we know most PEDs will affect your health when used in dosages that are too big and we also know athletes will take way over what would be considered safe just to get the edge over their competition. Also there's no sure way to say what the appropriate and not harmful dosage of steroids would be as long as steroids are illegal and scientific researches using steroids are as well.

[AirFederer]

Hgh at a young age will make you taller, and that includes your arms...

Look at players still growing at 18,19,20. And growing from 6'3 to 6'10 or more suddenly late in the teens, while donning a unibrow and teeth all over the place- you do the math.

At 6'3 he doesn't sniff at NBA, at 6'10 he's a future mvp...

[SpanishACB]

the best part is the little adult kids (the players) think that by coming out publically against weed and such (that does nothing) they're going to be able to drag this no HGH testing policy even further.

They're probably right too, it's sad.

To the people trying to theorize about there being no actual playing benefits, poor souls, you shouldn't be playing devil's advocate when you can't even understand a page of Dante's.

[G.O.A.T]

Who does believe players don't use it?

The question is....do you care?

I do in a way....but not all that much. It bugs me because of the edge it gives them on former players who had to do it closer to the right way(people were on things even in the 70s). But im not losing sleep.

I bet 20% of the NFL is or was on something.

More than 20% of small college football players are using some type of steroid or growth hormone. In the NFL, my guess is around 90% of non-specialists/quarterbacks.

I agree that the question is not if they are using, but if we care.

I don't care. I enjoyed baseball in 1998, a lot. Honestly the writers keeping players like Bonds, McGwire, Clemens etc. out of the HOF bothers me more than their "cheating". To me, they are trying to rewrite history. I don't see why we can't look at the steroid era in baseball just like the dead ball era or pre-integration era. circumstances changed and so did the game, let's teach people of future generations what happened, not try to alter the history to suit our sensibilities today.

To your point about performance enhancement in the 1970's and before let's not discount the use of amphetamines, common in baseball and football as far back as the 1950's. Or, how about Pine Tar, Vaseline, etc. I understand these have different effects, but the intention is the same, any little edge one can acquire.

Also KBlaze, please join our HOF project and consider sticking it to the front page.

[fourkicks44]

today's era > all other eras

All because of HGH.

With today's drugs Jordan would have won 10 championships. Lebron can't even get more than 2 shooting up.

[tomtucker]

Dwyane Wade is most definitely not on HGH. He just like storing nuts in his mouth.

but who

[R.I.P.]

LMAO at the NBA player union wanting increased testing for marijuana and co., because they are sick of underpeforming cokeheads as teammates, but have no interest in increased PED testing like HGH and EPO. :roll: :roll:

[MavsSuperFan]

LMAO at the NBA player union wanting increased testing for marijuana and co., because they are sick of underpeforming cokeheads as teammates, but have no interest in increased PED testing like HGH and EPO. :roll: :roll:
sad, and makes me suspect them

[ILLsmak]

Hgh at a young age will make you taller, and that includes your arms...

Look at players still growing at 18,19,20. And growing from 6'3 to 6'10 or more suddenly late in the teens, while donning a unibrow and teeth all over the place- you do the math.

At 6'3 he doesn't sniff at NBA, at 6'10 he's a future mvp...


Well, I agree with HGH... but I think HGH or whatever NBA players are using is making them shorter. Either that or how they measure height, or their athleticism due to using PEDs has phased out the true 7 footer.

I dunno if 6'3-6'10 is a strange spurt. Someone in my family grew a whole foot, but he wasn't 6'3 beforehand. The teeth and eyebrow is strange though haha.

I think HGH is bad because it's made the game different. All PEDs are bad, there are some serious athletes without them and if the rest of players are skill players (something the NBA lacks now), then that gives them more room to operate. Opposed to everyone having a shaky jumper and being great at attacking the rim.

But, the question isn't even... are they using or do we care. It's more like what are we gonna do... nothing. Dudes are on PEDs in the Olympics, too, **** the bullshit. Maybe not on the same ridic level as the NBA or Professional sports tho.

As for rehabbing from injuries, that will never work because that means its on hand. I mean, it'll never work as a legit mechanic where they can just stop when they are 'healed.'

-Smak

[GODbe]

today's era > all other eras

All because of HGH.

With today's drugs Jordan would have won 10 championships. Lebron can't even get more than 2 shooting up.
:facepalm Jordan was already on these same drugs to begin with when he played. Could barely get past Kobe's ring count despite being on the most stacked team of all time, in a weak era.

[Soundwave]

Wouldn't be surprised at all if its used in the NBA among other pro sports.

There are regular joe gym rats at my gym that are on it. Naive to believe pro athletes wouldn't be tempted.

[eliteballer]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11515179/nfl-players-union-votes-accept-revised-drug-policy

NFL has approved HGH testing, Silver said the NBA would follow the NFL's lead..

[ProfessorMurder]

^ Good.

I want real players that don't juice.

[Magic 32]

It aint gonna make your shot go in.

It aint gonna make your arms longer to grab rebounds.


It give you better stamina. Every part of your game can benefit from that.

[eliteballer]

More than 20% of small college football players are using some type of steroid or growth hormone. In the NFL, my guess is around 90% of non-specialists/quarterbacks.

I agree that the question is not if they are using, but if we care.

I don't care. I enjoyed baseball in 1998, a lot. Honestly the writers keeping players like Bonds, McGwire, Clemens etc. out of the HOF bothers me more than their "cheating". To me, they are trying to rewrite history. I don't see why we can't look at the steroid era in baseball just like the dead ball era or pre-integration era. circumstances changed and so did the game, let's teach people of future generations what happened, not try to alter the history to suit our sensibilities today.

To your point about performance enhancement in the 1970's and before let's not discount the use of amphetamines, common in baseball and football as far back as the 1950's. Or, how about Pine Tar, Vaseline, etc. I understand these have different effects, but the intention is the same, any little edge one can acquire.

Also KBlaze, please join our HOF project and consider sticking it to the front page.

What's your source for the bolded?

[Random_Guy]

hmmm the usual HGH debate. just gonna throw my opinions in to the mix. In my opinion i dont care whether players juice or not, or whether HGH harms ones health. I want the best possible show in front of me.