Larry Brown: Great players aren't teammates

[Deuce Bigalow]

Unlike LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, Brown says great players like Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson would never join forces to form a championship team.

http://sports.yahoo.com/video/larry-brown-lebron-great-players-110000351.html

[The Iron Fist]

[Typical Lebron] who is larry brown? What does he know about basketball?[/**********]

[CelticBaller]

[Typical Lebron] who is larry brown? What does he know about basketball?[/**********]
But when another geezer praises him all of the sudden his status reappears

[Deuce Bigalow]

[Typical Lebron] who is larry brown? What does he know about basketball?[/**********]
Is he any good doe? Can the heat get him?

[moe94]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.

[The Iron Fist]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.:facepalm
Did they collude with said players to form a "superteam"?

[Deuce Bigalow]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.
Yeah because they decided to join them during free agency in their prime.

[aj1987]

"Michael Jordan, Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, those guys wouldn't want to team up with great players..."
Because most of those guys had teams that were stacked as ****.

"I found out the other day that he's bigger than Karl Malone..."

Seriously? Doesn't Malone have like 2 inches and 20 lbs on him?



Yeah because they decided to join them during free agency in their prime.
They didn't have to. They already had those GOAT level players.

[sammichoffate]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.http://replygif.net/i/980.gif

[moe94]

So it's an issue of how it's formed, not that it exists. It's almost like this has been beaten to death and we're going through the motions.

Same shit, different day. It's not 2011. Get over it already.

[Smook A.]

http://www.environmentalcaskets.com/images/Casket550Pix.jpg

[AintNoSunshine]

If I get drafted to a team with the arguable GOAT and a All-time top 10 SF and great supporting cast, I wouldn't complain either:roll:

Magic is part of the most stacked team in the history of the league:facepalm

[red1]

Holy f*ck these kobe fanboys are still butthurt after THREE years. Every legend has had stacked teams. Get over it

[red1]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.
:applause:

[JohnFreeman]

Magic Johnson would never play on a stacked team. Neither would Jordan. Could you imagine Magic having the best C in the league or some nonsense like Jordan having the best SF of an entire decade? Ludicrous.
:oldlol:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Holy f*ck these kobe fanboys are still butthurt after THREE years. Every legend has had stacked teams. Get over it

Larry Brown isn't a Kobe fan boy.

Anyway, I agree with his message (even though Wade/Bosh are not what they once were).

[G-train]

:facepalm
Did they collude with said players to form a "superteam"?

Look up Magic's comments before he got drafted.

[red1]

Larry Brown isn't a Kobe fan boy.

Anyway, I agree with his message (even though Wade/Bosh are not what they once were).
With all due respect his comments don't mean shit. We don't know how mj/bird/magic would have reacted to playing with bron's supporting casts in cleveland. All of this talk is hot air since they have all had stacked teams. Every. Single. One.

[russwest0]

Larry Brown is 100% correct here.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

With all due respect his comments don't mean shit. We don't know how mj/bird/magic would have reacted to playing with bron's supporting casts in cleveland. All of this talk is hot air since they have all had stacked teams. Every. Single. One.

I wont deny Magic had a stacked team (though his impact was INSANE from the get go); however, Jordan built his squad from the bottom-up. Same w/ Bird.

About this "BEST SF" talk. Feels like I'm repeating myself, but from 87-90ish, Pippen was super green and NOTHING like he was from '91 on. Jordan, Phil and the Bulls grew together as a team, and developed incredible chemistry, hence the championships.

[bballnoob1192]

08-10 gasol > 12-14 wade and i'm a kobe fan. kobe had great teammates during his runs

[red1]

I wont deny Magic had a stacked team (though his impact was INSANE from the get go); however, Jordan built his squad from the bottom-up. Same w/ Bird.

About this "BEST SF" talk. Feels like I'm repeating myself, but from 87-90ish, Pippen was super green and NOTHING like he was from '91 on. Jordan, Phil and the Bulls grew together as a team, and developed incredible chemistry, hence the championships.
Even still anyone with a brain can see that the context is not remotely similar. OF COURSE none of those guys would change teams, why would they when their front office is building them a roster even more balanced and complete than this admittedly stacked but flawed heat roster. None of them would win shit in LBJ's shoes in cleveland.

[Rooster]

Look up Magic's comments before he got drafted.

Magic did not say that before he got drafted:no: He said that during the 91 Finals.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Even still anyone with a brain can see that the context is not remotely similar. OF COURSE none of those guys would change teams, why would they when their front office is building them a roster even more balanced and complete than this admittedly stacked but flawed heat roster. None of them would win shit in LBJ's shoes in cleveland.

We really don't know that, but I'll agree that their situations are a bit different.

I also have no problem with anyone excluding Magic in these discussions.

[no pun intended]

Says the man who coached Iverson.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Even still anyone with a brain can see that the context is not remotely similar. OF COURSE none of those guys would change teams, why would they when their front office is building them a roster even more balanced and complete than this admittedly stacked but flawed heat roster. None of them would win shit in LBJ's shoes in cleveland.
2007 anybody?

You're telling me MJ, Kobe, Bird, West, Dr J, ect could not have dominated the Spurs in the Finals?

22 ppg, 6 t/o, 36%fg, 69%ft :bowdown:

[navy]

2007 anybody?

You're telling me MJ, Kobe, Bird, West, Dr J, ect could not have dominated the Spurs in the Finals?

22 ppg, 6 t/o, 36%fg, 69%ft :bowdown:
They wouldnt have made the finals.

[Deuce Bigalow]

They wouldnt have made the finals.
Why not? 07 EC was one of the weakest conf ever.

[russwest0]

2007 anybody?

You're telling me MJ, Kobe, Bird, West, Dr J, ect could not have dominated the Spurs in the Finals?

22 ppg, 6 t/o, 36%fg, 69%ft :bowdown:

ethered

[Rake2204]

I think Larry Brown's primary message is correct here. I was more or less bummed to see such a great talent like LeBron James go to the complete opposite end of the spectrum and compensate for his supposed lack of support in Cleveland by overkilling by more or less creating a brand new team from scratch featuring three dream teamers.

I feel if all great players followed that logic, there'd be four to six teams all stacked with a bevy of dream teamers, with the other 24 teams just playing out the string... forever. For the vast majority of the league, the idea of fair play and competition would jump straight out of the window.

And at the end of the day, I think that's my issue with the Heat. I really do think it makes a difference as to how a great team comes together. GM's creating teams has proven difficult over time, at least requiring a bit of luck or good fortune along the way, along with much sacrifice and a hefty bit of strategy. But the best player in the world, one of the top 5 players in the world, and a five-time all-star simply deciding to create a super team on their own seems to bypass a lot of the normal competitive expectations for me. It all felt a little too easy to create an instant finalist (and eventual repeat winner). It didn't feel so much as if the Miami franchise had built or earned a winning team as opposed to winning a championship roster lottery.

[livingby3's]

Frankly, does anyone regret the fact that KG wasted his prime with the Wolves? Wouldn't you want to see what a prime KG could deliver on a championship caliber team?

Where will KG be ranked now if he had won more, even with a stacked team? Probably the best PF all time. Not saying LeBron is at all praise-able for joining 2 stars with all that drama, but at least he chose his own path and want to be great.

Look where the Cavs are now post-LeBron, everyone knew he ain't winning shit with the Cavs. LeBron knew it, Mo Knew it, I knew it, you knew it. You want to succeed in life, in what you do, so does LeBron, what's with all these hates for an athlete?

[Yao Ming's Foot]

08-10 gasol > 12-14 wade and i'm a kobe fan. kobe had great teammates during his runs

Pretty sure it's not a 2 vs 2 sport. Winning a title with just one other all star teammate is rare.


5 times is unheard of...

[Rake2204]

Frankly, does anyone regret the fact that KG wasted his prime with the Wolves? Wouldn't you want to see what a prime KG could deliver on a championship caliber team?

Where will KG be ranked now if he had won more, even with a stacked team? Probably the best PF all time. Not saying LeBron is at all praise-able for joining 2 stars with all that drama, but at least he chose his own path and want to be great.

Look where the Cavs are now post-LeBron, everyone knew he ain't winning shit with the Cavs. LeBron knew it, Mo Knew it, I knew it, you knew it. You want to succeed in life, in what you do, so does LeBron, what's with all these hates for an athlete?I think the fact that we're discussing entertainment-based competitive sports, as opposed to generally getting ahead in life, can sometimes complicate matters. For me, deciding to create one's own superteam from scratch seems to sort of contradict the idea of competition in the first place.

The question then becomes: Does winning mean the same if one overwhelmingly stacks the odds in their own favor as opposed to dealing with the semi-realistic hand they're dealt? Some say yes, because a win is a win is a win, whether it's against another super team, the Bucks, or a pile of fifth graders. But I believe others may beg to differ.

I try to think of fluent analogies, but it is somewhat difficult due to the uniqueness of the Heat situation. I've mentioned the streetball comparison, and that may be similar (three DI prospects showing up, insisting on only playing on each other's squad, running the table, relishing victory as if it were ever a fight) or maybe it's like a team within a high school conference wooing two more All-Conference players from rival cities to come team up with their own All-Conference player, then dominating the league. I suppose it's about at what point is competition compromised and/or eclipsed in importance instead by how willing superstars are to team up.

I think I felt LeBron James was one of the types of players Larry Brown originally referenced - someone who was going to ride or die and take full ownership of what his team did or did not accomplish. It was my belief that a ring was only going to be a matter of time for LeBron James in Cleveland, and it would have been glorious because he took a team, made it his, played the right way, and would more or less make a mockery of the big markets and other players who'd jump to new squads simply looking to stack one's way to a ring. It was a bummer to see him take the route he did. It was like he gave in to the silly media pressure that somehow believed James wouldn't really be a good basketball player until the team for which he played won an NBA championship.

[tpols]

08-10 gasol > 12-14 wade and i'm a kobe fan. kobe had great teammates during his runs

08-10 Gasol was better than 08-10 Tim Duncan... how would people feel if Kobe hopped to the spurs doe?

[iamgine]

Unlike LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, Brown says great players like Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson would never join forces to form a championship team.

http://sports.yahoo.com/video/larry-brown-lebron-great-players-110000351.html
Well obviously they would never join forces because those two already had all time greats on their team in the first place.

[Mr Exlax]

Look up Magic's comments before he got drafted.

This

[Deuce Bigalow]

Well obviously they would never join forces because those two already had all time greats on their team in the first place.
MJ had alltime greats already? Who? Bulls were below .500 for his first 3 seasons.

[no pun intended]

"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?!"

-Allen Iverson

[Micku]

"How the hell can I make my teammates better by practicing?!"

-Allen Iverson

Not a game. Not a game. We talkin bout practice!

[Milbuck]

Great players are also not given ten feet of room and dared to shoot...for 3 out of 4 finals :confusedshrug:

Seriously though, this is all bullshit. No one knows how Magic, Bird, MJ would've reacted and how their careers would've played out if they weren't in such good situations.

[riseagainst]

lemme guess. You can't take Larry Brown seriously because he's a nobody.

:rolleyes:

[russwest0]

Great players are also not given ten feet of room and dared to shoot...for 3 out of 4 finals :confusedshrug:

Scott Brooks doe

[iamgine]

MJ had alltime greats already? Who? Bulls were below .500 for his first 3 seasons.
Who was talking about his first three seasons?

[bballnoob1192]

08-10 Gasol was better than 08-10 Tim Duncan... how would people feel if Kobe hopped to the spurs doe?
why would he need to? its not like his team was terrible. Lebron's cleveland team would not be that good if they were not in the shitty east. Would people give him shit then for leaving lets say a 4-5th seed cleveland team that was in the west? People give lebron crap for leaving a 60+ win team, but they only got that for playing in the shitty ass east.

[HOoopCityJones]

It's funny whenever people look back at those Cavs Teams as some sort of shit sandwich.

How can people sit there and act like Bron's Cavs weren't a 60 win Team?

And if that Team wasn't good enough to win it all, why doesn't anyone make excuses for Steve Nash? Who pretty much led a Team to deep playoff runs like LBJ, but came up short everytime.

What would people have said about Steve Nash in 06 if he left the Suns after they were knocked out by the Spurs? Despite being a 60 win Team and having the top seed in the West coming in to those Playoffs?

[SHAQisGOAT]

Great players are also not given ten feet of room and dared to shoot...for 3 out of 4 finals :confusedshrug:

Seriously though, this is all bullshit. No one knows how Magic, Bird, MJ would've reacted and how their careers would've played out if they weren't in such good situations.

Bird and MJ didn't "arrive" into what you call good situations. And Bird turned it around instantly.

[Da_Realist]

So it's an issue of how it's formed, not that it exists.

Yeah, because the issue is his take on Lebron's mentality, not on his team's ability to win championships.

I don't think MJ or Magic would every join up together except for the Dream Team. And even that was a front because they went at it in practice. MJ admitted that he went to see how the other guy's competed. We would have never seen the best of those guys had they played together. It was the competition against each other (and others like Bird, Domininique, Drexler, Olajuwon, etc) that drove them to be the best.

As far as whether or not it taints Lebron's championships...I don't think it does at all. I just see it as a different mentality.

[Da_Realist]

As far as whether or not it taints Lebron's championships...I don't think it does at all. I just see it as a different mentality.

Let me clarify this. I don't blame Lebron because I think the whole culture is different today. Today's basketball is about comparing numbers and collecting titles. The journey doesn't mean so much. We're in a stat- and legacy-obsessed culture. One 50 point game validates someone to HOF status until the next time he shoots 35% and is called a bum. There is no patience whatsoever.

There was pride involved in the process when I first started watching basketball in the mid-80's. Listen to how Isiah described the work it took to climb that Green Monster in Boston. They obsessed over the Celtics the whole offseason. Isiah would have NEVER taken DJ's place just to win a title. It was either win in Detroit or not at all.

Same arc with Chicago vs Detroit. There was some pride involved in knocking on Detroit's door and having it slammed in their faces for 3 straight years. Joining a team that just took your lunch money to win a title like Ray Allen did would have been heresy. That title would never have counted by fans. MJ would have been hated by Bulls fans and never fully trusted by Pistons fans.

I think it started to change a little bit in the mid 90's with Shaq moving to LA, Rodman going from Detroit to SA to Chicago, Drexler going to Houston and Barkley moving from Phoenix to Houston. Shaq wasn't really moving to an established championship team but he was going to a very talented one. Rodman had already won titles. Drexler and Barkley were on the downside of their careers and definitely not in their primes. (Barkley did move from Philly to Phoenix in his prime but taking them to the Finals actually gave him more respect. It validated his talent.)

It's not exactly the same as today but those moves planted the seed. If the old versions of Hakeem, Barkley and Drexler can play well, what could they look like in their primes? Fans weren't as nauseated by the thought of superstars playing together anymore. The game had changed. It just needed someone to blaze the trail. Then Shaq left LA to play with DWade. Garnett and Ray Allen headed to Boston and won a title with Paul Pierce. Soon after Pau Gasol moves to play with Kobe. Then eventually Lebron moves down to Miami to partner with DWade. The culture had changed by the point. All Lebron did was take advantage of it.