Was Obamacare "the big consolation" for continued war, deficit, and spying?

[Akrazotile]

Is that what the push for Barrycare was really all about? Placating those in the party who wanted Bush's head on a platter over war, spending, and spying?

"Well, I know you only support me bc Im a Democrat and youre trained to think Im personally against war, spending, and spying... But the truth is we're all the same. But to keep you blind monkies thinking there's a difference, we're gonna pass healthcare which the Democrats will support unfailingly, and republicans will oppose unfailingly, and you can continue to argue over that while we continue to do all the things you demanded change for. This will keep your petty and naive attention focused on the opposite parties opposition.

"But wait! Thats not all! Vote now and we'll even throw in some lip service to gay rights and stuff, in whatever way you wanna frame them. Not that we Democrat loliticians give one single flying fukc about it, but we know it will keep you stupid and focused on frivolous competition with the opposite party.

WAR
CRUSHING DEFICIT
DOMESTIC SPYING/TERROR

vs

Health insurance reform and gay rights.



EPIC CHANGE + HOPE!!!!!!!!!

[DukeDelonte13]

eh, domestic spying and war were here long before barry took office.


I voted for Obama for the healthcare, i got the healthcare, and i'm very pleased. Thanks Obama.

It's a bigger deal than most people think, but unless you are self employed or running your own small business you won't give a crap about it. It's been a godsend.

History will look back on Barrack as a good president. I'd put money down on it if something like that was actually quantifiable.

[Rodmantheman]

eh, domestic spying and war were here long before barry took office.


I voted for Obama for the healthcare, i got the healthcare, and i'm very pleased. Thanks Obama.

It's a bigger deal than most people think, but unless you are self employed or running your own small business you won't give a crap about it. It's been a godsend.

History will look back on Barrack as a good president. I'd put money down on it if something like that was actually quantifiable.

No

[Akrazotile]

eh, domestic spying and war were here long before barry took office.


I voted for Obama for the healthcare, i got the healthcare, and i'm very pleased. Thanks Obama.

It's a bigger deal than most people think, but unless you are self employed or running your own small business you won't give a crap about it. It's been a godsend.

History will look back on Barrack as a good president. I'd put money down on it if something like that was actually quantifiable.



Obamacare does very little to curtail the REASONS healthcare is so expensive in this country. It does nothing to actually solve the problem.

You are pleased with this President because he gave YOU a handout at the expense of taxpayers, and so he got your vote. That pretty much sums up the Democratic party. Maybe even politics in general.

Thanks dukedelonte. You helped demonstrate why crucial problems that people SAY they care about (war, economy, individual liberties) go ignored by the public, because people are so unprincipled they can easily be bought off by a handout.

The system works in favor of politicians, thanks to folks like DukeDelonte. It always has, because of folks like him. And unfortunately, it probably always will.


Of course, during the next election, when the base public is looking for someone to blame for the current problems they love to chirp about but not help solve, they'll just target whoever the next republican candidate is. Always frame it like the distant goliath is the force who's causing all the problems, insead of Joe Sixpack, or Duke Delonte, earning a modest $50,000/yr or whatever. Apparently nobody who isn't rich contributes to ANY of our country's ills.







Well, they do, it's just that the average, awkward academia softie is such a fruitcake pussee that he's SCARED to ever confront a neighbor face to face. He feels helpless and insecure, so he can use all the allies he can get and loves to look cool on his soapbox pointing a finger at all the big establshments and institutions. Meanwhile those around him are being bought off left and right. And so is he. But he bleets about the meanie repubican jerks anyway like a good little sheep.



The system works. To a tee.

[niko]

How exactly is a guy who lives off mommy and daddy lecturing people on handouts?

[Akrazotile]

How exactly is a guy who lives off mommy and daddy lecturing people on handouts?


How can a 40+ year old with two kids who still gets shamefully defensive about a sports team and brags on a message board that he got a job interview going to question anyone else....?


You are TOO OLD to be THIS corny dude. You are by far the corniest person on this site.


But let's not derail the thread, please.

[niko]

How can a 40+ year old with two kids who still gets shamefully defensive about a sports team and brags on a message board that he got a job interview going to question anyone else....?


You are TOO OLD to be THIS corny dude. You are by far the corniest person on this site.


But let's not derail the thread, please.
Are u going to answer or not? Nice try though. The fact you're going to be a single 40 yr old wannabe actor back at home asking mommy for pizza money takes the sting away just a bit from anything you say.

So, what's your answer?

[ALBballer]

How exactly is a guy who lives off mommy and daddy lecturing people on handouts?

This isn't really relevant. In fact this is a classic ad-hominem attack which the OP does as well.

Regardless I would rather him take handouts from his parents than from society as a whole.

[Akrazotile]

Are u going to answer or not? Nice try though. The fact you're going to be a single 40 yr old wannabe actor back at home asking mommy for pizza money takes the sting away just a bit from anything you say.

So, what's your answer?


I've burned down this strawman in other threads, I'm not wasting time on it here.

You only use it because you have literally nothing to offer to this discussion, including a simple agreement because you are the exact type of hypocrite crybaby I'm talking about, and once again you really are too old for that to be the case. You should have more to say at your age than just 24/7 "omgz shut up stupid knick haters, ur team is more stupider!!!!" and "hey u guys, i'm 45 and i'm about to go on a job interview, wish me luck all my e-friends!" :facepalm

You have the mental maturity of a 12 year old. Don't derail my thread with it. If you need my attention that bad, just PM me. I won't answer, but at least you can get it off your chest. This isn't the thread for it you infinite cornball.

[JtotheIzzo]

Healthcare has been on the table for the left since before Jimmy Carter, momentum built up a little more each time till they got this compromise Mitt Romney system they are running today.

Should have been a single payer, but big pharma would die is Americans paid discount prices for drugs.

[Akrazotile]

Healthcare has been on the table for the left since before Jimmy Carter, momentum built up a little more each time till they got this compromise Mitt Romney system they are running today.

Should have been a single payer, but big pharma would die is Americans paid discount prices for drugs.


But do you think it was planned in advance to be a part of this administration, for the purpose of ameliorating all of the left's anger toward the "Bush" policies?

Without healthcare being the major news story and the major Democrat battle cry throughout Barry's term, it might have been more obvious to Democrats that nearly every major outrage perpetrated by Bush was continued by their savior Barry.


I mean politicians have their own healthcare, they don't give a shit. They don't give a shit about anything, anything that gets done is for political reasons. Any leader can justify anything to his base by blaming the other one.


The war and the spying and the spending was GOING to continue. It seems that healthcare was an all too convenient distraction to finally provide. A nice, time-released concession to the public in exchange for letting Democrats do everything they told the Republicans not to.

So that's my question. Do you think this finally came about because politicians on the inside said "Yes, this is what the American people need, and it's high time we deliver what is right." Or do you think they said "Ok, our agenda is to continue these extremely controversial policies, we need something we can 'sacrifice' as a means to keep the people happy."


I mean just look at what Duke Delonte said. "Obama gave me free healthcare, so I voted for Obama. And I'm good."



Pretty much says it all, no?

[DukeDelonte13]

Obamacare does very little to curtail the REASONS healthcare is so expensive in this country. It does nothing to actually solve the problem.

You are pleased with this President because he gave YOU a handout at the expense of taxpayers, and so he got your vote. That pretty much sums up the Democratic party. Maybe even politics in general.

Thanks dukedelonte. You helped demonstrate why crucial problems that people SAY they care about (war, economy, individual liberties) go ignored by the public, because people are so unprincipled they can easily be bought off by a handout.

The system works in favor of politicians, thanks to folks like DukeDelonte. It always has, because of folks like him. And unfortunately, it probably always will.


Of course, during the next election, when the base public is looking for someone to blame for the current problems they love to chirp about but not help solve, they'll just target whoever the next republican candidate is. Always frame it like the distant goliath is the force who's causing all the problems, insead of Joe Sixpack, or Duke Delonte, earning a modest $50,000/yr or whatever. Apparently nobody who isn't rich contributes to ANY of our country's ills.







Well, they do, it's just that the average, awkward academia softie is such a fruitcake pussee that he's SCARED to ever confront a neighbor face to face. He feels helpless and insecure, so he can use all the allies he can get and loves to look cool on his soapbox pointing a finger at all the big establshments and institutions. Meanwhile those around him are being bought off left and right. And so is he. But he bleets about the meanie repubican jerks anyway like a good little sheep.



The system works. To a tee.


I don't see how i'm getting much tax payer help... I still pay 400$ bucks a month for regular health insurance.

Without Obamacare i'd be paying over one thousand a month. And that's WITHOUT KIDS. Just me and my wife. I'd have to pay an entire second mortgage just to go see the f*cking doctor. Only tax help i get is a 99 dollar a month tax credit. You know who eats that bulk of that difference in money? Health Insurance companies, not taxpayers. Yes there are some tax credits given to insurance companies as well, but they are the party that's really suffering the brunt of the loss and they should be. They still are going to make money hand over fist.


I can't for the life of me explain why people wanna defend health insurance companies like they are the victims and they are the ones that have nothing to do with ridiculous health care costs.

Obamacare is simply the government setting new ground rules for insurers. It equals the playing field between a party with no power versus a party with 100% of the power.

When you are self insured your choices are extremely limited. When you have prexisting condition depending on how bad it is pre obamacare a lot of times you couldn't get insurance even if you wanted it.

[ALBballer]

Healthcare has been on the table for the left since before Jimmy Carter, momentum built up a little more each time till they got this compromise Mitt Romney system they are running today.

Should have been a single payer, but big pharma would die is Americans paid discount prices for drugs.

Single payer might be a good option in Scandinavian countries with small healthy homogenous population. Also many of these socialized countries benefit from our private practices since America leads the world in medical innovations.

[JtotheIzzo]

Single payer might be a good option in Scandinavian countries with small healthy homogenous population. Also many of these socialized countries benefit from our private practices since America leads the world in medical innovations.

Does having different ethnic groups lead to different medical techniques?

You are right though, the US system props up big pharma.

[Akrazotile]

I don't see how i'm getting much tax payer help... I still pay 400$ bucks a month for regular health insurance.

Without Obamacare i'd be paying over one thousand a month. And that's WITHOUT KIDS. Just me and my wife. I'd have to pay an entire second mortgage just to go see the f*cking doctor. Only tax help i get is a 99 dollar a month tax credit. You know who eats that bulk of that difference in money? Health Insurance companies, not taxpayers. Yes there are some tax credits given to insurance companies as well, but they are the party that's really suffering the brunt of the loss and they should be. They still are going to make money hand over fist.


I can't for the life of me explain why people wanna defend health insurance companies like they are the victims and they are the ones that have nothing to do with ridiculous health care costs.

Obamacare is simply the government setting new ground rules for insurers. It equals the playing field between a party with no power versus a party with 100% of the power.

When you are self insured your choices are extremely limited. When you have prexisting condition depending on how bad it is pre obamacare a lot of times you couldn't get insurance even if you wanted it.



Healthcare is still largely a supply and demand industry. America is an extremely unhealthy country, yet it demands medical treatment/remedies for every time it gets a boo boo. Because people have insurance, it encourages them to go to the doctor any time they feel like it because "they're not paying." Then all of a sudden we have huge premiums because guess what, SOMEONE IS ALWAYS PAYING.


The majority of Americans have turned fast food into their drug of escape. http://static.ddmcdn.com/gif/evolutionary-roots-obesity-1.jpg

"That's ok! Blame is on the insurance companies, steal some rich people's money, pay my premium and I won't care!"



American hospitals are housing the extremely elderly and people in the final stages of life by the hundreds of thousands which requires staff, requires equipment, requires resources. That's a problem that everyone is scared to acknowledge because of the CULTURE OF SHSHHHH BE SENSITITIVEEE!!!!

http://www.medicine.virginia.edu/clinical/departments/medicine/grad-ed/geri/images/20080521_guitarplayer_33.jpg

"That's ok! Blame is on the insurance companies, steal some rich people's money, pay my premium and I won't care!"



People take pills for EVERYTHING now. Heart burn, athletes foot, acne, people get their STOMACH STAPLED because they can't keep from eating (covered by insurance) people get hooked on drugs and then need detox (covered by insurance) then they become depressed and need mental health treatment (covered by insurance) and on and on and on and on.

http://blog.aarp.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/timer_626px.jpg

"That's ok! Blame is on the insurance companies, steal some rich people's money, pay my premium and I won't care!"



Instead of demanding accountability from CITIZENS to address healthcare costs, you would rather yank money from the economy and subordinate our very constitution so you can put an extra few hundred in your pocket each month. Now, that's entirely human of you. People are selfish creatures. You are extremely selfish. My point is the HYPOCRISY of your finger-wagging at insurance companies, wealthy people, republicans etc. and your delusion that Democrats are "here to save the day" because they're not. They're taking advantage of YOUR selfishness by giving you a dollar from every ten they snatch illegally. You are complicit because you are dumb and needy and selfish and instead of taking a leadership role in your society, you take a backdoor handout then stand on a soapbox and complain about Republicans.


Nice.

[Akrazotile]

Does having different ethnic groups lead to different medical techniques?


No but different cultural values effects medical needs.

[KevinNYC]

blah, blah blah........If you need my attention that bad, .....

This from the guy who posted a picture of blood streaming down his face.

[Akrazotile]

This from the guy who posted a picture of blood streaming down his face.


That was for communal entertainment you fat pig. This is a serious topic.

I'm sure I've struck a nerve with you since you're a fatass collecting disability and medicaid because you ate yourself stupid to the point of being bedridden.

Worthless slob.

[DukeDelonte13]

Healthcare is still largely a supply and demand industry. America is an extremely unhealthy country, yet it demands medical treatment/remedies for every time it gets a boo boo. Because people have insurance, it encourages them to go to the doctor any time they feel like it because "they're not paying." Then all of a sudden we have huge premiums because guess what, SOMEONE IS ALWAYS PAYING.




American hospitals are housing the extremely elderly and people in the final stages of life by the hundreds of thousands which requires staff, requires equipment, requires resources. That's a problem that everyone is scared to acknowledge because of the CULTURE OF SHSHHHH BE SENSITITIVEEE!!!!




People take pills for EVERYTHING now. Heart burn, athletes foot, acne, people get their STOMACH STAPLED because they can't keep from eating (covered by insurance) people get hooked on drugs and then need detox (covered by insurance) then they become depressed and need mental health treatment (covered by insurance) and on and on and on and on.





Instead of demanding accountability from CITIZENS to address healthcare costs, you would rather yank money from the economy and subordinate our very constitution so you can put an extra few hundred in your pocket each month. Now, that's entirely human of you. People are selfish creatures. You are extremely selfish. My point is the HYPOCRISY of your finger-wagging at insurance companies, wealthy people, republicans etc. and your delusion that Democrats are "here to save the day" because they're not. They're taking advantage of YOUR selfishness by giving you a dollar from every ten they snatch illegally. You are complicit because you are dumb and needy and selfish and instead of taking a leadership role in your society, you take a backdoor handout then stand on a soapbox and complain about Republicans.


Nice.


So your argument against obamacare is people shouldn't have insurance because they go to the hospital and drive up health care costs.

Brilliant :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:


somebody give this guy the genius of the world medal for solving the health care crisis! Just stop going to the hospital! Who needs medical care anyways!

You are an EMBARRASSMENT to republicans.


f*ck logic right, because the more people paying premiums couldn't possibly lower the costs for everyone in the pool.. right? It's as if someone in a larger insurance pool somehow pays less in premiums... hmmmm i wonder how that works...:hammerhead:

[Akrazotile]

So your argument against obamacare is people shouldn't have insurance because they go to the hospital and drive up health care costs.

Brilliant :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:


somebody give this guy the genius of the world medal for solving the health care crisis! Just stop going to the hospital! Who needs medical care anyways!


:facepalm
I literally cringed at how hard you had to force that transparent revision of my words to avoid admitting I was right.



Someone who doesn't want to buy health insurance shouldn't be legally mandated to buy it just to lower YOUR premium. Again, you are violating the rights of others because its more money for YOU.

Every person has their own decision to make and the subsequent consequences to live with. And yes, if people were RESPONSIBLE with their health, it would have a much greater effect on healthcare costs than any intrusive regulation from the government. The only way to truly make a meaningful impact on cost is with prevention. That's why your car insurance gives you a bigger discount for driving safely than signing up your friends :facepalm Believe me, if our population was smarter about healthcare, I would be interested in streamlining the system into something more universal.

Barrycare is not about health. It's about politics. And you admitted it yourself, basically affirming every single thing I wrote in my OP. They offered you some money for healthcare, you gave them your vote. You gave them carte blanche to do whatever else they want to do because you got the handout you wanted. Now you're simply mad that I put that into proper context.


Sorry champ. You're the one who sold your vote for a handout. Don't blame me for shining a light on it.

[KevinNYC]

That was for communal entertainment you fat pig. This is a serious topic.

I'm sure I've struck a nerve with you since you're a fatass collecting disability and medicaid because you ate yourself stupid to the point of being bedridden.

Worthless slob.

Does it make you feel better to believe that nonsense? It's pretty pathetic.

As I pointed out in another thread, I'm pretty sure I'm going to pay more in taxes this year, than you have earned as income.

[niko]

Does it make you feel better to believe that nonsense? It's pretty pathetic.

As I pointed out in another thread, I'm pretty sure I'm going to pay more in taxes this year, than you have earned as income.
I don't get why you people bother. This is a person who can be called a dependant on a return (who clearly has no real acting gigs or he'd be more concerned with group insurance) trying to rile you up. He's a leech on society arguing health care is leeching society. It's stupid.

[Jailblazers7]

So is it your hypothesis that Obama wasted all of his political capital on Obamacare to distract from the drone program and other foreign policy maneuvers?

Or

Is it that the political system in general allowed Obamacare to pass so that it would create a symbolic divide to dristract from "business as usual" in Washington?

[KevinNYC]

I don't get why you people bother. This is a person who can be called a dependant on a return (who clearly has no real acting gigs or he'd be more concerned with group insurance) trying to rile you up. He's a leech on society arguing health care is leeching society. It's stupid.

Yeah, sometimes I ignore the trollbait and sometimes I take it. But as I sit here in my office trying to plan out all the project for the next quater, it's a bit irritating, for this lying prick to continue his lies.

[Akrazotile]

So is it your hypothesis that Obama wasted all of his political capital on Obamacare to distract from the drone program and other foreign policy maneuvers?

Or

Is it that the political system in general allowed Obamacare to pass so that it would create a symbolic divide to dristract from "business as usual" in Washington?


Both, essentially. Do not both apply? Obama got elected on the "HOPE" that he would "CHANGE" things like middle eastern occupation, the intrusion of the patriot act, the souring economy.


[quote]On May 26, 2011, President Barack Obama signed the PATRIOT Sunsets Extension Act of 2011,[2] a four-year extension of three key provisions in the USA PATRIOT Act:[3] roving wiretaps, searches of business records (the "library records provision"), and conducting surveillance of "lone wolves"

[Akrazotile]

Basically, real tawk:

99% - greedy, self interested, hypocritical

1% - greedy, self interested, hypocritical


The 99% are playing the denial game. Painting only the 1% as greedy, as avaricious, as selfish and destructive. While the rest of society is innocent, well-meaning, virtuous, deserving, doing its part. The rich 1% is cunniving, corrupt, with their closed-door agreements, kickbacks, favor-for-a-favor good ol boy networking. Everyone else is just trying to do the right thing and earn his fair share.




I voted for Obama for the healthcare, i got the healthcare, and i'm very pleased. Thanks Obama.




When it comes right down to it, we're all the same. People just don't want to accept the merit component. Because at the end of the day, looking for sympathy and support is easier than the effort of self improvement and the uncertainty of competition.