Most underrated player on ISH: Hakeem, KG, or Wade?

[fpliii]

:confusedshrug:

[Milbuck]

Hard to pick, but I might have to go with Wade. His health problems the past few years, along with Lebron coming to Miami has made a lot of people forget just how ****ing good he was.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

KG easily. Top 10-15 player ever.
Hakeem gets rated. Wade is overrated.

[Smook A.]

I remember when there was a dumbass thread that said "Hakeem Olajuwon is the most overrated player ever"

[Rocketswin2013]

1. KG
2A : Hakeem
2B : Wade

[Just2McFly]

How is Hakeem underrated?:oldlol:

[Smook A.]

I'll go with KG. One of the greatest power forwards of all time, yet no one talks about him. It's been forever since I've aeen his name on ISH

Some just don't remember how GREAT he was.

[STATUTORY]

KG then Hakeem

Wade is not underrated, so many stans on this board for the guy. Hakeem is also rated appropriately on most top 10 list

KG is a legit top 20 player in his peak so I think he's underrated

[SilkkTheShocker]

Definitely not Duncan. He apparently is allowed to miss point blank layups that cost his team the Finals without a whisper.

[SilkkTheShocker]

How is Hakeem underrated?:oldlol:

This. He is treated like a demigod on here despite losing in the first round an embarrassing amount of times. Same with KG to a lesser extent.

[Smoke117]

I would say probably Kevin Garnett. Look at how everyone is all over Noah's nuts right now for his defense and game. Kevin Garnett stats were much better and so was his defense. That 2004 season is just ridiculous: 24.2ppg 13.9rpg 5.0apg 2.2bpg 1.5spg.

[T_L_P]

I would say probably Kevin Garnett. Look at how everyone is all over Noah's nuts right now for his defense and game. Kevin Garnett stats were much better and so was his defense. That 2004 season is just ridiculous: 24.2ppg 13.9rpg 5.0apg 22bpg 1.5spg.

Not even Wilt could approach those numbers :bowdown:

I'd say Garnett though.



Definitely not Duncan. He apparently is allowed to miss point blank layups that cost his team the Finals without a whisper.

:facepalm

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

KG, for sure. I'm still of the opinion he was every bit as good as Duncan was from late 03 - 08.

I dont see how Wade is underrated. But alright.


Wade is not underrated, so many stans on this board for the guy.

Yeah, I really dont see it.

[selrahc]

Wade... he carried lebron to two championships but for some reason lebron gets all the credit

[mr.big35]

its easily KG he was always top 5 player in his prime but no one talks about him

[oarabbus]

KG, people be like he's not even a NCAA player compared to Wilt/KAJ... just isn't true

[sd3035]

probably Durant

[Legends66NBA7]

None of them are underrated on ISH.

[T_L_P]

probably Durant

Lost to the 7th seed without another top 5-10 player :roll:

[Fire Colangelo]

KG isn't even underrated here. Only argument anyone has for KG vs Duncan is rings. You even see people picking KG over the likes of Duncan, Dirk, Malone, Barkley in some hypotheticals.

His defense gets way too overrated on this board. Yes he anchored the best defense on the Celtics, but the only time he's anchored a top 10 defense in his prime? His MVP season in 04.

Comparisons:

Duncan's teams had a top 10 defense every year he's on the team except 08.

Hakeem's teams had a top 10 defense every year from 85-95 with exception of 1986 and 1995.

KG's just not a first option type of player. He wasn't strong enough to back you down in the post, he wasn't a post threat like Malone/Barkley/Duncan, and he won't be demanding many doubles in the post like these guys do. He takes too many midrange jumpers and if I'm the other team, I'd let that fly all day.

To me, Garnett is similar to Pippen. Both guys who COULD be the first option on the team, but won't get you the ship doing so. Perfect 1b guys.

[plowking]

Hakeem is overrated on here to the point its hilarious. Anyone who actually believes hes the best center ever (and there are people on here), simply don't know shit about basketball. There has never been a player that has had his whole aura and myth based around one series like Hakeem has, and I'm talking about the D-Rob one.
Its laughable enough people consider him better than Shaq...

I've seen Garnett overrated on here as well. He wasn't a better player than Karl, and he wasn't better than Barkley. You never got the sense throughout his entire career that Garnett was some overwhelming force on offense, despite how multi-faceted he was. Barkley and Malone were exactly that. Dominant.

Wade on the other hand is exactly what the title says. Underrated.
People act as if 25/5/5 players with great efficiency are common place. If I'm correct, I'm pretty sure Wade is the only player in NBA history with averages of 20/5/5 and at least a block and steal a game. Or at least on a very, very short list. Not to mention hes a 3 time champ to go along with it all.

[Fire Colangelo]

Hakeem is overrated on here to the point its hilarious. Anyone who actually believes hes the best center ever (and there are people on here), simply don't know shit about basketball. There has never been a player that has had his whole aura and myth based around one series like Hakeem has, and I'm talking about the D-Rob one.
Its laughable enough people consider him better than Shaq...

I've seen Garnett overrated on here as well. He wasn't a better player than Karl, and he wasn't better than Barkley. You never got the sense throughout his entire career that Garnett was some overwhelming force on offense, despite how multi-faceted he was. Barkley and Malone were exactly that. Dominant.

Most have Hakeem ranked at 10ish, below Shaq and KAJ. I think that's alright, since those are the only two I'd take over Hakeem.

[Solefade]

wade isn't underrated on this forum, he's been overrated as fvck especially when lebron is winning chips

[plowking]

Most have Hakeem ranked at 10ish, below Shaq and KAJ. I think that's alright, since those are the only two I'd take over Hakeem.

Wilt>>>

[Cone]

should be most overrated.

most overrated definitely to KG

[T_L_P]

I'm pretty sure Wade is the only player in NBA history with averages of 20/5/5 and at least a block and steal a game. Or at least on a very, very short list. Not to mention hes a 3 time champ to go along with it all.

Garnett did it like 6 seasons in a row.

[plowking]

Garnett did it like 6 seasons in a row.

Career averages.

[T_L_P]

Career averages.

Ah, sorry. Thought you mean one season

[INDI]

:confusedshrug:

Hakeem and Oscar

honarable mentions: Moses Malone, Elgin Baylor and Dr J

[Bob Dole]

Out of those 3, Wade. Damn sure aint Hakeem. He's the most overrated play on this board next to Kobe.

[fpliii]

Hakeem and Oscar

honarable mentions: Moses Malone, Elgin Baylor and Dr J
I agree, and not because of the triple double season. Dude had amazing fundamentals, a wet jumper, and was a great scorer who got better in that regard during the playoffs against tough defenses. Along with Magic and Nash, he led one of the three GOAT offensive dynasties. Unfortunately, just as with Nash (to be fair though, if Amare isn't suspended they probably win a ship in 07), their defenses were atrocious (dealing with Russ and Wilt every year sucks too).

[Fire Colangelo]

Wilt>>>

Don't think anyone ranks Hakeem over Wilt either lol, I was talking about more modern centers but I'd take Wilt/Russell/Shaq/KAJ over Hakeem

[Brizzly]

Hakeem is considered top 10, safe to say he aint underrated.

I'd say

1. KG
2. Wade




3.Keem

[Odinn]

None of them IMO.

Hakeem is getting treated like he was as good as 93-95 for his entire career.
KG is generally ranked 2-5 range of PFs and compared to DRob. There are threads about him being superior player to TD.
There are similar situations that apply for Wade, too.

Most underrated player on ISH is probably from '60s or '70s because of revisionist young ones. Elgin Baylor and/or John Havlicek is more underrated/overlooked. And only Hakeem is superior to them, from the listed ones.

[Jacks3]

Wade is insanely overrated. He only has 4 1st-tier superstar seasons and people think he's the 2nd best SG ever and top 15 all-time. It's pretty ****ing ridiculous.

[houston]

wade of course

[ThePhantomCreep]

KG is the most underrated of the three, but he gets plenty of love too. Wade is borderline overrated.

[ProfessorMurder]

Dominique and Karl Malone are underrated here.


His defense gets way too overrated on this board. Yes he anchored the best defense on the Celtics, but the only time he's anchored a top 10 defense in his prime? His MVP season in 04.


You realize you need a good team to have a great defense?

[Anaximandro1]

Most underrated

Bill Russell - Back in 1980 Russell was voted by experts as the GOAT. Nowadays, Bill Russell gets compared to Ben Wallace.... This is the most outrageous statement: "if Ben Wallace and Bill Russell switched places, Ben would have had a similar career".

Wilt Chamberlain - He is known as a choker and stat-padder.

Duncan / Shaq - Statistically, they both are light years ahead of Larry Bird (check tempo-free stats).

David Robinson - People blame him for those postseason failures while they're busy making excuses for Garnett and Malone.

Dirk - One of the greatest postseason performers of all-time.



Most overrated

Bird / Kobe - Enough said.

Karl Malone - Huge drop in scoring efficiency in playoffs. And he had John Stockton.

Garnett - His offensive stats are mediocre in those postseason failures, but KG always gets a pass.

[AirTupac]

Wade underrated? Dude has been overrated for a while now :oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

Wade is insanely overrated. He only has 4 1st-tier superstar seasons and people think he's the 2nd best SG ever and top 15 all-time. It's pretty ****ing ridiculous.

I don't get this...not counting Wade's rookie year;

25/6/5 57% TS regular season player with an absurdly good peak in 09 (the year most say was his best year...)

24/6/5 56% TS playoffs...has 3 titles and a finals MVP

He's not top 15 all time at this point. He could have been if they won in 11 and he had 4 titles and 2 finals mvp's, but he's certainly around the top 20 all time with a resume like that

And those playoff numbers above are skewed by playing an entire title run (22 games) while seriously injured.

I mean...we really have to see how his longevity plays out in order to rank him, but he's been pretty damn good to date overall and we just have to wait and see what happens.

You act like he hasn't already played 11 years now. That is a long time. Especially when he was heavily relied upon from day 1. He didn't have the luxury of playing limited minutes as a bench player for his first 2 years.

First 11 years;

Kobe - 25/5/5 56% TS
Wade - 24/5/6 57% TS

Playoffs

Kobe 23/5/5 53% TS
Wade 24/6/5 55% TS

I guess we couldn't talk about Kobe being an all time great after the 07 season...LOL

[red1]

Wade is insanely overrated. He only has 4 1st-tier superstar seasons and people think he's the 2nd best SG ever and top 15 all-time. It's pretty ****ing ridiculous.
kobe is the most overrated player of all time

[Legends66NBA7]

Most underrated

David Robinson - People blame him for those postseason failures while they're busy making excuses for Garnett and Malone.

Doesn't really make him underrated. He's really in the same boat as those players.

I've seen ISH posters say that David Robinson was better than Tim Duncan, which is pretty much the same as ISH posters trying to say Charles Barkley/Kevin Garnett/Karl Malone were better than Tim Duncan.

[boozehound]

none of these guys are close to the most underrated, but of these three is def. hakeem. If anything Wade and KG are slightly overrated.

[fpliii]

BTW guys, this was a bait thread. :rockon:

[Fire Colangelo]

Dominique and Karl Malone are underrated here.



You realize you need a good team to have a great defense?

I'm on my phone but the likes of mutumbo, Duncan, Hakeem turned their teams into top defensive teams as soon as they got drafted.

KG had the stats, but the fact is he only anchored a top defense once in his prime and couldn't win a ring until he got together with Pierce and Allen.

To whoever said KG was the first option on those Celtics teams, lmfao. He was the most valuable yes, he should've won FMVP. But he wasn't the first option. Whenever the C's had trouble scoring they went to pierce, whenever they needed a bucket down the stretch they went to pierce.

[bballnoob1192]

KG hands down is underrated. you have barkley fanatics like round mound, but no one is a kg stat spewing paragraphing typing fanatic here, wade is rated fine here and sometimes a little overrated, and hakeem is overrated on this board imo.

[ILLsmak]

KG easily. Top 10-15 player ever.
Hakeem gets rated. Wade is overrated.

I rank Wade higher than KG all-time. Dude had some issues with injuries, as did many people.

KG is a beast, too... but Wade was on GOAT level for a couple years. That's why I'm always gonna say Dirk is a beast... dudes only need to really do one amazing thing to impress me. KG never did anything on the level of Wade in 06. Wade in 05, too, really.

I dunno why sports fans wanna say shit like THAT WAS A FLUKE. LONGEVITY DOE... nah. I mean, it has its place, but going apeshit for a short span is something I hold in higher regard than years upon years of all-nba level play.

Hakeem got on that ogod video game level, too. So, really, of the ones listed the only one that didn't was KG.

I'm going with Wade tho because a lot of ISH people have Hakeem in their top 10. I bet most people don't have Wade in their top 15. But to me... what makes Kobe better than Wade? Wade is on that level, altho he's a different player.

-Smak

[smoovegittar]

KG.

[Jacks3]

... but Wade was on GOAT level for a couple years.
-Smak
:oldlol:

[Y2ktors]

Hakeem is overrated on here to the point its hilarious. Anyone who actually believes hes the best center ever (and there are people on here), simply don't know shit about basketball. There has never been a player that has had his whole aura and myth based around one series like Hakeem has, and I'm talking about the D-Rob one.
Its laughable enough people consider him better than Shaq...

I've seen Garnett overrated on here as well. He wasn't a better player than Karl, and he wasn't better than Barkley. You never got the sense throughout his entire career that Garnett was some overwhelming force on offense, despite how multi-faceted he was. Barkley and Malone were exactly that. Dominant.

Wade on the other hand is exactly what the title says. Underrated.
People act as if 25/5/5 players with great efficiency are common place. If I'm correct, I'm pretty sure Wade is the only player in NBA history with averages of 20/5/5 and at least a block and steal a game. Or at least on a very, very short list. Not to mention hes a 3 time champ to go along with it all.
Hakeem was better than Shaq. He wasn't as physically imposing as Shaq but only Wilt was as imposing if not more.

[Y2ktors]

Most have Hakeem ranked at 10ish, below Shaq and KAJ. I think that's alright, since those are the only two I'd take over Hakeem.
I have Dream 7th, Shaq 9th.

[D.J.]

Wade. Took 34 year old Shaq, Antoine Walker, Jason Williams, 37 year old Gary Payton, Haslem, and Alonzo Mourning struggling to play 15-20 minutes to a title and breaking his ass in the Finals(shady officiating aside).

Then on the top of that, he puts up 30/8/5/2+/1+ on nearly 50% shooting in '09 with a team that compares to T-Mac's supporting cast in '03, and takes them to 43 wins and nearly an upset of Atlanta in the 1st round.

And despite all this, I don't see many talking about Wade here. Everything with the Heat is LeBron this, LeBron that. And can't forget about Kobe. But back in '09, Wade was playing some unreal basketball and to me, he was the MVP. You take Wade off that team, I don't even think they win 20 games.

[Y2ktors]

Wade is insanely overrated. He only has 4 1st-tier superstar seasons and people think he's the 2nd best SG ever and top 15 all-time. It's pretty ****ing ridiculous.
Jordan, Kobe, West and then Wade.

[moe94]

:oldlol:

Peak Wade was as good as Kobe ever was.

[ProfessorMurder]

Wade. Took 34 year old Shaq, Antoine Walker, Jason Williams, 37 year old Gary Payton, Haslem, and Alonzo Mourning struggling to play 15-20 minutes to a title and breaking his ass in the Finals(shady officiating aside).

Then on the top of that, he puts up 30/8/5/2+/1+ on nearly 50% shooting in '09 with a team that compares to T-Mac's supporting cast in '03, and takes them to 43 wins and nearly an upset of Atlanta in the 1st round.

And despite all this, I don't see many talking about Wade here. Everything with the Heat is LeBron this, LeBron that. And can't forget about Kobe. But back in '09, Wade was playing some unreal basketball and to me, he was the MVP. You take Wade off that team, I don't even think they win 20 games.

Keep acting like Shaq wasn't a 20 / 9.2 / 2 ast / 2 blk regular season and 18.5 / 10 / 2 ast / 2 blk playoff performer when he was 'dragged' by Wade.

[LAZERUSS]

I have Dream 7th, Shaq 9th.

Just curious...how in the hell do you have Hakeem ranked over Shaq when...

Shaq won as many MVPs, was voted much higher in the MVP voting his entire career, won more FMVPs, was more dominant in both the regular season and post-season (particularly his Finals), led teams to more rings, led teams to better regular season records, and...just crushed Hakeem in their regular season AND post-season H2H games?

[ProfessorMurder]

I'm on my phone but the likes of mutumbo, Duncan, Hakeem turned their teams into top defensive teams as soon as they got drafted.

KG had the stats, but the fact is he only anchored a top defense once in his prime and couldn't win a ring until he got together with Pierce and Allen.

To whoever said KG was the first option on those Celtics teams, lmfao. He was the most valuable yes, he should've won FMVP. But he wasn't the first option. Whenever the C's had trouble scoring they went to pierce, whenever they needed a bucket down the stretch they went to pierce.

Really? Duncan and Hakeem had much better teams in their early years. Sampson and David Robinson? Two imposing 7 footers as teammates with 2 other imposing 7 footers... KG had Gugliotta and a shitty Laettner.

Mutombo was a great defensive presence, but never really had to carry an offense. Mutombo's team improved every year, but they were actually building a team then. He did support the offense a bit in his first couple of years, but KG had to play both sides much more.

The Timberwolves improved every year in KG's first three years, then the franchise was set back with Starbury and Joe Smith. You can't anchor an incredible defense without solid teammates.

Duncan literally fell into a team with an aging superstar and championship level role players.




Season before arrival - 17th/23 in drtg - Sampson (rookie), Ehlo, Elvin Hayes (15th year) - 29 wins

1st season - 4th/23 drtg - Ehlo, Hollins, Sampson, Hakeem - 48 wins, 1st round

2nd season - 14th/23 drtg - Ehlo, Sampson, Hakeem - 51 wins, finals

3rd season - 3rd/23 - Maxwell, Hakeem, Sampson - 42 wins, 2nd round





Season before arrival - 29th/29 drtg - Robinson (out season), Avery, Del Negro, Vernon Maxwell, Nique (old), Perdue, Elliott - 20 wins

1st season - 2nd/29 in drtg - Duncan, Robinson, Avery, Del Negro, Perdue, Person, Elliott, Malik Rose - 56 wins, 2nd round

2nd season - 1st/29 in drtg - Duncan, Robinson, Elie, Elliott, Avery, Perdue, Malik - adjusted 61 wins, championship

3rd season - 2nd/29 in drtg - Duncan, Elie, Elliott, Avery, Kersey, Porter, Robinson, Malik - 53 wins, 1st round




Season before arrival - 27th/27 in drtg - Mahmoud, Anthony Mason (rookie), Woolridge (washed up) - 20 wins

1st season - 13th in drtg - Mahmoud, Mutombo - 24 wins

2nd season - 8th in drtg - Mahmoud, Laphonso, Mutombo, Pack, Stith - 36 wins

3rd season - 5th in drtg - Mahmoud, Bison Dele, LaPhonso, Mutombo, Pack, Stith, Rodney Rogers - 42 wins, 2nd round




Season before arrival - 26th/27 in drtg - Gugliotta, Laettner, Donyell Marshall, Isaiah Rider - 21 wins

1st season - 20th/29 in drtg - Gugliotta, Laettner, Sam Mitchell, Terry Porter, Isaiah Rider, KG - 26 wins

2nd season - 15th/29 in drtg - KG, Gugliotta, Marbury, Mitchell, Porter - 40 wins

3rd season - 23rd/29 in drtg - KG, Gugliotta, Marbury, Mitchell, Peeler, Porter - 45 wins, 1st round

[JellyBean]

KG

[Jacks3]

Peak Wade was as good as Kobe ever was.
Ok, but that doesn't make him GOAT level.

[D.J.]

Keep acting like Shaq wasn't a 20 / 9.2 / 2 ast / 2 blk regular season and 18.5 / 10 / 2 ast / 2 blk playoff performer when he was 'dragged' by Wade.


You mean the same Shaq who missed 23 games during the regular season? You mean the same Shaq who didn't score more than 18 points in any of the Finals games? Who BTW scored 5 points in game 2 and also 9 points in the clinching game. Funny how you pick out that part of the post, but ignore the rest of it.

[STATUTORY]

:roll: @ the notion that wade is anything close to being underrated

[Jacks3]

They went 11-12 in the games Shaq missed.

In a pathetic conference.

Refs were the only ones "carrying" the 06 Heat.

[miles berg]

KG & Wade are overrated here, big time.

None of these guys are close to being underrated here, Hakeem is top 10 and is treated like its 90% of the posters.

[ProfessorMurder]

You mean the same Shaq who missed 23 games during the regular season? You mean the same Shaq who didn't score more than 18 points in any of the Finals games? Who BTW scored 5 points in game 2 and also 9 points in the clinching game. Funny how you pick out that part of the post, but ignore the rest of it.

The same Shaq who had 21.5/10.5 in the ECF against Detroit :rolleyes:

[Smook A.]

http://i.imgur.com/hTjQx.gif

[Rubio2Gasol]

Wade :roll: One great playoffs (in which ref help was pretty much the crux of his performace) and one great season. Blame injuries, whatever, he's not in that category.

I'm the biggest Hakeem fan there is, but until a couple months ago, he was a tad overrated. His peak is still pretty much the best I've ever seen a dude play both ends. He didn't always have the help, he did some amazing things, beating the lakers that 2nd year, but at the end, I don't know if two chips is enough.

KG I have sympathy for, he played for pretty much the gutter team of the NBA. I mean no help. None. With the Celtics the dude did some great things waaay past his prime. If San Antonio drafts him instead of Duncan, he'd be the consensus best PF of all time.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

I rank Wade higher than KG all-time. Dude had some issues with injuries, as did many people.

KG is a beast, too... but Wade was on GOAT level for a couple years. That's why I'm always gonna say Dirk is a beast... dudes only need to really do one amazing thing to impress me. KG never did anything on the level of Wade in 06. Wade in 05, too, really.

I dunno why sports fans wanna say shit like THAT WAS A FLUKE. LONGEVITY DOE... nah. I mean, it has its place, but going apeshit for a short span is something I hold in higher regard than years upon years of all-nba level play.

Hakeem got on that ogod video game level, too. So, really, of the ones listed the only one that didn't was KG.

I'm going with Wade tho because a lot of ISH people have Hakeem in their top 10. I bet most people don't have Wade in their top 15. But to me... what makes Kobe better than Wade? Wade is on that level, altho he's a different player.

-Smak
Wade was never close to 03 or 04 KG:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[Round Mound]

Hakeem: GOAT CF/FC

[Deuce Bigalow]

Lost to the 7th seed without another top 5-10 player :roll:
2011 - 8th seed
2009 - 6th seed

[Artillery]

2011 - 8th seed
2009 - 6th seed

2005 - Kobe misses the playoffs in his prime.

[Deuce Bigalow]

2005 - Kobe misses the playoffs in his prime.
Did he have a team that was the 1st or 3rd seed losing in the first round? No