Tim Duncan has more 50 Win Seasons than most NBA Franchises [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:07 AM

In what way can Duncan's career be argued as better than Shaq's? Even Wilt's? Especially Bird's?

He was never as good as those guys were at their best.

Shaq: 4 rings, 3 Finals MVPs, 1 regular season MVP, 14 All-NBA teams, 3 All-Defensive teams, played with Penny, Kobe and Wade.

Duncan: 4 rings, 3 Finals MVPs, 2 regular season MVPs, 14 All-NBA teams, 14 All-Defensive teams, played with aging Robinson, Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili. Oh, and the system.

Shaq had the superior peak obviously. But that doesn't offset the rest.

Keno

04-03-2014, 02:08 AM

RichieW

04-03-2014, 02:08 AM

In what way can Duncan's career be argued as better than Shaq's? Even Wilt's? Especially Bird's?

He was never as good as those guys were at their best.

In terms of longevity, Duncan is only second to Kareem. All-NBA first team and All-Defensive 16 years apart with a whole lot in between.

If you're talking career, consistent excellence is just as important as peak IMO, and Timmys peak was pretty damn good too.

RichieW

04-03-2014, 02:11 AM

moe94

04-03-2014, 02:12 AM

In what way can Duncan's career be argued as better than Shaq's? Even Wilt's? Especially Bird's?

He was never as good as those guys were at their best.

You're underrating Duncan's body of work.

The-Legend-24

04-03-2014, 02:12 AM

http://www.ngngsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/gregg-popovich.jpg
:applause:

Lets remember the dude was a role player for a number of years, and they were still winning 50+. :oldlol:

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:14 AM

wanna know the most interesting thing about this stat? the only non-fifty win season was in a lockout season with only fifty games that year(1998-1999). they were on pace to pass fifty wins that season too. the best and most consistent player of the 2000 decade.

If anything, we should give more credit to the coaching staff & the FO for building Playoff teams year in and year out & winning 50+ games every season since the 99 lockout (including the 66-game season in 2011-2012). Even though Duncan is nowhere near his prime self, the teams still keep winning at the same rate, and currently they're having their best regular season since ever. It's just the brilliance of coaching & team chemistry. There are no superstars on this roster, Parker was the only all-star this year. You have a bunch of role players playing their roles to perfection every single game. It's a joy to watch.

I'm never sold on the Spurs winning it all though because they have a great regular season like every year but they haven't won a title in 7 years. For all the great regular season success Duncan's had, the Spurs have never even made it to the Finals in 2 consecutive seasons. I think they have a great chance finally doing that this season though.

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:16 AM

:applause:

Lets remember the dude was a role player for a number of years, and they were still winning 50+. :oldlol:

Oh, and how many rings since that time?

You Lakers fans must be so bored

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:19 AM

You're underrating Duncan's body of work.

Which is? Having the worst TS% for any FMVP in league history? Missing the easiest layup of his life when it mattered the most & missing the tip-in attempt right there at the rim with no contest? Never making it to the Finals in consecutive years? Never winning back-to-back?

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:19 AM

Oh, and how many rings since that time?

You Lakers fans must be so bored

You won the title last season & they made you give it back in 28 seconds :oldlol:

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:23 AM

You won the title last season & they made you give it back in 28 seconds :oldlol:

Dude, why are you even in this thread? Do you hate Duncan so much for helping LeBron knock Kobe out of the top 10?

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:25 AM

Which is? Having the worst TS% for any FMVP in league history? Missing the easiest layup of his life when it mattered the most & missing the tip-in attempt right there at the rim with no contest? Never making it to the Finals in consecutive years? Never winning back-to-back?

-Winning with teams that only a few others in NBA history could

-Winning titles without other All-Stars (iir only Hakeem, Duncan and Dirk have done that in the past thirty-something years)

-Being the consummate teammate and leader.

If you're seriously asking what Duncan has done to be considered a great, you should be asking that question for almost every player in NBA history.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 02:25 AM

Jordan
Magic
Russell
Kareem
Duncan
Duncan: 0 scoring titles, 0 rebounding titles, 0 FG% titles
Wilt: 7 scoring titles, 11 rebounding titles, 9 FG% titles

And everyone knows I'm no Wilt fan, but Duncan just was never as dominant as the others.

tpols

04-03-2014, 02:27 AM

Oh, and how many rings since that time?

You Lakers fans must be so bored

What do rings have to do with 50 win seasons? Why should duncan get full credit for winning 50+ wins in years he was averaging 13/9?

They need duncan to play great in the playoffs to win sure.. but to win 50? Spurs could do it without him altogether if they wanted right now.

moe94

04-03-2014, 02:28 AM

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 02:29 AM

Dude, why are you even in this thread? Do you hate Duncan so much for helping LeBron knock Kobe out of the top 10?
:lol

Kobe is firmly ahead of Duncan bud and I can prove that as I have already many times with the majority's rankings. If anything, Lebron knocked Duncan out the top 10. Lebron is easily more dominant than Duncan was. He has literally like 8 seasons better than Duncan's best if you compare the numbers and he's in year 10 :oldlol:

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:31 AM

By all means, can we get Kobe's Finals stats if we're going down this path? Best to lay it all out there, right? :banana:

Only player since MJ to average 30+ ppg 5+ rpg 7+ apg in a Finals series, you mad?

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:32 AM

Duncan: 0 scoring titles, 0 rebounding titles, 0 FG% titles
Wilt: 7 scoring titles, 11 rebounding titles, 9 FG% titles

And everyone knows I'm no Wilt fan, but Duncan just was never as dominant as the others.

Your way of judging players is so arbitrary.

You ever compare Duncan to Kobe and you get the "Boiled down." However, on your all-time list you have Hakeem and Wilt, who each won two titles, ahead of Duncan.

Then when you try to compare, say, Hondo and Kobe, using your boiled down system, you can't, because Hondo never won an MVP. Surely then Kobe's rings before he won an MVP ('08) shouldn't count, because he didn't prove he was the most valuable player in the league up until that point?

And now you're talking about leading the league in statistical categories. Your agenda is so obvious.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:32 AM

RichieW

04-03-2014, 02:33 AM

Duncan: 0 scoring titles, 0 rebounding titles, 0 FG% titles
Wilt: 7 scoring titles, 11 rebounding titles, 9 FG% titles

And everyone knows I'm no Wilt fan, but Duncan just was never as dominant as the others.

Im not a hater on Wilt or Russell by any means, but the game was so different you can't compare their stats to modern players.

I believe Russell and Wilt would be successful in any era, but trying to compare them to modern players is a fools errand.

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:35 AM

:lol

Kobe is firmly ahead of Duncan bud and I can prove that as I have already many times with the majority's rankings. If anything, Lebron knocked Duncan out the top 10. Lebron is easily more dominant than Duncan was. He has literally like 8 seasons better than Duncan's best if you compare the numbers and he's in year 10 :oldlol:

Yeah, Duncan totally didn't carry his All-Star-less team to a title in '03. No dominance in that :facepalm

Again, this is more proof of how arbitrary your way of judging players is. Your whole "Choke rating" relies on how badly a player's production dips from the Regular Season to the Post-season, then to the Finals. Now when we talk about "Dominance!" only the Regular Season applies.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:37 AM

Im not a hater on Wilt or Russell by any means, but the game was so different you can't compare their stats to modern players.

I believe Russell and Wilt would be successful in any era, but trying to compare them to modern players is a fools errand.

Bill & Wilt were the most dominant players of their era, just like Magic & Bird dominated theirs, or like MJ & Hakeem dominated theirs, or like Kobe & Shaq dominated their era.

You can't compare the statistics, obviously, because the game is played differently.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:37 AM

Yeah, Duncan totally didn't carry his All-Star-less team to a title in '03. No dominance in that :facepalm

Again, this is more proof of how arbitrary your way of judging players is. Your whole "Choke rating" relies on how badly a player's production dips from the Regular Season to the Post-season, then to the Finals. Now when we talk about "Dominance!" only the Regular Season applies.

You're underrating the 2003 Spurs team.

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:40 AM

You're underrating the 2003 Spurs team.

Again, I'll post the numbers and you won't reply, as you always have.

3% of the GMs predicted them to win it all, and Duncan had to work with David Robinson's carcass, sophomore Tony Parker, rookie Manu Ginobili, and Stephen Jackson.

Only Duncan and Hakeem could exhibit the dominance needed on both ends of the floor to win with that team. You'd know that if you watched that run :confusedshrug:

tpols

04-03-2014, 02:43 AM

You're underrating the 2003 Spurs team.

Its not that the help wasnt that good, its more the competition.

Only one team in the past 40 or so years has made 4 finals in a row.. and the Lakers were coming off 3 straight already. The spurs had HCA and won 60 games to LA's 50... And then they played an injured Mavs team and a Nets team that was no more stacked than themselves.

Its like when Dallas beat LA in 2011. The team was burnt out.

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:45 AM

What do rings have to do with 50 win seasons? Why should duncan get full credit for winning 50+ wins in years he was averaging 13/9?

They need duncan to play great in the playoffs to win sure.. but to win 50? Spurs could do it without him altogether if they wanted right now.

I definitely agree with you. I'm not saying Duncan deserves more credit than Pop or the staff for what they've been able to do in the Regular Season the past 7 years.

However, like DMAVS once said, the "System" doesn't translate so well into the post-season, which you alluded to in your post.

RichieW

04-03-2014, 02:50 AM

Bill & Wilt were the most dominant players of their era, just like Magic & Bird dominated theirs, or like MJ & Hakeem dominated theirs, or like Kobe & Shaq dominated their era.

You can't compare the statistics, obviously, because the game is played differently.

You're gonna think I'm trolling you but I'm not when I tell you Kobe never had his own 'era'.

There as Wilt/Russell, then Magic/Bird, then MJ, then Shaq/Duncan, and now possibly Lebron but we'll see.

I fel Kobe had an 'inbetween' era like the Bad Boy Pistons and Hakeems Rockets. I mean you can include Kobe in with Shaq/Duncan but it's quite clear that peak Shaq was the driving force for those titles, a lot of guards could have 3-peated with Shaq

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 02:51 AM

Please, Deuce, boil it down for him.
Kobe: 5
Duncan: 4

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:51 AM

Again, I'll post the numbers and you won't reply, as you always have.

3% of the GMs predicted them to win it all, and Duncan had to work with David Robinson's carcass, sophomore Tony Parker, rookie Manu Ginobili, and Stephen Jackson.

Only Duncan and Hakeem could exhibit the dominance needed on both ends of the floor to win with that team. You'd know that if you watched that run :confusedshrug:

Who cares about GMs? Is that your only argument? Spurs were the #1 seed & faced a tired Lakers squad in midst of turmoil, an injured Mavs team & a shitty Nets team that Shaq & Kobe had career games against in the 2002 Finals. The competition was hardly that great for SA when you consider they had HCA throughout the Playoffs & faced teams that weren't that great to begin with.

Spurs were no underdogs that year, they were tied for the best record in the league while the Lakers were a 5th seed & could barely crack 50 wins that season. The overall talent on that team might have not been THAT great, but they had the legs & the chemistry for it while other teams didn't. Duncan had his best season no doubt, but let's not act like he went up against some of the greatest teams ever.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 02:54 AM

I definitely agree with you. I'm not saying Duncan deserves more credit than Pop or the staff for what they've been able to do in the Regular Season the past 7 years.

However, like DMAVS once said, the "System" doesn't translate so well into the post-season, which you alluded to in your post.
A lot of guards could have 3peated with Shaq, that's why Shaq won a multitude of rings his first 7 years before Kobe was 21.

Btw, mind posting Shaq and Kobe's stats vs the spurs in the playoffs, mainly 2001 and 2002 since they won titles those years.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 02:58 AM

You're gonna think I'm trolling you but I'm not when I tell you Kobe never had his own 'era'.

There as Wilt/Russell, then Magic/Bird, then MJ, then Shaq/Duncan, and now possibly Lebron but we'll see.

I fel Kobe had an 'inbetween' era like the Bad Boy Pistons and Hakeems Rockets. I mean you can include Kobe in with Shaq/Duncan but it's quite clear that peak Shaq was the driving force for those titles, a lot of guards could have 3-peated with Shaq

Lakers would be outed in the WCF without Kobe in 2000, they would lose Game 4 of the Finals in OT with Shaq fouled out if it weren't for Kobe, they'd lose to the Kings in 2002 without Kobe.

Are you kidding me? How many guards could actually do what Kobe did during the three-peat? 2000 WCF Game 7, Kobe leads Lakers in 4 catergories (Scoring, rebounds, assists, blocks) to bring the team back from a double digit deficit in the 4th quarter with his key plays (the most notable play of the Playoffs that year was Kobe crossing Scottie & lobbing it to Shaq to seal the series.)

2001 Playoff run, Kobe was the best player on the team for 3 out of the 4 series, had b2b 45+ point 10+ reb 3+ast games, had the same WS/48 as Shaq, was a better road performer than Shaq in the Playoffs, locked down the opposing perimeter players. 2002 Finals one of the most dominant series by any wing player (27 6 5 on 51/55/81 shooting). You are kidding me if "most" wing players would 3-peat with Shaq.

Big#50

04-03-2014, 02:58 AM

Duncan was never a stat whore. He did what it took to win. His level of play usually elevated in gut check games. Shaq/Duncan are the GOAT.

jstern

04-03-2014, 02:59 AM

Was the one he missed the 1998-99 where the season was 50 games long?

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 02:59 AM

Who cares about GMs? Is that your only argument? Spurs were the #1 seed & faced a tired Lakers squad in midst of turmoil, an injured Mavs team & a shitty Nets team that Shaq & Kobe had career games against in the 2002 Finals. The competition was hardly that great for SA when you consider they had HCA throughout the Playoffs & faced teams that weren't that great to begin with.

Spurs were no underdogs that year, they were tied for the best record in the league while the Lakers were a 5th seed & could barely crack 50 wins that season. The overall talent on that team might have not been THAT great, but they had the legs & the chemistry for it while other teams didn't. Duncan had his best season no doubt, but let's not act like he went up against some of the greatest teams ever.

The GM thing is proof that Duncan exceeded the expectations. I'll try and find some other sources, but there weren't any/many analysts predicting a good Spurs title run that year either, and people definitely didn't think the Spurs were championship worthy squad. :confusedshrug:

Sure, that Laker squad was having problems, but even a Laker squad with fatigue/chemistry issues still should have been able to beat that Spurs team. Even Rick Fox said that the Lakers loss to the Spurs in '03 was more about Duncan's dominance than it was the Shaq and Kobe feud.

The Mavs' only serious injury was Dirk. But even in the three games that he was there Duncan got the best of that team. Even without Dirk, that Mavs squad still should have had a chance to beat the Spurs, they just couldn't.

The Nets were the #1 rated defense in the league. There were an elite team. :confusedshrug:

Obviously Duncan didn't go up against all-time great teams (although a Shaq/Kobe team, regardless of personal problems, is always gonna be an incredible teams), but he didn't have an all-time great team either. Duncan simply dominated, on a level that only a couple of guys have (in terms of playing on both ends of the floor).

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:00 AM

Lakers would be outed in the WCF without Kobe in 2000, they would lose Game 4 of the Finals in OT with Shaq fouled out if it weren't for Kobe, they'd lose to the Kings in 2002 without Kobe.

Are you kidding me? How many guards could actually do what Kobe did during the three-peat? 2000 WCF Game 7, Kobe leads Lakers in 4 catergories (Scoring, rebounds, assists, blocks) to bring the team back from a double digit deficit in the 4th quarter with his key plays (the most notable play of the Playoffs that year was Kobe crossing Scottie & lobbing it to Shaq to seal the series.)

2001 Playoff run, Kobe was the best player on the team for 3 out of the 4 series, had b2b 45+ point 10+ reb 3+ast games, had the same WS/48 as Shaq, was a better road performer than Shaq in the Playoffs, locked down the opposing perimeter players. 2002 Finals one of the most dominant series by any wing player. You are kidding me if "most" wing players would 3-peat with Shaq.
Kobe was amazing. Shaq>Kobe still.
Shaq/Duncan
MJ
KAJ
Bird
Kobe
Lebron
Magic
Russell/Wilt

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:00 AM

Was the one he missed the 1998-99 where the season was 50 games long?

Yes, and there were on pace for a 60 win season

DMAVS41

04-03-2014, 03:01 AM

The GM thing is proof that Duncan exceeded the expectations. I'll try and find some other sources, but there weren't any/many analysts predicting a good Spurs title run that year either, and people definitely didn't think the Spurs were championship worthy squad. :confusedshrug:

Sure, that Laker squad was having problems, but even a Laker squad with fatigue/chemistry issues still should have been able to beat that Spurs team. Even Rick Fox said that the Lakers loss to the Spurs in '03 was more about Duncan's dominance than it was the Shaq and Kobe feud.

The Mavs' only serious injury was Dirk. But even in the three games that he was there Duncan got the best of that team. Even without Dirk, that Mavs squad still should have had a chance to beat the Spurs, they just couldn't.

The Nets were the #1 rated defense in the league. There were an elite team. :confusedshrug:

Obviously Duncan didn't go up against all-time great teams (although a Shaq/Kobe team, regardless of personal problems, is always gonna be an incredible teams), but he didn't have an all-time great team either. Duncan simply dominated, on a level that only a couple of guys have (in terms of playing on both ends of the floor).

I'm on your side, but it is absurd to say the Mavs had a chance after Dirk went down

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:03 AM

Kobe was amazing. Shaq>Kobe still.
Shaq/Duncan
MJ
KAJ
Bird
Kobe
Lebron
Magic
Russell/Wilt

Shaq > Kobe? :oldlol:

Kobe won 2 without Shaq with 2 FMVPs & 3 straight Finals, Shaq was merely a sidekick for his only ring without Kobe & failed to win more despite playing with Penny & Grant, Wade, Lebron, Nash, Amare, Rondo, KG, Allen, Pierce :oldlol:

jstern

04-03-2014, 03:06 AM

Wow, a positive thread about Duncan, and for some reason I didn't expect for the Kobe stans to come on to put him down. Agenda so annoying.

rmt

04-03-2014, 03:07 AM

:bowdown:

You could also say the same thing about Tony Parker and Manu too

No you can't - Parker has only played 13 full seasons and Manu 12.

Kobe fans bored with nothing to do but criticize Duncan, but the fact is that the Spurs have won at least 61% (equivalent of a 50 win season) or greater each season with Duncan - that's 17 years in a row.

Another fact - Duncan has won 4 rings without an all-nba team mate. They haven't won since Duncan's decline. Spurs are very well-rounded this year - we'll see if that's enough to win it all.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:07 AM

The GM thing is proof that Duncan exceeded the expectations. I'll try and find some other sources, but there weren't any/many analysts predicting a good Spurs title run that year either, and people definitely didn't think the Spurs were championship worthy squad. :confusedshrug:

Sure, that Laker squad was having problems, but even a Laker squad with fatigue/chemistry issues still should have been able to beat that Spurs team. Even Rick Fox said that the Lakers loss to the Spurs in '03 was more about Duncan's dominance than it was the Shaq and Kobe feud.

The Mavs' only serious injury was Dirk. But even in the three games that he was there Duncan got the best of that team. Even without Dirk, that Mavs squad still should have had a chance to beat the Spurs, they just couldn't.

The Nets were the #1 rated defense in the league. There were an elite team. :confusedshrug:

Obviously Duncan didn't go up against all-time great teams (although a Shaq/Kobe team, regardless of personal problems, is always gonna be an incredible teams), but he didn't have an all-time great team either. Duncan simply dominated, on a level that only a couple of guys have (in terms of playing on both ends of the floor).

"only" lost Dirk, as if Dirk wasn't their best player by far
Oh, the same Nets team Shaq & Kobe both had their most efficient series against with Shaq putting up damn near 40/20 every game & Kobe averaging 27 6 5 on 51/55/81 shooting? Damn, the Nets were really a defensive juggernaut.

The Nets team was a damn joke as was the Eastern Conference. Their best player was Jason Kidd, Jason Collins was a starter for crying out loud. Duncan went up against the tough front court of Kenyon Martin, Jason Collins & Richard Jefferson :bowdown:

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:07 AM

I'm on your side, but it is absurd to say the Mavs had a chance after Dirk went down

Yeah, I overstated that one. I simply meant on raw talent alone (I always thought Michael Finley was incredible, and Van Exel had the ability to take over a series, although a lot of the time he would shoot himself out of one). But obviously without Dirk running the offense it was a real uphill struggle for that team.

I'm assuming you watched the Mavs back then. Did you think there had serious title hopes (obviously if Dirk doesn't go down)?

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:09 AM

"only" lost Dirk, as if Dirk wasn't their best player by far
Oh, the same Nets team Shaq & Kobe both had their most efficient series against with Shaq putting up damn near 40/20 every game & Kobe averaging 27 6 5 on 51/55/81 shooting? Damn, the Nets were really a defensive juggernaut.

The Nets team was a damn joke as was the Eastern Conference. Their best player was Jason Kidd, Jason Collins was a starter for crying out loud. Duncan went up against the tough front court of Kenyon Martin, Jason Collins & Richard Jefferson :bowdown:

Kenyon Martin was one of the best defensive bigs. Just sayin'

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 03:11 AM

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:12 AM

No you can't - Parker has only played 13 full seasons and Manu 12.

Kobe fans bored with nothing to do but criticize Duncan, but the fact is that the Spurs have won at least 61% (equivalent of a 50 win season) or greater each season with Duncan - that's 17 years in a row.

Another fact - Duncan has won 4 rings without an all-nba team mate. They haven't won since Duncan's decline. Spurs are very well-rounded this year - we'll see if that's enough to win it all.

I'm not criticizing Duncan, I have the upmost respect for him. It's just the blind Duncan "stans" that are annoying and the Kobe haters that are trying to lift Duncan to heights never seen before to downplay Kobe. The Spurs are all about the system. Maybe Kobe would win 50 games every year too if he had Phil every year & a competent FO that would not trade away our draft picks for 1-year rentals. Duncan is just very lucky to be in San Antonio, surrounded by the best coaches and scouts, who put the teams together. Duncan is also very lucky to never have suffered a major injury. It is what it is.

All in all, the regular season success matters little when the most consistent franchise can't win consistently in the Playoffs. It seems like their regular season success hardly translates into post-season success because they never even went to 2 straight Finals.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:14 AM

Kenyon Martin was one of the best defensive bigs. Just sayin'

Please. Shaq & Duncan both had career games against him.

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:15 AM

Shaq > Kobe? :oldlol:

Kobe won 2 without Shaq with 2 FMVPs & 3 straight Finals, Shaq was merely a sidekick for his only ring without Kobe & failed to win more despite playing with Penny & Grant, Wade, Lebron, Nash, Amare, Rondo, KG, Allen, Pierce :oldlol:
Shaq>Kobe

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:16 AM

They did win it all last year despite Duncan's decline. They just handed the trophy to Miami.

Duncan was the best Spur in that series. Don't act like he was putting up 13/9 in the Finals.

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:17 AM

I'm not criticizing Duncan, I have the upmost respect for him. It's just the blind Duncan "stans" that are annoying and the Kobe haters that are trying to lift Duncan to heights never seen before to downplay Kobe. The Spurs are all about the system. Maybe Kobe would win 50 games every year too if he had Phil every year & a competent FO that would not trade away our draft picks for 1-year rentals. Duncan is just very lucky to be in San Antonio, surrounded by the best coaches and scouts, who put the teams together. Duncan is also very lucky to never have suffered a major injury. It is what it is.

All in all, the regular season success matters little when the most consistent franchise can't win consistently in the Playoffs. It seems like their regular season success hardly translates into post-season success because they never even went to 2 straight Finals.
Kobe just doesn't have the impact a great big has. Only perimeter player that can say that is MJ.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 03:20 AM

A lot of guards could have 3peated with Shaq, that's why Shaq won a multitude of rings his first 7 years before Kobe was 21.

Btw, mind posting Shaq and Kobe's stats vs the spurs in the playoffs, mainly 2001 and 2002 since they won titles those years.
I guess that guy didn't want to post them but here they are.

2001 WCF vs Spurs
Shaq: 27 PPG, 13 RPG, 2.5 APG, 0.75 SPG, 1.25 BPG, 54.1%FG, 54.7%TS
Kobe: 33.3 PPG, 7 RPG, 7 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.75 BPG, 51.4%FG, 57.1%TS

2002 WCSF vs Spurs
Shaq: 21.4 PPG, 12.2 RPG, 3.2 APG, 0.6 SPG, 3.0 BPG, 44.7%FG, 48.7%TS
Kobe: 26.2 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 4.8 APG, 1.0 SPG, 0.2 BPG, 45.5%FG, 48.6%TS

Kobe was the Spur killer.

rmt

04-03-2014, 03:22 AM

I'm not criticizing Duncan, I have the upmost respect for him. It's just the blind Duncan "stans" that are annoying and the Kobe haters that are trying to lift Duncan to heights never seen before to downplay Kobe. The Spurs are all about the system. Maybe Kobe would win 50 games every year too if he had Phil every year & a competent FO that would not trade away our draft picks for 1-year rentals. Duncan is just very lucky to be in San Antonio, surrounded by the best coaches and scouts, who put the teams together. Duncan is also very lucky to never have suffered a major injury. It is what it is.

All in all, the regular season success matters little when the most consistent franchise can't win consistently in the Playoffs. It seems like their regular season success hardly translates into post-season success because they never even went to 2 straight Finals.

You don't call a knee injury that locks him down for the playoffs and results in knee surgery a major injury?

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:23 AM

Kobe just doesn't have the impact a great big has. Only perimeter player that can say that is MJ.

Hmm, Kobe doesn't have the impact that a great big has, yet he has more rings than Shaq & Duncan. Weird, isn't it? Ok. Kobe doesn't have the impact of a Shaq or a Duncan, but he's better at winning. I'll take the winning over the impact.

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:24 AM

I guess that guy didn't want to post them but here they are.

2001 WCF vs Spurs
Shaq: 27 PPG, 13 RPG, 2.5 APG, 0.75 SPG, 1.25 BPG, 54.1%FG, 54.7%TS
Kobe: 33.3 PPG, 7 RPG, 7 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.75 BPG, 51.4%FG, 57.1%TS

2002 WCSF vs Spurs
Shaq: 21.4 PPG, 12.2 RPG, 3.2 APG, 0.6 SPG, 3.0 BPG, 44.7%FG, 48.7%TS
Kobe: 26.2 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 4.8 APG, 1.0 SPG, 0.2 BPG, 45.5%FG, 48.6%TS

Kobe was the Spur killer.
Spurs had nobody to guard Kobe. Duncan/DROB are better defenders than what they had on the perimeter.

The-Legend-24

04-03-2014, 03:24 AM

Duncan actually only has 3 rings, lockout wins don't count.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:24 AM

You don't call a knee injury that locks him down for the playoffs and results in knee surgery a major injury?

One small bump on the road compared to Kobe having one of the most dominant series ever & leading the Lakers to a championship on one leg after he had a similar knee injury.

ImKobe

04-03-2014, 03:28 AM

Spurs had nobody to guard Kobe. Duncan/DROB are better defenders than what they had on the perimeter.

Bowen in 2002? Kobe having a 4 - 2 all-time record against the Spurs in the POs? Re-watch the 2008 WCF, look how Kobe didn't give a fk and scored half of his points on Duncan in the paint while Timmy couldn't do anything to stop him. How about Kobe scoring over the twin towers in the 2001 Playoffs like it was nothing.

Duncan could never guard Kobe inside.

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:28 AM

Duncan actually only has 3 rings, lockout wins don't count.

And rigged ones do?

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:29 AM

Hmm, Kobe doesn't have the impact that a great big has, yet he has more rings than Shaq & Duncan. Weird, isn't it? Ok. Kobe doesn't have the impact of a Shaq or a Duncan, but he's better at winning. I'll take the winning over the impact.
Shaq and that front court of Gasol/Odom/Bynum. Without them Kobe wins nothing. Duncan and Shaq won rings with role players.

The-Legend-24

04-03-2014, 03:31 AM

And rigged ones do?
Lakers won fair and square. :confusedshrug:

No lockout needed.

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:31 AM

Bowen in 2002? Kobe having a 4 - 2 all-time record against the Spurs in the POs? Re-watch the 2008 WCF, look how Kobe didn't give a fk and scored half of his points on Duncan in the paint while Timmy couldn't do anything to stop him. How about Kobe scoring over the twin towers in the 2001 Playoffs like it was nothing.

Duncan could never guard Kobe inside.
I was speaking of the monster numbers in 01.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 03:32 AM

Shaq and that front court of Gasol/Odom/Bynum. Without them Kobe wins nothing. Duncan and Shaq won rings with role players.
Kobe was a role player? 06 Wade was a role player?

Manu who was the best player in the 05 finals and should have been finals mvp was just a role player? 07 finals mvp Parker was a role player?

T_L_P

04-03-2014, 03:33 AM

Lakers won fair and square. :confusedshrug:

No lockout needed.

Surely then it's a knock on Shaq/Kobe/Lakers that they couldn't win in a much easier, lockout season?

aboss4real24

04-03-2014, 03:34 AM

KG>TD

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:36 AM

Kobe was a role player? 06 Wade was a role player?

Manu who was the best player in the 05 finals and should have been finals mvp was just a role player? 07 finals mvp Parker was a role player?
Kobe was a role player for the first ring.
Duncan won in 03 with role players.

tpols

04-03-2014, 03:37 AM

Shaq and that front court of Gasol/Odom/Bynum. Without them Kobe wins nothing. Duncan and Shaq won rings with role players.

This is absolutely ridiculous... especially for shaq. Wade and Kobe role players:oldlol:

even in 2000.. a 2nd team all nba first team all nba defense.. just a role player.

swagga

04-03-2014, 03:38 AM

We all know you mad that duncan was and still is better than kobe you dick s

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:42 AM

This is absolutely ridiculous... especially for shaq. Wade and Kobe role players:oldlol:

even in 2000.. a 2nd team all nba first team all nba defense.. just a role player.
All I remember was Shaq destroying the league that season. Kobe was in the backseat.

tpols

04-03-2014, 03:44 AM

All I remember was Shaq destroying the league that season. Kobe was in the backseat.

That doesnt mean he was a role player.. unless youre criteria for role player is someone worse.. which would make everyone in the league role players.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 03:44 AM

[QUOTE=swagga]We all know you mad that duncan was and still is better than kobe you dick s

Big#50

04-03-2014, 03:45 AM

That doesnt mean he was a role player.. unless youre criteria for role player is someone worse.. which would make everyone in the league role players.
Kobe was a role player that season. He played his role great.

Mr. Jabbar

04-03-2014, 03:47 AM

if im reading this correctly, dancan can take on at least 26 nba teams 1 on 5 and win

MMM

04-03-2014, 03:49 AM

Boiled down:

Kobe: 5
Duncan: 4

Why so mad?

Boiled down
4-5 .800
5-7 .714

bukowski81

04-03-2014, 04:16 AM

Much respect to Kobe, one of the greatest ever.

But Kobe stans so mad that most educated fans know that Duncan>Kobe. They feel the need to highjack any thread that says something good about Duncan.

Their comments on this thread are both hilarious and retarded.

dunksby

04-03-2014, 04:53 AM

Such a shame Kobe stans ruined this thread. Anyway Duncan is great and his career speaks for itself, so good to see such longevity in an elite big man.

retaxis

04-03-2014, 07:23 AM

Duncan is a real winner

Kobe on the other hand between r4ping defenseless women and crying about being traded to a winning team and missing the playoffs...Geez real hard to choose here.

Honestly Give me Vince Carter before Kobe. I have no Doubt Vince can win with Shaq and Pau/Odom/Bynum line ups as well as Phil.

NumberSix

04-03-2014, 07:36 AM

How is that even possible if he played through 2 LO seasons?

The_Yearning

04-03-2014, 07:40 AM

Boiled down
4-5 .800
5-7 .714

:kobe:

DMV2

04-03-2014, 07:55 AM

Boiled down:
Duncan 4 rings/3 FMVP in 13 years as alpha dawg, 4 years as co-alpha

Kobe 3 rings in 8 season as sidekick, 2 rings/2FMVP 8 seasons as alpha, 1 season as a gimp benchwarmer

Andrei89

04-03-2014, 09:03 AM

Tim Duncan > Kirby

Anybody who has any knowledge of the game of basketball should know this.

JohnFreeman

04-03-2014, 09:09 AM

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/assets/3927087/duncan_bank.gif

Uncle Drew

04-03-2014, 09:17 AM

http://www.sporcle.com/games/brulesrules/nba-more-playoff-wins---duncan-or-franchise

Jlamb47

04-03-2014, 09:23 AM

Yal be trippin. Duncan and Kobe the two greatest of these past generation along with Shaq.

ninephive

04-03-2014, 10:45 AM

How is that even possible if he played through 2 LO seasons?
Exactly :bowdown:

HOoopCityJones

04-03-2014, 11:32 AM

Yal be trippin. Duncan and Kobe the two greatest of these past generation along with Shaq.

This.

Boiled down Shaq-Kobe-Duncan are the only ones who were winning in the previous Era. KG and Dirk to a lesser extent.

Haters can suck a nut.

rmt

04-03-2014, 02:16 PM

How is that even possible if he played through 2 LO seasons?

1998-99 37-13 (74% - equivalent to a 61 win season)
2011-12 50-16 (75.8% - equivalent to a 62 win season)

If you extrapolate the 98-99 season, it's been 17 consecutive years.

inclinerator

04-03-2014, 02:21 PM

tim ducan is great but pop is a probably the goat coach

MMM

04-03-2014, 05:17 PM

NustABut

04-03-2014, 05:19 PM

tim ducan is great but pop is a probably the goat coach

+1

Guys teams stands a chance against any team, even without their top players. :wtf:

Thats when you know the system works :rockon:

Legends66NBA7

04-03-2014, 06:40 PM

More playoff wins than 21 of 29 teams
:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

Only
Celtics
Lakers
Pistons
Bulls
Suns
Bucks
Sonics
And Rockets have more Playoff wins I believe.

If not Rockets then maybe Blazers

Hawks. 45 (going to be 46) years can scrap along a lot of playoff wins for a team that has still never won 2 rounds in 1 playoff year.

Lakers - 440
Celtics - 344
Sixers - 217
Pistons - 188
Knicks - 185
Bulls - 177
Hawks - 140
Thunder/Sonics - 136
Suns - 133

Tim Duncan - 130

Rockets - 118
Jazz - 114
Warriors - 110
Bucks - 104
Heat - 99
Blazers - 97
Pacers - 94
Nets - 92
Mavericks - 86
Wizards - 77
Kings - 76
Cavaliers - 70
Nuggets - 61
Magic - 57
Pelicans/Hornets - 35
Clippers - 26
Grizzlies - 18
Timberwolves - 17
Raptors - 11
Bobcats - 0

CelticBaller

04-03-2014, 06:41 PM

knicks and rockets :roll: :roll: :roll:

MMM

04-03-2014, 06:47 PM

Hawks. 45 (going to be 46) years can scrap along a lot of playoff wins for a team that has still never won 2 rounds in 1 playoff year.

Lakers - 440
Celtics - 344
Sixers - 217
Pistons - 188
Knicks - 185
Bulls - 177
Hawks - 140
Thunder/Sonics - 136
Suns - 133

Tim Duncan - 130

Rockets - 118
Jazz - 114
Warriors - 110
Bucks - 104
Heat - 99
Blazers - 97
Pacers - 94
Nets - 92
Mavericks - 86
Wizards - 77
Kings - 76
Cavaliers - 70
Nuggets - 61
Magic - 57
Pelicans/Hornets - 35
Clippers - 26
Grizzlies - 18
Timberwolves - 17
Raptors - 11
Bobcats - 0

Damn, looks like he'll pass some teams this season.

BTW does any other franchise have more then 4 Championship other than Boston, LA, and Chicago.

The-Legend-24

04-03-2014, 06:59 PM

Give Nick Young a coach like Pop and he does the same.

The Iron Sheik

04-03-2014, 07:04 PM

tim duncan is an all time great no question, but people always give him so much credit when he hasn't been the most important guy on his own team the last couple of regular seasons.

r0drig0lac

04-03-2014, 07:11 PM

tim duncan is an all time great no question, but people always give him so much credit when he hasn't been the most important guy on his own team the last couple of regular seasons.
1st team all nba after 37 years of age,
yes, he is still the anchor of this team

secund2nun

04-03-2014, 07:14 PM

PsychoBe

04-03-2014, 07:21 PM

:roll:

Kobe, Mr. prime first round loser, is nowhere compared to Duncan. Duncan now at his old age is easily better then prime Kobe ever was.

kobe won 5 championships in 10 years. was voted player of the decade (firmly ahead of duncan), more all defensive first teams, all-star appearances, etc.

Legends66NBA7

04-03-2014, 07:22 PM

knicks and rockets :roll: :roll: :roll:

:confusedshrug:

Damn, looks like he'll pass some teams this season.

BTW does any other franchise have more then 4 Championship other than Boston, LA, and Chicago.

No.

The Sixers, Pistons, Warriors, and Heat all have 3 titles. The Heat could potentially join the other 4 teams this season.

After that, the Knicks and Rockets have 2 titles. Followed by 7 teams with 1 title and 13 teams with 0 titles.

Fire Colangelo

04-03-2014, 07:25 PM

Fisher has more rings than most franchises, so does Horry.

so? :confusedshrug:

Dresta

04-03-2014, 07:40 PM

Wow, a positive thread about Duncan, and for some reason I didn't expect for the Kobe stans to come on to put him down. Agenda so annoying.
This.

Kobe stans out in full force again making another thread intolerable.

Legends66NBA7

04-03-2014, 07:49 PM

Fisher has more rings than most franchises, so does Horry.

so? :confusedshrug:

True, it is the politically correct thing to say.

When most do these type of things on numbers (usually a team stat/accomplishment for an individual), they are rewarding an all-time great player and not a role player known mostly for just making big shots.

MMM

04-03-2014, 07:55 PM

kobe won 5 championships in 10 years. was voted player of the decade (firmly ahead of duncan), more all defensive first teams, all-star appearances, etc.

Are you really using defensive teams to argue Kobe is better???

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Fire Colangelo

04-03-2014, 07:57 PM

True, it is the politically correct thing to say.

When most do these type of things on numbers (usually a team stat/accomplishment for an individual), they are rewarding an all-time great player and not a role player known mostly for just making big shots.

That's true, but I just think these "stats" are dumb since Pop + Manu and Parker were equally as important to the Spurs as Duncan was especially towards the end of the 2000s.

dazzer87

04-03-2014, 08:06 PM

Are you really using defensive teams to argue Kobe is better???

:roll: :roll: :roll:
And all-star appearances...........stupid ass KoMe stans......:roll:

rmt

04-03-2014, 08:12 PM

That's true, but I just think these "stats" are dumb since Pop + Manu and Parker were equally as important to the Spurs as Duncan was especially towards the end of the 2000s.

Parker and Manu weren't there for the beginning part of the "streak."

And exactly how many championships did they win towards the end of the 2000s. Yes, the Spurs after Duncan's decline win regular season games, but do they win championships? Can the Spurs with Parker as the main guy win a ring?

rmt

04-03-2014, 08:14 PM

kobe won 5 championships in 10 years. was voted player of the decade (firmly ahead of duncan), more all defensive first teams, all-star appearances, etc.

LOL

voted by the casual fans
some undeserved all-defensive 1st teams
all-star = popularity contest

Duncan - 4 rings as the man
Kobe - 2 rings as the man

AnaheimLakers24

04-03-2014, 09:37 PM

Playing basketball must suck for Timmy.

And they look like a lock to win this year. Stacked team, great coach, great bench and great team environment. Don't think OKC will stop them this year, and I'm not sure my Heat can either. Spurs probably have the better overall team, and they trump us in terms of coaching, and then there is also the age factor.
they arent stacked you homosexual

AnaheimLakers24

04-03-2014, 09:39 PM

LOL

voted by the casual fans
some undeserved all-defensive 1st teams
all-star = popularity contest

Duncan - 4 rings as the man
Kobe - 2 rings as the man
duncan with 3 going by your criteria

ThePhantomCreep

04-03-2014, 10:05 PM

Call me when Duncan gets his numbers back to Daugherty-esque levels. When was his last 20/10 season? Bush was still president, I know that much.

15/10 isn't worth of all the knob-polishing he's getting.

Deuce Bigalow

04-03-2014, 10:23 PM

LOL

voted by the casual fans
some undeserved all-defensive 1st teams
all-star = popularity contest

Duncan - 4 rings as the man
Kobe - 2 rings as the man
99 playoffs - 23/12/3/1/3 on 57%TS
03 playoffs - 25/15/5/1/3 on 58%TS
05 playoffs - 24/12/3/0/2 on 53%TS
07 playoffs - 22/12/3/1/3 on 56%TS

00 playoffs - 21/5/4/1/1 on 52%TS
01 playoffs - 29/7/6/2/1 on 56%TS
02 playoffs - 27/6/5/1/1 on 51%TS
09 playoffs - 30/5/6/2/1 on 56%TS
10 playoffs - 29/6/6/1/1 on 57%TS

13 playoffs - 18/10/2/1/2 on 52%TS

04 playoffs - 25/5/6/2/0 on 51%TS
08 playoffs - 30/6/6/2/0 on 58%TS

Jameerthefear

04-03-2014, 10:26 PM

Kobe stans just can't handle that Duncan is far superior to Kobe Bryant. Shit is pathetic.

zoom17

04-03-2014, 10:27 PM

Kobe stans just can't handle that Duncan is far superior to Kobe Bryant. Shit is pathetic.

:applause:

JohnFreeman

04-03-2014, 10:28 PM

Kobe stans just can't handle that Duncan is far superior to Kobe Bryant. Shit is pathetic.
A little bit of this

rmt

04-03-2014, 11:43 PM

duncan with 3 going by your criteria

Duncan was the man in 2006-07 by any criteria

Regular Season

Duncan 20 pts / 10.6 rebs / 3.4 assts / 2.4 blks 54.6% all-nba 1st team, all-defensive 1st team
Parker 18.6 pts / 3.2 rebs / 5.5 assts / 1.1 stl 52%

Playoffs

Duncan 22.2 pts / 11.5 rebs / 3.3 assts / 3.1 blks 52.1%
Parker 20.8 pts / 3.4 rebs / 5.8 assts / 1.1 stl 48%

T_L_P

04-04-2014, 05:37 AM

Did people seriously not know how many 50-win seasons Duncan had?

It seems like everybody in the press who has wrote about it had no idea :roll:

mrpuente

04-04-2014, 07:17 AM

MJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Kareem
Kobe
Shaq
Wilt
Hakeem
Kobe and Shaq played on the same team.
Magic and Lew played on the same team.

Would you look at that. They are somehow in the top ten using team stats.

God for bid you use Timmy's coaching staff, F.O., or teammates for his superiority.

Bird

04-04-2014, 07:37 AM

Kobe: 5
Duncan: 4

Jim Loscutoff: 7
Robert Horry: 6
Kobe: 5

:confusedshrug:

annbafan

04-04-2014, 07:45 AM

how can a player have 50 win season? the team that he play on does, but not him. teams win, not players.

ArbitraryWater

04-04-2014, 08:49 AM

Duncan > Kobe, deal with it.

Funny how Deuce changes his criteria every time :oldlol:

Once it's Duncan he goes to compare statistical titles, what happened to "boiling it down" ?

Dude can't take himself serious...

Anyone honest, will admit that Shaq is simply a way better basketball player than Kobe.

And btw, ImKobe, saying Kobe outplayed Shaq in 3/4 series' in 2001? :oldlol:

Post the stats, he outplayed him in the WCF, that's it.

ArbitraryWater

04-04-2014, 09:11 AM

-Winning with teams that only a few others in NBA history could

-Winning titles without other All-Stars (iir only Hakeem, Duncan and Dirk have done that in the past thirty-something years)

-Being the consummate teammate and leader.

If you're seriously asking what Duncan has done to be considered a great, you should be asking that question for almost every player in NBA history.

Nah that's not true. Jordan in 1991 and 1998 won without an All-Star. We all know those Teams were stacked in 1998, and in 1991 I have no clue why Pip didn't get a Selection, still.

Uncle Drew

04-04-2014, 09:38 AM

15/10 isn't worth of all the knob-polishing he's getting.
He does it in 29 minutes, at age 37...

riseagainst

04-04-2014, 12:24 PM

eh.... Duncan is great. But he's getting massively overrated here.... and why say "Duncan" getting 50 win seasons? he was playing 1v5?

annbafan

04-04-2014, 01:06 PM

How can a player have a championship? the team that he plays on does, but not him. teams win, not players.

Jordan 6 Titles? HELL NO
Russell 11? NOPE

:confusedshrug:

Jordan 6 Titles as a member of the Chicago Bulls
Russell 11 as a member of the Boston Celtics

the same with Duncan and 50 win seasons. Comparison of a player to a franchise lacks any sense for me.

rmt

04-04-2014, 02:00 PM

eh.... Duncan is great. But he's getting massively overrated here.... and why say "Duncan" getting 50 win seasons? he was playing 1v5?

How about the only player on a team that wins the equivalent of 17 consecutive 50 win seasons? Why mince words when he's been the main reason for the winning seasons?

SuperPippen

04-04-2014, 02:25 PM

Yea, count me in for the "TD is definitely a greater player than Kobe" camp.

And yes, Deuce's "boiled down" crap is pretty pathetic. :lol

MMM

04-04-2014, 03:05 PM

Yea, count me in for the "TD is definitely a greater player than Kobe" camp.

And yes, Deuce's "boiled down" crap is pretty pathetic. :lol

There is a number of ways to boil it down doe

Championship
4-5 .800
5-7 .714

FMVP
3-5 .600
2-7 .286

MVP
2-1

annbafan

04-04-2014, 03:16 PM

There is a number of ways to boil it down doe

Championship
4-5 .800
5-7 .714

FMVP
3-5 .600
2-7 .286

MVP
2-1

so the more finals you made the worse player you are? :D

Deuce Bigalow

04-04-2014, 03:19 PM

There is a number of ways to boil it down doe

Championship
4-5 .800
5-7 .714

FMVP
3-5 .600
2-7 .286

MVP
2-1
More championships and more finals is better than less championships and less finals.

Duncan's 05 FMVP was Manu's. 20.6 ppg on 47.1%TS :oldlol:

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons are better than any of Duncan's despite not winning MVP those years. And what about scoring titles? Rebounding titles? Kobe 2, Duncan 0.

There you go, all nice and boiled down for you.

T_L_P

04-04-2014, 03:31 PM

More championships and more finals is better than less championships and less finals.

Duncan's 05 FMVP was Manu's. 20.6 ppg on 47.1%TS :oldlol:

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons are better than any of Duncan's despite not winning MVP those years. And what about scoring titles? Rebounding titles? Kobe 2, Duncan 0.

There you go, all nice and boiled down for you.

Regular seasons, yes. But Kobe didn't do anything nearly as good as Duncan's '03 run.

And even then, Duncan's 02 regular season >> any of Kobe's. He had the highest Usage rate of all-time in 06. That was when he was really a ball-hog.

MMM

04-04-2014, 04:03 PM

More championships and more finals is better than less championships and less finals.

Duncan's 05 FMVP was Manu's. 20.6 ppg on 47.1%TS :oldlol:

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons are better than any of Duncan's despite not winning MVP those years. And what about scoring titles? Rebounding titles? Kobe 2, Duncan 0.

There you go, all nice and boiled down for you.

For an all time great I'm somewhat surprised that Kobe was the best player on the biggest stage 2 out of 7 times. Guys that you compare him too weren't as inconsistent on the biggest stage.

Deuce Bigalow

04-04-2014, 04:10 PM

Regular seasons, yes. But Kobe didn't do anything nearly as good as Duncan's '03 run.

And even then, Duncan's 02 regular season >> any of Kobe's. He had the highest Usage rate of all-time in 06. That was when he was really a ball-hog.
No one remembers Duncan's "02 regular season".

Ai2death

04-04-2014, 04:39 PM

Kobe is not even top 10.

/end thread

ArbitraryWater

04-04-2014, 04:40 PM

Kobe is not even top 10.

/end thread

Your first good post on ISH :cheers:

Took a while, but whatever

SuperPippen

04-04-2014, 05:46 PM

No one remembers Duncan's "02 regular season".

Just so you know, just because YOU say that nobody remembers it, doesn't make it true.

You know you've exhausted all possible bullshit criteria for "objectively" discussing greatness when you try to discredit another player by claiming that nobody remember's one of his great seasons.

BlackVVaves

04-04-2014, 05:57 PM

More championships and more finals is better than less championships and less finals.

Duncan's 05 FMVP was Manu's. 20.6 ppg on 47.1%TS :oldlol:

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons are better than any of Duncan's despite not winning MVP those years. And what about scoring titles? Rebounding titles? Kobe 2, Duncan 0.

There you go, all nice and boiled down for you.

Kobe's 06, 07 seasons were better than 02, 03 Duncan?

Do tell.