Replace Scottie with Kemp on the 95-98 Bulls?

[fpliii]

Everything else happens as it did, but this rumored trade goes down:

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1994-06-30/sports/9406300177_1_scottie-pippen-free-agents-horace-grant-pippen-deal

How does Chicago perform in those four years?

[fpliii]

Follow-up, does Seattle make the Finals at all in that span?

[guy]

Assuming the rest of the roster moves still go down, I'd say they still win it all from 96-98. I don't think the Bulls are as good, and they probably don't have record breaking seasons, but I still don't see anyone beating a team of Jordan, Kemp, Rodman, Kukoc, etc.

[QuebecBaller]

We already did it a couple of weeks ago

[fpliii]

We already did it a couple of weeks ago
I must've missed it, link? :confusedshrug:

EDIT: Oops, found it:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=329868

Mods can delete.

[Smoke117]

It's hard to see how the Bulls get better and the Sonics lose out on this trade. Scottie pippen was clearly the best non big man in the league in 94 and 95. Shawn Kemp I'll admit never got the defensive recognition he deserved (he was the anchor and not Gary and his big mouth that gave him a DPOY he never had no business receiving over David Robinson in 96 but that's a different story). The Main problem with Kemp (aside from the fact that he was massively foul prone his entire career... is that he was all athleticism with a bit of skill. Comparing Pippen to Kemp as basketball players is a joke. Scottie was one of the greatest students of the game, should have been awarded DPOY in 95 over Mutombo, and was a vastly more intelligent player than Kemp. You would basically lose almost nothing replacing Kemp with Pippen, but maybe some rebounds. Scottie was literally better at ever facet of the game and on an entire different level than Shawn Kemp.

The only problem I could see is the fact that Gary was a PG's PG and handled the ball a lot when Scottie was used to do doing that in the trinagle, but I don't see it being that big of deal considering Scottie was good off the ball and frankly was a much more skilled post player than Kemp ever was. The Sonics definitely get better and the Bulls I just don't see working out once MIchael came back. Kemp was always an immature player with his antics, so after playing with Scottie for so many years, I can't really see Michael putting up with Kemps bullshit for very long. in the 8 seasons he was with the Sonics he was averaging nearly 4fpg and didn't even even reach 30mpg in that tenure because he was always in foul trouble (and a huge coke head by the 97 season which got him finally got him traded away away when the Sonics had enough of his bullshit). I find it hilarious that it was the Sonics who turned down the trade when they were being offered the best player in the league who wasn't a center and one of the best defensive players that has ever played.....

[wakencdukest]

They still win. Kukoc slides into Scotties place at small forward and Kemp takes over at Power forward with Rodman getting all the minutes he can handle off the bench. Kukoc was underrated as a playmaker and scorer.

[Smoke117]

They still win. Kukoc slides into Scotties place at small forward and Kemp takes over at Power forward with Rodman getting all the minutes he can handle off the bench. Kukoc was underrated as a playmaker and scorer.

Toni Kukoc cant' just "slide into Scotties place". For one you are saying replace teh best defensive player at his position in the league with an horrendous defender. Toni was basically a poor man Pippen offensively with a better jump shot, but he didnt' have Pippen's quickness, ball handling, explosiveness, or length. Toni was a joke in the post too where Pippen was extremely underrated because he was never asked to post up that much. You start Kemp, Kukoc, and ROdman as your starting Front court and I only see a nightmare there. Kemp would b ein constant foul trouble, Kukoc is as useless as you can be defensively, and Dennis couldn't even be trusted game to game to not lose it and play normally.

If the trade did happen at the beginning of 1994-95 season, I don't even see Jordan coming back at all in the first place. Scottie was the best 1-3 player in the league when Jordan was gone, so why would he want to come back when they they traded him away for an inferior player like Shawn Kemp?

[DonDadda59]

Follow-up, does Seattle make the Finals at all in that span?

Not unless they made a move to fill that 4 spot, unless they slide Shrempf there. They would have a monster defensive back court though. Don't think they make the finals but they make noise in the playoffs, maybe reach the WCF.

The Bulls on the other had gain some flexibility in their lineup.

Longley
Kemp
Kukoc
Jordan
Harper

With Rodman getting major minutes in the 4/5 spot. Kerr, Wennington, Buechler, etc getting their usual rotation.

They lose some defensively but still enough to be top 5, but their offense improves IMO. They win 3 'ships.

[Angel Face]

They will still 3peat.

[MiseryCityTexas]

Assuming the rest of the roster moves still go down, I'd say they still win it all from 96-98. I don't think the Bulls are as good, and they probably don't have record breaking seasons, but I still don't see anyone beating a team of Jordan, Kemp, Rodman, Kukoc, etc.


bulls wouldn't have won shit with Jordan and Kemp. Jordan and Pippen compliment each otehr's games so well.

[Smoke117]

People need to remember the main reason Jordan retired after 98 was the fact that Pippen and Jackson were leaving. Pippen wanted to finally get paid and Phil was dealing wit his own health issues at he time and didn't want to be on the road all that much. A lot of people give Pippen a lot of flack for how the Rockets played, but he was never allowed to play his game on the Rockets. Their entire offense was built on post Hakeem or Barkley. Scottie had played his entire career pretty much running the offense and being able to get into the paint as the Bulls never had any signficant big men clogging the point. With Hakeem and Barkley and frankly past their primes, Pippen never had a chance to play his game.

He played the most minutues he ever had had in that shortened season season at 40.2mpg which was 4-5 mpg than Hakeem and Barkley played. The whole reason that the team didn't work out was that Pippen was the youngest player of the big three and he was already 33 lol. He was disgruntled most of the season because the entire offense was basically pound it into Hakeem or Barkley. For a guy who played his entire career with Jordan and no real post up players it was really hard for him to find any kind identity offensively. When was was traded to the Blazers he actually played really well and aggreassive till he started to take it easy the last half the season. He was easily the Blazers best players after Sheed though when he stopped being passive and started playing aggressive in the playoffs. He destroyed Wally's World and was huge vs the Jazz. He's always said how much it haunts him how in that game 7 the Blazers lost to the Lakers because he didn't start getting more aggressive. I remember that game like it was yesterday....Sheed and Steve Smith were getting great lookd but they judy kept missing. It wasn't really anyone's fault. They were getting the shots they wanted but they just couldn't get them to go down.