European Media: "Strong Rumors Messina Likely Headed To NBA"

[Euroleague]

https://twitter.com/HCanPelister/statuses/453592186798739456

Halil Can Pelister ‏@HCanPelister

There are strong rumors that Messina leaves CSKA this year, likely headed to the NBA, per source.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again, the NBA shows how stupid it is with their fascination with Messina. He's incredibly overrated.

There are much better coaches than him in Europe.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Messina? More like the messiah come to save our heathen basketball league with his GOAT euro skillz

[Smook A.]

Who THE HELL is Messina?? :kobe:

[Trollsmasher]

Messi is a midget though

And he is also choker

[blablabla]

Apparently he's going to be the new Warriors coach









Santa Cruz Warriors

[Sakkreth]

He is overrated, but still better than most nba coaches.

[Euroleague]

He is overrated, but still better than most nba coaches.

Most Euroleague coaches are better than NBA coaches.

Maybe it's going to be the Lakers. He worked with them before, and D'Antoni has been a disaster there. I can't imagine them keeping him any longer.

He's certainly much better than D'Antoni is. But the point still stands that if you are going to bring in a Euroleague coach, why not bring in one of the best ones, and not Messina, who has proven in the last 5 years or so that he's very overrated and simply can't win no matter how much money he has to spend, or what roster he has?

It's just illogical.

[AirTupac]

The reason why Euroleague coaches never work is because they are racist. The last time a Euroleague coach came to the NBA, he had an altercation with Latrell Sprewell and called him a coon.

Source: Euroleague.net

[JUDGE WITNESS]

another euroleague star coming to stink it up in 'merica

[Euroleague]

The reason why Euroleague coaches never work is because they are racist. The last time a Euroleague coach came to the NBA, he had an altercation with Latrell Sprewell and called him a coon.

Source: Euroleague.net

reported

[aj1987]

Is he good? Can the Heat get him?

[9erempiree]

If you have problems with the mods post here to address your concerns....

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=331500

[KobesFinger]

Where do you rank him amongst current NBA coaches? And is he better than Lionel Hollins IYO?

[ralph_i_el]

http://i1294.photobucket.com/albums/b619/alex_mcdonald2/herc-carver-huh-the-wire_zps009823e9.gif (http://s1294.photobucket.com/user/alex_mcdonald2/media/herc-carver-huh-the-wire_zps009823e9.gif.html)

^ summary of every Euroleague thread



Why don't you make one big thread of all the asinine things you believe and then we can all lambaste you there? Oh wait, you're a troll and I fall for it daily.

[Xiao Yao You]

Will be interesting to see if Euroleague coaches fare any better in the NBA than college coaches have.

I'd guess the Jazz will be looking at him if he's coming. Ollie is supposed to be on their early list as well.

[smoovegittar]

Jim Messina? Didn't he play with Kenny Loggins?

[R.I.P.]

Too bad Svetislav Pesic never made it to the NBA. I

[Fiba basketball]

[QUOTE=R.I.P.]Too bad Svetislav Pesic never made it to the NBA. I

[oarabbus]

:eek: Euroleague just posted an NBA relevant thread!


http://www.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/real-madrid-coach-jose-mourinho-celebrates-goal.png

[Euroleague]

Pesic coached Adam Morrison in Red Star and when Morisson left he gave interview for USA media and talked about how Pesic ( whom Morrison called local legend :facepalm ) is crazy. Pesic is strict and demanding but he isn't even close to coaches like Vujosevic or Ivanovic when it comes to that.

Pesic is a player's coach easily compared to someone like Messina. Messina is like Euroleague Larry Brown. I have no idea why NBA teams think he is going to work in modern NBA.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Euroleague why would the top coaches from Europe come to America when you've said yourself the quality of play is so much better in Europe?

[Milbuck]

Guarantee he'll be demoted to the Maine Red Claws within a week. These Euroleague kids can't hang with the pros in the NBA. This is what NBA guys are PAID to do. This isn't the casual pick up ball they play over in Europe.

[Derka]

I'm sure he'll make a great equipment manager somewhere.

[Euroleague]

Euroleague why would the top coaches from Europe come to America when you've said yourself the quality of play is so much better in Europe?

How many times does it have to be repeated that Messina isn't one of the best coaches in the Euroleague for you to grasp it?

[Angel Face]

The NBA has enough water boys, towel boys and mop boys. I don't think he'll make it.

[Dr.J4ever]

Pesic is a player's coach easily compared to someone like Messina. Messina is like Euroleague Larry Brown. I have no idea why NBA teams think he is going to work in modern NBA.
Below is a write up about Ettore Messina from Wikipedia:

"Ettore Messina (born 30 September 1959) is an Italian professional basketball coach, currently the head coach of CSKA Moscow. He has won four Euroleague championships as a head coach. Messina is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches, having been named in 2008 one of the 50 Greatest Euroleague Contributors.

He was named the Italian League's Best Coach three times, in the years 1998, 2001, and 2005. Furthermore, he has been named Euroleague Coach of the Year twice, in 2006 and 2008. He was inducted into the Italian Basketball Hall of Fame in 2008."

Of course, you might accuse me again of being one of Wiki's writers.

[morbius]

Messina is a very good coach. I expect him to do very well in NBA, if given a proper chance.

Most American basketball fans do not know this, but Europe is actually full of excellent coaches, better than most guys which are now coaching NBA teams.

There are however differences that they would need to get used to in order to succeed in NBA. American BB is less structured and disciplined, there is a lot more running and gunning due to better physical quality of players.

Cultural differences are large as well. Best Euro coaches are often divas, their influence over team presidents is big. In Europe, if coach like Messina is unsatisfied with players' performance, he can go to the club president and say: "These ****** suck, get me some other ******" and he will have his way. In NBA things do not work like that, teams value their star players way more than their coaches.

[Fiba basketball]

Below is a write up about Ettore Messina from Wikipedia:

"Ettore Messina (born 30 September 1959) is an Italian professional basketball coach, currently the head coach of CSKA Moscow. He has won four Euroleague championships as a head coach. Messina is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches, having been named in 2008 one of the 50 Greatest Euroleague Contributors.

He was named the Italian League's Best Coach three times, in the years 1998, 2001, and 2005. Furthermore, he has been named Euroleague Coach of the Year twice, in 2006 and 2008. He was inducted into the Italian Basketball Hall of Fame in 2008."

Of course, you might accuse me again of being one of Wiki's writers.


Well you don't have to be a great coach to win with players like Danilovic and Ginobili on your team ( Bologna ) or to win with CSKA where Ivkovic left him the best team in Europe.

After he left CSKA he did terrible job with Real ( only time they reached final 4 is the season he left during top 16 ) and now he is back in CSKA where he continues to prove that he's overrated.

[Myth]

Most Euroleague coaches are better than NBA coaches.



They'd have to have good coaches to succeed to make up for the lack of talent on the court.

[dannywpt]

It's so funny how every player or coach who is even linked to coming over to the NBA appearantly is a TOTAL SCRUB and sucks in Europe.

[Fiba basketball]

It's so funny how every player or coach who is even linked to coming over to the NBA appearantly is a TOTAL SCRUB and sucks in Europe.

What coach othere than Messina was linked to NBA ?

[gabepizza]

Well you don't have to be a great coach to win with players like Danilovic and Ginobili on your team ( Bologna ) or to win with CSKA where Ivkovic left him the best team in Europe.

After he left CSKA he did terrible job with Real ( only time they reached final 4 is the season he left during top 16 ) and now he is back in CSKA where he continues to prove that he's overrated.

Yes now that CSKA is 11-2 in the Top 16 tied for the 2nd best record in Euroleague, really showing he's overrated.

[duskovujosevic]

messina is overrated, he coached the best european players in merely every club he coached. look at the CSKA, he ****ed up euroleague title with Kirilelnko, Krstic, Teodosic and other elite european players. overrated piece of crap.

[Fiba basketball]

Yes now that CSKA is 11-2 in the Top 16 tied for the 2nd best record in Euroleague, really showing he's overrated.

If you watched games you would know that they barly won some of the games. For exapmle at home against Lokomotiva they won because Teodosic scored 15pts in 4 minutes but they should be able to win by 20, last week against Galatasaray ( their best player is Erceg who was 2nd PF in CSKA last season ) they won in OT but again they should have blown them out.

CSKA should at least be dominant as Real has been so far but instead they are playing like they are trying to lose every game.

[Fiba basketball]

messina is overrated, he coached the best european players in merely every club he coached. look at the CSKA, he ****ed up euroleague title with Kirilelnko, Krstic, Teodosic and other elite european players. overrated piece of crap.

Kazlauskas was coach when Kirilenko played for CSKA.

[KyrieTheFuture]

How many times does it have to be repeated that Messina isn't one of the best coaches in the Euroleague for you to grasp it?
I do grasp it, I don't think you're grasping what I'm asking you.

[gabepizza]

If you watched games you would know that they barly won some of the games. For exapmle at home against Lokomotiva they won because Teodosic scored 15pts in 4 minutes but they should be able to win by 20, last week against Galatasaray ( their best player is Erceg who was 2nd PF in CSKA last season ) they won in OT but again they should have blown them out.

CSKA should at least be dominant as Real has been so far but instead they are playing like they are trying to lose every game.

A win is a win, by 20 points or by 1. The fact is that CSKA has the 2nd best record in all of Euroleague so you cannot call the coach overrated.

[Dr.J4ever]

Well you don't have to be a great coach to win with players like Danilovic and Ginobili on your team ( Bologna ) or to win with CSKA where Ivkovic left him the best team in Europe.

After he left CSKA he did terrible job with Real ( only time they reached final 4 is the season he left during top 16 ) and now he is back in CSKA where he continues to prove that he's overrated.
You know what, you're right. He might be overrated despite his very impressive credentials. The thing is most Americans on this board know next to nothing about him, and you know the details about his coaching. However, it's not us saying he's a great coach, but it's all the other Euros who love the guy. I mean the guy won Coach of the year twice or something and has been selected in that top 50 EL contributors, whatever that is. Bottom line, he's a highly respected guy.

If you say he is overrated because he was lucky enough to have good players, then I guess Phil Jackson was overrated too.

[Fiba basketball]

A win is a win, by 20 points or by 1. The fact is that CSKA has the 2nd best record in all of Euroleague so you cannot call the coach overrated.

Yes I can. As I already said Erceg who was 2nd pf in CSKA last season is best player on Galatasaray ( top 8 team ). And who did Messina bring to replace him, well Hines who was one of top 3 players of last seasons champion. He got Pargo ( ex all EL team ) to be 3rd PG, best russian sg Fridzon to play 18 mpp.

It's like saying that if a team with Paul,Westbrook,Kobe,Wade,Harden,George,KD,Lebron,D irk,Love,Duncan,Howard was 2nd in NBA but by winning by 1 pt coach is doing a good job. Ofcourse not with that kind of team everyone should be able to have good record.


You know what, you're right. He might be overrated despite his very impressive credentials. The thing is most Americans on this board know next to nothing about him, and you know the details about his coaching. However, it's not us saying he's a great coach, but it's all the other Euros who love the guy. I mean the guy won Coach of the year twice or something and has been selected in that top 50 EL contributors, whatever that is. Bottom line, he's a highly respected guy.

If you say he is overrated because he was lucky enough to have good players, then I guess Phil Jackson was overrated too.

Not the same. Jackson is something like Obradovic in Europe. They both had great players on their teams but thay always won unlike Messina who didn't do anything for 6 years now even though he had great players.

Also Messina didn't just have great players but when he first came to CSKA he didn't have to do anything because that team was already the best and now had one year of playing together which made them even better.

[Ratnik]

I still cant figure out if Euroleague is a troll or not :biggums:

[Euroleague]

Below is a write up about Ettore Messina from Wikipedia:

"Ettore Messina (born 30 September 1959) is an Italian professional basketball coach, currently the head coach of CSKA Moscow. He has won four Euroleague championships as a head coach. Messina is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches, having been named in 2008 one of the 50 Greatest Euroleague Contributors.

He was named the Italian League's Best Coach three times, in the years 1998, 2001, and 2005. Furthermore, he has been named Euroleague Coach of the Year twice, in 2006 and 2008. He was inducted into the Italian Basketball Hall of Fame in 2008."

Of course, you might accuse me again of being one of Wiki's writers.


All 3 people that actually watch Euroleague already said in this thread that he isn't one of the best coaches in Euroleague.

You, the mega clown troll, used Wikipedia to make a point, because your IQ is about 50.

Like I said, he's Euroleague version of Larry Brown.

Hey, why don't you post some things from Larry Brown's Wikipedia page. Go on you freaking imbecile. DO IT.

Start posting excerpts from Larry Brown's Wikipedia page you stupid moron.

Where is Larry Brown? Why does he not coach in the NBA? Why was he a miserable failure in so many NBA teams and in recent times?

Because that shit does not work in modern basketball idiot.

You are RETARDED.

Messina's basketball is 15 years outdated. He can't win a damn thing in Europe, despite having the best rosters in Europe every single year. You are a colossal clown.

[Euroleague]

Messina is a very good coach. I expect him to do very well in NBA, if given a proper chance.

Most American basketball fans do not know this, but Europe is actually full of excellent coaches, better than most guys which are now coaching NBA teams.

There are however differences that they would need to get used to in order to succeed in NBA. American BB is less structured and disciplined, there is a lot more running and gunning due to better physical quality of players.

Cultural differences are large as well. Best Euro coaches are often divas, their influence over team presidents is big. In Europe, if coach like Messina is unsatisfied with players' performance, he can go to the club president and say: "These ****** suck, get me some other ******" and he will have his way. In NBA things do not work like that, teams value their star players way more than their coaches.

Messina is better than most NBA coaches........that is true. But he's NOT one of the best coaches in Euroleague - not even close. And every single Euroleague follower here agrees in this thread.

[Demitri98]

I still cant figure out if Euroleague is a troll or not :biggums:
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=316678

This dude is truly insane

[Euroleague]

Well you don't have to be a great coach to win with players like Danilovic and Ginobili on your team ( Bologna ) or to win with CSKA where Ivkovic left him the best team in Europe.

After he left CSKA he did terrible job with Real ( only time they reached final 4 is the season he left during top 16 ) and now he is back in CSKA where he continues to prove that he's overrated.

Yes now that CSKA is 11-2 in the Top 16 tied for the 2nd best record in Euroleague, really showing he's overrated.

The biggest troll in the history of this forum appears. What a shock. GTFO.

He had the biggest budget in Europe every year with CSKA...........he was 2 for 8 in the final four.........ultimate choker.

He went to Real Madrid and got the club's biggest budget EVER, much bigger than it has now, and almost singled handed destroyed the club. It took them like 2 years to recover from the damage he caused he was so awful, the worst coach they had in decades.

He comes back to CSKA, and with the biggest budget in Europe last year, got destroyed by Olympiacos, a team with a mid tier budget.........

And as Fiba said, he won shit YEARS AGO..........and with teams that had BY FAR AND AWAY THE BIGGEST BUDGETS AND MOST STACKED ROSTERS IN EUROPE.

Bologna? Are you freaking kidding me? It was a super team with a super roster and mega budget. And even then, as was already said, that basketball isn't working now.

With CSKA, he still only got 2 championships out of like 10 years having the best roster in Europe and the biggest budget in Europe, being able to buy literally ANY player or team he wanted to. I mean literally, being able to play fantasy GM and get ANY player he wanted ANY time.

GTFO you POS troll.

He's super duper overrated.

[Maga_1]

I would take at least this six, any day of the week before Messina:
Laso
Obradovic
Ivkovic
Pesic
Bartzokas
Blatt

Scariolo and Messina are truly overrated in a tactical stand point.

[Fiba basketball]

I would take at least this six, any day of the week before Messina:
Laso
Obradovic
Ivkovic
Pesic
Bartzokas
Blatt

Scariolo and Messina are truly overrated in a tactical stand point.
I would add Pasqual, Vujosevic and Plaza. There are few more who are debatable like Pashutin, Banchi...

[Maga_1]

I would add Pasqual, Vujosevic and Plaza. There are few more who are debatable like Pashutin, Banchi...

- I'm not buying Pasqual until he uses this system in another team, he's clearly talented but in a Barcelona's team it isn't very difficult :lol .
- Plaza is kinda inconsistent, he's def good but not "world level good"
- Vujosevic is a talent maker, no doubts about that. But "world class level"?

[Fiba basketball]

- I'm not buying Pasqual until he uses this system in another team, he's clearly talented but in a Barcelona's team it isn't very difficult :lol .
- Plaza is kinda inconsistent, he's def good but not "world level good"
- Vujosevic is a talent maker, no doubts about that. But "world class level"?

Pasqual made Barcelona play best defense in Europe despite having so many bad defenders, for me that is the mark of an great coach. Although I don't like the way Barcelona runs it's offense, to slow and strict for a team with so many great players.

If we are talking about doing great in another team then why did name Laso when he needed 3 seasons to make Real this good ( and I think they still won't win EL).

Well Plaza might not be world level but for me Messina isn't also so I don't see Plaza for me is better.

Vujosevic is world class level but he has one huge problem, he doesn't speak english. It's very hard to coach a team when you can't talk to players and that's why he failed everywhere except Partizan ( also making basketball legends who are over 30 years old work 7 hours per day like they are 20 while he was in CSKA didn't help ).
I don't know if you watched Partizan at start of the season before injuries but it was coaching at it's finest ( normaly Partizan playes like that at end of every season but because players stayed which wasn't the case before you could see it at start as well ) : Defensive rotations were perfect, transition game was great, ball movement on offense was simply amazing.

[Andrew Wiggins]

euroleague is probably furiously jerking off and soaking himself in his own c.um right now because his god spanoulis just hit a game winning 3 against his "favorite" team panathinaikos. :lol

[Euroleague]

A win is a win, by 20 points or by 1. The fact is that CSKA has the 2nd best record in all of Euroleague so you cannot call the coach overrated.

This guy never ceases to be the biggest clown in the entire forum.

And they are tied with Barca for the 2nd best record with 5 loses, you freaking moron.

Besides the fact that Olympiacos, the next team, only has one more loss with 6, and they would have a better record than CSKA, if not for the fact they lost every game while Spanoulis was out for a month with a knee injury.

And CSKA was playing in the easier group in the 2nd stage, so the fact they have a tied record with Barca, or one game ahead of Olympiacos, does not mean much, considering the group those teams play in is infinitely harder - pretty much the hardest group anyone can remember.

So yeah, more like the 4th best performance in regular season, from the team with once again, by far and away, the biggest roster and budget in Europe.

And CSKA won't do jack shit again this year. In fact, they probably won't even make it past the playoffs - they probably won't even make the damn final four.

Messina = overrated and gabepizza = clown mega troll.

[Euroleague]

You know what, you're right. He might be overrated despite his very impressive credentials. The thing is most Americans on this board know next to nothing about him, and you know the details about his coaching. However, it's not us saying he's a great coach, but it's all the other Euros who love the guy. I mean the guy won Coach of the year twice or something and has been selected in that top 50 EL contributors, whatever that is. Bottom line, he's a highly respected guy.

If you say he is overrated because he was lucky enough to have good players, then I guess Phil Jackson was overrated too.

Again, the clown mega trolls with their 50 IQs...........

[Euroleague]

Not the same. Jackson is something like Obradovic in Europe. They both had great players on their teams but thay always won unlike Messina who didn't do anything for 6 years now even though he had great players.

Also Messina didn't just have great players but when he first came to CSKA he didn't have to do anything because that team was already the best and now had one year of playing together which made them even better.

Obradovic is better than Messina and is not as overrated as Messina, but he's still super overrated also, as I have been telling you for years. You keep arguing with me about that.

Well, the debate is over and that's settled now. I told you he can only win if every single condition is perfect, and even with enormous budgets, he can not even make the playoffs.

He failed miserably many times with Panathinaikos - twice did not make it past Top 16 with 35 million euro rosters, and now did the same in Fener with a 35 million euro roster.

He's better than Messina, and of course most NBA coaches, but he's super overrated.

No debate anymore, after his season in Fener it is proven. I told you he was. I saw it over and over in Panathinaikos. He's a MYTH created by Panathinaikos fan base.

[Euroleague]

I would take at least this six, any day of the week before Messina:
Laso
Obradovic
Ivkovic
Pesic
Bartzokas
Blatt

Scariolo and Messina are truly overrated in a tactical stand point.

I think I would take the ones in bold and these ones over Messina - Plaza, Ataman, Banchi, Pedoulakis and Pascual also.

I would put probably Scariolo, Pesic, Messina, Katsikaris, Pashutin, Trinchieri, Giannakis, Vujosevic, Chris Fleming, and guys like that in the same group.

Coaches in Europe that I think are way too overrated and get way too much credit for whatever reason are guys like:

Pesic
Messina
Obradovic
Blatt
Vujosevic
Piangiani
Scariolo

I mean Scariolo.......in US sports media they kept saying in like every article how he was the "best coach in Europe" every time they talked about the Spanish national team.........

:rolleyes:

There are some other possibilities out there, like Itoudis, who has always been rumored from people in the know to have been the real coach of Panathinaikos and not Obradovic (who was supposed to just be nothing more than a showman of the owners).

If that is true, then Itoudis is up there also, but for now even though he has very good results in Banvit, it's still too small of a club too draw any conclusions. Although he is supposed to be rumored to be CSKA's top choice to replace Messina if he does leave. So I guess we would find out soon enough.

Also some coaches that coach in national teams show a lot of promise but are coaching in much too small of clubs for us to know for sure. There are several such cases. There is no need to go into them. But at some point they might get into bigger clubs. Just as an example, Finland's head coach seems to be excellent, but you don't really know for sure without seeing them in a club.

So Messina is one of the better coaches in Europe..........he's not by any stretch of the imagination anywhere close to being "the best coach in Europe" as this NBA marketing BULLSHIT claims, and of course will HYPER claim if he signs with an NBA team.

He's more like middle of the pack 12-15 range or something like that probably. Which is still better than most NBA coaches. But just drop the NBA only fan BULLSHIT, "he's the best coach in Europe" stuff.

[Euroleague]

- I'm not buying Pasqual until he uses this system in another team, he's clearly talented but in a Barcelona's team it isn't very difficult :lol .
- Plaza is kinda inconsistent, he's def good but not "world level good"
- Vujosevic is a talent maker, no doubts about that. But "world class level"?

Pascual for me is same exact kind of coach like Messina, but he gives his players some more freedom and he is more open to what kind of players he can use in his team and especially for what kind of offense.

I mean people complain about him limiting his teams, but it's not even close to what Messina does. Pascual is same kind of coach, but he's younger and more modern. He's a bit better to offense.

I think Plaza is better. Not on defense and tactics probably, but just look at what he did with Zalgiris and Malaga. Can you imagine what Messina will do with clubs with 12 million euros budget?

I doubt they will last even a month or so before they explode. When was the last time Messina developed some young players or anything? I don't remember really. Plaza shows he can do that.

I would prefer Plaza if I was hiring a coach, although technically Messina is better.

Vujosevic and Messina are pretty similar in level I would say. I disagree with Fiba, but he's a Partizan fan so that's why he named him. Vujosevic isn't better, I think Messina is better actually. But Vujosevic is the perfect coach for Partizan, so that's probably why he sees it that way. He's not going to do much better than Messina or anything in bigger clubs though.

He's good, but he's too limited in what he does, much like Messina is.

I would agree that Messina is technically better than Plaza, but I would rather have a guy like Plaza as a coach, because Messina is just that nasty grumpy, guy - that Larry Brown guy that just won't do anything but his way or the highway. We see how that way is an absolute disaster for all his teams in recent years.

Hell, Messina supposedly from rumors wanted to coach Greek NT, Italian NT, Turkish NT, Russian NT and none of them signed him - that should tell you something. So, Pascual is a better coach for me.

[Fiba basketball]

I think I would take the ones in bold and these ones over Messina - Plaza, Ataman, Banchi, Pedoulakis and Pascual also.

I would put probably Scariolo, Pesic, Messina, Katsikaris, Pashutin, Trinchieri, Giannakis, Vujosevic, Chris Fleming, and guys like that in the same group.

Coaches in Europe that I think are way too overrated and get way too much credit for whatever reason are guys like:

Pesic
Messina
Obradovic
Blatt
Vujosevic
Piangiani
Scariolo

I mean Scariolo.......in US sports media they kept saying in like every article how he was the "best coach in Europe" every time they talked about the Spanish national team.........

:rolleyes:

There are some other possibilities out there, like Itoudis, who has always been rumored from people in the know to have been the real coach of Panathinaikos and not Obradovic (who was supposed to just be nothing more than a showman of the owners).

If that is true, then Itoudis is up there also, but for now even though he has very good results in Banvit, it's still too small of a club too draw any conclusions. Although he is supposed to rumored be CSKA's top choice to replace Messina if he does leave. So I guess we would find out soon enough.

Also some coaches that coach in national teams show a lot of promise but are coaching in much too small of clubs for us to know for sure. There are several such cases. There is no need to go into them. But at some point they might get into bigger clubs. Just as an example, Finland's head coach seems to be excellent, but you don't really know for sure without seeing them in a club.

So Messina is one of the better coaches in Europe..........he's not by any stretch of the imagination anywhere close to being "the best coach in Europe" as this NBA marketing BULLSHIT claims, and of course will HYPER claim if he signs with an NBA team.

He's more like middle of the pack 12-15 range or something like that probably. Which is still better than most NBA coaches. But just drop the NBA only fan BULLSHIT, "he's the best coach in Europe" stuff.

:lol You serious

You are putting Pesic and Vujosevic in same group with those guys ?
I would like to see some of them reaching at least top 8 with Partizan or take Valencia after horrible start and be a game away of final 4.

[Rooster]

Lakers wasted their money and time to bring this supposedly 4 time Euroleague champion. Minor league stuff is not for elite level. If they did try to imposed their will, they will get a Latrell Sprewell welcome to the pros.

[Fiba basketball]

Pascual for me is same exact kind of coach like Messina, but he gives his players some more freedom and he is more open to what kind of players he can use in his team and especially for what kind of offense.

I mean people complain about him limiting his teams, but it's not even close to what Messina does. Pascual is same kind of coach, but he's younger and more modern. He's a bit better to offense.

I think Plaza is better. Not on defense and tactics probably, but just look at what he did with Zalgiris and Malaga. Can you imagine what Messina will do with clubs with 12 million euros budget?

I doubt they will last even a month or so before they explode. When was the last time Messina developed some young players or anything? I don't remember really. Plaza shows he can do that.

I would prefer Plaza if I was hiring a coach, although technically Messina is better.

Vujosevic and Messina are pretty similar in level I would say. I disagree with Fiba, but he's a Partizan fan so that's why he named him. Vujosevic isn't better, I think Messina is better actually. But Vujosevic is the perfect coach for Partizan, so that's probably why he sees it that way. He's not going to do much better than Messina or anything in bigger clubs though.

He's good, but he's too limited in what he does, much like Messina is.

I would agree that Messina is technically better than Plaza, but I would rather have a guy like Plaza as a coach, because Messina is just that nasty grumpy, guy - that Larry Brown guy that just won't do anything but his way or the highway. We see how that way is an absolute disaster for all his teams in recent years.

Hell, Messina supposedly from rumors wanted to coach Greek NT, Italian NT, Turkish NT, Russian NT and none of them signed him - that should tell you something. So, Pascual is a better coach for me.

Pasqual isn't the same as Messina. His team plays much better defense and his offense is also better but it's only because CSKA does 3 things on offense ( Teodosic runs pick, ISO for Weems or Krstic plays with his back to the basket ).

Can you imagine Plaza or Messina having succes with budget around 3 million? Plaza maybe could reach top 16 but Messina probably wouldn't even win one game.

Vujosevic might be system coach but I don't think it a bad thing. Ivkovic with Oly was changing the roster during the season so he could find players that could work in his system and we saw how good Oly was because of that.

[Euroleague]

euroleague is probably furiously jerking off and soaking himself in his own c.um right now because his god spanoulis just hit a game winning 3 against his "favorite" team panathinaikos. :lol

Panathinaikos season is probably over. Why should I be happy? Although match up wide they are the absolute ultimate nightmare for Real Madrid. That's the most horrible team in all of Euroleague for Real to get in playoffs.

Like Nash-Amare/D'Antoni Phoenix Suns (Real Madrid) versus Spurs (PAO).........

So it's match up wise it all favors PAO. But Diamantidis is an ex player, and can only be even mildly useful once every month in Euroleague, and only ever plays a good game in Greek League because every game there is rigged by the refs (which are all owned by PAO)......

It is actually a better match up than CSKA for PAO, as they could not beat CSKA, because CSKA has the depth and the big men to beat them. But still, Real is a better team, has home court, and the way they played this year, they should be the favorites.

Even with OAKA incredible home court, and huge pressure on Real to win both of the first 2 games in Madrid.........they have to be favorites. So it is probably the end of the season.

I don't give a damn about stupid Greek League and what happens there - it is rigged and everyone knows it is. Win, lose, whatever the whole thing is a joke. You lose, well they lose even with 8 on 5 advantage, or they win, big deal, they win playing 8 on 5 - who the hell cares?

It works out in PAO's favor oddly enough because it's a better match up, which it is funny that they were in such a desperation and panic to win that game, giving everything like it was a Euroleague final. Because those moron coaches should grasp, they are the worst match up in all Euroleague to Real and against CSKA they have no match up advantage.

But still, season probably ended considering just the match up advantage and just the OAKA hell probably isn't enough against a team like Real (even though they are soft).

Spanoulis? You still can't ****ing get it? And you claim to be a guy doing scouting in Europe? He IS THE GOD OF EUROPE'S BASKET.

He is now freaking triple teamed the whole damn game, every time he plays against PAO, they triple team the whole game............STILL ****ING BEAT THEM.

Single cover.......no team can win.

Double team....it's an auto championship (that's the result last 2 years).

OK, so PAO tried mixing it up this year with Pedoulakis experimenting with a triple team. It has worked so far this year, even also Malaga copied it in one game.

The next game Malaga tried it again, Spanoulis beat it. Seemed maybe he had it, then PAO did it again, and he could beat it. But PAO is a much bigger, stronger, more physical, and more athletic team than Malaga.

They have all those Bramos, Maciulis, Ukic, Lasme, Gist, Wright - I mean that's just the most athletic team in Europe by far. So that triple team with a pure zone (no defensive 3 seconds) is crazy hard.

Today Spanoulis busted that cherry wide open at the end of the game. Eventually players like that find the hole. Even in such a defense like that there is a hole. In every defense, there is a hole. He found it. It's over for that defense.

Triple teams on the ball with the pure zone and no defense 3 seconds (3 guys in the paint) won't work anymore now because now he knows where the holes in that defense are. He finally figured it out.

And then at the end of the game, that started opening up the lanes, scrambling the defense, getting them moving, you get defenders lost, guys isolated, then he got his usual double team in iso that he normally gets......which you can't guard.

Announcers were saying maybe Real or CSKA copies that PAO defense in the playoffs - good luck with that, as now he knows where the gaps are finally. If he just gets the split second or the bit of space to get to the double team, he's scoring. That's how it is.

Diamantidis........he's a dinosaur. Without the rigged refs in Greece he is useless most of the time. He can have a good game about once every 2 weeks.

[Euroleague]

Pasqual isn't the same as Messina. His team plays much better defense and his offense is also better but it's only because CSKA does 3 things on offense ( Teodosic runs pick, ISO for Weems or Krstic plays with his back to the basket ).

Can you imagine Plaza or Messina having succes with budget around 3 million? Plaza maybe could reach top 16 but Messina probably wouldn't even win one game.

Vujosevic might be system coach but I don't think it a bad thing. Ivkovic with Oly was changing the roster during the season so he could find players that could work in his system and we saw how good Oly was because of that.

I meant Pascual is same coach as Messina in psychology, as in he wants to be in control of how his players train very strictly - just not to that same extreme.

We should not compare Ivkovic to Messina. Obviously, Ivkovic is in another totally separate level.

Mentioning Teodosic, people bashed Giannakis endlessly, but I just remember how every single year under Giannakis, Teodosic got so much better, and with Messina, he gets worse and worse...........

That's another example.

[KobesFinger]

Euroleague, you missed my post on the first page.

Where would you rank him amongst current NBA coaches?

[PacerRaptor]

https://twitter.com/HCanPelister/statuses/453592186798739456

Halil Can Pelister ‏@HCanPelister

There are strong rumors that Messina leaves CSKA this year, likely headed to the NBA, per source.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again, the NBA shows how stupid it is with their fascination with Messina. He's incredibly overrated.

There are much better coaches than him in Europe.
It's funny you say that...Ettore Messina (born 30 September 1959) is an Italian professional basketball coach, currently the head coach of CSKA Moscow. He has won four Euroleague championships as a head coach. Messina is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches, having been named in 2008 one of the 50 Greatest Euroleague Contributors.

He was named the Italian League's Best Coach three times, in the years 1998, 2001, and 2005. Furthermore, he has been named Euroleague Coach of the Year twice, in 2006 and 2008. He was inducted into the Italian Basketball Hall of Fame in 2008

[Euroleague]

Pasqual made Barcelona play best defense in Europe despite having so many bad defenders, for me that is the mark of an great coach. Although I don't like the way Barcelona runs it's offense, to slow and strict for a team with so many great players.

If we are talking about doing great in another team then why did name Laso when he needed 3 seasons to make Real this good ( and I think they still won't win EL).

Well Plaza might not be world level but for me Messina isn't also so I don't see Plaza for me is better.

Vujosevic is world class level but he has one huge problem, he doesn't speak english. It's very hard to coach a team when you can't talk to players and that's why he failed everywhere except Partizan ( also making basketball legends who are over 30 years old work 7 hours per day like they are 20 while he was in CSKA didn't help ).
I don't know if you watched Partizan at start of the season before injuries but it was coaching at it's finest ( normaly Partizan playes like that at end of every season but because players stayed which wasn't the case before you could see it at start as well ) : Defensive rotations were perfect, transition game was great, ball movement on offense was simply amazing.

I think the problem with Vujosevic is that he's a superb guy at developing players and coaching in that way. But it's harder to take what he does past that.

I think he's more something like in USA terms, the great NCAA coaches, versus the NBA coaches. The NCAA coaches are usually better than the NBA coaches. But they won't fit so much in NBA because the older players can't handle their demands like the younger players can.

Vujosevic's methods are too difficult for older players. I think it's sort of like Malkovich. He has not really been able to adjust to coaching in recent years, because it's just not the way older players accept being coached now.

Not just in NBA, but even in Europe. All the American players coming to Europe changed the mentality. They don't accept these military boot camp like conditions anymore.

It's just easier to get 17-20 year old kids to do it. And older players can't even physically last. And admit it, even in Partizan, even the young players have a very high injury rate because of it.

It gets great results, but it's perfect for Partizan, I don't think so much for too many other teams though.

[Euroleague]

It's funny you say that...Ettore Messina (born 30 September 1959) is an Italian professional basketball coach, currently the head coach of CSKA Moscow. He has won four Euroleague championships as a head coach. Messina is regarded as one of the best European basketball coaches, having been named in 2008 one of the 50 Greatest Euroleague Contributors.

He was named the Italian League's Best Coach three times, in the years 1998, 2001, and 2005. Furthermore, he has been named Euroleague Coach of the Year twice, in 2006 and 2008. He was inducted into the Italian Basketball Hall of Fame in 2008

Another sub 60 IQ............

[Fiba basketball]

I meant Pascual is same coach as Messina in psychology, as in he wants to be in control of how his players train very strictly - just not to that same extreme.

We should not compare Ivkovic to Messina. Obviously, Ivkovic is in another totally separate level.

Mentioning Teodosic, people bashed Giannakis endlessly, but I just remember how every single year under Giannakis, Teodosic got so much better, and with Messina, he gets worse and worse...........

That's another example.
I didn't compared Ivkovic and Messina, I copered Ivkovic and Vujosevic ( they are similair in the way the both have their system and trie to fit players in it rather than making a new one ). Teodosic was amazing last season and was legitamet MVP candidate but CSKA depended to much on him and that was Messinas fault.

[Euroleague]

:lol You serious

You are putting Pesic and Vujosevic in same group with those guys ?
I would like to see some of them reaching at least top 8 with Partizan or take Valencia after horrible start and be a game away of final 4.

Like I said, coaches getting overrated for various reasons.

[Euroleague]

Euroleague, you missed my post on the first page.

Where would you rank him amongst current NBA coaches?

He's probably something like Tom Thibodeau, except that he's got more that Larry Brown type controlling factor.

[Euroleague]

I didn't compared Ivkovic and Messina, I copered Ivkovic and Vujosevic ( they are similair in the way the both have their system and trie to fit players in it rather than making a new one ). Teodosic was amazing last season and was legitamet MVP candidate but CSKA depended to much on him and that was Messinas fault.

My point was Teodosic is getting worse under Messina, which he IS GETTING worse under him.

Under Giannakis, he kept getting better, and he was better 4 years ago, under him, than he is now, or was last season.

And all you ever heard about was how Giannakis was holding Teodosic back, stunting his development, not developing him right, and all this other stuff.

I mean it's comical really in comparison.

The point is that Teodosic is that guy in Euroleague among lead guards with that NBA mentality to take a shot whenever he wants to, or from wherever he wants to...........

Also to make any pass literally at any time.

Messina never has controlled that, neither did Kazlauskas. Giannakis was doing a good job of that and he played his best under him in Euroleague, and all people did was bitch and complain that he was "stunting his growth", which now was proven to be that he was doing the right thing with him.

Giannakis should know, as he was one of the best lead guards of all the history of Europe, he should know how to control him and use him and motivate him the right way.

So, Messina basically it's just Teodosic again he does not have that control of himself like he should. Now just think almost EVERY lead guard in NBA plays the way Milos does.

OK, maybe not Prigioni or Andre Miller, or some players like that, but like 90% of NBA lead guards play just like Milos. They will take any shot or make any pass they want and at any time.

The coaches have to have some control of the guards, and on the other hand, in the NBA, the lead guards basically run the team and the coaches pretty much have to let them do it.

Here you have Messina, that shows he can't control Milos at all, AND who is one of those Larry Brown/Jeff Van Gundy guys that wants to dominate over his team all the time - same kind of guys that NBA wants nothing to do with at all these days.

My point is that's it's like the NBA has absolutely zero information on Messina even at all. He likes to micromanage every detail of everything. Those kind of coaches (Brown, JVG) just don't seem to fit in the NBA at all now.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Not gonna troll and say Euroleague (the actual league, not poster) is garbage, or that it's basically the "college game", as coach Nick once said.. but at the same time, its not where the NBA is at. Not even close, imo.

Their H2H matchups speak for themself (NBA is 44-10 vs EL)