Miami Cavaliers are back!

[livinglegend]

Bosh is worst than Mo Williams right now:facepalm
Wade is on vacation.
Oden in a nursing room.
Chalmers and Cole, dumb and dumber
Lewis, Battier, Haslem, Allen: old

[CelticBaller]

Our king needs more help :facepalm

[20Four]

Our king needs more help :facepalm
Our king? LOL

Hes a b|tch and if he's soo good, why does he need more help?

[Prometheus]

The supporting cast has been disappointing, but these whiney threads are not a good look. Rise above the insecurity my friend.

Real talk though, LeBron's support is so overrated. Anyone who watches this team play knows they are not "stacked".

[Marlo_Stanfield]

they have a single above average play outside of bron and that is wade. and wade sits our most games and will be hurt in the playoffs again.
bosh is average to below average because he goes invisible for long stretches and gets owned by EVERYONE on defense.
Birdman is okay.
the rest is pure WORTHLESS trash.
cant wait till LeBron leaves this SCRUB team and joins the Warriors:applause:

[livinglegend]

Our king needs more help :facepalm

I m almost done with this team and the scrub role players + Spobot.
I m ready to jumpship along with Lebron.
Will you also come?

[Prometheus]

Our king? LOL

Hes a b|tch and if he's soo good, why does he need more help?

Good choice getting rid of the meathead avy. It was just sending the wrong impression.

[TheReal Kendall]

Good choice getting rid of the meathead avy. It was just sending the wrong impression.

:lol

[pauk]

The supporting cast has been disappointing, but these whiney threads are not a good look. Rise above the insecurity my friend.

Real talk though, LeBron's support is so overrated. Anyone who watches this team play knows they are not "stacked".

This.

[PyrrhusX]

Excuses are starting to formulate :oldlol:

[secund2nun]

Unless Riley has some master plan Lebron needs to ditch this pathetic cast and coach this offseason. Lebron literally has to do everything for this team even when Wade and Bosh play.

[ripthekik]

so.. lebron can't win unless he has 2 stars healthy. Gotcha.

[chazzy]

Bron stans gonna dust off their Cavs jerseys in protest

[PyrrhusX]

Unless Riley has some master plan Lebron needs to ditch this pathetic cast and coach this offseason. Lebron literally has to do everything for this team even when Wade and Bosh play.

He needs Wade to win though. Look at his Cleveland years and look at this year.

[edrick]

so.. lebron can't win unless he has 2 stars healthy. Gotcha.

Did Kobe ever win on his own? Kobe didn't do shit on his own.

[ripthekik]

Did Kobe ever win on his own? Kobe didn't do shit on his own.
all he needed was 1 good sidekick. 1 star. Not 2. Kobe has won with just 1 star in his team 5 times.

The two times lebron won, he won with 2 all stars. Digest that.

[secund2nun]

so.. lebron can't win unless he has 2 stars healthy. Gotcha.

LOL Dwayne "wheelchair" Wade and Christina "pushup bra" Bosh are "stars" alright

[secund2nun]

He needs Wade to win though. Look at his Cleveland years and look at this year.

He doesn't need Wade. Wade doesn't even fit well with Lebron, let alone this old crippled version of Wade who can barely play yet gets paid big time money. Cleveland had garbage teammates, but there are a lot better options out there.

[secund2nun]

all he needed was 1 good sidekick. 1 star. Not 2. Kobe has won with just 1 star in his team 5 times.

The two times lebron won, he won with 2 all stars. Digest that.

Gasol was the real 2010 and 2009 finals MVP. Kobe was a first round loser without an elite front court that couldn't be better than a 7th seed first round loser in his prime. 6 for 24. Digest that.

[ripthekik]

LOL Dwayne "wheelchair" Wade and Christina "pushup bra" Bosh are "stars" alright
they are official all stars in the east. Both starters last year as well. It's official, not just a label I throw in for them.

[PyrrhusX]

LOL Dwayne "wheelchair" Wade and Christina "pushup bra" Bosh are "stars" alright

Does not detract from the point that Lebron NEVER WON until he joined up with them, who are stars despite what you want to make yourself believe. Everyone needs help, no one does it on their own, especially not Lebron.

If the Heat do lose this year, you can use the idea that Wade and Bosh are not stars anymore, but it also means Lebron cant win **** by himself.

[AnaheimLakers24]

needs more hall of famers

[PyrrhusX]

He doesn't need Wade. Wade doesn't even fit well with Lebron, let alone this old crippled version of Wade who can barely play yet gets paid big time money. Cleveland had garbage teammates, but there are a lot better options out there.

Lebron without Wade - 0 rings
Lebron with Wade - 2 rings

He needed Wade and he needed Bosh to get his rings. Its like how everyone uses the fact that Kobe won his rings when he had help (more impressively because he normally had one other star over Lebrons 2).

[ripthekik]

Lebron without Wade - 0 rings
Lebron with Wade - 2 rings

He needed Wade and he needed Bosh to get his rings. Its like how everyone uses the fact that Kobe won his rings when he had help (more impressively because he normally had one other star over Lebrons 2).
you forgot to add:
Wade without Lebron - 1 ring 1 FMVP

[TMT]

First of all, Lebron's game tonight wasn't really about making his teammates look good like he usually does. Instead guys were doing it on their own, and as a result guys like Cole and Chalmers were just losing the ball left and right against Memphis' great perimeter defense. Lebron proceeded to create much of his points of isolations and a seldom nice cut. Not exactly good for the team at large. Bosh isn't a physical four, and that was exposed once again tonight with one of the toughest front courts in the league.

But what I truly don't understand is with the only two centers on the team out, with the addition of Wade and Haslem, why the hell didn't Lebron take it upon himself to guard Z-bo at any point tonight? Even for a single minute? The loss isn't on him in any way, but as the biggest most physically dominant player on your team how can you sit on the perimeter and guard the likes of Courtney Lee and James Johnson all night? :confusedshrug: Can anybody explain this to me?

[PyrrhusX]

you forgot to add:
Wade without Lebron - 1 ring 1 FMVP

I didnt want to make him feel any worse. It just shows how much more alpha DWade is considering he pretty much carried his team to that ring while Bran needed help.

[secund2nun]

they are official all stars in the east. Both starters last year as well. It's official, not just a label I throw in for them.

Kyrie Irving is a 2 time all star....enough said.

[Derka]

Lebron needs more All-Star teammates :(

[RedBlackAttack]

Bosh is worst than Mo Williams right now:facepalm
Wade is on vacation.
Oden in a nursing room.
Chalmers and Cole, dumb and dumber
Lewis, Battier, Haslem, Allen: old
:facepalm

[20Four]

all he needed was 1 good sidekick. 1 star. Not 2. Kobe has won with just 1 star in his team 5 times.

The two times lebron won, he won with 2 all stars. Digest that.
Real talk mayne....preach it brotha:


almost forgot this pic:

http://i.minus.com/jbsQOYOgxlscd.png (http://minus.com/i/bsQOYOgxlscd)

[secund2nun]

Does not detract from the point that Lebron NEVER WON until he joined up with them, who are stars despite what you want to make yourself believe. Everyone needs help, no one does it on their own, especially not Lebron.

If the Heat do lose this year, you can use the idea that Wade and Bosh are not stars anymore, but it also means Lebron cant win **** by himself.

You would have a point if Lebron played with a talented cast prior to Miami, but he played on a talentless scrub cast on Cleveland. Also Bosh was never a star and Wade no longer is a star.

I never claimed Lebron can win by himself. No player can. I was responding to when you said Lebron needs Wade to win...he doesn't. There are more talented and better fits out there than a rapidly aging Dwayne Wade and Chris Bosh (not to mention a terrible coach in Spo).

[secund2nun]

Lebron without Wade - 0 rings
Lebron with Wade - 2 rings

He needed Wade and he needed Bosh to get his rings. Its like how everyone uses the fact that Kobe won his rings when he had help (more impressively because he normally had one other star over Lebrons 2).

This logic makes no sense. So because he could not win with Mo Williams as his 2nd option he needs Wade and Bosh to win?

You do realize there are more talented and better fit teammates for Lebron than Wade, right?

Replace Blake Griffin with Lebron and that Clippers team is better than this big 3 Miami team. Had he went to Chicago that team would have been even better than this big 3 Miami.

As for Kobe he could not even win a playoff series in his prime without Gasol or Shaq or get better than a 7th seed. Not to mention Gasol out performed Kobe for large parts of the title runs, while Lebron has easily out performed Wade and Bosh.

[RedBlackAttack]

You would have a point if Lebron played with a talented cast prior to Miami, but he played on a talentless scrub cast on Cleveland. Also Bosh was never a star and Wade no longer is a star.

I never claimed Lebron can win by himself. No player can. I was responding to when you said Lebron needs Wade to win...he doesn't. There are more talented and better fits out there than a rapidly aging Dwayne Wade and Chris Bosh (not to mention a terrible coach in Spo).
Those teams better not have a point guard on the roster... because, you know... they're worthless.

[secund2nun]

But what I truly don't understand is with the only two centers on the team out, with the addition of Wade and Haslem, why the hell didn't Lebron take it upon himself to guard Z-bo at any point tonight? Even for a single minute? The loss isn't on him in any way, but as the biggest most physically dominant player on your team how can you sit on the perimeter and guard the likes of Courtney Lee and James Johnson all night? :confusedshrug: Can anybody explain this to me?

The reason is that Lebron is the entire offense...he has little energy left. Guarding Z-bo would be very draining. If other players stepped up on offense he could expend more energy on defense.

[Mr. Jabbar]

time to pickup that phone bran :roll:

[Crimsonrain777]

First of all, Lebron's game tonight wasn't really about making his teammates look good like he usually does. Instead guys were doing it on their own, and as a result guys like Cole and Chalmers were just losing the ball left and right against Memphis' great perimeter defense. Lebron proceeded to create much of his points of isolations and a seldom nice cut. Not exactly good for the team at large. Bosh isn't a physical four, and that was exposed once again tonight with one of the toughest front courts in the league.

But what I truly don't understand is with the only two centers on the team out, with the addition of Wade and Haslem, why the hell didn't Lebron take it upon himself to guard Z-bo at any point tonight? Even for a single minute? The loss isn't on him in any way, but as the biggest most physically dominant player on your team how can you sit on the perimeter and guard the likes of Courtney Lee and James Johnson all night? :confusedshrug: Can anybody explain this to me?

i'm guessing they didn't want to tire him out. the majority of the time, the offense runs through him and the last thing spo wanted to do was exhaust the crap out of him dealing with Z-Bo's post game. nobody else on the heat team could create for themselves besides Bosh every now and then

[secund2nun]

Those teams better not have a point guard on the roster... because, you know... they're worthless.

LOL good reference.

Rose is worthless now that he is massively overpaid not to mention injured (plus provides little spacing so he doesn't fit well with Lebron), but Chicago's front court of Noah and Gibson is amazing. Add Lebron to this year's Chicago team without Rose and they win the title easily. That front court is why Chicago with Lebron would be better than the big 3 Miami squad. Plus a much better coach.

As for CP3 he is one of the true PGs that are legit. He is a top distributor, good defender, nice efficient scorer, can shoot so he can space it out unlike Wade, and even helps out some of the boards. He is one of the best PGs of all time. LA also has a good center in Jordan unlike Miami. Though I'd argue that a Lebron-Griffin-Jordan core would be even better than the CP3-Lebron-Jordan core but Lebron and CP3 are best friends so if he ended up in LA I don't see tbat core happening.

[secund2nun]

you forgot to add:
Wade without Lebron - 1 ring 1 FMVP

Correction: Wade with Shaq= 1 ring

Prime Wade without Shaq or Lebron= nothing but low seeded first round losses or missed playoffs

[MVBallin2K]

This is pretty much what anyone should expect when most of the cap space is taken up by three players. You're only going to have a short window you can win championships and this current Heat team are approaching theirs.

You gotta take the good with the bad. Miami put together a dynasty team and you got two (maybe three if they can pull it together) championships. Any more, you should be thankful for, not entitled to. Very few teams threepeat so if they pull that off then celebrate that. All the Heat fans were ready for the ride when it happened but you gotta take the downfall too when the wheels start to fall off. It's the end of the season, the playoffs are what will tell the real story.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

This Miami team is pure trash outside of Bron, Bosh and Wade included.
just shit players everywhere.
Birdman is probably the second most valuable player and that says everything:facepalm

[RedBlackAttack]

This is pretty much what anyone should expect when most of the cap space is taken up by three players. You're only going to have a short window you can win championships and this current Heat team are approaching theirs.

You gotta take the good with the bad. Miami put together a dynasty team and you got two (maybe three if they can pull it together) championships. Any more, you should be thankful for, not entitled to. Very few teams threepeat so if they pull that off then celebrate that. All the Heat fans were ready for the ride when it happened but you gotta take the downfall too when the wheels start to fall off. It's the end of the season, the playoffs are what will tell the real story.
This isn't about having a reasonable outlook like the one you provide here. This is about setting the table just in case the wheels do fall off this postseason, so the blame falls everywhere but on a certain individual.

It's so incredibly transparent, I'm assuming everyone can see through it.

That isn't to say they are going to lose, but just in case... setting that table is important, here.

[navy]

Those teams better not have a point guard on the roster... because, you know... they're worthless.
Just false. Lebron sets good screens and because teams are afraid to come off him and it gives the Heat guards chances to drive and score. the Heat have increasing run this more because Chalmers is getting better at driving. Cole sucks at it.

Chalmers and Coles cant run an offense at all.

[livinglegend]

they are official all stars in the east. Both starters last year as well. It's official, not just a label I throw in for them.

Dont matter if they are all star in east since you guys has been saying the East is historically weak.

[navy]

This isn't about having a reasonable outlook like the one you provide here. This is about setting the table just in case the wheels do fall off this postseason, so the blame falls everywhere but on a certain individual.

It's so incredibly transparent, I'm assuming everyone can see through it.

That isn't to say they are going to lose, but just in case... setting that table is important, here.
Lebron will get blamed no-matter what happens so it is irrelevant. Just like he was in Cleveland, where they actually were the Cavaliers. :oldlol:

Im sure he wont get credit if he wins either. Another asterisk ring for Lebron. That's three years in a row you know. :rolleyes:

[livinglegend]

Lebron without Wade - 0 rings
Lebron with Wade - 2 rings

He needed Wade and he needed Bosh to get his rings. Its like how everyone uses the fact that Kobe won his rings when he had help (more impressively because he normally had one other star over Lebrons 2).

Kobe with fisher - 5 rings
Kobe without fisher- cant even make the finals

[livinglegend]

you forgot to add:
Wade without Lebron - 1 ring 1 FMVP

Kobe with fisher- 5 rings
Kobe without- cant even make the WCF
Fisher without Kobe- Nba finals

Fisher >> Kobe

[RedBlackAttack]

Just false. Lebron sets good screens and because teams are afraid to come off him and it gives the Heat guards chances to drive and score. the Heat have increasing run this more because Chalmers is getting better at driving. Cole sucks at it.

Chalmers and Coles cant run an offense at all.
:facepalm


Lebron will get blamed no-matter what happens so it is irrelevant. Just like he was in Cleveland, where they actually were the Cavaliers. :oldlol:

Im sure he wont get credit if he wins either. Another asterisk ring for Lebron. That's three years in a row you know. :rolleyes:

Oh, yeah... he certainly was blamed. Because, you know, it's not like teams who won 60+ games in multiple seasons and went to the ECF and Finals are routinely mocked on this site, including in this very thread.

That doesn't happen.

No, for the most part, people blame LeBron James -- not the Cavs -- for not being able to pull together a title from 2003-10. I'm sure you're right. And, there is no better thread to illustrate that point.

[navy]

:facepalm
You can facepalm all you want, it's the truth. Unless I misread your post :oldlol:

[RedBlackAttack]

You can facepalm all you want, it's the truth. Unless I misread your post :oldlol:
Sarcasm is not always easily detectable on the Internet. For context, look up second2nun's ranting on basically every PG in the NBA. He hates virtually all of them. He especially has a thing for Kyrie Irving, who he inexplicably brought up out of the blue in this thread, as well.

Also, check the edit.

[navy]

:facepalm



Oh, yeah... he certainly was blamed. Because, you know, it's not like teams who won 60+ games in multiple seasons and went to the ECF and Finals are routinely mocked on this site, including in this very thread.

That doesn't happen.

No, for the most part, people blame LeBron James -- not the Cavs -- for not being able to pull together a title from 2003-10. I'm sure you're right. And, there is no better thread to illustrate that point.

Let's be honest, everything about Lebron James has a polarizing effect, so it isnt hard to find anything in any direction about him. To say he wasnt blamed for those loses or perhaps I should say sarcastically imply, would be pretty asinine. Why do you think people started calling Lebron a choker before 2011, his only real choke? :confusedshrug:

[zoom17]

Feel like this Heat team will play up to there standard in the playoffs and wade has a decent playoffs run.

[RedBlackAttack]

Let's be honest, everything about Lebron James has a polarizing effect, so it isnt hard to find anything in any direction about him. To say he wasnt blamed for those loses or perhaps I should say sarcastically imply, would be pretty asinine. Why do you think people started calling Lebron a choker before 2011, his only real choke? :confusedshrug:
Well, to be fair, he also completely threw in the towel with the Cavs up 2-1 against the Celtics in 2010. In fact, the last three games of that series looked an awful lot like the last few games of the Dallas series the next season.

And, no... I don't accept that James is largely blamed for the Cavs' failure to win a title from 2003-10. He's not, by and large, and as a Cavs fan, I'm not even allowed to harken back to those days as good ones for the franchise without being laughed at.

Somehow, 60+ win teams that were a lot of people's favorites to win it in a couple of those years, went to the ECF, started out the playoffs 8-0 once, went to the Finals...

Those teams deserve to be laughed at and mocked... constantly.

But, I should accept that James is blamed for them? Come on.

[Bandito]

Who's up for a bet that Op's a fggt? I'm in.

[dude77]

miami not playing well = horrible team .. lebron has no help

miami wins titles = they're stacked .. lebron teamed up with two other superstars .. he needed help to win .. he didn't earn anything lol ..


so which is it .. did lebron win his titles with superstar help or did he carry a shit team ? which is it you dumb fggts .. fkn hypocrite bipolar schizos on this board

[edrick]

miami not playing well = horrible team .. lebron has no help

miami wins titles = they're stacked .. lebron teamed up with two other superstars .. he needed help to win .. he didn't earn anything lol ..


so which is it .. did lebron win his titles with superstar help or did he carry a shit team ? which is it you dumb fggts .. fkn hypocrite bipolar schizos on this board

You answered your own question, it depends on whether or not the Heat win or lose.

[navy]

Well, to be fair, he also completely threw in the towel with the Cavs up 2-1 against the Celtics in 2010. In fact, the last three games of that series looked an awful lot like the last few games of the Dallas series the next season.

And, no... I don't accept that James is largely blamed for the Cavs' failure to win a title from 2003-10. He's not, by and large, and as a Cavs fan, I'm not even allowed to harken back to those days as good ones for the franchise without being laughed at.

Somehow, 60+ win teams that were a lot of people's favorites to win it in a couple of those years, went to the ECF, started out the playoffs 8-0 once, went to the Finals...

Those teams deserve to be laughed at and mocked... constantly.

But, I should accept that James is blamed for them? Come on.

Game 4: 22 points, 9 rebounds, 8 assist
6 fourth quarter field goal attempts

Game 5: Bad Game for Lebron 3-14, but 9-12 freethrows.
Boston Blowout-Quit though? I need some evidence of that

Game 6: 27 points, 19 rebounds, 10 assist
6 fourth quarter field goal attempts


GOAT Quitter :oldlol:

Definitely comparable to Dallas...

Sounds like you are just bitter to me. Like I said you can find anything you
want to about Lebron James. He's that polarizing.

Hell yeah, Cleveland deserves to be laugh at. Whole city is a failure. Looking back, the Cavs suck and lucked into (probably rigged) a once in a generation basketball talent. Just what it is.

[secund2nun]

Sarcasm is not always easily detectable on the Internet. For context, look up second2nun's ranting on basically every PG in the NBA. He hates virtually all of them. He especially has a thing for Kyrie Irving, who he inexplicably brought up out of the blue in this thread, as well.

Also, check the edit.

I believe most PGs are overrated. The reason I said Chicago would have been better for Lebron is because of their great front court plus coach and Miami has a crap center rotation and garbage coach. Though Rose there with a huge contract makes it a less desirable place.

PGs like Stockton, Nash, and CP3 are fine by me as they are great passers and all 3 can space the floor. I am still iffy on the huge contract for CP3, but at least he is a star player unlike most other PGs.

[navy]

I believe most PGs are overrated. The reason I said Chicago would have been better for Lebron is because of their great front court plus coach and Miami has a crap center rotation and garbage coach. Though Rose there with a huge contract makes it a less desirable place.

PGs like Stockton, Nash, and CP3 are fine by me as they are great passers and all 3 can space the floor. I am still iffy on the huge contract for CP3, but at least he is a star player unlike most other PGs.
Hmm.... I think great point guards are so important to their teams offense that they hide the offense flaws until the postseason where the other players on the team and thus the point guards ability to create are exposed.

However, let's be honest. Titles are won by the best players in the NBA regardless of position. Past 15 years have had Duncan, Wade, and Kobe in the finals. Before that it was basically Jordan.

[The-Legend-24]

How much more help does this nikka need?

2 Superstars in their prime - check

GOAT 3 point shooter - check

Top 3 perimeter defender of all time in Battier - check

Top 10 coach in Spo - check

:biggums:

[J Shuttlesworth]

How much more help does this nikka need?

2 Superstars in their prime - check

GOAT 3 point shooter - check

Top 3 perimeter defender of all time in Battier - check

Top 10 coach in Spo - check

:biggums:
By this logic, there's no excuse for Kobe to barely make the playoffs last year. They should have won a ring, and been 2 peating this year

4 HOF? check

2nd GOAT SG? check

Best C in the league? Check

One of the best PG's of all time? Check

A guy to carry the 2nd GOAT SG through the finals? Check (Pau)

[RedBlackAttack]

Definitely comparable to Dallas...

Oh, it definitely was. And, even James' biggest supporters on here were baffled by his performances at the time. Don't waste your time giving me statistics, especially cherry-picked statistics without delving too deeply... like the fact that he shot 34% from the field, 15% from three and 74% from the line in those last three games. He also had 19 turnovers, many critical, late in the game (that's over 6 a game, if you're keeping tabs).

It wasn't because the Cs were just bottling him up. It was because he stopped attacking and his breaking down of the defense was integral to how that team's offense worked. He stood in the corner on far too many possessions.

But, ignoring all that, basketball isn't played in a boxscore. He looked either distracted or disinterested, especially in the most important game of the series. The Cavs had just split in Boston, were back in Cleveland and everyone expected a huge game... everything was on the line.

It was obvious going back to Boston down 3-2 was going to be the end.

That was the moment he chose for arguably his worst game as a Cavalier. Again, looked disinterested... distracted... something.


I was completely baffled by it until I saw him take a similar path when things really heated up against Dallas the following season. The biggest difference between the Cs in 2010 and Dallas in 2011 was that Wade was on his team in 2011, so he naturally assumed what James' role was supposed to be and became the team's initiator/attacker on offense.

The Cavs didn't have that luxury, so they were forced to continue to feed James the ball, even though it looked like he didn't want it most of the time.


There's nothing bitter about it. James was awesome in 2009. That was one of the greatest individual playoff runs I've ever seen. I've never been afraid to admit James' greatness on the basketball court. That series against the Cs, though... yikes. It was bad.

[secund2nun]

Hmm.... I think great point guards are so important to their teams offense that they hide the offense flaws until the postseason where the other players on the team and thus the point guards ability to create are exposed.

However, let's be honest. Titles are won by the best players in the NBA regardless of position. Past 15 years have had Duncan, Wade, and Kobe in the finals. Before that it was basically Jordan.

I agree I like distributing PGs as long as they are reasonably paid like Nash was at 10-13 million a year. Chucking ball hog PGs like Rose I don't like at all, especially when they for some crazy reason get paid huge max contracts.

[secund2nun]

Oh, it definitely was. And, even James' biggest supporters on here were baffled by his performances at the time. Don't waste your time giving me statistics, especially cherry-picked statistics without delving too deeply... like the fact that he shot 34% from the field, 15% from three and 74% from the line in those last three games. He also had 19 turnovers, many critical, late in the game (that's over 6 a game, if you're keeping tabs).

It wasn't because the Cs were just bottling him up. It was because he stopped attacking and his breaking down of the defense was integral to how that team's offense worked. He stood in the corner on far too many possessions.

But, ignoring all that, basketball isn't played in a boxscore. He looked either distracted or disinterested, especially in the most important game of the series. The Cavs had just split in Boston, were back in Cleveland and everyone expected a huge game... everything was on the line.

It was obvious going back to Boston down 3-2 was going to be the end.

That was the moment he chose for arguably his worst game as a Cavalier. Again, looked disinterested... distracted... something.


I was completely baffled by it until I saw him take a similar path when things really heated up against Dallas the following season. The biggest difference between the Cs in 2010 and Dallas in 2011 was that Wade was on his team in 2011, so he naturally assumed what James' role was supposed to be and became the team's initiator/attacker on offense.

The Cavs didn't have that luxury, so they were forced to continue to feed James the ball, even though it looked like he didn't want it most of the time.


There's nothing bitter about it. James was awesome in 2009. That was one of the greatest individual playoff runs I've ever seen. I've never been afraid to admit James' greatness on the basketball court. That series against the Cs, though... yikes. It was bad.

Lebron in that series: 27 ppg on 19 shots per game, 9 rpg, 7 apg, 4.5 top while being doubled and tripled while completely shutting down Pierce.

No player has ever been as scrutinized and held to a higher standard as Lebron James.

The blame lies on the Cavs teammates and Mike Brown for doing nothing on offense and defense, especially Mo Williams who did nothing offensively and made Rondo look like Magic Johnson and the Cavs front court got destroyed by KG. Rondo went something like 21/12/6 and KG nearly averaged a 20/10 in that series.

You can't blame Lebron for his idiot coach and the idiot ISO offense, nor can you blame him for his teammates missing every shot and allowing Rondo and KG to murder them.

[Mrofir]

It's true this team would be absolutely nowhere this year without LBJ. Bunch of scrubs... why, without Lebron they would be the... 3rd seed.

Hm.

[navy]

Oh, it definitely was. And, even James' biggest supporters on here were baffled by his performances at the time. Don't waste your time giving me statistics, especially cherry-picked statistics without delving too deeply... like the fact that he shot 34% from the field, 15% from three and 74% from the line in those last three games. He also had 19 turnovers, many critical, late in the game (that's over 6 a game, if you're keeping tabs). Nothing there suggest he quit. He clearly was still firing shots and had the ball in his hand. He played bad, but he was still clearly trying. I just havent seen evidence of him not.



It wasn't because the Cs were just bottling him up. It was because he stopped attacking and his breaking down of the defense was integral to how that team's offense worked. He stood in the corner on far too many possessions.
But, ignoring all that, basketball isn't played in a boxscore. He looked either distracted or disinterested, especially in the most important game of the series. The Cavs had just split in Boston, were back in Cleveland and everyone expected a huge game... everything was on the line.



It was obvious going back to Boston down 3-2 was going to be the end.

That was the moment he chose for arguably his worst game as a Cavalier. Again, looked disinterested... distracted... something.


I was completely baffled by it until I saw him take a similar path when things really heated up against Dallas the following season. The biggest difference between the Cs in 2010 and Dallas in 2011 was that Wade was on his team in 2011, so he naturally assumed what James' role was supposed to be and became the team's initiator/attacker on offense.

The Cavs didn't have that luxury, so they were forced to continue to feed James the ball, even though it looked like he didn't want it most of the time.


There's nothing bitter about it. James was awesome in 2009. That was one of the greatest individual playoff runs I've ever seen. I've never been afraid to admit James' greatness on the basketball court. That series against the Cs, though... yikes. It was bad.

I didnt see a quit. I saw, Lebron's jumper disappear and the Celtics setting up their defense to stop his drives. And yes, Lebron will go sit in the corner when teams do that even to this day if the Coach isnt smart enough to run plays outside of a Lebron iso or pick and roll at the top of the key. Lebron had no post game then as well.

[navy]

Lebron in that series: 27 ppg on 19 shots per game, 9 rpg, 7 apg, 4.5 top while being doubled and tripled while completely shutting down Pierce.

No player has ever been as scrutinized and held to a higher standard as Lebron James.

The blame lies on the Cavs teammates and Mike Brown for doing nothing on offense and defense, especially Mo Williams who did nothing offensively and made Rondo look like Magic Johnson and the Cavs front court got destroyed by KG. Rondo went something like 21/12/6 and KG nearly averaged a 20/10 in that series.

You can't blame Lebron for his idiot coach and the idiot ISO offense, nor can you blame him for his teammates missing every shot and allowing Rondo and KG to murder them.
Pretty much this. Bad offense and Bad defense by the Cavs. Lebron just couldnt overcome it, partly due to his own deficiencies, but also as a team. He was still trying though. At least it looked that way to me. :confusedshrug:

[RedBlackAttack]

Lebron in that series: 27 ppg on 19 shots per game, 9 rpg, 7 apg, 4.5 top while being doubled and tripled while completely shutting down Pierce.

No player has ever been as scrutinized and held to a higher standard as Lebron James.

The blame lies on the Cavs teammates and Mike Brown for doing nothing on offense and defense, especially Mo Williams who did nothing offensively and made Rondo look like Magic Johnson and the Cavs front court got destroyed by KG. Rondo went something like 21/12/6 and KG nearly averaged a 20/10 in that series.

You can't blame Lebron for his idiot coach and the idiot ISO offense, nor can you blame him for his teammates missing every shot and allowing Rondo and KG to murder them.
First of all, my beef with James in that series has nothing to do with games 1-3. His Game 3 was incredible, as it was by the whole team. They went into Boston in what people assumed was going to be the biggest game of the series and absolutely destroyed them.

James led the way, but he wasn't alone. Because he was in attack mode, the offense was clicking on all cylinders. All the starters plus Delonte scored in double-figures. Jamison put up 20/12. Mo and Delonte combined for 26/10 at the point.

It was a beatdown in every phase of the game.


That's what made the final three games so baffling. And, no... his standing around, looking disinterested had nothing to do with Pierce or his teammates or anyone else.

In the aforementioned most important game of the season -- LeBron's worst -- Game 5, Shaq was completely dominant in the first half when the game was still close. He almost single-handedly kept us within striking distance while James stood around.

Anyone who believes James played up to his true capabilities in those final three games and that it was the Cavs/Brown's fault are beyond saving. He was terri-awful considering what was on the line and what he's capable of... and what the Cavs had done all season and even in that particular series prior to his checking out mentally.

I'm not sure if it was the looming free agency or just too much pressure, but something clicked to the "off" position in those final three games. And, he deserved/deserves criticism for it.

[El Gato Negro]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-v5qIApQK0c&app=desktop no denying bron quit in that game, i was there and saw him wave off coach brown telling the team not to bother fouling even tho the game wasn't over. Worst thing i have ever "witnessed" at a sporting event, there's no defending or excuse for it.

[Mr. Incredible]

:facepalm

Can we give this up already?

The Heat have been playing poorly. It starts with LeBron and trickles down to the last man on the bench. It's time to stop giving passes. That goes for James as well. His turnovers have cost the Heat too. If Wade doesn't play, so be it. The Heat have enough firepower to win this games.

But instead, how about give Brooklyn and Memphis credit? They deserved to win the games and made the most important plays of the game to be successful.

Miami will be fine.

[chazzy]

Lebron's final 3 games of 2010 were disappointing as hell considering the extremely high level of play he was at for the entire season and playoffs up until that point. It came out of nowhere, especially that bizarre game 5. It doesn't get talked about much because it happened right before the decision and 2011 disaster.

[AintNoSunshine]

Our king? LOL

Hes a b|tch and if he's soo good, why does he need more help?


Tell me how far your boyfriend went around 2006 when he wasn't carried, you kunt.

I hope I didn't make you feel like being harrassed :oldlol:

[Mr. Incredible]

Tell me how far your boyfriend went around 2006 when he wasn't carried, you kunt.

I hope I didn't make you feel like being harrassed :oldlol:
Why do you guys constantly feed the trolls? :facepalm

Stop being weak.

[Solefade]

so.. lebron can't win unless he has 2 stars healthy. Gotcha.


d. wade was never healthy when the heat has won the past couple years :confusedshrug:

[Mr. Incredible]

d. wade was never healthy when the heat has won the past couple years :confusedshrug:
Again, he made an illogical comment to get someone like you to respond? When will you guys learn? :facepalm

[All Net]

Miami cast is very overrated these days.. People see the names and not the production.

[Nash]

Can you people please discuss Miami's roster for one second instead of shitting on each other and Lebron? Clearly Lebron is the best thing Miami has right now and not exactly the problem here.

Also, here is what people need to understand about Miami. They are built top heavy. When James, Bosh and Wade were offered their big contracts they were expected to play like 20ppg+ type of players. Today in 2014 that is not the case anymore. With those 3 getting that much money, the rest of the squad consists of old players and average guys who are not wanted. Miami's problem is that Bosh and Wade are not playing up to the almost 40m they take away from the salary cap which makes Miami really, really vulnerable since they are as I said extremely top heavy team. For those 40m Miami could have had 2 15m per year players and one 10m player and as long as they don't play well below what they are paid for like Bosh and Wade, Miami will be fine.

[Andrei89]

so.. lebron can't win unless he has 2 stars healthy. Gotcha.


Kobe never, ever did anything on his own. :lol :lol

This thread sucks btw, Miami will be fine come playoffs.

[coin24]

Can you people please discuss Miami's roster for one second instead of shitting on each other and Lebron? Clearly Lebron is the best thing Miami has right now and not exactly the problem here.

Also, here is what people need to understand about Miami. They are built top heavy. When James, Bosh and Wade were offered their big contracts they were expected to play like 20ppg+ type of players. Today in 2014 that is not the case anymore. With those 3 getting that much money, the rest of the squad consists of old players and average guys who are not wanted. Miami's problem is that Bosh and Wade are not playing up to the almost 40m they take away from the salary cap which makes Miami really, really vulnerable since they are as I said extremely top heavy team. For those 40m Miami could have had 2 15m per year players and one 10m player and as long as they don't play well below what they are paid for like Bosh and Wade, Miami will be fine.

The heat are wades team, pauk..
Beta bran ran to join his stacked squad, boo hoo now they can't carry his choking ass to a 4th finals it's not fair:cry:

[Marlo_Stanfield]

The heat are wades team, pauk..
Beta bran ran to join his stacked squad, boo hoo now they can't carry his choking ass to a 4th finals it's not fair:cry:
reported

[Nash]

The heat are wades team, pauk..
Beta bran ran to join his stacked squad, boo hoo now they can't carry his choking ass to a 4th finals it's not fair:cry:
I swear, sometimes I wish for a good basketball discussion only for idiots like you come in with their trolling nonsense.

[coin24]

reported

Reported


Go outside once in a while

[sd3035]

Bran can't get it done without Wade, even with the most stacked team in the league

[Castor Troy]

this feels like the last run for the 'big 3'. Bosh and Wade have declined to a point where LeBron is so far ahead of the rest of the team that it does have a little Cavs feel about the team.

Despite that, I still feel that they are too good for any Eastern Conference opposition and will make it to a 4th Finals in a row. Where it goes from next year though...

[Dresta]

Kobe with fisher- 5 rings
Kobe without- cant even make the WCF
Fisher without Kobe- Nba finals

Fisher >> Kobe
Yeah, because winning a chip and finals mvp with an absolutely dominant playoff and finals run (as Wade did) without Bron is the same as Fisher making the finals as a below average role player.

:hammerhead:

[jzek]

Nothing more I want this season than for the Heat to get eliminated in the playoffs. Why? It makes LeBron leaving Miami that much more likely.

Let's face it - Miami isn't good anymore with Wade done and Bosh isn't the #2 option that you can win titles with.

LeBron needs to go to a better team with a better supporting cast than these old and washed-up Heatles.

[Demitri98]

you forgot to add:
Wade without Lebron - 1 ring 1 FMVP
Wade with Shaq - 1 ring
LeBron with Shaq - No rings

[JellyBean]

Bosh is worst than Mo Williams right now:facepalm
Wade is on vacation.
Oden in a nursing room.
Chalmers and Cole, dumb and dumber
Lewis, Battier, Haslem, Allen: old

Oh boy. I hope that this thread gets pinned or whatever. So that we can look back and see what folks were saying when the Heat 3-peat.

Jeez. The whole over reacting to Bosh is getting silly. "Bosh is worst than Mo Williams" Really? Slow down, folks.

[secund2nun]

First of all, my beef with James in that series has nothing to do with games 1-3. His Game 3 was incredible, as it was by the whole team. They went into Boston in what people assumed was going to be the biggest game of the series and absolutely destroyed them.

James led the way, but he wasn't alone. Because he was in attack mode, the offense was clicking on all cylinders. All the starters plus Delonte scored in double-figures. Jamison put up 20/12. Mo and Delonte combined for 26/10 at the point.

It was a beatdown in every phase of the game.


That's what made the final three games so baffling. And, no... his standing around, looking disinterested had nothing to do with Pierce or his teammates or anyone else.

In the aforementioned most important game of the season -- LeBron's worst -- Game 5, Shaq was completely dominant in the first half when the game was still close. He almost single-handedly kept us within striking distance while James stood around.

Anyone who believes James played up to his true capabilities in those final three games and that it was the Cavs/Brown's fault are beyond saving. He was terri-awful considering what was on the line and what he's capable of... and what the Cavs had done all season and even in that particular series prior to his checking out mentally.

I'm not sure if it was the looming free agency or just too much pressure, but something clicked to the "off" position in those final three games. And, he deserved/deserves criticism for it.

Series averages:

Lebron: 27-9-7, 45% fg
Pierce: 13-5-4, 35% fg

Mo:.........13-5-4, 41% fg
Rondo:....21-12-6, 54% fg

Jamison:...12-7 42% fg
KG:...........19-8-2 52% fg

Parker:.......8-3-1, 50% fg
Ray:..........16-3-2, 43% fg

Shaq:.......13.5-5, 42% fg
Andy:.......6-6, 46% fg
Perkins:....7-7, , 64% fg

What more is there to say. Just look at that. Lebron was the only Cavs player who was not pathetic or mediocre. Even Kendric Perkins out played Shaq and Varejao. No player in NBA history would get criticized when he plays that well and his teammates play that poorly...except for Lebron.

The theory that Lebron quit while averaging 27-9-8 on 19 spg against a great team shutting down Pierce and having Mike Brown as his coach and had a 27-19-8 game in game 6 after "quiting" is an example of how unreasonable people are toward Lebron. The hatred clouds people's judgement.

That series was all his teammates and Mike Brown's fault. Mike Brown, Jamison, and Mo Williams are the 3 biggest reasons for the series loss.

[BlackVVaves]

The reason is that Lebron is the entire offense...he has little energy left. Guarding Z-bo would be very draining. If other players stepped up on offense he could expend more energy on defense.

And yet, when this logic is applied to other stars during past NBA seasons, it's inexplicably responded with "It doesn't matter if Player A is Team A's entire offense; if he can't produce defensively simultaneously, he isn't that good. That saving his energy for offense is a cop out. Player A just can't play defense."

And there are SEVERAL instances throughout ISH where this paraphrasing occurred. So tell us, on a day where it was yet again argued that what makes LeBron so impactful defensively is his ability to "defend 1-5," is it okay to not emphasize on defense when you are the beginning and end of your team's offense, or is LeBron's unwillingness to guard Z-Bo....a power forward who was going off on the Heat from the opening tip....culpable of the same criticism other stars have received when not performing effectively defensively/indicative of the opinion that "LeBron can guard any position no problem!" is severely overstated?

Which one is it?

[navy]

And yet, when this logic is applied to other stars during past NBA seasons, it's inexplicably responded with "It doesn't matter if Player A is Team A's entire offense; if he can't produce defensively simultaneously, he isn't that good. That saving his energy for offense is a cop out. Player A just can't play defense."

And there are SEVERAL instances throughout ISH where this paraphrasing occurred. So tell us, on a day where it was yet again argued that what makes LeBron so impactful defensively is his ability to "defend 1-5," is it okay to not emphasize on defense when you are the beginning and end of your team's offense, or is LeBron's unwillingness to guard Z-Bo....a power forward who was going off on the Heat from the opening tip....culpable of the same criticism other stars have received when not performing effectively defensively/indicative of the opinion that "LeBron can guard any position no problem!" is severely overstated?

Which one is it?
The Heat shut Z-bo down. Did you watch the game? He had no production after the first quarter. Do you know how they shut him down? Fronting and rotating.

What is wrong with you guys? Why would they stop something that's working?

[secund2nun]

And yet, when this logic is applied to other stars during past NBA seasons, it's inexplicably responded with "It doesn't matter if Player A is Team A's entire offense; if he can't produce defensively simultaneously, he isn't that good. That saving his energy for offense is a cop out. Player A just can't play defense."

And there are SEVERAL instances throughout ISH where this paraphrasing occurred. So tell us, on a day where it was yet again argued that what makes LeBron so impactful defensively is his ability to "defend 1-5," is it okay to not emphasize on defense when you are the beginning and end of your team's offense, or is LeBron's unwillingness to guard Z-Bo....a power forward who was going off on the Heat from the opening tip....culpable of the same criticism other stars have received when not performing effectively defensively/indicative of the opinion that "LeBron can guard any position no problem!" is severely overstated?

Which one is it?

You do realize that Lebron's offense load is even larger than normal right now because Wade and Birdman didn't play last game and Wade hasn't played in a long time right?

With Wade Lebron doesn't have to carry quite as much burden on offense and can focus more on defense. Lebron already does a ton on defense. Miami has won titles with no paint anchor because of Lebron's unique defensive abilities.

[tpols]

Series averages:

Lebron: 27-9-7, 45% fg
Pierce: 13-5-4, 35% fg

Mo:.........13-5-4, 41% fg
Rondo:....21-12-6, 54% fg

Jamison:...12-7 42% fg
KG:...........19-8-2 52% fg

Parker:.......8-3-1, 50% fg
Ray:..........16-3-2, 43% fg

Shaq:.......13.5-5, 42% fg
Andy:.......6-6, 46% fg
Perkins:....7-7, , 64% fg

What more is there to say. Just look at that. Lebron was the only Cavs player who was not pathetic or mediocre. Even Kendric Perkins out played Shaq and Varejao. No player in NBA history would get criticized when he plays that well and his teammates play that poorly...except for Lebron.

The theory that Lebron quit while averaging 27-9-8 on 19 spg against a great team shutting down Pierce and having Mike Brown as his coach and had a 27-19-8 game in game 6 after "quiting" is an example of how unreasonable people are toward Lebron. The hatred clouds people's judgement.

That series was all his teammates and Mike Brown's fault. Mike Brown, Jamison, and Mo Williams are the 3 biggest reasons for the series loss.

Whose insight are we going to value here?


A longtime cavs fan whose followed the team inside out during the 2010 playoffs (and every other playoffs regular season, draft, etc.) who is a mod on this site, and one of the most level headed posters

or some punk kid who tries to look smart by showing boxscores weve all seen a thousand times? lol..


Everyone saw elbowgate.. the guy was straight up making excuses for why he couldnt go hard with a fake injury. Lebron can put up stats while going passive.. the difference is when hes aggressive his stats are out of this world and when hes not his stats are just ordinary superstar. He took his foot off the pedal in 2010 and quit on his team.. the stats you posted have literally nothing to do with anything

[FLDFSU]

Whose insight are we going to value here?


A longtime cavs fan whose followed the team inside out during the 2010 playoffs (and every other playoffs regular season, draft, etc.) who is a mod on this site, and one of the most level headed posters

or some punk kid who tries to look smart by showing boxscores weve all seen a thousand times? lol..


Everyone saw elbowgate.. the guy was straight up making excuses for why he couldnt go hard with a fake injury. Lebron can put up stats while going passive.. the difference is when hes aggressive his stats are out of this world and when hes not his stats are just ordinary superstar. He took his foot off the pedal in 2010 and quit on his team.. the stats you posted have literally nothing to do with anything

so pretty much you have nothing?

[Straight_Ballin]

The reason is that Lebron is the entire offense...he has little energy left. Guarding Z-bo would be very draining. If other players stepped up on offense he could expend more energy on defense.

Have to disagree on this. Jordan guarded the best while shitting on the other team offensively like many other players. It's just shitty coaching in Spo and nothing more.

[navy]

so pretty much you have nothing?
He tried to appeal to authority. :oldlol:


Isnt RedBlackAttack the one who claimed he would stop watching basketball if Lebron won a ring? Definitely level headed and objective. :oldlol:

[BlackVVaves]

The Heat shut Z-bo down. Did you watch the game? He had no production after the first quarter. Do you know how they shut him down? Fronting and rotating.

What is wrong with you guys? Why would they stop something that's working?

And when their defense honed in on Z-Bo after the first quarter, Gasol and Conley went off; the latter particularly in the closing quarter.

So again, I ask; if part of the perception as to why LeBron is the most unique basketball specimen in history is because of his uncanny ability to guard and effectively shut down any position on the court, any place on the court....then why didn't it occur last night? Surely LeBron's defensive prowess would have been better suited elsewhere instead of following Courtney Lee and James Johnson around the court?

I'm not disqualifying LeBron's ability to play defense (though clearly this is one of his worse years defensively in his career). I'm just posing these questions to comb through the hypocritical rhetoric that LeBron stans pitch around here. And trust me, you all aren't the only disillusioned stan community here that I've tossed purposeful inquiries at; it's just, lately, your kind have been insufferable around these parts. Like when some of you have clamored for Bron to be DPOY.

Most impactful defender in the league they say, but it's okay for him to take plays...games....off because of the heavy load he carries offensively. But, it's not okay for Melo, KD, Kobe, ect to do the same.

Huh?

Most versatile defender in the league, but doesn't take on the Z-Bos, Marc Gasols, Roy Hibberts of the world when they are shredding the Heat in the post.

Huh??

I think he's the best player in the league. I also think his level of superiority is grossly exaggerated by his stans. And hey, it's what all stans do. But don't sit at your keyboard/on your hand-held crucifying stans of other players then when they follow your lead.



You do realize that Lebron's offense load is even larger than normal right now because Wade and Birdman didn't play last game and Wade hasn't played in a long time right?

With Wade Lebron doesn't have to carry quite as much burden on offense and can focus more on defense. Lebron already does a ton on defense. Miami has won titles with no paint anchor because of Lebron's unique defensive abilities.

So again I ask, in your estimation, it's cool for a player - when he has little to no help offensively - to take plays, even games off at a time defensively?

That's all I'm really asking.

And by the way, Miami won tithes with no paint anchor because of "Spobot's" defensive scheme built around athletic players who can move swiftly laterally and trap hard on the perimeter. Of which, LeBron indeed is the best, but not the sole cog. Wade, Bosh, and Battier have done a terrific job in their past title runs defending the pick and roll and disrupting offensive sets.

[Straight_Ballin]

Can you people please discuss Miami's roster for one second instead of shitting on each other and Lebron? Clearly Lebron is the best thing Miami has right now and not exactly the problem here.

Also, here is what people need to understand about Miami. They are built top heavy. When James, Bosh and Wade were offered their big contracts they were expected to play like 20ppg+ type of players. Today in 2014 that is not the case anymore. With those 3 getting that much money, the rest of the squad consists of old players and average guys who are not wanted. Miami's problem is that Bosh and Wade are not playing up to the almost 40m they take away from the salary cap which makes Miami really, really vulnerable since they are as I said extremely top heavy team. For those 40m Miami could have had 2 15m per year players and one 10m player and as long as they don't play well below what they are paid for like Bosh and Wade, Miami will be fine.

Bron CHOSE to go to Miami and leave Cleveland. He couldn't win with Mo and he did win with Wade/Bosh. So yes, he knew he NEEDED them to win because if he felt he didn't, he would have signed with another team. This is 2014, not 2012, shit happens, heat won't three peat because bosh wade aren't playing like they we're and this needs to be accepted.

[FLDFSU]

can somebody explain to me how you can grab 19 rebounds in 48 minutes, play the entire game, score 27 points and quit at the same time?

does anybody think its possible Bron to teach bosh how to quit? maybe if bosh quit we could get 10 rebounds out of him.

[tpols]

so pretty much you have nothing?



His team down by 27 points and a promising season suddenly in peril, LeBron James walked off the floor to a smattering of boos and rows of empty seats.

If this was goodbye Cleveland, it wasn't the send-off he imagined.

The Boston Celtics have pushed the two-time MVP and the Cavaliers dangerously close to an early start to the Summer of LeBron.

Ray Allen scored 25 points, Rajon Rondo scored all of his 16 in the second half and the Celtics, once thought too old to challenge for another title, beat James and the Cavs 120-88 in Game 5 on Tuesday night to move within one win of knocking the league's top team from the playoffs.

Paul Pierce added 21 and Kevin Garnett 18 for the Celtics, who handed the Cavs their worst home playoff loss in history and can end Cleveland's season with a win in Game 6 on Thursday night.

"We cannot come back here," Garnett said. "We have to think this is our Game 7 coming up and we cannot afford to have the best team in the league have a Game 7 on their floor. Just not possible."

James, on the verge of an expected trip into free agency on July 1, had an atrocious game. He scored 15 points on 3-of-14 shooting, a startling outing for the 25-year-old who has been playing with a sprained elbow. He refused to use his injury as an excuse.

Celtics Storm Cleveland
Boston beat Cleveland by the largest margin of victory ever in a Game 5 with the series tied in a seven-game series.

"I missed a lot of open shots that I normally make," he said with little emotion. "You don't see that out of me a lot so when it happens, it's a big surprise."

Because of James' uncertain future, Game 5 may have been his last at home for Cleveland and it has set up Game 6 as the most important in franchise history: Win and force Game 7 on Sunday in Cleveland; lose and maybe watch James, the local kid trying to deliver this city its first pro championship since 1964, leave for good.

"Our backs are against the wall," James said. "We've won on that floor before and we've got to get it done."

As for this potentially being his last game in Cleveland, James added: "I didn't even think about that. Me sitting up here and saying this is potentially our last game here this season, that wouldn't be me and that wouldn't be our team."

The articles from game 5 are actually kinda eerie.. looking back at it. Eveything points to his mind being somewhere else..

As for the last bolded quote, its absurd for Lebron to have said he didnt even think about it being his last game in cleveland.. you know he didnt decide to go to miami on a whim.. that was in his mind for a while. I honestly think the guilt/anxiety knowing he was about to leave them took over and he just lost focus on pursuing anything or trying hard for the team anymore.

He came out in game 6 harder to atone, but it was the game 5 dissapearance that had already turned the tides of the series.. it was the biggest blowout in a tied series ever.. if that doesnt affect where the series is going I dont know what will.

[HiphopRelated]

Lebron needs to keep playing within the offense and stop dribbling going nowhere for 10 secs.

You get perfectly good ball movement for several possessions, then Bron needs to get his and the game gets bogged down

[FLDFSU]

The articles from game 5 are actually kinda eerie.. looking back at it. Eveything points to his mind being somewhere else..

As for the last bolded quote, its absurd for Lebron to have said he didnt even think about it being his last game in cleveland.. you know he didnt decide to go to miami on a whim.. that was in his mind for a while. I honestly think the guilt/anxiety knowing he was about to leave them took over and he just lost focus on pursuing anything or trying hard for the team anymore.

He came out in game 6 harder to atone, but it was the game 5 dissapearance that had already turned the tides of the series.. it was the biggest blowout in a tied series ever.. if that doesnt affect where the series is going I dont know what will.

I will say this again. Boston, had it not been for a KG injury and the formation of the Heat, would have gone to 5 straight finals. FIVE STRAIGHT FINALS!

Boston was a CHAMPIONSHIP team. I have no idea where people get off on the idea that one player could defeat a TEAM full of HOFs with a All-star PG and an HOF Coach.

The line-up of Allen, Pierce, KG, Rondo, and Perkins HAD NEVER LOST A SERIES. EVER!

Talk about having it easy. First they ganged up on Wade, then Lebron, then Howard, and ALMOST got Kobe (Perkins was injured for game 7).

Micheal Jordan himself is NOT defeating that Celtics teams by himself.

So stop DISRESPECTING Boston and acting like 1 person is capable of winning a 7 game series against them.

[Solefade]

I will say this again. Boston, had it not been for a KG injury and the formation of the Heat, would have gone to 5 straight finals. FIVE STRAIGHT FINALS!

Boston was a CHAMPIONSHIP team. I have no idea where people get off on the idea that one player could defeat a TEAM full of HOFs with a All-star PG and an HOF Coach.

The line-up of Allen, Pierce, KG, Rondo, and Perkins HAD NEVER LOST A SERIES. EVER!

Talk about having it easy. First they ganged up on Wade, then Lebron, then Howard, and ALMOST got Kobe (Perkins was injured for game 7).

Micheal Jordan himself is NOT defeating that Celtics teams by himself.

So stop DISRESPECTING Boston and acting like 1 person is capable of winning a 7 game series against them.



you're talking to kobe fans who psyche themselves into believing Kobe's as good as Shaq and Kobe did it all by himself through 09-10 and pau was just merely "some role player"

[tpols]

I will say this again. Boston, had it not been for a KG injury and the formation of the Heat, would have gone to 5 straight finals. FIVE STRAIGHT FINALS!

Boston was a CHAMPIONSHIP team. I have no idea where people get off on the idea that one player could defeat a TEAM full of HOFs with a All-star PG and an HOF Coach.

The line-up of Allen, Pierce, KG, Rondo, and Perkins HAD NEVER LOST A SERIES. EVER!

Talk about having it easy. First they ganged up on Wade, then Lebron, then Howard, and ALMOST got Kobe (Perkins was injured for game 7).

Micheal Jordan himself is NOT defeating that Celtics teams by himself.

So stop DISRESPECTING Boston and acting like 1 person is capable of winning a 7 game series against them.

Despite all of that, an engaged, aggressive Lebron was good enough to lead his team past them.. thats how good he was, but he just stopped playing mid-series in one of the most crucial games. He probably had your same mentality here when he shouldnt have.

[kamil]

LeBron* James, the most overrated GOAT of all time.

[FLDFSU]

you're talking to kobe fans who psyche themselves into believing Kobe's as good as Shaq and Kobe did it all by himself through 09-10 and pau was just merely "some role player"

But what they don't understand is ALL they are doing is making James look like a superhero.

They are the ones that think James is God and can defeat a team full of HOF and all-stars by himself. They are the ones that think 27-19-8 is not a particularly good game. They are the ones that believe that Lebron is capable of a championship when of the 10 players on the court...5 of the next six players after James is the best players.

They are the ones who don't expect Wade, Howard, or even Kobe to defeat Boston by themselves and understand that you need a team effort to beat them--unless your name is Lebron James--James needs no help.

It is Lebron's HATERS that justify his hype. When was the last time you heard a Kobe hater say he needed to:
score the most points
have the most assists
have the most rebounds
have the most steals
take on the biggest defensive assignments
be amongst the team leaders in blocks

while playing the most minutes?

You don't because even the Kobe's haters see the limitations of his game.

Leborn haters are doing something any stan could only hope to achieve: send Lebrons into God status.

[FLDFSU]

Despite all of that, an engaged, aggressive Lebron was good enough to lead his team past them.. thats how good he was, but he just stopped playing mid-series in one of the most crucial games. He probably had your same mentality here when he shouldnt have.

You think Lebron is God. I respectably disagree. Lebron is not God.

No person on Earth is defeating that Boston team, with their supporting cast playing like the Cavs did over the course of a 7 game series.

[SexSymbol]

If you're a real fan of the team, you'll go out of your way to make your team's players look better so you could create the image of invincibility to others.
Seeing as most heat fans are LeBron fans, I'm not even remotely surprised how Wade is being labeled and average player, and Bosh is somebody who can't do shit. Next thing you'll hear is Ray Allen can't shoot lol.
Grow a pair, and be a fan of your team.

[J Shuttlesworth]

If you're a real fan of the team, you'll go out of your way to make your team's players look better so you could create the image of invincibility to others.
Seeing as most heat fans are LeBron fans, I'm not even remotely surprised how Wade is being labeled and average player, and Bosh is somebody who can't do shit. Next thing you'll hear is Ray Allen can't shoot lol.
Grow a pair, and be a fan of your team.
I mean I get what you're saying, but it'd be like the Laker fans last year not complaining about their team since they had 4 HOFers starting. They're facing injuries from Wade, and Bosh simply buckles under when he faces a strong front court. And to act like Ray Allen is the same player as he was in his prime is just foolish.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

I will say this again. Boston, had it not been for a KG injury and the formation of the Heat, would have gone to 5 straight finals. FIVE STRAIGHT FINALS!

Boston was a CHAMPIONSHIP team. I have no idea where people get off on the idea that one player could defeat a TEAM full of HOFs with a All-star PG and an HOF Coach.

The line-up of Allen, Pierce, KG, Rondo, and Perkins HAD NEVER LOST A SERIES. EVER!

Talk about having it easy. First they ganged up on Wade, then Lebron, then Howard, and ALMOST got Kobe (Perkins was injured for game 7).

Micheal Jordan himself is NOT defeating that Celtics teams by himself.

So stop DISRESPECTING Boston and acting like 1 person is capable of winning a 7 game series against them.
damn, dont do em like that

[dynasty1978]

I mean I get what you're saying, but it'd be like the Laker fans last year not complaining about their team since they had 4 HOFers starting. They're facing injuries from Wade, and Bosh simply buckles under when he faces a strong front court. And to act like Ray Allen is the same player as he was in his prime is just foolish.

Just to be clear, you're legitimizing the Laker fans complaints from last year?

What you're saying about Wade, Bosh, and Allen sounds eerily similar to what Laker fans were saying about Howard (a shell of the old howard, turnover prone, can't shoot FTs), Gasol (soft against strong frontcourts, a shell of his championship form), and Nash (broke his leg in game 4 of that season, missed a chunk of the season, and was never the same player).

[JT123]

But what they don't understand is ALL they are doing is making James look like a superhero.

They are the ones that think James is God and can defeat a team full of HOF and all-stars by himself. They are the ones that think 27-19-8 is not a particularly good game. They are the ones that believe that Lebron is capable of a championship when of the 10 players on the court...5 of the next six players after James is the best players.

They are the ones who don't expect Wade, Howard, or even Kobe to defeat Boston by themselves and understand that you need a team effort to beat them--unless your name is Lebron James--James needs no help.

It is Lebron's HATERS that justify his hype. When was the last time you heard a Kobe hater say he needed to:
score the most points
have the most assists
have the most rebounds
have the most steals
take on the biggest defensive assignments
be amongst the team leaders in blocks

while playing the most minutes?

You don't because even the Kobe's haters see the limitations of his game.

Leborn haters are doing something any stan could only hope to achieve: send Lebrons into God status.
:applause: Rat poison. These idiots are unknowingly crowning Lebron as the greatest player of all time. :lol

[RedBlackAttack]

You think Lebron is God. I respectably disagree. Lebron is not God.

No person on Earth is defeating that Boston team, with their supporting cast playing like the Cavs did over the course of a 7 game series.
This is easily the dumbest attempt to spin an argument that I've ever seen. I don't think it is a superhuman request for what I truly believed was the best player in the league to do better than 3-for-14 while looking disinterested in what was arguably the most important game of his career up to that point and certainly the most important of the season.

The shooting percentages wouldn't even bother me if it looked like he was engaged, but he wasn't... and everyone noticed it at the time. Tpols provided one article pointing out this odd turn of events. I'm sure I could find many, many more.

What we have here is a group of player fans attempting to reshape history to fit a narrative they prefer. Unfortunately for them, there were people with a vested interest who actually watched those games.

[Trollsmasher]

FLDFSU completly destroying this thread:applause:

[2swift4u]

Nice thread name :D kinda true...

Miami Heat starting 5:
Lebron = beast
Bosh = good player, but too soft and plays like ray allen these days
Wade = injured princess
Chalmers = wouldn't start on any other NBA team
Battier = done

Rest of the team = either old or average at best

[FLDFSU]

This is easily the dumbest attempt to spin an argument that I've ever seen. I don't think it is a superhuman request for what I truly believed was the best player in the league to do better than 3-for-14 while looking disinterested in what was arguably the most important game of his career up to that point and certainly the most important of the season.

The shooting percentages wouldn't even bother me if it looked like he was engaged, but he wasn't... and everyone noticed it at the time. Tpols provided one article pointing out this odd turn of events. I'm sure I could find many, many more.

What we have here is a group of player fans attempting to reshape history to fit a narrative they prefer. Unfortunately for them, there were people with a vested interest who actually watched those games.

And Dwight Howard-league MVP candidate, DMVP, the previous year went to the finals, Best center in the league:

In game 1 ECF- against the same Boston team..3/10 13 points/ 12 rebs.
In game 3 ECF- 3/10 7 points/ 7 rebs.

THE BOSTON CELTICS WERE A GREAT TEAM WHO COULD SHUT DOWN ANY SUPERSTAR IN A GIVEN GAME.

We are talking about ONE game in which Lebron James STILL:
played the most minutes (42 minutes)
tied for the most rebounds
had the most assists
took the most shots (yet somehow he was not aggressive)
attempted the most free throws (yet somehow he was not aggressive)
tied for the most steals
of the starters had the highest +/-

If James, on his WORST games is still leading your team in most relevant categories HOW BAD IS YOUR TEAM?

And BTW, people were NOT just focusing on game 5. People were taking about game 6 and the entire Boston series. So my response were primarily about game 6/the entire series.

Lebron is HUMAN.

HE IS NOT A GOD. STOP TREATING HIM LIKE A GOD. IT ONLY MAKES YOUR CASE WEAKER AND ONLY ENHANCES HIS GREATNESS.

[FLDFSU]

O, I forgot, in that game 5, Lebron also had the 2nd amount of points (15) to Shaq's 21.

Please stop.

[Trollsmasher]

Heat's 2nd best player this year has been Birdman

It may not be even close in fact

[ILLsmak]

The supporting cast has been disappointing, but these whiney threads are not a good look. Rise above the insecurity my friend.

Real talk though, LeBron's support is so overrated. Anyone who watches this team play knows they are not "stacked".

hmm they are stacked. lol.

Shit doesn't mean they got role players scoring 40 ppg each game, but in general dudes are there to fill their roles above and beyond what they are asked to do.

-Smak

[TheMarkMadsen]

This fan base is pathetic

[ILLsmak]

Oh, it definitely was. And, even James' biggest supporters on here were baffled by his performances at the time. Don't waste your time giving me statistics, especially cherry-picked statistics without delving too deeply... like the fact that he shot 34% from the field, 15% from three and 74% from the line in those last three games. He also had 19 turnovers, many critical, late in the game (that's over 6 a game, if you're keeping tabs).

It wasn't because the Cs were just bottling him up. It was because he stopped attacking and his breaking down of the defense was integral to how that team's offense worked. He stood in the corner on far too many possessions.

But, ignoring all that, basketball isn't played in a boxscore. He looked either distracted or disinterested, especially in the most important game of the series. The Cavs had just split in Boston, were back in Cleveland and everyone expected a huge game... everything was on the line.

It was obvious going back to Boston down 3-2 was going to be the end.

That was the moment he chose for arguably his worst game as a Cavalier. Again, looked disinterested... distracted... something.


I was completely baffled by it until I saw him take a similar path when things really heated up against Dallas the following season. The biggest difference between the Cs in 2010 and Dallas in 2011 was that Wade was on his team in 2011, so he naturally assumed what James' role was supposed to be and became the team's initiator/attacker on offense.

The Cavs didn't have that luxury, so they were forced to continue to feed James the ball, even though it looked like he didn't want it most of the time.


There's nothing bitter about it. James was awesome in 2009. That was one of the greatest individual playoff runs I've ever seen. I've never been afraid to admit James' greatness on the basketball court. That series against the Cs, though... yikes. It was bad.


Well... the Dallas thing was interesting because it made us feel that Bron didn't quit... that he just shit the bed. I dunno, though, I still feel like he quit, that he knew he was gonna be out of there so he just wanted to get it over with.

I think it was worse in Cle.

And yea it's funny now that dudes come in here and bust out stats and try to act like Bron played his ass off in that series... lol. I wonder if they even watched that shit.

I watched every game that year because I am a huge Shaq fan and that was one of his last seasons. It's obvious, even without having something to compare it with, that Bron quit... he's a terrible actor. As you said he really did just hide in the corner... didn't want the ball, gave it back, etc.

And people are mad at his teammates for playing bad? lol Their whole gameplan was ****ed. The role players couldn't play any roles because the person who set them up stopped playing. They had Shaq out there tryin' to carry them. Was really something that made me mad at LeBron. It wouldn't have made me as mad if I didn't feel that he knew he was dipping at that point.

I'll never get over that shit. Bron played like ass in 2011, but it's not even on the same level. Cuz he at least wanted to win.

-Smak

[secund2nun]

Whose insight are we going to value here?


A longtime cavs fan whose followed the team inside out during the 2010 playoffs (and every other playoffs regular season, draft, etc.) who is a mod on this site, and one of the most level headed posters

or some punk kid who tries to look smart by showing boxscores weve all seen a thousand times? lol..


Everyone saw elbowgate.. the guy was straight up making excuses for why he couldnt go hard with a fake injury. Lebron can put up stats while going passive.. the difference is when hes aggressive his stats are out of this world and when hes not his stats are just ordinary superstar. He took his foot off the pedal in 2010 and quit on his team.. the stats you posted have literally nothing to do with anything

I followed the Cavs inside out in 2010 as well and watched all of the games RS and playoffs.

You can't trust a Cavs fan on Lebron. They are all bitter. Even the ones who try to act reasonable are still slightly bitter.

I trust the facts, but apparently you don't. I watched the games, I know how good his teammates where and I know how good his coach was. I know how good the Boston players were as well. Rondo and KG raped Cleveland that series and Lebron did very good overall, but unfortunately all of his other teammates sucked.

You can't speak facts so you just say non sense like "punk kid" because you have nothing to say.

If you think you can get 19 rebounds in a must win game 6 against an elite team you are insane not to mention shutting down Pierce as well.

Apparently you think Lebron put up a 27-19-8 line without his foot on the pedal :roll:

Continue with your delusional butthurt distorted views of NBA "reality".

[secund2nun]

so pretty much you have nothing?

Yep... in other words he doesn't know jack about basketball. He is probably the type of fan that orgasms over empty volume scorers and thinks they "will" their team to victory.

[secund2nun]

Have to disagree on this. Jordan guarded the best while shitting on the other team offensively like many other players. It's just shitty coaching in Spo and nothing more.

Pippen guarded the best more than Jordan did. It was Pippen who guarded Magic in the finals not Jordan. Also guarding a PF or C is a lot more taxing than guarding a wing player.

[secund2nun]

So again I ask, in your estimation, it's cool for a player - when he has little to no help offensively - to take plays, even games off at a time defensively?

That's all I'm really asking.

And by the way, Miami won tithes with no paint anchor because of "Spobot's" defensive scheme built around athletic players who can move swiftly laterally and trap hard on the perimeter. Of which, LeBron indeed is the best, but not the sole cog. Wade, Bosh, and Battier have done a terrific job in their past title runs defending the pick and roll and disrupting offensive sets.

In the regular season? Yes. You need to save up energy for the playoffs. In the playoffs you have to go hard both ways.

Spobot's scheme is the only alternative because Pat has failed to get a center for 4 years in a row now, but it is still a stupid scheme overall. I mean it's not Spo's fault that Miami has no center...that's on Riley though. If Miami had even an average center the defense would be so much better.

[dannywpt]

This fan base is pathetic

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/strange-quotation-marks-40.jpg

[Mr. Incredible]

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/strange-quotation-marks-40.jpg
:oldlol:

[zoom17]

hopefully wade steps up looked nice against the hawks.

[TheMilkyBarKid]

hopefully wade steps up looked nice against the hawks.
bobcats

[Bandito]

I followed the Cavs inside out in 2010 as well and watched all of the games RS and playoffs.

You can't trust a Cavs fan on Lebron. They are all bitter. Even the ones who try to act reasonable are still slightly bitter.

I trust the facts, but apparently you don't. I watched the games, I know how good his teammates where and I know how good his coach was. I know how good the Boston players were as well. Rondo and KG raped Cleveland that series and Lebron did very good overall, but unfortunately all of his other teammates sucked.

You can't speak facts so you just say non sense like "punk kid" because you have nothing to say.

If you think you can get 19 rebounds in a must win game 6 against an elite team you are insane not to mention shutting down Pierce as well.

Apparently you think Lebron put up a 27-19-8 line without his foot on the pedal :roll:

Continue with your delusional butthurt distorted views of NBA "reality".
Shoulder Injury though