What percentage of ISH posters...

[ILLsmak]

do you think actually have any idea what they are talking about?

I don't usually make threads and this might be an off-topic, soon-to-be-closed meta-thread, but I want to know what people really think about this.

I mean, there is 'basketball discussion' and 'fan discussion.' If that makes sense. I feel like a lot of the dudes on here are fans.

Not even talking about trolls, either, but I'm talking about the people who actually give their opinions and try to offer arguments.

I have a lot of those moments where I open up a reply box, start typing, then decide... nah... not worth it.

-Smak

[livinglegend]

Not many.
Many of those non troll posters dont know how to debate. To prove support their arguments, they use term like ''that team was hot during that time'', ''the team didnt give their best'', '' they were coasting'', ''he didnt try hard'' etc. Those are statements that cant be verified, so they cant support your argument. Those posters go on and on with those kind of statements, writing long paragraphs.

DMAVS guy is a great example.

[moe94]

Not many.
Many of those non troll posters dont know how to debate. To prove support their arguments, they use term like ''that team was hot during that time'', ''the team didnt give their best'', '' they were coasting'', ''he didnt try hard'' etc. Those are statements that cant be verified, so they cant support your argument. Those posters go on and on with those kind of statements, writing long paragraphs.

DMAVS guy is a great example.

You picked that dude of all people to call out? Are you angry you can't argue with him or something? He's the last person you should be calling out. He knows what he's talking about. :coleman:

Also, most people have no idea what they're talking about, myself included. There's like maybe 5 % of ISH that truly has any grasp on what they're saying.

[Legends66NBA7]

I usually think before I type anything, so I would like to say I know what I'm talking about in what I'm discussing.

[DMAVS41]

Not many.
Many of those non troll posters dont know how to debate. To prove support their arguments, they use term like ''that team was hot during that time'', ''the team didnt give their best'', '' they were coasting'', ''he didnt try hard'' etc. Those are statements that cant be verified, so they cant support your argument. Those posters go on and on with those kind of statements, writing long paragraphs.

DMAVS guy is a great example.

What are you on?

I support my opinions with facts more than anyone here.

Also, the statement..."that team was hot"...is an objective statement. You can go look at how a team normally shoots and compare it to how they shoot in certain situations while you are claiming they are "hot"...if the "hot" time is well above the norm...it's a fine statement to make rather than typing out a long paragraph about the numbers.

:facepalm

[Railgun]

For me it's
Other teams: not really
Orlando Magic: Definitely

[KyrieTheFuture]

Anything post 2008 I would say I know what I'm talking about, besides that I pull shit outta my ass.

[livinglegend]

What are you on?

I support my opinions with facts more than anyone here.

Also, the statement..."that team was hot"...is an objective statement. You can go look at how a team normally shoots and compare it to how they shoot in certain situations while you are claiming they are "hot"...if the "hot" time is well above the norm...it's a fine statement to make rather than typing out a long paragraph about the numbers.

:facepalm

I cant find the thread where we were debating Miami s runs to the finals. Find me that thread and i ll tell you what s wrong how your supports are wrong.

[DMAVS41]

I cant find the thread where we were debating Miami s runs to the finals. Find me that thread and i ll tell you what s wrong how your supports are wrong.

Which Heat run?

[moe94]

I cant find the thread where we were debating Miami s runs to the finals. Find me that thread and i ll tell you what s wrong how your supports are wrong.

When someone needs to know how to rationalize not taking up an avy bet loss with BS loopholes, I'll let you know. You have quite the firm grasp there.

[livinglegend]

Which Heat run?

There was a thread about Heat having it easy (last 2-3 years), and we were debating. I cant find the thread.

[livinglegend]

When someone needs to know how to rationalize not taking up an avy bet loss with BS loopholes, I'll let you know. You have quite the firm grasp there.

Let s be real, i was right about that bet thing. OP never had any intention of taking the bet. Take a look at this bet that he made after :
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=329781

He lost it and never changed his avy.
That guy never responded me because if Nets lost, he would say: I never made it official. I never responded.

[Budadiiii]

Not many at all.

There are a ton of mentally delayed morons on here. It's sad because most of these clowns aren't casual fans, they actually do watch the game. They're just too stupid and slow to actually grasp what winning basketball is.

Most are just geeks who haven't actually competed at a mid-high level.

[DMAVS41]

There was a thread about Heat having it easy (last 2-3 years), and we were debating. I cant find the thread.

And what is your position?

[livinglegend]

And what is your position?

It s not about position, but the way the debating went. You and another LA fan guy were using statements like '' Wade felt better in the finals (his reason for Wade playing better in the finals) '', ''Wade wouldnt be able to keep it up for 3 series'', '' Wade coasted'', ...
I mean come on. Who do you prove those points? Who can you tell that Wade felt better?

[red1]

Just give your opinion on topics that you are knowledgeable on. You wont see me in an 80s thread or a wilt thread

[moe94]

Most are just geeks who haven't actually competed at a mid-high level.

Like this dude?

http://www.wcbsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Simmons.gif

Terrible way of thinking. You don't need to make films to critique them, either.

[AnaheimLakers24]

There was a thread about Heat having it easy (last 2-3 years), and we were debating. I cant find the thread.
cause it doesn't exist

[Railgun]

basketball players don't know shit about ball for the most part just like most fans don't know shit about it.

[Budadiiii]

Like this dude?

http://www.wcbsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Simmons.gif

Terrible way of thinking. You don't need to make films to critique them, either.
That's such a predictable response.

I almost put "inb4 someone brings up Bill Simmons"

Bill Simmons is actually smart, unlike the idiots on here.

You're actually a perfect example of someone who hasn't competed. You're the same idiot who always discounts 'heart' and intangibles because to you, they don't exist. You've never competed to know how important they are.

You're low IQ sports fan 101.

[moe94]

That's such a predictable response.

I almost put "inb4 someone brings up Bill Simmons"

Bill Simmons is actually smart, unlike the idiots on here.

You're actually a perfect example of someone who hasn't competed. You're the same idiot who always discounts 'heart' and intangibles because to you, they don't exist. You've never competed to know how important they are.

You're low IQ sports fan 101.

I have no doubt that I'd trash your corny ass on the court. I'm bout it bout it. :coleman:

"heart"
"killer instinct"

Those words have almost no meaning. They're buzzwords, which is ironic because you seem to be taking a position of superiority. Can you bring the heart and killer instinct stats? How many angry faces per game does Westbrook have again?

As Jameer said, players with all the talent in the universe have little to no understanding of the history of the game. Being a great baller isn't synonymous with knowing what you're talking about. How you're arguing the contrary is beyond me.

You're a dude who lives off ad hominem, which is cute. You imply things you cannot possibly know yet you call anyone else a moron. Try harder.

[IncarceratedBob]

I've been interested basketball since I was 8 years old, that would put the year at 1964. My family didn't get a TV until 73 but I read the previous weeks paper daily and read about what happened.

[DMAVS41]

It s not about position, but the way the debating went. You and another LA fan guy were using statements like '' Wade felt better in the finals (his reason for Wade playing better in the finals) '', ''Wade wouldnt be able to keep it up for 3 series'', '' Wade coasted'', ...
I mean come on. Who do you prove those points? Who can you tell that Wade felt better?

Oh...I see.

Well, it was clear to me watching that Wade had more of a pep in his step as the playoffs went longer.

Early on he looked like he could barely run. That was of course a subjective claim based on me watching the games, but there is also stuff to back it up.

Wade put up 14/7/6 45% TS agains the Bucks. He even sat out a game due to his health.

Wade put up 13/3/5 53% TS against the Bulls....and just wasn't really involved offensively like you would normally see him if he was healthy.

Wade put up 15/5/4 49% TS against the Pacers...he had a 3 game stretch in that series in which he averaged 12/3/3 on 32% shooting from the field.

I don't know man...you ask me...Wade was clearly hurt in the eastern conference playoffs and it made otherwise pretty weak competition look a lot better than it actually was. I thought it was obvious that Wade has hobbled and was doing his best to pace himself so he had enough for when his team really needed him.

In the finals he looked like a different player at times. Showing a burst we hadn't seen in a while. He was locked in defensively more and was getting to his spots more easily.

The last 4 games of the finals Wade put up 24/6/5 and came up huge in that do or die game 4. I just don't think Wade early on in the playoffs was healthy enough to throw up a 32/6/4 with 6 steals on 14 of 25 shooting game against one of the best teams in the league. That was his clear cut best game of the playoffs...and his top 3 games in my opinion came against the Spurs in the Finals.

[Budadiiii]

I have no doubt that I'd trash your corny ass on the court. I'm bout it bout it. :coleman:

"heart"
"killer instinct"

Those words have almost no meaning. They're buzzwords, which is ironic because you seem to be taking a position of superiority. Can you bring the heart and killer instinct stats? How many angry faces per game does Westbrook have again?

As Jameer said, players with all the talent in the universe have little to no understanding of the history of the game. Being a great baller isn't synonymous with knowing what you're talking about. How you're arguing the contrary is beyond me.

You're a dude who lives off ad hominem, which is cute. You imply things you cannot possibly know yet you call anyone else a moron. Try harder.
:sleeping

Most players don't have the time to study basketball extensively like some of the losers do on here, you're right.

And most basketball players are idiots in general, who is arguing that?

Having competed at a mid-high level gives you the insight that you lack. killer instinct isn't making goofy faces you ****ing dumbass. When does Nash make a goofy face? He's a killer, and that matters.

I'm not saying heart and intangibles are the be all end all, but unlike you I actually consider them and understand it's the reason KD > TMac and Westbrook > Arenas.

[moe94]

:sleeping

Most players don't have the time to study basketball extensively like some of the losers do on here, you're right.

And most basketball players are idiots in general, who is arguing that?

Having competed at a mid-high level gives you the insight that you lack. killer instinct isn't making goofy faces you ****ing dumbass. When does Nash make a goofy face? He's a killer, and that matters.

I'm not saying heart and intangibles are the be all end all, but unlike you I actually consider them and understand it's the reason KD > TMac and Westbrook > Arenas.

Was Arenas considered clutch? That means he had the almighty killer instinct!

You're contradicting yourself all over the place. You don't even have a position. At first, you said people who don't play at a high level cannot know the game, which was wrong. Then you said, oh he's smart so he's an exception! So, exactly what is your position? :facepalm

Killer instinct and heart are not quantifiable and are thrust onto players. They can have this killer instinct one year when they're "clutch" but the next year that they're not, is the instinct dormant? It's all BS, homie.

[Legends66NBA7]

"Heart" is definitely visual.

[Budadiiii]

Was Arenas considered clutch? That means he had the almighty killer instinct!

You're contradicting yourself all over the place. You don't even have a position. At first, you said people who don't play at a high level cannot know the game, which was wrong. Then you said, oh he's smart so he's an exception! So, exactly what is your position? :facepalm

Killer instinct and heart are not quantifiable and are thrust onto players. They can have this killer instinct one year when they're "clutch" but the next year that they're not, is the instinct dormant? It's all BS, homie.
:facepalm

It's not about being clutch. What the **** are you talking about?

When did I say people who don't play at a high level can't know the game? Anyone can know the game.

I said a lot of people ON HERE haven't competed, and I say it based on what I've seen.

I see people like you who don't understand how important the intangibles are to winning. Maybe I should just call you ignorant instead of a moron.

Why is Derek Fisher in the league and Arenas is not?

[mr.big35]

some of the ISH posters are too concern about stats rather than how a player plays.

[Prometheus]

Was Arenas considered clutch? That means he had the almighty killer instinct!

You're contradicting yourself all over the place. You don't even have a position. At first, you said people who don't play at a high level cannot know the game, which was wrong. Then you said, oh he's smart so he's an exception! So, exactly what is your position? :facepalm

Killer instinct and heart are not quantifiable and are thrust onto players. They can have this killer instinct one year when they're "clutch" but the next year that they're not, is the instinct dormant? It's all BS, homie.

Dude you're my boy and all, and boo daddy is a big fat ball of ***, but I agree with him in this case. Heart and killer instinct are real things. That's why being a great athlete does not always make someone a great competitor. He might be wrong about who actually has these qualities, but if you want to act like they don't matter then I'm sorry moe but you're just not correct.

[moe94]

Budadiii, what does killer instinct mean? Please define the term so we're on the same page. Why is that LeBron is said not to posses it whereas it's the basis for overrating Kobe. Please define it.

[Legends66NBA7]

Why is Derek Fisher in the league and Arenas is not?

One has remarkable durability and brings some veteran experience, while being good in certain situations, the other doesn't and by all accounts should be off all teams because of the whole gun thing. Don't want that drama. Besides, his game really regressed badly.

[Prometheus]

Joakim Noah --> mediocre talent, supreme heart. great player
Andrew Bynum --> very good talent, total joke with no heart. lousy player

make sense?

Also to OP, the answer is honestly probably about 20%. ISH is a troll playground, there are very few people here who are both interested in real debate and insightful enough to contribute to it.

[moe94]

He might be wrong about who actually has these qualities, .
That's why I don't buy it. You can talk out of your ass with these terms. I put little to no stock in them.

[Prometheus]

Budadiii, what does killer instinct mean? Please define the term so we're on the same page. Why is that LeBron is said not to posses it whereas it's the basis for overrating Kobe. Please define it.

LeBron doesn't have killer instinct, but he has a ton of heart. I commented on this a while back, LeBron has what I call survival instinct. He's at his best when he's backed into a corner on the verge of total collapse, but he lacks the knack for turning up the pressure and intensity when the enemy is on the verge of defeat. Jordan had that killer instinct, like a shark when they smell blood in the water, they naturally "go in for the kill". LeBron is more like a rhino or something... like he's kind by nature and doesn't want to fight you, but if you **** with him enough he will stampede you and then go back to eating shrubs.

[Milbuck]

I have a lot of those moments where I open up a reply box, start typing, then decide... nah... not worth it.
Happens to me all the time, for various reasons.

You'll almost never see me in a Wilt/KAJ/Russell or any other 50s-70s thread, because I have no idea what I'm talking about there and I'm not going to pretend I do.

Same thing with troll threads, to a lesser degree. I still post quite frequently in blatant troll threads, but not nearly as much as I used to. It's just not worth it anymore. Especially considering the trolling field seems to be at an all time low. You have little ISH houseflies buzzing around throwing "You madd?" and "He shook" comments everywhere. Say what you will about 9er, Silk, even TonyMontana, they're creative and in TM's case, pretty intelligent.

As far as knowing what I'm talking about goes, I'm confident about what I say about 1999-today. I've also watched a lot of footage from the 90s, but I didn't watch it live so I'm not as confident. Anything before 1986 or so I've only seen highlights.

[Budadiiii]

Budadiii, what does killer instinct mean? Please define the term so we're on the same page. Why is that LeBron is said not to posses it whereas it's the basis for overrating Kobe. Please define it.
It's not about just being fearless. Joe Johnson is considered clutch and fearless, but he doesn't have the winning intangibles I'm looking for.

Killer instinct and heart are just one aspect. Off the court intangibles are another, leadership another, bla bla. It's easy to find what I'm talking about and how it translates into winning basketball.

it's why Chris Paul is the best PG in the league. LeBron does have those winning intangibles, he just lacks the 'killer' part that would put him over the edge. And compared to most, he does have heart and desire, just not on the level of Westbrook or Jordan or Kobe or Durant which is the standard we hold him to.

But he's a good teammate and he's dedicated to getting better, head on straight, cerebral player who impacts the game at a high level.

[Milbuck]

LeBron doesn't have killer instinct, but he has a ton of heart. I commented on this a while back, LeBron has what I call survival instinct. He's at his best when he's backed into a corner on the verge of total collapse, but he lacks the knack for turning up the pressure and intensity when the enemy is on the verge of defeat. Jordan had that killer instinct, like a shark when they smell blood in the water, they naturally "go in for the kill". LeBron is more like a rhino or something... like he's kind by nature and doesn't want to fight you, but if you **** with him enough he will stampede you and then go back to eating shrubs.
Probably the best description of it I've seen in a while.

[livinglegend]

Oh...I see.

Well, it was clear to me watching that Wade had more of a pep in his step as the playoffs went longer.

Early on he looked like he could barely run. That was of course a subjective claim based on me watching the games, but there is also stuff to back it up.

Wade put up 14/7/6 45% TS agains the Bucks. He even sat out a game due to his health.

Wade put up 13/3/5 53% TS against the Bulls....and just wasn't really involved offensively like you would normally see him if he was healthy.

Wade put up 15/5/4 49% TS against the Pacers...he had a 3 game stretch in that series in which he averaged 12/3/3 on 32% shooting from the field.

I don't know man...you ask me...Wade was clearly hurt in the eastern conference playoffs and it made otherwise pretty weak competition look a lot better than it actually was. I thought it was obvious that Wade has hobbled and was doing his best to pace himself so he had enough for when his team really needed him.

In the finals he looked like a different player at times. Showing a burst we hadn't seen in a while. He was locked in defensively more and was getting to his spots more easily.

The last 4 games of the finals Wade put up 24/6/5 and came up huge in that do or die game 4. I just don't think Wade early on in the playoffs was healthy enough to throw up a 32/6/4 with 6 steals on 14 of 25 shooting game against one of the best teams in the league. That was his clear cut best game of the playoffs...and his top 3 games in my opinion came against the Spurs in the Finals.

Yeah, the problem is how do you prove to me that Wade s numbers being down against the EC is due to his health? It could be because of the opponents he faced, it could be because of his mental state, ... Many factors could have caused his mediocre numbers, it s impossible to tell which one actually affected him.
You cant just claim it was his health, you dont have any prove.

The only sure thing was that Wade sucked in the EC playoffs and that made Heat s road was much harder. Heat s road to the finals wasnt easier than the Spurs because Wade sucked.

[NumberSix]

This is not really an analysis discussion board. It's a fan discussion board.

[Railgun]

LeBron doesn't have killer instinct, but he has a ton of heart. I commented on this a while back, LeBron has what I call survival instinct. He's at his best when he's backed into a corner on the verge of total collapse, but he lacks the knack for turning up the pressure and intensity when the enemy is on the verge of defeat. Jordan had that killer instinct, like a shark when they smell blood in the water, they naturally "go in for the kill". LeBron is more like a rhino or something... like he's kind by nature and doesn't want to fight you, but if you **** with him enough he will stampede you and then go back to eating shrubs.
What a dumb post.

[Budadiiii]

LeBron doesn't have killer instinct, but he has a ton of heart. I commented on this a while back, LeBron has what I call survival instinct. He's at his best when he's backed into a corner on the verge of total collapse, but he lacks the knack for turning up the pressure and intensity when the enemy is on the verge of defeat. Jordan had that killer instinct, like a shark when they smell blood in the water, they naturally "go in for the kill". LeBron is more like a rhino or something... like he's kind by nature and doesn't want to fight you, but if you **** with him enough he will stampede you and then go back to eating shrubs.
:applause:

LeBron would be the type to flea and survive.

When his back is against the wall, his 'instincts' take over, his adrenaline starts coursing, and BOOM, best player ever.

Everybody wants him to have that urgency that MJ and Westbrook have, but it's just not in his nature.

[moe94]

LeBron doesn't have killer instinct, but he has a ton of heart. I commented on this a while back, LeBron has what I call survival instinct. He's at his best when he's backed into a corner on the verge of total collapse, but he lacks the knack for turning up the pressure and intensity when the enemy is on the verge of defeat. Jordan had that killer instinct, like a shark when they smell blood in the water, they naturally "go in for the kill". LeBron is more like a rhino or something... like he's kind by nature and doesn't want to fight you, but if you **** with him enough he will stampede you and then go back to eating shrubs.
Pretty cool animal analogy.

[Prometheus]

It's not about just being fearless. Joe Johnson is considered clutch and fearless, but he doesn't have the winning intangibles I'm looking for.

Killer instinct and heart are just one aspect. Off the court intangibles are another, leadership another, bla bla. It's easy to find what I'm talking about and how it translates into winning basketball.

it's why Chris Paul is the best PG in the league. LeBron does have those winning intangibles, he just lacks the 'killer' part that would put him over the edge. And compared to most, he does have heart and desire, just not on the level of Westbrook or Jordan or Kobe or Durant which is the standard we hold him to.

But he's a good teammate and he's dedicated to getting better, head on straight, cerebral player who impacts the game at a high level.

:wtf: did I just agree with almost every word of a budadiiii post? :wtf:

I would add that Westbrook and Durant also lack important leadership intangibles though. Westbrook is too hot-headed and is prone to making decisions that are very stupid and counter-productive... he needs to learn how to moderate his pulse rate and not be a moron in crucial moments. Durant is far too submissive, his talent is too great for his attitude, and he needs to learn how to tell everyone else (Westbrook included... Westbrook especially) to get the **** out of the way when it's time to take over.

[Legends66NBA7]

Eh, I think the whole killer instinct thing is vague and it's definition keeps changing.

Unlike "heart", you have to get into specifics about what your talking about.

[NumberSix]

Eh, I think the whole killer instinct thing is vague and it's definition keeps changing.
Classic subversive tactic of Marxist commies.

[Marchesk]

Wilt stans know what they're talking about.

[DMAVS41]

Yeah, the problem is how do you prove to me that Wade s numbers being down against the EC is due to his health? It could be because of the opponents he faced, it could be because of his mental state, ... Many factors could have caused his mediocre numbers, it s impossible to tell which one actually affected him.
You cant just claim it was his health, you dont have any prove.

The only sure thing was that Wade sucked in the EC playoffs and that made Heat s road was much harder. Heat s road to the finals wasnt easier than the Spurs because Wade sucked.

See. You say we don't have "proof", but I don't know what more you want. Wade was clearly hobbled. He admitted it. We watched him play and he looked hurt. His team rested him even more than usual. He played poorly for his standards...

I mean...what more "proof" do you need.

Wade being hurt does not make the teams that the Heat played and better. It absolutely made the task of getting to the finals harder on the Heat with Wade/Bosh playing like complete shit, but it doesn't speak to how good the teams they played actually were.

I think that is where you are confused. And it's lucky to play such easy teams because in some years, like 2011, for example....the Heat would not have had the luxury of playing such weak competition. And if Wade was playing like he did last year...the Heat aren't coming out of the conference.

That is our point.

As for you needing more evidence. I really can't help you there. Wade looked hurt, said he was hurt, his team rested him more, and his production on the court was his worst of his career.

If that's not enough to prove he was hurt....I give up.

[secund2nun]

I have no doubt that I'd trash your corny ass on the court. I'm bout it bout it. :coleman:

"heart"
"killer instinct"

Those words have almost no meaning. They're buzzwords, which is ironic because you seem to be taking a position of superiority. Can you bring the heart and killer instinct stats? How many angry faces per game does Westbrook have again?

As Jameer said, players with all the talent in the universe have little to no understanding of the history of the game. Being a great baller isn't synonymous with knowing what you're talking about. How you're arguing the contrary is beyond me.

You're a dude who lives off ad hominem, which is cute. You imply things you cannot possibly know yet you call anyone else a moron. Try harder.

99% of the time anyone mentions killer instinct it means they have no idea about the game of basketball.

[livinglegend]

See. You say we don't have "proof", but I don't know what more you want. Wade was clearly hobbled. He admitted it. We watched him play and he looked hurt. His team rested him even more than usual. He played poorly for his standards...

I mean...what more "proof" do you need.

Wade being hurt does not make the teams that the Heat played and better. It absolutely made the task of getting to the finals harder on the Heat with Wade/Bosh playing like complete shit, but it doesn't speak to how good the teams they played actually were.

I think that is where you are confused. And it's lucky to play such easy teams because in some years, like 2011, for example....the Heat would not have had the luxury of playing such weak competition. And if Wade was playing like he did last year...the Heat aren't coming out of the conference.

That is our point.

As for you needing more evidence. I really can't help you there. Wade looked hurt, said he was hurt, his team rested him more, and his production on the court was his worst of his career.

If that's not enough to prove he was hurt....I give up.

Wade admitted that he was hurt the whole playoffs, not only during the EC playoffs. The reports said that Wade was hurt the WHOLE playoffs including the finals. If Wade played awful during the EC playoffs only because of his health, then, he should also have played bad against the Spurs because he was hurt in that series too, You and that Lakers guy act like he suddenly got in better health during the finals. What proof do you have for that? Yes, he played better in the finals, but you cant say for sure that it was because of his health. The reports dont support your statement. His better play might be because the opponent, you cant sure.

[AussieG]

This forum seems to be more about entertainment than actual discussion. Every now and then a topic or a post pops up that adds something but most of the time, it's just entertainment and shooting the shit.. that shouldn't be taken very seriously.

[Dresta]

What are you on?

I support my opinions with facts more than anyone here.

Also, the statement..."that team was hot"...is an objective statement. You can go look at how a team normally shoots and compare it to how they shoot in certain situations while you are claiming they are "hot"...if the "hot" time is well above the norm...it's a fine statement to make rather than typing out a long paragraph about the numbers.

:facepalm
Support that opinion with some facts brah..

[zoom17]

This forum seems to be more about entertainment than actual discussion. Every now and then a topic or a post pops up that adds something but most of the time, it's just entertainment and shooting the shit.. that shouldn't be taken very seriously.

This I also like the meltdowns on this forum.

[Andrei89]

Not many at all.

There are a ton of mentally delayed morons on here. It's sad because most of these clowns aren't casual fans, they actually do watch the game. They're just too stupid and slow to actually grasp what winning basketball is.

Most are just geeks who haven't actually competed at a mid-high level.


Coming from you it really does not mean shit. All I see from you is Lebron hate on some of his best performances.

Sad little individual you are. In fact, I would even go as far to say you are one of the worst posters I have ever seen on ISH who is also clueless about basketball.

[DonDadda59]

10%... tops.

[Mrofir]

Id say most people, 51% or so, have SOME idea about basketball. It really all depends on what you consider as qualifications for a person to be knowledgeable.

We could pose a similar question about all the "experts" at ESPN or former players that offer their analysis and depending on the standard imposed, many of those people could be considered to know very little about basketball despite having played or coached at a professional level. Obviously they must know something.

If being able to make accurate predictions about basketball is the standard we are going to adopt, then truly very few people know anything about basketball. Even scouts are wrong more often than they are right, depending of course on what standard you hold them to.

Personally I've played and watched enough basketball that I feel like I know a decent amount. But within my knowledge base I have significant strengths and weaknesses. If you ask me about the Phoenix Suns circa 2005-2010, I know ALOT about basketball. If you ask me about the Charlotte Bobcats circa whatever, I don't know very much at all.

When a person is consistently willing to comment on matters that they are not in truth familiar with, especially in an overly confident or brash way, they come across as an emotional fan. If those same people were more selective they might be considered thoughtful posters.

[DMAVS41]

Wade admitted that he was hurt the whole playoffs, not only during the EC playoffs. The reports said that Wade was hurt the WHOLE playoffs including the finals. If Wade played awful during the EC playoffs only because of his health, then, he should also have played bad against the Spurs because he was hurt in that series too, You and that Lakers guy act like he suddenly got in better health during the finals. What proof do you have for that? Yes, he played better in the finals, but you cant say for sure that it was because of his health. The reports dont support your statement. His better play might be because the opponent, you cant sure.

Yea, they really do. The Spurs are objectively better than those East teams...and played better defense than all of them other than the Pacers.

Also, part of evidence is watching...and if we could fire up video clips of all the plays in the first 2 rounds and compare it to the finals and ecf...you will see a Wade that started to have more of a bounce in his game.

You really think it was the opponent holding Wade down in the East? No, it was evident that he was hurt and the team was trying to manage that as best they could while he still played.

I don't even get this really...what point are you trying to make? That the Heat actually played great teams in the East last year because a broken down Wade played like crap?

[mr.big35]

Support that opinion with some facts brah..

his a biggest stan in here, thinks dirk is greater than moses malone :roll: :roll: :roll:

[fpliii]

There are big gaps in my knowledge, but I try not to comment on stuff about which I don't know all that much.

I didn't play any organized basketball after middle school, but I love learning more about specific plays, coaching, and strategy. I really like learning more about the post game (and footwork in general), which as a guy who topped out at 6'1" is something I didn't get to try out much when playing regularly when I did (couldn't really use it in IM leagues, or when playing in the park with friends).

The game seems so simple, but there's a lot more to it than meets the eye.

[Chuckbrook]

I would add that Westbrook and Durant also lack important leadership intangibles though. Westbrook is too hot-headed and is prone to making decisions that are very stupid and counter-productive... he needs to learn how to moderate his pulse rate and not be a moron in crucial moments. Durant is far too submissive, his talent is too great for his attitude, and he needs to learn how to tell everyone else (Westbrook included... Westbrook especially) to get the **** out of the way when it's time to take over.
It's kind of hard not agree with this post.

-Brook

[livinglegend]

Yea, they really do. The Spurs are objectively better than those East teams...and played better defense than all of them other than the Pacers.

Also, part of evidence is watching...and if we could fire up video clips of all the plays in the first 2 rounds and compare it to the finals and ecf...you will see a Wade that started to have more of a bounce in his game.

You really think it was the opponent holding Wade down in the East? No, it was evident that he was hurt and the team was trying to manage that as best they could while he still played.

I don't even get this really...what point are you trying to make? That the Heat actually played great teams in the East last year because a broken down Wade played like crap?

Yeah, as far as your evidence is concerned, I watched the games and it was the same Wade, he didn't have more bounce. He was just playing better basketball. He was more comfortable in the finals against Spurs D.

The point i m trying to make is that the strength of a team s road to the finals is determined by many factors:
- Health
-Mental state
-Matchups
-Luck
- .... ( i can name many more factors)

In 2013, Heat had a harder road to the finals than the Spurs because they played more games before the finals than the Spurs. Why they had to play more games? It s impossible to tell, too many factors come in to play. ( as I mentioned previously: health, Mental state, Luck, Matchups, ...) It s also impossible to tell which factors and how much those factors really affected Miami.

Many in here think the strength of a team s road to the finals is only determined by their opponent s regular season record, which is not true.

[JT123]

Yeah, as far as your evidence is concerned, I watched the games and it was the same Wade, he didn't have more bounce. He was just playing better basketball. He was more comfortable in the finals against Spurs D.

The point i m trying to make is that the strength of a team s road to the finals is determined by many factors:
- Health
-Mental state
-Matchups
-Luck
- .... ( i can name many more factors)

In 2013, Heat had a harder road to the finals than the Spurs because they played more games before the finals than the Spurs. Why they had to play more games? It s impossible to tell, too many factors come in to play. ( as I mentioned previously: health, Mental state, Luck, Matchups, ...) It s also impossible to tell which factors and how much those factors really affected Miami.

Many in here think the strength of a team s road to the finals is only determined by their opponent s regular season record, which is not true.
:applause: Agreed. I can not take anyone seriously if they try and claim the Spurs were more worn out by the time they got to the Finals than the Heat were. Spurs had 8 days off prior to the Finals. The Heat had a whole 2 days to rest after barely getting by Indiana. The Heat were way more fatigued, both mentally and physically. Spurs had everything going for them, including the most flukey 3 point shooting spree I have ever seen from a role player over the course of 5 games.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

I wouldn't know the difference between a basketball and a pumpkin painted as one.

[jstern]

I think 99% of people in life don't know what they are talking about. People are arrogant, and they care more about being right and defending their opinion. Not interested in really finding the truth.

[ProfessorMurder]

Maybe 5%.

[secund2nun]

The NBA has the most stupid fans of any sport. NBA history is distorted and corrupted. This is in large part because the NBA is the only league that artificially creates "superstars" and "stars" from media hype and distortion of why certain outcomes happened based on whether the playing style of player excites fans and/or the size of the market they play for. This corruption has seeped into every aspect of the NBA from the media where it started, to the casual fans, to the hardcore fans, and right down to the GMs, coaches, and former players themselves.

[smoovegittar]

There are a few posters here who bring it... and they're usually not baited into the troll game. I find about 80% of the "posters" in here to be boorish, snobby fans who don't really get the game at all. The multi-alt and 1 man wonder fans are the worst. Still, I have a laugh now and then. But posting certainly isn't worth my time, unless it's on my franchise board.

[jstern]

The NBA has the most stupid fans of any sport. NBA history is distorted and corrupted. This is in large part because the NBA is the only league that artificially creates "superstars" and "stars" from media hype and distortion of events based on whether the playing style of player excites fans and/or the size of the market they play for. This corruption has seeped into every aspect of the NBA from the media where it started, to the casual fans, to the hardcore fans, and right down to the GMs, coaches, and former players themselves.

This is true. It at least has the dumbest youngest fans, because they place their value more on trying to look cool, doing things like over dribbling.

I'll go to the courts and watch the teenagers doing the same And1 kind of moves over and over, and over again. And you can see it in their face that it makes them feel extremely confident, but they don't realize that they aren't doing anything, and just giving the defender extra opportunities to steal the ball.

So the game to them is more about style and posing.

My cousin's son made the basketball team, so I was trying to show him some of Jordan's first steps, but instead he proceeded to watch countless And1 videos, and The Professor videos.

[secund2nun]

This is true. It at least has the dumbest youngest fans, because they place their value more on trying to look cool, doing things like over dribbling.

I'll go to the courts and watch the teenagers doing the same And1 kind of moves over and over, and over again. And you can see it in their face that it makes them feel extremely confident, but they don't realize that they aren't doing anything, and just giving the defender extra opportunities to steal the ball.

So the game to them is more about style and posing.

My cousin's son made the basketball team, so I was trying to show him some of Jordan's first steps, but instead he proceeded to watch countless And1 videos, and The Professor videos.

All very true especially the bold part. The fans do the same. They judge players based on how flashy they are. Flashy players with limited production are hailed as "stars" despite being completely mediocre basketball players. Then when a TEAM does well the fans always have to pick out one exciting flashy player (usually an athletic wing player) and give all of the success to him acting like they carried the team never mind the fact that the team won with team defense, rebounding and equal contribution of team members not that one player's mediocre ball hogging.

Those playground selfish ball hog kids sadly grow up to be NBA players which is why we see so many of those players in the NBA today....and they are wrongfully glorified. Brandon Jennings (formerly) and Kyrie Irving are perfect examples of this. Hero ball is the name of the game.

These type of players are almost always deemed stars or deemed as having star potential if they have great athleticism. It's gotten to the point that you can probably take any athletic young player and have them chuck up shot after shot no matter how often they miss and they will be hailed as a star. The 5 games where they go 5/19 will be ignored while the 1 game they go 12/20 will be glorified and remembered forever and will stand as a sign of their "potential" to the casual fans.

In sports like football the fundamentals are appreciated. You often hear even the typical casual NFL fan mention that the games are won in the trenches. Well basketball is no different. The game is won in the trenches, but you hear many fans talk non sense like "big men are irrelevant".

[ILLsmak]

That's such a predictable response.

I almost put "inb4 someone brings up Bill Simmons"

Bill Simmons is actually smart, unlike the idiots on here.

You're actually a perfect example of someone who hasn't competed. You're the same idiot who always discounts 'heart' and intangibles because to you, they don't exist. You've never competed to know how important they are.

You're low IQ sports fan 101.

you're 'actually smart', too, but you mostly troll. DMAVS seems like a good guy and is also intelligent. I think a lot of the 'facts' he uses are more like 'references.' I think people believe if they say one thing and post stats that it means it's right. To me, it's definitely something to take into account, but I've never seen someone say something and post stats/a gif/whatever that made it true. If something was so easily proved, then dudes wouldn't be arguing about it.

I think someone can be batshit crazy as long as they create discussion. Even dudes like Euroleague I don't mind. Or Jlauber(sp) + alts. It's more these dudes who... I dunno I don't wanna call any of them out but let's say it's ironic that this thread gathered many of them.

Edit: And anyone can post some shit they read. That doesn't mean they know what's up. Gimme someone with an original, blatantly wrong idea over that. haha. At least it gets people thinking.

-Smak

[MMM]

The NBA has the most stupid fans of any sport.

Agreed, not sure why but they are also obsessed with ranking everything. I've rarely seen top 10 lists in other NA sports but with basketball it goes as far as being ridiculed if you don't share ones top 10 rankings.

[elementally morale]

Speaking of history, I do.
Speaking if single seasons, I don't.
Speaking of something else, I do.

[BoutPractice]

I've never seen someone say something and post stats/a gif/whatever that made it true. If something was so easily proved, then dudes wouldn't be arguing about it.
Exactly. By definition, debates are about ambiguous questions where there is no clear objective answer. You can't debate someone who holds that the Earth is flat: he is simply wrong, the debate is over before it's even started.

Incidentally, not every discussion has to be an "argument"...

[jstern]

Exactly. By definition, debates are about ambiguous questions where there is no clear objective answer. You can't debate someone who holds that the Earth is flat: he is simply wrong, the debate is over before it's even started.

Incidentally, not every discussion has to be an "argument"...

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=40617

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/rapture-2-banner-2.jpg

Here are three experiments that you can try to prove that the earth is flat

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=45427

[D.J.]

As far as a general idea, probably the majority. Those who I can debate with in detail about current NBA/players, past NBA/players, and other topics...maybe 10%.

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

do you think actually have any idea what they are talking about?

I don't usually make threads and this might be an off-topic, soon-to-be-closed meta-thread, but I want to know what people really think about this.

I mean, there is 'basketball discussion' and 'fan discussion.' If that makes sense. I feel like a lot of the dudes on here are fans.

Not even talking about trolls, either, but I'm talking about the people who actually give their opinions and try to offer arguments.

I have a lot of those moments where I open up a reply box, start typing, then decide... nah... not worth it.

-Smak

10% know what they are talking about.

[jstern]

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=40617

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/rapture-2-banner-2.jpg

Here are three experiments that you can try to prove that the earth is flat

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=45427

If you look at the debate on those thread, it's just like any other argument on ISH, or any other place on the internet. The only difference is that it's a ridiculous topic, the Earth being flat. But the authority, the reaching for stuff to support ones argument, it's all the same.

Since the arguments on ISH and other places on the internet don't involved extremely ridiculous topics, people never realize how for the most part everyone talks out of their behind.

[moe94]

Yep. This. It's the reason why idiots would take Marc Gasol over Dwight Howard, beause Gasol shoots jumpers and Howard hits only half his FT's.

:biggums:

[CelticBaller]

1%

[Mrofir]

If you look at the debate on those thread, it's just like any other argument on ISH, or any other place on the internet. The only difference is that it's a ridiculous topic, the Earth being flat. But the authority, the reaching for stuff to support ones argument, it's all the same.

Since the arguments on ISH and other places on the internet don't involved extremely ridiculous topics, people never realize how for the most part everyone talks out of their behind.

This link is absolutely fascinating but I must say there are some critical differences between that board and ISH

That board is filled with people who are certifiably, scientifically wrong about their claims.

Saying "Lebron is a choker" cannot be scientifically proven or disproven. This is largely a discussion of opinion. If you want to say the link you provided is an open ended discussion of opinion, that's scary.


Edit just realized in addition to what I stated above, that website is actually a satire of fundamentalist Christianity.

[Budadiiii]

This link is absolutely fascinating but I must say there are some critical differences between that board and ISH

That board is filled with people who are certifiably, scientifically wrong about their claims.

Saying "Lebron is a choker" cannot be scientifically proven or disproven. This is largely a discussion of opinion. If you want to say the link you provided is an open ended discussion of opinion, that's scary.


Edit just realized in addition to what I stated above, that website is actually a satire of fundamentalist Christianity.
Well that's much closer to fact than opinion but I see what you're saying.

[Black and White]

Jameer posting in this thread?? :wtf:

He knows the least about basketball on this forum.

[jstern]

This link is absolutely fascinating but I must say there are some critical differences between that board and ISH

That board is filled with people who are certifiably, scientifically wrong about their claims.

Saying "Lebron is a choker" cannot be scientifically proven or disproven. This is largely a discussion of opinion. If you want to say the link you provided is an open ended discussion of opinion, that's scary.


Edit just realized in addition to what I stated above, that website is actually a satire of fundamentalist Christianity.

Yes, it's satire, though there are people just as delusional out there, and an actual flat Earth society. I didn't want to mention in my post that it's satire, because it takes away that shock factor.

I understand your point, but I didn't quite explain my point well, because sometimes it's just hard to put certain concept into words.

My point is that even on the simplest arguments, people ignored certain things, or don't use logic in order to win a discussion. Similar to that website.