Most dominant playoff scoring center in NBA history?

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kareem, Shaq, or Hakeem? Who you got?

[Milbuck]

http://www.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/5-shaq-weird-shaq-gifs.gif

[ThePhantomCreep]

Kareem averaged 29ppg a game in the postseason until age 36...after which he was only good for about 23-25 a game until he hit 40. :bowdown:

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Kareem for sure for consistency and longevity. Shaq was his equal at his best but Shaq also got fatter and was less skilled scoring the basketball so he has smaller window than Kareem

[navy]

3 straight FMVPs are no joke.

[WillC]

For me it has to be as follows:

1) Wilt Chamberlain
2) Shaquille O'Neal
3) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

Hakeem would probably be fourth, but you could make a case for David Robinson.

[qrich]

Agenda driven thread is agenda driven

[Round Mound]

Shaq

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

For me it has to be as follows:

1) Wilt Chamberlain
2) Shaquille O'Neal
3) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

Hakeem would probably be fourth, but you could make a case for David Robinson.
:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm
u could make a case for Robinson over Hakeem as playoff scorer:roll: :roll: :facepalm

[Cold soul]

Shaq for me. I mean three straight FMVP with total dominance he showed was unbelievable. You can make solid case Shaq had the GOAT peak. I wasn't alive to have seen Wilt or Kareem play so I have no say in the matter.

[ThePhantomCreep]

For me it has to be as follows:

1) Wilt Chamberlain
2) Shaquille O'Neal
3) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

Hakeem would probably be fourth, but you could make a case for David Robinson.
:biggums:

Wilt has the lowest PPG and TS% of the four players. His scoring famously dropped in the playoffs. I see no case for him.

Wilt: 7 regular season scoring titles; 1 postseason scoring title
Shaq: 2 regular season; 1 postseason
Hakeem: 0 regular season; 2 postseason (not counting 1988 as he only played 4 games).
Kareem: 2 regular season; 5 postseason

[rhowen4]

well wilt can't have this one

[The-Legend-24]

Lowkey taking shots at LAZERUSS. :roll:

[LAZERUSS]

Just for the fun of it...

How many of those guys had FOUR playoff series of 37.0 ppg, 37.0 ppg, 38.6 ppg, and 38.7 ppg?

And this one is really good...how many of them had FOUR 50+ point games, including THREE in MUST-WIN games? Or a 45 point MUST-WIN game in the Finals?

[T_L_P]

It's Kareem

[East_Stone_Ya]

shaq

[aj1987]

Just for the fun of it...

How many of those guys had FOUR playoff series of 37.0 ppg, 37.0 ppg, 38.6 ppg, and 38.7 ppg?

And this one is really good...how many of them had FOUR 50+ point games, including THREE in MUST-WIN games? Or a 45 point MUST-WIN game in the Finals?
Shaq had 3 straight Finals of 36, 33, and 38 PPG. Won all 3 as well. Wilt?

[dunksby]

Easily Kareem, he was a constant dominant force in the postseason within different eras.

[Milbuck]

Are we really going to act like Shaq, who averaged nearly 36ppg over 3 consecutive finals series, wouldn't utterly rape the competition of the 60s, 70s, and even 80s? I respect the hell out of Wilt and all his supporters, but there is no logical argument to suggest that prime Shaq wouldn't score at or above Wilt/Kareem level in their respective eras.

[Angel Face]

Shaq is the most dominant center that I've seen. Hakeem has better fundamentals and more technically sound though and he schooled Shaq during his prime.

[WillC]

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm
u could make a case for Robinson over Hakeem as playoff scorer:roll: :roll: :facepalm

I missed the 'playoff' part of the title.

In that case, my answer is simple: Shaq.

[WillC]

Although, it should be noted, Wilt Chamberlain has 3 of the 5 highest single-season playoff PPG averages in history (amongst centers).

People forget that he completely changed his game in the second half of his career. Instead of scoring, he concentrated on rebounding, passing and defending.

When he was needed to score in the post-season, he was dominant:

- 37ppg in 1960-61
- 35ppg in 1961-62
- 34.7ppg in 1963-64
- 33.2ppg in 1959-60

etc.

But still, based upon an entire career's worth of work in the playoffs, my answer would be Shaq, then Kareem, then Wilt, then Hakeem.

[dankok8]

Kareem although Shaq is a close second.

Kareem's Playoff Numbers in His Prime ('69-'81) (97 games)

30.3 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 3.9 apg, 3.4 bpg on 53.3 %FG/72.7 %FT/56.8 %TS in 44.1 mpg

Kareem's Finals Numbers in His Prime ('69-'81) (16 games)

31.4 ppg, 14.2 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.2 bpg on 54.8 %FG/74.7 %FT/57.7 %TS in 44.8 mpg

[-23-]

Shaq

[ThePhantomCreep]

Kareem although Shaq is a close second.

Kareem's Playoff Numbers in His Prime ('69-'81) (97 games)

30.3 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 3.9 apg, 3.4 bpg on 53.3 %FG/72.7 %FT/56.8 %TS in 44.1 mpg

Kareem's Finals Numbers in His Prime ('69-'81) (16 games)

31.4 ppg, 14.2 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.2 bpg on 54.8 %FG/74.7 %FT/57.7 %TS in 44.8 mpg

End thread.

Sorry, dropping 38 a game on Rik Smits isn't as impressive.

[Le Shaqtus]

The Big Shaqtus.

[riseagainst]

Shaq. Wilt shouldn't even be mentioned in this thread....

[Dr.J4ever]

Playoffs? It's Kareem, hands down. Not really surprising that the #1 low post option in NBA history is also the most dominant playoff scorer in NBA history. When the play slowed down in the Playoffs, Magic dumped it again and again to Kareem, and it worked, and worked repeatedly.

No.2, maybe Shaq, but I would take Hakeem if I had to decide who to take on my team. At a certain point, free throws will be an issue with Shaq in late game situations.

Wilt and the others, I don't know, since I never saw Wilt play in real time. Hard to comment just looking at You Tube videos and pure stats. It has to be noted though that Wilt had more team success when he learned to involve his teammates more, and score less.

[ArbitraryWater]

For me it has to be as follows:

1) Wilt Chamberlain
2) Shaquille O'Neal
3) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

Hakeem would probably be fourth, but you could make a case for David Robinson.


:biggums: :hammerhead:

IT SAYS PLAYOFFS

[jlip]

Are we really going to act like Shaq, who averaged nearly 36ppg over 3 consecutive finals series, wouldn't utterly rape the competition of the 60s, 70s, and even 80s? I respect the hell out of Wilt and all his supporters, but there is no logical argument to suggest that prime Shaq wouldn't score at or above Wilt/Kareem level in their respective eras.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7733934&postcount=12
:confusedshrug:

[Andrei89]

Lebron

[aj1987]

End thread.

Sorry, dropping 38 a game on Rik Smits isn't as impressive.
A 23 year old Shaq, in his 3rd year, dropped 28/13/6/3 on 60% on Hakeem.

[WillC]

A 23 year old Shaq, in his 3rd year, dropped 28/13/6/3 on 60% on Hakeem.

Meanwhile, Shaq averaged 33ppg against Dikembe Mutombo in the 2001 NBA Finals on .573 FG%.

For the series, Shaq had 33.0ppg, 15.8rpg, 4.8apg and 3.4bpg.

[sbw19]

Kareem, Shaq, Dream. In that order.

[ThePhantomCreep]

A 23 year old Shaq, in his 3rd year, dropped 28/13/6/3 on 60% on Hakeem.
A 39 year old Kareem dropped 27 a game on 50% FG versus Akeem/Sampson in the 86 playoffs.

Shaq was beyond done at that age.

[aj1987]

A 39 year old Kareem dropped 27 a game on 50% FG versus Akeem/Sampson in the 86 playoffs.

Shaq was beyond done at that age.
Nobody's disputing the fact that KAJ has longevity over Shaq. You implying that Shaq couldn't get his against other greats is asinine. If you look at sheer dominance though, the only thing that was able to slow down Shaq was his FT shooting. This thread is about dominance and Shaq did his thing by absolutely taking a massive dump on the league during the 3peat. Would've won more, if it wasn't for Kobe's ego and him wanting to be "the man" over Shaq. 3peat Shaq is the GOAT basketball player.

Name one single player who was more dominant than '00-'02 Shaq.

[Rocketswin2013]

Longevity: Kareem
Best stretches(01' Finals, single series, etc.):Shaq
Most clutch(GM 7, elimination games, etc.): Hakeem


Shaq practically averaged 40-20 in the 00' Finals. :eek:
But overall I'd give the slight edge to Kareem's longevity.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Nobody's disputing the fact that KAJ has longevity over Shaq. You implying that Shaq couldn't get his against other greats is asinine. If you look at sheer dominance though, the only thing that was able to slow down Shaq was his FT shooting. This thread is about dominance and Shaq did his thing by absolutely taking a massive dump on the league during the 3peat. Would've won more, if it wasn't for Kobe's ego and him wanting to be "the man" over Shaq. 3peat Shaq is the GOAT basketball player.

Name one single player who was more dominant than '00-'02 Shaq.

Already did, Kareem. Did you miss where I posted his PPG through age 36? 29ppg 15ppg with competent foul shooting to boot. Shaq in his entir career only had two-three playoff runs that matched that.

All of Shaq's big scoring series came on mostly single-coverage, so I don't get why you'd blame Kobe for Shaq not scoring more. Blame his horrible FT shooting for that. LeBron fan? When Shaq saw doubles (2000 WCFs, vs the Spurs) Shaq's production tended to drop. And yeah, he saw one great center during the three-peat, a 35 year old Mutumbo. Robinson was completely past it by that point.

Kareem has Shaq in peak and longevity.

[aj1987]

Already did, Kareem. Did you miss where I posted his PPG through age 36? 29ppg 15ppg with competent foul shooting to boot. Shaq in his entir career only had two-three playoff runs that matched that.

:oldlol:

KAJ - 28.8 PPG from his rookie year till the '83 season. Scored 29 PPG in 126 playoff games, along with 14 rebounds, 4 assists, and 3 blocks. 57.1 % TS.

Shaq - 27.2 PPG in 158 playoff games, along with 13 rebounds, 3 assists and 2 blocks a game.

Since this thread is about scoring:
KAJ - 28.8 on 57.1% TS
Shaq- 27.2 on 56.8% TS

I'm not entirely sure, but didn't KAJ's era play at a higher pace?

As I said, KAJ has him on longevity, but Shaq's peak >.


All of Shaq's big scoring series came on mostly single-coverage, so I don't get why you'd blame Kobe for Shaq not scoring more. Blame his horrible FT shooting for that. LeBron fan? When Shaq saw doubles (2000 WCFs, vs the Spurs) Shaq's production tended to drop. And yeah, he saw one great center during the three-peat, a 35 year old Mutumbo. Robinson was completely past it by that point.

Kareem has Shaq in peak and longevity.
This has to be among the dumbest crap that I've ever read on this board.


I'll just leave this here:
Shaq in the '04 Finals - 27 PPG on 17 shots a game.
Kobe in the '04 Finals - 24 PPG on 24 shots a game.

Peak Shaq > KAJ

[ThePhantomCreep]

Good job showing Shaq's numbers are worse across the board. The playoffs were a lot less inclusive in Kareem's days, hence fewer series. Hence, tougher series. And still Kareem's numbers are superior.

There you go blaming Kobe again. Did you know that Shaq's postseason production actually declined when he played with "unselfish" Penny Hardaway? Why don't you ever post FT%? Did you knoe he shot an abysmal 49% (on a whopping 11 attempts) in those 2004 Finals? Such a major flaw, completely glossed over when talking about Shaq.

[aj1987]

Good job showing Shaq's numbers are worse across the board. The playoffs were a lot less inclusive in Kareem's days, hence fewer series. Hence, tougher series. And still Kareem's numbers are superior.
As I said, KAJ had the better longevity. How hard is that to understand? Shaq, however, was more dominant during his peak. Name one other center who did that. 30/15/3/2 on 56% TS, while winning 3 FMVP's and 3 rings. Once again, remember that pace matters when it comes to stuff like rebounds and blocks.


There you go blaming Kobe again. Did you know that Shaq's postseason production actually declined when he played with "unselfish" Penny Hardaway? Why don't you ever post FT%? Did you knoe he shot an abysmal 49% (on a whopping 11 attempts) in those 2004 Finals? Such a major flaw, completely glossed over when talking about Shaq.
Kobetards...:facepalm

TS% of Shaq - 62%
TS% of Kobe - 46%

Shaq was more efficient, anyway you look at it. You want to being up Shaq's FT shooting? Do you know that Kobe shot 17% on nearly 5 3's a game?

Again, if it wasn't for Kobe's ego and chucking, because he wanted to be "the man", Shaq would have more rings and FMVP's.

Oh, and before you spout more BS about Shaq "diminishing" when he got doubled and tripled, look at this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kM2OdZPVaw

[ThePhantomCreep]

Quit trying to derail this thread with your Kobe blather. Shaq was past his peak by 2004 anyway--he averaged about 21-22 a game that year. And before you chalk it up to Kobe shooting too much--the following year with pure, wholesome Dwayne Wade as his teammate, Shaq's postseason production dropped to 19ppg.

It does you no good bringing up 2004/2005 Deisel. Kareem at that age was putting 33/14/5 blocks in the Finals in an MVP season.

Kareem is in his own tier as a dominant scorer.

[aj1987]

Quit trying to derail this thread with your Kobe blather. Shaq was past his peak by 2004 anyway--he averaged about 21-22 a game that year. And before you chalk it up to Kobe shooting too much--the following year with pure, wholesome Dwayne Wade as his teammate, Shaq's postseason production dropped to 19ppg.
Are you stupid or do you just have selective memory. Just 2 posts ago, I pointed out that Shaq scored 27 points on 17 shots a game in '04, in the Finals.


It does you no good bringing up 2004/2005 Deisel. Kareem at that age was putting 33/14/5 blocks in the Finals in an MVP season.
As I said, Shaq was still a beast in '04 and would've won a ring and FMVP, if it wasn't for Kobe.


Kareem is in his own tier as a dominant scorer.
True. Shaq is just flat out better at their peaks though.

[dankok8]

Kareem always somewhat suffers in peak discussions because he didn't have a well-defined peak. He played at a constant GOAT level for about 12 years since he was a rookie until '81. And for some reason it's used against him!

Kareem's '70, '71, '74, '77, '79, an '80 postseasons are very much on par with any of Shaq's. Go look at the offensive numbers.

[JohnFreeman]

Kareem

[Smoke117]

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm
u could make a case for Robinson over Hakeem as playoff scorer:roll: :roll: :facepalm


David Robinson in his rookie season took the Spurs from 21 wins in 89 to 56 in 90 and averaged: 24.3ppg 12.0rpg 4.0bpg 1.1spg 2.3apg 2.4topg with a .581ts% in the playoffs while being by far (far far far...i'm not sure i can say it enough) the best defensive player player on the team and taking the eventual 1990 finals losing Blazers to 7 games in the WCSF. Jesus christ, what a joke Robinson is. He immediately joins the Spurs turning them into an elite team basically overnight by his presence, has a great playoffs which includes taking the team who actually went to the Finals in 1990 from the WC the Blazers to 7 games. THIS IS HIS ROOKIE YEAR. Here's a player who is defined by one playoff series vs another dominant player at the same position who has no equal as far as players period that were as good as him as a rookie in the last 34 years. That's how good he was. David Robinson was basically a top 3 player in the league HIS FIRST SEASON. I don't understand how you can be underrated when you basically have the best rookie regular season over the last 30+ years, went 7 games with the team that lost in the NBA Finals that same year...not even Shaq can say he was as dominate as Robinson in his ROOKIE YEAR.

[Odinn]

Peak-wise;
1. Shaquille O'Neal
1. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Hakeem Olajuwon

Overall;
1. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2. Shaquille O'Neal
3. Hakeem Olajuwon

[Asukal]

Just for the fun of it...

How many of those guys had FOUR playoff series of 37.0 ppg, 37.0 ppg, 38.6 ppg, and 38.7 ppg?

And this one is really good...how many of them had FOUR 50+ point games, including THREE in MUST-WIN games? Or a 45 point MUST-WIN game in the Finals?

Just for the fun of it...

How many of those guys saw an 8 point drop from their regular season ppg to their playoff ppg for their career? :rolleyes:

[LAZERUSS]

Just for the fun of it...

How many of those guys saw an 8 point drop from their regular season ppg to their playoff ppg for their career? :rolleyes:

How many of them averaged 30 ppg in their regular season careers? How many of them averaged 40 ppg over the course of their seven best scoring seasons? And in their seven best scoring seasons, how many of them averaged 33 ppg in the playoffs in that span?

[ralph_i_el]

How many of them averaged 30 ppg in their regular season careers? How many of them averaged 40 ppg over the course of their seven best scoring seasons? And in their seven best scoring seasons, how many of them averaged 33 ppg in the playoffs in that span?

you're right dude, point totals from those two eras are very comparable :applause: valid points all

[dunksby]

Are you stupid or do you just have selective memory. Just 2 posts ago, I pointed out that Shaq scored 27 points on 17 shots a game in '04, in the Finals.


As I said, Shaq was still a beast in '04 and would've won a ring and FMVP, if it wasn't for Kobe.


True. Shaq is just flat out better at their peaks though.
Kareem had better peak everything wise, he scored efficiently, he made his FTs at a high level, dished out assists, facilitated offense and I know it's not relevant here (as are rebounding numbers) but he also played elite defense.

[Psileas]

you're right dude, point totals from those two eras are very comparable :applause: valid points all

These what "2 eras"? He's not even comparing 2 players. Read before trying to sound smart.
And even if he was, if total points are not comparable, neither are point differentials.