Proof that Pippen > Lebron... according to lebron fans....

[riseagainst]

Basis: "MJ could never win without Pippen." - lebron stans

Proof: Replace Pippen with Lebron. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Bulls were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Pippen on the team.

Conclusion: Pippen > Lebron. As Pippen is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

[SilkkTheShocker]

LeBron >>> Kobe all-time


It's time to move on, son.

[b1imtf]

Wat

[oarabbus]

Basis: "MJ could never win without Pippen." - lebron stans

Proof: Replace Pippen with Lebron. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Bulls were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Pippen on the team.

Conclusion: Pippen > Lebron. As Pippen is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.


:facepalm

0/10

That was ****ing awful. And I'm the farthest thing from a Branstan. Better luck next time.

[DaSeba5]

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[riseagainst]

proof makes perfect sense to me. Why people catching feelings?

:confusedshrug:

[DMV2]

LeBron >>> Kobe all-time


It's time to move on, son.
Pippen >>>>> Kobe as a sidekick, Robin, #2 option. :lol

[dubeta]

Honestly at this point we need to seriously consider whether Kobe was even better all time than Pippen

Pippen has 6 rings to Kobe's 5

Majority of both players rings were sidekick rings, although Pippen was a more important sidekick

Pippen was a scorer, defender, rebounder, distributor

Yes Kobe scored more, but he didnt do much else, and often shot inefficiently, leading to Finals losses (2004)

Kobe only has 1 more MVP than Pippen, showing that he wasnt much more dominant than him in the regular season, both weren't extremely dominant in terms of the stat sheet

In terms of PER player efficiency rating, Kobe is 23.26 while Pippen is 18.63, not a great difference, neither of them are even top 15 in this category

Of course when you measure intangibles, teamwork, leadership, unselfishness, they all favour Pippen

While this objective analysis leads to Pippen being better all time, I am an unbiased individual and therefore I leave it up to ISH to decide who is really better all time.

[TylerOO]

:sleeping :sleeping

You a lame

[Marchesk]

Wilt > both

[KobeMagic]

OP is a genius.

logic says Pippen > Lebron, deal wit it.

:bowdown: :bowdown:

[dh144498]

:roll:

[robert_shaww]

give me pippen.

[red1]

proof that the OP is a raging unrepentant homosexual (no mark jackson):


Basis: "MJ could never win without Pippen." - lebron stans

Proof: Replace Pippen with Lebron. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Bulls were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Pippen on the team.

Conclusion: Pippen > Lebron. As Pippen is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

[Jailblazers7]

Basis: "MJ could never win without Pippen." - lebron stans

Proof: Replace Pippen with Lebron. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Bulls were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Pippen on the team.

Conclusion: Pippen > Lebron. As Pippen is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

So by the same logic Wade>MJ. :bowdown:

[97 bulls]

Honestly at this point we need to seriously consider whether Kobe was even better all time than Pippen

Pippen has 6 rings to Kobe's 5

Majority of both players rings were sidekick rings, although Pippen was a more important sidekick

Pippen was a scorer, defender, rebounder, distributor

Yes Kobe scored more, but he didnt do much else, and often shot inefficiently, leading to Finals losses (2004)

Kobe only has 1 more MVP than Pippen, showing that he wasnt much more dominant than him in the regular season, both weren't extremely dominant in terms of the stat sheet

In terms of PER player efficiency rating, Kobe is 23.26 while Pippen is 18.63, not a great difference, neither of them are even top 15 in this category

Of course when you measure intangibles, teamwork, leadership, unselfishness, they all favour Pippen

While this objective analysis leads to Pippen being better all time, I am an unbiased individual and therefore I leave it up to ISH to decide who is really better all time.
Ive been saying this for the longest.

And if PER includeded defense, Pippen would probably be slightly ahead of Bryant.

[Kblaze8855]

What the **** is that? Its like you just took a bucket full of somewhat basketball related words and threw them against a wall.

[oarabbus]

What the **** is that? Its like you just took a bucket full of somewhat basketball related words and threw them against a wall.

:oldlol:

[Mure]

Basis: "MJ could never win without Pippen." - lebron stans

Proof: Replace Pippen with Lebron. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Bulls were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Pippen on the team.

Conclusion: Pippen > Lebron. As Pippen is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

What language is this? One of the worst posts in the last few months I've read, 0/10, Lebron > Kobe.

[rhowen4]

holy shit

i'm laughing so hard right now

[Jailblazers7]

Basis: "Lebron could never win without Wade." - Jordan stans

Proof: Replace Wade with Jordan. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Heat were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Wade on the team.

Conclusion: Wade > Jordan. As Wade is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

Wade is actually the GOAT and nobody knew it. :bowdown:

[juju151111]

What the **** is that? Its like you just took a bucket full of somewhat basketball related words and threw them against a wall.
:roll: I'm rolling

[dubeta]

Honestly at this point we need to seriously consider whether Kobe was even better all time than Pippen

Pippen has 6 rings to Kobe's 5

Majority of both players rings were sidekick rings, although Pippen was a more important sidekick

Pippen was a scorer, defender, rebounder, distributor

Yes Kobe scored more, but he didnt do much else, and often shot inefficiently, leading to Finals losses (2004)

Kobe only has 1 more MVP than Pippen, showing that he wasnt much more dominant than him in the regular season, both weren't extremely dominant in terms of the stat sheet

In terms of PER player efficiency rating, Kobe is 23.26 while Pippen is 18.63, not a great difference, neither of them are even top 15 in this category

Of course when you measure intangibles, teamwork, leadership, unselfishness, they all favour Pippen

While this objective analysis leads to Pippen being better all time, I am an unbiased individual and therefore I leave it up to ISH to decide who is really better all time.

How come no Kobe stan has a response to this?

[sdot_thadon]

When logic spits in the face of reality.....

[IllegalD]

Your right.

Nash has 2 MVPs so that proves that he is better than Kobe, Shaq, or Pippen...

:facepalm

Kobe put up elite #1 option numbers in the 2001 and 2002 championship runs, along with elite perimeter defense. Kobe was the leading 4th quarter scorer in many of those series/games. In the 1st championship Kobe didn''t have 1st option stats but has 1st option moments (Game 7 against Blazers, Game 4 against Blazers, Game winner against Suns).

Not to mention Kobe won 2 as the man, while Pippen has NONE, even though he was on stacked teams after his Bulls years with the likes of the Blazers, and trying to form superteams with Olajuwon and Barkley on the rockets.

[IllegalD]

Kobe is Top 5 all time, no less than Top 10. Pippen isn't even Top 15. Get over it, guys.

[Peteballa]

As some of you may know, I am Peteballa. I've been on ISH since 2009, mostly lurking though - I learned the hard way that posting often times just leads to flame wars and arguments. However, as of this thread, I am no longer going to visit InsideHoops. This is a level of stupidity I never even knew was possible. Goodbye ISH, most of you probably don't know me, but you will never see me again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

[KobeMagic]

As some of you may know, I am Peteballa. I've been on ISH since 2009, mostly lurking though - I learned the hard way that posting often times just leads to flame wars and arguments. However, as of this thread, I am no longer going to visit InsideHoops. This is a level of stupidity I never even knew was possible. Goodbye ISH, most of you probably don't know me, but you will never see me again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

just gonna quote this.

[97 bulls]

Your right.

Nash has 2 MVPs so that proves that he is better than Kobe, Shaq, or Pippen...

:facepalm

Kobe put up elite #1 option numbers in the 2001 and 2002 championship runs, along with elite perimeter defense. Kobe was the leading 4th quarter scorer in many of those series/games. In the 1st championship Kobe didn''t have 1st option stats but has 1st option moments (Game 7 against Blazers, Game 4 against Blazers, Game winner against Suns).

Not to mention Kobe won 2 as the man, while Pippen has NONE, even though he was on stacked teams after his Bulls years with the likes of the Blazers, and trying to form superteams with Olajuwon and Barkley on the rockets.
Pippen never cost the Bulls a championship. Plus he has one more. The only thing that separates Bryant from Pippen is that MVP.

Besides, who knows what Pippen would've done if he had five years of being the best player on a team like Bryant.

One thing we do know. As far as impact, there wasn't much difference.

[MJ23forever]

Pippen never cost the Bulls a championship. Plus he has one more. The only thing that separates Bryant from Pippen is that MVP.

Besides, who knows what Pippen would've done if he had five years of being the best player on a team like Bryant.

One thing we do know. As far as impact, there wasn't much difference.
Yes he did. If it wasn't for Scottie's "headache" game in the '90 ECF's MJ and the Bulls have 7 rings. You're delusional if you think his impact was close to Kobe's post 2000. When Kobe matured later in the 2000-2001 season and playoffs, he was better than Pippen ever was and in 2002, he was also producing with his scoring at a level Pippen couldn't. Kobe was more clutch as well. Yeah, Pippen was the better defensive player and rebounder(though Kobe was no slouch here) and both ran their team's offense and were the closest things they had to a point guard, though Pippen had more of that mentality. And Kobe's role on the 2001 team and 2002 team was much closer to that of a number 1 option than Pippen's.

[nzahir]

So horry>kobe cuz more rings right?

[97 bulls]

Yes he did. If it wasn't for Scottie's "headache" game in the '90 ECF's MJ and the Bulls have 7 rings. You're delusional if you think his impact was close to Kobe's post 2000. When Kobe matured later in the 2000-2001 season and playoffs, he was better than Pippen ever was and in 2002, he was also producing with his scoring at a level Pippen couldn't. Kobe was more clutch as well. Yeah, Pippen was the better defensive player and rebounder(though Kobe was no slouch here) and both ran their team's offense and were the closest things they had to a point guard, though Pippen had more of that mentality. And Kobe's role on the 2001 team and 2002 team was much closer to that of a number 1 option than Pippen's.
Id have to disagree. Pippens migrane did not cost the Bulls the series. Besides, that's an injury. Kobe just flat out played BAD in 2004.

The first option stuff is nonsense. Bill Russell wasn't his teams first option. Neither was Magic. Most point guards aren't first options.

As far as impact, I just disagree. Pippens defensive impact was just as valuable as Bryants offensive impact. The best way to gauge this is by comparing Bryants 06 season to Pippens 95 season pre Jordan's return.

Their record was the same, And they both had historical statistical seasons. Bryants due to his avg 35 ppg and Pippen because he led his team in every major category. The only difference is their respective styles.

[Paul George 24]

Basis: "Lebron could never win without Wade." - Jordan stans

Proof: Replace Wade with Jordan. MJ + Lebron + rest of the Heat were not going to win vs any team in the finals, because Basis. No Wade on the team.

Conclusion: Wade > Jordan. As Wade is the only difference on the two teams between a champion and a non-champion.

Wade is actually the GOAT and nobody knew it. :bowdown:

Lebron could never win without Wade,MILLER,BOSH,$TERN,MARIO,COLES :roll:

[20Four]

LeBron >>> Kobe all-time


It's time to move on, son.
Fvcking ph^ggot die already :banghead:

[mentallooser]

Theo needs to put a diaper on this dude.

[Ne 1]

Id have to disagree. Pippens migrane did not cost the Bulls the series. Besides, that's an injury. Kobe just flat out played BAD in 2004.


Yeah, it was all Kobe's fault. The rest of the team outside of Shaq shooting 33%, Malone injured, Fox injured, Grant injured, Horry gone, Shaq's lazy play defensively and on the boards, Payton's atrocious play and non-existent defense on Billups had nothing to do with it. Right? :oldlol:

[97 bulls]

Yeah, it was all Kobe's fault. The rest of the team outside of Shaq shooting 33%, Malone injured, Fox injured, Grant injured, Horry gone, Shaq's lazy play defensively and on the boards, Payton's atrocious play and non-existent defense on Billups had nothing to do with it. Right? :oldlol:
True. But then where is the consistency? The role players get minimal credit for team succeses but full blame for failures? Where's the logic in that? Look at MJ23forvevers post. Blame Pippen for the Bulls loss in 90, then in his very next sentence, minimize his contributions by saying Kobes held more weight because he won as the man. It's just insane logic.

Truth be told, all the Lakers had an atrocious series statistically minus Shaq. But Kobe......? I say he played bad because of his approach in that Championship. Far too often he would poind the air out of the ball then chuck a bad three, attack.the basket and go 1 on 3. Wouldn't even look to Shaq in the post, missed open teammates, just bad shot after shot. Far too much hero ball. It as very similar to Russell Westbrook today. That's why I say he had a bad series.

[Ne 1]

Blame Pippen for the Bulls loss in 90, then in his very next sentence, minimize his contributions by saying Kobes held more weight because he won as the man. It's just insane logic.

I think his point was that if Pippen showed up and didn't go 1-10 in that Game 7, then the Bulls most likely would have won, just as if Kobe would have showed up and played to his standards the Lakers likely would have won in 2004. And I know Pippen is always blamed for that loss, but the truth is that none of the Bulls players outside of Jordan had a good game, so I don't think it's exactly fair or accurate to say it's all his fault that they lost, but he's right, the 2004 Finals loss can't just be blamed on Kobe either. As far as "rings as the man" I agree with you. This is not a real category. People throw it out as a statistical category. But really, does anyone outside of ISH and similar sites comprised of a tiny fraction of hardcore elitist fans care about this? This is a rhetorical question. No one does. Rings are rings. It's actually hilarious how elitist fans obsess over a fictional category that is based on subjective factors and is irrelevant. I mean if "the man" could win without the "sidekick" it would mean something but many players have proved this cannot be done, aside from a few cases such as Hakeem, Duncan, and Dirk who won a title without a great "#2". Look at LeBron before Wade. Look at Kobe before Gasol. Look at Jordan before before Pippen, Shaq before Kobe and the list goes on and on.



Truth be told, all the Lakers had an atrocious series statistically minus Shaq. But Kobe......? I say he played bad because of his approach in that Championship. Far too often he would poind the air out of the ball then chuck a bad three, attack.the basket and go 1 on 3. Wouldn't even look to Shaq in the post, missed open teammates, just bad shot after shot. Far too much hero ball. It as very similar to Russell Westbrook today. That's why I say he had a bad series.


The easy narrative of the Lakers losing that series that people like to latch onto (particularly Kobe detractors) is that Kobe was gunning for Finals MVP and then after that he forced Shaq out of L.A., but that's pretty far from the actual truth on both accounts. It's not a coincidence that the biggest blow-out for Detroit that series came in the game where Bryant only took 13 shots. They literally had nobody who could create anything on the perimeter and nobody who could shoot. At times they were running a lineup of Kobe, Kareem Rush, Slava Medvedenko, Devean George, and Derek Fisher. With Malone, Grant, and Rick Fox injured, they no longer had Robert Horry, and as I already pointed out Payton was totally ineffective on both ends of the court, this may be a worse team top to bottom than Kobe's 2006 squad outside of Shaq. But its more fun to imagine Kobe dribbling down the court with devil horns sticking out of his head, cackling like a mad scientist as he jacks up 30 foot fade-aways over 5 defenders while Shaq is under the rim wide open, on both knees, hands clasped together begging for the ball. We actually tried to force-feed Shaq plenty. It was almost as good for a turnover as it was a field goal. The game Kobe had the least shot attempts, 13, Shaq still only shot 14 times. If Bryant's "hero ball" or chucking was the only thing preventing Shaq from getting the rock and putting it in the hole, you'd think he'd have shot 25+ times with Kobe easing up, but that's not how basketball works.

It is how good the Pistons defense was. "You want to get the ball inside? Good luck." They weren't holding teams to <80ppg because they didn't know how to handle post players. Actually getting the basketball in the paint was a bitch against the '04 Pistons, be you perimeter player or bigman.

The guards outside of Kobe shot 30% for the series. The small forwards (Walton and George) shot 40%. The team as a whole shot 33% outside of Shaq. Nobody was making shots from the perimeter when Kobe fed them, and the Pistons made it difficult to feed Shaq inside the way they would have liked to, Ben and Sheed denied the the entry pass to Shaq the best I've ever seen in my life. The Lakers really had no one else to take those shots so of course it was often left to Kobe to gun, it wasn't him just forcing up bad shots.


Now don't get me wrong, Kobe had a horrendous series by his standards but not only that, Tex Winter actually criticized Shaq's play in that series too for being lazy on defense and on the glass, and not establishing position in the paint and not working to get the ball enough. Shaq did have some great offensive games but he was slow defensively coming off the pick and Rip and Chauncy got to the rim at will.

[Prometheus]

By OP logic, Pippen is the greatest player of all time.

Proof?

Jordan can't win without Pippen. Replace Pippen with Shaq, Duncan and Magic. Bulls = 0 rings because no Pippen. Jordan couldn't win without Pippen, therefore Pippen = GOAT. Seems legit.