Fellow Lebron Stans: MIA-OKC Finals will be a bloodbath and you all know it

[KirbyPls]

This is no longer 2012. KD is better than he was, Westbrook is better (there's two top-10 players on OKC), the supporting cast is deep (Butler is a great pick-up as a spot-up shooter), Jackson can erupt, Ibaka is one of the best mid-range shooters statistically in the game, and is a great rim protector, and, perhaps most of all, OKC is hungry, very hungry. OKC is also crafty and exploits officiating (insert joke here, but they don't struggle getting calls). If they meet in the Finals, there is absolutely no evidence it will be the same as 2012. I know you all are concerned, as am I, and we should be.

That being said, Miami is a veteran-laden team, plays well on both sides of the ball, is rested and healthy, and after last year, is taking no one, especially not the newly-minted MVP and his fellow superstar lightly. Miami is still more disciplined and intelligent than OKC, as well as better coached. Finally, if Lebron is who I (we) think he is, he will all-around outplay KD (probably very slightly) and lead the team to a brutal, hard-fought victory. But this is certainly no guarantee, like many claim on here.

Lots of playoffs left for both teams: Spurs look great, Pacers rejuvenated, hell, the Heat might drop two to the Nets and get stretched or even beaten by the Pacers. But, I think we are headed for a 2012 Finals rematch, and OKC is a more than a legit challenger. KD is a great player and worthy MVP, Heat will have their hand full three-peating.

But, I still think Heat in 7. KD's time is almost here though (and may be this year). Now back to our regularly-scheduled stanning.

[KD35willbeGOAT]

Great post. Only fear I have is OKC playing Perkins big minutes and especially starting him. We can see how effective OKC is when playing small ball. If only Brooks would follow suit more often.

[The-Legend-24]

ISH is going to be wild if these two teams meet. :oldlol:

I honestly can't wait. :oldlol:

[J Shuttlesworth]

Look at what happened when they played a good defensive team like the Grizzlies. Miami is a great defensive team and way more seasoned than the Grizzlies and have all the finals/playoff experience they need to overcome situations. OKC looks great against the Clippers because nobody is playing defense. Watch when they play the Spurs. You won't see the same numbers from Westbrook/Durant. It would be a great series though, but i got Heat in 6

[oh the horror]

Again as I said in the other thread. You fools fall in love with OKC's style of play visually and just assume they'll merely overtake Miami in a series because they're "better than they were"


Okc is literally custom made for the style in which Miami CAN beat.

They're PRIMARILY a perimeter team guys. I guarantee you that if they meet you WILL see the same outcome.

[KDthunderup]

Heat have no rim protection. Goatbrook gonna go ham

[inclinerator]

inb4 ish crashes after every game

[VengefulAngel]

Heat have no rim protection. Goatbrook gonna go ham

Not true anymore, Birdman is a legitimate rim protector and a mobile big.

[Rocketswin2013]

Heat have no rim protection. Goatbrook gonna go ham
They have one of the greatest perimeter defenses the league has ever seen. They'll shut down OKC's PnR game. And Westbrook will probably play aggressive and Chuck into their favor.

[KirbyPls]

Again as I said in the other thread. You fools fall in love with OKC's style of play visually and just assume they'll merely overtake Miami in a series because they're "better than they were"


Okc is literally custom made for the style in which Miami CAN beat.

They're PRIMARILY a perimeter team guys. I guarantee you that if they meet you WILL see the same outcome.

I respect you as a poster and your opinions and would love to believe it, but I cannot imagine Miami winning in less than 6. Hope you're right, but the Thunder look significantly different these last two games than they have for months. What if they found "it?"

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Look at what happened when they played a good defensive team like the Grizzlies. Miami is a great defensive team and way more seasoned than the Grizzlies and have all the finals/playoff experience they need to overcome situations. OKC looks great against the Clippers because nobody is playing defense. Watch when they play the Spurs. You won't see the same numbers from Westbrook/Durant. It would be a great series though, but i got Heat in 6
Miamis defense isnt anywhere near the Grizz:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[navy]

I respect you as a poster and your opinions and would love to believe it, but I cannot imagine Miami winning in less than 6. Hope you're right, but the Thunder look significantly different these last two games than they have for months. What if they found "it?"
The Clippers dont play defense. :confusedshrug:

[VengefulAngel]

They have one of the greatest perimeter defenses the league has ever seen. They'll shut down OKC's PnR game. And Westbrook will probably play aggressive and Chuck into their favor.

Miami's defense when all are intune is a masterpiece. Forcing turnovers, sharp rotations and runouts.

[VengefulAngel]

Miamis defense isnt anywhere near the Grizz:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

You really have no clue, Miami's defense is one of the best in the league in the playoffs.

[KirbyPls]

Miamis defense isnt anywhere near the Grizz:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Interior alone? No it's not. All around? I think it's better when they turn it on. And they will.

[Cocaine80s]

Miamis defense isnt anywhere near the Grizz:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
:biggums:

[J Shuttlesworth]

Miamis defense isnt anywhere near the Grizz:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
lol @ nowhere near. They didn't win 2 rings with pure offense. OKC BARELY squeezed by the Grizz. The Heat are elite on both ends whereas Memphis is only elite defensively. Spurs are a great balance of offense and defense and you guys would be lucky to beat them... though I am rooting for you in that regard.

[oh the horror]

I respect you as a poster and your opinions and would love to believe it, but I cannot imagine Miami winning in less than 6. Hope you're right, but the Thunder look significantly different these last two games than they have for months. What if they found "it?"


It's because it's the clippers dude. Believe me.

Okc looked lost against Memphis and we can all speculate might have even lost that series if Zach wasn't suspended. We will never know for sure but Memphis and their defense presented a lot of problems.


Miami, once in the finals will tighten that defense like a fu*king vice grip.

[KDthunderup]

They have one of the greatest perimeter defenses the league has ever seen. They'll shut down OKC's PnR game. And Westbrook will probably play aggressive and Chuck into their favor.
Is that the same perimeter defense that handed the Heat their worst home loss in Big 3 history?

[J Shuttlesworth]

Hamtaro went full retard ITT... or in his case "Furr retard"

[Keno]

repeat of 2012 finals.

[KirbyPls]

It's because it's the clippers dude. Believe me.

Okc looked lost against Memphis and we can all speculate might have even lost that series if Zach wasn't suspended. We will never know for sure but Memphis and their defense presented a lot of problems.


Miami, once in the finals will tighten that defense like a fu*king vice grip.

I'm picking up what you're putting down, I'm just nervous and skeptical. You are one of the best Lakers/Kobe fans on here; though you seem more Lakers than Kobe fan.

[VengefulAngel]

2013-2014

Hollinger Playoff Stats - Defensive Efficiency
RK TEAM PACE AST TO ORR DRR REBR EFF FG% TS% OFF EFF DEF EFF
1 Indiana 92.8 16.3 13.8 21.4 77.3 51.2 49.2 53.6 100.8 98.9
2 Miami 89.8 17.8 10.5 14.6 78.4 48.5 55.8 59.6 112.9 99.4
3 Washington 89.1 16.8 11.0 28.6 76.1 52.4 47.9 51.4 103.8 99.8
4 Atlanta 93.0 14.0 13.1 20.4 76.2 46.6 45.6 51.5 98.2 101.6
5 Oklahoma City 93.1 14.6 14.4 32.2 74.8 54.4 49.4 54.6 106.8 102.2
6 San Antonio 95.0 16.7 12.5 24.4 72.6 50.1 55.0 58.4 112.5 103.9
7 Chicago 88.1 16.6 13.0 27.9 72.2 49.3 46.3 50.8 100.4 104.8
8 Memphis 91.8 16.4 10.1 27.0 69.0 47.0 44.2 48.6 98.9 105.7

2012-2013

RK TEAM PACE AST TO ORR DRR REBR EFF FG% TS% OFF EFF DEF EFF
1 New York 89.1 13.0 11.5 24.2 76.5 48.4 46.0 49.8 98.6 95.6
2 Boston 89.0 14.9 18.1 14.0 76.3 48.0 46.3 52.5 90.8 96.9
3 San Antonio 91.9 17.3 12.3 23.3 73.8 49.4 51.1 54.7 105.9 98.8
4 Miami 89.8 17.1 13.1 25.2 71.1 48.6 51.8 55.9 107.7 99.8

Now can you stfu pls.

[oh the horror]

To be honest I'd prefer a spurs and heat finals again.

I just think SA matches up better and Pop and Co. Are a smarter bunch.

[KDthunderup]

2013-2014

Hollinger Playoff Stats - Defensive Efficiency
RK TEAM PACE AST TO ORR DRR REBR EFF FG% TS% OFF EFF DEF EFF
1 Indiana 92.8 16.3 13.8 21.4 77.3 51.2 49.2 53.6 100.8 98.9
2 Miami 89.8 17.8 10.5 14.6 78.4 48.5 55.8 59.6 112.9 99.4
3 Washington 89.1 16.8 11.0 28.6 76.1 52.4 47.9 51.4 103.8 99.8
4 Atlanta 93.0 14.0 13.1 20.4 76.2 46.6 45.6 51.5 98.2 101.6
5 Oklahoma City 93.1 14.6 14.4 32.2 74.8 54.4 49.4 54.6 106.8 102.2
6 San Antonio 95.0 16.7 12.5 24.4 72.6 50.1 55.0 58.4 112.5 103.9
7 Chicago 88.1 16.6 13.0 27.9 72.2 49.3 46.3 50.8 100.4 104.8
8 Memphis 91.8 16.4 10.1 27.0 69.0 47.0 44.2 48.6 98.9 105.7

2012-2013

RK TEAM PACE AST TO ORR DRR REBR EFF FG% TS% OFF EFF DEF EFF
1 New York 89.1 13.0 11.5 24.2 76.5 48.4 46.0 49.8 98.6 95.6
2 Boston 89.0 14.9 18.1 14.0 76.3 48.0 46.3 52.5 90.8 96.9
3 San Antonio 91.9 17.3 12.3 23.3 73.8 49.4 51.1 54.7 105.9 98.8
4 Miami 89.8 17.1 13.1 25.2 71.1 48.6 51.8 55.9 107.7 99.8

Now can you stfu pls.
Memphis more then 6 points better :lol :lol :lol

[dude77]

Is that the same perimeter defense that handed the Heat their worst home loss in Big 3 history?

surely you're not talking about a regular season game ? :facepalm

[VengefulAngel]

Memphis more then 6 points better :lol :lol :lol

omg, you just proved you're an idiot. Miami was ranked 2nd, Memphis 8th, a lower number is preferred....

[Big Cheese]

the spurs have a better chance of beating the heat than okc does. If you are a heat hater you should be cheering for the spurs to make it to the finals.

[KDthunderup]

omg, you just proved you're an idiot. Miami was ranked 2nd, Memphis 8th, a lower number is preferred....
Im comparing Def EFF you dumb fakkit. That's what we are talking about :facepalm

[J Shuttlesworth]

Memphis more then 6 points better :lol :lol :lol
Playoffs:

http://i.imgur.com/HFQdC9H.png

[VengefulAngel]

Im comparing Def EFF you dumb fakkit. That's what we are talking about :facepalm

That was defensive efficiency you idiot.

Miami is ranked 2nd, Memphis 8th :roll: :roll:

[PyrrhusX]

You really have no clue, Miami's defense is one of the best in the league in the playoffs.

Sure it looks good when you play **** teams :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[J Shuttlesworth]

Memphis slightly better in the season, but we're talking 0.7 difference

http://i.imgur.com/3AOCISk.png

Hollinger for Playoffs:

http://i.imgur.com/6Hpg30t.png

[dude77]

Sure it looks good when you play **** teams :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

2 time back to back defending champions says otherwise you dumb mfer :oldlol:

[VengefulAngel]

http://i57.tinypic.com/20psck6.png

[KD35willbeGOAT]

http://i57.tinypic.com/20psck6.png

Playoff stats this season or last? Because they did play the LOLCats this season and that definitely inflates them.

[dude77]

Playoff stats this season or last? Because they did play the LOLCats this season and that definitely inflates them.

it doesn't inflate shit .. miami always switches gears in the playoffs .. this isn't anything new

[VengefulAngel]

Playoff stats this season or last? Because they did play the LOLCats this season and that definitely inflates them.

Last season is this

http://i60.tinypic.com/zy5y13.png

[KD35willbeGOAT]

it doesn't inflate shit .. miami always switches gears in the playoffs .. this isn't anything new

It does inflate them if you play a mediocre offensive team, but regardless, Miami is a top tier defensive team, no doubt about it. In any case, so was Memphis.

[KD35willbeGOAT]

Last season is this



No doubt they're top tier, but OKC shows up too. Shockingly, NY is topping this list? I guess since they did play some shit offensive teams, it works in their favor.

[J Shuttlesworth]

It does inflate them if you play a mediocre offensive team, but regardless, Miami is a top tier defensive team, no doubt about it. In any case, so was Memphis.
Exactly. I don't even really care if people rank Memphis higher than Miami defensively this year, but to say "nowhere close" is simply ignorance. Miami's offensive fills the void that the Grizzlies had against the Thunder.

[J Shuttlesworth]

No doubt they're top tier, but OKC shows up too. Shockingly, NY is topping this list? I guess since they did play some shit offensive teams, it works in their favor.
Small sample size :lol

Miami's defensive rating if over 4 series in last years playoffs, with 2 of them going to game 7

[VengefulAngel]

No doubt they're top tier, but OKC shows up too. Shockingly, NY is topping this list? I guess since they did play some shit offensive teams, it works in their favor.

The defensive efficiency statistic measures the number of points a team allowed per 100 possessions.

^^ It can be distortionary due to the mediocrity of some teams on offense, but Miami's defense does not systematically pick on weaker offenses. In fact Miami's defense against the top tier teams in the playoffs is fantastic.

[KD35willbeGOAT]

Also, Miami plays a very slow pace, which also helps set their defense. OKC in the half court is abysmal and so we play a faster pace, affecting our defense more. Either way, it would be a solid match up, with Miami being favourites.

[VengefulAngel]

Also, Miami plays a very slow pace, which also helps set their defense. OKC in the half court is abysmal and so we play a faster pace, affecting our defense more. Either way, it would be a solid match up, with Miami being favourites.

Defensive efficiency adjusts for pace.

How it Works

The 2011-12 Oklahoma City Thunder allowed 96.94 points per game, which ranked 17th overall in that category - in the bottom half of the league. But if you eliminate the effect of pace - of the number of possessions per game - and rate the Thunder in terms of efficiency, they fare much better. Their defensive efficiency for the same season was a nice round 100.0 - the ninth-best mark in the league.
Why the difference? The Thunder averaged 95.7 possessions per game in 2011-12 - the fifth-fastest pace in the league.

Example ^^

[KD35willbeGOAT]

Defensive efficiency adjusts for pace.

How it Works

The 2011-12 Oklahoma City Thunder allowed 96.94 points per game, which ranked 17th overall in that category - in the bottom half of the league. But if you eliminate the effect of pace - of the number of possessions per game - and rate the Thunder in terms of efficiency, they fare much better. Their defensive efficiency for the same season was a nice round 100.0 - the ninth-best mark in the league.
Why the difference? The Thunder averaged 95.7 possessions per game in 2011-12 - the fifth-fastest pace in the league.

Example ^^

Thanks! I'm not a stat buff but that clears things up. I meant, the effect of pace on the flow of the game, not the statistics themselves.

[Black Mamba's B]

That was defensive efficiency you idiot.

Miami is ranked 2nd, Memphis 8th :roll: :roll:
Do these statistics take into account the sorry offensive teams the heat mostly play against?

[VengefulAngel]

Do these statistics take into account the sorry offensive teams the heat mostly play against?

As mentioned previously, individually no, cumulatively yes. There is a systematic evidence to suggest that Miami is an elite defensive team, validated with advanced metrics and results.

[Mr. Jabbar]

u can smell the fear from bran stans as they watch the western playoffs from a mile away :oldlol:

they're basically praying for injuries at this point

[KirbyPls]

u can smell the fear from bran stans as they watch the western playoffs from a mile away :oldlol:

they're basically praying for injuries at this point

Or, unlike Kobetards, we might want to examine objective analysis instead of mamba faces, killer instincts, clutch genes, wills to win, and other myths. Stick to cheeky .gifs, as you're out of your element in actual basketball discussions.

[JohnMax]

http://dimemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/lvIttbS.jpg

[DaSeba5]

Miami is not a good matchup for OKC. The Thunder do not have a post presence to hurt Miami on offense and defense. Miami has the best perimeter defense in the league and OKC's offense is purely based on the perimeter. OKC will not beat Miami 4 times shooting jump shots. It will be very similar to 2012.

[Heavincent]

Miami would win in 5 or 6 games.

[Megabox!]

Or, unlike Kobetards, we might want to examine objective analysis instead of mamba faces, killer instincts, clutch genes, wills to win, and other myths. Stick to cheeky .gifs, as you're out of your element in actual basketball discussions.
:applause: :applause: got wrecked

[Knicks2014champ]

A role player vs a real superstar hmm easy choice kd will cook leroleplayer :lol

[sd3035]

Miami will never get by Indiana

[sd3035]

OKC will broom Miami if they are lucky enough to get by the Pacers

[IMObjective]

Miami will never get by Indiana
I hope so. I do think Indy will surprise people in the eastern finals. Nothing like a common hatred to motivate and bring a group together. And they are beginning to look like their old selves in the wizards series.

[All Net]

It's the matchup the league needs.

[Straight_Ballin]

The Clippers dont play defense. :confusedshrug:

Then why are the clippers in the 2nd rd of the playoffs?

[Spokelahoma]

i love ppl using are the 2012 results to justify how this matchup would be lol

[Warfan]

Good post OP. Kd and Russ have been the 2 best players in the playoffs so far, and along with Ibaka all 3 have majorly improved since 2012, not to mention they have a very solid supporting cast. In the 12' Finals, Games 2-4 all couldve went either way as they came to down to the last few plays, Miami didnt steamroll them like they did in Game 5. Combined with the fact that wade isnt what he was even 2 years ago, and that OKC would have HCA i think the thunder have a chance to win. Id still pick Miami but i see it atleast going to 6, especially when the thunder have that 2nd guy who can win a game by himself. Now i know OKC doesnt necessarily exploit the weaknesses of Miami like people have already stated, but i dont think this heat team is what it was 2 years ago and have only looked good going against 2 average teams so far.

If san antonio makes the finals i think they take home their 5th title, so heat fans better pray that OKC does win since it's a more favourable matchup.

[LWBMIA]

"OKC vs Spurs is the REAL FINALS"

"Wade isn't as good and healthy as he was in 2011"

"Heat's bench is below average.Nobody can score like Harden"

"OKC is quicker and more athletic than Miami.They're gonna make them look old"

"OKC looks more impressive.They defeated the defending champs and backdoor swept the Spurs while the Heat barely beat the Pacers and old Celtics"

"Are the Heat underdogs?"

"OKC should be the favorites.They don't play in the Leastern conference and didn't take them 7 games to make it out of the Wild Wild West "


Same old sh*t.Just a different day.

Heat > > > OKC

Heat match up with OKC better than anyone in the entire league.They're 2-8 against Miami in the last 10 and some of them games weren't as close as the final score suggest.

OKC has one victory against Miami since game 1 of the 2012 finals and that's when they made a franchise record amount of three pointers while the Heat missed fifteen straight if I remember correctly.

Heat also had 20+ turnovers that game.

Other than that Heat generally embarrass OKC.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

thunder are stacked as shqt.
their back up Pg is an athletic freak and better than Miamis starting PG. ibaka is an epic defender and perkins and adams block a ton of shots.
not to speak of the second best player in the world and another top 5 player AND the refs in their pockets.
the nba tried to rig last years finals for the spurs what will they do for okc then:biggums: :biggums:
cant wait:coleman:

[FPJ]

All 4 or 5 games will be hellish.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Good post OP. Kd and Russ have been the 2 best players in the playoffs so far, and along with Ibaka all 3 have majorly improved since 2012, not to mention they have a very solid supporting cast. In the 12' Finals, Games 2-4 all couldve went either way as they came to down to the last few plays, Miami didnt steamroll them like they did in Game 5. Combined with the fact that wade isnt what he was even 2 years ago, and that OKC would have HCA i think the thunder have a chance to win. Id still pick Miami but i see it atleast going to 6, especially when the thunder have that 2nd guy who can win a game by himself. Now i know OKC doesnt necessarily exploit the weaknesses of Miami like people have already stated, but i dont think this heat team is what it was 2 years ago and have only looked good going against 2 average teams so far.

If san antonio makes the finals i think they take home their 5th title, so heat fans better pray that OKC does win since it's a more favourable matchup.
lebron was better than kd in the playoffs:biggums: :biggums:

[ArbitraryWater]

Thunder are worse, Heat clicking and playing to their strength will basically be 2012 Final's version... Heat in 5.

[ArbitraryWater]

Good post OP. Kd and Russ have been the 2 best players in the playoffs so far, and along with Ibaka all 3 have majorly improved since 2012, not to mention they have a very solid supporting cast. In the 12' Finals, Games 2-4 all couldve went either way as they came to down to the last few plays, Miami didnt steamroll them like they did in Game 5. Combined with the fact that wade isnt what he was even 2 years ago, and that OKC would have HCA i think the thunder have a chance to win. Id still pick Miami but i see it atleast going to 6, especially when the thunder have that 2nd guy who can win a game by himself. Now i know OKC doesnt necessarily exploit the weaknesses of Miami like people have already stated, but i dont think this heat team is what it was 2 years ago and have only looked good going against 2 average teams so far.

If san antonio makes the finals i think they take home their 5th title, so heat fans better pray that OKC does win since it's a more favourable matchup.


:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

Where does this come from, KD and Russ the Playoff's 2 Best Players????

Are we forgetting Westbrook shot like 35% against the Grizzlies, Durant 40%, and both only to be bailed by the refs?

Since when do they top LeBron?

[BarberSchool]

Okc is literally custom made for the style in which Miami CAN beat.

They're PRIMARILY a perimeter team guys. I guarantee you that if they meet you WILL see the same outcome.Exact same thing was said by ALL THE ESPN EXPERTS about the 2011 Dallas Mavericks.

[red1]

Thunder have the talent to win it all but I wouldnt take them in a series over miami. Poorly coached perimeter team vs lockdown perimeter defense. Just not a good matchup.

[Trollsmasher]

Slaughtering of pigs

[Springsteen]

Then why are the clippers in the 2nd rd of the playoffs?

because they were playing a team that plays even less defense and was missing their best defender in the 1st round

[Ken_Masters]

You have to beat Miami with coaching not skill. It's no surprise the only teams to beat them, and come within 35 seconds of doing so were coached by Carlisle and Pop. I think Miami will exploit their weaknesses again. Even though Durant has improved, i still don't like this matchup for OKC. They have to hope that Indiana can take Miami out first.

[ArbitraryWater]

ISH is going to be wild if these two teams meet. :oldlol:

I honestly can't wait. :oldlol:

True... I never really liked to play OKC as they're bit boring IMO + Refs, but even though I thought I may prefer OKC over Spurs as they're easier, OP is right.... And ISH would be going crazy nuts every game :lol

[Mr. Incredible]

It really wouldn't be that close. Heat in 5 or 6.

[mehyaM24]

op is a fraud

thunder stand no chance against miami,any REAL hoop head will tell you that

[NumberSix]

The refs will be putting in WORK for the thunders.

[IamRAMBO24]

The Thunder are hungrier than the entire Heat organization. I'm not just talking about the players and the coaches. They want this more than Miami does and that is why they should be scared.

Miami can brush them off and dig in the past to prove they're not a threat, but that is all on paper. It's different on the court. The team that wants it more usually wins. Even scrub teams can beat good teams if they play hard enough. I just don't see the same fire in Lebron's eyes this season, but Westbrook (and to a lesser extent Durant) has the same passion for winning as a pre-champion Lebron.