Dave Cowens won 1973 MVP on 48% TS

[Rocketswin2013]

Stat line:



Season ▾ Age Tm Lg Pos G GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS

1972-73 ★ 24 BOS NBA C 82 41.8 9.0 20.0 .452 9.0 20.0 .452 2.5 3.2 .779 16.2 4.1 3.8 20.5


18.1 PER.....

The early 70's has to be, by far the weakest era in the history of professional basketball.

Put LeBron in this era....How many MVP's?

[Kiddlovesnets]

Well the 70s were clearly weaker than both 60s and 80s, probably only slightly better than the 50s when only white players were in NBA. Still, the ABA stole many top basketball players from NBA atm, the two leagues were competing and in later years ABA was actually better than NBA. It's just like if NFL and AFL were not in the same league but were competing against each other, the quality of NFL will be way worse.

[LAZERUSS]

Stat line:



Season ▾ Age Tm Lg Pos G GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS

1972-73 ★ 24 BOS NBA C 82 41.8 9.0 20.0 .452 9.0 20.0 .452 2.5 3.2 .779 16.2 4.1 3.8 20.5


18.1 PER.....

The early 70's has to be, by far the weakest era in the history of professional basketball.

Put LeBron in this era....How many MVP's?

Can you post Russell's while you are at?

BTW, Cowens beat out KAREEM and his 28.5 PER in that season, as well.

And then badly outplayed him in a blowout win on Kareem's home floor in game seven of the '74 Finals. Kareem never recovered.

[ArbitraryWater]

Yeah, total travesty that Cowens won it... joke tbh.

That was Kareem's Award all the way.

[Fudge]

OP's a lowkey LeBron stan and he always tries to deflect it. :oldlol: Stop. You're making us actual Heat fans look bad.

[LAZERUSS]

Yeah, total travesty that Cowens won it... joke tbh.

That was Kareem's Award all the way.

Not true at all, but in any case, Kareem STOLE McAdoo's MVP in '76.

[Rocketswin2013]

OP's a lowkey LeBron stan and he always tries to deflect it. :oldlol: Stop. You're making us actual Heat fans look bad.
Nah more of a Rockets fan...Part time Dwight fan....Would have asked how many Dwight would win but people hate him. :confusedshrug:

[Rocketswin2013]

Not true at all, but in any case, Kareem STOLE McAdoo's MVP in '76.
And Moses stole all his MVP's from Kareem. But stop deflecting. Cowens was trash and Wilt snaged just ONE ring out of the weakest era ever....


:roll:

Dwight > Cowens... Kareem> Wilt

[Fudge]

Nah more of a Rockets fan...Part time Dwight fan....Would have asked how many Dwight would win but people hate him. :confusedshrug:
And people don't hate LeBron on here? :confusedshrug:

[SexSymbol]

Remember, stats don't matter.

[LAZERUSS]

And Moses stole all his MVP's from Kareem. But stop deflecting. Cowens was trash and Wilt snaged just ONE ring out of the weakest era ever....


:roll:

Dwight > Cowens... Kareem> Wilt

Moses DOMINATED Kareem. If anything, Kareem STOLE Moses' in '80.

Moses OWNED Kareem in their 40 career H2H's, including trashing him their seven post-season games (and going 6-1 in them, even winning with a 40-42 team behind him)

GTFO...

[Rocketswin2013]

Remember, stats don't matter.
Production does matter.

[ArbitraryWater]

Not true at all, but in any case, Kareem STOLE McAdoo's MVP in '76.

You're one big ****in' joke... Kareem outside of 1975 and 1979 should have won all 8 others, that's a fact. And he was also the 1980 FMVP...

Oh, and also, Kareem >>> Wilt. Your essay writing will be useless, and FORGOTTEN... sadly you won't do it forever, can't. But Wilt will forever be placed below mister 6 Rings, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

[dankok8]

Kareem had the better statistical year but Cowens winning the MVP in '73 is not a travesty. Dave played superb defense that year, was the best outlet passer and playmaker from the post, and elevated his game against the top competition. For example he averaged 31.8 ppg and 19.8 rpg in 4 games against Wilt Chamberlain. And his team won 68 games. If it wasn't for Hondo's crippling injury in the playoffs they would have almost certainly won a dominating title.

If anything I may have chosen Havlicek over him but it's very close.

[Rocketswin2013]

Kareem had the better statistical year but Cowens winning the MVP in '73 is not a travesty. Dave played superb defense that year, was the best outlet passer and playmaker from the post, and elevated his game against the top competition. For example he averaged 31.8 ppg and 19.8 rpg in 4 games against Wilt Chamberlain. And his team won 68 games. If it wasn't for Hondo's crippling injury in the playoffs they would have almost certainly won a dominating title.

If anything I may have chosen Havlicek over him but it's very close.
Sounds like choosing Bill Russell over Wilt.

[SexSymbol]

Production does matter.
Production in context matters
Like if a player averages 40 % FG against the best defense of all time, and another player averages 50 % FG against nash's run'n'gun suns, it's basically the same thing

[houston]

mvp is a impact award anyways

[CavaliersFTW]

Do you think Steve Nash's MVP's were any more deserving? Serious question.

[Kblaze8855]

Cowens was trash

So trash he puts up 28/14/9 vs Kareem closing out the finals...

If you watched him play so much as a game you would see he was a great player. Eve nwashed up 2-3 years retired Dave came back on the Bucks and was having good games vs guys who were starting in the 90s.

He had handles, heart, rebounding, passing, a jumper, and he was a lot more athletic than people seem to be aware of. Ive seen Dave Cowens go coast to coast and hit floaters in traffic. Added to that he was one of the best defensive bigmen ever...could guard everyone on the floor....




Hes out there at 6'9'' switching onto the greatest guard of all time to that point....1 minute left...tie game...NBA finals...



http://redsarmy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/1a.gif


24 second violation. Celtics ball. And thats after he had tied it with a long jumper. And it was actually one of his worst games. But he wasnt the type to just not make an impact.

Dave cowens deserves more respect than a bunch of people who dont know shit about him making noise on the internet.

Talking about his ****ing PER while the players hes playing against every night voted him the MVP over people putting up historic numbers. I suspect they had a better idea of what he meant than you do. Or me. But at least I attempt to look into it....

[LAZERUSS]

Dwight Howard in the early 70's...

An average center, and playing on losing teams.

Here were the list of centers in the early 70's, that were CLEARLY better than Howard.

Elvin Hayes (much better scorer), Wes Unseld (look up his resume and compare it to Dwight's), Willis Reed (ok, he was nearing the end, but he still managed to win two FMVPs, albeit, one was not deserved), Bob Lanier (I'll give Dwight a SLIGHT edge in defense and possibly rebounding, but Lanier a commanding edge in offense), Dave Cowens (yes, we already shattered any comparison to Dwight from early on), Artis Gilmore (better at everything in the early 70's than Dwight), Nate Thurmond, (who would have held Dwight scoreless)McAdoo, (LOL at dwight trying to guard this guy), Kareem (even the OP says as much...and yes, it was an OVERWHELMING edge), and of course, Wilt, who was the best rebounder and defender of that era, and by far the most efficient.

Go back a couple of years, and Russell was better, as well. And go back to the early to mid-60's, and Bellamy would have been lighting Dwight up for 30+ every night, too.

So, in the early 70's...Dwight would have been about the TENTH best center, and probably only marginally better than Lucas (who would have been scoring 20 ppg against Dwight just from 20-25 ft alone.) Hell, players like the 7-0 270 lb Boerwinkle would have given Dwight some tough nights, too.

BTW, out of that list, Dwight would have only been taller than Unseld, slightly taller the Cowens and Reed (and Lucas), the same height as Hayes and McAdoo, and shorter than Lanier, Thurmond, Wilt, Gilmore, and Kareem.

There you have it... Dwight (I am only average in the 70's NBA") Howard.

[Rocketswin2013]

Dwight Howard in the early 70's...

An average center
You're too old to be trolling like this tbh.

[LAZERUSS]

You're too old to be trolling like this tbh.

And you are too ignorant to be posting here,..tbh.

[Pushxx]

Hondo and Cowens are two of the most underrated basketball players...hustle, IQ, skill, teamwork.

Those guys defined what it means to be a Celtic.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Despite the obvious agenda here (LeBron ******ging), Cowens was indeed a joke MVP.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Do you think Steve Nash's MVP's were any more deserving? Serious question.

Are you serious? Nash's shooting and assist numbers were stellar during his MVP seasons, and he was arguably even better in 2007.

[SHAQisGOAT]

This ignorant child with yet again another dumb thread :facepalm Dude should be prohibited from talking basketball and its history.
Yea keep mentioning PER and TS% like the end to it all, and as if stuff like that actually makes you know more or the same as people who were actually playing/watching the games :facepalm Keep underrating players/eras like that when you don't even know what you're talking about :rolleyes:


So trash he puts up 28/14/9 vs Kareem closing out the finals...

If you watched him play so much as a game you would see he was a great player. Eve nwashed up 2-3 years retired Dave came back on the Bucks and was having good games vs guys who were starting in the 90s.

He had handles, heart, rebounding, passing, a jumper, and he was a lot more athletic than people seem to be aware of. Ive seen Dave Cowens go coast to coast and hit floaters in traffic. Added to that he was one of the best defensive bigmen ever...could guard everyone on the floor....




Hes out there at 6'9'' switching onto the greatest guard of all time to that point....1 minute left...tie game...NBA finals...



http://redsarmy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/1a.gif


24 second violation. Celtics ball. And thats after he had tied it with a long jumper. And it was actually one of his worst games. But he wasnt the type to just not make an impact.

Dave cowens deserves more respect than a bunch of people who dont know shit about him making noise on the internet.

Talking about his ****ing PER while the players hes playing against every night voted him the MVP over people putting up historic numbers. I suspect they had a better idea of what he meant than you do. Or me. But at least I attempt to look into it....


/thread

[Smoke117]

Dave Cowens was one of the best defensive and rebounding players during the 70s era. So he wasn't a good scorer and that makes him a bad player? Dave Cowens was the Dennis Rodman before Dennis Rodman and the original better version and everyone sucks his ****? So why aren't you all sucking Dave's ****?

[Droid101]

Uh... unless I'm reading it wrong that says he shot 20% on 2 pointers. Cannot possibly be accurate.

[Natureland]

Uh... unless I'm reading it wrong that says he shot 20% on 2 pointers. Cannot possibly be accurate.
The numbers are off by a row it seems. the 41.8 is his minutes played, the 9.0 is his FGM average and the 20 is his FGA average.

[ImKobe]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2005_finals.html

47%TS for a Finals MVP :facepalm

[Dr.J4ever]

Well the 70s were clearly weaker than both 60s and 80s, probably only slightly better than the 50s when only white players were in NBA. Still, the ABA stole many top basketball players from NBA atm, the two leagues were competing and in later years ABA was actually better than NBA. It's just like if NFL and AFL were not in the same league but were competing against each other, the quality of NFL will be way worse.

So true. What others have said is that by the time the 2 leagues merged, there was rough parity between the 2 leagues. Had the ABA champ and NBA champ battled in a sort of Superbowl sometime in the last 3 years before the merger, the ABA could have won AFL style.

In the last year before the merger, a case could be made that Doc's Nets would have beaten a mediocre Boston team that played a mediocre Phoenix team in the NBA Finals. Doc's Nets defeated the Denver Nuggets in 6 games games in the last ABA Final. This is the same Denver team that almost had the best record in the newly merged NBA. The same Denver team that lost in 6 games to the Portland Trailblazers in the first season of the newly merged NBA.

[reppy]

Dave cowens deserves more respect than a bunch of people who dont know shit about him making noise on the internet.

Talking about his ****ing PER while the players hes playing against every night voted him the MVP over people putting up historic numbers. I suspect they had a better idea of what he meant than you do. Or me. But at least I attempt to look into it....

Do you ever wonder what the sports world would be like if you could not use statistics to make an argument? I've thought about trying it with a few friends when we do our irregular sports podcast for friends. It would be one hell of an interesting debate.

You'd have to actually have watched the game and know the key moments that defined the game. A novel concept.

[Legends66NBA7]

Celtics went 68-13 that year, 2nd best record of all-time at that point. Biggest driving force behind that MVP. Cowens was also the anchor for the best defense in the league that year too.

[BoutPractice]

From the games I've watched Cowens seems like he's one of the most underrated players in league history. They hardly ever talk about him but he was brilliant all-around. It's not like he's a fluke MVP either, he was arguably the best player on 2 championship teams. The 1974 team had Havlicek, but Cowens averaged 20, 14 and 4 in the playoffs... 23, 10 and 4.5 against prime Kareem, including 28 and 14 in the title clinching game (Kareem had 26 and 13). In 1976 it seems like Cowens pretty much got robbed of FMVP... Jo Jo White averaged 22, 4 and 6, but Cowens had 20, 16 and 3.5 a game on 54% shooting, and put up 21 in the clinching game while Jo Jo White only had 15. (Adding to it the fact that Cowens was the team's leader and heart and soul) You can see some of those Finals games on YouTube too, he's all over the place.

[Pushxx]

You can see some of those Finals games on YouTube too, he's all over the place.

That's what people don't realize about Cowens: he was literally all over the court all the time.

He knew where to be and had the energy and hustle to always get there.

[LAZERUSS]

That's what people don't realize about Cowens: he was literally all over the court all the time.

He knew where to be and had the energy and hustle to always get there.

I mentioned it earlier, but Cowens would have run Howard ragged for three quarters, and then just stomped on his ass in the 4th. Of course, Howard would be resting due to fatigue and foul trouble for entire halves of games against him, as well.

[La Frescobaldi]

Despite the obvious agenda here (LeBron ******ging), Cowens was indeed a joke MVP.

nah the agenda of this thread is not that one, although at first it would make sense, and you are probably making a real good guess, without the knowledge of another thread.

This thread is because I flat told the op that Cowens was better than D12 in another thread. Which of course, is true; but it's no surprise OP knows nothing of Cowens.....
after all, he doesn't know anything whatever about Havlicek, White, Silas, Reed, Frazier, Issel, West, Robertson, Unseld, Jabbar, Rule,
Marques Sweet J, Boerwinkel, Thurmond, Van Lier, Big E Hayes, Lanier, Van Arsdale, Goodrich, DeBusschere, Barry, Haywood, Walton, King, Sikma,
Parrish, Erving, Bird, Mo Malone, McHale, Barkley, Jones, Ainge, Johnson, Johnson, Thomas, Worthy, Dumars, Pippen, Jordan, Grant, Rodman, Payton, Stockton, Malone, Iverson, Billups, O'Neal, Bryant, Rice, Fisher, Miller, Kidd, Love, Nowitzki, Duncan, Ginobili, Parker, Nash, Anthony, Durant, Westbrook, Wade, Leonard, Parsons, Paul, Griffin, Bosh, Hibbert, George, Irving, Wall, Aldridge, or Lillard... either.

All nobodies anyhow right?
So how in the world is op gonna know about a guy who retired before op's great-great-great-great-great- great-grandfather was born?
fleas gonna flea.

[Rocketswin2013]

nah the agenda of this thread is not that one, although at first it would make sense, and you are probably making a real good guess, without the knowledge of another thread.

This thread is because I flat told the op that Cowens was better than D12 in another thread. Which of course, is true; but it's no surprise OP knows nothing of Cowens.....
after all, he doesn't know anything whatever about Havlicek, White, Silas, Reed, Frazier, Issel, West, Robertson, Unseld, Jabbar, Rule,
Marques Sweet J, Boerwinkel, Thurmond, Van Lier, Big E Hayes, Lanier, Van Arsdale, Goodrich, DeBusschere, Barry, Haywood, Walton, King, Sikma,
Parrish, Erving, Bird, Mo Malone, McHale, Barkley, Jones, Ainge, Johnson, Johnson, Thomas, Worthy, Dumars, Pippen, Jordan, Grant, Rodman, Payton, Stockton, Malone, Iverson, Billups, O'Neal, Bryant, Rice, Fisher, Miller, Kidd, Love, Nowitzki, Duncan, Ginobili, Parker, Nash, Anthony, Durant, Westbrook, Wade, Leonard, Parsons, Paul, Griffin, Bosh, Hibbert, George, Irving, Wall, Aldridge, or Lillard... either.

All nobodies anyhow right?
So how in the world is op gonna know about a guy who retired before op's great-great-great-great-great- great-grandfather was born?
fleas gonna flea.
Shut the **** up you condescending piece of shit. As an individual talent he was not on the tier of Howard and I'm petty sure he wasn't the defender either. ****ing old ******s always talk like entitled bitches who think because they have erectile disfuction they automatically know more about the game.


I'm not denying he was important to his team but as an individual talent you're gonna sit here and say some glorified hustle player was better than a man who was a one man wrecking crew and carried defensive blackholes to deep playoff runs and formed an elite defene with them?


Kill yourself. Please, do it.

[Rocketswin2013]

Bump for the old worthless piece of shit so he can see these with his shitty vision when he gets on his windows 97.

[cltcfn2924]

Shut the **** up you condescending piece of shit. As an individual talent he was not on the tier of Howard and I'm petty sure he wasn't the defender either. ****ing old ******s always talk like entitled bitches who think because they have erectile disfuction they automatically know more about the game.


I'm not denying he was important to his team but as an individual talent you're gonna sit here and say some glorified hustle player was better than a man who was a one man wrecking crew and carried defensive blackholes to deep playoff runs and formed an elite defene with them?


Kill yourself. Please, do it.

Talk about rings before you talk your s^&t. Cowens would destroy Howard.

[Pushxx]

Cowens would run circles around Howard. Cowens was strong and agile. He wouldn't have a problem defending Howard's running hook that would be called a travel anyway.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Shut the **** up you condescending piece of shit. As an individual talent he was not on the tier of Howard and I'm petty sure he wasn't the defender either. ****ing old ******s always talk like entitled bitches who think because they have erectile disfuction they automatically know more about the game.


I'm not denying he was important to his team but as an individual talent you're gonna sit here and say some glorified hustle player was better than a man who was a one man wrecking crew and carried defensive blackholes to deep playoff runs and formed an elite defene with them?


Kill yourself. Please, do it.

Glorified hustle-player? :oldlol: You don't even know what you're saying, prime Dave Cowens was simply a great center.. Nice post-game with a sweet hook, really good to stretch the floor as he was taking/making lots of outside jumpers, a great rebounder, one of the best passers ever at the 5, pretty athletic and mobile, great defensive player, could fit into any team, lots of impact bothways, was just everywhere all the time, hustled all-out and was clutch, oh and he could actually shoot over 75% from the FT line, something that Dwight can't even dream of doing... So please just stop with your ignorant ass posts and threads, ****in dumb children giving opinions when don't even know what they're talking about :rolleyes: :facepalm :lol As far as primes/peaks, you gotta pick Cowens over Dwight, if you want to get it done, he was playing against and/or outplaying centers that absolutely shit on Dwight, as an overall player lmfao. You're the one who should kill yourself, as you never offer anything substantial, at all.

[Psileas]

LMAO at considering Cowens below Howard as an individual offensive talent. Comparing a player with an actual offensive arsenal who could score 30 on much bigger C's like Wilt or Kareem when he had to with a PED abuser who offensively becomes the butt of jokes when he faces some centers that he can't beat based on his size and strength alone (Shaq, Yao).