Cuban apologizes, but stands by his words.

[funnystuff]

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nba/story/_/id/10971451/mark-cuban-dallas-mavericks-apologizes-trayvon-martin-family-defends-words&ex_cid=sportscenter


Waiting for an apology to the random bald white kid with tattoos? :confusedshrug:



America is pu$$ified.

[nightprowler10]

Well, no bald white guys with tattoos have recently been murdered in a controversial case that riled up the nation... you ****ing fggt.

[funnystuff]

Well, no bald white guys with tattoos have recently been murdered in a controversial case that riled up the nation... you ****ing fggt.
I wasn't aware that Trayvon patented the hoodie look?

Mark didn't even mention his name.

[Bobcats2013]

Well, no bald white guys with tattoos have recently been murdered in a controversial case that riled up the nation... you ****ing fggt.

The only reason it was controversial is because Zimmerman looks white, and Trayvon is black. No one bats an eye when a black guy kills a white guy.

[nightprowler10]

I don't give a **** what was right or wrong. I'm saying it was a stupid mistake by Cuban to use that specific verbiage. I actually completely agree with what he said, but using that verbiage makes a connection in people's minds you don't want people to make. Someone like Cuban should know better and should choose his words carefully when talking about a volatile topic like that.

And again, after listening to what he originally said I totally agree with him and laud him for having the balls to talk about it, but at the same I think it's stupid to thoughtfully give a statement like that and not thinking about the impact of the examples you use.

Cuban realized that and apologized for that oversight.

[sbw19]

http://abload.de/img/screenshot2014-05-23adiksy.png


This just in. Might not be an ugly fight after all.

[phelix2000]

All the black people getting upset about what Cuban said are only driving more racist thoughts. What he said wasn't wrong or racist, he was stating what he felt and what we stereotype as a perceived threat. I'm honestly tired of every black man calling Cuban a racist and they second someone disagrees with the Trayvon Martin case if they are WHITE they are deemed a racist. Let me spit some facts for you African Americans and maybe instead of calling everyone racist you can begin reflecting on these facts and maybe understand why at times people perceive certain black people in a threatening outfit as harmful. \

1. Among African Americans, the numbers are even more horrifying. According to the NAACP, one in three black males born in the United States today is likely to spendtime in prison at some point in his life. That's compared with one in six Hispanic males or one in 25 white males. African Americans are clearly committing A LOT more crimes (im sure people will say the system is racist, SURPRISE).

2. 2011 US Crime Statistics by Race (from the FBI)

Arrests by crime and race

Crime White Black Indian/Eskimo Pacific Isl.

Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter 4,000 4,149 105 87

By percentage 48.0% 49.7% 1.3% 1.0%

Keep in mind the black population is about 1/4th of the white population. So Blacks are committing slightly more murders and are only 25% as large as the white population.

Shut up with the racist shit. It's annoying, go educate yourself.

[Myth]

I don't give a **** what was right or wrong. I'm saying it was a stupid mistake by Cuban to use that specific verbiage. I actually completely agree with what he said, but using that verbiage makes a connection in people's minds you don't want people to make. Someone like Cuban should know better and should choose his words carefully when talking about a volatile topic like that.

And again, after listening to what he originally said I totally agree with him and laud him for having the balls to talk about it, but at the same I think it's stupid to thoughtfully give a statement like that and not thinking about the impact of the examples you use.

Cuban realized that and apologized for that oversight.

Agreed. All he obviously meant was that if he sees somebody that appears sketchy, he avoids them. He would have been wise to just say that rather than site specific examples.

[Sarcastic]

Cuban wasn't saying anything that any of us don't know. He might as well of told us that the sky is blue, and water is wet. But what he was actually doing was trying to provide a cover or an excuse for Sterling, and it was completely unnecessary. His boy is getting kicked from the league, and he needs to accept it.


And yes, it can happen to him one day as well. Owning the Mavericks is a privilege, not a right. If the NBA determined that he was causing harm to the brand overall to lose money directly because of him, they will have the right to remove him as well. It's all there in his franchise ownership contract.

[Trollsmasher]

To whom is he apologizing?:biggums:

[bagelred]

All the black people getting upset about what Cuban said are only driving more racist thoughts. What he said wasn't wrong or racist, he was stating what he felt and what we stereotype as a perceived threat. I'm honestly tired of every black man calling Cuban a racist and they second someone disagrees with the Trayvon Martin case if they are WHITE they are deemed a racist. Let me spit some facts for you African Americans and maybe instead of calling everyone racist you can begin reflecting on these facts and maybe understand why at times people perceive certain black people in a threatening outfit as harmful. \

1. Among African Americans, the numbers are even more horrifying. According to the NAACP, one in three black males born in the United States today is likely to spendtime in prison at some point in his life. That's compared with one in six Hispanic males or one in 25 white males. African Americans are clearly committing A LOT more crimes (im sure people will say the system is racist, SURPRISE).

2. 2011 US Crime Statistics by Race (from the FBI)

Arrests by crime and race

Crime White Black Indian/Eskimo Pacific Isl.

Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter 4,000 4,149 105 87

By percentage 48.0% 49.7% 1.3% 1.0%

Keep in mind the black population is about 1/4th of the white population. So Blacks are committing slightly more murders and are only 25% as large as the white population.

Shut up with the racist shit. It's annoying, go educate yourself.

You are an obvious racist! BAN HIM! WE WILL NOT TOLERATE INTOLERANCE!!! BAN HIM!!! NOW!!!

[The Iron Sheik]

:oldlol: predictable

[MavsSuperFan]

Agreed. All he obviously meant was that if he sees somebody that appears sketchy, he avoids them. He would have been wise to just say that rather than site specific examples.
i this point, but the hoodie worn by a young black male is associated with crime in the same way that a shaved white head by a white male is associated with white supremacy.

If you are a white male and you choose to shave your head, imo you are sending a message. Maybe its unintentional but imo the msg is sent.

The stereotype of young black males committing crimes while wearing hoodies exists. It was popularized by a bunch of films in the early 90s that glorified life in the inner cities.

Its unfair that black males send a message while wearing a hoodie, the same way its unfair that a shaved white head sends a message.

google image search neo nazi, most of them wouldn't have visible tattoos. they do however have shaved white heads.

[MavsSuperFan]

To whom is he apologizing?:biggums:
to trayvon's family from what i remember

[Trollsmasher]

to trayvon's family from what i remember
who's that guy?

[tmacattack33]

I have slowly become a huge Mark Cuban fan.

He is using his position as an NBA owner to become somewhat of a voice of reason for the country as a whole.

Not saying he's a genius (he probably is though to get where he is), but he's just very logical and honest. And nobody else famous is.

[WolfGang]

l the black people getting upset about what Cuban said are only driving more racist thoughts. What he said wasn't wrong or racist, he was stating what he felt and what we stereotype as a perceived threat. I'm honestly tired of every black man calling Cuban a racist and they second someone disagrees with the Trayvon Martin case if they are WHITE they are deemed a racist. Let me spit some facts for you African Americans and maybe instead of calling everyone racist you can begin reflecting on these facts and maybe understand why at times people perceive certain black people in a threatening outfit as harmful. \

1. Among African Americans, the numbers are even more horrifying. According to the NAACP, one in three black males born in the United States today is likely to spendtime in prison at some point in his life. That's compared with one in six Hispanic males or one in 25 white males. African Americans are clearly committing A LOT more crimes (im sure people will say the system is racist, SURPRISE).

2. 2011 US Crime Statistics by Race (from the FBI)

Arrests by crime and race

Crime White Black Indian/Eskimo Pacific Isl.

Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter 4,000 4,149 105 87

By percentage 48.0% 49.7% 1.3% 1.0%

Keep in mind the black population is about 1/4th of the white population. So Blacks are committing slightly more murders and are only 25% as large as the white population.

Shut up with the racist shit. It's annoying, go educate yourself.[/QUOTE]


You're completely missing the point. Cuban basically said that black people scare him. That if one of his black players walked passed him with a hoodie, he would be scared. Note that the example of the white man has to be much more extreme with the tats on his face. So white people in hoodies don't scare him. In order to keep his comment fair, both races should have had the same circumstance. Is he wrong for what he said? No. Is he racist? No. Was he stupid? Yes.

What you are saying is in fact 100 percent true, but completely off topic. You or Cuban have possibly never been mugged, touched or even live around black people. Most black violence is done against other blacks.

When someone is in a

[MavsSuperFan]

All the black people getting upset about what Cuban said are only driving more racist thoughts. What he said wasn't wrong or racist, he was stating what he felt and what we stereotype as a perceived threat. I'm honestly tired of every black man calling Cuban a racist and they second someone disagrees with the Trayvon Martin case if they are WHITE they are deemed a racist. Let me spit some facts for you African Americans and maybe instead of calling everyone racist you can begin reflecting on these facts and maybe understand why at times people perceive certain black people in a threatening outfit as harmful. \

1. Among African Americans, the numbers are even more horrifying. According to the NAACP, one in three black males born in the United States today is likely to spendtime in prison at some point in his life. That's compared with one in six Hispanic males or one in 25 white males. African Americans are clearly committing A LOT more crimes (im sure people will say the system is racist, SURPRISE).

2. 2011 US Crime Statistics by Race (from the FBI)

Arrests by crime and race

Crime White Black Indian/Eskimo Pacific Isl.

Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter 4,000 4,149 105 87

By percentage 48.0% 49.7% 1.3% 1.0%

Keep in mind the black population is about 1/4th of the white population. So Blacks are committing slightly more murders and are only 25% as large as the white population.

Shut up with the racist shit. It's annoying, go educate yourself.


Also blacks commit robberies/break ins/muggings/rapes against whites at much higher rates than whites commit these crimes against blacks.

Yes it is true that intra-racial crime is far more common than interracial crime. Eg. Blacks are more likely to commit crimes against other blacks than on whites, and whites are more likely to commit crimes on other whites than on blacks.

But in america blacks commit crimes upon whites at great rates than whites do on blacks.

Personally I as a liberal I think there are many socio-economic reasons for this and I don't for 1 second subscribe to the notion that blacks are in anyway inherently more inclined to crime. I am of the opinion that any race that was put in the same socio-economic position as black people would have similar crime statistics.
Eg. Many black people from africa come to america and get advanced degrees and are among the highest educated people in this country.

I just get annoyed whenever anyone ignores statistics. IMO the high crime rates are explained by socio-economic factors (its harder for black people to get jobs and they are usually poorer) and culture (rap music and many movies like strapped, boy z in the hood, some what glorify crime imo)

[MavsSuperFan]

You're completely missing the point. Cuban basically said that black people scare him. That if one of his black players walked passed him with a hoodie, he would be scared. Note that the example of the white man has to be much more extreme with the tats on his face. So white people in hoodies don't scare him. In order to keep his comment fair, both races should have had the same circumstance. Is he wrong for what he said? No. Is he racist? No. Was he stupid? Yes.
Cuban said a black kid in a hoodie scares him. not a black kid there is a big difference.
there is no reason black males have to wear hoodies. its not even a religions requirement

the stereotype exists of black kids wearing hoodies to commit crimes. this stereotype has been popularized by movies in the early 90s.

Hoodies block the face and make it harder to identify people.


So white people in hoodies don't scare him.
of course not, thats not the stereotype.
If you saw a single balding white dude on the playground, watch other kids wouldn't you be more suspicious of him than a black dude doing the same thing?

In order to keep his comment fair, both races should have had the same circumstance. Is he wrong for what he said? No. Is he racist? No. Was he stupid? Yes.

here is a question. Do you see the difference between a shaved black head and a shaved white head?

be honest if you saw a black male with a shaved head you wouldnt think twice. If you saw a white male with a shaved head, you would atleast wonder if he was a white supremacist

google image search neo nazi. the vast majority of them have shaved white heads, but no visible tattoos. a shaved white head is associated with white supremacy.

[aboss4real24]

We need more black owners

[Verticality]

If you saw a single balding white dude on the playground, watch other kids wouldn't you be more suspicious of him than a black dude doing the same thing?


I'd be suspicious of the black dude, because there are no black kids at my playground. :coleman:

[SilkkTheShocker]

People still butthurt over Tyrone Martin's death.

[Soundwave]

I get what Cuban was trying to do, but I still wonder why he's needlessly throwing himself into this debate.

Is he worried that there's a tape of him out there?

[Xsatyr]

I'd be suspicious of the black dude, because there are no black kids at my playground. :coleman:

Sounds like you have a nice playground.

I keed I keed

[dude77]

We need more black owners

we need more nonblack players

[navy]

we need more nonblack players
Dats racist. We need an all black league and all white league.

[Teanett]

why does everybody gets so worked up about the trayvon reference?

isnt it the perfect example because it DID HAPPEN?

it's like jewish people getting upset over using the holocaust as an example of genocide?
it happened; dont ignore it, learn from it!

:confusedshrug:

[nightprowler10]

why does everybody gets so worked up about the trayvon reference?

isnt it the perfect example because it DID HAPPEN?

it's like jewish people getting upset over using the holocaust as an example of genocide?
it happened; dont ignore it, learn from it!

:confusedshrug:
I get what you're saying and maybe even agree with you, and perhaps that's what Cuban had in mind as well. But I think the wound is too fresh right now for many people. I think the example would work better a couple years from now.

[Teanett]

I get what you're saying and maybe even agree with you, and perhaps that's what Cuban had in mind as well. But I think the wound is too fresh right now for many people. I think the example would work better a couple years from now.

fresh wound or not.
let's say you wouldnt be allowed to mention fukushima in a discussion about the safety of nuclear power plants because tens of thousands of people lost their lives.

when are we allowed to reference it again? is there a set period of mourning for each person who passed away unjust?

it's absurd.

[SCdac]

If I were a GM or owner in the league right now, for the sake of living comfortably I'd refuse all interview questions about the subject. don't have to stick up for yourself or anybody, don't have to jump in on any verbal mobbing. Just make your vote and that's it. Cuban is vocal though. that's who he is, can respect that. What he was saying can easily be taken out of context, but again makes me think why talk?

[nightprowler10]

fresh wound or not.
let's say you wouldnt be allowed to mention fukushima in a discussion about the safety of nuclear power plants because tens of thousands of people lost their lives.

when are we allowed to reference it again? is there a set period of mourning for each person who passed away unjust?

it's absurd.
Fukushima didn't divide a nation and continues to do so. Surely you know the difference.

[ZenMaster]

Fukushima didn't divide a nation and continues to do so. Surely you know the difference.

The Martin case didn't divide a nation, it was already divided. It's just that people don't want to talk about it, sort of like you're doing now.

keep saying "it's too sensitive" and it wont ever get fixed, but that's political correctness for you.

[Teanett]

Fukushima didn't divide a nation and continues to do so. Surely you know the difference.

what do you mean it didnt?
there's the nuclear power industry/ business/ goverment vs the people who they lead on to believe its technology was safe.
:confusedshrug:

[Teanett]

The Martin case didn't divide a nation, it was already divided. It's just that people don't want to talk about it, sort of like you're doing now.

keep saying "it's too sensitive" and it wont ever get fixed, but that's political correctness for you.

i agree.

[nightprowler10]

The Martin case didn't divide a nation, it was already divided. It's just that people don't want to talk about it, sort of like you're doing now.

keep saying "it's too sensitive" and it wont ever get fixed, but that's political correctness for you.
I'm not doing anything. My point since the beginning of the thread has been that if you think your point has a lot of value for discussion on a national platform, I would think that the last thing you want to do is make connections in people's minds that aren't there which will divert the conversation. I, again, laud Cuban for saying what he said, but from what I can tell, no one is having the conversation he wanted to have and instead idiots are jumping on their chance to call him a racist.

I think my high number of posts in this thread are making me seem like I'm defending a position that I'm not.

[ZenMaster]

I'm not doing anything. My point since the beginning of the thread has been that if you think your point has a lot of value for discussion on a national platform, I would think that the last thing you want to do is make connections in people's minds that aren't there which will divert the conversation. I, again, laud Cuban for saying what he said, but from what I can tell, no one is having the conversation he wanted to have and instead idiots are jumping on their chance to call him a racist.

I think my high number of posts in this thread are making me seem like I'm defending a position that I'm not.

I think that by saying Cuban made a mistake using the example he did because it diverts away from his point because idiots run with it as racism, then you are in fact legitimizing the opinions of those idiots.

[GimmeThat]

I think he's stating his lack of trust in society in general, he's essentially saying that police aren't doing their jobs and people who may possibly be committing crime is running everywhere.

Which, that's like a problem on the streets.

Where as in other scenarios for the riches, it may be theft, fraud and other crime etc.

Is this right or wrong?

I think that each individual naturally reacts to danger by avoiding it. But it is different than the pro-active attempt to eliminate danger that has yet to be formed.

the public service world exists in the possibility of the wrongful conviction, wrongful death, wrongful anything. If that is the reality where one can not accept, their ideals might just be crushed.

bigotry involves the attempt of committing wrongdoing.
if we consider the results of a wrongdoing as bigotry, we ought to understand there are many more possibilities that results in wrongdoing, besides bigotry.

[mehyaM24]

cuban never should have apologized. admittedly he's kind of a d-bag, but he was brave enough to speak his mind.....and what he said wasn't the least bit offensive.

everyone needs to grow up and put on their big-boy and -girl pants.

[The_Night_Elf]

I'd be suspicious of the black dude, because there are no black kids at my playground. :coleman:

That is a brilliant response. LOL:applause:

[UK2K]

to trayvon's family from what i remember
They cashed im they dont care.

He was kicked out of his house when he was killed. I doubt theyre too upset.

[Pointguard]

The Sterling thing was about an owner saying things that were stupid insensitive and offensive. I don't understand Cuban jumping in, on the stage set up by Sterling, and upping him in the insensitivity department. Its something only a jerk does. He didn't have to say anything. He offered no light on the subject and offered something that a second grader would. It just came off as insensitive to a very recent incident.. No need to go for his head, tho.

[xoracle55]

I get what Cuban was trying to do, but I still wonder why he's needlessly throwing himself into this debate.

Is he worried that there's a tape of him out there?


Maybe :lol

You guys here are mostly ignorant, young clueless SOB's. History people, history! Nobody, no one here has the slightest sensitivity to the decades of oppression and unhuman treatment blacks or African Americans had to endure for centuries against the hands of of self-proclaim whiter so called superior race.

But I dont want to take you guys seriosuly.:D You are all nothing but basketball geeks and junkies.

I look at it this way. If you're white, there is no way you can speak about b racism and come out with a favorable argument. Just look at Stepehn Smith when he talks about race or racism on TV, you see Skip Bayless jsut nodding his head in agreement. He doesnt dare say a word becasue he's so smart he knows better to stfu. Cuban is going to get himself in a lot of trouble sooner or later.

[oarabbus]

They cashed im they dont care.

He was kicked out of his house when he was killed. I doubt theyre too upset.


:biggums: They don't care Trayvon is dead because they got money?

:biggums:

[longtime lurker]

I actually have respect for Cuban for apologizing. It takes a real man to understand how his example just helped to reinforce negative stereotypes, but he still stood by his previous statement which was on point.

[Soundwave]

The Martin case didn't divide a nation, it was already divided. It's just that people don't want to talk about it, sort of like you're doing now.

keep saying "it's too sensitive" and it wont ever get fixed, but that's political correctness for you.

The situation gets fixed every day. Every day some old racist person dies, and a new generation is born that is going to be more progressive and open minded than even their current parents, who are more open minded about things than their parents were and so on.

It just doesn't happen overnight, but it's happening all the time.

We currently live in the most multi-cultural, globally connected society that humanity has ever known and its only going to evolve further from here.

And yes even if it is a cliche example, 20-30 years ago, there's no chance a black man could be president of the USA, today we have a two term black president.

Odds are every person on this board has more friends/acquaintances of different ethnicities than their parents did. Even if they're racist pricks themselves, odds are they are more open minded than their parents are, and odds are their kids will be even more open minded. Can't stop progress.

[ZenMaster]

I actually have respect for Cuban for apologizing. It takes a real man to understand how his example just helped to reinforce negative stereotypes, but he still stood by his previous statement which was on point.

Do you think the stereotype of a black guy in a hoodie might be a "bad guy"? Is a real or false stereotype?

[longtime lurker]

Do you think the stereotype of a black guy in a hoodie might be a "bad guy"? Is a real or false stereotype?

I think a black guy in a hoodie might want to be comfortable :confusedshrug:

Like seriously every single race wears hoodies. If you've ever participated in athletics you probably own multiple hoodies. It's like saying that every person wearing a turban is a terrorist and you'll switch planes if one sits beside you.

[Soundwave]

Do you think the stereotype of a black guy in a hoodie might be a "bad guy"? Is a real or false stereotype?

To be honest, I'm a white guy, but I wouldn't even blink if I see a black kid wearing a hoodie.

It must be something to people who grew up in the 60s/70s that terrifies them of hoodies, lol, the younger generation of people in their 20s/30s don't really seem to have an issue with it.

[Teanett]

I think a black guy in a hoodie might want to be comfortable :confusedshrug:

Like seriously every single race wears hoodies. If you've ever participated in athletics you probably own multiple hoodies. It's like saying that every person wearing a turban is a terrorist and you'll switch planes if one sits beside you.


To be honest, I'm a white guy, but I wouldn't even blink if I see a black kid wearing a hoodie.

It must be something to people who grew up in the 60s/70s that terrifies them of hoodies, lol, the younger generation of people in their 20s/30s don't really seem to have an issue with it.

this is not the point.
you have to understand that your opinion about black kids with hoodies doesnt matter. it's not the topic of wether or not black people in hoodies are bad guys or not.
it's a fact that trayvon martin was shot because of it.
the stereotype of a bad black guy in a hoodie does exist. the stereotype is real. (i'm not saying the stereotype is true)

[ZenMaster]

I think a black guy in a hoodie might want to be comfortable :confusedshrug:

Like seriously every single race wears hoodies. If you've ever participated in athletics you probably own multiple hoodies. It's like saying that every person wearing a turban is a terrorist and you'll switch planes if one sits beside you.

I'm asking if the stereotype is real?

Sure plenty of people in athletics own hoodies, and nobody is saying that anybody can't wear them. Remember that the guy walking opposite just crosses the street out of fear of something that might happen either because of perception, past experiences or both.

But I want to know if you think that the stereotype is true or something made up?

And if it is made up then who's responsible? Is it TV Shows like the Wire where basically every black guy doing some crime on the street level wore a hoodie?

[fos]

It was only controversial and newsworthy because it was a nonblack killing a black. To all those familiar with the case it was pretty obvious from the beginning that Zimmerman would be acquitted. Agenda-driven media story with blacks as victims of white oppression (in this case Hispanic).

[fos]

The hoodie thing, it depends on the circumstances. If someone is wearing a hoodie in warm weather? Yeah that's shady to me.

[Soundwave]

The hoodie thing, it depends on the circumstances. If someone is wearing a hoodie in warm weather? Yeah that's shady to me.

http://citizencashmere.com/cashmere_news/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/eminem-nike-la-restaurant.jpg

Runnnnn! He might assault you! :lol

[longtime lurker]

I'm asking if the stereotype is real?

Sure plenty of people in athletics own hoodies, and nobody is saying that anybody can't wear them. Remember that the guy walking opposite just crosses the street out of fear of something that might happen either because of perception, past experiences or both.

But I want to know if you think that the stereotype is true or something made up?

And if it is made up then who's responsible? Is it TV Shows like the Wire where basically every black guy doing some crime on the street level wore a hoodie?

Stereotypes are based on observations and will never apply to 100% of a population. Like I said everybody wears hoodies and unless we have access to data that tells us what someone is wearing when they committed a crime there's no basis in reality. And if criminals wear hoodies to conceal their identity then wouldn't it make sense that every race of criminal would wear them too? But for some reason it's only when a black person wears them that imminent danger is present.

It's interesting that you bring up the Wire because almost every example of violence in the wire is black on black crime. Statistically as a white person you're more likely to be killed by another white person, just like as a black person you're more likely to be killed by another black person. So unless you're white and live in predominately black neighborhood with a high crime rate (which Mark Cuban definitely doesn't) then you should be more afraid of white people than black people. Another problem is media outlets like Fox news with their fear mongering. They've somehow made people think that only thugs wear hoodies while it couldn't be further from the truth.

[MC Gusto]

The only reason it was controversial is because Zimmerman looks white, and Trayvon is black. No one bats an eye when a black guy kills a black guy.

Fixed.

[MC Gusto]

I'd be suspicious of the black dude, because there are no black kids at my playground. :coleman:
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Solefade]

They cashed im they dont care.

He was kicked out of his house when he was killed. I doubt theyre too upset.


this is the most ignorant shit i've ever heard

please don't have children

[MC Gusto]

The Martin case didn't divide a nation, it was already divided. It's just that people don't want to talk about it, sort of like you're doing now.

keep saying "it's too sensitive" and it wont ever get fixed, but that's political correctness for you.
:applause: :applause: :applause:

You're absolutely right.

[MC Gusto]

Maybe :lol

You guys here are mostly ignorant, young clueless SOB's. History people, history! Nobody, no one here has the slightest sensitivity to the decades of oppression and unhuman treatment blacks or African Americans had to endure for centuries against the hands of of self-proclaim whiter so called superior race.

But I dont want to take you guys seriosuly.:D You are all nothing but basketball geeks and junkies.

I look at it this way. If you're white, there is no way you can speak about b racism and come out with a favorable argument. Just look at Stepehn Smith when he talks about race or racism on TV, you see Skip Bayless jsut nodding his head in agreement. He doesnt dare say a word becasue he's so smart he knows better to stfu. Cuban is going to get himself in a lot of trouble sooner or later.

You do realize that white on black racism isn't the only racism that exists, right? And I'm saying this as a black man.

[MC Gusto]

Do you think the stereotype of a black guy in a hoodie might be a "bad guy"? Is a real or false stereotype?
50/50 chance IMO, just because the number of crimes being committed by black men and the number of black men who wear hoodies.

I wear hoodies for several reasons including comfortability and sometimes the laziness of not wanting to waste a wear on a shirt that is going to be covered up by the hoodie. If people think I'm potentially up to no good, then so be it. Until I get faced with somebody approaching me on some George Zimmerman s*it, I'm going to continue to wear them.

[NumberSix]

You're completely missing the point. Cuban basically said that black people scare him. That if one of his black players walked passed him with a hoodie, he would be scared. Note that the example of the white man has to be much more extreme with the tats on his face. So white people in hoodies don't scare him. In order to keep his comment fair, both races should have had the same circumstance. Is he wrong for what he said? No. Is he racist? No. Was he stupid? Yes.
1) Who said prejudices have to be fair?

2) was it not clear that the white guy scared him MORE? He said he'd cross the street if there is a black guy in a hoodie. If on the other side there was a skinhead looking guy, he'd cross back over to the LESS THREATENING side with the black guy.

3) the entire point is that the prejudices are not rational or justified. He was NOT making the point that blacks in hoodies is a rational fear, but that it ISNT.

[longtime lurker]

"Unless we have access to data" won't work, you're going to tell people not to use common sense because a study wasn't presented? Something can have basis in reality just because a study hasn't been made.
The gas station a few streets up from here they'll tell you to take your hood down if up, or if at night when they work with locked doors they wont let you in.

Yeah that's great and all. If you want to have common sense and run away from every black person you see that's great for you. It will be kind of ironic if you're ever in a life or death situation and a black person comes to help you but you run away. My point is you can't use your own personal experience to make a blanket statement about millions of people. Or you can if you want, but then don't get indignant when someone calls you out on it.


In the city that I live there's a segment of people I'd describe as "bad guys" or whatever. They often wear hoodies or tight t-shirts, a certain type of jeans, Nike Shox shoes or something that looks like it and often have short hair. White or arab their appearance is pretty close.
This is where you argue that without numbers it has no base in reality, but I KNOW it. I've seen some of them in my local neighboord at the local drug dealer once I went there, they where pretty young. But more importantly I know people from other parts of the city that fits that description, and they're criminals or people of questionable ethics compared to the norm, for example some of them fight or have done so a lot. They admit it to, some of the ones who can don't even pull the race card because, they know who they are..

Yeah again you're basing everything on your personal experience and that's fine. But your experiences won't translate to other cities and they're not indicative of all white or arab or even the majority of all white or arab people. You're trying to make equate your experiences and apply them to black people in hoodies. Unless the world revolves around you, then the stereotypes that you believe are true will not hold true 100% of the time. And its fine to have personal prejudices, but when black kids are racially profiled and sometimes even killed because of the way they dress people need to sit back and evaluate how they view others.


You also ducked my The Wire comment by turning it into black on black and white on white, that has nothing to do with it. You are debating that it's OK to be offended because somebody crosses the street just for good measure, they aren't harming you in any way, just looking out for themselves just in case.

I didn't duck your wire comment I simply told you the facts of white on white and black on black violence. What do you want me to say? That the Wire is responsible for what people believe? The wire is written by a white guy who was a cop so the show is written from his perspective. If a person watches the wire and believes all black people in hoodies are committing a crime then they're easily influenced and misguided.

And I'm not offended by someone crossing the street, if people want to live their lives in fear that's their prerogative. The problem is with classifying a whole race of people as thugs over an article of clothing while the same thing doesn't apply to other races that wear the same article of clothing. Mark Cuban still could have gotten his point across if he said he's fearful of anybody in a hoodie.

[ZenMaster]

Yeah that's great and all. If you want to have common sense and run away from every black person you see that's great for you. It will be kind of ironic if you're ever in a life or death situation and a black person comes to help you but you run away. My point is you can't use your own personal experience to make a blanket statement about millions of people. Or you can if you want, but then don't get indignant when someone calls you out on it.



Yeah again you're basing everything on your personal experience and that's fine. But your experiences won't translate to other cities and they're not indicative of all white or arab or even the majority of all white or arab people. You're trying to make equate your experiences and apply them to black people in hoodies. Unless the world revolves around you, then the stereotypes that you believe are true will not hold true 100% of the time. And its fine to have personal prejudices, but when black kids are racially profiled and sometimes even killed because of the way they dress people need to sit back and evaluate how they view others.



I didn't duck your wire comment I simply told you the facts of white on white and black on black violence. What do you want me to say? That the Wire is responsible for what people believe? The wire is written by a white guy who was a cop so the show is written from his perspective. If a person watches the wire and believes all black people in hoodies are committing a crime then they're easily influenced and misguided.

And I'm not offended by someone crossing the street, if people want to live their lives in fear that's their prerogative. The problem is with classifying a whole race of people as thugs over an article of clothing while the same thing doesn't apply to other races that wear the same article of clothing. Mark Cuban still could have gotten his point across if he said he's fearful of anybody in a hoodie.

I don't have to cross the street/run away from every sketchy person I see, but if it's late at night and certain looking group or person I just might cross if possible, usually though it takes more than a hoodie.

And no the world doesn't revolve around me, but there are people who can use common sense everywhere.

The last part of your post, well that's what he'd say in a perfect world but that wouldn't make it true in this world. Why? Well partially because you haven't seen white male youths in hoodies depicted as drug dealers on TV like in the Wire. Recently though you've seen a white guy wearing hoodies and pants around his ankles on TV, Jesse in Breaking Bad.

You should listen to Stephen A on this, you can't break a stereotype by telling others how to feel, you can only break it by not acting the part.

[Soundwave]

I don't have to cross the street/run away from every sketchy person I see, but if it's late at night and certain looking group or person I just might cross if possible, usually though it takes more than a hoodie.

And no the world doesn't revolve around me, but there are people who can use common sense everywhere.

The last part of your post, well that's what he'd say in a perfect world but that wouldn't make it true in this world. Why? Well partially because you haven't seen white male youths in hoodies depicted as drug dealers on TV like in the Wire. Recently though you've seen a white guy wearing hoodies and pants around his ankles on TV, Jesse in Breaking Bad.

You should listen to Stephen A on this, you can't break a stereotype by telling others how to feel, you can only break it by not acting the part.

Pretty sure the most successful white musician of the last 20 years wears a hoodie bro. Every freaking white kid I went to school with rocked the baggy jeans too, so it's not like "Jesse from Breaking Bad" is some exotic stereotype that you don't see on every street corner in suburbia.

The whole point of that character is that's he's the average, modern graduated high school kid.

But again none of this really has nothing to do with Donald Sterling, which is what Cuban was trying to equate it to, so it's all moot.

[NumberSix]

I don't have to cross the street/run away from every sketchy person I see, but if it's late at night and certain looking group or person I just might cross if possible, usually though it takes more than a hoodie.

And no the world doesn't revolve around me, but there are people who can use common sense everywhere.

The last part of your post, well that's what he'd say in a perfect world but that wouldn't make it true in this world. Why? Well partially because you haven't seen white male youths in hoodies depicted as drug dealers on TV like in the Wire. Recently though you've seen a white guy wearing hoodies and pants around his ankles on TV, Jesse in Breaking Bad.

You should listen to Stephen A on this, you can't break a stereotype by telling others how to feel, you can only break it by not acting the part.
I'm about 6'4 or 6'5. I completely understand why someone might be more cautious of me than a 5'9 guy. It's completely rational that I might be more threatening than a smaller person.

We all have characteristics that someone else may find more or less threatening. It's not for any of us to decide how someone else feels.

[97 bulls]

And its fine to have personal prejudices, but when black kids are racially profiled and sometimes even killed because of the way they dress people need to sit back and evaluate how they view others.*



The problem is with classifying a whole race of people as thugs over an article of clothing while the same thing doesn't apply to other races that wear the same article of clothing. Mark Cuban still could have gotten his point across if he said he's fearful of anybody in a hoodie.

Excellent points. And this is what people cant seem to realize. Blacks are personally effected by these stereotypes. Constantly.

I'd also like to add that all while its true that your typical black crimianl might wear hoodies to conceal their identity, its also true that thats the basic uniform for ALL CRIMINALS. What do white thieves/muggers wear? Suits?

[97 bulls]

Just to add, a point that a buddy of mine presented to me during a conversation about Cubans remarks.

Cuban himself looks crazy. If I saw him walking down the street at night, I'd try to avoid him as well. So we both would probably be crossing the street.

[NumberSix]

Excellent points. And this is what people cant seem to realize. Blacks are personally effected by these stereotypes. Constantly.

I'd also like to add that all while its true that your typical black crimianl might wear hoodies to conceal their identity, its also true that thats the basic uniform for ALL CRIMINALS. What do white thieves/muggers wear? Suits?
Question? What happens more?

A) White victims of black criminals.
B) Blacks victimized for wearing hoodies.


You seem to think that B is a very serious concern, so if A does indeed happen more, it is an even more justified fear, right?

[97 bulls]

Question? What happens more?

A) White victims of black criminals.
B) Blacks victimized for wearing hoodies.


You seem to think that B is a very serious concern, so if A does indeed happen more, it is an even more justified fear, right?
Theres an old saying that I heard a Judge say. "Better to let a 1000 guilty men go free, than the to send one innocent man to jail".

My point is as I said and many others. All criminals conceal themselves by wearing hoodies. Hoodies are a style that kids of all races wear.

[aboss4real24]

All white PPL R Racist

[16X]

Well, no bald white guys with tattoos have recently been murdered in a controversial case that riled up the nation... you ****ing fggt.
The fact that the case riled up the nation makes Trayvon's death no more important than any other death. Hundreds die every day in the States, and thousands more around the world. Their lives were not worth any less than Trayvon's, so Cuban's example was fine. If you think Trayvon's death matters more, you sir are a racist.

[Adam Silver]

What do you guys think? Should I ban Cuban for life?

[NumberSix]

What do you guys think? Should I ban Cuban for life?
No...





FOREVER

[MMM]

don't really have a problem with what Cuban said he was just honest about how he felt and it is something that 99.9 percent of people do all the time. If someone looks like they belong, dress a certain way, have a certain facial expression, etc. we tend to judge them one way or another.

If you see a middle eastern looking man leave a bag on the bus, what is your first thought going to be???

[T_L_P]

There are bigger things to worry about than a little prejudice, which isn't even necessarily unjustified.

[NumberSix]

There are bigger things to worry about than a little prejudice, which isn't even necessarily unjustified.
How DARE you

[xoracle55]

[QUOTE=Soundwave]The situation gets fixed every day. Every day some old racist person dies, and a new generation is born that is going to be more progressive and open minded than even their current parents, who are more open minded about things than their parents were and so on.

It just doesn't happen overnight, but it's happening all the time.

We currently live in the most multi-cultural, globally connected society that humanity has ever known and its only going to evolve further from here.

And yes even if it is a cliche example, 20-30 years ago, there's no chance a black man could be president of the USA, today we have a two term black president.

Odds are every person on this board has more friends/acquaintances of different ethnicities than their parents did. Even if they're racist pricks themselves, odds are they are more open minded than their parents are, and odds are their kids will be even more open minded. Can't stop progress.[/

:rockon:

Amazing how kids can school their parents on how to better treat a human being..

[NuggetsFan]

Cuban didn't say anything wrong really. Was actually pretty on point.

It's hilarious this whole "hoodie" thing too. Can't watch for 15 years to pass so I can talk about the good ol days where a piece of clothing worn by black, white, women, men etc. because such a staple and racy topic for everybody. The whole "hoodie" narrative with the Trayvon Martin case was overblown. Same thing happens with a baggy t-shirt.

[sundizz]

Cuban didn't say anything wrong really. Was actually pretty on point.

It's hilarious this whole "hoodie" thing too. Can't watch for 15 years to pass so I can talk about the good ol days where a piece of clothing worn by black, white, women, men etc. because such a staple and racy topic for everybody. The whole "hoodie" narrative with the Trayvon Martin case was overblown. Same thing happens with a baggy t-shirt.

In 15 years we'll have a hoodie that self zips up when it rains.

[JohnFreeman]

Black people are sensitive souls, bless.

[NumberSix]

Black people are sensitive souls, bless.
What about Turkish people?

[cltcfn2924]

The Sterling thing was about an owner saying things that were stupid insensitive and offensive. I don't understand Cuban jumping in, on the stage set up by Sterling, and upping him in the insensitivity department. Its something only a jerk does. He didn't have to say anything. He offered no light on the subject and offered something that a second grader would. It just came off as insensitive to a very recent incident.. No need to go for his head, tho.


No, it was about the other owners. Nobody here has gotten that, that these guys with Sterlings' head on a stick carry the same prejudices, they just aren't stupid enough to get caught on tape. He also said that Sterling did indeed have to go. If he did anything wrong it was to break from his fraternity. Get off the racist kick, he said nothing racist, just inner truths.

[Dresta]

Well, no bald white guys with tattoos have recently been murdered in a controversial case that riled up the nation... you ****ing fggt.
Maybe the nation shouldn't get riled up about inconsequential tripe then. That a nation can get riled by a single none-too-brutal murder case really does show how ****ing idiotic this nation is.

[SpanishACB]

don't really have a problem with what Cuban said he was just honest about how he felt and it is something that 99.9 percent of people do all the time. If someone looks like they belong, dress a certain way, have a certain facial expression, etc. we tend to judge them one way or another.

If you see a middle eastern looking man leave a bag on the bus, what is your first thought going to be???

just because 99.9 percent of people would do it doesn't make it right. You're just fueling the racism. Sure, statistically, blacks do more crimes, but it's also a statistic that they do not get equal opportunities at jobs, and that per capita, they have less access to proper education and a proper way of providing for their families... is that their fault? of course not. it's the inherent racism, the unions, etc... all that's wrong in america. So you can't just come up and claim blacks do more crimes therefore it's right to use the prejudice because whose fault is it? it's society's fault, not their, there's the same amount of lazy ass whites as there is blacks

sure we all have similar thoughts but cuban is in a position of mediatic power. he is has the power to reach millions of people and therefore he should act accordingly, with responsability.

[funnystuff]

Black people are sensitive souls, bless.
That they are, if they weren't nothing like this would blow up in the news.

[Dresta]

Theres an old saying that I heard a Judge say. "Better to let a 1000 guilty men go free, than the to send one innocent man to jail".

My point is as I said and many others. All criminals conceal themselves by wearing hoodies. Hoodies are a style that kids of all races wear.
Erm.. we aren't talking about judicial conviction here, just the personal feeling of vulnerability a person may have when around people presenting a certain image. Their willingness to exercise extra caution, and to avoid those they feel intimidated by, is not the same as convicting an innocent man, and causes no harm to the individual avoided (and may even lessen the chance of the cautious individual coming to harm). That saying is fatuous anyway because it is general, ambiguous and unspecific: what if those 1000 guilty men were potential child rapists and murderers who had a high probability of reoffending - it still better to set them free?

Some people do just look scarier than others, and i think that's hard to deny, and even harder to change. Wearing a hoody will make you look more intimidating. Would most black men wearing a hoody fill me with fear? Not at all. But if i ran into Kevin Garnett, at night, wearing a hoody, i'd probably get pretty anxious, because KG is one scary looking mother****er. Nate Robinson in a hoody on the other hand... It's not only about skin colour. I personally can't recall a time i've crossed a road to avoid people, but i have thought about it before with groups of youths at night (obvious gangs). But i can assure you that if i had a kid, i wouldn't give a second thought to avoiding them, because there are some things not worth risking

I live in London and was here when the July 05 bombings happened, and then the following week there was the failed bombings. And man, when an asian guy with a rucksack would get on the tube, literally half the people would get off or go to another carriage. Was terrible, and far more blatant and obvious than any crossing of the street is, and more hurtful to the individual being profiled, but can i cast judgement on the people who moved for doing so? Not really. The human instinct to flight is inbuilt, and people can't really help it if they get scared. Cowards perhaps, yes, but when it comes down to it most people are cowards these days. The refinement of morality increases alongside the refinement of fear. People are scared of everything, even of causing disagreeable feelings in their peers or of garnering their moral disapproval. It is craven, but it is also human nature.

[Dresta]

just because 99.9 percent of people would do it doesn't make it right. You're just fueling the racism. Sure, statistically, blacks do more crimes, but it's also a statistic that they do not get equal opportunities at jobs, and that per capita, they have less access to proper education and a proper way of providing for their families... is that their fault? of course not. it's the inherent racism, the unions, etc... all that's wrong in america. So you can't just come up and claim blacks do more crimes therefore it's right to use the prejudice because whose fault is it? it's society's fault, not their, there's the same amount of lazy ass whites as there is blacks

sure we all have similar thoughts but cuban is in a position of mediatic power. he is has the power to reach millions of people and therefore he should act accordingly, with responsability.
Idiot post. It's not 'societies fault' that there are so many homicides committed by black Americans, and it is pathetic to try and exculpate their guilt by laying the blame on the mythical entity of 'society.' In reality the individual is to blame, and also their parents, who need to be more responsible themselves, and accept that the family does provide a solid foundation from which to propel your offspring upwards.

Racial discrimination is not a justification for violence. The first person to commit a violent act is the guilty party, always.

[SpanishACB]

Idiot post. It's not 'societies fault' that there are so many homicides committed by black Americans, and it is pathetic to try and exculpate their guilt by laying the blame on the mythical entity of 'society.' In reality the individual is to blame, and also their parents, who need to be more responsible themselves, and accept that the family does provide a solid foundation from which to propel your offspring upwards.

Racial discrimination is not a justification for violence. The first person to commit a violent act is the guilty party, always.

okay then genius what is the reason more crimes per capita are commited by african americans?

genetics? :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[MavsSuperFan]

Theres an old saying that I heard a Judge say. "Better to let a 1000 guilty men go free, than the to send one innocent man to jail".

My point is as I said and many others. All criminals conceal themselves by wearing hoodies. Hoodies are a style that kids of all races wear.
So you acknowledge that hoodies can be used to hide identities or at least make it more difficult to identify ppl and for that reason are associated with criminal behavior? Ski masks, gloves, etc are also used for this purpose, but hoodies are a lot less conspicuous.


but no one white guy with shaved head and/or face tattoos have been killed lately, black kids in hoodies are being targeted, etc

Sigh, I actually do think trayvon's death was a tragedy. Also that white guy Michael Dunn who shot and killed a black kid and wounded 3 others is a monster, and that old white man that murdered a black kid.

But, the reason you know about this is black ppl and the media make it about race, and I actually think race is the primary factor.

White ppl are killed everyday by young black males, and it is almost never made into about race. There were 2 incidences of blacks shooting white babies. One was a black man that wanted to kill the baby because he thought it would grow up to be a racist. Other case was 2 black teens just for fun.

In Tennessee an early 20 year old white couple were both raped, sodomized, mutilated and tortured by black people for no reason.

The media never connects the killing of whites by blacks to racism. It never makes a big deal about so that either the white victims or black perps become big names.

Look up the stats black violence against whites is insanely high if you adjust for blacks being 12.7% of the population.

Almost every black person ignores this. And pretends whites killing blacks is more common. Or that white serial killers are more common.

The reason the news never reports incidences of black males shooting whites is it happens so much that 24 hours is not enough to cover it at the national level. (Eg shootings during robberies, break ins, random violence, etc)