Could you argue against LeBron in the top 5 with another championship and finals MVP?

[atljonesbro]

I don't think you can.

[robert_shaww]

I don't think you can.

after he wins against the thunder this year, he is around 12

[BigBoss]

Le*

[Cocaine80s]

He'll be #6 at worst.

[Black and White]

Jordan
KAJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Kobe
Duncan


would still all be clearly ahead of him

[K Xerxes]

Jordan
KAJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Kobe
Duncan


would still all be clearly ahead of him

Really nothing to argue for in favor of Kobe if this happens.

[Black and White]

Really nothing to argue for in favor of Kobe if this happens.

How so? I would say they would be on the same level, or LeBron still slightly behind, its not a bad thing though, he would still be a top 10 player.

[BBallZen83]

He would definitely be sniffing the top 5. Probably 6-8 range assuming the hypothetical.

[JohnnyA]

Nope not top five, but its not as if his career will just stop. He's likely to be one of the best payer for another 2-4 years, and still very good for a few more after that. Unless he falls off dramatically its pretty likely he will go down as top five by the time its all said and done.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Jordan
KAJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Kobe
Duncan


would still all be clearly ahead of him
I would add in Mikan as well.

[SamuraiSWISH]

In terms of game, and on court impact? Only better is prime Jordan, and comparable for a short period? Maybe peak Larry Bird / Magic Johnson. Resume? I don't see how anyone other than MJ would be ranked over him. And that's just honest truth, not even a fan of the guy. Lakers fans will be salty AF.

[oh the horror]

You know, to be honest I don't really care.


His fanboys are getting exactly what they wanted. Path of least resistance toward multiple title runs in a depleted eastern conference.


Heat could afford to rest players and still had no fear of being beaten by anyone really. Indiana? Again I laughed at a buddy of mine that thought differently. The heat won me 160 bucks. They were literally an absolute to go back to the finals this year.

Lebron and the Heat's run has to be one of the most underwhelming championship runs I've ever seen.



It's fun for their fans and especially for their bandwagoners. But outside of that is anyone buying the hype 100 percent?


That's not to say Lebron HIMSELF isn't an amazing player but there isn't much to be in awe about. They feast on inferior team after inferior team.


Their only real challenges have been the Spurs (which yes the did beat) and that's been about it to me.

[sammichoffate]

Weak era. I'd have him at around 8.

[Cocaine80s]

How so? I would say they would be on the same level, or LeBron still slightly behind, its not a bad thing though, he would still be a top 10 player.
not sure if srs...

its arguable that Lebron is ahead of kobe right now.

If he wins another fmvp? theres no argument for kobe ahead of him

[Byobob]

In terms of game, and on court impact? Only better is prime Jordan, and comparable for a short period? Maybe peak Larry Bird / Magic Johnson. Resume? I don't see how anyone other than MJ would be ranked over him. And that's just honest truth, not even a fan of the guy. Lakers fans will be salty AF.

I agree. I think he still has some work to do to surpass KAJ all time. Very little to no shot at MJ though.

P.S. I'm a Bran stan

[GODbe]

He'd surpass Gasol for the #44 spot imho. There's honestly nothing he can do at this point to get into top 5 unless time machines are invented.

[Black and White]

not sure if srs...

its arguable that Lebron is ahead of kobe right now.

If he wins another fmvp? theres no argument for kobe ahead of him

Realistically, asides from MVP awards, what does LeBron have over Kobe in terms of a career yet??

I said LeBron wouldn't be higher than him with 3 rings, but LeBron can always end up higher if he keeps winning.

[BBallZen83]

Realistically, asides from MVP awards, what does LeBron have over Kobe in terms of a career yet??

I said LeBron wouldn't be higher than him with 3 rings, but LeBron can always end up higher if he keeps winning.
If you have a gut check, and be honest with yourself, it would be the fact that he has 3 chips as the man with fmvp, and 4 mvps.

[Cocaine80s]

Realistically, asides from MVP awards, what does LeBron have over Kobe in terms of a career yet??

I said LeBron wouldn't be higher than him with 3 rings, but LeBron can always end up higher if he keeps winning.
if he wins this year, 3FMVP>2FMVP and better career stats.

[Relinquish]

if he wins this year, 3FMVP>2FMVP and better career stats.

Don't forget 4>1 as well :confusedshrug:

[aj1987]

Jordan
KAJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Kobe
Duncan


would still all be clearly ahead of him
4 MVP's, 3 Rings, and 3 FMVP's? Nope. LeBron would be above all of them. IMO, LeBron is already above Bird.

[Black and White]

4 MVP's, 3 Rings, and 3 FMVP's? Nope. LeBron would be above all of them. IMO, LeBron is already above Bird.

I dunno, Duncan and Kobe in particular have longevity on their side, 4 and 5 rings respectively, I guess you have to look at context, longevity is important to me, shows how consistent they can be, LeBron is heading in that path though....

[Black and White]

if he wins this year, 3FMVP>2FMVP and better career stats.

The stats are still coming, as I said, his career is not done yet.

[SwishSquared]

If this happens, he's best SF of all time. As far as perimeter guys, I think only Magic + MJ would be definitively be above him in all-time rankings at end of this year. I can see him surpassing Magic though once he hangs 'em up but he has little shot of catching/surpassing MJ. Now if he 4peats, then this gets interesting. Gotta win this year before I go there though haha...

[Cocaine80s]

I dunno, Duncan and Kobe in particular have longevity on their side, 4 and 5 rings respectively, I guess you have to look at context, longevity is important to me, shows how consistent they can be, LeBron is heading in that path though....
Longevity works for Duncan, but for kobe?

What has he done in the past 4 years? He got swept by the mavs, lost in 5 to okc, and was injured the past 2 years. Is that really longevity? He hasnt really done anything since 31 yrs old

[aj1987]

I dunno, Duncan and Kobe in particular have longevity on their side, 4 and 5 rings respectively, I guess you have to look at context, longevity is important to me, shows how consistent they can be, LeBron is heading in that path though....
LeBron is 29. Played 11 seasons. Also, if longevity is important, you need to remove Bird and Magic from that list.

[Solefade]

not sure if srs...

its arguable that Lebron is ahead of kobe right now.

If he wins another fmvp? theres no argument for kobe ahead of him


he's a kobe stan/boston fan/heat troll

[Marlo_Stanfield]

How so? I would say they would be on the same level, or LeBron still slightly behind, its not a bad thing though, he would still be a top 10 player.
this kobetard is killing me
LeBron 3 peating with 4 finals in a row would make him top 5:banana: :banana:

[Black and White]

LeBron is 29. Played 11 seasons. Also, if longevity is important, you need to remove Bird and Magic from that list.

Yea I said LeBron is going down that path.

Magic and Bird are still top 10 because I have them in tiers, LeBron is on the tier with Kobe, Duncan, Hakeem etc, what puts Kobe and Duncan ahead atm is the longevity. I see Lebron finishing in Magic/Bird/Shaqs tier, just behind MJ/KAJ/Russell.

[Black and White]

this kobetard is killing me
LeBron 3 peating with 4 finals in a row would make him top 5:banana: :banana:

Does context mean anything to you?

[Cocaine80s]

Yea I said LeBron is going down that path.

Magic and Bird are still top 10 because I have them in tiers, LeBron is on the tier with Kobe, Duncan, Hakeem etc, what puts Kobe and Duncan ahead atm is the longevity. I see Lebron finishing in Magic/Bird/Shaqs tier, just behind MJ/KAJ/Russell.
What has kobe done in the past 4 years? He got swept by the mavs, lost in 5 to okc, and was injured the past 2 years. Is that really longevity? He hasnt really done anything since 31 yrs old

[pauk]

No, no you cant.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Does context mean anything to you?
look, i get it that you like Kobe and aint nothing wrong with it, even tho you are a supposed Celtics fan:coleman:
it just isnt a debate that lebron is above kobe all time by a huge margin if he should win again.
3 FMVPS in a row aganst hard finals competition blows the accomplishment margin WIDE open.
Lebron hasn exactly been a fraud in the years where he didnt win either:confusedshrug:

[Black and White]

What has kobe done in the past 4 years? He got swept by the mavs, lost in 5 to okc, and was injured the past 2 years. Is that really longevity? He hasnt really done anything since 31 yrs old

Longevity is more production than what they actually do from a winning standpoint, what Kobe did last season for his age is amazing.

[Warfan]

Yes, especially if he plays great in the finals

mj
kareem
Russell

wilt
magic
bird

shaq
Duncan
kobe/bron

probably moves up to the 2nd tier...

[Black and White]

look, i get it that you like Kobe and aint nothing wrong with it, even tho you are a supposed Celtics fan:coleman:
it just isnt a debate that lebron is above kobe all time by a huge margin if he should win again.
3 FMVPS in a row aganst hard finals competition blows the accomplishment margin WIDE open.
Lebron hasn exactly been a fraud in the years where he didnt win either:confusedshrug:

This is what I mean by context, LeBron has the benefit of a stacked team that was put together to win titles, did you expect anything less than 2-3 rings for a squad like this? Especially playing in a weak eastern conference. Should you really discredit Kobe and Duncans 4 and 5 rings in favour of LeBrons 3??? Kobe and Duncan faced much harder competition en route to their rings.

[Cocaine80s]

Longevity is more production than what they actually do from a winning standpoint, what Kobe did last season for his age is amazing.
thats retarded. So if what they do doesnt translate to wins it still makes them great?


that doesnt make any sense. Duncan is old as **** but still lead his team to the finals. Thats how i view longevity. Kobe's body is breaking down on him and hes only 35.

[Black and White]

thats retarded. So if what they do doesnt translate to wins it still makes them great?


that doesnt make any sense. Duncan is old as **** but still lead his team to the finals. Thats how i view longevity. Kobe's body is breaking down on him and hes only 35.

Level of play is what constitues to longevity, if a player is still playing at a high level, then thats something great, Kobe, Duncan, Dirk, they all fall in that category, I think Tony Parker will too.

[JUDGE WITNESS]

already the GOAT


-smak

[Cocaine80s]

Level of play is what constitues to longevity, if a player is still playing at a high level, then thats something great, Kobe, Duncan, Dirk, they all fall in that category, I think Tony Parker will too.
alright w/e bruh


i just feel longevity is overrated unless it actually translates to team success...

[SilkkTheShocker]

People can put whomever they want in front of Bron the all time list. Fact of the matter their is one player in the top 10 that was arguably better than Lebron. Everyone simply never played at the level as The King

[Kingwillball]

He'd surpass Gasol for the #44 spot imho. There's honestly nothing he can do at this point to get into top 5 unless time machines are invented.


He already passed Kobe..LOl Greatest SF of all time as Marc Jackson said..

[Black and White]

alright w/e bruh


i just feel longevity is overrated unless it actually translates to team success...

Thats your opinion so fair enough, but for example, if the Mavs never signed Monta and Dirk failed to make the playoffs but still put up great stats, that should be held against him? You can't really knock players for their franchise not being able to put them in a position to succeed, which is why I never knocked LeBron for his early Cleveland days, I look at their consistency and ability to keep playing at a high level, thats what I use for longevity comparisons.

[Solefade]

In terms of game, and on court impact? Only better is prime Jordan, and comparable for a short period? Maybe peak Larry Bird / Magic Johnson. Resume? I don't see how anyone other than MJ would be ranked over him. And that's just honest truth, not even a fan of the guy. Lakers fans will be salty AF.


this.

resume wise if he has 4 mvps 3fmvps 3 rings w/ a 3PEAT as the man and the kind of impact he has for his teams on both sides of the floor..there's no way he's not top 6

[plowking]

Black and White has to be the saltiest poster. Dude is clearly mad but tries to come off objective.

Spouting all this shit in the regular season when Durant was playing well, and now he is all quiet but still trying to take jabs here and there... lol. Pathetic.

Look at his damn posts... "All these players are quite clearly ahead"... Next moment... "They're on the same level, but these guys are still slightly ahead".

Dude can't give credit and is clearly fuming lol.

[Cocaine80s]

Thats your opinion so fair enough, but for example, if the Mavs never signed Monta and Dirk failed to make the playoffs but still put up great stats, that should be held against him? You can't really knock players for their franchise not being able to put them in a position to succeed, which is why I never knocked LeBron for his early Cleveland days, I look at their consistency and ability to keep playing at a high level, thats what I use for longevity comparisons.

Well i mean would that really move him up the all time list? putting up great stats? What im saying is that there are more deserving reasons why Lebron would be higher than kobe. Same amount of fmvps, 4 to 1 mvps, and better career stats should be more important than longevity.

I mean if were gonna count longevity, maybe we should factor in how good a player was at their peak. Shaq would be top 3 then

[Black and White]

Black and White has to be the saltiest poster. Dude is clearly mad but tries to come off objective.

Spouting all this shit in the regular season when Durant was playing well, and now he is all quiet but still trying to take jabs here and there... lol. Pathetic.

Look at his damn posts... "All these players are quite clearly ahead"... Next moment... "They're on the same level, but these guys are still slightly ahead".

Dude can't give credit and is clearly fuming lol.

You call me salty when there are posters here saying he will never be top 15, you didnt quote me when I said I can see him ending up on Bird/Magics tier, you didnt quote me when I said LeBrons consistency should not be overlooked in the playoffs, no, you chose to cherrypick things I have said to make it look like I don't rank LeBron fairly, not everyone has him as high as others, its called having an opinion, you don't see me knocking yours, I would expect you to do the same for me, considering my opinions are not as farfetched as you would like to think.

[Black and White]

Well i mean would that really move him up the all time list? putting up great stats? What im saying is that there are more deserving reasons why Lebron would be higher than kobe. Same amount of fmvps, 4 to 1 mvps, and better career stats should be more important than longevity.

I mean if were gonna count longevity, maybe we should factor in how good a player was at their peak. Shaq would be top 3 then

I think people do count peaks too, hence why Bird and Shaq make peoples lists, for me, 4 rings and 4 FMVP for LeBron would put him in the top 6 with his resume.

[Cocaine80s]

I think people do count peaks too, hence why Bird and Shaq make peoples lists, for me, 4 rings and 4 FMVP for LeBron would put him in the top 6 with his resume.
Lol what


4 FMVP and only top 6? I don't understand.

How do you have Bird At #5? He only has 3 rings and fmvps, plus he did not have longevity. What is your ranking criteria for him?

[Just2McFly]

Jordan
KAJ
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Kobe
Duncan


would still all be clearly ahead of him
laughable at best

4x MVP
3x Champion
3x FMVP
a three peat under his belt and you are going to say that Kobe/Shaq/Bird/Duncan and Magic are going to be CLEARLY ahead??


..STOP

[Rocketswin2013]

Only KAJ and MJ would have a definite case over him. LeBron could be argued to being better than everybody else though.

[Black and White]

Lol what


4 FMVP and only top 6? I don't understand.

How do you have Bird At #5? He only has 3 rings and fmvps, plus he did not have longevity. What is your ranking criteria for him?

Well, MJ, Kareem, Russell and Magic would be ahead of him, I could see people debating Shaq too, I said top 6, meaning it would be debateable, putting him anywhere from 4-6.

Bird is based on peak, championships, context etc, but the argument for him is fading quickly.

[Black and White]

laughable at best

4x MVP
3x Champion
3x FMVP
a three peat under his belt and you are going to say that Kobe/Shaq/Bird/Duncan and Magic are going to be CLEARLY ahead??


..STOP

Duncan 4 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Shaq 4 rings

etc, its all based on opinion though, but 4 rings for LeBron and he goes ahead of them.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Black and White has to be the saltiest poster. Dude is clearly mad but tries to come off objective.

Spouting all this shit in the regular season when Durant was playing well, and now he is all quiet but still trying to take jabs here and there... lol. Pathetic.

Look at his damn posts... "All these players are quite clearly ahead"... Next moment... "They're on the same level, but these guys are still slightly ahead".

Dude can't give credit and is clearly fuming lol.
:applause: :applause:

[Just2McFly]

Duncan 4 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Shaq 4 rings

etc, its all based on opinion though, but 4 rings for LeBron and he goes ahead of them.

so now we are throwing FMVP's and MVP's out the window?:oldlol:

[Black and White]

so now we are throwing FMVP's and MVP's out the window?:oldlol:

No, I'm saying that the chips are one of the reasons they are ranked ahead, if you wanna say LeBron is top 6-9 with 3 rings, thats fine though, but I still put those guys ahead.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

His impact carries the same weight as Bird and Magic. I wouldn't argue with anyone who'd put him top 5 IF he were to win another one..

[Just2McFly]

No, I'm saying that the chips are one of the reasons they are ranked ahead, if you wanna say LeBron is top 6-9 with 3 rings, thats fine though, but I still put those guys ahead.
:coleman:

Whatever dude.

[plowking]

so now we are throwing FMVP's and MVP's out the window?:oldlol:

Yeah dude. Don't you know 1 or 2 more championships makes up for having less FMVP's and 3 less MVP's. :oldlol:
Also it makes up for Lebron being a better and more impactful player at each of their respective primes. :oldlol:

[maybeshewill13]

Jordan
KAJ
Magic
Bird
Russell
Shaq
Duncan

All still would be above him. He needs one more after that to crack the 5.

[wakencdukest]

At the rate he's going, I wouldn't argue. He might get a few more rings. Even with the collusion angle, Bosh has been disappointing, and Wade has been slowly dropping off over the last 2 years.