If Duncan retires...

[Pointguard]

SA gets either Bosh or Al Jefferson and wins its all...

Would you lower Duncan's GOAT position in favor of Pop's coaching?

[pastis]

duncan has now 1 1/2 ring (03 ring and half 99 ring, other half robinson). 05 manu and 07 parker.

wtihout parker, manu, popovic, stacked team, duncan barely top 30 all-time. when he retires now, he will be one of the most overrated top 10 ever with wilt chamberlain.

topic: yes.

[T_L_P]

duncan has now 1 1/2 ring (03 ring and half 99 ring, other half robinson). 05 manu and 07 parker.

wtihout parker, manu, popovic, stacked team, duncan barely top 30 all-time. when he retires now, he will be one of the most overrated top 10 ever with wilt chamberlain.

topic: yes.

'99 Robinson: 16/10/3/2/2
'07 Duncan: 22/12/3/1/3

Robinson gets half a title, Duncan gets none. :facepalm


How many rings does Kobe have? What about Magic?

[DMAVS41]

SA gets either Bosh or Al Jefferson and wins its all...

Would you lower Duncan's GOAT position in favor of Pop's coaching?

No...duncan is old as shit right now and the Spurs around him are really talented.

If Leonard improves next year...you actually have a pretty loaded team with Duncan or with a good replacement player.

I think it's funny that these sorts of topics come up...mainly because the Spurs haven't won shit since Duncan started to decline...

Seems to me that the evidence points to it being more because of Duncan in terms of the rings now more than ever. If it was about Pop or Parker/Manu and deep teams...why aren't they winning anything from 07 to now?

[SCdac]

Is this a serious question?

The fact that 38 year old Tim Duncan is even in the same sentence as prime Chris Bosh and Al Jefferson speaks volumes about his lasting talent, skill, impact, and worth.

Duncan played the most minutes for the Spurs this season. Give him some credit for being a rock and anchor. Pop owes his career to Duncan.

Really think 32-33 year old Parker + oft injured Al Jefferson are going to make series waves in a league with prime Durant and Lebron and who knows what other amazing players coming up (Anthony Davis, etc)?

Kawhi is a great piece to build with, as is Splitter. But they're going to need a better franchise player eventually. Al Jeff and Bosh are not the answer when Duncan is gone. Spurs should look at Al Horford or Greg Monroe, imo, and even they're not quite the answer. Might even take a losing season or two to truly rebuild, which would be the first lottery pick in nearly two decades.

Will the Spurs be able to retain their depth is the question. Diaw can't play forever and neither can Manu.

[pastis]

like always discrediting everyone but duncan. and more funny fact is this word:


Is this a serious question?

Give him some credit for being a rock and anchor. Pop owes his career to Duncan.


ANCHROR, ANCHOR, ANCHOR; ship, ship, ANCHOR, ANCHOR, tuuuuuut, tutttt, HE is an ANCHOR, ANCHOR on the floor, wuhuuuuu ANCHOR ANCHOR

facepalm.jpg

[AT9]

Is this a serious question?

The fact that 38 year old Tim Duncan is even in the same sentence as prime Chris Bosh and Al Jefferson speaks volumes about his lasting talent, skill, impact, and worth.

Duncan played the most minutes for the Spurs this season. Give him some credit for being a rock and anchor. Pop owes his career to Duncan.

Really think 32-33 year old Parker + oft injured Al Jefferson are going to make series waves in a league with prime Durant and Lebron and who knows what other amazing players coming up (Anthony Davis, etc)?

Kawhi is a great piece to build with, as is Splitter. But they're going to need a better franchise player eventually. Al Jeff and Bosh are not the answer when Duncan is gone. Spurs should look at Al Horford or Greg Monroe, imo, and even they're not quite the answer. Might even take a losing season or two to truly rebuild, which would be the first lottery pick in nearly two decades.

Will the Spurs be able to retain their depth is the question. Diaw can't play forever and neither can Manu.

What about Kevin Love? I doubt it will happen since the Spurs don't go after huge deals and Love probably wouldn't be as interested here as he would be with some other big name place. But I've seen his name mentioned as a possibility recently, and he would be that young franchise player we need. They could really build around him and Leonard.

[T_L_P]

like always discrediting everyone but duncan. and more funny fact is this word:



ANCHROR, ANCHOR, ANCHOR; ship, ship, ANCHOR, ANCHOR, tuuuuuut, tutttt, HE is an ANCHOR, ANCHOR on the floor, wuhuuuuu ANCHOR ANCHOR

facepalm.jpg


Just like you saying "overrated defense, solid bt overrated, solid, solid, solid, overrated".

You've never managed to explain why, either because you can't or you have a dysfunction of some kind.

facepalm.jpg

[Pointguard]

No...duncan is old as shit right now and the Spurs around him are really talented.

If Leonard improves next year...you actually have a pretty loaded team with Duncan or with a good replacement player.

I think it's funny that these sorts of topics come up...mainly because the Spurs haven't won shit since Duncan started to decline...

Seems to me that the evidence points to it being more because of Duncan in terms of the rings now more than ever. If it was about Pop or Parker/Manu and deep teams...why aren't they winning anything from 07 to now?

Well when did he start to decline? Seven years ago or this year? They certainly had a great chance to win it last year when they were one mistake away in game six.

[Pointguard]

Is this a serious question?

The fact that 38 year old Tim Duncan is even in the same sentence as prime Chris Bosh and Al Jefferson speaks volumes about his lasting talent, skill, impact, and worth.

Duncan played the most minutes for the Spurs this season. Give him some credit for being a rock and anchor. Pop owes his career to Duncan.

Really think 32-33 year old Parker + oft injured Al Jefferson are going to make series waves in a league with prime Durant and Lebron and who knows what other amazing players coming up (Anthony Davis, etc)?

Kawhi is a great piece to build with, as is Splitter. But they're going to need a better franchise player eventually. Al Jeff and Bosh are not the answer when Duncan is gone. Spurs should look at Al Horford or Greg Monroe, imo, and even they're not quite the answer. Might even take a losing season or two to truly rebuild, which would be the first lottery pick in nearly two decades.

Will the Spurs be able to retain their depth is the question. Diaw can't play forever and neither can Manu.
If the question wasn't serious to you, why couldn't you answer it?

The obvious implication is that Gin won't have anything left, next year. Parker won't be able to play good games back to back. Duncan not there. If they win it all, it would be moreso on Pop, no matter how much better Leonard got or the quality center replacement. Outside of Embiid, Unibrow and DH, there are no great centers or defensive anchors. If they win it all it would be on Pop.

Neither Parker, Gin and even Duncan could be counted on for good games LAST YEAR. And they should have won it all.

[Upgrayedd]

When Duncan retires, Poppovich is leaving too and so is Ginobili. Spurs would go into rebuild mode and probably build around Parker, Leonard and Green.

[DMAVS41]

Well when did he start to decline? Seven years ago or this year? They certainly had a great chance to win it last year when they were one mistake away in game six.

that's the point...a great coach and system can only take you so far. you need a true superstar almost always (often 2) to win in the NBA.

Duncan was a true superstar through the 09 season in my opinion and more than capable those seasons, but just had some bad luck and tough opponents.

He was an elite force last year...and it's no coincidence that it was the best Spurs team in years and like you said....one play away.

The point is that a great coach and system can get you wins in the regular season. But wins in the playoffs are totally different.

[DMAVS41]

If the question wasn't serious to you, why couldn't you answer it?

The obvious implication is that Gin won't have anything left, next year. Parker won't be able to play good games back to back. Duncan not there. If they win it all, it would be moreso on Pop, no matter how much better Leonard got or the quality center replacement. Outside of Embiid, Unibrow and DH, there are no great centers or defensive anchors. If they win it all it would be on Pop.

Neither Parker, Gin and even Duncan could be counted on for good games LAST YEAR. And they should have won it all.

Because the competition they faced was weak. Think about it...they lucked out with the Westbrook injury and then got to play a good Grizzlies team that they matched up really well against...and then faced and injured/slumping Heat team.

Maybe people will read your post, which is accurate by the way about how some of the spurs weren't that consistent or good, and finally come around to understanding that the 13 Spurs and 13 Heat were not that great...especially by the time of the finals for the Spurs.

[DonDadda59]

So replacing a 38 year old Duncan with a prime Bosh or Jefferson and them winning means said old as dirt Timmy is overrated?

If a 38 year Shaq (who was nowhere remotely near as effective as Duncan is now) was replaced by a prime Dwight Howard and Boston had won the championship, would that mean Shaq's GOAT standing would be negatively affected?

Think before you type, people. :facepalm

[Pointguard]

So replacing a 38 year old Duncan with a prime Bosh or Jefferson and them winning means said old as dirt Timmy is overrated?

If a 38 year Shaq (who was nowhere remotely near as effective as Duncan is now) was replaced by a prime Dwight Howard and Boston had won the championship, would that mean Shaq's GOAT standing would be negatively affected?

Think before you type, people. :facepalm

If you were thinking, you would see its a question based on a trio winning while none of them were playing great. The rest of the stuff you brought to the table.

[Pointguard]

Because the competition they faced was weak. Think about it...they lucked out with the Westbrook injury and then got to play a good Grizzlies team that they matched up really well against...and then faced and injured/slumping Heat team.

Maybe people will read your post, which is accurate by the way about how some of the spurs weren't that consistent or good, and finally come around to understanding that the 13 Spurs and 13 Heat were not that great...especially by the time of the finals for the Spurs.
At what point do we not say that for any other year? It might be different if SA never won back to backs.

[SCdac]

Neither Parker, Gin and even Duncan could be counted on for good games LAST YEAR. And they should have won it all.

I'm not even sure what that means.

Parker, Manu, and Tim scored 3,000+ points in the regular season and 1,000+ points in the post season last year.

That's 39% of regular season points and 50% of post season points coming from 3 players.. yet they're "not being counted on for good games"?

You would think Pop himself is putting on a uniform and playing all 5 positions by some of yalls assertions :facepalm

Give credit to the General Manager of the Spurs, RC Buford, he's compiled one of the deepest teams of the last two seasons. It helps to have a team full of good players for a coach to play around with.

Could Pop take the current Timberwolves to the championship past the OKC/Heat? Could he take the Bobcats to a championship? If not, why?

[Pointguard]

I'm not even sure what that means.

Parker, Manu, and Tim scored 3,000+ points in the regular season and 1,000+ points in the post season last year.

That's 39% of regular season points and 50% of post season points coming from 3 players.. yet they're "not being counted on for good games"?
Oh, so Gin averaged 12ppg and due to weird mathematics this means he could be counted on for good games? Do you know what counted on means? I don't care about mass volume of three players, that hides and disguises many ills. Wilt scored more than 4000 points by himself so you could say he and 2 other players scored 5000 points and that that player never had a bad game?


You would think Pop himself is putting on a uniform and playing all 5 positions by some of yalls assertions :facepalm

Give credit to the General Manager of the Spurs, RC Buford, he's compiled one of the deepest teams of the last two seasons. It helps to have a team full of good players for a coach to play around with.

Could Pop take the current Timberwolves to the championship past the OKC/Heat? Could he take the Bobcats to a championship? If not, why?
Pop gets more out of 10 players than any coach ever. That's what I'm talking about. I never said the GM wasn't good but name me another coach that converts marginal players into solid contributors. I don't care what a GM does, you aren't getting 10 contributors on his merits. That's on the coach. And its a shame you can watch them year after year and not know this.

[Legends66NBA7]

SA gets either Bosh or Al Jefferson and wins its all...

Would you lower Duncan's GOAT position in favor of Pop's coaching?

No, I would not.

[Pointguard]

No, I would not.
Thanks, I'm with you on that sentiment. Except if it happened for two or three years.

[DMAVS41]

At what point do we not say that for any other year? It might be different if SA never won back to backs.

You should. Some of the Spurs titles like 07 they faced an unbelievably easy road.

That absolutely should be mentioned, but it doesn't change how good they were. From 03 through 07 they were pretty damn great. They just had to face a couple tough teams. It's not like they lost a lot in those 5 years...they lost 2 series. One to the loaded Lakers on a the Fisher huge shot and another to the Dirk led Mavs with Dirk having an all time great last 5 games to that series of 30/15/4 69% TS and an amazing 37/15/2 game 7.

They were literally the fisher .4 shot and the horrible manu foul from having a real chance at a 5 peat. No need to play revisionist history though, but the point is that the 03 through really 08 Spurs are under-rated.

[tpols]

You should. Some of the Spurs titles like 07 they faced an unbelievably easy road.

That absolutely should be mentioned.

Do you think the 2013 spurs couldve won in 07 with duncan replaced by say.. current Marc Gasol?

[DMAVS41]

Do you think the 2013 spurs couldve won in 07 with duncan replaced by say.. current Marc Gasol?

Yea...I do. Don't think it's a lock, but yea...

[Pointguard]

You should. Some of the Spurs titles like 07 they faced an unbelievably easy road.

That absolutely should be mentioned, but it doesn't change how good they were. From 03 through 07 they were pretty damn great. They just had to face a couple tough teams. It's not like they lost a lot in those 5 years...they lost 2 series. One to the loaded Lakers on a the Fisher huge shot and another to the Dirk led Mavs with Dirk having an all time great last 5 games to that series of 30/15/4 69% TS and an amazing 37/15/2 game 7.

They were literally the fisher .4 shot and the horrible manu foul from having a real chance at a 5 peat. No need to play revisionist history though, but the point is that the 03 through really 08 Spurs are under-rated.

Yeah, its a fragile thing... Duncan ranks very high for me because he was a winner. I only have three players where winning weighs in heavy enough for two or three positions in a top ten GOAT list and Duncan is one of them, I have him above Shaq because of that. Shaq was a more dominant player. Shaq caused more problems. With most non-great coaches I would pick Shaq before Duncan. Shaq could be the defensive anchor that Duncan was in a lot of cases. I only give Duncan the better teammate and better team player edge - off the top of my head. I think most people have it really tight when it comes to Shaq, Hakeem, Duncan, Kobe, Bird and a few others in their top ten GOAT list.

Duncan with two rings isn't above Hakeem to me. Duncan's ability to be in the mix year in and year out is a great element to his game. But if I found out that Pop was some super coach that could win without a HOF player, it could affect how I rank Duncan.