Kobe Bryant ‘Jealous’ Of Tim Duncan

[$LakerGold]

[QUOTE]

[pastis]

kobe is right, but kobe has to think, that he had the honour to play with jackson and win his rings with him. and i think phil plays an important role in winning the rings.

same of course with duncan and popovic (and super stacked team).

if kobe is mad, what should DIRK be, or DURANT?

[IllegalD]

He should be jealous of LeBron. Having no less than 2 other HOFs for all of his rings. Playing in a historically shit Leastern Conference for his whole career.

[TheMarkMadsen]

he's played with Pop his entire career, Kobe had a lot of years with Phil (and made the most of them) while Kobe has had to go through some not so GOAT coaches..

[pastis]

He should be jealous of LeBron. Having no less than 2 other HOFs for all of his rings. Playing in a historically shit Leastern Conference for his whole career.

exactly. in my opinion, you should remove at least 10.000 points from lebron or wade of their scoring-list, cause playing their whole career in the weak EC. more rest, easy points, super easy playoffs...damn heaven for all wild west players

[jstern]

Pop is so humble. I remember back in 1999 after winning the champion him completely taking the credit away from himself saying that any coach would have won it with Tim. And that stuck with me for years, that he was just a regular coach, until realizing that's not the case.

[JohnFreeman]

Shouldn't swallow the salary cap and then he could be competing for rings ever year :confusedshrug:

[kamil]

He should be jealous of LeBron. Having no less than 2 other HOFs for all of his rings. Playing in a historically shit Leastern Conference for his whole career.

Don't forget the injuries too.

[jstern]

exactly. in my opinion, you should remove at least 10.000 points from lebron or wade of their scoring-list, cause playing their whole career in the weak EC. more rest, easy points, super easy playoffs...damn heaven for all wild west players

Kobe should be happy about how bad the East is, can you imagine his Finals 40% FG percentage? We should take off 10% off, and like 7 PPG to his average. And probably 3 rings.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Don't forget the injuries too.
Do you even rep a team man? I don't think I've ever seen you post about basketball unless it's to hate LeBron. I don't ever recall seeing you in Laker threads that weren't Kobe vs. LeBron threads

[pastis]

Kobe should be happy about how bad the East is, can you imagine his Finals 40% FG percentage? We should take off 10% off, and like 7 PPG to his average. And probably 3 rings.

what is wrong. i was talking about the EC in general. i never said, that there wasn't always one good team in the east, reaching the finals and able to compete with the WCF champion. but they never had to go through the same tough playoffs and were way more rested. problem officer?:biggums:

[IllegalD]

Kobe should be happy about how bad the East is, can you imagine his Finals 40% FG percentage? We should take off 10% off, and like 7 PPG to his average. And probably 3 rings.

:wtf:

Just because the Conference is shit overall doesn't mean the top 1-2 teams are. 2010 Celtics are better than any team LeFraud has ever beat in the finals.* The 2000s Spurs in the midst of their dynasty with a prime Duncan is greater than any team LeBron has faced EVER.

[kamil]

Do you even rep a team man? I don't think I've ever seen you post about basketball unless it's to hate LeBron. I don't ever recall seeing you in Laker threads that weren't Kobe vs. LeBron threads

Yeah, I'm a Bucks fan.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Duncan was in a terrific situation since his 1st year one of the luckiest players ever.

[pastis]

:wtf:

Just because the Conference is shit overall doesn't mean the top 1-2 teams are. 2010 Celtics are better than any team LeFraud has ever beat in the finals.* The 2000s Spurs in the midst of their dynasty with a prime Duncan is greater than any team LeBron has faced EVER.

i agree with you except last words.

Dirk 2011. thx.

[9erempiree]

Jealous is going to jealous. All players in the history of basketball are probably jealous of Duncan.

This guy is like Brady and Belichik. They came up together.

[kennethgriffin]

imagine if kobe had a good coach for all 18 years instead of just 11

**** harris

**** rambis

**** rudy

**** hamblin

**** brown

and **** d'antoni



but still.. kobe did more with phil in just 11 years than duncans accomplished with pop...

[jstern]

what is wrong. i was talking about the EC in general. i never said, that there wasn't always one good team in the east, reaching the finals and able to compete with the WCF champion. but they never had to go through the same tough playoffs and were way more rested. problem officer?:biggums:


:wtf:

Just because the Conference is shit overall doesn't mean the top 1-2 teams are. 2010 Celtics are better than any team LeFraud has ever beat in the finals.* The 2000s Spurs in the midst of their dynasty with a prime Duncan is greater than any team LeBron has faced EVER.

That magic team was rather disappointing, and that Celtic team was like the 5th seed in the East. What about the Nets and the 76rs?

[IllegalD]

That magic team was rather disappointing, and that Celtic team was like the 5th seed in the East. What about the Nets and the 76rs?

What about the 2000s Spurs, one of the greatest dynasties of all time with Duncan still in his prime?

The 2010 Celts are a 4 HOF team that were only one year removed from being championships. Not like 7 years removed like last years Spurs.

The 2004 Pistons are one of the greatest defensive teams of all time.

The 2000 Blazers are one of the most stacked teams to never win it all.

ANd the countless 50+ quality teams that Kobe had to go through JUST to GET to the Finals.

The 2011 Mavs are a one superstar team that no-one saw winning it all.

[eliteballer]

The 2004 Spurs are better than any team LeBron or Jordan beat.

[Akrazotile]

Kobe is the MJ of insecurity.

[Verticality]

Duncan Jealous that he never played with a player better than himself like Kobe did.

[Verticality]

but still.. kobe did more with Shaq/phil in just 11 years than duncans accomplished with pop

Fixed

[IllegalD]

Fixed

Shaq wasn't there for 05-10 :confusedshrug:

[JohnFreeman]

http://assets.espn.go.com/i/nba/spursplayoffs2014_900.png

[bdreason]

He should've kept passing the ball to Shaq and maybe Phil would have hung around a little longer.

[Verticality]

Shaq wasn't there for 05-10 :confusedshrug:

Right, but without Shaq, Kobe hasn't done more than Duncan. Kobe deserved his 2 rings in 09 and 10, but Kobe wasn't good enough to win championships in the early 2000s without a guy like Shaq.

[jstern]

What about the 2000s Spurs, one of the greatest dynasties of all time with Duncan still in his prime?

The 2010 Celts are a 4 HOF team that were only one year removed from being championships. Not like 7 years removed like last years Spurs.

The 2004 Pistons are one of the greatest defensive teams of all time.

The 2000 Blazers are one of the most stacked teams to never win it all.

ANd the countless 50+ quality teams that Kobe had to go through JUST to GET to the Finals.

The 2011 Mavs are a one superstar team that no-one saw winning it all.
I responded to someone who said that they should take 10,000 points from Lebron's career total because he played in the East, and to mock the ridiculousness of what he said I said that they should take % points off Kobe's FG%, and lower his PPG, etc in the Finals since he mostly played against weak East teams. So I don't know why you're talking about the strong West teams when the discussion is about how weak the East is vs the West. Need to focus better on what the argument is and not let the defensive, sensitive fanboy emotion take over.


Kobe is the MJ of insecurity.

That's a funny dis.

[IllegalD]

Right, but without Shaq, Kobe hasn't done more than Duncan. Kobe deserved his 2 rings in 09 and 10, but Kobe wasn't good enough to win championships in the early 2000s without a guy like Shaq.

Actually.. Kobe won 2 as the man without Shaq, yet Shaq never won one as the man without Kobe. Seems to me that Shaq is the one that was left with something to prove, while the 2 "the man" rings validate Kobe's role in the first 3 with Shaq.

[Keno]

hahahhahahahhahahhahahah no one sees the irony in his ****ing tweet? kobe is more delusional than his fans. meanwhile we have lebron dragging an asian video coordinator to rings.

[IllegalD]

hahahhahahahhahahhahahah no one sees the irony in his ****ing tweet? kobe is more delusional than his fans. meanwhile we have lebron dragging an asian video coordinator to rings.

And more HOFs than Kobe ever needed to win his rings.

Even Rashard Lewis was more all-star appearances than Lamar Odom, and half the amount of Gasol. :lol

[Keno]

Do you even rep a team man? I don't think I've ever seen you post about basketball unless it's to hate LeBron. I don't ever recall seeing you in Laker threads that weren't Kobe vs. LeBron threads

he's a jordan/chicago stan. if you haven't noticed by now most jordan stans, if not all hate lebron because they know lebron is going to pass jordan soon. shit, even jordan himself hates lebron and cries in his sleep thinking about the day it happens.

[Keno]

And more HOFs than Kobe ever needed to win his rings.

Even Rashard Lewis was more all-star appearances than Lamar Odom, and half the amount of Gasol. :lol

phil jackson and the most dominant front court in the nba > any team in the league. you're comparing roided up, 35 year old lewis to prime odom and gasol? kobe stans are really a special kind of retard.

[IllegalD]

phil jackson and the most dominant front court in the nba > any team in the league.

Wade (LeBron's 2nd option): 10 All-Star Selections
Bosh (LeBron's 3rd option): 9 All-Star Selections
Ray Allen (LeBron's 4th option): 10 All-Star Selections

Just for shits and giggles:

Rashard Lewis (benchwarmer): 2 All-Star Selections

LeBron Supporting Cast Total All-Star Selections: 31

Gasol (Kobe's 2nd option): 4 All-Star Selections
Lamar Odom (Kobe's 3rd option): 0 All-Star Selections
Ron Artest (Kobe's 4th option): 1 All-Star Selection

Kobe's Supporting Cast Total All-Star Selections: 5


Kobe's HOF teammates (that actually contributed, no Mitch Richmond f*cks) for 5 rings: Shaq, Gasol (2)

LeBron's HOF teammates for 2 rings: Wade, Bosh, Jesus (3)

[Myth]

Actually.. Kobe won 2 as the man without Shaq, yet Shaq never won one as the man without Kobe. Seems to me that Shaq is the one that was left with something to prove, while the 2 "the man" rings validate Kobe's role in the first 3 with Shaq.

Shaq was clearly the man from 2000-02. Well deserved FMVPs.

[Myth]

phil jackson and the most dominant front court in the nba > any team in the league. you're comparing roided up, 35 year old lewis to prime odom and gasol? kobe stans are really a special kind of retard.

This.

[step_back]

Shouldn't swallow the salary cap and then he could be competing for rings ever year :confusedshrug:

I think Kobe is great but I completely agree with you. Take less money and bring in better players. He's only got two years left in the league and it's not like he hasn't made a ton already.

[16X]

Shouldn't swallow the salary cap and then he could be competing for rings ever year :confusedshrug:
Competing for titles while playing only a handful of games the entire season? Dumbass. Competing for titles while coming back a shell of himself next season? Dumbass.

[JohnFreeman]

Competing for titles while playing only a handful of games the entire season? Dumbass. Competing for titles while coming back a shell of himself next season? Dumbass.
So then why does he deserve that contract?

[Droid101]

"Prime Odom." :roll:

Literally one year removed from being a crack addict who can't get a minimum contract.

Kobe haters are despicable idiots.

[16X]

I think Kobe is great but I completely agree with you. Take less money and bring in better players. He's only got two years left in the league and it's not like he hasn't made a ton already.
Half of that is going to belong to his whore wife soon enough. I applaud Kobe for taking the money :applause: He deserves it.

This is Kobe's farewell tour. He just had an almost career ending injury, then came back and got injured again, and n*ggas on here are talking about Kobe taking less money so he can get a Robin and be FMVP again. Damn, that shows you how great Kobe actually is. Almost just ended his career and his haters are talking about him still being able to win a ring as the man if only he took less :oldlol:

[16X]

So then why does he deserve that contract?
Because Kobe = ratings and profits if he's playing, no matter how much the team sucks. I know he hasn't been playing, but you pay the man and take that risk when he's such a money maker for the organization.

I'm not worried about winning titles. The Lakers have just been in 7 Finals. I'm not a greedy fan. I'm fine with sucking for a while. The Lakers are going to be like Jordan's Wizards next season, and that's actually not such a bad thing in my opinion. There's a very good chance Kobe goes down again and is out for the season, so if he's surrounded by sh*t teammates, at least we can tank hard once he goes down, and get an even better draft pick next year.

[T_L_P]

That's what happens when the players and coaches trust, respect and love each other.

Kobe knows the deal. He's perhaps the most selfish player in league history. Sometimes it works for him, but sometimes it doesn't. I'm pretty sure Popovich would have had problems with him if he were drafted by the Spurs (not that he'd play a minute there anyway).

[gts]

Only on ISH does Kobe complementing a person turn into am issue :lol

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Funny comments by Kobe, considering he ran Phil off in 2004.

Phil got so pissed at Kobe, he called him "UNCOACHABLE"

[DwnShft2Xcelr8]

Kobe: "I'm jealous of Tim Duncan."

Will you take less money so the Lakers can build a contender around you for the next few years, the same way the Spurs have done for Timmy?

Kobe: "No, I want the money. It's management's concern how they sign great players around my enormous contract, but they better find championship caliber players + championship caliber coach."

Don't you think that'd all be easier if you stopped being so concerned about your bank account?

Kobe: "No. My wife has grown accustomed to diamond accessories, like earrings and bracelets. I have to keep affording them until I die if I want her to stay with me. Vanessa, please!"

[IGOTGAME]

But for Mike DAntoni, Kobe would not have torn that tendon. This will always be my opinion.

[Mr Feeny]

Funny comments by Kobe, considering he ran Phil off in 2004.

Phil got so pissed at Kobe, he called him "UNCOACHABLE"This. You can sense the envy and bitterness. I can just picture him on his couch crying his eyes out and seething with anger as Lebron and Duncan continue to add to their legacies and leave him in dust, while he's at the end of the road, seemingly destined to end his career with a whimper
:oldlol:

[ArbitraryWater]

Spurs Graphic

Sick Graphic... although Duncan was injured in 2000, not 2001.

[ArbitraryWater]

Only on ISH does Kobe complementing a person turn into am issue :lol

Really, gts? Who is he complementing? He's stupidly taking away from what Timmy has achieved, not even seeming to realize how fortunate he has been during a large span of HIS career... you don't see that, at all? Put your bias aside for once. I know you can.

[3LiftHeatCurse]

This. You can sense the envy and bitterness. I can just picture him on his couch crying his eyes out and seething with anger as Lebron and Duncan continue to add to their legacies and leave him in dust, while he's at the end of the road, seemingly destined to end his career with a whimper
:oldlol:


Bryant told Jackson that O'Neal's presence on the team would affect his decision to stay with the Lakers, adding, "I'm tired of being a sidekick," Jackson wrote.

Jackson wrote he became so frustrated with Bryant that he told general manager Mitch Kupchak in January, "I won't coach this team next year if he is still here. He won't listen to anyone. I've had it with this kid."

"It's no sweat for me, man," Bryant said. "He's a great coach. I really learned a lot from him and I respect him from that standpoint. But this is a new challenge for me here, so I'm not going to belabor what somebody might say from past events."

----------

Phil leaves, Shaq is traded, all due to Kobe. Eventually, the Lakers beg Phil Jackson to return to coaching the Lakers, once Kobe realizes how much he needs Phil.


Fast forward to Kobe in 2014 : "im so jealous of u timmy, omg man u had the same coach for your whole career!"

[DMV2]

Kobe is such an insecure little fggot, acting like Pop somewhat made Duncan. It wasn't like Pop was a 6-time champion head coach when Duncan arrived in '97.

Just like he said how he had to sacrifice his game when he played with Shaq. Nigguh you was still a chucking selfish piece of shit. Just be glad Shaq gave you 3 rings before age 25. You ungrateful fcking fggot!

Thank God this piece of shit of a rapist's career is over now.

[DMV2]

Duncan was in a terrific situation since his 1st year one of the luckiest players ever.
You can say the same thing about Pop being so lucky to start his head coaching career with Duncan AKA the greatest PF ever.

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Kobe is such an insecure little fggot, acting like Pop somewhat made Duncan. It wasn't like Pop was a 6-time champion head coach when Duncan arrived in '97.

Just like he said how he had to sacrifice his game when he played with Shaq. Nigguh you was still a chucking selfish piece of shit. Just be glad Shaq gave you 3 rings before age 25. You ungrateful fcking fggot!

Thank God this piece of shit of a rapist's career is over now.

Exactly how I feel. That little shitstain was given everything by the Lakers.

The Lakers had to pull off the most lopsided trade in NBA history with the Kwame Brown for Pau Gasol trade, in order for Kobe to get 2 rings as "the leader" so he wouldn't be seen as Shaq's sidekick for the rest of his career.

This guy's statistics even prove he's just a 45% fg chucker. He's the most unlikeable and most overrated "star" I've ever seen in any sport. Glad he's done already because I couldn't stand to watch the game of basketball be sullied with this guy. He was completely undeserving of everything he received.

[gts]

Really, gts? Who is he complementing? He's stupidly taking away from what Timmy has achieved, not even seeming to realize how fortunate he has been during a large span of HIS career... you don't see that, at all? Put your bias aside for once. I know you can.:rolleyes:

Read the entire article by Mark Stein on ESPN, read how the quote was framed then get back to me..

Like I said only on ISH can calling somebody a "historically great coach" be fighting words

[DMV2]

Exactly how I feel. That little shitstain was given everything by the Lakers.

The Lakers had to pull off the most lopsided trade in NBA history with the Kwame Brown for Pau Gasol trade, in order for Kobe to get 2 rings as "the leader" so he wouldn't be seen as Shaq's sidekick for the rest of his career.

This guy's statistics even prove he's just a 45% fg chucker. He's the most unlikeable and most overrated "star" I've ever seen in any sport. Glad he's done already because I couldn't stand to watch the game of basketball be sullied with this guy. He was completely undeserving of everything he received.
Couldn't say it better myself.

The selfish bastard been baby'd by the league since draft night. :cry: I can't play for Charlotte, I need the entire spotlight on me, gimme Los Angeles Lakers ONLY! :cry:

[DonDadda59]

Bryant told Jackson that O'Neal's presence on the team would affect his decision to stay with the Lakers, adding, "I'm tired of being a sidekick," Jackson wrote.

Jackson wrote he became so frustrated with Bryant that he told general manager Mitch Kupchak in January, "I won't coach this team next year if he is still here. He won't listen to anyone. I've had it with this kid."

"It's no sweat for me, man," Bryant said. "He's a great coach. I really learned a lot from him and I respect him from that standpoint. But this is a new challenge for me here, so I'm not going to belabor what somebody might say from past events."

----------

Phil leaves, Shaq is traded, all due to Kobe. Eventually, the Lakers beg Phil Jackson to return to coaching the Lakers, once Kobe realizes how much he needs Phil.


Fast forward to Kobe in 2014 : "im so jealous of u timmy, omg man u had the same coach!"

Yeah it seems age has not given Bean any sort of perspective. He more or less chased Phil out of LA with his diva ways and his prime suffered because of it (34-48 record + missed playoffs his first season post Phil/Shaq). And now he refuses to give management any sort of maneuvering ability because he's eating through salary cap despite playing a handful of games this past season.

Dude just seems completely oblivious.


Only on ISH does Kobe complementing a person turn into am issue :lol

That's as backhanded a 'compliment' as you can get. A real compliment would've been something along the lines of 'Congratulations to Pop and Tim, you guys have been an great duo since the late 90s'. Instead, with his comments he comes across as bitter for something he had a large hand in creating (being difficult to deal with in his younger years, crippling the franchise financially despite being washed up now). Plus he just threw every coach he played for, not counting Phil, under the bus.

Hell of a compliment :applause:

[ArbitraryWater]

"im so jealous of u timmy, omg man u had the same coach!"

same coach? what?

[longtime lurker]

Only on ISH does Kobe complementing a person turn into am issue :lol

These losers have a permanent hard on for Kobe :lol

[ArbitraryWater]

These losers have a permanent hard on for Kobe :lol

I know right.. what the **** is he talking about?

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Yeah it seems age has not given Bean any sort of perspective. He more or less chased Phil out of LA with his diva ways and his prime suffered because of it (34-48 record + missed playoffs his first season post Phil/Shaq). And now he refuses to give management any sort of maneuvering ability because he's eating through salary cap despite playing a handful of games this past season.

Dude just seems completely oblivious.



That's as backhanded a 'compliment' as you can get. A real compliment would've been something along the lines of 'Congratulations to Pop and Tim, you guys have been an great duo since the late 90s'. Instead, with his comments he comes across as bitter for something he had a large hand in creating (being difficult to deal with in his younger years, crippling the franchise financially despite being washed up now). Plus he just threw every coach he played for, not counting Phil, under the bus.

Hell of a compliment :applause:

Yep. He's always been a piece of shit.

I remember back years ago, he used to say "I never really liked Michael Jordan, my favorite player was Magic"...... while at the same time, wearing Jordan jerseys when he was a teenager... and having a room in his house with hundreds of VHS tapes of every game jordan ever played so he could study them and copy him...... yeah, "I never really liked jordan" sure thing..... or how about getting arrested for rape and then when in the police station, he brings up "Shaq pays for sex" as a way to get the police to arrest Shaq for prostitution.....he's a sociopath.

We all know he raped that girl, but the chick accepted that $$$ payday and so she settled out of court with Kobe.


This comment by Kobe is in league with everything he is as a person. A piece of shit.

[Mr Feeny]

Bryant told Jackson that O'Neal's presence on the team would affect his decision to stay with the Lakers, adding, "I'm tired of being a sidekick," Jackson wrote.

Jackson wrote he became so frustrated with Bryant that he told general manager Mitch Kupchak in January, "I won't coach this team next year if he is still here. He won't listen to anyone. I've had it with this kid."

"It's no sweat for me, man," Bryant said. "He's a great coach. I really learned a lot from him and I respect him from that standpoint. But this is a new challenge for me here, so I'm not going to belabor what somebody might say from past events."

----------

Phil leaves, Shaq is traded, all due to Kobe. Eventually, the Lakers beg Phil Jackson to return to coaching the Lakers, once Kobe realizes how much he needs Phil.


Fast forward to Kobe in 2014 : "im so jealous of u timmy, omg man u had the same coach for your whole career!"

It's laughable isnt it:oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

Kobe :facepalm


You would have had the same all time great coach from 99 through present if you weren't such a ****ing horrible teammate and ego driven maniac.

[chazzy]

Kobe :facepalm


You would have had the same all time great coach from 99 through present if you weren't such a ****ing horrible teammate and ego driven maniac.
Jackson wouldn't have retired in '11 if Kobe was nice? He and the team seemed burnt out more than anything. He only left for 05 prior to that.

2011 Phil just seemed old and done with coaching in general. He would've gone to another team if he still had it in him.. the only time he was in the mix to coach again was for.. the Lakers.. last year

[Mr Feeny]

Jackson wouldn't have retired in '11 if Kobe was nice? He and the team seemed burnt out more than anything. He only left for 05 prior to that.

2011 Phil just seemed old and done with coaching in general. He would've gone to another team if he still had it in him.. the only time he was in the mix to coach again was for.. the Lakers.. last year

He was talking about 2004. That's fairly obvious, and he's right too.

[chazzy]

He was talking about 2004That' fairly obvious, and he's right too.
Poor Kobe, didnt have Phil in one injury plagued year with a bad roster :oldlol:

That's not what Kobe's referring to.

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Jackson wouldn't have retired in '11 if Kobe was nice? He and the team seemed burnt out more than anything. He only left for 05 prior to that.

2011 Phil just seemed old and done with coaching in general. He would've gone to another team if he still had it in him.. the only time he was in the mix to coach again was for.. the Lakers.. last year

Then maybe the Lakers should have tried for a homegrown new coach that was younger, and wouldn't be too old by 2011.

Instead, they went for a proven GOAT coach with 6 championships, who already had his legacy with Michael Jordan the GOAT player. I guess they needed the best of the best to win anything with Kobe on the roster

At least LeBron is following the Jordan route. Winning chips with a new, homegrown coach in Spoelstra who had 0 head coaching rings, and will eventually enter into the Hall of Fame as a coach thanks to Bron. And Spo will not be too old to coach Bron when Bron is 36.

Maybe in the year 2023, when LeBron is retired, the Lakers will chase Coach Spoelstra, coach of 6 rings with Bron, for $10million a year and the cycle repeats itself.

Lakers are just a mercenary organization. They hire outside proven coaches and players to win anything. The only homegrown guys they have ever had were Jerry West and Magic Johnson.

[DMAVS41]

Jackson wouldn't have retired in '11 if Kobe was nice? He and the team seemed burnt out more than anything. He only left for 05 prior to that.

2011 Phil just seemed old and done with coaching in general. He would've gone to another team if he still had it in him.. the only time he was in the mix to coach again was for.. the Lakers.. last year

Who knows...considering Phil wanted back in as recently as 13...maybe he just needed a 1 year break.

The point is that if Kobe was the type of teammate, person, and player that Duncan was...he could easily have had his all time great coach for every relevant year of his career.

And we all know it...not enough is made of this here. Acting like Duncan lucked out to have Pop stay all these years. Pop stayed and vice versa for Duncan because of each other. Pop knew coaching Duncan would never be a problem...he'd do what was best for the team over any individual goals and things he wanted to prove. This is a real thing...

[chazzy]

Then maybe the Lakers should have tried for a homegrown new coach that was younger, and wouldn't be too old by 2011.

Instead, they went for a proven GOAT coach with 6 championships, who already had his legacy with Michael Jordan the GOAT player. I guess they needed the best of the best to win anything with Kobe on the roster

At least LeBron is following the Jordan route. Winning chips with a new, homegrown coach in Spoelstra who had 0 head coaching rings, and will eventually enter into the Hall of Fame as a coach thanks to Bron. And Spo will not be too old to coach Bron when Bron is 36.
Huh? Phil helped them get to 3 straight finals prior to 2011. Everything has an expiration date. What are you even saying

[Bandito]

Jackson wouldn't have retired in '11 if Kobe was nice? He and the team seemed burnt out more than anything. He only left for 05 prior to that.

2011 Phil just seemed old and done with coaching in general. He would've gone to another team if he still had it in him.. the only time he was in the mix to coach again was for.. the Lakers.. last year
he was talking 05 and 06...

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Huh? Phil helped them get to 3 straight finals prior to 2011. Everything has an expiration date. What are you even saying

At what point in time did Phil have 6 championship rings?

Not hard to figure out what I am saying. How old are you?

[chazzy]

Who knows...considering Phil wanted back in as recently as 13...maybe he just needed a 1 year break.

The point is that if Kobe was the type of teammate, person, and player that Duncan was...he could easily have had his all time great coach for every relevant year of his career.

And we all know it...
He pretty much did! :oldlol: 05 was a down year for both he and the Lakers so it wasn't relevant. Phil retired due to being old and tired for 2012 and then tried to come back in 2013.. to the Lakers! And they hired Mike instead.

[Mr Feeny]

Poor Kobe, didnt have Phil in one injury plagued year with a bad roster :oldlol:

That's not what Kobe's referring to.

Ah! Alrighty then. Having a 6 time championship coach from 2000-2011 is a pitiful situation isnt it! As opposed to Duncan who got a coach that had never won a thing before!

Solid logic here. Top notch stuff.

[chazzy]

Ah! Alrighty then. Having a 6 time championship coach from 2000-2011 is a pitiful situation isnt it! As opposed to Duncan who got a coach that had never won a thing before!

Solid logic here. Top notch stuff.
I've never said I felt bad for Kobe's coaching situation..?

[Mr Feeny]

At what point in time did Phil have 6 championship rings?

Not hard to figure out what I am saying. How old are you?

:oldlol:
He doesn't know his history, this young chap.

[DMAVS41]

He pretty much did! :oldlol: 05 was a down year for both he and the Lakers so it wasn't relevant. Phil retired due to being old and tired for 2012 and then tried to come back in 2013.. to the Lakers! And they hired Mike instead.

The point is that I don't think Kobe loses out on 05 through 07 without being the kind of selfish player and teammate he was overall...

But yes...Kobe really doesn't have a leg to stand on here as he's had an all time great coach for pretty much every relevant year of his career.

[Mr Feeny]

I've never said I felt bad for Kobe's coaching situation..?
No. Kobe Bryant did. He's sulking comparing his coaching situation to Duncan's. And that's what we are discussing.

[chazzy]

The point is that I don't think Kobe loses out on 05 through 07 without being the kind of selfish player and teammate he was overall...

He had Phil in 06 and 07

[3LiftHeatCurse]

He had Phil in 06 and 07

Only to then pout and refuse to shoot in a Game 7 vs the Suns to "prove a point"

[T_L_P]

I honestly thought it was common knowledge that Kobe is one of the worst teammates in league history. Shaq and Phil (the two most important people in his career) had huge issues with him, as did other former teammates and I believe Rudy T as well.

How are people arguing this?

[DMAVS41]

He had Phil in 06 and 07

I know he did man...I'm talking about losing out on a chance to contend...not just about Phil

The point is that Kobe is very much responsible, as is Phil and Shaq and ownership, for what the Lakers did from 03 through 07.

I personally blame Kobe the most. I think his huge ego and unwillingness to do what was best for the team (something Duncan gladly does) really hurt what the Lakers were able to accomplish during those 5 years.

Put it this way...if it was Duncan on the Lakers those 5 years...I think they would have made it all work...and never had a stretch in which the Lakers missed the playoffs and then lost in the first round back to back times in the heart of his prime/peak. Duncan/Phil would have figured out a way to keep it going...

[chazzy]

I know he did man...I'm talking about losing out on a chance to contend...not just about Phil

The point is that Kobe is very much responsible, as is Phil and Shaq and ownership, for what the Lakers did from 03 through 07.

I personally blame Kobe the most. I think his huge ego and unwillingness to do what was best for the team (something Duncan gladly does) really hurt what the Lakers were able to accomplish during those 5 years.
That's a different topic and not what your intitial post said

[ArbitraryWater]

That's a different topic and not what your intitial post said

:rolleyes:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Everyone was jealous of Kobe who played with prime Shaq and PJax.

Much of the reason Lebron teamed up with Bosh/Wade

[DMAVS41]

That's a different topic and not what your intitial post said

My initial post said that Kobe would have had him for every single year of his career if he was more like Duncan. I guess I should change that to say....

Kobe, you would have had Phil Jackson from 99 through at least 11 and then likely 13 and beyond if you were the kind of selfless person and teammate Duncan was. Who knows how much history changes if Phil/Shaq stay on for 05.

This all comes down to the post 04 stuff.

I blame Kobe the most....especially for Phil leaving. He had had enough and the team had to go from legit title contender to fringe playoff contender because of the kind of selfish ego maniac Kobe was.

[T_L_P]

Kobe is a cutthroat guy. It's what made him popular around the world and adored by the youth.

We can't have it both ways. He's a shitty leader and a shitty teammate. His teams have been irrelevant every year that Phil Jackson -- the real leader -- was not there.

[Mr Feeny]

I honestly thought it was common knowledge that Kobe is one of the worst teammates in league history. Shaq and Phil (the two most important people in his career) had huge issues with him, as did other former teammates and I believe Rudy T as well.

How are people arguing this?

It beats me. When Phil Jackson himself calls you un-coachable and refuses to return to the team due to your presence, you know that you are the sticking point. And then to denigrate Duncan's accomplishments by sulking about his 'relatively enviable coaching situation' is laughable. And I am no Spurs fan by any stretch. But this athlete, Kobe Bryant, could be as unlikable as any other with some of the drivel he spouts sometimes.

Were he to take a little more responsibility, his perception would be radically different. Just disappointing.

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Kobe is a cutthroat guy. It's what made him popular around the world and adored by the youth.


I disagree.

I think it was his microscope, obsessive copycatting of Michael Jordan's game. The way he shoots a jumpshot, the fadeaway, the mannerisms, the way he dunks, etc.... Kobe copied it all.

and since Jordan was the most exciting, electrifying, GOAT player.... even his clone copycats get famous.

[chazzy]

Phil tried to come back in 13 though. That was just a management decision to not go with him

[3LiftHeatCurse]

Phil tried to come back in 13 though. That was just a management decision to not go with him

He tried to come back, really?

or did the Lakers reached out to him via Jeannie Buss, his wife, and Phil was going to consider it and needed time to think about it, and wanted special conditions if he came back.... only for Jim Buss to just go with D'Antoni before Phil was done considering it?

It's all on record. Phil was going to consider it, and needed some time.... but Jim Buss decided to just go with D'Antoni.

You laker fans, rewrite history to make Kobe look good. You've been doing it for 10 years+ and it only makes us hate Kobe more.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Comments were a bit shortsided, and as I said, there were players jealous of Kobe who played with Shaq (Ray Allen), but some of yall make the LeBron detractors look normal. Damn.. :oldlol:

[Akrazotile]

LMAO @ the Beantards in this thread trying to spin these comments as anything but more excuse and insecurity from Shaq and Paus spoiled little sidekick.

[chazzy]

He tried to come back, really?

or did the Lakers reached out to him via Jeannie Buss, his wife, and Phil was going to consider it and needed time to think about it, and wanted special conditions if he came back.... only for Jim Buss to just go with D'Antoni before Phil was done considering it?

It's all on record. Phil was going to consider it, and needed some time.... but Jim Buss decided to just go with D'Antoni.

You laker fans, rewrite history to make Kobe look good. You've been doing it for 10 years+ and it only makes us hate Kobe more.
You're reaching hard. He was awaiting medical clearance and would have accepted given enough time. Point is, it was in play and "Kobe's personality" isn't the reason why he's not coaching.

[DMV2]

Phil would have returned in 2013? :oldlol:

Come on son, Phil is smart enough to know that unless he's coaching the Miami Heat, he ain't sniffing another championship that year, this year or the next few years as long as Heat are still the supreme team in the league.

Phil only coaches the best player in the league and the best player in the league isn't with the Lakers.

[chazzy]

Phil would have returned in 2013? :oldlol:

Come on son, Phil is smart enough to know that unless he's coaching the Miami Heat, he ain't sniffing another championship that year, this year or the next few years as long as Heat are still the supreme team in the league.
Were you living under a rock during the Bickerstaff era?

[Solefade]

what a sarcastic/backhanded compliment



kobe is spoiled ass brat and such a little bitch sometimes

[T_L_P]

Phil would have returned in 2013? :oldlol:

Come on son, Phil is smart enough to know that unless he's coaching the Miami Heat, he ain't sniffing another championship that year, this year or the next few years as long as Heat are still the supreme team in the league.

Phil only coaches the best player in the league and the best player in the league isn't with the Lakers.

So Shaq was the best from '00-'05. Then Kobe from '06-'11?

:oldlol:

[3LiftHeatCurse]

You're reaching hard. He was awaiting medical clearance and would have accepted given enough time. Point is, it was in play and "Kobe's personality" isn't the reason why he's not coaching.

You have reading comprehensions issues.

Kobe's personality is in fact a reason why Phil left.

In 2004. Stop posting until you read posts and understand them.

[Mr Feeny]

You have reading comprehensions issues.

Kobe's personality is in fact a reason why Phil left.

In 2004. Stop posting until you read posts and understand them.

And actually addressing points.

[Magic 32]

You have reading comprehensions issues.

Kobe's personality is in fact a reason why Phil left.

In 2004. Stop posting until you read posts and understand them.

And thanks god he made his power felt.

Shaq and Phil wanted Kobe to be a servant forever.

[Mr Feeny]

And thanks god he made his power felt.

Shaq and Phil wanted Kobe to be a servant forever.What a well thought out and insightful post.

[Kiddlovesnets]

He should be jealous of LeBron. Having no less than 2 other HOFs for all of his rings. Playing in a historically shit Leastern Conference for his whole career.

He was talking about the coaching staff aspect, why would Kobe be jealous at Lebron? Kobe has had a HOF coach Phil Jackson for more than half of his career, while Lebron never had an elite coach to rely on so he had to do a lot more work himself.

[16X]

You Kobe haters are too funny :oldlol: Acting like it would have made a difference if Phil Jackson never left. Yeah, Phil was going to win a chip with Odom as the second best player on the team. Sure. Yeah Kobe is an asshole, but that never cost the Lakers a chance to go the the Finals or anything like that.

[3LiftHeatCurse]

oh, and as I said before, my previous post was accurate.

Phil didn't "try to come back". It was the Lakers going after him.

The Lakers, through Jeannie Buss, went after Phil. Then, Phil told them he would CONSIDER it and give him the weekend to think about it.

Then Jim Buss hired Mike D'Antoni and didn't wait for Phil's answer.

Here is proof. At the 1:00 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmdZ0XU_7ts

[16X]

The point is that if Kobe was the type of teammate, person, and player that Duncan was...he could easily have had his all time great coach for every relevant year of his career.

Uhh... he did. He had Phil every year the Lakers had a good enough team to compete :facepalm

[T_L_P]

Kobe is kind of a dickhead for this though. :lol Obviously saying Pop made Duncan. And honestly, judging by how much harder it's been for Dwight since SVG's system left him......He might be half right. Imagine Duncan having to play for Mike D'antoni or some shit. He'd regress, even in his prime. He'd be much less effective.



...But we'll never know for sure.

Duncan, along with Shaq, were two of the most assured pre-draft players ever. He was pretty much a superstar before even entering the league

Popovich was an average offensive coach for ages. He was a master of defense though. Popovich's "system" was dumping the ball to Duncan and letting him create. He used to say that all the time. :confusedshrug:

If he didn't play for Popovich his stats would have been even better. He gave Parker way too many touches in the early 2000s (to help him develop), and he was on some of the slowest teams in the league.

[Mr Feeny]

Uhh... he did. He had Phil every year the Lakers had a good enough team to compete :facepalm

Then why is he sulking?

[16X]

I personally blame Kobe the most. I think his huge ego and unwillingness to do what was best for the team (something Duncan gladly does) really hurt what the Lakers were able to accomplish during those 5 years.

Put it this way...if it was Duncan on the Lakers those 5 years...I think they would have made it all work...and never had a stretch in which the Lakers missed the playoffs and then lost in the first round back to back times in the heart of his prime/peak. Duncan/Phil would have figured out a way to keep it going...
WOW. You think Duncan would have made it work with Odom and Kwame as his sidekicks :oldlol: You would have just lost all credibility if you had any to begin with :lol

[T_L_P]

WOW. You think Duncan would have made it work with Odom and Kwame as his sidekicks :oldlol: You would have just lost all credibility if you had any to begin with :lol

He made it work with Derek Anderson and Antonio Daniels.

[Magic 32]

He made it work with Derek Anderson and Antonio Daniels.

and Robinson.

[Mr Feeny]

WOW. You think Duncan would have made it work with Odom and Kwame as his sidekicks :oldlol: You would have just lost all credibility if you had any to begin with :lol

He would have. Duncan doesn't need Shaq or Gasol to win championships; he's won with far less.

[T_L_P]

and Robinson.

Yep. And Robinson, who was a shell of his former self.

In '02 he missed a bunch of Playoff games and didn't do much when he did play.

19-year-old Parker, Bruce Bowen, Steve Smith, Malik Rose, Danny Ferry, Terry Porter, Mark Bryant, Antonio Daniels.

Stacked. :bowdown:

[Magic 32]

Yep. And Robinson, who was a shell of his former self.

In '02 he missed a bunch of Playoff games and didn't do much when he did play.

19-year-old Parker, Bruce Bowen, Steve Smith, Malik Rose, Danny Ferry, Terry Porter, Mark Bryant, Antonio Daniels.

Stacked. :bowdown:

Third best defensive team in the NBA.

Smush, Kwarme and Luke could not stop traffic.

[16X]

Then why is he sulking?
Maybe he thought Phil could have made it work with him and Dwight? :confusedshrug: Maybe he's mad they didn't have Phil in 2012 and thought they would have had a better chance with him? Maybe he just really didn't like playing for Brown or D'Antoni and he's letting that be known? I mean, fans of every team shit on Mike Brown and Mike D'Antoni all day long, but for some reason Kobe's not allowed to do the same. Why? Because Kobe haters never fail to get butthurt about anything he says.

[Mr Feeny]

Third best defensive team in the NBA.

Smush, Kwarme and Luke could not stop traffic.

Mhmm....Duncan made his teammates better defensive players than Kobe did:applause:

[longtime lurker]

WOW. You think Duncan would have made it work with Odom and Kwame as his sidekicks :oldlol: You would have just lost all credibility if you had any to begin with :lol

Meanwhile Duncan loses to Memphis in the first round WITH Ginobili, Parker and Popovich :oldlol:

[Magic 32]

Mhmm....Duncan made his teammates better defensive players than Kobe did:applause:

Right.

Bowen and Robinson were scrubs on D without Duncan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxCcC8oHjWc

[Mr Feeny]

Maybe he thought Phil could have made it work with him and Dwight? :confusedshrug: Maybe he's mad they didn't have Phil in 2012 and thought they would have had a better chance with him? Maybe he just really didn't like playing for Brown or D'Antoni and he's letting that be known? I mean, fans of every team shit on Mike Brown and Mike D'Antoni all day long, but for some reason Kobe's not allowed to do the same. Why? Because Kobe haters never fail to get butthurt about anything he says.

Ah! He could have been a consummate professional like Duncan was and not drove Phil away:applause: Maybe then Phil wouldn't have considered him 'uncoachable' and would have been more inclined to stay longer/return to coach Kobe.

So cute with the Miley avatar btw...:lol

[T_L_P]

Third best defensive team in the NBA.

Smush, Kwarme and Luke could not stop traffic.

Hmm...I guess that's not due in part to one of the greatest defenders ever. :rolleyes:

And it's not like Kobe was ever a really good defender after Shaq.

[Mr Feeny]

Right.

Bowen and Robinson were scrubs on D without Duncan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxCcC8oHjWc

You haven't refuted my point:cheers:

[Magic 32]

Hmm...I guess that's not due in part to one of the greatest defenders ever. :rolleyes:

Right. Duncan could guard every position.

By osmosis he made Bowen and Robinson defensive juggernauts

[T_L_P]

Right. Duncan could guard every position.

By osmosis he made Bowen and Robinson defensive juggernauts

Bowen was anything but a juggernaut in '02. He hadn't even come into his own yet. :oldlol:

[Mr Feeny]

Right. Duncan could guard every position.

By osmosis he made Bowen and Robinson defensive juggernauts

You are utterly clueless aren't you:oldlol:

[Magic 32]

Bowen was anything but a juggernaut in '02. He hadn't even come into his own yet. :oldlol:


In the following year, Bowen was retained by the Heat. In that year, he had his breakout season. For the first time in his career, he played in all 82 regular season games, averaged 7.6 points, 3.0 rebounds, 1.6 assists and 1.01 steals in 32.7 minutes per game and set new single season career-highs in games, points, rebounds, assists, blocks, minutes, field goals made and attempted, three-point goals made and attempted and free throws made and attempted.[3] Bowen logged more minutes (2,685 vs. 2,678), scored more points (623 vs. 606) and hit more threes (103 vs. 54) than he had in his first four seasons combined.[3] Especially, Bowen earned himself a reputation as a defensive stopper. For his strong perimeter defense, he was voted into the All-Defensive Second Team.[2]

Wiki lies?

[Mr Feeny]

Wiki lies?

We can't argue with Wikipedia, now can we?:oldlol:

[T_L_P]

Wiki lies?

Defensive stopper = defensive juggernaut.

:roll:

[Magic 32]

Defensive stopper = defensive juggernaut.

:roll:

Compared to Kwame, Smush and the rest of the Lakers.

Hell yes.

[Magic 32]

We can't argue with Wikipedia, now can we?:oldlol:

or the NBA how put him on the all-defense second team.

[Keno]

man this comment is still too funny lmao. kobe must of been on drugs or something, irony through the roof with this post.

"jealous of duncan" - takes an undeserving 30 mill a year so the lakers can't sign anyone.

"playing with same historically great coach entire career" - nigha, you played with the greatest coach of all time for most of your career hahahhahaa.

[T_L_P]

Compared to Kwame, Smush and the rest of the Lakers.

Hell yes.

Cool. But what are we even arguing here? The '05 Lakers weren't a defensive team; they were an offensive team. Their star wasn't a good defender. The '01-'03 Spurs were a defensive team, not an offensive one. Their star was perhaps the best defender in the league, and a great offensive player.

You see how much easier it is to succeed when your star can play on both ends of the floor?

[Magic 32]

Cool. But what are we even arguing here? The '05 Lakers weren't a defensive team; they were an offensive team. Their star wasn't a good defender. The '01-'03 Spurs were a defensive team, not an offensive one. Their star was perhaps the best defender in the league, and a great offensive player.

You see how much easier it is to succeed when your star can play on both ends of the floor?

Like the 2001 76'ers?

Or the 2007 Cavs?

[Kiddlovesnets]

Kobe is jealous that Duncan is ranked higher on all-time list than he is, but theres nothing he can do. If I were Kobe i'd worry more about Lebron instead, Duncan is already greater than him anyway and no one can change this fact, but Lebron without his 3rd ring will be at least a bit controversial to take over Kobe.

[T_L_P]

Like the 2001 76'ers?

I don't get it. Being compared to AI is hardly a good thing, they were playing in the shitty East, and the only reason they got that far was because the series against the Bucks was absolutely rigged.

[16X]

Ah! He could have been a consummate professional like Duncan was and not drove Phil away:applause: Maybe then Phil wouldn't have considered him 'uncoachable' and would have been more inclined to stay longer/return to coach Kobe.

So cute with the Miley avatar btw...:lol
Thanks. Glad you like the avi.

Phil was not staying past 2011. He had health issues and Pau was not Pau anymore, so Phil knew the Lakers weren't winning anything more. I'm pretty sure he didn't leave because of Kobe. If anyone is to blame (besides Phil's health issues), it would be Pau for regressing, not Kobe. If you're talking about 2004, it's probably better that Phil left anyways. It gave Phil a chance to rest up and have a renewed passion for coaching once he decided he was ready to come back.

[Magic 32]

I don't get it. Being compared to AI is hardly a good thing, they were playing in the shitty East, and the only reason they got that far was because the series against the Bucks was absolutely rigged.


And Duncan got smashed by the Lakers (2nd round).

If your team can play defense, you can get a solid regular season seed with one star player.

But you will get exposed as one dimensional when they face real competition the PO.

[Straight_Ballin]

Kobe had the benfit of being coached by a man who coached JORDAN. I mean, how much more of an adavantage do you need?!?! People blame Kobe for emulating Jordan. He was only doing what his coach told him to do much like Pop told Duncan, "hey, go out there and be fundamental...that's your game."

Phil: Hey Kobe, Jordan use to do this on this play. Here's how you do it.
Kobe: OK, let me give it a try that way this time.

Instant success.

[T_L_P]

And Duncan got smashed by the Lakers (2nd round).

If your team can play defense, you can get a solid regular season seed with one star player.

But you will get exposed as one dimensional when they face real competition the PO.

That's the point I'm making: the '01-'03 Spurs were mediocre as ****. Robinson missed half the Lakers series as well, which obviously didn't help.

Shaq and Kobe beating Duncan and a rookie Tony Parker should come as no surprise.

But look at what happened in '03: no other star player, beats prime Shaq and Kobe, wins title. Did Kobe ever do something like that? Of course not. He's never won without another star by his side (with one of them being clearly better than Kobe himself).

Besides, this is all moot. The main reason the '05 Lakers were so shit was because of Kobe. He gives the ball to Shaq in the '04 Finals, they win, Shaq and Phil don't leave, another year of contending.

[Magic 32]

That's the point I'm making: the '01-'03 Spurs were mediocre as ****. Robinson missed half the Lakers series as well, which obviously didn't help.


Right, both Kobe's and Duncan's teams were mediorce, but Duncan had a great defensive team around him that could stack up regular season wins (and get him easy opponents in the first round).

And don't try to slip in 2002-03. Parker and Manu had already raised their game and Jackson, Bowen and even Kerr made them a dangerous sharpshooting team. AND THEY PLAYED DEFENSE.

Shaq/Kobe after 3 championship runs >>>> NO Dirk >>>>>>> The Nets.




Besides, this is all moot. The main reason the '05 Lakers were so shit was because of Kobe.

http://www.greene.k12.ia.us/wpdevelopment/spring2010/dmartzahn/finalproject/72807977.jpg

[HOoopCityJones]

TLP you need to quit acting like Duncan's gay lover his wife was talkin about.

[PsychoBe]

TLP you need to quit acting like Duncan's gay lover his wife was talkin about.

someone please tell me if duncan is really bi. i keep hearing rumors and jokes but idk if it's true or not :confusedshrug:

serious question.

[dubeta]

Because Kobe = ratings and profits if he's playing, no matter how much the team sucks. I know he hasn't been playing, but you pay the man and take that risk when he's such a money maker for the organization.

I'm not worried about winning titles. The Lakers have just been in 7 Finals. I'm not a greedy fan. I'm fine with sucking for a while. The Lakers are going to be like Jordan's Wizards next season, and that's actually not such a bad thing in my opinion. There's a very good chance Kobe goes down again and is out for the season, so if he's surrounded by sh*t teammates, at least we can tank hard once he goes down, and get an even better draft pick next year.

Lakers dont have a pick next year

[T_L_P]

TLP you need to quit acting like Duncan's gay lover his wife was talkin about.

Why, because I'm making a valid point?

Refute what I said and then make that claim.

[chazzy]

You have reading comprehensions issues.

Kobe's personality is in fact a reason why Phil left.

In 2004. Stop posting until you read posts and understand them.
Relax. I was responding to this:

Kobe, you would have had Phil Jackson from 99 through at least 11 and then likely 13 and beyond if you were the kind of selfless person and teammate Duncan was.

[Y2ktors]

TLP you need to quit acting like Duncan's gay lover his wife was talkin about.
:oldlol:

[Ne 1]

But look at what happened in '03: no other star player, beats prime Shaq and Kobe, wins title. Did Kobe ever do something like that? Of course not. He's never won without another star by his side (with one of them being clearly better than Kobe himself).

Let's not forget, the Spurs won 60 games while the Lakers won 50.

Personally, I don't think Kobe played that well vs the Spurs in '03, but aside from Shaq, that Laker team was pretty poor.

Rick Fox was injured and didn't play in the series and his backup, the great Devean George, missed a game with an injury. While Robert Horry also couldn't hit a shot to save his life. He shot 26% from the field, 57% at the line and he was 0/18 on 3s.

Brian Shaw was getting 21 mpg for the Lakers that series and he averaged just over 3 ppg and he shot 27% from the field, 20% on 3s and 50% from the line.

The Spurs were a better team. They had the best player in the league, home court advantage, Parker, Jackson and at times Ginobili were scoring threats, Bowen was the best perimeter defender at the time, they always had a solid big man next to Duncan whether it be Rose or Robinson and they had one of the great coaches of all time.


And despite that, if Horry's 3 doesn't rim out at the end of game 5, they go back to Staples Center with a 3-2 lead.

I think Kobe deserves blame for that series, but it's not like he had some huge advantage vs the '03 Spurs. The Lakers were very, very weak outside of their 1-2 punch by the time of that series.