How many titles would kobe have playing for the spurs his whole career?

[Mr. Jabbar]

Under Pops coaching with dat roster?

[J Shuttlesworth]

0. He would disturb the flow of the ball movement by being a chucker, and popovich would kick him out and let him be someone elses rape problem

[DFish24]

6-7 Titles

[Mr. Jabbar]

0. He would disturb the flow of the ball movement by being a chucker, and popovich would kick him out and let him be someone elses rape problem

jokes aside, he would have developed into a more team oriented player, worse "stats" but more championships. i say between 7-10 titles.

[Mr. Jabbar]

6-7 Titles

on the low end. yes.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Kobe/Manu/Parker = GOAT perimeter tandem

[Uncle Drew]

One thing is certain, Kobe wouldn't take a pay cut to keep that roster together like Duncan did.

[kennethgriffin]

kobe = 5 titles, 7 finals with a good coach for only 11 years

duncan = 4 titles, 6 finals with a good coach for 17 years


give kobe the spurs and he wins 6-7 titles,

[J Shuttlesworth]

kobe = 5 titles, 7 finals with a good coach for only 11 years

duncan = 4 titles, 6 finals with a good coach for 17 years


give kobe the spurs and he wins 6-7 titles,
Give Duncan prime Shaq/PJ and they win 11 titles together since duncan won't drive Shaq out of town

[strike first]

Less than they have now. Kobe brings nothing to their style of play. Only upside is he doesnt have to rape women anymore because the fat san antonio girls put out.

[Mr. Jabbar]

damn, it would suck to see shaq go down with just 1 title in this scenario tho :(

[kennethgriffin]

Give Duncan prime Shaq/PJ and they win 11 titles together since duncan won't drive Shaq out of town


shaq needed a 2nd guy who could average 27-30 ppg cause the lakers lacked any depth offensively ( kobes 21 was enough in 2000 cause of glen rice )

duncan couldnt supply the firepower needed to make that combo work


all kobe would need for the spurs is 16-17ppg to get it done... like timmys doing this season
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

the spurs require less from a star cause theyre that deep and well coached...

[J Shuttlesworth]

shaq needed a 2nd guy who could average 27-30 ppg cause the lakers lacked any depth offensively ( kobes 21 was enough in 2000 cause of glen rice )

duncan couldnt supply the firepower needed to make that combo work


all kobe would need for the spurs is 16-17ppg to get it done... like timmys doing this season
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

the spurs require less from a star cause theyre that deep and well coached...



Prime Duncan was putting up 28/14/5/4 in the playoffs. That's greater than anything Kobe could ever dream of doing

[ThePhantomCreep]

Less than they have now. Kobe brings nothing to their style of play. Only upside is he doesnt have to rape women anymore because the fat san antonio girls put out.

You're right, Kobe's might have actually made the Spurs watchable. People might tune in!

[aj1987]

Who's gonna protect the paint if there's no Duncan? They MIGHT win 1 title.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Less than they have now. Kobe brings nothing to their style of play. Only upside is he doesnt have to rape women anymore because the fat san antonio girls put out.

Kobe might have actually made the Spurs watchable. People might tune in!

[Straight_Ballin]

Under Pops coaching with dat roster?

He couldn't win 5 as the man, only 2 so he would only have 2 at max.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Prime Duncan was putting up 28/14/5/4 in the playoffs. That's greater than anything Kobe could ever dream of doing
He only did that once, over 9 games.

Might as well compare it to 2001 Kobe's series against the Kings and Spurs, where he averaged 34/8/6.

[T_L_P]

What are the circumstances, Kobe and Duncan switching teams or imagining Duncan never played in the NBA and Kobe got drafted by the Spurs?

[DFish24]

What are the circumstances, Kobe and Duncan switching teams or imagining Duncan never played in the NBA and Kobe got drafted by the Spurs?

Kobe with D-Rob, Parker and Manu.

[red1]

that's a tough one. I'll say zero, maybe one

[Rose'sACL]

What are the circumstances, Kobe and Duncan switching teams or imagining Duncan never played in the NBA and Kobe got drafted by the Spurs?
shaq and duncan on the same team against Kobe with 2003 spurs.

[T_L_P]

Kobe with D-Rob, Parker and Manu.

You wrote 6-7 titles. Which years, exactly?

[NumberSix]

None

[T_L_P]

shaq and duncan on the same team against Kobe with 2003 spurs.

If the two are switching teams, Kobe doesn't come close to a title before '06.

[Paul George 24]

Kobe with D-Rob, Parker and Manu.

POP WILL SIT DOWN KOBE "CANCER" BRYANT FOR HIS SELFISH PLAYS

[ThePhantomCreep]

lol @ idiots saying zero or one.

Kobe, at the tail end of his prime, went on a run of three straight finals the instant he got a quality second option, winning two.

Duncan has played on stacked teams virtually his entire career.

Do the math.

[DFish24]

You wrote 6-7 titles. Which years, exactly?

Kobe wins Titles in '01, 03', '06, '07-'08 and '09-'10.

[red1]

Kobe wins Titles in '01, 03', '06, '07-'08 and '09-'10.
agreed, zero titles indeed

[aj1987]

lol @ idiots saying zero or one.

Kobe, at the tail end of his prime, went on a run of three straight finals the instant he got a quality second option, winning two.

Duncan has played on stacked teams virtually his entire career.

Do the math.
A team with Kobe, Manu, and Parker is winning titles? Who's protecting the paint?

[T_L_P]

Kobe wins Titles in '01, 03', '06, '07-'08 and '09-'10.

03? Are you ****ing kidding me?

There's being a stan and then there's outright delusion. Who on that Spurs team is making them one of the best defenses in the league without Duncan? 20 minute Robinson? How is Kobe winning in '09 with Manu missing the Playoffs; how is he averaging 32 PPG on 56% shooting against the Mavs, when he could only do 28 PPG against the Suns? How is he winning in '01 without Derek Anderson?

[aj1987]

Kobe won't win Titles in '01-05', '06, '07-'08 and '09-'10.
Agreed.

[Im Still Ballin]

03? Are you ****ing kidding me?

There's being a stan and then there's outright delusion. Who on that Spurs team is making them one of the best defenses in the league without Duncan? 20 minute Robinson? How is Kobe winning in '09 with Manu missing the Playoffs; how is he averaging 32 PPG on 56% shooting against the Mavs, when he could only do 28 PPG against the Suns? How is he winning in '01 without Derek Anderson?
Close up shop buddy. You've taken one too many bricks to the head to be posting anything worthwhile reading.

[T_L_P]

Close up shop buddy. You've taken one too many bricks to the head to be posting anything worthwhile reading.

Then skip over the post, or at least address the post -- which I highly doubt you can do.

[GODbe]

The fact that Godbe's never had a roster as stacked as Duncans his entire career and still ended up with more rings than Duncan is incredible. I say he wins about 9-10. 11-12 is possible.

[Im Still Ballin]

Then skip over the post.
Look mate. Nothing personal, but I think your about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

[T_L_P]

Look mate. Nothing personal, but I think your about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

Cool. Like I said, you didn't address my post, which just means you have nothing to add. So don't quote me.:confusedshrug:

[ThePhantomCreep]

A team with Kobe, Manu, and Parker is winning titles? Who's protecting the paint?

Any stiff will do (see: 90's Bulls). Don't bother mentioning Rodman or Grant either--neither were rim protectors.

Manu/Parker/Kobe would crush the league. I doubt Kobe comes up ringless on those insanely stacked 2011, 2012, and 2013 Spurs teams either.

[ThePhantomCreep]

dp

[ThePhantomCreep]

03? Are you ****ing kidding me?

There's being a stan and then there's outright delusion. Who on that Spurs team is making them one of the best defenses in the league without Duncan? 20 minute Robinson? How is Kobe winning in '09 with Manu missing the Playoffs; how is he averaging 32 PPG on 56% shooting against the Mavs, when he could only do 28 PPG against the Suns? How is he winning in '01 without Derek Anderson?

If you think Kobe couldn't win in 2006 with that ridiculous Spurs roster, you're flat out delusional.

Kobe was deliberately trying to get others involved in that Suns series, world-beating talents like Kwame Brown, Smush Parker, and Luke Walton. It wasn't because he couldn't score on them.

[Straight_Ballin]

The fact that Godbe's never had a roster as stacked as Duncans his entire career and still ended up with more rings than Duncan is incredible. I say he wins about 9-10. 11-12 is possible.

Quite possibly the dumbest thing said on ISH today. Kobe had Shaq, most dominant player ever.

Not to mention a stacked laker team. :facepalm

Quit trying to prop up a chucker that was barely the best player on his team during years when Shaq wasn't playing.

[Goldrush25]

Under Pops coaching with dat roster?

Dat roster wouldn't have been there because Kobe would've taken up 30% of the cap space.

[aj1987]

Any stiff will do (see: 90's Bulls). Don't bother mentioning Rodman or Grant either--neither were rim protectors.

Manu/Parker/Kobe would crush the league. I doubt Kobe comes up ringless on those insanely stacked 2011, 2012, and 2013 Spurs teams either.
As I said, they might win one ring MAX.

Also, Kobe =/= MJ and TP/Manu =/= Pippen.

[bigkingsfan]

None vs Shaq/Duncan

[GODbe]

Quite possibly the dumbest thing said on ISH today. Kobe had Shaq, most dominant player ever.

Not to mention a stacked laker team. :facepalm

Quit trying to prop up a chucker that was barely the best player on his team during years when Shaq wasn't playing.

Lakers stack? :roll: :roll:Outside of a decent center in Shaq, Kobe never had the luxury of perfect rosters that Duncan had year after year :facepalm

Also, Shaq was not that dominant honestly. Even a young child version of Kobe outplayed him regularly. GOAT gonna GOAT.

[Lebronxrings]

real question is how many LeBron would have. Kobe had shaq and phil, anyone would have won with that. Lebron has garbage teammates and the worst coach EVER to win a ring.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Lakers stack? :roll: :roll:Outside of a decent center in Shaq, Kobe never had the luxury of perfect rosters that Duncan had year after year :facepalm

Also, Shaq was not that dominant honestly. Even a young child version of Kobe outplayed him regularly. GOAT gonna GOAT.
Tim Duncan won a ring that year as the only all star on his team :facepalm

[ThePhantomCreep]

As I said, they might win one ring MAX.

Also, Kobe =/= MJ and TP/Manu =/= Pippen.

Nobody cares what you say. Peak Kobe is very comparable to late-90's Jordan at least.

And lmao at Pippen being better than Parker AND Manu. Get real.

[DMAVS41]

For sure wins in 07.

After that? Totally debatable...but 07 is the only for sure title.

People listing 03 and 06 are nuts...

99 - Nope. Wasn't a championship first option yet.

00 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

01 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

02 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

03 - Just absolutely no chance whatsoever. I can't even believe people are listing this.

04 - Nah...lost with a better team than Duncan had.

05 - Nah...down year for Kobe and he would have faced his toughest task in the Pistons in the finals.

06 - Well, Duncan did put up a 32/12/4 62% TS series and failed to get out of the 2nd round. I'm not going to say there is no chance here, but highly unlikely Kobe beats the Mavs, then the Suns, and then the Heat.

08 - What? Manu was hurt. No way is Kobe leading that Spurs team to the title with his 2nd best player hurt over the 08 Celtics. Kobe's 08 team was better than the 08 Spurs and he lost.

09 - Nope. Manu was hurt and missed the entire playoffs

10 - Doubtful, Kobe came within a couple plays of losing the finals that year. And the 10 Lakers were better than the 10 Spurs.

11 - Nope...Kobe wasn't a championship first option in 11 in the playoffs. He was hurt.

12 - Possible finals trip, but no title. The Heat were just better.

13 - Nope. Injured.

14 - Nope. Injured.

[ThePhantomCreep]

For sure wins in 07.

After that? Totally debatable...but 07 is the only for sure title.

People listing 03 and 06 are nuts...

99 - Nope. Wasn't a championship first option yet.

00 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

01 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

02 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

03 - Just absolutely no chance whatsoever. I can't even believe people are listing this.

04 - Nah...lost with a better team than Duncan had.

05 - Nah...down year for Kobe and he would have faced his toughest task in the Pistons in the finals.

06 - Well, Duncan did put up a 32/12/4 62% TS series and failed to get out of the 2nd round. I'm not going to say there is no chance here, but highly unlikely Kobe beats the Mavs, then the Suns, and then the Heat.

08 - What? Manu was hurt. No way is Kobe leading that Spurs team to the title with his 2nd best player hurt over the 08 Celtics. Kobe's 08 team was better than the 08 Spurs and he lost.

09 - Nope. Manu was hurt and missed the entire playoffs

10 - Doubtful, Kobe came within a couple plays of losing the finals that year. And the 10 Lakers were better than the 10 Spurs.

11 - Nope...Kobe wasn't a championship first option in 11 in the playoffs. He was hurt.

12 - Possible finals trip, but no title. The Heat were just better.

13 - Nope. Injured.

14 - Nope. Injured.

2006. Kobe was at the peak of his career, better than 2009 and 2010. Duncan got hot for a few games against the Mavericks, but he averaged his usual 19/11 numbers that year, missing several games. Brad Daugherty territory. The Spurs still won 63 games. You people are on crack if you think peak Kobe can't do better with that team.

And Kobe was better in 2005 than 2004, he could win that Spurs roster, no question.

Considering the good fortune the Spurs faced in 2003 (Webber/Dirk injuries, cream puff Nets in the Finals), a title that year isn't completely far-fetched.

[zoom17]

For sure wins in 07.

After that? Totally debatable...but 07 is the only for sure title.

People listing 03 and 06 are nuts...

99 - Nope. Wasn't a championship first option yet.

00 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

01 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

02 - Nope. Wouldn't have beaten Shaq's team

03 - Just absolutely no chance whatsoever. I can't even believe people are listing this.

04 - Nah...lost with a better team than Duncan had.

05 - Nah...down year for Kobe and he would have faced his toughest task in the Pistons in the finals.

06 - Well, Duncan did put up a 32/12/4 62% TS series and failed to get out of the 2nd round. I'm not going to say there is no chance here, but highly unlikely Kobe beats the Mavs, then the Suns, and then the Heat.

08 - What? Manu was hurt. No way is Kobe leading that Spurs team to the title with his 2nd best player hurt over the 08 Celtics. Kobe's 08 team was better than the 08 Spurs and he lost.

09 - Nope. Manu was hurt and missed the entire playoffs

10 - Doubtful, Kobe came within a couple plays of losing the finals that year. And the 10 Lakers were better than the 10 Spurs.

11 - Nope...Kobe wasn't a championship first option in 11 in the playoffs. He was hurt.

12 - Possible finals trip, but no title. The Heat were just better.

13 - Nope. Injured.

14 - Nope. Injured.

so only one:oldlol:

[Keno]

no phil jackson = 0.

[AirFederer]

Kobe, the Wilt of the 00's :applause:

[DMAVS41]

2006. Kobe was at the peak of his career, better than 2009 and 2010. Duncan got hot for a few games against the Mavericks, but he averaged his usual 19/11 numbers that year, missing several games. Brad Daugherty territory. The Spurs still won 63 games. You people are on crack if you think peak Kobe can't do better with that team.

And Kobe was better in 2005 than 2004, he could win that Spurs roster, no question.

Considering the good fortune the Spurs faced in 2003 (Webber/Dirk injuries, cream puff Nets in the Finals), a title that year isn't completely far-fetched.

03 is far fetched because 03 Kobe wasn't 80% as good as Duncan. And he would have had to beat Shaq paired up with Duncan...and that just isn't happening.

That it the part of these hypotheticals you people seem to want to ignore. If Kobe joins the Spurs. You have to put Duncan in place of Kobe. That is the only fair way to do it. Otherwise it's just removing the biggest competition for Kobe each year as he wouldn't have to face another elite player on Shaq's team like Duncan did.

05? Are you serious? Kobe was injured most of the year and couldn't even make the playoffs. Yet I'm to think he's going to lead that Spurs team to the title? Going through the Pistons in the finals that destroyed him the year before? No way.

06? Might have been Kobe's peak, and I didn't say it was impossible, but Duncan played about as elite as you can against the Mavs and it still wasn't enough.

[PickernRoller]

About the same or 1 more. The only difference is that the Spurs will actually 2-peat and 3-peat w/ Kobe on board. Duncan doesn't care being a beta.

[ThePhantomCreep]

03 is far fetched because 03 Kobe wasn't 80% as good as Duncan. And he would have had to beat Shaq paired up with Duncan...and that just isn't happening.

That it the part of these hypotheticals you people seem to want to ignore. If Kobe joins the Spurs. You have to put Duncan in place of Kobe. That is the only fair way to do it. Otherwise it's just removing the biggest competition for Kobe each year as he wouldn't have to face another elite player on Shaq's team like Duncan did.

05? Are you serious? Kobe was injured most of the year and couldn't even make the playoffs. Yet I'm to think he's going to lead that Spurs team to the title? Going through the Pistons in the finals that destroyed him the year before? No way.

06? Might have been Kobe's peak, and I didn't say it was impossible, but Duncan played about as elite as you can against the Mavs and it still wasn't enough.

Kobe played as many games as Duncan in 2005, 66. It's not like Duncan had a legendary Finals against the Pistons either (who weren't as deep as the 04 team that won the title), so Kobe winning that year isn't far-fetched at all.

It's difficult to play the hypothetical game, switching a wingplayer for a big man, but Kobe/Manu/Parker is about as dominant a perimeter tandem as this game has ever seen, and the NBA would have to deal with them for over a decade. I have no doubt Kobe could match Duncan's ring count of 4.

[Rubio2Gasol]

Are we simply replacing Duncan with Kobe?

[SwayDizzle]

Kobe is winning 7 titles with the Spurs squads throughout the years.
Kobe the best man to man defensive SG of all time would become even stronger in team defense under Pops. Kobe quite possibly could have been the GOAT under Pops.

[Mure]

Kobe is winning 7 titles with the Spurs squads throughout the years.
Kobe the best man to man defensive SG of all time would become even stronger in team defense under Pops. Kobe quite possibly could have been the GOAT under Pops.

Kobe the best man to man defensive SG of all time? LOL. :biggums: :biggums:

[SwayDizzle]

Kobe the best man to man defensive SG of all time? LOL. :biggums: :biggums:
12-time member of the All-Defensive team, most for any SG in history.

[GODbe]

Kobe the best man to man defensive SG of all time? LOL. :biggums: :biggums:
Easily. How do you even have the nerve to ask this? :facepalm

[DMAVS41]

Kobe played as many games as Duncan in 2005, 66. It's not like Duncan had a legendary Finals against the Pistons either (who weren't as deep as the 04 team that won the title), so Kobe winning that year isn't far-fetched at all.

It's difficult to play the hypothetical game, switching a wingplayer for a big man, but Kobe/Manu/Parker is about as dominant a perimeter tandem as this game has ever seen, and the NBA would have to deal with them for over a decade. I have no doubt Kobe could match Duncan's ring count of 4.

But which years other than 07?

Often the amount of titles a player wins breaks on the competition level and bad luck.

Again, you have to remember that Duncan then goes to play with Shaq...or, at the very least, Shaq gets someone as good as Kobe....because Duncan had to face Shaq/Kobe. You have to build that into the equation.

So 98 through 02 is out of the question. Kobe wasn't good enough be a championship first option until 01. The 01 and 02 Kobe led Spurs are not beating Shaq and another top 12 player of all time. That isn't happening.

03 is more than what you are letting on. Yes, the competition wasn't elite...again though...part of that was because Kobe hijacked his own team. Why would we suddenly assume Kobe becomes the epitome of a team player and leads a team with young Tony Parker as the 2nd best player to the title. An 03 Kobe led Spurs team wouldn't even be favored, in my opinion, to beat the 03 Nets.

Again, in 04 we saw Kobe lose with a superior team. So how is he winning with a worse team?

05...Kobe as not himself at all. He gained weight and was hurt. The competition that year was also brutal. Seattle and the Suns were hardly pushovers....Seattle, for example, lost a tight 6 game series...and lost game 6 in the finals seconds on a Tim Duncan game winner. The point is that a series like that is not a for sure thing.

And then they'd have to beat a loaded 05 Suns team and then a championship Pistons team that can defend Kobe as well as anyone...

Possible? Sure, but likely in these types of hypotheticals? Nah

We've been over 06 and 07 (for sure win)...

But I think you have ignored the circumstances of 08 through 10 for the Spurs. Manu got hurt in the 08 playoffs and he wasn't himself in the WCF. There is no way Kobe is leading the 08 Spurs with Manu hobbled to the title over the 08 Celtics. Just no.

Then in 09 Manu missed the entire playoffs. Again, no way he wins here.

10...the Spurs were clearly a worse team than the Lakers. Considering the Lakers came within a couple plays in a game 7 to win the title. I don't see much logic leading to a Spurs victory here over the 10 Celtics.

11 and on...Kobe has not been a championship first option. Well, I take that back...in 12 he was, but the Spurs wouldn't have been good enough. I totally conceded they might get by the Thunder and make the finals, but the 12 Spurs with Kobe are not beating the Heat. Nightmare matchup with an equal or better at sg and the clear cut best player in the series in Lebron on the other team.

The obviously in 13 and 14...kobe is hurt.



So much of winning titles is based on circumstances. Also, Duncan was just a better player than Kobe in the playoffs. He's an all time great defender/rebounder....and combined that with excellent offensive skills and a team first attitude that exudes leadership. Duncan has perhaps won the most with the least in NBA history. If he wins this year....it absolutely will be the case. 5 titles and 6 finals appearances with those teams....that is truly historic stuff.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Now he's entertaining the idea of the 2005 Spurs losing to the Sonics with Kobe at the helm. Good grief.

And Kobe wouldn't need to run himself into the ground on the 2011 and 2013 Spurs, so no injuries those years most likely. He could play 25-30 minutes a night like Duncan, miss a game or three just because, and basically kick back until the postseason starts, comforted in the knowledge that his supremely stacked team will cruise to 60+ wins anyway.

That's basically Duncan's MO for the last decade.

Yeah, 0-1 rings for Kobe. Dream on. guys.

[dubeta]

0 rings and thats being generous

[Carbine]

Kobe was too young or not good enough in '99 or '00 to win with Robinson.

The '01 squad, David was declining even further and it was obvious. Anderson got hurt in the playoffs. Kobe not winning with that group.

'02 was even worse. Robinson a year older, no Anderson. Parker was an unknown and not very effective.

'03 took one of the greatest playoff runs of all-time to get a ring. It's tough to give Kobe credit that he would win a title with that team.

'04 Rasho, Horry and Malik Rose would be their big men. That would probably be the weakest big men rotation in the NBA at the time. Parker was improved, Manu was coming along but still not at his peak so that's not going to result in a title. Kobe lost with a much better team, so it's dumb to give Kobe credit for a title this year.

'05 would have been Mohammad, Horry & Rasho for big men. That's still brutal. This is where it gets interesting from this year further.

People see big names (Manu, Parker) and insert another big name and you all of a sudden have a great team. Pieces have to fit.

Is Parker, "Parker" if he doesn't have the ball in his hands all the time like he's accustomed to now? **** no. He doesn't space the floor well.

He's Parker because of what he can do with the ball is his hands. Having Kobe on the team takes the ball out of his hands. Kobe is a ball dominant player....and being the better player between the two, he would get the ball much more than Parker.

I think Gino could work off the ball much better. He's a fierce attacker off drive and kicks and he spaces the floor with his shooting. He also provided good active defense.

It's Parker who would suffer with Kobe. Quite a bit.

A 34 year old Kobe didn't give the ball up to Nash. Safe to say a 26 year old Kobe wouldn't give the ball up to a 22 year old Parker to let Parker be Parker.

I think they could win 1, maybe two titles with those hideous front courts they would have without Duncan when Kobe was good enough to win a title as the man (2001 and beyond) but it's very possible they win none because of those very poor front lines at mentioned prior.

They had Rasho/Horry/Mohammad for '06
Oberto/Elson/Horry '07
Oberto/Kurt Thomas/Very Old Horry '08
Bonner/Thomas/Oberto in '09
McDyess/Blair/Bonner '10 and '11
Blair/Bonner/Rookie Splitter in '12
Splitter/Diaw/Blair/Bonner for '13 (this is an OK group)
Splitter/Diaw/Bonner for '14 (OK group)

[ThePhantomCreep]

^^^^^

And yet, no one doubts that Shaq and Duncan would win a gazillian titles together, nevermind that their games don't compliment each other at all and they'd be surrounded by role-players who couldn't create their own offense if their lives depended on it.

Kobe, Manu, and Parker can each EASILY create their own offense, just having that as a threat makes them impossible to guard. They don't need a powerhouse frontcourt to win in this era eiher--a few wide bodies who can clog the paint and grab some boards will do.

[Carbine]

I'm not suggesting they would need a powerhouse front court to win, but those front courts that I have outlined would probably be the worst in the league at those given years except for the past two years.

[VIntageNOvel]

Kobe was too young or not good enough in '99 or '00 to win with Robinson.

The '01 squad, David was declining even further and it was obvious. Anderson got hurt in the playoffs. Kobe not winning with that group.

'02 was even worse. Robinson a year older, no Anderson. Parker was an unknown and not very effective.

'03 took one of the greatest playoff runs of all-time to get a ring. It's tough to give Kobe credit that he would win a title with that team.

'04 Rasho, Horry and Malik Rose would be their big men. That would probably be the weakest big men rotation in the NBA at the time. Parker was improved, Manu was coming along but still not at his peak so that's not going to result in a title. Kobe lost with a much better team, so it's dumb to give Kobe credit for a title this year.

'05 would have been Mohammad, Horry & Rasho for big men. That's still brutal. This is where it gets interesting from this year further.

People see big names (Manu, Parker) and insert another big name and you all of a sudden have a great team. Pieces have to fit.

Is Parker, "Parker" if he doesn't have the ball in his hands all the time like he's accustomed to now? **** no. He doesn't space the floor well.

He's Parker because of what he can do with the ball is his hands. Having Kobe on the team takes the ball out of his hands. Kobe is a ball dominant player....and being the better player between the two, he would get the ball much more than Parker.

I think Gino could work off the ball much better. He's a fierce attacker off drive and kicks and he spaces the floor with his shooting. He also provided good active defense.

It's Parker who would suffer with Kobe. Quite a bit.

A 34 year old Kobe didn't give the ball up to Nash. Safe to say a 26 year old Kobe wouldn't give the ball up to a 22 year old Parker to let Parker be Parker.

I think they could win 1, maybe two titles with those hideous front courts they would have without Duncan when Kobe was good enough to win a title as the man (2001 and beyond) but it's very possible they win none because of those very poor front lines at mentioned prior.

They had Rasho/Horry/Mohammad for '06
Oberto/Elson/Horry '07
Oberto/Kurt Thomas/Very Old Horry '08
Bonner/Thomas/Oberto in '09
McDyess/Blair/Bonner '10 and '11
Blair/Bonner/Rookie Splitter in '12
Splitter/Diaw/Blair/Bonner for '13 (this is an OK group)
Splitter/Diaw/Bonner for '14 (OK group)

yes of course pop and spurs wouldnt draft/sign players differently to complement kobe, of course they would still draft like they have duncan and wouldnt get a quality biG

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

if kobe was spurs, 5 rings at worst, possibly, 6-7 rings

this is spurs we are talking about,

team who get/develop manu from #57 pick,
and paker for #28

heck they even trade solid back up PG george hill and draft kahwi
i doubt they keep manu if kobe was there

[Dbrog]

^^^^^

And yet, no one doubts that Shaq and Duncan would win a gazillian titles together, nevermind that their games don't compliment each other at all and they'd be surrounded by role-players who couldn't create their own offense if their lives depended on it.

Kobe, Manu, and Parker can each EASILY create their own offense, just having that as a threat makes them impossible to guard. They don't need a powerhouse frontcourt to win in this era eiher--a few wide bodies who can clog the paint and grab some boards will do.

The fact that you say Shaq and Duncan's games dont compliment each other "at all" says so much about you. I'm not even going to explain this to you but will direct you to go try to find some early 2000s footage of both on youtube.

As for Kobe/Manu/Parker. They don't get through a KG Celtics squad IMO. You must have a legit big to do that (see: Magic + Pau/Kobe Lakeshow).

[Carbine]

yes of course pop and spurs wouldnt draft/sign players differently to complement kobe, of course they would still draft like they have duncan and wouldnt get a quality biG

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

if kobe was spurs, 5 rings at worst, possibly, 6-7 rings

this is spurs we are talking about,

team who get/develop manu from #57 pick,
and paker for #28

heck they even trade solid back up PG george hill and draft kahwi
i doubt they keep manu if kobe was there

You're right if that's the perspective you want to use. If they had drafted kobe in the '96 draft they would draft and build the team differently.

So it's possible they don't draft Parker. It's possible they don't draft Manu with Kobe already there. Under this scenario the whole team could be different around Kobe.

I'm looking at it from the perspective of if Kobe got to play with these Spurs.

[GimmeThat]

3 -5

He'd probably give up his scoring title
might be able to win one if not two more MVP
most likely one.

3 is on the conservative end of the approach.

Because I think the Spurs franchise would have been able to draft and develope a Pau Gasol type player somewhere along that decade and a half.

And we saw what Kobe could do with a player like Pau.

[Cold soul]

I'll go with 4-6.

[Carbine]

People acting like LA hasn't done enough for Kobe or something. He's going to win more titles with the Spurs than he has with a peak Shaq, Glen Rice, excellent role players like Fisher, Horry, Fox, Horace Grant.....then got Payton & Malone......and then surrounded by (Once Pau was traded for) one of the top 3 casts for a superstar in the league for a four year stretch. Then got Dwight & Nash.

Doesn't seem logical to me. Kobe has had it damn good. As good as any other star from his era.

[raprap]

Kobe's overrated. Biggest diva in the nba. Pop would not stay as the coach with kobe as his franchise player. So I say none for sure.

[BigBoss]

99 vs Knicks W 4-0 sweep
00 vs Pacers W 4-2
01 vs Sixers W 4-0 sweep
02 vs Nets W 4-0 sweep
03 vs Nets W 4-1
04 vs Pistons L 4-1
05 vs Pistons W 4-2
06 vs Heat W 4-3
07 vs Cavaliers W 4-0
08 vs Celtics L 4-2
09 vs Magic W 4-1
10 vs Celtics W 4-3
11 vs Heat W 4-0
12 vs Heat W 4-0
13 vs Heat W 4-0
14 vs Heat W 4-0 ( kobe would log 47 minutes with no AC and finish game 1. Offering his water to his teammates to make sure the were hydrated)


He would have 14 rings. Pop would have managed his minutes and Kobe would have never tore his achilles. Lebron would have 0 rings. Beating him in the Finals 5 times.

[VIntageNOvel]

99 vs Knicks W 4-0 sweep
00 vs Pacers W 4-2
01 vs Sixers W 4-0 sweep
02 vs Nets W 4-0 sweep
03 vs Nets W 4-1
04 vs Pistons L 4-1
05 vs Pistons W 4-2
06 vs Heat W 4-3
07 vs Cavaliers W 4-0
08 vs Celtics L 4-2
09 vs Magic W 4-1
10 vs Celtics W 4-3
11 vs Heat W 4-0
12 vs Heat W 4-0
13 vs Heat W 4-0
14 vs Heat W 4-0 ( kobe would log 47 minutes with no AC and finish game 1. Offering his water to his teammates to make sure the were hydrated)


He would have 14 rings. Pop would have managed his minutes and Kobe would have never tore his achilles. Lebron would have 0 rings. Beating him in the Finals 5 times.

:applause:

[jstern]

Phil was established, so I don't think Kobe would respond to Pop as well. Plus Pop has a certain personality type that he likes, which was talked about a lot in the Spurs vs Thunder theory, and Kobe definitely doesn't fit that personality. So perhaps Kobe could get traded for other superstars.

Then again, Pop wouldn't have been established and more likely he would be the one gone.

In short, Kobe's personality doesn't fit Pop's system.

[GimmeThat]

In short, Kobe's personality doesn't fit Pop's system.

It's true, by utilizing the Fed's policy to influence the market, which creates huge upswing and downward spirals would not be that of Pop's system.

Now, as to why there's in any way to suggest that any players personality wouldn't fit into a stable environment, and would only strive under one with huge momentum swing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKI8K7GP3NM

[Bandito]

Prime Duncan was putting up 28/14/5/4 in the playoffs. That's greater than anything Kobe could ever dream of doing
It sucks that Kobe is not 7foot...

[Bandito]

Who's gonna protect the paint if there's no Duncan? They MIGHT win 1 title.
He meant Kobe and Duncan together.

[ImKobe]

6-7 rings. IF you put WCF-Finals type of roster around him all his career, he's going to go to at least 7-8 Finals and he'll win at least 6 or 7 of them. There would obviously be years, where there's fatigue, injuries and what not, but I'm fairly confident he'd have more rings than he does now. People disregard how the Lakers front office completely screwed Kobe in his prime, they traded Shaq away for Lamar Odom & Caron Butler, you don't trade the 2nd best big man/top 5 player in the game (back in 04) for two fringe all-star players + a scrub on his last legs (Brian Grant), you don't do that to your franchise player.
And to make matters worse, they let Caron go the following season, and he became an decent starter and an all-star player on a medicore Wizards team, Kobe could have at least used that to help him out on offense.

[GimmeThat]

He meant Kobe and Duncan together.


They might be able to win 6-7 rings if they were in Utah.

Maybe even more, who knows!

[T_L_P]

6-7 rings. IF you put WCF-Finals type of roster around him all his career, he's going to go to at least 7-8 Finals and he'll win at least 6 or 7 of them. There would obviously be years, where there's fatigue, injuries and what not, but I'm fairly confident he'd have more rings than he does now. People disregard how the Lakers front office completely screwed Kobe in his prime, they traded Shaq away for Lamar Odom & Caron Butler, you don't trade the 2nd best big man/top 5 player in the game (back in 04) for two fringe all-star players + a scrub on his last legs (Brian Grant), you don't do that to your franchise player.
And to make matters worse, they let Caron go the following season, and he became an decent starter and an all-star player on a medicore Wizards team, Kobe could have at least used that to help him out on offense.

Which years, exactly? Also, is Duncan playing for LA or does he not exist in this scenario? If it's the former, Kobe doesn't come close to a ring before '05. Then from that point there's no way he wins 6-7 of the next 10.

[ImKobe]

Which years, exactly? Also, is Duncan playing for LA or does he not exist in this scenario? If it's the former, Kobe doesn't come close to a ring before '05. Then from that point there's no way he wins 6-7 of the next 10.

I thought Duncan would also be on that team? OP says under coach Pop with that roster. The roster includes Tim Duncan. OP wasn't specific enough about what players Kobe would have around him or where Duncan would be, so I figured it would be Kobe-Duncan from 97 to now, in which case Spurs would have won at least 2 more titles, because Kobe ruined their title runs in 01, 04 & 08.

[T_L_P]

I thought Duncan would also be on that team?

Oh, if that's the case then definitely. I assumed the OP meant if Kobe and Duncan switched places, or if Kobe played for SAS and Duncan doesn't play in the NBA at all.

[red1]

Looks like the consensus is 0-1 rings. Not bad at all for an overrated chucker

[Lebron23]

Non unless Kobe plays with prime David Robinson.

[KOBE143]

He would become the Bill Russell of this era with much better non inflated stats and he would take the coaching job from Pop in his last 2 season to win the title as a player-coach and then would retire as GOAT of all GOAT..