Duncan officially overtook Kobe on all time list and this might be team of the decade

[huskerdu]

Duncan has more minutes and more double doubles than anyone in playoff history while Kobe will spend the rest of his career in the lottery alienating teammates.


This year's Spurs would crush any of the previous champions this decade and probably before dating back to the 08 Celtics.

[La Frescobaldi]

Duncan has more minutes and more double doubles than anyone in playoff history while Kobe will spend the rest of his career in the lottery alienating teammates.


This year's Spurs would crush any of the previous champions this decade and probably before dating back to the 08 Celtics.

They gotta finish before we can compare anything

[SexSymbol]

Duncan has more minutes and more double doubles than anyone in playoff history while Kobe will spend the rest of his career in the lottery alienating teammates.


This year's Spurs would crush any of the previous champions this decade and probably before dating back to the 08 Celtics.
You seem to underrate the triangle and the 08-10 Lakers. And Kobe and other great champions like 11 mavs

[HOoopCityJones]

How? he's not even the best player on the floor.

[oh the horror]

Yet another fake account shows itself.

[J Shuttlesworth]

How? he's not even the best player on the floor.
Him and Kawhi Leonard are, but Kobe wasn't the best player on the floor for 3/5 of his rings

[DFish24]

:no: Role Player

[Eye Test]

lol

how this finals is unfolding is every kobe hater nightmare :oldlol:

[huskerdu]

How? he's not even the best player on the floor.

Neither was Kobe in some of his championships

[HOoopCityJones]

Him and Kawhi Leonard are, but Kobe wasn't the best player on the floor for 3/5 of his rings

:roll: you hurt

Kobe was 1B and our Closer since 2000, keep on hating LeQuit fan.

[ThePhantomCreep]

10 points 4/10 shooting tonight.

This ring would be a legacy builder the way Kareem's 1988 ring was for him.

[J Shuttlesworth]

:roll: you hurt

Kobe was 1B and our Closer since 2000, keep on hating LeQuit fan.
Not hating, just being realistic.

In the 3 peat run, did Kobe win FMVP? If not, why? Did he get robbed?

[Eye Test]

kobe as a youngling = not even 2nd option but 1b with the greatest prime the league has ever seen :bowdown:, next thing u know, 2 straight with gasol as 2nd option :applause: :applause: :applause:

[ThePhantomCreep]

2014 Duncan > 2000 Kobw

2014 Duncan = 1995 Vlade Divac

[DFish24]

10 points 4/10 shooting tonight.

This ring would be a legacy builder the way Kareem's 1988 ring was for him.

This. Dude had 4 points after the first half and his team was up 19. Just a role player at this point.

[T_L_P]

2014 Duncan = 1995 Vlade Divac


2014 Duncan = 1995 Vlade Divac > 2000 Kobe

[T_L_P]

This. Dude had 4 points after the first half and his team was up 19. Just a role player at this point.

Kobe has 9 points and his team still wins :facepalm

[Magic 32]

2014 Duncan > 2000 Kobe

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/ec/a5/01/eca501f82483cf063f73045316c8c2a1.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mx4K47En3eo

[HOoopCityJones]

Not hating, just being realistic.

In the 3 peat run, did Kobe win FMVP? If not, why? Did he get robbed?

Balling out as the second option > Choking as the first

[SuperPippen]

Duncan is still arguably the team's most important player.

He's by far their most consistent player, their defensive anchor, and you Kobe jizz guzzling fakkits really wanna call him a role player?

Can't you salty losers just recognize greatness? Leave Kobe out of it.

[HOoopCityJones]

Duncan is still arguably the team's most important player.

He's by far their most consistent player, their defensive anchor, and you Kobe jizz guzzling fakkits really wanna call him a role player?

Can't you salty losers just recognize greatness? Leave Kobe out of it.

Hey, mofo, the OP brought Kobe up, call him the ****** , we're just arguing our position.

[Mr Feeny]

I think most neutrals had him ahead of Kobe before this. He's just leaving Kobe in his wake by now. Ditto with Shaq.

[I.R.Beast]

Lets get real..duncan has been solid...but lets not make it seem like he's been some dominant force..this is just great team play... Kawhi Leonard is Finals MVP for SA..

[Ne 1]

Neither was Kobe in some of his championships
Sure, but for 2 of those, the gap was minuscule.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Boiled down...it will be Kobe: 5, Duncan: 5.

[KG215]

Yet another fake account shows itself.
Naw, pretty sure this is the same guy whose RealGM handle is huskerdu. He's a bad poster there, too. Shitty posters are gonna be shitty regardless of where they post.

[Mr Feeny]

Boiled down...it will be Kobe: 5, Duncan: 5.

Nah.

It will be 5 titles, 3/4 FMPs, 2 MVPs

vs

5 titles, 2 FMVPs, 1 MVP

[COnDEMnED]

Duncan has more minutes and more double doubles than anyone in playoff history while Kobe will spend the rest of his career in the lottery alienating teammates.


This year's Spurs would crush any of the previous champions this decade and probably before dating back to the 08 Celtics.
Do you understand when a decade starts?

[HOoopCityJones]

Do you understand when a decade starts?

:lol

[huskerdu]

Do you understand when a decade starts?

Yeah hence why I said "and probably before"

Learn to read instead of listening to crappy music

[GoSpursGo1984]

Kobe career> Lebron's career

[west_tip]

lol

how this finals is unfolding is every kobe hater nightmare :oldlol:

:sleeping

Its Spurs v Heat, the only people who think this Finals has anything to do with Kobe are the most tragic of his fanboy obsessives.

[ImKobe]

Duncan has been getting worse by the game in this series, if it was up to his production, the Spurs would be down 1-3 in the series because he's only had one above average game. His FG% is decent, but he's been very turnover prone and he has provided basically zero rim protection in this series. He gets wide open shots at the rim all game because Miami is trying to stop the Spurs 3pt shooting and their ball is moving so well.

This is even worse than Kobe's 2000 ring, tbh.

17 & 9 for the Playoffs before this game, which brings his numbers down even more. At least Kobe averaged 21 4 4 with 1.5 stls & 1.5 blks, Duncan is averaging 1 block a game for the entire Playoffs

[nosfan773]

Duncan has been getting worse by the game in this series, if it was up to his production, the Spurs would be down 1-3 in the series because he's only had one above average game. His FG% is decent, but he's been very turnover prone and he has provided basically zero rim protection in this series. He gets wide open shots at the rim all game because Miami is trying to stop the Spurs 3pt shooting and their ball is moving so well.

This is even worse than Kobe's 2000 ring, tbh.

17 & 9 for the Playoffs before this game, which brings his numbers down even more. At least Kobe averaged 21 4 4 with 1.5 stls & 1.5 blks, Duncan is averaging 1 block a game for the entire Playoffs

Just like last year its great to see Kobe stan do the dap dance. You guys are rooting against the Heat but you don't want Duncan to get more resume material. Its not an easy task.

[COnDEMnED]

Yeah hence why I said "and probably before"

Learn to read instead of listening to crappy music
Even if you include "before" and "probably", it makes a worse case for your argument. Try not to think to hard, smarty...

[ImKobe]

Just like last year its great to see Kobe stan do the dap dance. You guys are rooting against the Heat but you don't want Duncan to get more resume material. Its not an easy task.

Let Duncan have 5, Kobe will get to 6 before it's all said and done, belee dat.

[unbreakable]

Duncan has been getting worse by the game in this series, if it was up to his production, the Spurs would be down 1-3 in the series because he's only had one above average game. His FG% is decent, but he's been very turnover prone and he has provided basically zero rim protection in this series. He gets wide open shots at the rim all game because Miami is trying to stop the Spurs 3pt shooting and their ball is moving so well.

This is even worse than Kobe's 2000 ring, tbh.

17 & 9 for the Playoffs before this game, which brings his numbers down even more. At least Kobe averaged 21 4 4 with 1.5 stls & 1.5 blks, Duncan is averaging 1 block a game for the entire Playoffs

LOL @ you completely ignoring Duncan being the defensive ANCHOR on this Championship team.

a career of 50+ wins doesnt happen by accident, fool.

[Magic 32]

Just like last year its great to see Kobe stan do the dap dance. You guys are rooting against the Heat but you don't want Duncan to get more resume material. Its not an easy task.

But somehow we got what we wanted. :cheers:

[ProfessorMurder]

Duncan's never been below Kobe.

[Ne 1]

Duncan has been getting worse by the game in this series, if it was up to his production, the Spurs would be down 1-3 in the series because he's only had one above average game. His FG% is decent, but he's been very turnover prone and he has provided basically zero rim protection in this series. He gets wide open shots at the rim all game because Miami is trying to stop the Spurs 3pt shooting and their ball is moving so well.

This is even worse than Kobe's 2000 ring, tbh.

17 & 9 for the Playoffs before this game, which brings his numbers down even more. At least Kobe averaged 21 4 4 with 1.5 stls & 1.5 blks, Duncan is averaging 1 block a game for the entire Playoffs
Great post. This doesn't mean Duncan hasn't been an instrumental part of the Spurs success or that he's a dispensable scrub, but it is reality thought. Also concerning Kobe's '00 ring, it can't be forgotten how many huge moments he stepped up in throughout the playoffs which is why even though he wasn't truly elite yet, I don't feel like he was replaceable as some people like to believe.

[DetroitPistonFan]

Team of the decade? So far the Heat are the team in '10's. Lakers was the team of the decade in the '00's since they won 5 NBA Championships out of 7 Finals appearances.

[Ne 1]

LOL @ you completely ignoring Duncan being the defensive ANCHOR on this Championship team.

a career of 50+ wins doesnt happen by accident, fool.
And 2000 was perhaps Kobe's defensive peak season. Anyway it's very rare for a guard to be a defensive anchor or impact a game on defense the same way as a big man

[imnew09]

team of decade when the decade of 2010's hasnt ended. Fken ISH DUMB a$$es again:bowdown:

From 99 - 2010 It was clearly Kobe the player of the decade.

[FlashDwyaneWade3]

Some people here say Duncan is better than Kobe yet Kobe destroyed the Spurs in their meetings in the Playoffs except for 1999 and 2003. Kobe was a Spurs killer. And the Lakers beat the Spurs 4 times and Spurs only beat them twice. So I don't think the Spurs are the team of the decade.

[COnDEMnED]

team of decade when the decade of 2010's hasnt ended. Fken ISH DUMB a$$es again:bowdown:

From 99 - 2010 It was clearly Kobe the player of the decade.
If he goes back to "even before" to the 08 Celtics, he makes the case even worse for himself by putting his "team of the decade" against repeat Lakers, repeat heat, historic mavericks, and a potential all time defensive great Celtics. Not to mention the decade isn't even half over yet and his team hasn't won anything currently. That aside, can't blame the little tyke for being excited. He might have been a youngster the last time the Spurs won a championship.

[NumberSix]

How? he's not even the best player on the floor.
Meh. Better than Kobe was in 2000.

[HOoopCityJones]

Meh. Better than Kobe was in 2000.

:roll: It's sad that you guys can only pick on Kobe through injuries.

Seriously sad, the dude still managed to drop decent numbers on a bum ankle.

AND took over a crucial game when Shaq fouled out.

[Magic 32]

Meh. Better than Kobe was in 2000.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrdTzh_iH6s

The defense!!!

[chopchop20]

Tim even called himself a role player in his press conference tonight...

[joe]

Tim Duncan's personality is what allowed a team like this to be built. Him and Popovich set the tone. Even though he's no longer a superstar talent, this is still his team.

[west_tip]

Tim Duncan's personality is what allowed a team like this to be built.

Exactly, his humility, his intelligence and leadership is why he is pushing 38 and still playing in the Finals.

On the other hand Kobe has not been relevant for a few seasons, last played in a Finals at age 31 and won't sniff another one as long as he lives.

[FlashDwyaneWade3]

Exactly, his humility, his intelligence and leadership is why he is pushing 38 and still playing in the Finals.

On the other hand Kobe has not been relevant for a few seasons, last played in a Finals at age 31 and won't sniff another one as long as he lives.
:facepalm

[huskerdu]

I'm saying this specific 2014 Spurs team could probably beat any team 2008 onward. Their point differential is godly.

08 Celtics are massively overrated getting taken to 7 games by both Hawks and Cavs.

Spurs were taken 7 by the Mavs, but this year's Mavs probably could have gone to ECF in 2008 as well.

And Mavs always matched up poorly with the Spurs. 2014 Mavs were a better matchup than 2011 Mavs were. Harris and Ellis were a handful.

[huskerdu]

If he goes back to "even before" to the 08 Celtics, he makes the case even worse for himself by putting his "team of the decade" against repeat Lakers, repeat heat, historic mavericks, and a potential all time defensive great Celtics. Not to mention the decade isn't even half over yet and his team hasn't won anything currently. That aside, can't blame the little tyke for being excited. He might have been a youngster the last time the Spurs won a championship.

Been following the Spurs since 1995, but thanks.

Heat are the franchise of the decade, but 2014 could beat anyone else. They are absolutely steamrolling everyone.

2011 Mavs faced a Heat team who still lacked chemistry and had tons of close games, where the Spurs closest margin of victory in the Finals is 15+.

Not even close.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Exactly, his humility, his intelligence and leadership is why he is pushing 38 and still playing in the Finals.

On the other hand Kobe has not been relevant for a few seasons, last played in a Finals at age 31 and won't sniff another one as long as he lives.

Famous last words. You are aware that Duncan did not sniff a Finals from age 31-37, right?

[chopchop20]

Famous last words. You are aware that Duncan did not sniff a Finals from age 31-37, right?

Furthermore... hasn't Kobe won 2 since the last time Timmie won?

[Kiddlovesnets]

Duncan has always been higher than Kobe, always was and always will be. What do you mean by he's officially overtook Kobe when hes already ahead?
:facepalm

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Him and Kawhi Leonard are, but Kobe wasn't the best player on the floor for 3/5 of his rings

Because not being better than prime Shaq is equivalent to not being better than Kawahi Leonard and Tony Parker?

[STATUTORY]

kobe haters flailing, grasping at straws :roll:

[Mr Feeny]

Because not being better than prime Shaq is equivalent to not being better than Kawahi Leonard and Tony Parker?

Who said its equivilant? People just know the distinction between lead-dog rings and supporting cast rings:cheers:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Who said its equivilant? People just know the distinction between lead-dog rings and supporting cast rings:cheers:

The distinction is of the supporting cast and "lead dog" would only matter if basketball was a 2 on 2 game. Isn't itit funny how Kobe is the only one who gets penalized for not being better than prime Shaq when the alleged greatest PF of all time with an overlapping prime somehow dodges the comparison. :oldlol:

[aboss4real24]

kobe will always be better than TD

[Mr Feeny]

The distinction is of the supporting cast and "lead dog" would only matter if basketball was a 2 on 2 game. Isn't itit funny how Kobe is the only one who gets penalized for not being better than prime Shaq when the alleged greatest PF of all time with an overlapping prime somehow dodges the comparison. :oldlol:

Well that's your opinion. I think you're in the minority too, unfortunately. Duncan, Lebron etc never had the luxury of being lead to a title by Shaq:cheers:
Oh how they would kill for a 28 ppg, 60%fg scorer who commands double teams and leaves them on single coverage:D

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Well that's your opinion. I think you're in the minority too, unfortunately. Duncan, Lebron etc never had the luxury of being lead to a title by Shaq:cheers:
Oh how they would kill for a 28 ppg, 60%fg scorer who commands double teams and leaves them on single coverage:D

Kobe never had the luxury of playing on a super deep team raining threes everywhere while your barely playing starter minutes and still end up a one seed. :facepalm

The Spurs current 3-8 >>>>> a Dream Team composed of the best Lakers 3-8 from any title winning team 00-02, 09-10

[Warners0]

Kobe never had the luxury of playing on a super deep team raining threes everywhere while your barely playing starter minutes and still end up a one seed. :facepalm

The Spurs current 3-8 >>>>> a Dream Team composed of the best Lakers 3-8 from any title winning team 00-02, 09-10

Yea Kobe was never surrounded by players like Danny Green and Boris Diaw who nobody wanted and anyone could have picked up.

There is a reason why players like this shine playing with Duncan and not with Kobe.

[Mr Feeny]

Kobe never had the luxury of playing on a super deep team raining threes everywhere while your barely playing starter minutes and still end up a one seed. :facepalm

The Spurs current 3-8 >>>>> a Dream Team composed of the best Lakers 3-8 from any title winning team 00-02, 09-10

Why go past the 1-2?:no:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Yea Kobe was never surrounded by players like Danny Green and Boris Diaw who nobody wanted and anyone could have picked up.

There is a reason why players like this shine playing with Duncan and not with Kobe.

So Duncan fans want extra credit now for being on a stacked team now? :oldlol:

Duncan makes Green shoot some some absurd percentage from 3.
Duncan makes Diaw flirt with a triple double.

Starting to sound a lot like Lebron mythologists.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Why go past the 1-2?:no:

Maybe ask Duncan and Popovich why, They seem to get it. :confusedshrug:

[DMAVS41]

Kobe never had the luxury of playing on a super deep team raining threes everywhere while your barely playing starter minutes and still end up a one seed. :facepalm

The Spurs current 3-8 >>>>> a Dream Team composed of the best Lakers 3-8 from any title winning team 00-02, 09-10

Because Kobe wouldn't work on a team like that. Stop ignoring this shit!

You think Kobe works on a team that shares the ball and doesn't hold it and gun for stats????????

Also, Duncan took a huge paycut to make a team like this happen...what did Kobe do? Oh, that's right, he signed a monster deal that prevents the Lakers from building a team like this.

And what is even funnier, is how Kobe did with nash, gasol, and howard the year before.

Simply put...Kobe would never sacrifice his numbers or paycheck in order to build a team like the current Spurs.

Which is just one of many man many reasons;

Duncan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kobe

[Warners0]

So Duncan fans want extra credit now for being on a stacked team now? :oldlol:

Duncan makes Green shoot some some absurd percentage from 3.
Duncan makes Diaw flirt with a triple double.

Starting to sound a lot like Lebron mythologists.

LOL @ Danny Green and Boris Diaw being great players. Nobody wanted these dudes.

Anyone could of had Boris Diaw when he was cut by the Bobcats.

Same thing with Danny Green he was cut by the Cavs cut by the Spurs twice and nobody even looked at him.

Give me a break.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Because Kobe wouldn't work on a team like that. Stop ignoring this shit!

You think Kobe works on a team that shares the ball and doesn't hold it and gun for stats????????

Also, Duncan took a huge paycut to make a team like this happen...what did Kobe do? Oh, that's right, he signed a monster deal that prevents the Lakers from building a team like this.

And what is even funnier, is how Kobe did with nash, gasol, and howard the year before.

Simply put...Kobe would never sacrifice his numbers or paycheck in order to build a team like the current Spurs.

Which is just one of many man many reasons;

Duncan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kobe

http://www.toledoblade.com/image/2008/08/25/800x_b1_cCM_z/U-S-basketball-player-Kobe-Bryant-top-center-leaps-on-top-of-his-teammates-as-they-celebrate-after-the-U-S-defeated-Spain-to-win-the-gold-medal-in-men-s-basketball-at-the-Beijing-2008-Olympic-Games-August-24-2008.jpg

:biggums:

[DMAVS41]

LOL @ Danny Green and Boris Diaw being great players. Nobody wanted these dudes.

Anyone could of had Boris Diaw when he was cut by the Bobcats.

Same thing with Danny Green he was cut by the Cavs cut by the Spurs twice and nobody even looked at him.

Give me a break.


Exactly.

Cast off players like Green, Mills, and Diaw are now great? Belly? These are guys that could have been had by the entire league repeatedly.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Exactly.

Cast off players like Green, Mills, and Diaw are now great? Belly? These are guys that could have been had by the entire league repeatedly.


What makes a player great? How they play or how much they were wanted beforehand?

Was Kwame Brown a great player?

[DMAVS41]

http://www.toledoblade.com/image/2008/08/25/800x_b1_cCM_z/U-S-basketball-player-Kobe-Bryant-top-center-leaps-on-top-of-his-teammates-as-they-celebrate-after-the-U-S-defeated-Spain-to-win-the-gold-medal-in-men-s-basketball-at-the-Beijing-2008-Olympic-Games-August-24-2008.jpg

:biggums:

Great response.

So Kobe did take less money to help his team? He has sacrificed his numbers and minutes to help his team?

He does lead? He does work his ass off on defense?


Kobe, post game 6 of the 2010 NBA finals, hasn't done anything of note. When he actually has played, he's been a gunner that refuses to play team ball or defense.

Just the truth brah.

There is no way the Lakers could have built a Spurs style team around him based on his ****ing enormous ego and selfishness alone....not even including the his salary that ****s the team from the jump.

[DMAVS41]

What makes a player great? How they play or how much they were wanted beforehand?

Was Kwame Brown a great player?

The point is that you call these guys great because of the culture of the Spurs and the role everyone (including the best players) take on the team.

If Kobe played with half of those guys...you moronic Kobe stans would be calling them scrubs that can't create their own shot....the common Kobe stan speak the last few years.

You had Dwight Howard, the perfect piece next to Kobe, and drove him out of town.

but you are going to make it work with splitter, mills, diaw, and green????

Heard the same shit in 2011. How great Terry, Kidd, Marion, Barea, Stevenson, Butler, and Chandler. Nearly all cast off players. How'd that 25 million dollar deal work out for the Clippers with Butler? How has paying Chandler 60 million gone for the Knicks? Barea on the Wolves? What happened to Josh Howard's career when he left the Mavs?

I't situational....that is what you can't grasp. And when you have leaders of teams that do what is best for the team...and don't care about stats or ego or credit...etc. It allows those players to play a role they are well suited for and allows them to play at or near their optimal level.

Kobe, at no point in his career, could ever have led Spurs/Mavs style teams the way you are implying. Guy ****ing turns Steve Nash into an off ball player...ROFL

[oh the horror]

They may win one title with this current spurs roster and suddenly they may be the team of the decade?


I mean they're very good and play ball the right way but let's not get crazy.

[crisoner]

Really what this soon to be title for the Spurs does is take out LeBron....now it's a Duncan vs. Kobe convo.

Which just goes to show the LeBron vs. Jordan talk was real premature.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Great response.

So Kobe did take less money to help his team? He has sacrificed his numbers and minutes to help his team?

He does lead? He does work his ass off on defense?


Kobe, post game 6 of the 2010 NBA finals, hasn't done anything of note. When he actually has played, he's been a gunner that refuses to play team ball or defense.

Just the truth brah.

There is no way the Lakers could have built a Spurs style team around him based on his ****ing enormous ego and selfishness alone....not even including the his salary that ****s the team from the jump.


Kobe's never had the luxury the sacrifice numbers to build a NBA championship contending team.

When he was presented with the opportunity to do so for the United States. He did exactly what you claim he is incapable of. Focused on defense and shot way less. Also ended up with two golds.

Meanwhile...

http://www2.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Olympics+Day+15+Basketball+6gRyQ25aUQcl.jpg

[IllegalD]

Because Kobe wouldn't work on a team like that. Stop ignoring this shit!

You think Kobe works on a team that shares the ball and doesn't hold it and gun for stats????????

Also, Duncan took a huge paycut to make a team like this happen...what did Kobe do? Oh, that's right, he signed a monster deal that prevents the Lakers from building a team like this.

And what is even funnier, is how Kobe did with nash, gasol, and howard the year before.

Simply put...Kobe would never sacrifice his numbers or paycheck in order to build a team like the current Spurs.

Which is just one of many man many reasons;

Duncan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kobe


Kobe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dirk

Which is why you spend 99.9% of your posts trying to diminish him.

[DMAVS41]

Kobe's never had the luxury the sacrifice numbers to build a NBA championship contending team.

When he was presented with the opportunity to do so for the United States. He did exactly what you claim he is incapable of. Focused on defense and shot way less. Also ended up with two golds.

Meanwhile...

http://www2.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Olympics+Day+15+Basketball+6gRyQ25aUQcl.jpg

The olympics is not the NBA moron...

[DMAVS41]

Kobe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dirk

Which is why you spend 99.9% of your posts trying to diminish him.

Meh...I disagree. I'd take Dirk...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

The olympics is not the NBA moron...

:roll:

My bad I thought they were both playing basketball.

[DMAVS41]

:roll:

My bad I thought they were both playing basketball.

Yea...and taking on less of a role on an olympic team is in no way comparable to taking on less of a role in the NBA.

Again, Kobe answered this for us. He signed his contract. You don't do that if you want to take on a lesser role and help the team win. He wants his numbers. And he's earned that...

But don't come on here talking about Kobe hasn't had the luxury of deep teams late in his career. First of all, he did...he had loaded teams from 08 through 11...and he's been injured in 13 and 14. The only team late in his career that wasn't great was in 2012.

[GimmeThat]

if you were so eager to say Kobe was the player of the decade before this final series.

permission granted.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Yea...and taking on less of a role on an olympic team is in no way comparable to taking on less of a role in the NBA.

Again, Kobe answered this for us. He signed his contract. You don't do that if you want to take on a lesser role and help the team win. He wants his numbers. And he's earned that...

But don't come on here talking about Kobe hasn't had the luxury of deep teams late in his career. First of all, he did...he had loaded teams from 08 through 11...and he's been injured in 13 and 14. The only team late in his career that wasn't great was in 2012.

I don't know what the relevance is of Kobe's future contract has on titles won anywhere from 3-14 years ago.

Can you construct a better 3-8 than the current Spurs made up of from a best of team from the 3-8 from the Lakers last 5 title winning teams?

[T_L_P]

Is this guy really using the Olympics as an example of Kobe changing his ethos? How many games did they play, 10?

The simple fact is, even in 2013, Kobe only had a few great years left. He should have helped morph Dwight into the future of the franchise. Instead he had to be the guy, Dwight left, and now Kobe will never compete for a championship again. It's not even like he took less money to try and help make another superteam. The Lakers can't do anything right now, except hope their older, somewhat broken down star will get their team back into the Playoffs -- which, parenthetically, is probably exactly how Kobe likes it.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Is this guy really using the Olympics as an example of Kobe changing his ethos? How many games did they play, 10?

The simple fact is, even in 2013, Kobe only had a few great years left. He should have helped morph Dwight into the future of the franchise. Instead he had to be the guy, Dwight left, and now Kobe will never compete for a championship again. It's not even like he took less money to try and make another attempt at a superteam. The Lakers can't do anything right now, except hope their older, somewhat broken down star will get their team back into the Playoffs again -- which, parenthetically, is probably exactly how Kobe likes it.

Do you guys forget Kobe never even played in the playoffs that year?
And he got injured playing some absurd amount of minutes?

Thats comparable to Duncan coasting all season and the Spurs ending up a one seed? Not only that you want extra credit for that? Kobe couldn't play for some stacked team. He would rather be forced to stay on the court all year and tear his achilles. The delusion is strong.

:facepalm

[DMAVS41]

I don't know what the relevance is of Kobe's future contract has on titles won anywhere from 3-14 years ago.

Can you construct a better 3-8 than the current Spurs made up of from a best of team from the 3-8 from the Lakers last 5 title winning teams?

You can't because of Kobe's contracts in the past.

Duncan has been making 10 million a year of like 4 years now. And, as the leader and best player on the team, it sets an example for Parker and Manu to take less money than they could get.

Did Kobe do that? Did he ever set that "team first" example?

The problem you can't seem to grasp is that Kobe wouldn't have even allowed for it to happen....and even if they somehow built a team like this around Kobe...it wouldn't work because he doesn't play the kind of team ball necessary. He is too ball dominant to make it work. You think this Spurs team would work if Parker held the ball as often as Kobe does????

In fact, probably the only weakness on this Spurs team shows itself when Parker dribbles the life out of the ball and tries to do shit on his own.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

You can't because of Kobe's contracts in the past.

Duncan has been making 10 million a year of like 4 years now. And, as the leader and best player on the team, it sets an example for Parker and Manu to take less money than they could get.

Did Kobe do that? Did he ever set that "team first" example?

The problem you can't seem to grasp is that Kobe wouldn't have even allowed for it to happen....and even if they somehow built a team like this around Kobe...it wouldn't work because he doesn't play the kind of team ball necessary. He is too ball dominant to make it work. You think this Spurs team would work if Parker held the ball as often as Kobe does????

In fact, probably the only weakness on this Spurs team shows itself when Parker dribbles the life out of the ball and tries to do shit on his own.

Did you ever watch the triangle offense in action? Take a look at the offensive ratings of Lakers championship teams and slap yourself. I have to go to work but somehow you amaze me with your increasing delusion.

[Straight_Ballin]

Duncan was always higher than Kobe. These finals don't matter to Duncan. He doesn't even have to try.

[DMAVS41]

Did you ever watch the triangle offense in action? Take a look at the offensive ratings of Lakers championship teams and slap yourself. I have to go to work but somehow you amaze me with your increasing delusion.

Dude...you have to wake up to reality. I'm sorry, but you are under a huge delusion that Kobe is some team first guy on and off the court like Duncan.

Again...Kobe answered this for us.

You really think Dirk/Mavs fans should have the right to complain about the quality of team we have going forward if Dirk signs a 2 year 49 million dollar deal??????

[Heavincent]

Is this guy really using the Olympics as an example of Kobe changing his ethos? How many games did they play, 10?

The simple fact is, even in 2013, Kobe only had a few great years left. He should have helped morph Dwight into the future of the franchise. Instead he had to be the guy, Dwight left, and now Kobe will never compete for a championship again. It's not even like he took less money to try and help make another superteam. The Lakers can't do anything right now, except hope their older, somewhat broken down star will get their team back into the Playoffs -- which, parenthetically, is probably exactly how Kobe likes it.

Why would he give the team to Dwight? Kobe was still a much better player than Howard in 2013.

BTW, Kobe's "selfish chucking" led to 5 rings, so I'd say he's done alright as a teammate. Pau's stats didn't drop off at all despite going from 1st option to second option, Ariza, Odom, Bynum, Brown, and even Luke ****ing Walton thrived playing with Kobe. How come "the ultimate teammate" Lebron relegates Chris Bosh to spot up shooting duty? Only gets 4 touches in a finals game. When did that happen to Pau? He got the same amount of shot attempts in LA as he did in Memphis. Bynum also had that big season in 2012 and got a bunch of touches every game.

The shit about Kobe not being a good teammate is a complete myth.

[Frozen1]

Duncan is not more than a role player right now. Spurs are blowing out the heat with him sitting on the bench.

If a role player is going to win the FMVP, give it to Diaw, not Duncan.

But everyone knows Duncan will win. And the experts will put him ahead of Kobe all time, even though he isn

[KobeRules24]

A year ago i had Duncan a few spots behind my favorite player. i have to say that i know have to rank Duncan ahead of Kobe, specially since kobe did nothing this year and Duncan keeps making finals series and winning titles. Timmy is a legend and deserves more respect.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Again how can you overtake someone already behind you?
:rolleyes:

[T_L_P]

[QUOTE=Frozen1]Duncan is not more than a role player right now. Spurs are blowing out the heat with him sitting on the bench.

If a role player is going to win the FMVP, give it to Diaw, not Duncan.

But everyone knows Duncan will win. And the experts will put him ahead of Kobe all time, even though he isn

[Stringer Bell]

Duncan has always been higher on the all-time list than Kobe. That's no slight to Kobe, he's still high up there.

:oldlol: :roll: at all the "role player" stuff, and saying Kobe's finals in 2000 was better. Kobe had one good game in that finals and wasn't healthy. He barely made a third of his FGs LOL.

Duncan put up better numbers so far and remains a huge part of their interior defense.

Kobe stans are something else.

[rmt]

Why would he give the team to Dwight? Kobe was still a much better player than Howard in 2013.

BTW, Kobe's "selfish chucking" led to 5 rings, so I'd say he's done alright as a teammate. Pau's stats didn't drop off at all despite going from 1st option to second option, Ariza, Odom, Bynum, Brown, and even Luke ****ing Walton thrived playing with Kobe. How come "the ultimate teammate" Lebron relegates Chris Bosh to spot up shooting duty? Only gets 4 touches in a finals game. When did that happen to Pau? He got the same amount of shot attempts in LA as he did in Memphis. Bynum also had that big season in 2012 and got a bunch of touches every game.

The shit about Kobe not being a good teammate is a complete myth.

what kobe and his stans dont understand is he needs to sacrifice his stats and numbers so that young players can grow and develop for the good of the team and franchise. his continued insistence on being the man turns off others who wants to play with that. take note of the teamwork displayed by sas. everyone has a chance to shine. the young get to learn and become better players. the old get rest and support to prolong their career.

[HOoopCityJones]

what kobe and his stans dont understand is he needs to sacrifice his stats and numbers so that young players can grow and develop for the good of the team and franchise. his continued insistence on being the man turns off others who wants to play with that. take note of the teamwork displayed by sas. everyone has a chance to shine. the young get to learn and become better players. the old get rest and support to prolong their career.

Dude, if this was any other player declining stats and being relegated to a role playing role on a Team would be a slight against any All-time players, but according to you Spurs fans and Duncan stans , he deserves MORE credit for taking a back seat. Ive never heard such bullshit in my life.


Timmy has been turnover prone this entire series , getting stripped by wing players half his size, if it wasn't for Tony and Kawhii he woulda choked this series away a long time ago as the first option, again if this was ANYONE else, Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Shaq, Dwight..they would be getting killed for it on this forum. Hell Wade's getting killed right now.

But since Duncan is quiet, Nice guy , takes paycuts cuz he declined since 07 , he's better all time because he's accepting his role playing role? :biggums: :wtf:

:lol And you all call us delusional.

[T_L_P]

Dude, if this was any other player declining stats and being relegated to a role playing role on a Team would be a slight against any All-time players, but according to you Spurs fans and Duncan stans , he deserves MORE credit for taking a back seat. Ive never heard such bullshit in my life.


Timmy has been turnover prone this entire series , getting stripped by wing players half his size, if it wasn't for Tony and Kawhii he woulda choked this series away a long time ago as the first option, again if this was ANYONE else, Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Shaq, Dwight..they would be getting killed for it on this forum. Hell Wade's getting killed right now.

But since Duncan is quiet, Nice guy , takes paycuts cuz he declined since 07 , he's better all time because he's accepting his role playing role? :biggums: :wtf:

:lol And you all call us delusional.

You are comparing these guys to a 38 year old. How many players Duncan's age have outproduced him? It's funny that you don't mention Kareem at all though.

Kobe would never take a role. And look what happened: Shaq left, Kobe's Lakers did nothing for 3 years, and now, without Dwight, the Lakers are back to sucking ass again.

[HOoopCityJones]

You are comparing these guys to a 38 year old. How many players Duncan's age have outproduced him?

It's funny that you don't mention Kareem at all though. Agenda spotted.

Wtf does Kareem have to do with anything? I'm talking about these ridiculous double standards you Kobe haters have.

It doesn't matter when Duncan chokes in the Finals

Doesn't matter when he has multiple turnovers during a crucial game.


Doesn't matter that he's being outplayed by the FOURTH option, fifth if you count Diaw before Leonard.

The point I'm trying to make is if anyone else was performing under these circumstances there wouldn't be threads about him moving above anyone all-time. Duncan isn't the first option on this Team and Kobe's 5th ring came as the first option. How does Duncan get the nod just for being nicer? that's essentially what you guys are saying and it's juvenile, if not Damn pathetic. Personal opinion? Sure why not.

But "Officially"? Gimmie a break.

Tell me this TLP, if Kobe gets a 6th ring in the next few years as the 2nd or 3rd option, does he move above anyone all-time dropping his 2000 numbers?

[NBASTATMAN]

Yea Kobe was never surrounded by players like Danny Green and Boris Diaw who nobody wanted and anyone could have picked up.

There is a reason why players like this shine playing with Duncan and not with Kobe.


Nailed this

[boozehound]

duncan already was ahead of kobe for all serious basketball fans.

[T_L_P]

Wtf does Kareem have to do with anything? I'm talking about these ridiculous double standards you Kobe haters have.

It doesn't matter when Duncan chokes in the Finals

Doesn't matter when he has multiple turnovers during a crucial game.


Doesn't matter that he's being outplayed by the FOURTH option, fifth if you count Diaw.

The point I'm trying to make is if anyone else was performing under these circumstances there wouldn't be threads about him moving above anyone all-time. Duncan isn't the first option on this Team and Kobe's 5th ring came as the first option. How does Duncan get the nod just for being nicer? that's essentially what you guys are saying and it's juvenile, if not Damn pathetic. Personal opinion? Sure why not.

But "Officially"? Gimmie a break.

Tell me this TLP, if Kobe gets a 6th ring in the next few years as the 2nd or 3rd option, does he move above anyone all-time dropping his 2000 numbers?

But you don't get it. This isn't 2005 Tim Duncan being outplayed by the fifth option, it's a 38-year-old, and he's still the third leading scorer and leading rebounder. Kareem averaged like 15/5 in his last Finals win, and he was about 39. It's expected. 38-year-olds are not 20/10 players. Hakeem and Robinson were washed up. Shaq was a bench player. Magic and Bird were out of the league.

Nothing Duncan does at this point will tarnish his legacy, and he's still having a good Finals, and he had an incredible Finals last year (one shot is not choking, consistently playing bad is).

Why can't you get this through your head? Kobe's three airballs against the Jazz didn't end his legacy. He was a damn kid, and Duncan is a damn dinosaur.

Are you still seriously saying Duncan choked the 2013 Finals? He choked on a play. Without his consistent play in that series, his team aren't even in a place to tie it in a game 7. They would have lost in 5.

[chopchop20]

Because Kobe wouldn't work on a team like that. Stop ignoring this shit!

You think Kobe works on a team that shares the ball and doesn't hold it and gun for stats????????

Also, Duncan took a huge paycut to make a team like this happen...what did Kobe do? Oh, that's right, he signed a monster deal that prevents the Lakers from building a team like this.

And what is even funnier, is how Kobe did with nash, gasol, and howard the year before.

Simply put...Kobe would never sacrifice his numbers or paycheck in order to build a team like the current Spurs.

Which is just one of many man many reasons;

Duncan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kobe

Do you have any idea about the Triangle offense? Are you saying that the ball is not shared?

[chopchop20]

But you don't get it. This isn't 2005 Tim Duncan being outplayed by the fifth option, it's a 38-year-old, and he's still the third leading scorer and leading rebounder. Kareem averaged like 15/5 in his last Finals win, and he was about 39. It's expected. 38-year-olds are not 20/10 players. Hakeem and Robinson were washed up. Shaq was a bench player. Magic and Bird were out of the league.

Nothing Duncan does at this point will tarnish his legacy, and he's still having a good Finals, and he had an incredible Finals last year (one shot is not choking, consistently playing bad is).

Why can't you get this through your head? Kobe's three airballs against the Jazz didn't end his legacy. He was a damn kid, and Duncan is a damn dinosaur.

Are you still seriously saying Duncan choked the 2013 Finals? He choked on a play. Without his consistent play in that series, his team aren't even in a place to tie it in a game 7. They would have lost in 5.

Who's guarding Tim this series? Miami doesn't even start a center. He SHOULD put up decent numbers....

[HOoopCityJones]

But you don't get it. This isn't 2005 Tim Duncan being outplayed by the fifth option, it's a 38-year-old, and he's still the third leading scorer and leading rebounder. Kareem averaged like 15/5 in his last Finals win, and he was about 39. It's expected. 38-year-olds are not 20/10 players. Hakeem and Robinson were washed up. Shaq was a bench player. Magic and Bird were out of the league.

Nothing Duncan does at this point will tarnish his legacy, and he's still having a good Finals, and he had an incredible Finals last year (one shot is not choking, consistently playing bad is).

Why can't you get this through your head? Kobe's three airballs against the Jazz didn't end his legacy. He was a damn kid, and Duncan is a damn dinosaur.

Are you still seriously saying Duncan choked the 2013 Finals? He choked on a play. Without his consistent play in that series, his team aren't even in a place to tie it in a game 7. They would have lost in 5.

Son , outplayed is outplayed , I'm not gonna give Duncan a nod over an All-time great because of contributing to whats already a great Team. It's like Duncan fans and Lebron stans live in this delusional world where Kobe should be penalized three of his Rings just for playing next to Shaq, but them playing on an overly talented Team doesn't mean anything. For all five of his rings , Kobe's Teams have only been Two deep at a time.

Duncan isn't what got them here. Pop, Tony and Leonard are.

[Rocketswin2013]

Hold on.....What are Kobe fans even arguing at this point? I can go back to that comment where T_L_P slammed the notion of Kobe having better stats.......


Amd after this series It's not even close, Duncan has 5 rings, possibly 4 FMVP(If not, his 3 are more than KB's) more MVPs, much better longevity.....

I mean...What the hell is the argument? ALL-NBA selections?

[T_L_P]

Son , outplayed is outplayed , I'm not gonna give Duncan a nod over an All-time great because of contributing to whats already a great Team. It's like Duncan fans and Lebron stans live in this delusional world where Kobe should be penalized three of his Rings just for playing next to Shaq, but them playing on an overly talented Team doesn't mean anything. For all five of his rings , Kobe's Teams have only been Two deep at a time.

Duncan isn't what got them here. Pop, Tony and Leonard are.

And yet, Duncan is the second leading scorer, leading rebounder, leading shotblocker, 1st in PER, 1st in Win Shares, and second in WS/48. I'm pretty sure you started watching the Spurs two games ago, because Kawhi did nothing to put himself ahead of Duncan this year before that point.

All TP and Kawhi though.

Shut up kid. Kobe was being carried through the Playoff in his prime. Duncan is still arguably the best player at 38. Huge difference. Duncan > tired old shit bag Kobe.

[Legends66NBA7]

Since when does individual play in context not get rewarded all-time when the team he is on loses ?

I thought individual play gets rewarded the highest amongst arbitrary lists despite the outcome of a team, does it not ?

[DMAVS41]

Do you have any idea about the Triangle offense? Are you saying that the ball is not shared?

I'm saying Kobe would not share it enough with the likes of Diaw, Mills, Splitter, Belly...etc.

He wouldn't sacrifice his own game/numbers enough to make it work...it's not his game...never has been and it's yet to be seen in the future.

But to this point...he has showed no signs of playing less minutes, shooting less, taking less money...etc.

All the things that start with Duncan and then filter down to the rest of the team.

Part of being a great player and having a great career is doing what Duncan did around 2011 and what Dirk did starting in 2013.

And Dirk is hopefully going to follow through and take the Duncan type paycut to help out even more.

Instead, you've got Kobe signing a big deal and basically refusing to relinquish control to anybody else.

You guys had a top 10 player on your team in 2013 ready for a new contract and he bolted for ****ing Houston, Texas to get away...ROFL

Not enough is made of that! It's horrible...

[HOoopCityJones]

And yet, Duncan is the second leading scorer, leading rebounder, leading shotblocker, 1st in PER, 1st in Win Shares, and second in WS/48. I'm pretty sure you started watching the Spurs two games ago, because Kawhi did nothing to put himself ahead of Duncan this year before that point.

All TP and Kawhi though.

Shut up kid. Kobe was being carried through the Playoff in his prime. Duncan is still arguably the best player at 38. Huge difference. Duncan > tired old shit bag Kobe.

Now your feelings are just hurt. :facepalm


Lebron on two cramped legs shits in Duncan's cereal.


Lol Kobe's the tired old shit bag , how ironic. :roll:

[Derka]

Bob Mould doe :rockon:

[T_L_P]

Now your feelings are just hurt. :facepalm


Lebron on two cramped legs shits in Duncan's cereal.


Lol Kobe's the tired old shit bag , how ironic. :roll:

Obviously I'm talking about on his team. :facepalm

Duncan is on his way to winning another ring and potential FMVP. Kobe is watching him play and scheduling trips to Germany to drain his knee...if that ain't a tired old shitbag, I'm afraid I don't know what is.

[chopchop20]

I'm saying Kobe would not share it enough with the likes of Diaw, Mills, Splitter, Belly...etc.

He wouldn't sacrifice his own game/numbers enough to make it work...it's not his game...never has been and it's yet to be seen in the future.

But to this point...he has showed no signs of playing less minutes, shooting less, taking less money...etc.

All the things that start with Duncan and then filter down to the rest of the team.

Part of being a great player and having a great career is doing what Duncan did around 2011 and what Dirk did starting in 2013.

And Dirk is hopefully going to follow through and take the Duncan type paycut to help out even more.

Instead, you've got Kobe signing a big deal and basically refusing to relinquish control to anybody else.

You guys had a top 10 player on your team in 2013 ready for a new contract and he bolted for ****ing Houston, Texas to get away...ROFL

Not enough is made of that! It's horrible...

Kobe took $8 Million less than he could have received.... But really, that whole argument makes no sense at all.

The owners are the ones who put the salary cap in place. Yet no one complains about that fact (ironically). Owners don't put a cap on their profits but you expect players to put a cap on their finite earning potential?

So in reality, you're saying that players (millionaires) should take less so that owners (billionaires) can make more?

[chopchop20]

Obviously I'm talking about on his team. :facepalm

Duncan is on his way to winning another ring and potential FMVP. Kobe is watching him play and scheduling trips to Germany to drain his knee...if that ain't a tired old shitbag, I'm afraid I don't know what is.

What was Duncan doing when Kobe won his 5th ring?

[T_L_P]

What was Duncan doing when Kobe won his 5th ring?

Being called a tired old shitbag.

[chopchop20]

Being called a tired old shitbag.

So he was to tired to actually lead his Spurs to victory over the Lakers?

[iBandwagon]

I'm sure it has been mentioned, but Duncan didn't just "officially [overtake] Kobe." He was already above Kobe. The only difference is Duncan took away the 5>4 argument that Kobe fans used.

[DMAVS41]

Kobe took $8 Million less than he could have received.... But really, that whole argument makes no sense at all.

The owners are the ones who put the salary cap in place. Yet no one complains about that fact (ironically). Owners don't put a cap on their profits but you expect players to put a cap on their finite earning potential?

So in reality, you're saying that players (millionaires) should take less so that owners (billionaires) can make more?

What?

I have no problem with Kobe taking as much money as he can get...but then don't turn around and say he doesn't have the luxury of a Spurs type team like Duncan has.

Because the only reason the Spurs have the team they currently have is because Duncan set the example both on and off the court with taking a reduced salary and reduced role.

That is my point.

I couldn't care less in broad terms about Kobe's finances...


Also, the whole argument about Kobe vs Duncan in help is pointless. Kobe played with peak/prime Shaq for 8 years. For 8 ****ing years of his career he had a GOAT Peak candidate...

LOL @ Kobe fans bitching about help.

[AlphaWolf24]

What?

I have no problem with Kobe taking as much money as he can get...but then don't turn around and say he doesn't have the luxury of a Spurs type team like Duncan has.

Because the only reason the Spurs have the team they currently have is because Duncan set the example both on and off the court with taking a reduced salary and reduced role.

That is my point.

I couldn't care less in broad terms about Kobe's finances...


Also, the whole argument about Kobe vs Duncan in help is pointless. Kobe played with peak/prime Shaq for 8 years. For 8 ****ing years of his career he had a GOAT Peak candidate...

LOL @ Kobe fans bitching about help.


peak Snaq was putting toronto Chris Bosh Numbers...

Hardaway played with peak Snaq and never sniffed the sucess Kobe had...

Wade played with skinny snaq and never sniffed the sucess Kobe had....won a title then followed it up with a 15 win season:lol

Kobe played with snaq and they dominated....but who was the 3rd option?....D Fish?....old man Rice....

Snaq was a great player.....as was Kobe....Kobe did much more for the team and still dominated without Snaq. In fact Kobe without Snaq is more dominant.

look at how much help Dirk has had throughout his career....playing with prime Nash as a 3rd option....he still fizzlled out of the Playoffs year after year.

when he had a old slow unstacked team....he beat the Heat!!!...having a stacked team doesn't mean = easy win.

Fat Snaq Oneal with Fisher as a 3rd option is not a stacked team...:facepalm


PS: has anyone seen Pauk the spider?

[chopchop20]

What?

I have no problem with Kobe taking as much money as he can get...but then don't turn around and say he doesn't have the luxury of a Spurs type team like Duncan has.

Because the only reason the Spurs have the team they currently have is because Duncan set the example both on and off the court with taking a reduced salary and reduced role.

That is my point.

I couldn't care less in broad terms about Kobe's finances...


Also, the whole argument about Kobe vs Duncan in help is pointless. Kobe played with peak/prime Shaq for 8 years. For 8 ****ing years of his career he had a GOAT Peak candidate...

LOL @ Kobe fans bitching about help.

Taking less money is a moot point if you simply remove the salary cap, no? Why treat the symptoms when you can remove the disease...

It's the job of the GM and ownership to put the best product on the floor to win. Kobe has no say on the roster or head coach. So why does the burden of winning fall solely on his shoulders?

Also, you do realize that Kobe went to 3 Finals without Shaq... Next excuse?