Lebron's first finals appearance

[allball]

All you who like to go on about this 2/5 business. Why, if you're being objective, are you counting this finals appearance AGAINST him? shouldn't it be seen as an accomplishment given his age and the roster he had to work with?

would he have been better to have lost in the ECF?

[Warfan]

Those people are just trolling or retarded, or probably a bit of both. I mean he didn't play well at all in the finals, but I think leading that team to the finals adds to his legacy. There aren't many other players that could do it...

[PJR]

When it comes to discussing LeBron, all logic, reason, and perspective goes out the window.

[uber]

When it comes to discussing LeBron, all logic, reason, and perspective goes out the window.

you can say this for both sides .. the stans and the haters

[PJR]

you can say this for both sides .. the stans and the haters

True. But it's far worse on one side than it is on the other. Far worse.

[fpliii]

All you who like to go on about this 2/5 business. Why, if you're being objective, are you counting this finals appearance AGAINST him? shouldn't it be seen as an accomplishment given his age and the roster he had to work with?

would he have been better to have lost in the ECF?
Nobody really counts it against him (and most probably don't count this year against him, 2010 and 2011 are obviously the big black eyes in his postseason career), but the 2/5 trolling by anti-LeBron posters is a reaction to all the hyping by pro-LeBron posters. If you're going to talk trash when things are going your way, you gotta expect to get it right back when they aren't going so well.

[tmacattack33]

Using Finals Wins-to-Finals Losses as some type of big stat to prove who better is actually a good filter for seeing which fans have terrible logic and aren't worth listening to.

[IllegalD]

Maybe because for 10+ years the media and LeBron Stans have been shoving the "LeBron next MJ" or even "BETTER than MJ, will leave him eating his dust" hype d*ck down our collective throats.

If he had won and 3-peated the board would be littered with "Is LeBron already unanimous GOAT?" "Will LeBron finish with 9 rings?" posts.

Blah blah blah.

So why shouldn't the opposite be true if he loses, and fails to live up to the great expectation/hype that the media and even he himself built up for the past decade-plus? :confusedshrug:

[tmacattack33]

Maybe because for 10+ years the media and LeBron Stans have been shoving the "LeBron next MJ" or even "BETTER than MJ, will leave him eating his dust" hype d*ck down our collective throats.

If he had won and 3-peated the board would be littered with "Is LeBron already unanimous GOAT?" "Will LeBron finish with 9 rings?"

Blah blah blah.

So why shouldn't the opposite be true if he loses, and fails to live up to the great expectation/hype that the media and even he himself built up for the past decade-plus? :confusedshrug:

Well that would be total ring count, not a Finals Wins-to-Finals Losses ratio. Which would be a whole different thing.

[HoopsFanNumero1]

2011 is his only failure in the Finals imo. Other than that, he did his part.

[IllegalD]

Well that would be total ring count, not a Finals Wins-to-Finals Losses ratio. Which would be a whole different thing.

It isn't a different thing. The standard/expectation that was set is Jordan. To a lesser extent Kobe. When Kobe lost ONE finals everybody pretty much said the "next Jordan" thing was dead. Let alone two finals losses. Let alone THREE. Are you kidding me?

You'd probably be one of the ones that'd be riding LeBron's "Unanimous GOAT" d*ck had he threepeated. Of course since he got herbed out in the worst fashion ever, here come the excuse makers acting like they weren't ready to give LeBron the crown before he even sat on the throne.

Its not just the finals losses themselves, its the WAY he lost them. You want to give him a pass for 07? Then you can't use the same season to praise him for carrying a "sh*tty team" to the Finals. Doesn't that seem a bit hypocritical? Praise him as a GOAT for carrying a mediocre squad through a mediocre conference, but then use that as an excuse to not count the finals sweep against him? How convenient...

Even if you don't count 07 against him. There's still 2011, where all he had to do is be a good enough sidekick to Wade's Finals MVP performance to win, and he couldn't even do that. Then in 2014 he basically got blown out of all but 5 of the games.

[allball]

Maybe because for 10+ years the media and LeBron Stans have been shoving the "LeBron next MJ" or even "BETTER than MJ, will leave him eating his dust" hype d*ck down our collective throats.

If he had won and 3-peated the board would be littered with "Is LeBron already unanimous GOAT?" "Will LeBron finish with 9 rings?" posts.

Blah blah blah.

So why shouldn't the opposite be true if he loses, and fails to live up to the great expectation/hype that the media and even he himself built up for the past decade-plus? :confusedshrug:

what does that have to do with this one finals appearance?

[IllegalD]

what does that have to do with this one finals appearance?

Read my other post.

Cause a finals loss is a finals loss.

If you want to use 07 and his performance against the Pistons to prop him up, then you can't turn around and cry "booohoohooo UNFAIR" when he gets herbed out in the same playoff run when he reaches the finals.

[allball]

It isn't a different thing. The standard/expectation that was set is Jordan. To a lesser extent Kobe. When Kobe lost ONE finals everybody pretty much said the "next Jordan" thing was dead. Let alone two finals losses. Let alone THREE. Are you kidding me?

You'd probably be one of the ones that'd be riding LeBron's "Unanimous GOAT" d*ck had he threepeated. Of course since he got herbed out in the worst fashion ever, here come the excuse makers acting like they weren't ready to give LeBron the crown before he even sat on the throne.

Its not just the finals losses themselves, its the WAY he lost them. You want to give him a pass for 07? Then you can't use the same season to praise him for carrying a "sh*tty team" to the Finals. Doesn't that seem a bit hypocritical? Praise him as a GOAT for carrying a mediocre squad through a mediocre conference, but then use that as an excuse to not count the finals sweep against him? How convenient...

Even if you don't count 07 against him. There's still 2011, where all he had to do is be a good enough sidekick to Wade's Finals MVP performance to win, and he couldn't even do that. Then in 2014 he basically got blown out of all but 5 of the games.

I see you on 2011 but 07 was a different story. he had no chance to win even if he played great and 2014 "he" got blown out?

[Sarcastic]

If he had won, wouldn't his backers be using it as a case for him?

[Rubio2Gasol]

It's interesting, they played one team with a winning record on their way to the finals. Anyway, at that age, it was a decent accomplishment.

The main thing anyone should remember about 2007 was how the Suns got shafted by the league while Amare and Nash were playing the best pick and roll ball the league has ever seen.

Period.

[GimmeThat]

because they got so busy making rings for players who didn't contribute.

they don't got no silver medals left.

[fpliii]

It's interesting, they played one team with a winning record on their way to the finals. Anyway, at that age, it was a decent accomplishment.

The main thing anyone should remember about 2007 was how the Suns got shafted by the league while Amare and Nash were playing the best pick and roll ball the league has ever seen.

Period.
Very, very true.

[Ne 1]

His first Finals, it's not the fact that he lost that series, but that he performed so far below what you would have expected from him is why it's a black mark. He averaged 22/7/7, but he shot 35% from the field, 20% on 3's and 69% from the line while averaging 6 turnovers per game and on 23 shots per game. That's horrendous for a player of James' caliber. Although I do give him somewhat of a pass for losing since nobody really expected the Cavs to beat the Spurs, but the thing is if he played even a little bit better, the series would have been closer instead of the Cavs being swept, specifically in Game's 3 and 4, it would have been 2-2 going to Cleveland. It's a black mark on his resume in a way not because he lost, but because of how poorly he played by his standards even back in 2007. Although I don't really judge him based on that too much because he wasn't in his prime yet. Part of that was him being exposed as a terrible shooter. (For the entire season, he shot just 34% from 16-23 feet, 31% on 3s and 69% from the line.) As far as the Cavs and LeBron making it to the Finals being an accomplishment? I'm sure most teams would view making it to the Finals as a great year, there can only be one champion after all. But in context, it says more about how weak the East was. It's amazing how far you could go in the East some years with an elite defense (which that Cavs team was, funny how people ignore this and act like basketball is just one sided) one superstar and solid role players. Besides that 2007 Cavs team, look at the 2001 Sixers, 2009 Magic and 2002 and 2003 Nets.

[Kukoc]

Maybe because for 10+ years the media and LeBron Stans have been shoving the "LeBron next MJ" or even "BETTER than MJ, will leave him eating his dust" hype d*ck down our collective throats.

If he had won and 3-peated the board would be littered with "Is LeBron already unanimous GOAT?" "Will LeBron finish with 9 rings?" posts.

Blah blah blah.

So why shouldn't the opposite be true if he loses, and fails to live up to the great expectation/hype that the media and even he himself built up for the past decade-plus? :confusedshrug:



So true. Very good said :applause: :applause: :applause:

[SouBeachTalents]

2011 is his only failure in the Finals imo. Other than that, he did his part.

This

[GODbe]

5-7 > 2-5

5> 1.5*

[zoom17]

2011 is his only failure in the Finals imo. Other than that, he did his part.

Basically this:cheers:

[Heavincent]

Didn't he shoot like 36% in that series?

[TheGreatDeraj]

He was terrible in the finals, but the only reason he made it was due to an awful East. Didn't he play two .500 teams and then the over the hill past their prime Pistons?

I don't count it against him for making the finals in '07, it was a small accomplishment, but I do count against him for the way he played. Definitely below what he should have done. It's not as bad as 2011, that was a disaster, but still a mark against him.

[Akrazotile]

Using Finals Wins-to-Finals Losses as some type of big stat to prove who better is actually a good filter for seeing which fans have terrible logic and aren't worth listening to.


In other words: Kobe stans

[VIntageNOvel]

lol, cavs lost single digit even though lebron played like absolute shit

but its his no-name/scrub teammate fault right?

fast forward to 2014, its now his superstar teammates fault

those double standard

[ArbitraryWater]

If he had won, wouldn't his backers be using it as a case for him?

:biggums:

Of course dude, why not? That would have been one of the biggest upsets ever... What kind of retarded logic is that?? :lol

[SamuraiSWISH]

His same fans hold Derrick Rose's 2011 ECF, at the same age, against him. So why can't I do the same for LeBron? Especially considering he's the better player, and has a much higher ceiling.

[mehyaM24]

if anything he deserves praise for carrying trash to to the finals

boob gibson, varejao ,marshall, mike brown

LOL

[dubeta]

At the end of the day 2/5 in FMVP is much better than 2/7