I look at some of LeBron's Cleveland Cavalier rosters and I wonder...

[TheCorporation]

Why the **** did he stay for so long? They're all so horrible, at least in comparison to the "loyal" players:

Kobe was gifted Shaq since Kobe's inception. Must've been so hard for Kobe to stay in LA after playing with one of the most dominant peak players of all time, one of the greatest coach of all time, and 3 rings. So loyal of Kobe to stay.

Duncan was gifted David Robinson since Duncan's inception. Must've been so hard for Duncan to stick around in San Antonio after winning a chip his second year, playing with one of the greatest coaches of all time, oh and did I mention having more HOF talent surround him in Parker and Ginobli. So loyal of Tim to stay.

I don't know how they did, manged to stay on those teams and remain so loyal, it must have been so hard on them to stay...

Lebron was gifted Carlos Boozer (for a season lol) since Bron's inception. He was also gifted Kevin Ollie and Ira Newble. Who? Shit I don't know either, but these are the dudes in the top 5 in games played, in 2004 on the Cavs. In 2005, LeBron was then gifted DeSagana Diop and Lucious Harris (move over Shaq and DRob).

I think you get my point, here.

[SamuraiSWISH]

They weren't bad at all. He just needed a reliable second option. Mo Williams was that dude until the 2009 ECF. He didn't need to leave, and go super dramatic on the other end of the spectrum by stacking the deck. Taking the path of least resistance. He was just one piece away.

And given how quickly the Celtics aged, and D-Wade as well. He would've been in a perfectly fine position to win championships in Cleveland from 2011 - Now, without any of the negativity, or insane expectation to win rings every season. He shot his legacy in the foot.

[onhcetum]

Well they did make the finals when he was 22... and followed that up with two back to back 66 wins seasons i think...

honestly, i thought they were a great team and had all of the pieces but just couldnt turn the corner in the playoffs. maybe a stop here and there, and they coulda won a title

[Beastmode88]

Which top 10 player actually left their team (not being traded)?

[Droid101]

Cavs had great defense and one of the best three point shooting in the league. He left and the team he went to won less games his first season there.

Cavs could easily have retooled them to make deep playoff runs for his entire career. He bitched out.

[lilteapot]

They weren't bad at all. He just needed a reliable second option. Mo Williams was that dude until the 2009 ECF. He didn't need to leave, and go super dramatic on the other end of the spectrum by stacking the deck. Taking the path of least resistance. He was just one piece away.

And given how quickly the Celtics aged, and D-Wade as well. He would've been in a perfectly fine position to win championships in Cleveland from 2011 - Now, without any of the negativity, or insane expectation to win rings every season. He shot his legacy in the foot.
>taking the path of least resistance
>lost in the first year with the heat, taken to 7 games several times

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

What Swish said. They were a Klay Thompson/Monta Ellis away from winning a chip.

rebounders, shooters, defense...just not that second option to help take defensive pressure off of LeBron.

[lilteapot]

What Swish said. They were a Klay Thompson/Monta Ellis away from winning a chip.

rebounders, shooters, defense...just not that second option to help take defensive pressure off of LeBron.
so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?

[JT123]

Which top 10 player actually left their team (not being traded)?
Shaq

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?

Look what they've done without LeBron

There's your answer.. :oldlol:

[JT123]

so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?
Better question, how come they haven't made the playoffs since Bron left?
That bum ass franchise can't even make the playoffs in the weakest conference of all time! :roll:

[navy]

They weren't bad at all. He just needed a reliable second option. Mo Williams was that dude until the 2009 ECF. He didn't need to leave, and go super dramatic on the other end of the spectrum by stacking the deck. Taking the path of least resistance. He was just one piece away.

And given how quickly the Celtics aged, and D-Wade as well. He would've been in a perfectly fine position to win championships in Cleveland from 2011 - Now, without any of the negativity, or insane expectation to win rings every season. He shot his legacy in the foot.


They were average teams held together by the Goat carrier. Just like 2014. They were never going to win a ring with what they had. Maybe come close every time Lebron went nuts.

In 2011 they would have had to beat the Celtics again. In 2012, Celtics again and Thunder. In 2013 and 2014 the Spurs. If Lebron had stayed in Cleveland he would have been ringless.

Granted he never got reliable help while there. The Cavs were not cheap and maybe they could have gotten someone, but it is obvious why Lebron didnt take that chance.

Better to be a ringed team hopper than a ringless Ohio hero.

[TheCorporation]

Which top 10 player actually left their team (not being traded)?

You're asking the wrong question, but getting to my point. Who was truly loyal, stayed on a team for while and didn't win it all, but eventually, prevailed and got a Championship?

Two names come to mind: Dirk and Paul Pierce.

Do I have to praise Magic Johnson's loyalty for staying with a Lakers organization that gifted him Kareem Abdul-Jabber since Magic's inception, too :lol And Magic winning it all in his first year. Must've been a tough decision to stay lol

[TheCorporation]

so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?

LOLOL They can't answer that one.

[J Shuttlesworth]

I love how the haters say "The Cavs made the finals. They were a good enough team" and then go on to say that "Making the finals in the East 4 years in a row isn't impressive"

They made the finals, but they weren't going to beat a great team in the West. They weren't ever championship contenders.

[TheCorporation]

Better question, how come they haven't made the playoffs since Bron left?
That bum ass franchise can't even make the playoffs in the weakest conference of all time! :roll:

Bro, they were only an inefficient chucking guard away from winning all da chips bro.

:durantunimpressed:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

LOLOL They can't answer that one.

Just a clarification.. I agree in the sense that LeBron's Cavs weren't "bad". Believe it or not they were built decently around his individual talents

The franchise and management on the other hand...

[1~Gibson~1]

so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?
There are three ways that we could have gotten a really good player along side LeBron but virtually there was only one.

Draft: not only did our FO stink it up each year by drafting not do good players, but we usually picked in the late teens or twenties so the probability of finding LeBrons 2nd option in the draft were slim to none.

Free Agency: if you havent noticed by now, no 1st or even 2nd tier player wants to go to Cleveland except for Lebron because hes from that area.

So via a trade is the only answer. We tried trading for Delonte West, Wally Z., Mo Williams and Shaq but none of those players except for maybe Mo were good enough 2nd options.

[TheCorporation]

I love how the haters say "The Cavs made the finals. They were a good enough team" and then go on to say that "Making the finals in the East 4 years in a row isn't impressive"

They made the finals, but they weren't going to beat a great team in the West. They weren't ever championship contenders.

DUDE! With Gibson, Hughes, Marshall, ERIC SNOWWWWW and BIG Z!? You crazy! They finna win da chip each year! :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

Gibson, Hughes, Snow, Big Z, Marshall > Duncan, Parker, Ginobli, Horry, Bowen

[Droid101]

The selective memory on this forum is astounding.

I remember when the Cavs traded for Antawn Jamison. Reaction from other team fanbases as as bad as after the Decision. Everyone said it was unfair, they're too stacked, etc etc.

It happened to not work out, but it wasn't for lack of the Cavs' trying. Everyone trying to say they stuck with Paul Silas and Ricky Davis for 8 straight years in this thread.

[navy]

There are three ways that we could have gotten a really good player along side LeBron but virtually there was only one.

Draft: not only did our FO stink it up each year by drafting not do good players, but we usually picked in the late teens or twenties so the probability of finding LeBrons 2nd option in the draft were slim to none.

Free Agency: if you havent noticed by now, no 1st or even 2nd tier player wants to go to Cleveland except for Lebron because hes from that area.

So via a trade is the only answer. We tried trading for Delonte West, Wally Z., Mo Williams and Shaq but none of those players except for maybe Mo were good enough 2nd options.
This.The Cavs tried. They werent the Astros

Imagine if the Heat Big 3 had went to Cleveland. Probably would have been a better initial team. But the situation in Miami fit and Lebron took it.

[Droid101]

Proof about the Jamison trade, from this very forum:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=164283

Everyone thought it was a forgone conclusion after the trade that it'd be Lakers/Cavs in the Finals. Laker fans thought the Lakers would win, the rest of the league figured it'd be the newly revamped Cavs.

I'm sorry bron quit on you guys.

[Magic 32]

I love how the haters say "The Cavs made the finals. They were a good enough team" and then go on to say that "Making the finals in the East 4 years in a row isn't impressive"

They made the finals, but they weren't going to beat a great team in the West. They weren't ever championship contenders.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/061129

[VIntageNOvel]

so why didn't the cavs do anything in 8 years?


ask cavs fans for detail but i remember meticode or RBA saying that because lebron didnt commit long term (i dont exactly remember what lebron contract situation in cavs), but basically lebron took 3 years extension, which forced cavs to do some hasty move in order to win now so he dont leave, they trade for shaq etc, some hasty and stupid move, instead of slowly building a perfect core that surround him (that maybe would blossom in 2011-), again ask cavs fan

cavs aint that bad, it just bran's nutlicked discredit em so much to justify the decision

[J Shuttlesworth]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/061129
You're only furthering my point. The Cavs were good enough to make it out of the East, but not to win a ring. They weren't championship contenders

[Derka]

Because the entire state treated him like a King and because at one point in his career, being a competitor mattered.

[Trollsmasher]

Those Cavs teams were complete shit without LeBron on the floor. One man wrecking crew with no 2nd option. It's good for regular season record, but none of those scrubs had a playoffs level in them.

[LBJMVP]

People in here are soooo stupid. Don't know if this has been mentioned cause I only read the first page, but not a single person would sign with Cleveland because every free agent would ask lebron if he was gonna stay and he would refuse to answer. Thus, every free agent that we wanted refused to sign. He screwed that up. We agreed in principle to trade for bosh, but since "the big three" already colluded to go to Miami, Chris said he wouldn't agree to a sign and trade unless lebron did. (Which of course he didn't).

[knicksman]

Did Op also wonder how low his IQ is?

[Big Cheese]

Are people overlooking how long they kept Mike Brown? That alone is a good enough reason to not trust the organization and leave.

[TheCorporation]

Did Op also wonder how low his IQ is?

*looks at screen name. Notices he is a Knicks fan*

http://i.imgur.com/S7zTLMd.gif

[TheCorporation]

The selective memory on this forum is astounding.

I remember when the Cavs traded for Antawn Jamison. Reaction from other team fanbases as as bad as after the Decision. Everyone said it was unfair, they're too stacked, etc etc.

It happened to not work out, but it wasn't for lack of the Cavs' trying. Everyone trying to say they stuck with Paul Silas and Ricky Davis for 8 straight years in this thread.

Are you referring to 33-year old Antawn Jamison? The Antawn Jamison that played one year with LBJ? The one that averaged 16-8? Okay, not a terrible second option, pretty much what Chris Bosh but up this year (16-7).

Jamison also averaged 15 ppg during the playoffs, just like hobbled Wade did in 2013 (Wade actually averaged 16 ppg so Jamison da God actually did even less than hobbled Wade). Amazing second options here, folks. Keep the great comments coming. :applause:

Pippen's lowest playoff average during the two 3-peats? 17. His lowest in all 6 of those Finals runs was still 2 ppg higher than Jamison da God. And LBJ didn't even have a Rodman and Kukoc and Kerr and Jackson after JDG (Jamison Da God).

I'm waiting for you to make sense...Please don't ever say Jamison was going to be a game changer. Thanks for playing, bro.

Top tier second option 15 ppg game changer. lolz Good one!

[RedBlackAttack]

When you're down and out as a James fan, make a thread about the Cavs. This seems to be the trend.

Move on.

[Black and White]

Are people forgetting that the Cavs struggled to get LeBron help at the end because LeBron didnt want to commit???

[Lord Bean]

Antawn Jamison averaged 18-7-2-1-1 on the Cavs in his full seasons with them. That kind of production is just not enough for Lebron, I suppose. He needs a top 2 shooting guard in the league and a top 10 PF. And shooters surrounding him at every direction.

If he gets Carmelo, how long before Carmelo is forced to be a spot up shooter and people start attacking him the way they do current Bosh? I say 2 weeks into the season.

[Cavalier]

Are people forgetting that the Cavs struggled to get LeBron help at the end because LeBron didnt want to commit???

And then in the first week that he joined the Heat, he was already trying to recruit Derrick Fisher and Mike Miller.

[AirFederer]

Imagine Kobe on those Cavs teams.
Inb4 37,8 ppg on 34% 1,7 apg :oldlol:

[dubeta]

Antawn Jamison averaged 18-7-2-1-1 on the Cavs in his full seasons with them. That kind of production is just not enough for Lebron, I suppose. He needs a top 2 shooting guard in the league and a top 10 PF. And shooters surrounding him at every direction.

If he gets Carmelo, how long before Carmelo is forced to be a spot up shooter and people start attacking him the way they do current Bosh? I say 2 weeks into the season.

Didnt Odom average something similar on the Lakers while Kobe was carrying him to 1st round exits and the lottery

[TheCorporation]

Antawn Jamison averaged 18-7-2-1-1 on the Cavs in his full seasons with them. That kind of production is just not enough for Lebron, I suppose. He needs a top 2 shooting guard in the league and a top 10 PF. And shooters surrounding him at every direction.

If he gets Carmelo, how long before Carmelo is forced to be a spot up shooter and people start attacking him the way they do current Bosh? I say 2 weeks into the season.

Show me someone who won a Finals with their #2 and #3 options playoff averages equal this:

Jamison: 15-7
Williams: 14-5

Even Dirk's #2 in 2010 averaged 18-3 (Jason Terry), and don't forget future DPOY Chandler putting up 8 ppg and 9 rpg on 58%

Kobe's #2 in 2009-2010 already had Gasol averaging 20-10

But yep, we finna win da chipz with 15-7 Jamison da God...

[Droid101]

Didnt Odom average something similar on the Lakers while Kobe was carrying him to 1st round exits and the lottery
For your information, no. Odom never averaged those kinds of numbers in his entire career.

Don't let facts get in the way of your stupid trolling.

[T_L_P]

Tim very easily could have left in 2000.

Those 2000, 2001, 2002 (and even 2003) teams were very mediocre.

Also, let's not act like Duncan didn't have a huge hand in making Parker and Manu great. And let's not act like Pop did anything before Duncan, or he was some sort of miracle worker during Duncan's prime (he relied on his star as much as any coach).

Bran had some of the best defenses in the league, and relative to the competition he had reasonable help. The dude abandoned ship, which is fine, but not before promising a ring -- like a complete idiot.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Tim very easily could have left in 2000.

Those 2000, 2001, 2002 (and even 2003) teams were very mediocre.

Also, let's not act like Duncan didn't have a huge hand in making Parker and Manu great. And let's not act like Pop did anything before Duncan, or he was some sort of miracle worker during Duncan's prime (he relied on his star as much as any coach).

Bran had some of the best defenses in the league, and relative to the competition he had reasonable help. The dude abandoned ship, which is fine, but not before promising a ring -- like a complete idiot.
In 2000, Duncan had already won a ring and had Popovich as a coach. LeBron was ringless and had Mike Brown... not really comparable situations. Duncan's situation then is more like Bron's situation now than anything

[navy]

Are people forgetting that the Cavs struggled to get LeBron help at the end because LeBron didnt want to commit???
At the end? No shit James didnt commit at the end. They failed before that. :oldlol:

[TheCorporation]

Imagine Kobe on those Cavs teams.
Inb4 37,8 ppg on 34% 1,7 apg :oldlol:

:roll: :cheers: :roll:

I remember when Kobe was putting those numbers up in LA and crying and wanting out :roll: Good thing Gasol and Bynum and Artest came to save him.

[houston]

Tim very easily could have left in 2000.

Those 2000, 2001, 2002 (and even 2003) teams were very mediocre.

Also, let's not act like Duncan didn't have a huge hand in making Parker and Manu great. And let's not act like Pop did anything before Duncan, or he was some sort of miracle worker during Duncan's prime (he relied on his star as much as any coach).

Bran had some of the best defenses in the league, and relative to the competition he had reasonable help. The dude abandoned ship, which is fine, but not before promising a ring -- like a complete idiot.




Man him playing with Robinson is the reason he stayed with the Spurs. Lebron with the Cavs never played with anything that was close to Robinson. Duncan didn't make nobody they develop into their own.

[T_L_P]

Man him playing with Robinson is the reason he stayed with the Spurs. Lebron with the Cavs never played with anything that was close to Robinson. Duncan didn't make nobody they develop into their own.

Hah, go back and just watch some of the 03 highlights (or, if you are really interested, games).

He gave Parker loads of touches and pretty much covered his ass on defense every time someone blew by him.

Better yet, go watch a Parker interview. He'll tell you what Duncan did for him. :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[TheCorporation]

Didnt Odom average something similar on the Lakers while Kobe was carrying him to 1st round exits and the lottery

Not quite that high, he came off the bench as a 6th man role, but Gasol put up beastly numbers for Kobe and Company. Don't forget Bynum's near double/double average (9 and 7 on 54% in only 24 minutes) too. Come to think of it, has Bron ever had a player that averaged a double/double? LOL ??? New thread? lol

[TheCorporation]

Tim very easily could have left in 2000.

Those 2000, 2001, 2002 (and even 2003) teams were very mediocre.

Also, let's not act like Duncan didn't have a huge hand in making Parker and Manu great. And let's not act like Pop did anything before Duncan, or he was some sort of miracle worker during Duncan's prime (he relied on his star as much as any coach).

Bran had some of the best defenses in the league, and relative to the competition he had reasonable help. The dude abandoned ship, which is fine, but not before promising a ring -- like a complete idiot.

But my point still remains, he was drafted on a great team with a GOATesque coach and great support in Robinson and Company. The Spurs franchise are just a different breed. They really are like family there. Are you suggesting Duncan wins Rookie of the Year in 98, wins Finals MVP in 99, and leaves Spurs in 2000? LOL Let's at least be realistic.

He isn't going to leave a great franchise, especially after such success, and early success at that (2nd year in the league).

PS: Yes, LBJ promising a ring to CLE and then leaving was a complete idiot move, I agree :P

[houston]

Hah, go back and just watch some of the 03 highlights (or, if you are really interested, games).

He gave Parker loads of touches and pretty much covered his ass on defense every time someone blew by him.

Better yet, go watch a Parker interview. He'll tell you what Duncan did for him. :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm


that what being a good teammate does. But Parker and Manu have talent their own right. Still in 03 he had washed up Robinson still helping him him win.

[GimmeThat]

He may have stayed that long, because even he himself believed in the hype that maybe he could do something outlandish.

Which, I don't think he's lost that faith/believe in himself, but he just realizes that at the end winning is winning, even if that means doing so with an easier path.




You can't change the witnesses perspective, but you sure can change how the jury views an event, even with the witnesses describing their view on the event.

which, eventually changes the outcome/conviction of one put on the stand.

[LakersFan626]

The selective memory on this forum is astounding.

I remember when the Cavs traded for Antawn Jamison. Reaction from other team fanbases as as bad as after the Decision. Everyone said it was unfair, they're too stacked, etc etc.

It happened to not work out, but it wasn't for lack of the Cavs' trying. Everyone trying to say they stuck with Paul Silas and Ricky Davis for 8 straight years in this thread.

I remember it... I was one of the ones who thought that would result in the Lakers beating the Cavs because of the Gasol vs. Jamison matchup alone. Lakers would have won in 6 if the Cavs made the Finals (Kobe would be guarded by Anthony Parker, Mike Brown vs. Phil Jackson, Pau vs. Jamison, Mo probably wouldn't have played well even being guarded by Fisher, Artest would make LeBron work for his points, pick and roll could have changed momentum if Cavs were leading with Shaq and Z guarding the paint, Lamar would match Varejao's energy and be better offensively, Gibson wouldn't stop Brown and Farmar, etc.) but it resulted in a KG vs. Jamison matchup that Jamison got dominated in, which would make a matchup vs. PRIME Pau even worse. Cavs not playing Hickson anymore for whatever reason really screwed up their season, as Hickson was WAY more athletic than Jamison and about equal defensively. Amare was the only player in trade talks then (Amare Jamison, and Troy Murphy who actually would have been worse than Jamison) that would have worked as he was the only athletic one and the most reliable by far, which likely would have meant LeBron ended the Cleveland curse and would still be a Cav today.

[GimmeThat]

going up against a Kobe squad who just lost in the finals last year.

would have just been bad news for Mike Brown really.

[knicksman]

people forgot dirk did it too. In fact cp3 and kobe did it too. I dont know why people think only lebron can. LOL bran stans always be idiots. AT the end of the day he got what he wanted and still failed. so no excuses

[jbryan1984]

Regardless if Jamison changed things or not, the proof is there that not only did this forum think he was the final piece, but the media and basketball analysts did as well. Like others have said we tried to get free agents like Ray Allen and Ron Artest but since LeBron would not commit, we could not get them. Our front office pulled off some amazing trades, were not afraid to go over the cap and we always had a great record so we never got good picks. Only thing the office did wrong was keeping Mike Brown for so long.

[Roundball_Rock]

What Swish said. They were a Klay Thompson/Monta Ellis away from winning a chip.

rebounders, shooters, defense...just not that second option to help take defensive pressure off of LeBron.

There was no evidence to suggest they could acquire a second scorer, or even a legitimate second all-star player who was not a 20 ppg scorer. Cleveland tried numerous times to try to acquire talent around him. The problem was, they failed. I suspect to a significant extent this is due to players not wanting to live in Cleveland but the Cavs' front office bears a lot of blame as well. They best players they acquired were Larry Hughes, an old Shaq (Shaq has a renaissance in 2009--but he looked washed up in 2008 and in 2010 he resembled his 2008 self, not his 2010 version) who would retire after the following season, and a 33 year old Jamison. To be fair, he was a 21/9 player that year in Washington but he was a 15/7 player in Cleveland.


Which top 10 player actually left their team (not being traded)?

Free agency as we know it did not even exist until the late 80's. Shaq left Orlando and Jordan threatened to go to New York (which would pair him with Ewing) after the 96' season.


I love how the haters say "The Cavs made the finals. They were a good enough team" and then go on to say that "Making the finals in the East 4 years in a row isn't impressive"

They made the finals, but they weren't going to beat a great team in the West. They weren't ever championship contenders.

It also is funny how making the Finals is diminished because the East is relatively weak--but then the East champ, at least when it is the Heat, is expected to beat the best of the best from the West. :lol

One "problem" LeBron created was he improved the Cavs from 17 wins to 35 wins straight out of high school. If they stayed at the bottom longer they could have gotten higher draft picks (i.e. Chicago drafting Horace Grant with a top 10 pick and orchestrating a trade to get 5th pick Pippen via their 8th pick). With low draft picks, no interest from free agents trading was their only chance and they simply lacked the assets to acquire a legitimate all-star via trade. This isn't NBA2k. You need to give assets to get assets.

[AlphaWolf24]

With Amar'e Stoudemire unlikely to be dealt before Thursday's trading deadline, the next-biggest thing is being attempted by the Cleveland Cavaliers -- a surprise move at acquiring All-Star forward Antawn Jamison from the Washington Wizards.

A deal for Jamison is far from being completed, according to league sources who described the Wizards as reluctant to move a team leader. The sources considered the proposal a sign that the Cavaliers have become more aggressive in trying to improve at the deadline for a title push this spring.

The Cavaliers have talked to the Wizards about offering Wally Szczerbiak's expiring $13.8 million salary as payroll relief for the 32-year-old Jamison, who is on the books for $50 million through 2011-12. Jamison is averaging 21.4 points and 9.1 rebounds this season, and he would be a lethal scoring threat off the bench for Cleveland in an anticipated conference final against the defending champion Boston Celtics.

A move like this -- a championship contender adding a two-time All-Star scorer and rebounder without touching the top seven players in their rotation - would be the closest thing to a blockbuster in this year's trading-deadline market. Jamison would put enormous pressure on the Celtics, whose front line has already been challenged by the departures of James Posey and P.J. Brown.

"If Cleveland can get Jamison, that will be a home run,'' said an Eastern Conference executive with knowledge of the talks. "Jamison would give them a big boost -- he can finish games with them, and he's a slasher who will get more open shots playing with LeBron. I think that would clinch [the NBA Finals] for them. Boston would have a tough time with them.''

To bring the salaries within 125 percent of each other, Cleveland would have to take on one or more additional players in exchange for Szczerbiak's expiring $13.8 million -- an expensive proposition for the Cavaliers, who would already be paying the luxury tax on Jamison's salary next season.

By clearing salary, the Wizards would position themselves to relaunch next season around their high lottery pick in this draft in addition to a healthy (or so they hope) Gilbert Arenas and Caron Butler, who are both younger than 29. But in the midst of a 11-42 season, the Wizards appear disinclined to move Jamison, upon whom they are counting to lead them back into the playoffs next season.


Like someone said above....

Lebron would not commit to the Cavs....and even openly talked about leaving Cleveland as early as 2008!!!!....

He had his agent talk to Wade,Bosh and Anthony about not committing to a long term contracts.......just in-case they ever wanted to team up.:lol

but besides all that.....the Cavs were a good team that had the best record in the NBA/HCA 2 years in a row....they were contenders....

If Lebron played like he did in 2012 ....no doubt the Cavs would win titles and have something special.

[riseagainst]

Like someone said above....

Lebron would not commit to the Cavs....and even openly talked about leaving Cleveland as early as 2008!!!!....

He had his agent talk to Wade,Bosh and Anthony about not committing to a long term contracts.......just in-case they ever wanted to team up.:lol

but besides all that.....the Cavs were a good team that had the best record in the NBA/HCA 2 years in a row....they were contenders....

If Lebron played like he did in 2012 ....no doubt the Cavs would win titles and have something special.

dam.... thread shut down.

[FatComputerNerd]

Why the **** did he stay for so long? They're all so horrible, at least in comparison to the "loyal" players:

Kobe was gifted Shaq since Kobe's inception. Must've been so hard for Kobe to stay in LA after playing with one of the most dominant peak players of all time, one of the greatest coach of all time, and 3 rings. So loyal of Kobe to stay.

Duncan was gifted David Robinson since Duncan's inception. Must've been so hard for Duncan to stick around in San Antonio after winning a chip his second year, playing with one of the greatest coaches of all time, oh and did I mention having more HOF talent surround him in Parker and Ginobli. So loyal of Tim to stay.

I don't know how they did, manged to stay on those teams and remain so loyal, it must have been so hard on them to stay...

Lebron was gifted Carlos Boozer (for a season lol) since Bron's inception. He was also gifted Kevin Ollie and Ira Newble. Who? Shit I don't know either, but these are the dudes in the top 5 in games played, in 2004 on the Cavs. In 2005, LeBron was then gifted DeSagana Diop and Lucious Harris (move over Shaq and DRob).

I think you get my point, here.
Ira Newble was the sh*t, fool!

http://ballislife.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Ira-Newble-does-a-spinning-kick-on-Mike-Dunleavy-Jr.jpg

[TheCorporation]

I love how the one "help" player you guys focus on is Antawn 33 year old, 15/7, I played with Bron for ONE YEAR, Jamison. :lol

That really shows how bad Cleveland's help was. The one player you reminisce about and continually focus on is a 33 year old 15/7 that literally played with Bron for ONE SEASON. I love this shit :applause:

Just further proving my point, guys.

[FLDFSU]

The selective memory on this forum is astounding.

I remember when the Cavs traded for Antawn Jamison. Reaction from other team fanbases as as bad as after the Decision. Everyone said it was unfair, they're too stacked, etc etc.

It happened to not work out, but it wasn't for lack of the Cavs' trying. Everyone trying to say they stuck with Paul Silas and Ricky Davis for 8 straight years in this thread.
:applause: if Lebron were opts out and play for the 76ers morons would complain about Phillips being stacked.

[Trollsmasher]

I love how the one "help" player you guys focus on is Antawn 33 year old, 15/7, I played with Bron for ONE YEAR, Jamison. :lol

That really shows how bad Cleveland's help was. The one player you reminisce about and continually focus on is a 33 year old 15/7 that literally played with Bron for ONE SEASON. I love this shit :applause:

Just further proving my point, guys.
And let's not act like Jamison is some good 2nd option. Dude has been an ineffective shotjacker his entire career and has probably the emptiest stats in NBA history. He has also never played any kind of defense.

[JT123]

If Lebron played like he did in 2012 ....no doubt the Cavs would win titles and have something special.
Um, Lebron's Heat barely got by Boston in 2012 despite having Wade as the number 2 option. What the hell makes you think Cleveland would have got by Boston with Mo Williams in Wade's place? :roll: :roll: :roll: