Is Tony Parker a Hall of Famer?

[1987_Lakers]

Duncan & Ginobili are locks. How about Parker?

4x NBA Champion
2007 NBA Finals MVP
6x NBA All-Star
3x All-NBA 2nd Team
1x All-NBA 3rd Team

[RoundMoundOfReb]

yes

[Beastmode88]

WAHHH? LOL :lol

[Levity]

Legit question: how many Finals MVP's havent made/arent likely to make the HOF

2nd part: if the answer is none, does anyone think Kawhi Leonard may be the first Finals MVP not to make the HOF. (obviously too early to tell, but its worth a prediction)

[no pun intended]

No question. First European-born player to receive NBA Finals MVP.

[Smook A.]

Yes. This kind of question shouldn't even be asked :lol

Tony Parker is a lock to make the Hall of Fame.

[JellyBean]

Heck Yeah!!!!

[SCdac]

Legit question: how many Finals MVP's havent made/arent likely to make the HOF

2nd part: if the answer is none, does anyone think Kawhi Leonard may be the first Finals MVP not to make the HOF. (obviously too early to tell, but its worth a prediction)

Worth noting, Kawhi also earned All-Defensive team placement, probably one of many more to come. Good question none the less.

And yes Parker is in. Mitch Richmond just made it, Parker is at least in the same tier if not higher. Plus international accomplishments.

[Collie]

Legit question: how many Finals MVP's havent made/arent likely to make the HOF

2nd part: if the answer is none, does anyone think Kawhi Leonard may be the first Finals MVP not to make the HOF. (obviously too early to tell, but its worth a prediction)

Cornbread Maxwell

[T_L_P]

Getting into the NBA HoF is a joke...and once they let Mitch Richmond in, this should not have been a question.

Parker is a lock tbh. Carmelo Anthony is a lock. :oldlol:

[navy]

Yes. Basketball HOF isnt even that good.

[Milbuck]

Yes, he's a HOFer without question.

I will say though, it's some pretty weak shit that he's a certain future HOFer despite the fact that:

1) More often than not, he gets outplayed or embarrassed by other top-tier PGs in the game. He's had 3 acceptable/good games for a HOF player in his last 9 meetings (last 3 seasons) with Westbrook, 4 acceptable/good games in the past 5 seasons against CP3 (out of 13 meetings).
2) There's been visible and statistical evidence of his team performing better without him, in his prime. Conference finals and a decent chunk of the finals can support this.
3) He didn't win FMVP in a title run in his prime, in a team where he should've clearly been the best player. And it wasn't a Pippen scenario in which he lost it to the GOAT, he lost it to a 22 year old 3rd season player.

He's definitely a HOF player, but the basketball HOF is an utter joke when TP is a 100% lock and not even debatable.

[zoom17]

:facepalm

[the mesiah]

Cornbread Maxwell
Jo Jo as well

[JimmyMcAdocious]

Well Chauncey will probably make it and Parker has a better case than he does.

[To4]

He is a HOF...

[Marchesk]

Is he better than Tim Hardaway or Sidney Moncrief (SG but still)?

A related question is how much team accomplishments should and postseason awards should factor into it.

Hardaway and Moncrief were never in a finals, so they didn't get a chance to win FMVP.

[ninephive]

Yes, he's a HOFer without question.

I will say though, it's some pretty weak shit that he's a certain future HOFer despite the fact that:

1) More often than not, he gets outplayed or embarrassed by other top-tier PGs in the game. He's had 3 acceptable/good games for a HOF player in his last 9 meetings (last 3 seasons) with Westbrook, 4 acceptable/good games in the past 5 seasons against CP3 (out of 13 meetings).
2) There's been visible and statistical evidence of his team performing better without him, in his prime. Conference finals and a decent chunk of the finals can support this.
3) He didn't win FMVP in a title run in his prime, in a team where he should've clearly been the best player. And it wasn't a Pippen scenario in which he lost it to the GOAT, he lost it to a 22 year old 3rd season player.

He's definitely a HOF player, but the basketball HOF is an utter joke when TP is a 100% lock and not even debatable.
Parker-led teams have consistently knocked out the best point guard's teams his whole career: Williams, Billups, Nash, Paul, and now Lilliard and Westbrook. He led the Spurs throughout the playoffs again this season and even led them in scoring in the Finals (even though he wasn't the Spurs overall best player in that series or in OKC due to injury). And how many PGs won FMVP in their prime? (if we're not including 2007 as Parker's prime)

[moe94]

Obv

[ninephive]

Parker has a good chance to set the record for most playoff wins of all time as well.

[tpols]

Yes and he won't be the worst of them either.. Derrick rose will already make it with his map, Billups will make it.. Go look at the HOF. Nobody would even know half the players in there since they're all no names from 50s-70s outside the few names people recognize.

[navy]

Parker-led teams have consistently knocked out the best point guard's teams his whole career: Williams, Billups, Nash, Paul, and now Lilliard and Westbrook. He led the Spurs throughout the playoffs again this season and even led them in scoring in the Finals (even though he wasn't the Spurs overall best player in that series or in OKC due to injury). And how many PGs won FMVP in their prime? (if we're not including 2007 as Parker's prime)

How many of those series did he outplay the opposing point guard?

Curious as I dont know. Parker clearly regressed this season though.

[Clyde]

Getting into the NBA HoF is a joke...and once they let Mitch Richmond in, this should not have been a question.

Parker is a lock tbh. Carmelo Anthony is a lock. :oldlol:

Its not the nba hall of fame.....its the basketball hof.

[BasedTom]

It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Talent or achievement. So yes he'll probably make it in.

He'd be a first ballot lock for the Hall of Worthless ***** if one existed

[ninephive]

How many of those series did he outplay the opposing point guard?

Curious as I dont know. Parker clearly regressed this season though.
I'd have to go back and look at individual series to say.

In regards to regressing, you do know he had somewhere in the neighborhood of 5 injuries this season, not to mention the playoffs, right?

[ninephive]

It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Talent or achievement. So yes he'll probably make it in.

He'd be a first ballot lock for the Hall of Worthless ***** if one existed
Is the fact that Parker is 11-5 against Lebron in the Finals that has you mad or something else about him?

[navy]

I'd have to go back and look at individual series to say.

In regards to regressing, you do know he had somewhere in the neighborhood of 5 injuries this season, not to mention the playoffs, right?
Matters when you play on a team where you are never the clear cut best player. :confusedshrug:

He will have the same problems next year. That's regression.

[houston]

of course he is in

[ninephive]

Matters when you play on a team where you are never the clear cut best player. :confusedshrug:

He will have the same problems next year. That's regression.
Ok, he was the only All-Star on the team (selected by coaches). Clear-cut? Maybe not, but he's been the best player on the team for at least the past 5 years, arguably longer. He continues to get better every season as a leader and in terms of bball IQ, along with his jumper, 3 point shot, and ability to finish in the paint. He won't be as fast as he was in 2007, but he continues to play as good as ever and has consistently been in MVP talks the past several years until injuries put him out of contention. Just because he plays through ankle injuries in the playoffs shouldn't be taken out of consideration when evaluating him. But if you want to ignore his injuries, go ahead if it makes you feel better.

[joeyjoejoe]

Parker-led teams have consistently knocked out the best point guard's teams his whole career: Williams, Billups, Nash, Paul, and now Lilliard and Westbrook. He led the Spurs throughout the playoffs again this season and even led them in scoring in the Finals (even though he wasn't the Spurs overall best player in that series or in OKC due to injury). And how many PGs won FMVP in their prime? (if we're not including 2007 as Parker's prime)

He was at best third place for fmvp this year, and he was shooting for it in game 5 just couldn't get it done, was also terrible in the last finals, got outplayed in every game by westbrook in wcf then in game 6 they took him out at the half down dbl digits and came back to win with him on the bench. Just seems strange for a hof lock to never have been allnba first team but guess some of that has to do with being from outside of the u.s

[bballnoob1192]

this thread and the T-Mac thread are both retarded......of course they will, but will they get in as first ballots. if not then getting into the HoF is really pointless

[pastis]

parker and manu have carried this franchise to titles in 2005,2007,2014 = hall of fame lock

[T_L_P]

parker and manu have carried this franchise to titles in 2005,2007,2014 = hall of fame lock

Manu shot 25% in a series and the Spurs practically swept.

Carrying. :roll:

[Harison]

2nd part: if the answer is none, does anyone think Kawhi Leonard may be the first Finals MVP not to make the HOF. (obviously too early to tell, but its worth a prediction)
Baring injuries, Kawhi will make HOF. 1st ring and FMVP at the age of 22 is just the beginning. If Spurs repeat, Kawhi will get another FMVP, and he wont be in his prime yet either, let this sink in.

[Harison]

Speaking of FMVP, neither C.Maxwell nor Billups will make HOF.

[Artillery]

parker and manu have carried this franchise to titles in 2005,2007,2014 = hall of fame lock

Where were Parker and Manu in last year's Finals?

[ninephive]

He was at best third place for fmvp this year, and he was shooting for it in game 5 just couldn't get it done, was also terrible in the last finals, got outplayed in every game by westbrook in wcf then in game 6 they took him out at the half down dbl digits and came back to win with him on the bench. Just seems strange for a hof lock to never have been allnba first team but guess some of that has to do with being from outside of the u.s
I've said it before...the only way Parker starts getting all-star starts and All-NBA first teams is if (1) Chris Paul learns how to win, which will inevitably lower his stat-padding, (2) Tony Parker learns how to lose, which will inevitably jack up his stats, or (3) Parker gets traded to a bottom feeder or even mediocre team (like Paul's Clippers) where he can pad like crazy.

[ArbitraryWater]

Getting into the NBA HoF is a joke...and once they let Mitch Richmond in, this should not have been a question.

Parker is a lock tbh. Carmelo Anthony is a lock. :oldlol:

Everything about that comment :facepalm

Agree HoF is kinda pointless the way its used, but your reasons, no.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Definitely.




Cornbread Maxwell

Yes.

Better question would be: how many FMVP's are not yet in the HoF but definitely deserve to be?... Answer would be Jo Jo White. Cornbread was a really good player and won FMVP (that should've went to Bird) but not really a HoF'er, at all.

[ninephive]

Where were Parker and Manu in last year's Finals?
Where was Parker? He was running the offense as usual, holding Chalmers and Cole to terrible shooting numbers, leading the team in scoring in games 1 & 5, second on the team overall in scoring, leading the team in assists, hitting the game-clinching miracle shot in G1, having one of the biggest sequences in Finals history in the last 2 minutes of G6 (tying 3 over Lebron, steal, go-ahead leaner over Chalmers, outlet to Manu for free throws twice to seal the game...and then on the bench at the end of OT for some reason, just like how Duncan got benched in regulation), and then playing through injury in G7 (the whole series really, but it kept getting progressively worse). That's where Parker was last year. Oh, and defending the Lebron AND Allen 3s at the end of regulation in G6 when no one else could seem to guard them.

[ArbitraryWater]

Definitely.





Yes.

Better question would be: how many FMVP's are not yet in the HoF but definitely deserve to be?... Answer would be Jo Jo White. Cornbread was a really good player and won FMVP (that should've went to Bird) but not really a HoF'er, at all.



:roll:

[SHAQisGOAT]

:roll:

????

[BlazerRed]

Yes of course he will be.

[ninephive]

He was at best third place for fmvp this year, and he was shooting for it in game 5 just couldn't get it done, was also terrible in the last finals, got outplayed in every game by westbrook in wcf then in game 6 they took him out at the half down dbl digits and came back to win with him on the bench. Just seems strange for a hof lock to never have been allnba first team but guess some of that has to do with being from outside of the u.s
Why are you singling out G6 against OKC (which wasn't even an elimination game for the Spurs)? Why don't you look at the most important game of the Spurs season and ONLY elimination game, Game SEVEN against Dallas? Where was Parker? Oh, I don't know, dropping 32 and giving the team a chance to play for an NBA title. And what about the whole series against Portland where Parker torched Lilliard? Or what about Parker leading the Spurs in scoring and assists through the entire playoffs? Oh, no, let's concentrate on one game where he played the first half through injury. And it's like you're acting like the Spurs were better without him. What about the Spurs winning the other 3 games with him?i guess that doesn't matter. Maybe we should trade him....you're right...or just cut him. He's holding the Spurs back.

[joeyjoejoe]

I've said it before...the only way Parker starts getting all-star starts and All-NBA first teams is if (1) Chris Paul learns how to win, which will inevitably lower his stat-padding, (2) Tony Parker learns how to lose, which will inevitably jack up his stats, or (3) Parker gets traded to a bottom feeder or even mediocre team (like Paul's Clippers) where he can pad like crazy.

Lol plenty of guys with rings that actually put up good stats, parker just aint top 3 pg not saying he's not top 10 coz he is but he's very much a product of of pop and duncan, without Tim parker has no rings simple

[Da Doc04]

LOL @ this being a real question

[Anaximandro1]

4x NBA Champion
2007 NBA Finals MVP
6x NBA All-Star
3x All-NBA 2nd Team
1x All-NBA 3rd Team

Eurobasket 2013 MVP

Eurobasket 2013 champion

Fixed

He's a lock for the hall of fame ... a reward for all the hard work :applause:



parker and manu have carried this franchise to titles in 2005,2007,2014 = hall of fame lock

Don't forget Rasho and Francisco Elson.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-si7mc1zTMes/U6mLdhg1a8I/AAAAAAAADEU/qtJPr3OwVr4/s1600/1.jpg



2014 ?? Amazing team work :bowdown:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HyC7rYH7hKg/U6mRyO2jhRI/AAAAAAAADEs/gtA9GJDIvP0/s1600/2.jpg

[ninephive]

Fixed

He's a lock for the hall of fame ... a reward for all the hard work :applause:




Don't forget Rasho and Francisco Elson.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-si7mc1zTMes/U6mLdhg1a8I/AAAAAAAADEU/qtJPr3OwVr4/s1600/1.jpg



2014 ?? Amazing team work :bowdown:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HyC7rYH7hKg/U6mRyO2jhRI/AAAAAAAADEs/gtA9GJDIvP0/s1600/2.jpg
I love how those charts have 3 columns for rebounding alone and 1 for assists. And I love how it combines blocks and steals. If there was ever a way to try and make C/PF look more important than a G, this is the way to do it.

[Euroleague]

Its not the nba hall of fame.....its the basketball hof.

This is the dumbest line of BS that people say.

Ever actually look at how much shit a non NBA player has to do to get in there? Manu's "international career" is mega scrub level compared to those guys.

The standard is so high it's almost unbelievable.

And not only that - not only is the standard unbelieveble, it took Oscar Schmidt YEARS to get in there.

Nick Galis STILL IS NOT IN THERE.

Kukoc is not even there.

This whole "it's the basketball hall of fame, not the NBA hall of fame" line is total bullshit. NBA standard is WAY LOWER than the international standard is. You have to be a freaking GOD to get in based on international play.

Marciulionis got in this last year, and they even put a stipulation when they selected him that said, "not for play only, but for contribution to the game, due to that he created the Lithuanian national team and Lithuanian national league".

Otherwise, just based on international career and NBA, no way in hell would he have gotten in there either.

[GimmeThat]

This is the dumbest line of BS that people say.

Ever actually look at how much shit a none NBA player has to do to get in there?

The standard is so high it's almost unbelievable.


Even if we were to put a few Euroleaguers or global basketball players to help judge the committee.

I agree, it might influence the decision a bit, but how much do you think it's going to make a difference.

Should someone who has won 1 gold medal in their life been awarded into the HOF? or one player from a team who has won the gold medal had the most impact?


you've gotta take a few gold medals away from the U.S. team before you want to make the argument about the "how much shit a none NBA player has to do to get in there?"

[Thorn]

Why are you singling out G6 against OKC (which wasn't even an elimination game for the Spurs)? Why don't you look at the most important game of the Spurs season and ONLY elimination game, Game SEVEN against Dallas? Where was Parker? Oh, I don't know, dropping 32 and giving the team a chance to play for an NBA title. And what about the whole series against Portland where Parker torched Lilliard? Or what about Parker leading the Spurs in scoring and assists through the entire playoffs? Oh, no, let's concentrate on one game where he played the first half through injury. And it's like you're acting like the Spurs were better without him. What about the Spurs winning the other 3 games with him?i guess that doesn't matter. Maybe we should trade him....you're right...or just cut him. He's holding the Spurs back.
responded to:


Where was Parker? He was running the offense as usual, holding Chalmers and Cole to terrible shooting numbers, leading the team in scoring in games 1 & 5, second on the team overall in scoring, leading the team in assists, hitting the game-clinching miracle shot in G1, having one of the biggest sequences in Finals history in the last 2 minutes of G6 (tying 3 over Lebron, steal, go-ahead leaner over Chalmers, outlet to Manu for free throws twice to seal the game...and then on the bench at the end of OT for some reason, just like how Duncan got benched in regulation), and then playing through injury in G7 (the whole series really, but it kept getting progressively worse). That's where Parker was last year. Oh, and defending the Lebron AND Allen 3s at the end of regulation in G6 when no one else could seem to guard them.

hmmm

[Euroleague]

Even if we were to put a few Euroleaguers or global basketball players to help judge the committee.

I agree, it might influence the decision a bit, but how much do you think it's going to make a difference.

Should someone who has won 1 gold medal in their life been awarded into the HOF? or one player from a team who has won the gold medal had the most impact?


you've gotta take a few gold medals away from the U.S. team before you want to make the argument about the "how much shit a none NBA player has to do to get in there?"

I don't even care about the hall of fame or how they do it, or who is in there.

All I am saying is it gets really old always seeing that "it's the basketball hall of fame, not the NBA hall of fame" comment every time this hall of fame debate comes up for a non USA player.

People start claiming they will get in due to "international accomplishments" or whatever.

I'm just saying that's actually 100% complete BULLSHIT. Because they are implying an easier standard for international play for the hall of fame, when actually, it's the opposite. The have the bar set exponentially HIGHER, considerably HIGHER.

The standard for making the hall of fame from NBA is fairly low, for all players. But the standard for international play, especially for non American ones is EXTREMELY HIGH, almost impossible to obtain.

yet, someone always makes that comment about how "it's the basketball hall of fame not the NBA hall of fame" and how it's real easy to get in the hall of fame from some international play.

Someone even threw in winning the EuroBasket once in this thread.....is that a FREAKING JOKE? Guys in the hall of fame from international play win Eurobasket multiple times.

Parker won a tournament ONCE IN HIS CAREER.

Again, people make these stupid statements.

Just freaking look at the guys in there........

Drazen Dalipagic
Sergey Belov
Dino Meneghin
Kresimir Cosic
Arvydas Sabonis

I mean it takes either incredible, INCREDIBLE success with the national team, or the same in Euroleague, or some kind of combination of both.

Or it takes some kind of amazing individual out of this world domination that is just incredible

Drazen Petrovic
Oscar Schmidt

AND ON TOP OF THAT unbelievable individual domination, a personal tragedy on top of it to force them to "honor you" - something that OTHERWISE they would NOT have done (Schmidt was waiting for years and not getting even close until his cancer).

Schmidt = brain cancer
Petrovic = died in car crash


The mere fact that guys like Toni Kukoc and Nick Galis are not even in the hall of fame should be more than 100% proof beyond any doubt that the standard for international play is almost beyond reach and unattainable.

But NBA only fans just think the exact opposite, that it's a much lower standard than NBA.

It's just another bullshit legend created in the minds of NBA only fans.

[Eat Like A Bosh]

If Tim Duncan are Manu Ginobilli are locks, then I don't see why Parker couldn't make it. Even Billups made it, a player who isn't as well accomplished as Parker.

[greymatter]

If Dennis Johnson can make it, Tony Parker definitely can.

[ninephive]

Let me make this very simple:

There are 300+ members of the basketball Hall-Of-Fame. When Parker's career is over, he will have a legitimate case for top 50 players of all time. He's already one of <30 players with a FMVP. If he wins another one (which he would have the chance next season if he can stay healthy), that puts him on a list of 10 others with multiple FMVPs. He has 4 championships and is still in his prime. He has a very good chance to finish his career with the most playoff wins of all time. He ran what many are considering the greatest offense of all time. He was a top 5 MVP candidate for multiple seasons. And he is a fairly accomplished international player (which he did in his offseasons, not before his NBA career). Need I say more to make the case that Parker should easily make the HOF with the 300 other players already inducted?

[GimmeThat]

I don't even care about the hall of fame or how they do it, or who is in there.

All I am saying is it gets really old always seeing that "it's the basketball hall of fame, not the NBA hall of fame" comment every time this hall of fame debate comes up for a non USA player.



Okay, kick out every none-NBA player. And start another hall of fame.


The Department of Education has also placed a ban on honorary degree given out by universities.

Because, it's just dellusional for someone to obtain a degree from a school they've never attended.

[Alan Ogg]

A better question would be whether he'll be a first ballot HOFer.

He's going to finish top 10 in playoff points and assists. Could possibly crack 20,000 regular season points. That's aside from all his other accomplishments.

[Lebron23]

Yes

[tomtucker]

the flop hall of fame, yes

[greymatter]

If Tim Duncan are Manu Ginobilli are locks, then I don't see why Parker couldn't make it. Even Billups made it, a player who isn't as well accomplished as Parker.

Ginobili is a lock?

He hasn't even been the 4th best SG in the league but for maybe once or twice in his whole career. There's a good reason why he only has 2 AS appearances. If he makes it, it will only be because his legacy is tied to Duncan's. Dennis Johnson was a 5 time AS and he only barely made it in.

And FYI, Billups played for the Pistons this past season. You aren't eligible for the HOF until 5 years after retirement.

[BasedTom]

Is the fact that Parker is 11-5 against Lebron in the Finals that has you mad or something else about him?
I don't care about that at all. The fact that he's beaten the Heat hurts, but it's not everything. I have the utmost respect for Dirk Nowitzki, Kidd, Duncan, Ginobili, Leonard.

Parker? Horribly overrated. And he's French too, as well, so that only adds to it.

[DMAVS41]

Without a doubt...

But he's become absurdly over-rated here and in the basketball community the last 5 years or so.

[Artillery]

Without a doubt...

But he's become absurdly over-rated here and in the basketball community the last 5 years or so.

Yup. Dude is one of the more infamous playoff choke artists but hardly anybody seems to call him out on it. Look at just this year alone: quit on his team in the closeout game against Blazers, quit on his team in the closeout game against the Thunder, shot 0-9 in the first three quarters of the closeout game against Miami while his backup Patty Mills scored 14 points in the 3rd.

[TimmyDuncan]

Yup. Dude is one of the more infamous playoff choke artists but hardly anybody seems to call him out on it. Look at just this year alone: quit on his team in the closeout game against Blazers, quit on his team in the closeout game against the Thunder, shot 0-9 in the first three quarters of the closeout game against Miami while his backup Patty Mills scored 14 points in the 3rd.

Such a choke artist than in the only elimination game for the spurs, game 7 vs the maws, he dominated with 32 pts on 58% in 34 min.

The portland series was supposed to be a really tough one and he basically destroyed them early in the series.

I'll stop there since you are clearly here to hate on him for whatever reason and nothing I'll write will change that

[Euroleague]

Okay, kick out every none-NBA player. And start another hall of fame.


The Department of Education has also placed a ban on honorary degree given out by universities.

Because, it's just dellusional for someone to obtain a degree from a school they've never attended.

They already did. It's called FIBA hall of fame. It has an even higher standard.

Bill Russell and Oscar Robertson got in, but so far guys like Jordan, Bird and Magic only got nominated.

[Eat Like A Bosh]

Ginobili is a lock?

He hasn't even been the 4th best SG in the league but for maybe once or twice in his whole career. There's a good reason why he only has 2 AS appearances. If he makes it, it will only be because his legacy is tied to Duncan's. Dennis Johnson was a 5 time AS and he only barely made it in.

And FYI, Billups played for the Pistons this past season. You aren't eligible for the HOF until 5 years after retirement.
Gino is one of the few people to have won a Euroleague title, NBA Title and a Olympic Gold Medal. Remember, this is the basketball hall of fame, not just the NBA. I think Gino will make it.

[Purch]

Without a doubt...

But he's become absurdly over-rated here and in the basketball community the last 5 years or so.
It's not a suprise because Parker peaked as a player after 2011, when he became the focus of the new spurs offense

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Without a doubt...

But he's become absurdly over-rated here and in the basketball community the last 5 years or so.
This.

[dubeta]

I don't even care about the hall of fame or how they do it, or who is in there.

All I am saying is it gets really old always seeing that "it's the basketball hall of fame, not the NBA hall of fame" comment every time this hall of fame debate comes up for a non USA player.

People start claiming they will get in due to "international accomplishments" or whatever.

I'm just saying that's actually 100% complete BULLSHIT. Because they are implying an easier standard for international play for the hall of fame, when actually, it's the opposite. The have the bar set exponentially HIGHER, considerably HIGHER.

The standard for making the hall of fame from NBA is fairly low, for all players. But the standard for international play, especially for non American ones is EXTREMELY HIGH, almost impossible to obtain.

yet, someone always makes that comment about how "it's the basketball hall of fame not the NBA hall of fame" and how it's real easy to get in the hall of fame from some international play.

Someone even threw in winning the EuroBasket once in this thread.....is that a FREAKING JOKE? Guys in the hall of fame from international play win Eurobasket multiple times.

Parker won a tournament ONCE IN HIS CAREER.

Again, people make these stupid statements.

Just freaking look at the guys in there........

Drazen Dalipagic
Sergey Belov
Dino Meneghin
Kresimir Cosic
Arvydas Sabonis

I mean it takes either incredible, INCREDIBLE success with the national team, or the same in Euroleague, or some kind of combination of both.

Or it takes some kind of amazing individual out of this world domination that is just incredible

Drazen Petrovic
Oscar Schmidt

AND ON TOP OF THAT unbelievable individual domination, a personal tragedy on top of it to force them to "honor you" - something that OTHERWISE they would NOT have done (Schmidt was waiting for years and not getting even close until his cancer).

Schmidt = brain cancer
Petrovic = died in car crash


The mere fact that guys like Toni Kukoc and Nick Galis are not even in the hall of fame should be more than 100% proof beyond any doubt that the standard for international play is almost beyond reach and unattainable.

But NBA only fans just think the exact opposite, that it's a much lower standard than NBA.

It's just another bullshit legend created in the minds of NBA only fans.

dont see the big deal, international players are worse than JV players here

[Euroleague]

Gino is one of the few people to have won a Euroleague title, NBA Title and a Olympic Gold Medal. Remember, this is the basketball hall of fame, not just the NBA. I think Gino will make it.

As already pointed out, an Olympic gold and a Euroleague title isn't even remotely close to enough to get you in the hall of fame, even though NBA only fans keep making retarded claims like that.

Dozens of guys have WAY MORE THAN THAT and never sniffed the hall of fame.

Besides that Manu's Euroleague title is an asterisk title, something NBA sources and marketing never point out, but it is.

[Euroleague]

dont see the big deal, international players are worse than JV players here

Then how come NBA starters go to Euroleague and become absolute scrubs all the time?

STOP TROLLING

[ninephive]

Yup. Dude is one of the more infamous playoff choke artists but hardly anybody seems to call him out on it. Look at just this year alone: quit on his team in the closeout game against Blazers, quit on his team in the closeout game against the Thunder, shot 0-9 in the first three quarters of the closeout game against Miami while his backup Patty Mills scored 14 points in the 3rd.
Hahahahahahaha, are you mad because he still scored more than Duncan in that Heat closeout game you're referring to?

[ninephive]

Such a choke artist than in the only elimination game for the spurs, game 7 vs the maws, he dominated with 32 pts on 58% in 34 min.

The portland series was supposed to be a really tough one and he basically destroyed them early in the series.

I'll stop there since you are clearly here to hate on him for whatever reason and nothing I'll write will change that
Exactly. The guy's examples of Tony being a choke artist are games where he played through the first half with an injury until Pop benched him in the second half to keep him healthy and one where he went 6-7 in the 4th quarter of a Finals closeout game. Hahaha, if those are the games people point to as examples of you "choking," you've had a pretty damn good career!

[ninephive]

Yup. Dude is one of the more infamous playoff choke artists but hardly anybody seems to call him out on it. Look at just this year alone: quit on his team in the closeout game against Blazers, quit on his team in the closeout game against the Thunder, shot 0-9 in the first three quarters of the closeout game against Miami while his backup Patty Mills scored 14 points in the 3rd.
The reason "hardly anyone calls him on it" is because the only people who seem to think he's a choke artists are guys trying to prop up Duncan. We get it, you're bitter becuase Duncan hasn't won a FMVP in 9 years or been the best player on the team in several years and wasn't voted by the coaches as an All-Star like Parker was this year. HE'S STILL A TOP 5 PLAYER OF ALL TIME. Acting like Tony has been no help to him his whole career isn't going to improve his ranking. It's ok. All the greats have had other players like Parker by him...otherwise they wouldn't have had the success they did. Get over it. You're worse than a Lebron or Kobe stan sometimes with Duncan. The Spurs are a great team and for the time being Parker is the best player. That could transition to Kawhi soon, so be happy that the Spurs success continues as the torch is passed. Timmy has continued to show an unbelievable amount of longevity and I for one am ecstatic he's coming back for another one. Stop with the Parker crap though. He doesn't take the summers off like Tim so he's more banged up come the end of the season. This year hopefully we'll have him at full strength and maybe he can get back into MVP talks throughout the season. But please, just stop unless you've got some good evidence more than 2 random games (AND NOT EVEN THE WHOLE GAME...you literally picked out 5 total quarters of play!!!)

[Real14]

Hellz yea tony parker iz a hall of famer, he was 2007 finals mvp tha same year that he and tha spurs swept queen james in tha finals :applause:

[Fork]

Yup, no doubt.

[Young X]

The reason "hardly anyone calls him on it" is because the only people who seem to think he's a choke artists are guys trying to prop up Duncan. We get it, you're bitter becuase Duncan hasn't won a FMVP in 9 years or been the best player on the team in several years and wasn't voted by the coaches as an All-Star like Parker was this year. HE'S STILL A TOP 5 PLAYER OF ALL TIME. Acting like Tony has been no help to him his whole career isn't going to improve his ranking. It's ok. All the greats have had other players like Parker by him...otherwise they wouldn't have had the success they did. Get over it. You're worse than a Lebron or Kobe stan sometimes with Duncan. The Spurs are a great team and for the time being Parker is the best player. That could transition to Kawhi soon, so be happy that the Spurs success continues as the torch is passed. Timmy has continued to show an unbelievable amount of longevity and I for one am ecstatic he's coming back for another one. Stop with the Parker crap though. He doesn't take the summers off like Tim so he's more banged up come the end of the season. This year hopefully we'll have him at full strength and maybe he can get back into MVP talks throughout the season. But please, just stop unless you've got some good evidence more than 2 random games (AND NOT EVEN THE WHOLE GAME...you literally picked out 5 total quarters of play!!!)Parker is NOT the best player on the Spurs. Never has been.

[La Frescobaldi]

Legit question: how many Finals MVP's havent made/arent likely to make the HOF

2nd part: if the answer is none, does anyone think Kawhi Leonard may be the first Finals MVP not to make the HOF. (obviously too early to tell, but its worth a prediction)

Here's the list of Finals MVPs who are NOT in the Hall of Fame:
*************************
JoJo White
Cedric Maxwell
*************************

the rest of them are either active or haven't yet come up for selection.........
Shaquille O'Neal
Chauncey Billups
Tim Duncan
Dwyane Wade
Tony Parker
Paul Pierce
Kobe Bryant
Dirk Nowitzki
LeBron James
Kawhi Leonard

[La Frescobaldi]

Such a choke artist than in the only elimination game for the spurs, game 7 vs the maws, he dominated with 32 pts on 58% in 34 min.

The portland series was supposed to be a really tough one and he basically destroyed them early in the series.

I'll stop there since you are clearly here to hate on him for whatever reason and nothing I'll write will change that

clearly had to rep

[La Frescobaldi]

Definitely.





Yes.

Better question would be: how many FMVP's are not yet in the HoF but definitely deserve to be?... Answer would be Jo Jo White. Cornbread was a really good player and won FMVP (that should've went to Bird) but not really a HoF'er, at all.
JoJo was Glen Rice of his days, maybe not that good.

Threat to score at all times but overall... All-Star level no more.

[ninephive]

Parker is NOT the best player on the Spurs. Never has been.
Why was he the only All Star this year?

[Young X]

Why was he the only All Star this year?Hype.

[Artillery]

The reason "hardly anyone calls him on it" is because the only people who seem to think he's a choke artists are guys trying to prop up Duncan.

We get it, you're bitter becuase Duncan hasn't won a FMVP in 9 years or been the best player on the team in several years and wasn't voted by the coaches as an All-Star like Parker was this year. HE'S STILL A TOP 5 PLAYER OF ALL TIME. Acting like Tony has been no help to him his whole career isn't going to improve his ranking. It's ok. All the greats have had other players like Parker by him...otherwise they wouldn't have had the success they did. Get over it.

You're worse than a Lebron or Kobe stan sometimes with Duncan. The Spurs are a great team and for the time being Parker is the best player.

If that was true I would hate Manu but I consider him one of the best shooting guards in NBA history.


That could transition to Kawhi soon, so be happy that the Spurs success continues as the torch is passed.

I actually like Kawhi a lot. He's shown up for every Finals he's been a part of. Can't say the same for Tony.


Stop with the Parker crap though. He doesn't take the summers off like Tim so he's more banged up come the end of the season.

That's his own fault. It shows Tim cares more about the team than Tony. Then again, that's not surprising. Back in 2011, Parker said the Spurs were done as contenders.


This year hopefully we'll have him at full strength and maybe he can get back into MVP talks throughout the season. But please, just stop unless you've got some good evidence more than 2 random games (AND NOT EVEN THE WHOLE GAME...you literally picked out 5 total quarters of play!!!)

Two games? I have most of his playoff career as proof.

I call Parker a choke artist because he always fails to live up to his great regular season performances in the playoffs. In the reg season he has pretty great career numbers. Come playoff time, his efficiency plummets and he has trouble running a proper offense. Compare his regular season(RS) and post-season(PS) stats. His numbers fall across the board:

PER RS: 19.1
PER PS: 17.4

WS/48 RS: .151
WS/48 PS: .091

TS% RS: .551
TS% PS: .516

ORtg RS: 109
ORtg PS: 103

DRtg RS: 104
DRtg PS: 107

We all know about last year's Finals chokejob. He got outplayed by Mario Chalmers in game 6 and 7. Shot 6-23 in game 6. 3-12 in game 7. Averaged a mediocre 15 ppg on 47% TS. People go to great lengths to blame Ginobili for a few turnovers or to blame Duncan for missing a layup while ignoring how truly awful Parker was in the Finals. I don't think any other first option in NBA history has played THAT bad in an NBA Finals. I'd have to look up the numbers though.

How about this year? Played terrible against the Mavs until game 7. Missed the closeout game against the Blazers. Westbrook completely shits on him all series in the Conference Finals to the point where the Spurs look better when Parker is OFF the court. Missed the closeout game against the Thunder forcing the old guys to carry the team(TD, Manu, Diaw). Shot 0-9 against the Heat in the closeout game 5. Miami was blowing SA out while Parker was in game chucking for Finals MVP. The bench unit comes in and saves the day. Parker's backup scores 14 points in the 3rd quarter. TP only started scoring in garbage time when the game was well out of reach for Miami.

How about past series? He was by far the least important member of the Spurs trio during the 2000s. High usage, low efficiency chucker with mediocre court vision.

In 2003 he was horrid. Couldn't run the offense properly at all(96 ORtg in the playoffs). It got to the point that Pop had to replace him in 4th quarters with Speedy Claxton. Really, really bad efficiency too(.468 TS% in the playoffs).

Than there's his awful performance as a second option in 2004. He shot 7-23 in the pivotal game five of the conference semis against LA. Most of his shots should have been going to Duncan or Manu that series.

In 2005, TD and Manu carried the team to the title. Parker was a glorified role player. TS% of .490 throughout the playoffs that year. Horry, Barry, and Bowen were all more important than him.

In 2006, Duncan and Ginobili both had strong playoff performances against the Mavs in a close seven game series. TD averaged 32 pts/12 rebs on .61 TS% against Dallas. Ginobili averaged 21 ppg on .64 TS%. Unfortunately, the albatross known as Tony Parker dragged the team down with yet ANOTHER horribly inefficient series. Averaged 20 ppg on an Iverson-esque .47 TS%. Parker's crappy shot selection resulted in numerous wasted possessions.

Parker won Finals MVP in 2007 but it was a hollow award seeing as TD and Manu were both more important than him throughout that post-season run. It's a joke that people claim Parker led them to a title that year. Look at their cumulative stats for the entire 2007 playoffs:

27.4 PER - Duncan
21.9 PER - Ginobili
18.7 PER - Parker

Parker took advantage of the biggest mismatch in Finals history with the Cavs using Boobie Gibson to defend him. Meanwhile, Duncan had to deal with Varejao/Ilgauskas and Ginobili had Lebron guarding him for large portions. Makes sense that Parker had such a big series when Cleveland was throwing all their defensive attention towards other players on the Spurs. Mike Brown used to coach under Pop - He knew from personal experience that Parker would choke if he became the primary scoring option(see 2004 playoffs against the Lakers). Unfortunately for Brown, Parker actually had the series of his life and hit most of his jumpers for a change.

[ninephive]

If that was true I would hate Manu but I consider him one of the best shooting guards in NBA history.



I actually like Kawhi a lot. He's shown up for every Finals he's been a part of. Can't say the same for Tony.



That's his own fault. It shows Tim cares more about the team than Tony. Then again, that's not surprising. Back in 2011, Parker said the Spurs were done as contenders.



Two games? I have most of his playoff career as proof.

I call Parker a choke artist because he always fails to live up to his great regular season performances in the playoffs. In the reg season he has pretty great career numbers. Come playoff time, his efficiency plummets and he has trouble running a proper offense. Compare his regular season(RS) and post-season(PS) stats. His numbers fall across the board:

PER RS: 19.1
PER PS: 17.4

WS/48 RS: .151
WS/48 PS: .091

TS% RS: .551
TS% PS: .516

ORtg RS: 109
ORtg PS: 103

DRtg RS: 104
DRtg PS: 107

We all know about last year's Finals chokejob. He got outplayed by Mario Chalmers in game 6 and 7. Shot 6-23 in game 6. 3-12 in game 7. Averaged a mediocre 15 ppg on 47% TS. People go to great lengths to blame Ginobili for a few turnovers or to blame Duncan for missing a layup while ignoring how truly awful Parker was in the Finals. I don't think any other first option in NBA history has played THAT bad in an NBA Finals. I'd have to look up the numbers though.

How about this year? Played terrible against the Mavs until game 7. Missed the closeout game against the Blazers. Westbrook completely shits on him all series in the Conference Finals to the point where the Spurs look better when Parker is OFF the court. Missed the closeout game against the Thunder forcing the old guys to carry the team(TD, Manu, Diaw). Shot 0-9 against the Heat in the closeout game 5. Miami was blowing SA out while Parker was in game chucking for Finals MVP. The bench unit comes in and saves the day. Parker's backup scores 14 points in the 3rd quarter. TP only started scoring in garbage time when the game was well out of reach for Miami.

How about past series? He was by far the least important member of the Spurs trio during the 2000s. High usage, low efficiency chucker with mediocre court vision.

In 2003 he was horrid. Couldn't run the offense properly at all(96 ORtg in the playoffs). It got to the point that Pop had to replace him in 4th quarters with Speedy Claxton. Really, really bad efficiency too(.468 TS% in the playoffs).

Than there's his awful performance as a second option in 2004. He shot 7-23 in the pivotal game five of the conference semis against LA. Most of his shots should have been going to Duncan or Manu that series.

In 2005, TD and Manu carried the team to the title. Parker was a glorified role player. TS% of .490 throughout the playoffs that year. Horry, Barry, and Bowen were all more important than him.

In 2006, Duncan and Ginobili both had strong playoff performances against the Mavs in a close seven game series. TD averaged 32 pts/12 rebs on .61 TS% against Dallas. Ginobili averaged 21 ppg on .64 TS%. Unfortunately, the albatross known as Tony Parker dragged the team down with yet ANOTHER horribly inefficient series. Averaged 20 ppg on an Iverson-esque .47 TS%. Parker's crappy shot selection resulted in numerous wasted possessions.

Parker won Finals MVP in 2007 but it was a hollow award seeing as TD and Manu were both more important than him throughout that post-season run. It's a joke that people claim Parker led them to a title that year. Look at their cumulative stats for the entire 2007 playoffs:

27.4 PER - Duncan
21.9 PER - Ginobili
18.7 PER - Parker

Parker took advantage of the biggest mismatch in Finals history with the Cavs using Boobie Gibson to defend him. Meanwhile, Duncan had to deal with Varejao/Ilgauskas and Ginobili had Lebron guarding him for large portions. Makes sense that Parker had such a big series when Cleveland was throwing all their defensive attention towards other players on the Spurs. Mike Brown used to coach under Pop - He knew from personal experience that Parker would choke if he became the primary scoring option(see 2004 playoffs against the Lakers). Unfortunately for Brown, Parker actually had the series of his life and hit most of his jumpers for a change.
Hahahaha you are so selective it is unreal. You pick all these random games and quarters...literally you pick every one of Parker's worst games from his whole career and make no mention of his amazing performances or buzzer beaters or huge sequences (see the final 2 mins of last year's G6...about as clutch a closeout sequence as there has ever been).

Then you have the hilarious notion to say that Manu has a "few" turnovers. Hahahahaha how ridiculously blind are you. Do you not understand Manu had the worst game of his entire career in that game? Do you not realize he never in any other game of his career turned the ball over 8 times? And you're going to blame an injured Parker who hit the game-tying 3, stole the ball, then hit the go ahead shot in the last 2 minutes?

Then you're going to try to leassen his FMVP because they had mediocre defenders on him? Then what about Duncan's last 2 finals? Who has he had on him? Bosh? Birdman? Are those supposed to be good defenders or something? And you lessen the impact of Parker's 2007 FMVP by saying the others were garnering the defensive attention? Well, what about the past 2 Finals where Parker was the one who was defended by James? Want to mention the flip side of the coin or just pretend like he didn't open up the offense by drawing the hardest hedging I've ever seen in a playoff series. It was basically a double every time he touched the ball.

The fact is Parker is still an All-Star...want to address that? And he's still considered the Spurs best player by most. He was the highest scorer in every playoff series this year except the one he was most severely injured in and had to miss significant time. The offense still runs through him. So bring up all the random selective stats you want but Parker's numbers increase in the playoffs every year.

[ninephive]

If that was true I would hate Manu but I consider him one of the best shooting guards in NBA history.



I actually like Kawhi a lot. He's shown up for every Finals he's been a part of. Can't say the same for Tony.



That's his own fault. It shows Tim cares more about the team than Tony. Then again, that's not surprising. Back in 2011, Parker said the Spurs were done as contenders.



Two games? I have most of his playoff career as proof.

I call Parker a choke artist because he always fails to live up to his great regular season performances in the playoffs. In the reg season he has pretty great career numbers. Come playoff time, his efficiency plummets and he has trouble running a proper offense. Compare his regular season(RS) and post-season(PS) stats. His numbers fall across the board:

PER RS: 19.1
PER PS: 17.4

WS/48 RS: .151
WS/48 PS: .091

TS% RS: .551
TS% PS: .516

ORtg RS: 109
ORtg PS: 103

DRtg RS: 104
DRtg PS: 107

We all know about last year's Finals chokejob. He got outplayed by Mario Chalmers in game 6 and 7. Shot 6-23 in game 6. 3-12 in game 7. Averaged a mediocre 15 ppg on 47% TS. People go to great lengths to blame Ginobili for a few turnovers or to blame Duncan for missing a layup while ignoring how truly awful Parker was in the Finals. I don't think any other first option in NBA history has played THAT bad in an NBA Finals. I'd have to look up the numbers though.

How about this year? Played terrible against the Mavs until game 7. Missed the closeout game against the Blazers. Westbrook completely shits on him all series in the Conference Finals to the point where the Spurs look better when Parker is OFF the court. Missed the closeout game against the Thunder forcing the old guys to carry the team(TD, Manu, Diaw). Shot 0-9 against the Heat in the closeout game 5. Miami was blowing SA out while Parker was in game chucking for Finals MVP. The bench unit comes in and saves the day. Parker's backup scores 14 points in the 3rd quarter. TP only started scoring in garbage time when the game was well out of reach for Miami.

How about past series? He was by far the least important member of the Spurs trio during the 2000s. High usage, low efficiency chucker with mediocre court vision.

In 2003 he was horrid. Couldn't run the offense properly at all(96 ORtg in the playoffs). It got to the point that Pop had to replace him in 4th quarters with Speedy Claxton. Really, really bad efficiency too(.468 TS% in the playoffs).

Than there's his awful performance as a second option in 2004. He shot 7-23 in the pivotal game five of the conference semis against LA. Most of his shots should have been going to Duncan or Manu that series.

In 2005, TD and Manu carried the team to the title. Parker was a glorified role player. TS% of .490 throughout the playoffs that year. Horry, Barry, and Bowen were all more important than him.

In 2006, Duncan and Ginobili both had strong playoff performances against the Mavs in a close seven game series. TD averaged 32 pts/12 rebs on .61 TS% against Dallas. Ginobili averaged 21 ppg on .64 TS%. Unfortunately, the albatross known as Tony Parker dragged the team down with yet ANOTHER horribly inefficient series. Averaged 20 ppg on an Iverson-esque .47 TS%. Parker's crappy shot selection resulted in numerous wasted possessions.

Parker won Finals MVP in 2007 but it was a hollow award seeing as TD and Manu were both more important than him throughout that post-season run. It's a joke that people claim Parker led them to a title that year. Look at their cumulative stats for the entire 2007 playoffs:

27.4 PER - Duncan
21.9 PER - Ginobili
18.7 PER - Parker

Parker took advantage of the biggest mismatch in Finals history with the Cavs using Boobie Gibson to defend him. Meanwhile, Duncan had to deal with Varejao/Ilgauskas and Ginobili had Lebron guarding him for large portions. Makes sense that Parker had such a big series when Cleveland was throwing all their defensive attention towards other players on the Spurs. Mike Brown used to coach under Pop - He knew from personal experience that Parker would choke if he became the primary scoring option(see 2004 playoffs against the Lakers). Unfortunately for Brown, Parker actually had the series of his life and hit most of his jumpers for a change.
You talk like Parker's production drops in the playoffs. Here's his regular season vs playoffs PPG every year:

2014 - 16.7 to 17.4
2013 - 20.3 to 20.6
2012 - 18.3 to 20.1
2011 - 17.5 to 19.7
2010 - 16.0 to 17.3
2009 - 22.0 to 28.6
2008 - 18.8 to 22.4
2007 - 18.6 to 20.8
2006 - 18.9 to 21.1
2005 - 16.6 to 17.2
2004 - 14.7 to 18.4
2003 - 15.5 to 14.7
2002 - 9.2 to 15.5

So literally his scoring has gone up in the playoffs every year except one. Guess who can't say that? Your boy Duncan, whose scoring went down in the playoffs in '98, '04, & '11 (and then obviously in '00, when Duncan "quit" on his team, like you say Parker did). Overall, Duncan's scoring goes up 1.4 PPG over his career in the playoffs, whereas Parker's goes up 1.8. Duncan is close here though, so you've got to give that to him.

So quit acting like he shrinks in the playoffs. If you want to start getting into advanced stats, that's fine, go ahead if you think that makes your case. But Parker's not coming up empty in the playoffs like you want to suggest.

[ninephive]

Hype.
You do realize it was the coaches who voted him there right?

And you do realize in the last 3 years Duncan has made 1 All-Star team and Parker has made it every year right? Hype every time or what?

[ninephive]

If that was true I would hate Manu but I consider him one of the best shooting guards in NBA history.



I actually like Kawhi a lot. He's shown up for every Finals he's been a part of. Can't say the same for Tony.



That's his own fault. It shows Tim cares more about the team than Tony. Then again, that's not surprising. Back in 2011, Parker said the Spurs were done as contenders.



Two games? I have most of his playoff career as proof.

I call Parker a choke artist because he always fails to live up to his great regular season performances in the playoffs. In the reg season he has pretty great career numbers. Come playoff time, his efficiency plummets and he has trouble running a proper offense. Compare his regular season(RS) and post-season(PS) stats. His numbers fall across the board:

PER RS: 19.1
PER PS: 17.4

WS/48 RS: .151
WS/48 PS: .091

TS% RS: .551
TS% PS: .516

ORtg RS: 109
ORtg PS: 103

DRtg RS: 104
DRtg PS: 107

We all know about last year's Finals chokejob. He got outplayed by Mario Chalmers in game 6 and 7. Shot 6-23 in game 6. 3-12 in game 7. Averaged a mediocre 15 ppg on 47% TS. People go to great lengths to blame Ginobili for a few turnovers or to blame Duncan for missing a layup while ignoring how truly awful Parker was in the Finals. I don't think any other first option in NBA history has played THAT bad in an NBA Finals. I'd have to look up the numbers though.

How about this year? Played terrible against the Mavs until game 7. Missed the closeout game against the Blazers. Westbrook completely shits on him all series in the Conference Finals to the point where the Spurs look better when Parker is OFF the court. Missed the closeout game against the Thunder forcing the old guys to carry the team(TD, Manu, Diaw). Shot 0-9 against the Heat in the closeout game 5. Miami was blowing SA out while Parker was in game chucking for Finals MVP. The bench unit comes in and saves the day. Parker's backup scores 14 points in the 3rd quarter. TP only started scoring in garbage time when the game was well out of reach for Miami.

How about past series? He was by far the least important member of the Spurs trio during the 2000s. High usage, low efficiency chucker with mediocre court vision.

In 2003 he was horrid. Couldn't run the offense properly at all(96 ORtg in the playoffs). It got to the point that Pop had to replace him in 4th quarters with Speedy Claxton. Really, really bad efficiency too(.468 TS% in the playoffs).

Than there's his awful performance as a second option in 2004. He shot 7-23 in the pivotal game five of the conference semis against LA. Most of his shots should have been going to Duncan or Manu that series.

In 2005, TD and Manu carried the team to the title. Parker was a glorified role player. TS% of .490 throughout the playoffs that year. Horry, Barry, and Bowen were all more important than him.

In 2006, Duncan and Ginobili both had strong playoff performances against the Mavs in a close seven game series. TD averaged 32 pts/12 rebs on .61 TS% against Dallas. Ginobili averaged 21 ppg on .64 TS%. Unfortunately, the albatross known as Tony Parker dragged the team down with yet ANOTHER horribly inefficient series. Averaged 20 ppg on an Iverson-esque .47 TS%. Parker's crappy shot selection resulted in numerous wasted possessions.

Parker won Finals MVP in 2007 but it was a hollow award seeing as TD and Manu were both more important than him throughout that post-season run. It's a joke that people claim Parker led them to a title that year. Look at their cumulative stats for the entire 2007 playoffs:

27.4 PER - Duncan
21.9 PER - Ginobili
18.7 PER - Parker

Parker took advantage of the biggest mismatch in Finals history with the Cavs using Boobie Gibson to defend him. Meanwhile, Duncan had to deal with Varejao/Ilgauskas and Ginobili had Lebron guarding him for large portions. Makes sense that Parker had such a big series when Cleveland was throwing all their defensive attention towards other players on the Spurs. Mike Brown used to coach under Pop - He knew from personal experience that Parker would choke if he became the primary scoring option(see 2004 playoffs against the Lakers). Unfortunately for Brown, Parker actually had the series of his life and hit most of his jumpers for a change.
Well, if I were Parker, I would take that as a compliment to have created the "biggest mismatch in Finals history." Wow, that's saying something.

Was this the same set of guards who held Billups to 15.3 PPG on .429 shooting a series earlier? Or Jason Kidd to 15.2 on .418 the one before that?

So how does Parker go for 24.5 on .568 and get no credit?

[ninephive]

If that was true I would hate Manu but I consider him one of the best shooting guards in NBA history.



I actually like Kawhi a lot. He's shown up for every Finals he's been a part of. Can't say the same for Tony.



That's his own fault. It shows Tim cares more about the team than Tony. Then again, that's not surprising. Back in 2011, Parker said the Spurs were done as contenders.



Two games? I have most of his playoff career as proof.

I call Parker a choke artist because he always fails to live up to his great regular season performances in the playoffs. In the reg season he has pretty great career numbers. Come playoff time, his efficiency plummets and he has trouble running a proper offense. Compare his regular season(RS) and post-season(PS) stats. His numbers fall across the board:

PER RS: 19.1
PER PS: 17.4

WS/48 RS: .151
WS/48 PS: .091

TS% RS: .551
TS% PS: .516

ORtg RS: 109
ORtg PS: 103

DRtg RS: 104
DRtg PS: 107

We all know about last year's Finals chokejob. He got outplayed by Mario Chalmers in game 6 and 7. Shot 6-23 in game 6. 3-12 in game 7. Averaged a mediocre 15 ppg on 47% TS. People go to great lengths to blame Ginobili for a few turnovers or to blame Duncan for missing a layup while ignoring how truly awful Parker was in the Finals. I don't think any other first option in NBA history has played THAT bad in an NBA Finals. I'd have to look up the numbers though.

How about this year? Played terrible against the Mavs until game 7. Missed the closeout game against the Blazers. Westbrook completely shits on him all series in the Conference Finals to the point where the Spurs look better when Parker is OFF the court. Missed the closeout game against the Thunder forcing the old guys to carry the team(TD, Manu, Diaw). Shot 0-9 against the Heat in the closeout game 5. Miami was blowing SA out while Parker was in game chucking for Finals MVP. The bench unit comes in and saves the day. Parker's backup scores 14 points in the 3rd quarter. TP only started scoring in garbage time when the game was well out of reach for Miami.

How about past series? He was by far the least important member of the Spurs trio during the 2000s. High usage, low efficiency chucker with mediocre court vision.

In 2003 he was horrid. Couldn't run the offense properly at all(96 ORtg in the playoffs). It got to the point that Pop had to replace him in 4th quarters with Speedy Claxton. Really, really bad efficiency too(.468 TS% in the playoffs).

Than there's his awful performance as a second option in 2004. He shot 7-23 in the pivotal game five of the conference semis against LA. Most of his shots should have been going to Duncan or Manu that series.

In 2005, TD and Manu carried the team to the title. Parker was a glorified role player. TS% of .490 throughout the playoffs that year. Horry, Barry, and Bowen were all more important than him.

In 2006, Duncan and Ginobili both had strong playoff performances against the Mavs in a close seven game series. TD averaged 32 pts/12 rebs on .61 TS% against Dallas. Ginobili averaged 21 ppg on .64 TS%. Unfortunately, the albatross known as Tony Parker dragged the team down with yet ANOTHER horribly inefficient series. Averaged 20 ppg on an Iverson-esque .47 TS%. Parker's crappy shot selection resulted in numerous wasted possessions.

Parker won Finals MVP in 2007 but it was a hollow award seeing as TD and Manu were both more important than him throughout that post-season run. It's a joke that people claim Parker led them to a title that year. Look at their cumulative stats for the entire 2007 playoffs:

27.4 PER - Duncan
21.9 PER - Ginobili
18.7 PER - Parker

Parker took advantage of the biggest mismatch in Finals history with the Cavs using Boobie Gibson to defend him. Meanwhile, Duncan had to deal with Varejao/Ilgauskas and Ginobili had Lebron guarding him for large portions. Makes sense that Parker had such a big series when Cleveland was throwing all their defensive attention towards other players on the Spurs. Mike Brown used to coach under Pop - He knew from personal experience that Parker would choke if he became the primary scoring option(see 2004 playoffs against the Lakers). Unfortunately for Brown, Parker actually had the series of his life and hit most of his jumpers for a change.
So many crazy statements...how the heck is a 16.7/3.7/5.5 on .401 shooting guy more important than a 20.8/5.8/3.4 on .480 shooting guy? Where do you get this crap man?

[hawksdogsbraves]

Here's the list of Finals MVPs who are NOT in the Hall of Fame:
*************************
JoJo White
Cedric Maxwell
*************************

the rest of them are either active or haven't yet come up for selection.........
Shaquille O'Neal
Chauncey Billups
Tim Duncan
Dwyane Wade
Tony Parker
Paul Pierce
Kobe Bryant
Dirk Nowitzki
LeBron James
Kawhi Leonard

Huh, interesting list.

All of those guys other than Parker, Billups, and Leonard are locks.

I think Parker has a good shot, Billups has a chance but not a very good one, and it's too early to say for Leonard.

[La Frescobaldi]

Huh, interesting list.

All of those guys other than Parker, Billups, and Leonard are locks.

I think Parker has a good shot, Billups has a chance but not a very good one, and it's too early to say for Leonard.
yeah that's about how I see that too. Unfortunate for Chauncey dude is a true class act and a great great player and he should be there imo but in today's game it's all about stats which is the opposite of what he was about.