Could Manu Ginobli have become a top 3 PG of all time.

[westsideozzie]

I don't care what anyone says, this cat if he came here in 2000 and given the keys to the car could have been a 20/10 guy barring injuries. I don't think people give him his props on a historical level, but he is definitely the 3rd best guard of his generation behind Wade and Bryant. But with his skill set, I see him dominating as a big pg ala Jason Kidd. What say you?

[Marchesk]

Magic
Oscar
Stocton

/thread

[Fork]

Magic
Oscar
Stocton

/thread

/thread

[RoundMoundOfReb]

I love Manu but the mythology surrounding him is just ridiculous.

[Artillery]

His inability to play superstar minutes is what's basically prevented him from being a superstar. His impact numbers have always been great though.

[moe94]

I don't care what anyone says, this cat if he came here in 2000 and given the keys to the car could have been a 20/10 guy barring injuries. I don't think people give him his props on a historical level, but he is definitely the 3rd best guard of his generation behind Wade and Bryant. But with his skill set, I see him dominating as a big pg ala Jason Kidd. What say you?

Nash
Kidd

at least

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Nash
Kidd

at least
Nash, Kidd, Carter, Allen, Iverson, Paul etc...

[BlkMambaGOAT]

Magic
Oscar
Isiah Thomas

/thread
This niqqa actually prevented Jordan from winning a ring.

[moe94]

Nash, Kidd, Carter, Allen, Iverson, Paul etc...

Was going from a career standpoint. If we're doing peak play, then lol

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Was going from a career standpoint. If we're doing peak play, then lol
Even from a career standpoint those 6 have (or will have) had better ones without a doubt.

[Artillery]

Nash, Kidd, Carter, Allen, Iverson, Paul etc...

AI's incredibly overrated. A cancer on the basketball court. Replace Ginobili with Iverson and Spurs wouldn't win 2005 or 2007. SA already had a chucker in Tony Parker. Adding another one would have killed that team.

[moe94]

Even from a career standpoint those 6 have (or will have) had better ones without a doubt.

Yeah, you're probably right. Why do some people overrate Manu so much?

[RoundMoundOfReb]

AI's incredibly overrated. A cancer on the basketball court. Replace Ginobili with Iverson and Spurs wouldn't win 2005 or 2007. SA already had a chucker in Tony Parker. Adding another one would have killed that team.
I'm not the biggest AI fan but he undoubtedly had a better NBA career than Manu...

[Artillery]

I'm not the biggest AI fan but he undoubtedly had a better NBA career than Manu...

Yes, scoring lots of points on low efficiency on terrible teams. But is there any way you can build a championship team around him? Manu at least has value as a sidekick/2nd option. AI would't even be able to fulfill that kind of role properly.

[rmt]

Manu is fragile and injury-prone - can't carry a team. With his style of play, his minutes have ALWAYS been managed. Only twice has he averaged over 30 minutes/game - 31.1 minutes in 07-08 and 30.3 minutes in 2010-11.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Yeah, you're probably right. Why do some people overrate Manu so much?
Not sure. Probably the same reason that Chris Bosh is called a superstar. Largest fan base in the NBA having a (Lakers/Kobe fans) bias against Tim Duncan.

[Marchesk]

So Manu is better than Iverson now?

What a (recent) championship does for your legacy on ISH.

[Shih508]

AI's incredibly overrated. A cancer on the basketball court. Replace Ginobili with Iverson and Spurs wouldn't win 2005 or 2007. SA already had a chucker in Tony Parker. Adding another one would have killed that team.

How about if u replace AI with Tony Parker? I said Spurs gonna win from 2003-2007!

[played0ut]

His inability to play superstar minutes is what's basically prevented him from being a superstar. His impact numbers have always been great though.


Manu is fragile and injury-prone - can't carry a team. With his style of play, his minutes have ALWAYS been managed. Only twice has he averaged over 30 minutes/game - 31.1 minutes in 07-08 and 30.3 minutes in 2010-11.


Pop has said that he went to Ginobli and asked him to shorten his minutes-- this was YEARS ago.

Ginobli admitted to being hurt about it, AND Pop has explicitly said that he felt guilty about making someone who deserves starter minutes play so little.

[kennethgriffin]

Magic
Oscar
Stocton

/thread

the 3rd best PG all time is jerry west. he played 90% of his career at PG.. hes top 11-14 all time.. stockton is 19-23... and even isiah thomas is slightly better than stockton IMO

[robert_shaww]

Ginobili is top 40 player ever, thats all i know.

[bizil]

His inability to play superstar minutes is what's basically prevented him from being a superstar. His impact numbers have always been great though.

That's exactly right! Manu's durability and health was always the question. He had the alpha dog gene, could play or defend PG, SG, and SF, had a great scoring skillset, and was very good to great on defense. Skill for skill on both sides of the rock, Manu is a top 10 SG of all time. But his durability stopped him from being a true superstar. He's an All Star level player who accomplished enough on his resume to make the HOF.

[BoutPractice]

I don't know how you should "rank" Ginobili among all-time players because he's never been a heavy minute, carry the load guy.

But I've always seen him as one of them most talented and skilled players of his generation.

And if I need a lineup to kill any team over a 5 minute stretch, even if I have all the choice in the world, I will take a good, hard look at Ginobili as my SG. Not over a Jordan or a Jerry West, but other most of the "star" SGs in the history of the NBA certainly.

(As for the comparison to Chris Bosh, I will not even comment)

[Kvnzhangyay]

Is this a joke thread?

[Psileas]

Being able to pass the ball greatly doesn't necessarily make you a top 3 PG. This is like asking whether Isiah Thomas could have become a top 3 SG if he cared to.
Not to mention that a PG with his mpg is not going to overtake Stockton, Frazier, Payton, Kidd, Cousy or whoever else you have at #3.

[allball]

Is this a joke thread?

^^^^^^^^^^^

[bizil]

Being able to pass the ball greatly doesn't necessarily make you a top 3 PG. This is like asking whether Isiah Thomas could have become a top 3 SG if he cared to.
Not to mention that a PG with his mpg is not going to overtake Stockton, Frazier, Payton, Kidd, Cousy or whoever else you have at #3.

I agree! There is a reason why Ginobli came off the bench often in his career. Sure he was easily an All Star kind of player and highly skilled. So its good to have that off the bench. But it was also because of his durability and injury issues.

U are also correct in terms of passing the ball great. I consider MJ, Kobe, Wade, AI, and T-Mac to be great passers. But are they TRULY pass first players with that true QB mentality. I would say they aren't. That's why they are SG's instead of PG's, even though those guys have and could play PG better than a lot of PG's. So it's one thing to be a great passer BUT it's another to be a true floor general and PG like Stockton, Magic, Isiah, Cousy, Kidd, etc. Some PG's like a Big O, Magic, Paul, and Isiah are alpha dog level scorers but are pure floor generals by nature. Some SF's like Lebron or peak G Hill are similar to that as well.

[sportjames23]

The Bad Boys actually prevented Jordan from winning a ring.


Fix'd.

[T_L_P]

Manu is a great player. When he's at his best he's hard to stop.

But let's not forget he's only had a 10/11 year career, and he never played big minutes, and he came off the bench a lot of the time.

I can't say I'd draft him before guys like Stockton, Isiah, Payton etc. But that's hardly an insult for a late second round pick who has almost always been considered the third option.

I'm really gonna miss him when he hangs it up. A true legend, and I think he's better than Parker (for whatever that's worth).

[robert_shaww]

Manu is a great player. When he's at his best he's hard to stop.

But let's not forget he's only had a 10/11 year career, and he never played big minutes, and he came off the bench a lot of the time.

I can't say I'd draft him before guys like Stockton, Isiah, Payton etc. But that's hardly an insult for a late second round pick who has almost always been considered the third option.

I'm really gonna miss him when he hangs it up. A true legend, and I think he's better than Parker (for whatever that's worth).

good post.