would Kobe Bryant ever be outperformed by Ginobili AND Parker AND Leonard?

[kennethgriffin]

...in the NBA finals?

i saw allot of kobe haters and a few duncan fans ( well 2 i think, possibly alt account ) saying duncan has the better resume now

well he very well might.

but kobes only competition was prime shaq

hes the only guy that could outperform kobe ( and even then as a young 22 year old he was only being out done by 1 point )


now take into consideration that Duncan was outperformed in the finals 3 consecutive times by guys who should be waaaaaaaaaaay below him all time

2005 - Ginobili ( averaged 20 points in the 4 finals wins, 60% shooting series compared to duncans 40% )

2007 - Parker = Finals mvp

2014 - Leonard = Finals mvp



now ask yourself this question. would ginobili outstage kobe?

would parker outstage kobe?

would leonard outstage kobe?

heck kobe was healthy with a month left last year. i bet he could have stepped in the nba finals and out done leonards 18 ppg and snagged fmvp if he joined san antonio



so get outa here with your career sh*t... duncans career weighs heavily on his organization, coach, depth, and being carried by guys who are barely top 50 all time

you people might reply with "B...b....bbbut gasol averaged 18 and 10!"'

kobe averaged 29 and 8.. go to bed

duncan had 3 titles that are about as impressive as kobes first

kobe had 4 titles that are about as impressive as duncans best

so f*ck off i'm done arguing with you guys too...


the 2 for 5 to shut up lebron fans is funny... your BS is just annoying

[JohnFreeman]

reported

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Duncan was only outperformed maybe this year. That is it. Why do people completely ignore defense?

[kennethgriffin]

Duncan was only outperformed maybe this year. That is it. Why do people completely ignore defense?

the big man position is so sh*t these days i could care less about how good his defense is on shane battier and chris anderson down low..

he wasnt all defense this year

and in the past he was great yea... but so was kobe. and neither were ever a defensive player of the year. all we got are defensive awards and kobe has more of them. even though duncan has 3 chances to make the team by being a forward/center

and i dont wanna hear about them being undeserved.. kobe has way more competition at his position for awards.. there are no big men and havent been many for years now. while the wing position grows nonstop

[BlackVVaves]

No.

But he would be outperformed by Billups, Hamilton, and Ben :confusedshrug:

[ImKobe]

Duncan is the key to the Spurs' success. He might not produce as much on offense but he's their defensive anchor and people really overlook that. We all remember what happened to the Spurs in 2013 when Duncan was subbed out in Game 6, no one boxed out Chris Bosh which led to the Allen 3pter.

[kennethgriffin]

No.

But he would be outperformed by Billups, Hamilton, and Ben :confusedshrug:

not if kobe was on the pistons


fact*

only man with game big enough or balls big enough or dominance even remotely close enough to match or supass kobe on the same team is absolute prime shaquille oneal


even if michael jordan was on kobes team... somehow someway kobe would make him his side b*tch


duncan loves being the side b*tch. its his thing

[kennethgriffin]

Duncan is the key to the Spurs' success. He might not produce as much on offense but he's their defensive anchor and people really overlook that. We all remember what happened to the Spurs in 2013 when Duncan was subbed out in Game 6, no one boxed out Chris Bosh which led to the Allen 3pter.

seriously enough with this bs.. the spurs won solely on offensive production. they never shut down miami.


the heat got theirs. sanantonio was just lights out on the other end of the floor


defensive anchor is the absolute most overused term on ISH

sickens me. especially when its used for an offensive juggernaut and a guy whos guarding midgets playing 2 positions out of their natural spots

[RoundMoundOfReb]

the big man position is so sh*t these days i could care less about how good his defense is on shane battier and chris anderson down low..

First off, I'm not really talking about his man defense. His help defense, rim protection, knowing when to help etc... is all part of it. He's one of the most consistent/best defensive players ever in my book.

Secondly, I'm not just talking about this year. What about '99, '03, '05, '07?


he wasnt all defense this year and in the past he was great yea... but so was kobe. and neither were ever a defensive player of the year. all we got are defensive awards and kobe has more of them. even though duncan has 3 chances to make the team by being a forward/center

and i dont wanna hear about them being undeserved.. kobe has way more competition at his position for awards.. there are no big men and havent been many for years now. while the wing position grows nonstop


I don't want to derail this thread but both the eye test and stats support my thoughts that Kobe was an average defender overall. Great on-ball, but a poor team defender. Duncan is much more impactful on defense. I honestly don't see how this is debatable.

[Big#50]

Why is this dude not banned yet? Nobody gives a **** anymore. Kobe/Duncan/Lebron are all top players ever. Just stop. Kobe is your favorite. Leave it at that. Watch his games. Enjoy. Don't let it affect your life. Are you asian by any chance?

[RoundMoundOfReb]

seriously enough with this bs.. the spurs won solely on offensive production. they never shut down miami.


the heat got theirs. sanantonio was just lights out on the other end of the floor


defensive anchor is the absolute most overused term on ISH

sickens me. especially when its used for an offensive juggernaut and a guy whos guarding midgets playing 2 positions out of their natural spots
Spurs held the Heat to 92 points per game and an Ortg of 105 which was significantly below their normal averages.

[bdreason]

Kobe is overpaid and irrelevant at age 35... while Duncan is still winning championships as the most important player on his team at age 38.

[ImKobe]

No.

But he would be outperformed by Billups, Hamilton, and Ben :confusedshrug:

Kobe came off knee & shoulder surgery and people act like everyone on the Lakers played well except for Kobe, like it was comparable to the 2011 Finals...

Kobe was the 2nd most effective player on that team, that should tell you something..

[kennethgriffin]

Spurs held the Heat to 92 points per game and an Ortg of 105 which was significantly below their normal averages.


dont most teams score less in the finals regardless.. you're playing better competition

but anyways... where was duncans legendary stopping power last year?

sorry but i just dont see it. duncan barely even plays half the game.

what he get? 15 points

meh... kobe averaged more as a 6th man in 1998

[RoundMoundOfReb]

dont most teams score less in the finals regardless.. you're playing better competition

but anyways... where was duncans legendary stopping power last year?

sorry but i just dont see it. duncan barely even plays half the game.

what he get? 15 points

meh... kobe averaged more as a 6th man in 1998

So does Duncan have to win a chip every single year? Lmao


Also, stop just counting scoring averages. There's a lot more to the game than that.

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe is overpaid and irrelevant at age 35... while Duncan is still winning championships as the most important player on his team at age 38.

cant really knock kobe for having a near career ending injury. its not like his skills dropped off


duncans body is nearly the same and his mobility is still there. but his production dropped off drastically

while a healthy 34 year old kobe was putting up his same old 27/6/5 right before the achilles injury


its like calling out maravich for not being a great player after his death from cardiac arrest

just f*ck off already

[kennethgriffin]

So does Duncan have to win a chip every single year? Lmao


Also, stop just counting scoring averages. There's a lot more to the game than that.


the thing is... both kobe and duncan are legendary defenders

kobe was way better at play making, ball handling

duncan was way better at rebounding


so theyre pretty much tied


only way to differentiate the 2 is scoring... they both have an equality and an advantage... but kobe has an insanely large overbearing advantage in scoring

thats the separation

its the only thing a big and a small can really be compared for. after scoring its 2 different jobs all together


why compare defense? theyre not guarding the same guys

why compare rebounding? duncans a big man

why compare play making? kobes a ball handler



how about compare the one thing a big and a small can be comparable for


thats the only thing that can tell us something

kobe = 9 first team all defense

duncan = 8 first team all defense

talk crap all you want about kobes selections.. duncan can make F/F/C every year

kobe can only make G/G

so for the 2 times kobe might not have deserved it. duncans still had 17 more chances in his career to make 1st team all defense

[Big#50]

the thing is... both kobe and duncan are legendary defenders

kobe was way better at play making, ball handling

duncan was way better at rebounding


so theyre pretty much tied


only way to differentiate the 2 is scoring... they both have an equality and an advantage... but kobe has an insanely large overbearing advantage in scoring

thats the separation

its the only thing a big and a small can really be compared for. after scoring its 2 different jobs all together


why compare defense? theyre not guarding the same guys

why compare rebounding? duncans a big man

why compare play making? kobes a ball handler



how about compare the one thing a big and a small can be comparable for


thats the only thing that can tell us something

kobe = 9 first team all defense

duncan = 8 first team all defense

talk crap all you want about kobes selections.. duncan can make F/F/C every year

kobe can only make G/G

so for the 2 times kobe might not have deserved it. duncans still had 17 more chances in his career to make 1st team all defense

Lost it at Kobe legendary defender. Just quit. Come on. Legend yes. Defender? Come on, nobody has ever said that or even thought of it. Nobody. Not ever. Not once. Not in a million years. Hasn't happened yet. Doubt it ever will. Stop making shit up.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Lost it at Kobe legendary defender. Just quit. Come on. Legend yes. Defender? Come on, nobody has ever said that or even thought of it. Nobody. Not ever. Not once. Not in a million years. Hasn't happened yet. Doubt it ever will. Stop making shit up.
this

[kennethgriffin]

Lost it at Kobe legendary defender. Just quit. Come on. Legend yes. Defender? Come on, nobody has ever said that or even thought of it. Nobody. Not ever. Not once. Not in a million years. Hasn't happened yet. Doubt it ever will. Stop making shit up.

oh common people..

kobe is a legendary defender. hes atleast top 10-15 all time... a top 5 guard defender all time atleast

how on gods green earth does a guy get an ALL TIME RECORD


NINE first team all defensive awards

and NOT be a atleast ONE of the many legendary defenders this game has ever seen


for f******************************************ck sakes

his entire career is based on a what have you done for me lately sack of sh*t routine by idiotic fa**ot ass idiots like yourself

[kennethgriffin]

this

**** i hate ISH

i wish jeff banned me for life

[BlackVVaves]

oh common people..

kobe is a legendary defender. hes atleast top 10-15 all time... a top 5 guard defender all time atleast

how on gods green earth does a guy get an ALL TIME RECORD


NINE first team all defensive awards

and NOT be a atleast ONE of the many legendary defenders this game has ever seen


for f******************************************ck sakes

his entire career is based on a what have you done for me lately sack of sh*t routine by idiotic fa**ot ass idiots like yourself

Give up the charade clown. We all know by now you're either a psychotic 16 year old or an antagonist to the Kobe stan community seeking to disparage him in disguise by stirring up angst towards him with your posts.

Nobody even really cares what you have to say, they just engage with you for the **** of it. Out of boredom, pity, utter disbelief. Just give it up man. Get off the computer, and find a new hobby.

[kennethgriffin]

Give up the charade clown. We all know by now you're either a psychotic 16 year old or an antagonist to the Kobe stan community seeking to disparage him in disguise by stirring up angst towards him with your posts.

Nobody even really cares what you have to say, they just engage with you for the **** of it. Out of boredom, pity, utter disbelief. Just give it up man. Get off the computer, and find a new hobby.



if i'm 16. then i started on nba message boards when i was 2

and if you think i'm 16. then you're not quite noteworthy on nba message boards yet... any prominant poster would have a clue who i am

:lol



get your feet wet before jumping into this pool

[6 for 24]

or an antagonist to the Kobe stan community seeking to disparage him in disguise by stirring up angst towards him with your posts.


That would truly be egregious! Can you imagine?

Regarding the post, of course Kobe would never be outperformed by his teammates. And by outperformed I assume you mean "lower PER (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=324201)

[SuperPippen]

Why is this dude not banned yet? Nobody gives a **** anymore. Kobe/Duncan/Lebron are all top players ever. Just stop. Kobe is your favorite. Leave it at that. Watch his games. Enjoy. Don't let it affect your life. Are you asian by any chance?

This.


kenneth, does it ever cross your mind that nothing you've ever posted has ever convinced anyone of anything?

If you're going to be an extremely biased Kobe stan and continue to post drivel on this forum - which obviously means so much to you - can't you at least own up to your biases and adopt a less abrasive persona, like your comrade Mr. Jabbar?

Maybe then you would actually receive some of the validation you've been craving for so long.

[kennethgriffin]

This.


kenneth, does it ever cross your mind that nothing you've ever posted has ever convinced anyone of anything?

If you're going to be an extremely biased Kobe stan and continue to post drivel on this forum - which obviously means so much to you - can't you at least own up to your biases and adopt a less abrasive persona, like your comrade Mr. Jabbar?

Maybe then you would actually receive some of the validation you've been craving for so long.



hey.. you still didn't answer my question


how can i convince anyone of anything if they avoid every subject i bring up

:confusedshrug: :lol :roll:


would kobe be outperformed 3 consecutive times by ginobili, parker, leonard such as duncan has?

answer this... and be convinced


may god be with you all


i'm off to bed

[bdreason]

Duncan was the most important Spurs player in every Finals he competed in, including 2014. He was never "outperformed" by Parker, Ginobili, or Leonard... because Duncan is the one who allows them to perform at that level.



On a funny side-note, I just imagined Kobe trying to win a title with Ginobili, Parker, and Leonard.

[TheMilkyBarKid]

dont most teams score less in the finals regardless.. you're playing better competition

but anyways... where was duncans legendary stopping power last year?

sorry but i just dont see it. duncan barely even plays half the game.

what he get? 15 points

meh... kobe averaged more as a 6th man in 1998
Biased troll.

[Keno]

missed playoffs in prime, choked away 3-1 series lead in the first round, quit on the team. anything else?

[K Xerxes]

Anyone who meltdowns over a human that has no real impact on their lives is either an insecure teenager or in need of mental help. You've been at it for a while now, and it genuinely seems like you're furious by Duncan's success even though Kobe is an all time great himself. Grow up kid.

[rmt]

Notice that when the other team goes on a run, invariably coming out of a time-out, the ball goes to Duncan - usually it settles them down, calms the nerves and it's the safest 2. Also, notice that when the games are close, usually Duncan has a good scoring game (Pop goes to him more). During Spurs' blowouts, he does his thing on defense, doesn't score much and lets others shine offensively. He gives them exactly what they need and allows others to grow and develop (unlike Kobe).

copied from another thread:

2013-14 Playoffs

Parker 17.4 pts / 4.8 asst 48.6%FG
Duncan 16.3 pts / 9.2 rebs / 2 asst / 1.3 blks 52.3%
Leonard 14.3 pts / 6.7 rebs / 1.7 asst / 1.7 stl 51%
Manu 14.3 pts / 4.1 asst / 1.6 stl 43.9%

Considering that Duncan anchored the defense, that he averaged just 1 point less than Parker and that he led the Spurs in rebounds, blocks, FG% and minutes, I'd say that he was the best player throughout the playoff run.

[SwayDizzle]

Kobe and MJ are the two best SG man to man defenders of all time. Kobe IS a legendary defender. I'll admit his help defense has been weak the past 5 years or so, but this isn't a knock on his overall defensive understanding and ability. Kobe's knowledge of the game only rivals that of MJ's (this includes both offense and defense).

[rmt]

Kobe and MJ are the two best SG man to man defenders of all time. Kobe IS a legendary defender. I'll admit his help defense has been weak the past 5 years or so, but this isn't a knock on his overall defensive understanding and ability. Kobe's knowledge of the game only rivals that of MJ's (this includes both offense and defense).

What's the use of knowledge if it isn't put into ACTION? - 5 YEARS - LOL. Admit that he hasn't played much defense in years because he saves all his energy to chuck away on the offensive end.

[Yankstar]

What's the use of knowledge if it isn't put into ACTION? - 5 YEARS - LOL. Admit that he hasn't played much defense in years because he saves all his energy to chuck away on the offensive end.

Good thing Duncan has more all NBA defensive teams... oh wait :roll:

[rmt]

Good thing Duncan has more all NBA defensive teams... oh wait :roll:

Are you really going stand behind all of Kobe's all-defensive honors? Or claim that Kobe impacts defense as much as Duncan? - or that he's better at defense BECAUSE of having more all-defensive 1st team honors? LOL

[Nowitness]

Duncan's defence has always been overrated. Kobe is the second greatest peremiter defender ever (after GP), I mean he locked AI and Reggie in the finals whilst Duncan allowed Mutombo (at like 45) to murder him on offence (bearing in mind Dikembe sucked on O when he was young).

Duncan does nothing on defence great, he has been postered more than any star, can't guard anyone smaller than 6'10 and really has always been the second best interior force (Robinson, Thiago, Horry).

[TheMilkyBarKid]

Good thing Duncan has more all NBA defensive teams... oh wait :roll:
Please, argue that Kobe has a bigger defensive impact than Duncan. Show everyone how stupid you are.

[T_L_P]

Good thing Duncan has more all NBA defensive teams... oh wait :roll:

:biggums:

Duncan has more defensive teams than anyone else, ever.

How can you people seriously call Kobe a top fifteen defender, or a top five guard defender? He played some great defense his first five years, then he pretty much became a gambler. Even Phil Jackson criticized Kobe's defense.

[Nowitness]

:biggums:

Duncan has more defensive teams than anyone else, ever.

How can you people seriously call Kobe a top fifteen defender, or a top five guard defender? He played some great defense his first five years, then he pretty much became a gambler. Even Phil Jackson criticized Kobe's defense.

You smokin' san? Jackson would be critical, his daughter was involved in a sexual assault and Freudian association means he blames Kobe even though he did nothing. We all know Duncan has never been the best interior defender on his team (Robinson, Thiago, Horry) whilst Kobe has been the best perimeter defender for all but 1 year (when GP was playing).

[rmt]

You smokin' san? Jackson would be critical, his daughter was involved in a sexual assault and Freudian association means he blames Kobe even though he did nothing. We all know Duncan has never been the best interior defender on his team (Robinson, Thiago, Horry) whilst Kobe has been the best perimeter defender for all but 1 year (when GP was playing).

Strongly disagree with Tiago and Horry being better INTERIOR defenders - currently Tiago is a better pick and roll defender but that's because of Duncan's age/lack of mobility.

[ILLsmak]

cant really knock kobe for having a near career ending injury. its not like his skills dropped off


duncans body is nearly the same and his mobility is still there. but his production dropped off drastically

while a healthy 34 year old kobe was putting up his same old 27/6/5 right before the achilles injury


its like calling out maravich for not being a great player after his death from cardiac arrest

just f*ck off already

17 posts til you got bold. I was waiting. I didn't think you were serious for a second.

-Smak

[T_L_P]

Strongly disagree with Tiago and Horry being better INTERIOR defenders - currently Tiago is a better pick and roll defender but that's because of Duncan's age/lack of mobility.

He's trolling you. The only time where Duncan wasn't the best/most important defender on his team were parts of the game where Robinson put everything he had into that end of the floor, and maybe certain points with Kawhi last year.

Outside of that, especially in Duncan's prime?

[sportjames23]

not if kobe was on the pistons


fact*

only man with game big enough or balls big enough or dominance even remotely close enough to match or supass kobe on the same team is absolute prime shaquille oneal


even if michael jordan was on kobes team... somehow someway kobe would make him his side b*tch

duncan loves being the side b*tch. its his thing


Kobe's never been a great Finals performer, but he'd make the GOAT Finals perfomer his side b*tch? :oldlol:

[andgar923]

Bron stans take note.

The OP is putting on a clinic on how to troll.

Not sure if he's purposely trying to troll but it's a work of art.

[sportjames23]

[QUOTE=6 for 24]That would truly be egregious! Can you imagine?

Regarding the post, of course Kobe would never be outperformed by his teammates. And by outperformed I assume you mean "lower PER (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=324201)

[TheMilkyBarKid]

Bron stans take note.

The OP is putting on a clinic on how to troll.

Not sure if he's purposely trying to troll but it's a work of art.
Is trolling meant to produce feelings of pity?

[sportjames23]

Duncan's defence has always been overrated. Kobe is the second greatest peremiter defender ever (after GP), I mean he locked AI and Reggie in the finals whilst Duncan allowed Mutombo (at like 45) to murder him on offence (bearing in mind Dikembe sucked on O when he was young).

Duncan does nothing on defence great, he has been postered more than any star, can't guard anyone smaller than 6'10 and really has always been the second best interior force (Robinson, Thiago, Horry).


:facepalm

[Nowitness]

:facepalm

You can't deny, even your boy MJ couldn't defend like Colby.

[stalkerforlife]

Kobe's better than Bron.

Anyone with a basketball brain knows this.

[Fork]

Kobe's better than Bron.

Anyone with a basketball brain knows this.


Kobe has more rings, but Lebron is a better player.
Anyone with a basketball brain knows this

[SCdac]

Kobe's ego is too big to let himself be "outperformed" by any player, even if it was the best player in the world. Kobe ran Shaq, Bynum, and Dwight Howard out of town :oldlol:

[riseagainst]

[QUOTE=6 for 24]That would truly be egregious! Can you imagine?

Regarding the post, of course Kobe would never be outperformed by his teammates. And by outperformed I assume you mean "lower PER (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=324201)

[stalkerforlife]

Kobe's ego is too big to let himself be "outperformed" by any player, even if it was the best player in the world. Kobe ran Shaq, Bynum, and Dwight Howard out of town :oldlol:

ALPHA.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

:facepalm
lol He's not even remotely close to that. He has always been average on defense overall.

[Fork]

How was he outpreformed?

[Artillery]

Playoff Stats

2014 Duncan:

21 PER
.202 WS/48
56.8 TS%
120 ORtg
104 DRtg
3.2 total win shares

2000 Kobe:

19.3 PER
.115 WS/48
51.7 TS%
107 ORtg
107 DRtg
2.1 total win shares

Finals numbers:

2014 Duncan:
15.4 ppg/10 rpg/2 apg on 61 TS%
114 ORtg
105 DRtg

2000 Kobe:
15.6 ppg/4.6 rpg/4.2 apg on 41 TS%
96 ORtg
116 DRtg


Kobe's numbers are terrible compared to Duncan's.

[TheMarkMadsen]

01,02 Kobe >> 05,07,14 Duncan

[gts]

Why is this dude not banned yet? Nobody gives a **** anymore. Kobe/Duncan/Lebron are all top players ever. Just stop. Kobe is your favorite. Leave it at that. Watch his games. Enjoy. Don't let it affect your life. Are you asian by any chance?

people just need to quit responding to him.. The solid Laker fans have quit responding to the Lebron morons for the most part...

now it's time for others to step up and quit responding to this dork and others like him...

[Anaximandro1]

Hakeem never had a great team. Rockets were heavily dependent on him to win their championships in 1994 and 1995.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-xBc-fof1c_s/U6yFUhzT_4I/AAAAAAAADGQ/Mx1uJ7nR5fs/s1600/1.jpg


Duncan was a one man army during the Spurs' rebuilding period. They reached the WCF in 2001, the WCSF in 2002 and won the championship in 2003.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-dQXOSULK58U/U6yFUr-CTNI/AAAAAAAADGI/Kfx9FBFs3jI/s1600/2.jpg


Kobe had bad supporting casts during the first three years of the post-Shaq era. The Lakers couldn't even get out of the first round because Kobe contributes with only scoring and ast. The ban on hand checking wasn't enough, so Pau was gift-wrapped in 2008.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-WD1eqSwsuOw/U6yFVd3Q_2I/AAAAAAAADGU/CyUqlgDcCwo/s1600/4.jpg


That's why dominant big men are more valuable than dominant perimeter players (Michael Jordan is the exception to the rule)

[sportjames23]

You can't deny, even your boy MJ couldn't defend like Colby.


Ok, you got me. :oldlol:

[T_L_P]

01,02 Kobe >> 05,07,14 Duncan

:oldlol: at 02.

2002: 26.6 / 5.8 / 4.6 / 1.4 / 0.9

.511 TS% / 20.5 PER / 2.6 WS / .148 WS/48 / 106 ORtg / 103 DRtg

2005: 23.6 / 12.4 / 2.7 . 0.3 / 2.3 /

.526 TS% / 24.9 PER / 3.5 WS / .191 WS/48 / 111 ORtg / 98 DRtg

2007: 22.2 / 11.5 / 3.3 / 0.7 / 3.1

.556 TS% / 27.4 PER / 3.3 WS / .214 WS/48 / 111 ORtg / 101 DRtg

[kennethgriffin]

:oldlol: at 02.

2002: 26.6 / 5.8 / 4.6 / 1.4 / 0.9

.511 TS% / 20.5 PER / 2.6 WS / .148 WS/48 / 106 ORtg / 103 DRtg

2005: 23.6 / 12.4 / 2.7 . 0.3 / 2.3 /

.526 TS% / 24.9 PER / 3.5 WS / .191 WS/48 / 111 ORtg / 98 DRtg

2007: 22.2 / 11.5 / 3.3 / 0.7 / 3.1

.556 TS% / 27.4 PER / 3.3 WS / .214 WS/48 / 111 ORtg / 101 DRtg

i think you might be a bigger homer than myself

you think 2007 duncan ( who lost finals mvp to tony parker ) is better than 2001 or 2002 kobe bryant?

[J Shuttlesworth]

Bron stans take note.

The OP is putting on a clinic on how to troll.

Not sure if he's purposely trying to troll but it's a work of art.
Actually, ironically, he is being outperformed by 6 for 24 :roll: :bowdown:

Ayotunde on pace for ish goat

[kennethgriffin]

Actually, ironically, he is being outperformed by 6 for 24 :roll: :bowdown:

Ayotunde on pace for ish goat


you guys actually read his posts? theyre the exact same joke every single time lol

i just skim and see that signature at the end and skip the comment now. tried talking to him once i think

its an alt gimmick by some kobe hater on here. i wonder who. its like mysterion from southpark

he couldnt create a thread or get hatred. so hes just for fun i guess

[T_L_P]

i think you might be a bigger homer than myself

you think 2007 duncan ( who lost finals mvp to tony parker ) is better than 2001 or 2002 kobe bryant?

Not 01. I never said that.

But 02? Definitely.

My rankings:
2003
2009
1999
2001
2005
2010
2007
2002
2014/2000

[TheMarkMadsen]

Not 01. I never said that.

But 02? Definitely.

My rankings:
2003
2009
1999
2001
2005
2010
2007
2002
2014/2000

Lol @ 99* > 01

[kennethgriffin]

Not 01. I never said that.

But 02? Definitely.

My rankings:
2003
2009
1999
2001
2005
2010
2007
2002
2014/2000


now you're just being stupid. you're such a stat whore efficiency nerd

kobe in 2002 was a more polished player than 2001. kobe just had better numbers in 2001 cause he shot 2 more times a game and went to the line 1 more time a game ( which meant he shot about 3 more times a game ) he also played 3 more minutes a game so he had 0.4 more rebounds

by 2001 kobe was arguably the most talented player in the nba and 2nd best player behind shaq


to say he went from that to worse than side kick 2007 duncan over the span of a season is just insane

kobes talent from 2001 onto 2010 was always nop notch. just health and team issues or team mates derailed him in 2004 or 2005

duncan was better than kobe from 1998 till 2000.. then from 2001 till 2005 it was arguable who was more talented either way. had a better season in 2005 cause of kobes injury



prime duncan has a case against 2001,2002 kobe

2007 duncan doesnt

[kennethgriffin]

in terms of skill level. talent. the player

2001 to 2013 kobe is better than duncan.

kobe took over the nba in 2001 and never looked back


but in terms of season by season. its more even

1998 duncan
1999 duncan
2000 duncan
2001 kobe
2002 duncan
2003 kobe/duncan tie
2004 duncan
2005 duncan
2006 kobe
2007 kobe
2008 kobe
2009 kobe
2010 kobe
2011 kobe
2012 kobe
2013 kobe ( injured before playoffs... sure duncan made it to the finals. but kobe showed with his 27/6/5 average he was still near prime output )

2014 duncan ( kobe didnt play )

[T_L_P]

Is there any point in responding to kenneth when he calls Duncan a sidekick in 07? I can't believe he was watching basketball back then.

Kobe's defense was starting to falter in 02 and his efficiency was terrible. Kenneth uses words like "talent" and "polished" to hide the fact that he wasn't as effective as Duncan in 05 or 07.

And stop getting so mad as well. Most of the forum think Duncan is ahead of Kobe. If you can't handle it leave the forum.

[L.A. Jazz]

I have seen all of the Spurs' finals and Duncan wasn't outperformed by any of his teammates. He was always the most important part of the team. 1999 and 2003 is without discussion. 2005 is tougher because of his injuries but without him the have no chance to beat the bigs of Detroit who outmanned Shaq a year before. 2007 his defense (helping on Lebron) made the sweep possible. On offense they just rolled with the mismatch TP had. 2013 he was clearly the most consistent player against the Heat. Even this year over all 5 games he was the most consistent and his help defense made it possible for Kawhi to play Lebron and Wade as tight.

If you dont believe me, ask annyone on the Spurs (except TD), they will tell you who their leader and most important player was and is.

[sportjames23]

you guys actually read his posts? theyre the exact same joke every single time lol

i just skim and see that signature at the end and skip the comment now. tried talking to him once i think

its an alt gimmick by some kobe hater on here. i wonder who. its like mysterion from southpark

he couldnt create a thread or get hatred. so hes just for fun i guess


Thou furious, broheim?

[rmt]

I have seen all of the Spurs' finals and Duncan wasn't outperformed by any of his teammates. He was always the most important part of the team. 1999 and 2003 is without discussion. 2005 is tougher because of his injuries but without him the have no chance to beat the bigs of Detroit who outmanned Shaq a year before. 2007 his defense (helping on Lebron) made the sweep possible. On offense they just rolled with the mismatch TP had. 2013 he was clearly the most consistent player against the Heat. Even this year over all 5 games he was the most consistent and his help defense made it possible for Kawhi to play Lebron and Wade as tight.

If you dont believe me, ask annyone on the Spurs (except TD), they will tell you who their leader and most important player was and is.

Most reasonable people know this. It's only the _____ stans arguing their hero's case who point to Parker's few extra points (in this last playoff run only 1 extra point) as if that offsets Duncan anchoring the defense.

[TheMarkMadsen]

I have seen all of the Spurs' finals and Duncan wasn't outperformed by any of his teammates. He was always the most important part of the team. 1999 and 2003 is without discussion. 2005 is tougher because of his injuries but without him the have no chance to beat the bigs of Detroit who outmanned Shaq a year before. 2007 his defense (helping on Lebron) made the sweep possible. On offense they just rolled with the mismatch TP had. 2013 he was clearly the most consistent player against the Heat. Even this year over all 5 games he was the most consistent and his help defense made it possible for Kawhi to play Lebron and Wade as tight.

If you dont believe me, ask annyone on the Spurs (except TD), they will tell you who their leader and most important player was and is.

2005

Manu: 19/6/4 on 64% TS

Duncan: 21/14/2 on 47% TS ( LOL)

2007

Parker: 25/5/3 on 60% TS FMVP

Duncan: 18/12/4 on 48% TS (LOL)

2013

Lenard: 18/6/2 on 75% TS (wow) FMVP

Duncan: 15/10/2 on 61% TS (3rd leading scorer, rebounding was the only statistical category he led)

[T_L_P]

2005

Manu: 19/6/4 on 64% TS

Duncan: 21/14/2 on 47% TS ( LOL)



I'm not sure how 47 TS% on bum ankles against constant double teams from arguably the best defender in the league and another hound in Sheed is "lol".

Duncan shot just as LOL in game 7, yet Pop, Manu, Brown, Wallace all said Duncan won them that game.

Seeing as you watched the Finals, can you please explain how Manu outplayed Duncan and/or was more important?

[TheMilkyBarKid]

you guys actually read his posts? theyre the exact same joke every single time lol

i just skim and see that signature at the end and skip the comment now. tried talking to him once i think

its an alt gimmick by some kobe hater on here. i wonder who. its like mysterion from southpark

he couldnt create a thread or get hatred. so hes just for fun i guess
He can be funny though. You're just sad and seem to have a desire for attention which leads you to talk a lot of crap

[TheBigVeto]

Correct answer is: YES definitely
/thread

[Eye Test]

Repped

[Anaximandro1]

As you can see, the Spurs had a massive advantage inside with Duncan in three different decades.

In the 2000s, prime Kobe barely survived in the Finals. No problem, the Lakers had peak Shaq/Gasol.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-KBxUXWGPiIs/U62NEQg-DnI/AAAAAAAADHA/YQMFh0BXCeQ/s1600/2.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-o63Kqn4DEdw/U62QTYJGohI/AAAAAAAADHU/vxOXgJ8dT5s/s1600/1.jpg




H2H - Cumulative Stats (Duncan vs Shaq/Dirk/KG)

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-NOj1UCjtcOc/U2riB5TLYTI/AAAAAAAAC0M/ArIJ5MtPalQ/s1600/1.jpg

[tmacattack33]

Kobe was outplayed by air in the 2004 Finals.

If you had replaced Kobe with air on the 2004 Lakers, and allowed the team to run primarily through Shaq like they should have been doing, the team would have had a better chance to win the Finals that year.

[Artillery]

2005

Manu: 19/6/4 on 64% TS

Duncan: 21/14/2 on 47% TS ( LOL)

2007

Parker: 25/5/3 on 60% TS FMVP

Duncan: 18/12/4 on 48% TS (LOL)

2013

Lenard: 18/6/2 on 75% TS (wow) FMVP

Duncan: 15/10/2 on 61% TS (3rd leading scorer, rebounding was the only statistical category he led)

I'm not sure you want to be bringing up Finals stats considering Kobe's one of the worst Finals performers of his generation.

[KG215]

the big man position is so sh*t these days i could care less about how good his defense is on shane battier and chris anderson down low..
Yeah, because that's the only way a great defensive big man like Duncan makes an impact defensively: his one-on-one post defense.

You never cease to amaze with your stupidity and ignorance.


and in the past he was great yea... but so was kobe. and neither were ever a defensive player of the year. all we got are defensive awards and kobe has more of them. even though duncan has 3 chances to make the team by being a forward/center
And no one in their right mind would ever try to argue Kobe was, at any point in his career, on the same planet as Duncan in terms of defensive impact. You stupidly bringing up All-Defense teams, like we're supposed to take that as the authority on defensive greatness, only highlights your dumbassery and agenda.

[Jailblazers7]

Kobe got outplayed by Hamilton and Billups while getting shut down by Tayshaun Prince in '04.

[Dresta]

Kobe would ruin Spurs offense. He might 'outperform' his teammates, but his team wouldn't have come close to winning the title.

[Lebron23]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2000_finals.html

[Dresta]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2000_finals.html
That a 10x less valuable ring for Kobe than any of Duncan's, and both of Wade's sidekick rings too.