Greatest and Best Point Guards Ever: Year-by-Year Analysis

[Gifted Mind]

This thread is dedicated to Point Guards. Namely, the best and greatest PGs year-by-year. More specifically, best PGs year by year and the PG with the best season year by year.

The 1st half of this thread focuses on best player. So how do we define best? The player is the one who can lead any particular or average team to more wins than the other player. The objective of the game is to win, and the player who can win you more games on any particular team or average team is the better player. They are judge based only on their individual abilities to play in a team game. Thus, team success, accomplishments, really don't count for much here. It's based purely on basketball.

The 2nd half of this thread will focus on PGs with the best season. The best season is different from best player. If the NBA had a PG of the Year award at the end of every season (including playoffs), this is what the award would be for. Clearly it is more indicative of your individual success along with your team success, sort of like the MVP. Basically which PG had the greatest or most accomplished season.

With all that said, a few more notes. Obviously there will be debate "was this player a PG". I am choosing to ignore those debates and go with the general consensus for which position a player is considered for their entire career. I don't want to divert this thread from its actual purpose and turn this into a positional debate. Thus, in the best PG year-by-year, only players that are considered PGs general consensus will be considered. Same for the best season. However, I will call out the "actual PG of the year". It seems a bit odd to not give the "PG of the year" award to a player who played PG all season and had the best season. So it will be called out, but again the season series is still really considering players that are considered PGs.


Let's get started


Best PGs Year-by-Year








1950s




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1950: B.Davies

2. R.Beard

3. A.Phillip


The 1st official year of the NBA. The league wasn't very competitive early on. Nonetheless, Bob Davies was the best PG in the NBA. He was a dual threat PG possessing the ability to score and pass. After him was Beard, who also was a dual threat, though at this point in his career was just 22 and not reached his true potential. Andy Phillip was the 3rd best PG in the NBA, probably the best playmaker currently in the NBA.






1951: B.Davies

2. R.Beard

3. A.Phillip


Davies and Beard were toe to toe as the best PGs this year. It was really close, both were good scorers for PGs but neither were terrific passers. The small edge went to Davies as he led the team to the title through his leadership while Beard failed early. After these 2 it was once again Phillip who was the 3rd best PG in the NBA leading the league in assists once again.






1952: B.Cousy


2. B.Davies

3. A.Phillip


Now with the emergence of Cousy the league became slightly more competitive. He was easily the best PG in the NBA. He was impressively Top 3 in both points and assists in the NBA. There was no doubt in anyones mind that he was already a superstar. Davies falls behind from being the best PG in the NBA to being the 2nd best PG in the NBA. Phillip remained a Top 3 PG and was considered the best playmaker in the NBA during that time.



https://espn.go.com/i/sportscentury/inline/cousy.jpg







1953: B.Cousy


2. B.Davies

3. A.Phillip


Bob Cousy remained the best PG in the NBA. He won his 1st assist title and was still one of the most feared scorers in the NBA. Really there was no PG near his level of play as he was revolutionizing the position. Overall the Top 3 PGs in the NBA remained constant this year, Davies was still 2nd and Phillip 3rd.





1954: B.Cousy


2. A.Phillip

3. B.Davies


Bob Cousy remained the best PG in the NBA for the 3rd consecutive season. The PG position in the NBA was really weak besides Bob Cousy. He was easily considered the best playmaker and scoring PG in the NBA. Davies continues to decline and now is considered the 3rd best PG in the NBA while Phillip keeps his play steady and is 2nd.





1955: B.Cousy


2. S.Martin

3. D.McGuire


Bob Cousy remained the best PG in the NBA and was better than ever before in 1955. He set career highs for himself in both points and assists finishing Top 2 in each category. Both his scoring and passing were at their top form at this point in his career. After Cousy we had fresh new names in the Top 3. Slater Martin was now peaking playing his best basketball, besides for being a good scorer and passer, he was known to be a tough defender. Phillip and McGuire both had good arguments for 3rd but McGuire got the small edge as Phillip continued to age and fell off the Top 3.






1956: B.Cousy

2. J.George

3. S.Martin


Bob Cousy remained the best PG in the game. He set a career high in assists, a mark no one would match till 1960. He also remained one of the most feared scorers and overall there was really no one even close to him at PG. After Cousy came Jack George, now in his 3rd season he had taken some drastic steps to establish himself as a good PG in the NBA in 1956. Slater Martin remained top 3 turning 30, he still probably the best defensive PG in the NBA while showing solid scoring and playmaking skills.





1957: B.Cousy


2. S.Martin

3. J.George


Bob Cousy was once again the best PG in the NBA setting having a career season. He is still 28 and has played at a steady level for the past years continuing to be a dual threat of scoring and passing. There was still no one even close to his level of skill or play. He also showed leadership teaming with Russell to win the NBA Championship. After Cousy come Martin and George again. Both had declined from the previous year but the competition level at PG was so weak in the NBA right now that they were still Top 3.





http://cache.nba.com/media/history/cousy_pass_350.jpg






1958: B.Cousy

2. L.Costella

3. G.Shue


Surprise surprise, Bob Cousy remained the top PG in 1958. He was slown down a little bit not quite healthy all year, but nonetheless still far effective than any other PG. He was still the best scoring and playmaking PG in the league and truly viewed as a legend when he played the PG position. After Cousy some young fresh names come up. Costella and Shue, both PGs showed solid ability to score and setup their teammates and showed signs of a promising career ahead.








1959: B.Cousy


2. L.Costello

3. G.Shue


And Bob Cousy finishes the 1950s as the best PG in basketball. There was still absolutely no competition for him. He still looked as good as ever at age 30 showing no signs of slowing down. Still had great creativity inside him and was by far the best scorer and passer amongst PGs. If there was a weakness it was his defense but his offense more than made up for it. Costello and Shue followed behind Cousy again but neither were close to competing with him.

[Gifted Mind]

1960s


http://s30.postimg.org/9z63ptapd/1960_1964.jpg
http://s10.postimg.org/7yt2iz1xl/1965_1969.jpg



1960: B.Cousy

2. G.Shue

3. L.Costella




For the 9th consecutive year no one played the PG position better than Bob Cousy. He was starting to show some wear and tear in his body but was still effective and brilliant as he has ever been. He set new career highs in assists and guided his team to a 2nd consecutive championship. After Cousy was Shue this year, here is one guy who has really worked hard on improving his game each season and became a really good score-1st type of PG. Costella played at the same level as the season before and remained a Top 3 PG.






1961: O.Robertson


2. B.Cousy

3. G.Shue




Oscar Robertson was now the best PG in the NBA. In just his rookie season he dominated the PG competition like no other and even broke Cousy

[Gifted Mind]

1970s


http://s14.postimg.org/q8tnv0c29/1970_974.jpg
http://s16.postimg.org/vfyhd3th1/1975_1979.jpg





1970: W.Frazier


2. O.Robertson

3. L.Wilkens



The 1970s start with Walt Frazier at the top for PGs. This ends Robertson’s long 9 year run as the best PG in the NBA. Frazier was a great scorer and playmaker for the Knicks along with being an absolute defensive force. To this point he was the best defensive PG in the history of the NBA. After Frazier came the familiar Robertson remaining a Top 3 PG. The last spot was once again between Bing and Wilkens, and I gave the edge to Wilkens again as his leadership and playmaking skills were more important to helping a team succeed than Bing’s great scoring ability.









1971: W.Frazier


2. O.Robertson

3. D.Bing




Walt Frazier remained the top PG for back to back seasons. He was still young and therefore going to be in this discussion every year now. Part of what made him so special was he could impact the game in so many ways since he was a game changer on defense as well. Robertson remained the 2nd best PG, even at 32 he was actually still very effective guiding the Bucks to become the top offense. Bing took the 3rd spot this year playing better than ever especially on the scoring end.





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1972: W. Frazier

2. T.Archibald

3. O.Robertson




Walt Frazier was the top PG for the 3rd straight year. He remained great at what he did and that was not going to change anytime soon. He was given some competition this year by Archibald, a rising star in the NBA able to score at will and was also a great passer. Tiny was arguably a better scorer and passer at this point but Frazier had a significant defensive edge. Robertson was getting older every year but remained a Top 3 PG for another season.






1973: T.Archibald


2. W.Frazier

3. L.Wilkens



The battle raged between Archibald and Frazier for the top PG spot. They were really neck to neck again, Archibald being the more impressive scorer and playmaker while Frazier had the huge defensive advantage. This year Tiny Archibald was just too amazing to ignore, he was unstoppable at scoring leading the league in points and continued to amaze passing wise leading the league in assists. He also had great stamina night in night out playing nearly 46mpg and just no PG has looked this good on offense since a prime Robertson. Frazier though secured the 2nd spot. Wilkens was a Top 3 PG again, he really has shown some spectacular longevity still playing at a high level at age 35. His basketball IQ was just very high and he could still score well and was still one of the best playmakers in the game.






1974: W. Frazier

2. C.Murphy

3. D.Bing




With Archibald battling injuries, West and Robertson practically gone, Frazier had no competition and was the best PG in 1974. He continued to play at a steady high level and this actually was one of the easiest years to select the Top PG. After Frazier it got tough, Murphy, Bing, and Norm had arguments. Murphy was the best scorer at this point out of the 3 and had solid handling and playmaking skills, while Bing still was a solid PG even now. Van Lier was a defensive stud but his lack of offensive threat left him behind Murphy and Bing. Jo Jo White was nearly good as Bing but just lacking a little.






1975: W. Frazier


2. T.Archibald

3. J.White




Walt Frazier remained the best PG in 1975. He was still one of the most feared scorers at PG and still played terrific defense. The Knicks had gotten worse progressively, but Frazier was still playing at a high level with only minimal dropping. After Frazier it was familiar Tiny Archibald who was once again healthy and producing. He remained a force on offense. The last spot was once again between Bing, Murphy, and Jo Jo. They were all very close but I gave Jo Jo White the edge, he was more capable of stepping his game up in the postseason, which he has done numerous points upto now.








1976: T.Archibald


2. J.White

3. W.Frazier



Tiny Archibald was once again the Top PG in the game. He played at a similar dominant level as last year and Clyde slipped battling injuries and just getting older. After Archibald it was Jo Jo White, who was once again solid in the regular season and stepped up in the playoffs. He played his best in the finals and was named Finals MVP. Frazier remained a Top 3 PG in the NBA despite having slown down and battling injuries. He still was solid all-around and too good to leave out. Calvin Murphy just missed the cut for Top 3.






1977: J.White


2. W.Frazier

3. C.Murphy



The competition for Top PG was as weak as it has been in a while and Jo Jo White was able to steal some of the spotlight. He was once again solid this season with his score-1st approach and once again stepped up his game in the NBA playoffs. After White comes Frazier, who was a little out of his prime but still good enough for Top 3 when healthy in this era. Murphy comes in 3rd, he remained a consistent scoring threat but was maybe too small to dominate. Overall the 70s has not been as PG dominated as the past decade was by the Big O.





1978: C.Murphy


2. K.Porter

3. D.Buse




After a few Top 3 selections Calvin Murphy was finally the best PG in the NBA in 1978. He was finally given the freedom to do what he wanted in Houston this season and he showed the NBA he could be one of the best scorers when he wanted to be. He actually played SG this year but is still considered a PG overall thus got the best PG title this season. After him was Kevin Porter, who was probably the best passer in the NBA at this point and could do a decent job scoring. Lastly we had Don Buse. The best defensive PG today and similar to KC Jones from the 60s. This was arguably the least competitive year for PGs in the NBA historically.








1979: D.Johnson

2. G.Williams

3. N.Nixon






The NBA got a little more competitive again in 1979 with rising PG stars such as DJ, Gus Williams, Norm Nixon, and Phil Ford. All these players were non-factors the year before but became more than relevant in 1979. It was also very close to call who the best PG in the NBA was in 1979. DJ, Gus, and Norm were the top 3, but all were about equal. I gave Dennis Johnson the edge as general consensus in 79 said he was the best player out of the 3. He was hadn’t developed his playmaking abilities yet, but was a great scorer and arguably the best defensive player in the game. After Johnson was his teammate Gus Williams. He was probably the best scoring PG in the game right now but also hadn’t developed his playmaking abilities yet. Norm Nixon came 3rd, he was a great passer and could score as well but he wasn’t as good on defense or explosive as DJ or Gus.

[Gifted Mind]

1980s




http://s29.postimg.org/pcvnj65w7/1980_1984.jpg
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1980: M.Johnson


2. D.Johnson

3. M. Richardson



Magic Johnson made his debut in the NBA in 1980 and he was already a legend. He had unprecedented size at PG, but was still quick and an exceptional passer. He was indeed the best PG in the NBA already in his rookie season. Dennis Johnson slips to 2nd this year with the arrival of Magic. He expanded his scoring arsenal carrying over from last years championship run. After DJ came Sugar Ray Robinson. Another young PG who was an absolute monster. He was an excellent playmaker and arguably the best defensive PG at this point. His scoring ability still needed a little bit of work but at least at this point his career had a lot of potential. Gus Williams just missed the cut for Top 3, overall he was neck to neck with DJ in Seattle.






1981: D.Johnson


2. M.Richardson

3. N.Nixon




With Magic injured most of the season, the spot for best PG was once again open. Dennis Johnson took advantage and was the best PG in the NBA for the 2nd time in 3 years. He was in Phoenix now but continued to play basketball his style. He still had not developed his playmaking ability yet, but remained one of the top defenders and scorers for a PG. After him came Michael Ray Richardson, who was still playing at about the same level as last year. He wasn’t a forceful scorer but remained one of the top defenders and playmakers in the league. Nixon was top 3 this year with his steady play for the past few years.






1982: M.Johnson


2. G.Williams

3. D.Johnson




Magic Johnson was healthy again and considered the best PG in the NBA again. He hadn’t lost a step and was better than ever with room to improve at age 22. He was becoming a better creator by the day and was giving the Lakers the idea that he could be their primary PG in the future even at such height. After Magic comes Gus Williams. Taking a year off the NBA appeared to have done him well as he had worked on his passing and comeback as a solid playmaker now to go along with his scoring abilities. Dennis Johnson stayed about the same level as the year before in Phoenix and remained a Top 3 PG.




1983: M.Johnson


2. G.Williams

3. I.Thomas



Magic Johnson was the best PG in the NBA for the 2nd straight year. This year he was given more control of the Lakers offense than ever and posted career high assist numbers. He continued to look like the next big superstar and was truly magical. Gus Williams remained the 2nd best PG in the NBA as he now had fully developed his playmaking skills and was considered an elite PG having both scoring and passing components down. Isiah Thomas enters the Top 3 discussion at just age 21. For now he was mostly a score-1st PG and a great one at that.



http://www.playbill.com/images/photo/M/a/MagicDribble200.jpg




1984: M.Johnson

2. I.Thomas

3. G.Williams




For the 3rd straight year Magic Johnson remained the best PG in the NBA. Many around the league already knew this was just the start to a long run. We were truly witnessing a legend. Magic Johnson continued to develop his game, he was given full PG duties this season. He more than showed he can handle them leading the league in assists and continuing to score exactly when he wanted. After Magic it was the rising superstar PG Isiah Thomas. Isiah now was playing the best basketball of his career and was very dynamic leading all PGs in scoring and also an excellent playmaker. Gus Williams remained a Top 3 PG.






1985: M.Johnson


2. I.Thomas

3. M.Cheeks



Magic Johnson remained the best PG in the NBA. This was the 4th consecutive year he was considered the best. Isiah Thomas was right there with him giving him a challenge but Magic Johnson was in his prime and just way too good right now. He continued to score when he wanted and perform magic with his passing skills. Isiah also continued to get better and better each season and improving his ball handling and passing skills to the point where they were as good as they could be. Both Maurice Cheeks and Dennis Johnson had good arguments for the 3rd spot, but this year I went with Cheeks. He could play Johnson’s role almost equally as well and was more of a creator. Gus Williams had dropped a little and fell out of the Top 3.






1986: M.Johnson


2. I.Thomas

3. M.Cheeks



Magic Johnson was once again the best PG in the NBA for the 6th time in his still young career. His level of play was constant from the season before and he was still considered one of the best players in the NBA easily. After Magic was Isiah, who also continued to play at a very high level and was also considered to be a superstar by some around the NBA. Last but not least Cheeks remained a Top 3 PG. He was a very efficient scorer, excellent playmaker, and stingy defender. Sort of an ideal PG you want for your team to win games.






1987: M.Johnson


2. I.Thomas

3. M.Cheeks



1987 was Magic Johnson at his best. He displayed more scoring ability than ever and became a dual scoring and passing threat that was unstoppable. This season we may have arguably seen the best PG playing ever. Following Johnson was once again Isiah Thomas. For the 4th consecutive year he was considered the “2nd” best PG in the NBA. Very unfortunate the prime of his career coincided with Magic’s prime. Cheeks remained a Top 3 PG following Magic and Isiah although there was a big gap. His ideal abilities as a PG continued to get him Top 3 mentions just ahead of DJ and Lever.




http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yYjOWwxwuRE/T13TGVAJvXI/AAAAAAAAA-Q/EXXHSFUnTvk/s320/Magic+Johnson+NBA+Position.jpg





1988: M.Johnson


2. I.Thomas

3. J.Stockton




For the 7th consecutive season Magic Johnson was the best PG in the NBA. Only Robertson and Cousy have had runs of best PG longer than this. Each of them were the best PG for 9 consecutive seasons. Magic did what Magic always does in this season as well. Following Magic was Isiah Thomas once again. He was starting to slow down a little bit, but not nearly enough to keep him out of the top 3 or even the 2nd position once again. John Stockton makes his debut into the Top 3. He edged many other PGs who played at a similar level. His playmaking ability was just on another level compared to those other PGs giving him a Top 3 position.






1989: M.Johnson


2. J.Stockton

3. K.Johnson






No surprises here Magic Johnson ends the 1980s as the best PG in the NBA. He has dominated the 1980s remaining the best PG in the NBA all but one season where he was injured most of the year. Aside from that, Magic finished the 80s continuing to play the best basketball of his career. He had polished his entire game and there was no debate even now who was the best. The later positions were more debatable, Isiah Thomas had slowed down a little making room for new young PGs Stockton and KJ. Both had their own styles and both were effective.

[Gifted Mind]

1990s



http://s28.postimg.org/jz9bi6xe5/1990_1994.jpg
http://s2.postimg.org/9opzezhc9/1995_1999.jpg





1990: M.Johnson


2. K.Johnson

3. J.Stockton



10 years later, Magic Johnson was still the best PG in the NBA. At age 30 he still was playing at a very high level and continued to run the floor like a GOAT PG would. He was still one of the best scorers at PG able to drive, shoot, and post, while continued to be an amazing playmaker. After Magic were once again KJ and Stockton. I always had these 2 very close in their primes. This year Kevin Johnson just showed a little bit more outplaying Stockton in the season and taking his team past both Magic and Stockton’s teams into the WCF. Nonetheless, both Kevin and John played at extremely high levels for PGs and both were waiting for the time to someday pass Magic.






1991: M.Johnson


2. J.Stockton

3. K.Johnson




For the 11th time in his career Magic Johnson was considered the best PG in the NBA. This is truly remarkable, he only has played in the league 12 years, and all but 1 year he was considered the best PG in the league and that year he missed more than half the season. At age 31 he may have slown down a little bit from his peak but he was still tremendously effective trying to get his teammates more involved this season. After Magic were Stockton and KJ again. This year I gave the slight edge to Stockton, he was more consistent throughout the season and won his individual matchup with KJ in their series in the playoffs. Magic Johnson would retire this season...giving a chance to everyone for there to be a new best PG.






1992: K.Johnson


2. J.Stockton

3. M.Price




Magic Johnson had retired, meaning we would have a new best PG in the NBA. Kevin Johnson and John Stockton have been the best PGs after Magic the past few years, so naturally you would expect one of them to be the best. That was the case, but the question was who. Honestly this one was one of the toughest years to decide. As I said earlier, KJ and Stock were neck to neck in their peak years at the PG position. This year I gave Kevin Johnson the slight edge. His dual threat of being one of the top scorers and playmakers made him very valuable and he absolutely dominated John Stockton head to head this season. After KJ and Stockton the best PG was either Hardaway or Price. This year Price performed just a bit better and had the edge for me.




1993: J.Stockton


2. M.Price

3. T.Hardaway



John Stockton was finally considered the best PG in the NBA for the 1st time in his career. He played his usual basketball and that was good enough to get him this title after being the 2nd best the past 2 years. It was close though, Mark Price had another terrific year but I just felt he did not play enough to be the best PG. Stockton also outplayed them in their head to head meetings for the year. Hardaway makes a presence in the Top 3 for the 1st time in his career. He was another young PG that could have his way scoring and dishing the basketball.






1994: J.Stockton


2. K.Johnson

3. M.Price




With Kevin Johnson healthy again, it was once again between him and Stockton for the best PG in the NBA. As always these two were neck to neck. Stockton was the most consistent star who always found a way to positively contribute, while Kevin Johnson was the more dynamic player able to take over by his scoring and passing. Since they were so close I once again had to resort to little things to separate the two PGs. This year for me it was Stockton outplaying KJ in their head to head matchups and also playing 15 more games in the regular season that made the small difference. After these 2 PGs it was Mark Price who remained a Top 3 PG just edging Gary Payton who was beginning to become relevant in these discussions.





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1995: J.Stockton

2. G.Payton

3. A.Hardaway




For the 3rd straight season John Stockton was the best PG in the NBA. Even at age 32 he was very effective at what he did. The consistency was all there and he was still an incredible player and PG. Following Stockton this year was Gary Payton. Payton had improved his jumpshot and scoring ability to become one of the most feared PGs in the NBA. He was already a terrorizer on defense and now was an excellent 2 way player. He was right there with Stockton, but I gave Stock the slight edge for now due to the superior leadership and experience qualities he had over Payton at the moment. Hardaway also made his 1st appearance as a Top 3 PG pairing with O’Neal to make one of the best duos. He was a terrific scorer while being a solid passer.






1996: G.Payton

2. A.Hardaway

3. J.Stockton




Gary Payton rose to the top of the PG kingdom in 1996. His 2 way ability, leading his team on offense and anchoring them on defense gave him the top spot. Payton, like Frazier many years ago, was just able to impact the floor in so many ways making him very valuable. After Payton it was Anfernee Hardaway. He was even better than the season before and at his peak. He was probably the best scoring PG in the league during this time. Was a big PG and almost unstoppable attacking the rim. Stockton remained Top 3 for the 9th straight year continuing to play consistently strong basketball.






1997: G.Payton


2. J.Stockton

3. K.Johnson



For the 2nd straight year Gary Payton was the best PG in the NBA. He continued to play at the level he played last year and was once again the top PG in the NBA. He was more aggressive scoring the basketball and continued to be tenacious on the defensive end. The next spots were between Stockton, KJ, and Hardaway. It was quite close but Stockton stood out a little bit more. He was once again playing at a similar high level like in 1996 but he clearly showed his worth in the playoffs playing significantly better than KJ or Tim. Kevin Johnson and Tim Hardaway were once again healthy, both could score when they wanted and were great playmakers, I gave Johnson the small edge for just being much more efficient and finding an outside shot.




http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/visual/whatshot/1713_Payton.jpg





1998: G.Payton

2. T.Hardaway

3. J.Kidd




Gary Payton remained the best PG in the NBA. He was getting better while the competition around the rest of the league was getting a little worse. Stockton, KJ, and Hardaway were aging while Gary Payton was just now reaching the peak of his career. After Payton this year was Hardaway. He was about as good as he was last year and he was nearly Top 3 last year. Kidd finally enters the Top 3, giving the NBA a glimpse of his all-around ability. He wasn’t a strong scorer, but was an excellent playmaker who could play solid defense.






1999: J.Kidd

2. G.Payton

3. T.Hardaway




Jason Kidd was officially in his prime and he was one amazing PG. Kidd and Payton were easily the Top 2 PGs at this point. They both were all-around and could just impact the game in so many ways. This year Jason Kidd had Payton’s number. In the shortened season he just ended up showing more than Payton was able to though it was still very close. It was still so close that if the season went 82 games the results could have been different. After Payton and Kidd there was a big game and Tim Hardaway filled that in with another solid season though showing signs of slowing down every year.

[Gifted Mind]

2000s



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http://s10.postimg.org/gcvu4kwp5/2005_2009.jpg





2000: G.Payton


2. J.Kidd

3. S.Marbury



The Top 2 PGs were clearly Gary Payton and Jason Kidd again. They were both excellent again, but this year Gary Payton had the edge. He did not have an off-shooting short season like last year and did just everything for his team. Jason Kidd was starting to show deficiencies in his shooting and in the longer season just did not play as well. The main difference between Payton and Kidd right now was Gary Payton could score very well, Kidd could not. Otherwise both were excellent all-around PGs. After Payton and Kidd was Marbury. He had a lot of talent and could do great things with the basketball but just wasn’t at Payton or Kidd’s level.






2001: J.Kidd


2. G.Payton

3. S.Marbury




Jason Kidd and Gary Payton continued to be toe to toe as the best 2 PGs in the NBA. It was once again quite close between the 2. However, Kidd was in the peak of his career while Gary Payton was getting older. This year I also believe was the year Kidd actually surpassed Payton on defense, giving him the decisive yet still small advantage as the best PG in the NBA. Marbury was still the 3rd best, he put up great numbers but just didn’t make as much impact as Kidd or Payton.






2002: J.Kidd

2. G.Payton

3. S.Nash




For the 2nd straight year Jason Kidd remained the best PG in the NBA. He was at the peak of his career and the switch of teams to Nets only helped restate his case as the best PG. He had all the intangibles and leadership qualities you would want out of your PG. Gary Payton was still right there with him, the difference between the 2 was very small, but Kidd had the slight advantage. Steve Nash enters the Top 3 discussion, mainly because of his offensive abilities showing good abilities to create and score for the Mavericks.




http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/1371126274_jason-kidd-sportsbook-bonus.jpg




2003: J.Kidd


2. S.Nash

3. G.Payton



Jason Kidd remained the best PG in the NBA for the 3rd straight year. It was actually quite clear he was the best PG now, Payton had declined a bit and Nash was still rising. Jason Kidd on the other hand was playing at his peak. He had his best scoring season of his career and still was playing defense at his best. He continued to demonstrate excellent court vision with his passing and was one of the best rebounding PGs the game has seen. After Kidd this year was Nash. He was still awful on defense, but had become a great scorer and passer. Payton was 3rd this year just getting older now at age 34.






2004: J.Kidd

2. S.Nash

3. B.Davis




Jason Kidd remained the best PG again. He was still playing at a peak level no signs of slowing down just yet. This was now the 4th straight season he was regarded as the best PG. That is the most consecutive years anyone has remained the best PG in the NBA since Magic Johnson. Steve Nash was again 2nd, he was about as good as he was the season before except focused a little more on passing rather than shooting this season. Baron Davis got a Top 3 mention this year, he was just tremendous carrying his team on his back and also played above average defense.






2005: S.Nash


2. J.Kidd

3. G.Arenas



After finishing as the 2nd best PG for the last couple of years, a few rule changes helped propel Steve Nash into being the best PG in the NBA. He was able to play into his full potential in Phoenix and was lethal all the way around demonstrating excellent passing skills and explosive scoring. Kidd had dropped a little in play from the previous year and now was the 2nd best PG in the NBA. Arenas made his debut into the Top 3, he was one of the better scoring PGs in the league.






2006: S.Nash


2. C.Billups

3. J.Kidd



Steve Nash remained the best PG in the NBA and there once again was really no debate about it. He was still playing at his peak level. He was regarded as one of the best shooters in the game and scored very efficiently. His passing skill was at an all-time level of greatness. All together he was unstoppable on offense. Billups jumped to the 2nd spot this year, he had greatly improved his game from the season before is one of the more underrated PGs in history. Jason Kidd remained a Top 3 PG continuing to contribute in so many ways to a game.



http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/nashgone.jpg





2007: S.Nash


2. G.Arenas

3. C.Billups



Steve Nash remained the best PG in the NBA for the 3rd straight NBA season. It truly was Nash’s era for PGs in the NBA from 2005-2007. He was widely regarded as the best. And he was still playing at his highest level. Continuing to be the best playmaker in the NBA while able to take games over with his scoring when needed as well. Arenas was the 2nd best PG this year, his scoring ability was just phenomenal, able to go off on any given night. Billups remained a Top 3 PG continuing to play good smart winning basketball.





2008: C.Paul


2. S.Nash

3. D.Williams




It was Chris Paul’s turn. Chris Paul significantly improved his game in his 3rd season in the NBA and was the clear-cut best PG. He could score when he wanted, was an amazing ball-handler, and knew how to get his teammates involved. He was also a great defender at PG. Following Paul was now Nash, who slipped to 2nd. He remained a huge threat on offense. Deron Williams was the other young PG to enter the Top 3 discussion. He like Paul was in his 3rd season and also was an excellent playmaker who could score when he wanted to. The competition amongst PGs was picking up again.





2009: C.Paul

2. D.Williams

3. T.Parker




Chris Paul remained the best PG in the NBA for the 2nd straight year. There was really little debate at who was at top. Paul was still at his peak and continued to play the best basketball of his life following the previous season. After CP3 it became tougher. Deron, Parker, Nash, and Billups all had great Top 3 arguments. I gave Deron the edge because out of the remaining PGs, he was the best at combining the ability to score and pass. He was a dynamic PG able to do both the 2 most important duties of a PG very well. Following Deron was Parker. Tony Parker was just unstoppable at scoring the basketball and was the best scoring PG left. Nash and Billups had good arguments but you just could not say they were better at this point than the young Parker.

[Gifted Mind]

2010s





http://s7.postimg.org/v7czxjowr/2010_2014.jpg
http://s28.postimg.org/4j2pruqfh/2015.jpg





2010: D.Williams


2. S.Nash

3. R.Rondo



With Chris Paul and Tony Parker facing injuries most of the season, there was an opportunity for other PGs to be listed at the top. Deron Williams took advantage playing at a consistent level from the season before which was good enough to be called the best this year. Nash made a returned to the Top 3 list, even at age 35 he was very effective and still arguably the best offensive PG in the NBA. Rondo makes his 1st appearance in this list. He was sort of unique, not much of a scorer but excellent playmaker and one of the top defenders at the PG position. Kind of reminded you of Jason Kidd.






2011: C.Paul


2. D.Rose

3. D.Williams




The competition was tough in 2011 amongst PGs. 5 very good PGs had arguments for Top 3: CP3, Rose, D-Will, Rondo, and Westbrook. They were all young so it seemed plausible that the battle between these 5 would rage on for years to come. I gave Chris Paul the nod for the best PG in 2011. He was healthier than the previous year though still not back to the form he was in 2009. Nonetheless, he still retained most of his abilities and was still good enough to be called the best PG. Rose was 2nd this year, he was extremely explosive, leading all PGs in points and did enough on the playmaking end to be called the 2nd best PG in the NBA. Deron Williams took the last position. He was on pace to stay at least Top 2 but had trouble adjusting to a late season trade. Nonetheless he remained a franchise level player and brought everything you would want from a PG. Rondo was left out as he was just not as elite as a scorer as the other 3 while Westbrook was still without a reliable jumpshot.






2012: C.Paul

2. R.Westbrook

3. R.Rondo




Chris Paul switched over to the Clippers but nothing changed his status for the best PG in the NBA. In fact he was looking healthier and better than the previous season and you could argue he was as good as he’s ever been. He was once again more aggressive on offense and continued to be one of the better defenders on defense. After Paul this year was Westbrook. He was another very athletic and out of control PG who had finally developed at least a consistent mid-range jumpshot to his game. He was above average on defense amongst PGs and definitely knew how to take it to the rim. The last spot was between Deron and Rondo. I felt Deron started to rely too much on his long range shot instead of taking it to the basket and became inefficient at this point while Rondo remained to be one of the best playmakers who was amongst the best defenders for PGs.




2013: C.Paul


2. R.Westbrook

3. T.Parker



Chris Paul remained the best PG in the NBA for the 3rd consecutive season. It was clearly Chris Paul’s era for PGs and he was still in his prime just playing better than any other PG in the NBA at this point. Following Paul was Westbrook once again. He also wasn’t necessarily taking his game to the next level, he remained a score 1st PG who had solid playmaking and defensive abilities. Tony Parker made an appearance in the Top 3 playing the best basketball of his career. He was as good as anyone when it came to scoring the ball and was a solid playmaker at the PG position as well.




http://standingosports.com/main/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/url-300x220.jpeg





2014: C.Paul


2. S.Curry

3. J.Wall



Chris Paul was the best PG in the NBA again. He was more aggressive this year than last despite missing a portion of time due to injuries. He was still just 28 years old and able to take over games when he needed but still always kept his teammates involved. Westbrook and Rondo were injured a good portion of the season keeping themselves out of the Top 3. Curry was able to take advantage and makes his 1st appearance in this thread. He was the best shooter in the NBA and had improved his playmaking abilities. The last spot was given to John Wall. Another rising young PG who had solid scoring and passing abilities and was one of the top defensive PGs in the NBA. Tony Parker would probably have been the 3rd best PG had he been healthier this season.



2015: S.Curry


2. C.Paul

3. R.Westbrook



A very very competitive year for PGs this year. After being called the 2nd best PG in the NBA last year, Steph Curry improved his game even more to surpass Chris Paul as the best PG in the NBA. His playmaking ability stayed about the same, but he became an even better scorer than ever before. He also improved on defense. Chris Paul remained about the same player as the season before but that was only good enough for #2. Westbrook was healthy again unlike the season before re-entering the Top 3, but stayed behind Paul, who just had a more team orientated winning style of play at PG than Westbrook.

[Gifted Mind]

Best Season








1950s







1950


http://savpeople.com/images1/bob-davies-4.jpg


Bob Davies

Runner-Up: R.Beard

Honorable Mention: A.Phillip


The 1st official year of the NBA. Early on in the NBA it was hard enough figuring out who played PG and who did not in the NBA. Nonetheless, with many metrics I use, it was figured Davies was the closest thing to PG on his team and deserved the honors for the PG of the Year. He was the only PG to finish All-NBA 1st, led his team to the best record in the NBA, and was Top 5 in assists and points for PGs. Beard finished 2nd also with a good season and led all PGs in points per game being named to All-NBA 2nd. Phillip led the NBA in assists and received an honorable mention.








1951


http://savpeople.com/images1/bob-davies-4.jpg


Bob Davies

Runner-Up: R.Beard

Honorable Mention(s): D.McGuire, A.Phillip


The 2nd year of the NBA. For the 2nd straight year Bob Davies would have won a PG of the Year award. This year it was much more clear-cut. He was once again selected All-NBA 1st and this time led his team to the championship. Beard would once again win runner-up improving his season from last year. McGuire gets an honorable mention for All-NBA 2nd honors and taking his team to the finals while Phillips once again led the league in assists.






1952

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: B.Davies

Honorable Mention(s): A.Phillip



Bob Cousy becomes a superstar in the NBA and instantly wins the best PG of the year award. He was top 3 in both assists and points this season while leading his team to the 3rd best record in the NBA while receiving All-NBA 1st honors. Really there was no debate about who deserved the PG of the Year honors this year. 2 Time Winner Davies was runner-up this year, he had another strong season. Phillips once again receives honorable mention though had his best season yet.




1953

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: B.Davies

Honorable Mention(s): None


Bob Cousy received PG of the Year honors for the 2nd consecutive year. There was once again no doubt he deserved these honors. He was All-NBA 1st and led his team to one of the best records in the NBA. In the playoffs he did some damage before eventually losing. Davies was declining but if anyone was runner-up it was him.





1954

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: B.Davies

Honorable Mention(s): None


Bob Cousy takes the PG of the year honor for the 3rd straight year. And at this point in the league, it seems he will be taking it again and again for the years to come. He once again finishes with All-NBA 1st honors and a superstar PG type of season. Overall he was 1st in assists both regular season and playoffs, while 2nd in points in regular season and 1st in the playoffs. There was really no PG at his level.





1955

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: A.Phillip

Honorable Mention(s): None

For now the 4th consecutive year Bob Cousy takes the PG of the Year Honors. This year the decision was also unanimous, he was All-NBA 1st again, won another assist title, led all PGs in PPG, and was 1 series away from taking his Boston team to the finals. Andy Phillip finished runner-up this year, was still playing at an all-star level and almost guided his team to the championship.




1956

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: J.George

Honorable Mention(s): None


Bob Cousy was recognized as the top PG for the 5th straight year. He was still in the middle of his prime and there was really no competition for him so there was no telling how long his run was going to last. He was name All-NBA 1st and set a new NBA record for assists per game. After Cousy came Jack George this year who had a solid season himself being named to All-NBA 1st and winning an NBA championship.




1957

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: S.Martin

Honorable Mention(s):


Bob Cousy had the best season of his career in 1957. He became the 1st PG in NBA history to win MVP, while also winning an NBA championship. Really he could not have asked for a better season than this. And there was once again no question he deserved the PG of the year honors. After Cousy comes Slater, who had another solid season losing to Cousy in the NBA finals.




1958

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: S.Martin

Honorable Mention(s):


Bob Cousy continues his run of being the PG of the year. He nearly won another championship but at the very least made another finals appearance. He had another typical Cousy season winning another assist title, leading all PGs in points, and All-NBA 1st. There was really no competition for him again. Slater took the runner-up slot again with an NBA championship and All-NBA 2nd appearance. No one really to mention as an honorable mention, though Braun came close.




1959

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Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: L.Costello

Honorable Mention(s):


The 1950s finish up with Bob Cousy on the top. For an incredible 8 straight seasons Bob Cousy was once again recognized as the PG of the year. He had another strong season winning his 7th straight assist title, finishing Top 10 in the league in scoring, All-NBA 1st, and an NBA championship. Really no one came close. Costello probably had the 2nd best season amongst PGs, finishing Top 3 in both points and assists and leading his team to the 2nd round in the playoffs.

[Gifted Mind]

1960s





1960

http://images.sodahead.com/polls/000046102/polls_07_06_14_Bob_Cousy_1519_364969_poll_xlarge.j peg

Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: L.Costella

Honorable Mention: G.Shue


For the 9th consecutive season Bob Cousy wins PG of the year honor. Already his career at PG was spectacular and it seemed no one would ever pass him. He was All-NBA 1st once again and won another championship. He also set a new career high in assists. It just seemed like he could continue playing at this level forever. Larry Costella was once again the runner-up for the season. He really wasn’t doing anything spectacular but if someone had to be picked it was him. Shue would have been a good choice but he played SG for his team this season.




1961

http://images.sodahead.com/polls/000046102/polls_07_06_14_Bob_Cousy_1519_364969_poll_xlarge.j peg

Bob Cousy

Runner-Up: O.Robertson

Honorable Mention(s): G.Shue


This year was very difficult to decide and if it were up to me I would have flipped a coin to decide who deserves the PG of the year award. On 1 side there was Cousy with another effective All-NBA 1st and championship season, on the other side there was the Big O with a far more dominant individual season but misses playoffs. Robertson was obviously the better player but in terms of legacy and greatness, no matter how good of a season you have missing the playoffs is going to hurt you, especially against another player who was also All-NBA 1st and won the championship. Thus, I gave Cousy the tiny edge and his 10th consecutive PG of the year. Shue, Costella, and others had solid seasons at PG but neither really deserved a mention next to these 2.






1962

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: B.Cousy

Honorable Mention(s):



Last year it was close, but this year it was really not. Oscar Robertson ends Cousy’s 10 year run as the PG of the year. That feat may never be matched but in the upcoming future Robertson maybe the only one who could match it. He averaged a triple-double this season while leading his team to the playoffs. They didn’t get anywhere in the playoffs but nonetheless strong season by Robertson. Cousy was runner-up this year getting All-NBA 2nd and winning yet another championship.




1963

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: B.Cousy

Honorable Mention(s):


The Big O once again easily takes PG of the year honors. His numbers individually were just too great and left everyone else behind. He was All-NBA 1st and this year took his team to the 2nd round before losing to the eventual champion Celtics in 7 games. Cousy gets runner-up honors once again winning yet another championship.





1964

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: G.Rodgers

Honorable Mention(s):


Robertson wins PG of the year for the 3rd consecutive year. This season was probably the best of his career. He was All-NBA 1st again, led the league in assists and FT%, and won the league MVP. He becomes the 2nd PG in history to win the MVP after Cousy. After Robertson the PG who had the best season was probably Guy Rodgers. He was named to the All-Star team for the 2nd straight year and this time was part of a finals run that came up short.





1965

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: L.Wilkens

Honorable Mention(s):



Robertson continues to be as solid as they come as once again he really had no competition for having the best season at PG. He had another Big O caliber season, making his 5th consecutive All-NBA 1st appearance and leading his team to a 48-32 season while putting up 30/12/9. Hard to say any other PG had a better season than this. Wilkens gets the runner-up nod as he was one of the rising PGs in the league and the leader of the Hawks.

Actual PG of the Year: Jerry West

Jerry West played PG for the 2nd straight season in the NBA and was spectacular this season. He led his team to a #1 seed while averaging 31/6/5 All-NBA 1st, and then leading his team to the finals averaging an incredible 40.6ppg. It was hard to argue anyone else even Robertson over West this season and the league would have given Jerry West the PG of the year honors this season.
4.6



1966

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: L.Wilkens

Honorable Mention(s):


Robertson wins his 5th career PG of the year in 1966. He had a great year individually putting up spectacular numbers, finishing All-NBA 1st, and leading his team to a 45-35 record. In the playoffs they came up short again losing to Russell’s Celtics for the 3rd straight year. After Robertson, well, no one really had a great year but Lenny Wilken’s season was good enough for runner-up.




1967

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: L.Wilkens

Honorable Mention(s):


The Big O had the best season out of all PGs for the 6th consective season. He was once again All-NBA 1st and took his team to the playoffs like usual. They however didn’t get really far, but for Robertson to have the best season amongst PGs they really didn’t need to. He was once again dominate and did everything he could for his team to get as far as they did. Wilkens gets another runner-up mention as he remained solid at PG receiving another All-Star selection and was getting better every year for the rising Hawks.





1968

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/teamsites/images/legacy/hawks/HWK_Wilkens_Classic_HS.jpg

Lenny Wilkens

Runner-Up: O.Robertson

Honorable Mention(s):


Lenny Wilkens ends Robertson’s run for best season at PG and takes the honors this season. He was fantastic this season leading the Hawks to the Top seed in the West and having a career year for himself averaging 20/8. Robertson probably had the worst season of his career thus far, individually as a PG he was still the best, but his team missed the playoffs this season giving Wilkens the small edge over Oscar for the PG of the year in 1968.


Actual PG of the Year: Jerry West

Jerry West here would win his 2nd PG of the year honors. He was back at PG and even played PG last year as well. Wilken was the front-runner for the award since Oscar’s team missed the playoffs and West missed 31 games in the regular season, however Wilken’s Hawks got bounced out in the 1st round in an upset while the Lakers went to the NBA finals led by West. This secured the award for Jerry West.


ABA PG of the Year: Larry Jones



1969

http://www.blackpast.org/files/blackpast_images/Oscar_Robertson_0.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: W.Frazier

Honorable Mention(s):


Robertson adds another season as the top PG, winning the honors for 7th time in his career. This year was similar to last year for him, except the difference was there was just less competition for him. Lenny Wilkens had left the Hawks and did not have as much team success with the Sonics. Frazier was his new competition but he was still a rising star. But it’s not like Robertson was a slouch either he received another All-NBA 1st honors and continues to be one of the Top PGs.

Actual PG of the Year: Jerry West

Jerry West ends the 60s with another PG of the year award. This year he was clearly the choice. His regular season was solid, but he really won the award in the playoffs. He led his team to the NBA Finals before putting on a dazzling display in the finals. The Lakers came up short but West was still Finals MVP.


ABA PG of the Year: Jimmy Jones

[Gifted Mind]

1970s



1970

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Walt Frazier

Runner-Up: O.Robertson

Honorable Mention:



Walt Frazier takes the PG of the year honors this year, having one great season that included a All-NBA 1st and NBA championship. Any such combination becomes very tough to beat. He had a career season and was still 24 so this looked to be just the first of many such honors to come. Robertson had another solid season, but just like the last few years he has been slipping a little.

Actual PG of the Year: Jerry West

Jerry West wins the PG of the year award for the 3rd consecutive season. Even though he is historically considered a SG, he had many strong seasons at PG and this was one of his best. He led the league in scoring this season and finished 4th in the league in assists, while making All-NBA 1st and All-Defensive 1st and leading his team to the finals.


ABA PG of the Year: Larry Jones




1971

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-NjWZ0dLjQ98/UINBoFqA5lI/AAAAAAAABxw/wjRD0ntaG5E/s400/Oscar+Robertson.jpg

Oscar Robertson

Runner-Up: W.Frazier

Honorable Mention(s): D.Bing


Just when you thought he was gone Oscar Robertson wins 1 more PG of the year award. He had a spectacular season in 1971, that capped off with an NBA championship. He played a key role on one of the best teams in NBA history the 66-16 1971 Bucks. Frazier this time finishes behind Robertson as the runner-up, he had a similar season last year but of course without that championship. Bing gets an honorable mention here as he was actually All-NBA 1st but his team missed the playoffs.


ABA PG of the Year: Mack Calvin




1972

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/10/03/realestate/03frazier/03frazier-articleInline-v2.jpg

Walt Frazier

Runner-Up: O.Robertson

Honorable Mention(s): T.Archibald



Frazier enjoys another season being named the Top PG in the NBA. He was both the best and most successful in 1972. He was once again All-NBA 1st and All-Defensive 1st, put up great numbers, and took his team to the NBA finals where they came up short against the 72 Lakers. Nonetheless, there was really no debate about which PG had the best season this was for Frazier. Robertson was unable to repeat as both his play and his team’s play fell this year. Archibald had a strong individual season but his team was not as strong.

ABA PG of the Year: Bill Melchionni


Actual PG of the Year: Jerry West

Jerry West continues to thrive at the PG position and wins his 5th PG of the year award. This year was one of his most special, as he also won his 1st NBA championship. He was also named All-NBA 1st and All-Defensive 1st and 1972 really completed his career. Ironically this was also the only year he struggled in the playoffs.




1973

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/10/03/realestate/03frazier/03frazier-articleInline-v2.jpg

Walt Frazier

Runner-Up: T. Archibald

Honorable Mention(s):


Frazier finally receives his 3rd PG of the year honors. Only Cousy and Robertson have accomplished such a feat. Already one could make a case for Frazier being a Top 3 PG of all-time at this point. There was really no doubt he deserved them this year. He was All-NBA 1st again and won another championship, this time was the best player on his team when he won. Archibald had a great individual season but his team missed the playoffs.

ABA PG of the Year: Jimmy Jones



1974

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/10/03/realestate/03frazier/03frazier-articleInline-v2.jpg

Walt Frazier

Runner-Up: J.White

Honorable Mention(s):


Frazier wins the PG of the year honors again. This year, the main reason he probably won was the lack of competition. West and Robertson were practically gone while Archibald was battling injuries. Frazier was All-NBA 1st and had a solid enough year to take the PG of the year honors in 1974. Jo Jo White had a decent argument winning the championship and making the All-Star team, but he really did not play a big role in the championship and was at best their 3rd best player.

ABA PG of the Year: Jimmy Jones




1975

http://www.nba.com/media/history/uniforms_kings_archibald.jpg

T.Archibald


Runner-Up: J.White

Honorable Mention(s): W.Frazier


Tiny Archibald takes the PG of the year honors for the 1st time in his career. The fact he even got his team to the playoffs made him worthy of the honors this year. The Kings team was quite terrible but Archibald did enough to lead them to a 44-38 and take them into the playoffs for the 1st time in his career. But overall really there was not much competition for the award this year. After Tiny it was probably Jo Jo whose team was once again successful and he played at a strong level.

ABA PG of the Year: Mack Calvin



1976

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Jo Jo White

Runner-Up: R.Smith

Honorable Mention(s): T.Archibald


1976 had a surprise winner for the PG of the year. Well not too surprising since he was runner-up for the past couple of years. But this year was the year he deserved the grand award. He had a solid season but he really won the award in the playoffs playing excellent and eventually winning the NBA championship. After Jo Jo White no one really had too strong of a season, Randy Smith took runner-up honors having the best season of his career and carrying his play into the playoffs.


ABA PG of the Year: James Silas


1977

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Jo Jo White

Runner-Up: C.Murphy

Honorable Mention(s):


Jo Jo White comes in and wins his 2nd straight PG of the year award. There was almost no competition for the award this year, Jo Jo White had a solid year being named All-NBA 2nd and leading his team to the 2nd round. Nothing special, but good enough for 1977. Calvin Murphy took runner-up honors this year as the Rockets won the Central division and came 1 round short of the finals.





1978

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Don Buse

Runner-Up: K.Porter

Honorable Mention(s):



Picking PG of the Year was torturous this year. The competition was that low. In some years the PG of the year this year would probably not even have had a Top 10 PG season in other years. Nonetheless this gave Don Buse the chance to win the award. He was named All-Defensive 1st and amongst the league leaders in steals. His team made it to the playoffs but lost in the 1st round. Kevin Porter took runner-up honors this season winning the assist title.




1979

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Dennis Johnson

Runner-Up: G.Williams

Honorable Mention(s): N.Nixon, P.Ford, C.Murphy


Dennis Johnson takes the PG of the year honors in 1979. For the 3rd straight year a different player has won this award. DJ was terrific this season, he made it to the All-Star team but what made his season truly special is he led his team to the championship and was named Finals MVP. This honor has been received by very few PGs at this point. Gus Williams was the runner-up but he was also dynamic. Both complemented each other well and together made one of the best backcourts ever. There were a few honorable mentions this year. Nixon had a solid season averaging 17/9 before losing to the eventual champion Sonics in the 2nd round. Ford and Murphy were also in the argument, but their argument just wasn’t strong.


Actual PG of the Year: Gus Williams

Gus Williams would take the PG of the year honors in 1979. Dennis Johnson would probably have been the winner this year however he had played SG this year while Gus played more PG. Williams though had a pretty strong year compared to the winners of the past few years. He was solid in the regular season but just spectacular in the playoffs. Together with DJ they made one of the best backcourts of all-time. They led the Sonics to their only NBA championship.

[Gifted Mind]

1980s





1980

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Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: N.Nixon

Honorable Mention: T.Archibald, G.Williams


Magic Johnson enters the league as a rookie, and already had the best season amongst PGs in the NBA. His regular season wasn’t too special but where he really left his mark was the playoffs. Especially Game 6 of the NBA Finals where he had an historic game eventually winning the Finals MVP for the Lakers. After Magic comes Nixon, who was Magic’s backcourt partner and thus also part of the championship Lakers team. Gus Williams had another strong season with the Sonics playing well both in the regular season and playoffs. Archibald was back in the discussions now with the Celtics. The Celtics won over 60 games but were eliminated in the conference finals. Tiny did however lead all PGs in MVP votes.

Actual PG of the Year: Norm Nixon

Magic Johnson was more the 2 for the Lakers while Nixon played the 1 more. That is the main reason why he would have probably won the PG of the year this season, reasons for why his season was great are described above.



1981

http://www.alphahacks.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Nate-Archibald-219x300.jpg

Tiny Archibald

Runner-Up: D.Johnson

Honorable Mention(s):


After a 5 year gap, Tiny Archibald wins his 2nd career PG of the year award. He was named to All-NBA 2nd this year while playing on a 62 win Boston Celtic team. The real reason he won the award was because this team went onto win the NBA championship. Though past his prime, Archibald was an essential piece of this team and provided great leadership along with just fulfilling his PG duties perfectly. After Tiny comes DJ, who finally played PG this season. Johnson was All-NBA 1st and turned the Suns into the best in the west record wise.




1982

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: G.Williams

Honorable Mention(s): D.Johnson, N.Nixon


Magic Johnson is once again healthy and once again had the best season at PG. It was quite similar to his rookie year, where he had an impressive regular season but cemented his glory in the playoffs winning the championship and Finals MVP. There was no real debate about who deserved this award the most. After Magic it was Gus Williams who had a solid year being named All-NBA 1st over Magic and leading his Sonics team to 52 wins and the 2nd round while playing excellent in the playoffs like usual. Nixon took the runner-up position this year winning the championship and playing the best he has ever played in the postseason. Dennis Johnson had another solid season this year with Phoenix including a even better postseason.

Actual PG of the Year: Gus Williams

Once again for the Lakers Nixon played PG more than Magic at this point and thus someone else could eligible for this award. This time it would go to Gus Williams, for the reasons mentioned above.



1983

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: G.Williams

Honorable Mention(s):


Magic Johnson is once again noted as the Top PG in the NBA. This his 3rd time with this distinction in the past 4 years. There really is no debate about it. He was All-NBA 1st this season and led his LA Lakers team to the NBA Finals. They came up short this time but Magic still had a stellar season. Gus Williams takes the runner-up spot this year with another solid season averaging 20/8 and leading his Sonics team to 48 wins.




1984

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s):


Magic Johnson was once again the PG with the best season. This year it was a little closer than last year as Isiah Thomas continued to improve his game. But there was still really no one touching Magic. He had a year similar to last where he took his team to the finals before they lost to the Celtics. Isiah Thomas also had a strong season being named All-NBA 1st and being Top 5 in MVP voting. It was the best season of his career thus far however he could not get further than the 1st round.




1985

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson


Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s):


Magic Johnson had the best season amongst PGs once again. He was named All-NBA 1st and finished 2nd in MVP voting while leading his team to the NBA championship. Really hard for any PG in NBA history to top such a season. It would go down as one of the greatest seasons by any PG. Isiah Thomas continued to impress but was still 2nd to Magic. He was named All-NBA 1st again and this time got his team out of the 1st round.




1986

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s): D.Johnson


Magic Johnson continues to display greatness and wins a 5th consecutive PG of the year award. He joins Cousy and Robertson as the only players to accomplish such a feat. His season wasn’t as strong as the season prior, but it was still brilliant as he was named to another All-NBA 1st and still known as the Top PG. Isiah Thomas once again has a great season but once again it’s behind Magic’s year. It’s actually unfortunate for Isiah that the peak of his career came at the same time as the peak of Magic’s career. DJ got an honorable mention this year as he played a key role on one of the top teams of all-time.



1987

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s):


1987 was arguably the greatest PG season in NBA history. It was that special. Magic Johnson was selected to All-NBA 1st, led his team to a league high 65 wins, won MVP, and then led his team to the championship and won Finals MVP. Could it have gone any better? After Magic came Isiah Thomas, who again had a strong year and this year the Pistons were just 1 game away from the NBA finals stopped again by the Celtics.



1988

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s):


Make that 7th straight. This equals the 2nd longest run in NBA history for a PG to have the best season. Only Cousy’s 10 straight season run was better. And like almost every year, this year was a no brainer. Magic Johnson was All-NBA 1st again and led his team to another championship. His past 2 seasons at PG were arguably 2 of the greatest ever by any PG, any player for that matter. The runner-up was once again Isiah Thomas. He has been runner-up for this more than any PG it seems. This was one of his better seasons as the Pistons finally made it to the finals but came short against Magic’s Lakers.



1989

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson

Runner-Up: I.Thomas

Honorable Mention(s): K.Johnson, J.Stockton, M.Price


Magic Johnson finishes the 1980s with his 8th consecutive PG of the year award giving him 9 for his career. This is the 2nd most all-time behind just Bob Cousy. At this point Johnson had already done enough to get him general consensus as the GOAT PG. Now he was just adding to his great career with more strong seasons. After Magic for the 6th consecutive time is Isiah Thomas. No one has these many runner-ups in a row. It is actually sort of an accomplishment to be the runner-up PG behind Magic all these seasons. This year was special for Isiah, he finally won his 1st championship. You could make an argument for him to be the PG of the year, he came close, but Magic’s MVP and his team success to at least make it to the finals held his position firm for the 8th consecutive year. KJ, Stockton, and Price also had honorable seasons for PGs this season.

[Gifted Mind]

1990s






1990

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/media/pistons/thomas_931014.jpg

Isiah Thomas

Runner-Up: M.Johnson

Honorable Mention: K.Johnson, J.Stockton


Finally, Isiah Thomas is awarded a PG of the Year award. Quite frankly, he did not deserve it over Magic this season. He had a great year, having a fine regular season, leading his team to the championship, and winning Finals MVP. However, Magic Johnson still probably had a better overall season winning MVP and just flat out playing better basketball. But I chose Isiah this year, for the reason often we see MVP going to 1 player over another, he just deserved one by now. Magic’s Lakers underperformed in the playoffs going home in the 2nd round, while the Pistons won their 2nd championship in a row and this time Isiah brought home the Finals MVP. So it was not too much of a stretch to say Isiah Thomas had a better season than Magic this year. Kevin Johnson and John Stockton follow with strong seasons again and honorable mentions.




1991

http://www.tabdeportes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Magic-Johnson-Player-198x300.jpg

Magic Johnson


Runner-Up: J.Stockton

Honorable Mention(s): I.Thomas, K.Johnson


After a 1 year break Magic Johnson would comeback and win another PG of the year award. This year there was no sympathy given to other PGs who had never won, Magic clearly had the best season again. This would be the 10th time in his career he would have this honor, tying Cousy for the most times ever. After Magic this year it was Stockton, who had a stellar regular season took his team to the 2nd round. Isiah and Kevin followed with honorable mentions.




1992

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_D6_tKWr0gRs/RdyZb9eO7-I/AAAAAAAAAAU/rZf2Vdcsoss/s320/stockton.jpg

John Stockton

Runner-Up: M.Price

Honorable Mention(s): K.Johnson, T.Hardaway


Magic Johnson had retired, thus we had entered a new era of PGs. John Stockton was the 1st one to take advantage taking in his 1st career PG of the year award just edging Mark Price. Both Stockton and Price had similar seasons being named to All-NBA 2nd and taking their teams to the conference finals, but I gave the slight edge to Stockton just because Price simply did not play enough. After Price and Stockton were KJ and Hardaway both had solid seasons at PG>



1993

http://www.chicagonow.com/as-i-see-it/files/2012/05/mark_price_free_throw.jpg

Mark Price

Runner-Up: J.Stockton

Honorable Mention(s): K.Johnson. T.Hardaway


Mark Price takes the honor for PG of the year in 1993. He came close last year and this year he fully deserved it. He made All-NBA 1st and made it to the 2nd round in the playoffs, and quite frankly this was good enough to win the honors this year. KJ was injured much of the year, Hardaway missed the playoffs, and Stockton just didn’t do as much as he did the season. We now have had 4 different PGs win the PG of the year award the 1st 4 years of the 90s.





1994

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_D6_tKWr0gRs/RdyZb9eO7-I/AAAAAAAAAAU/rZf2Vdcsoss/s320/stockton.jpg

John Stockton


Runner-Up: K.Johnson

Honorable Mention(s): G.Payton


For the 2nd time in his career John Stockton takes the PG of the year honors. He was the only PG named All-NBA 1st and made it the farthest amongst the All-Star PGs in the playoffs. A year like this makes it pretty easy to see he had the best season amongst PGs this year. Following Stockton was KJ, who was the only PG to make it to All-NBA 2nd and probably played the best amongst PGs in the playoffs. Gary Payton received an honorable mention being part of the season best record Sonics.




1995

http://wallpoper.com/images/00/11/12/32/anfernee-hardaway_00111232.jpg

Anfernee Hardaway


Runner-Up: J.Stockton

Honorable Mention(s): G.Payton, K.Johnson


Anfernee Hardaway took the league by surprise in 1995 and was the PG of the year. He was named All-NBA 2nd and in fact was the only PG this season to get out of the 1st round. He not only made it out of the 1st round, but led the Orlando Magic made it to the NBA finals this season. After Hardaway Stockton received another runner-up mention, Stockton has either won or been runner-up PG of the year for the past 5 years now. Payton and KJ had solid enough seasons to receive honorable mentions. Payton was great during the regular season while KJ in the playoffs.




1996

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/0f/9b/ae/0f9bae94bd9b695d512451a64142fa59.jpg

Gary Payton

Runner-Up: A.Hardaway

Honorable Mention(s): J.Stockton


1996 was the Glove’s year. For the 1st time in his career Gary Payton was awarded the PG of the year. He had an outstanding season being named All-NBA 2nd, winning DPOY, leading his team to a West’s best 64 wins, and then making a trip to the NBA Finals. All these accomplishments made him worthy enough for the PG of the year. After Payton was Hardaway this season, he led the Magic even when Shaq was injured and received an All-NBA 1st selection. Stockton had another honorable mention season but just fell short of the finals.



1997

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_D6_tKWr0gRs/RdyZb9eO7-I/AAAAAAAAAAU/rZf2Vdcsoss/s320/stockton.jpg

John Stockton

Runner-Up: T.Hardaway

Honorable Mention(s): G.Payton


For the 3rd time in his career John Stockton was awarded the PG of the year. He joins a very elite list of PGs to have won this award 3 times in their careers: Cousy, Robertson, Frazier, and Magic. This year he won the award in the playoffs. He had arguably his best postseason of his career and led his team to the NBA finals. Tim Hardaway had the best season of his career being named All-NBA 1st for the 1st time and making the deepest run of his career in the playoffs. Payton had another strong season and received an honorable mention.




1998

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/0f/9b/ae/0f9bae94bd9b695d512451a64142fa59.jpg

Gary Payton

Runner-Up: T.Hardaway

Honorable Mention(s): J.Stockton



Gary Payton wins his 2nd PG of the year. He had a strong season this year being named All-NBA 1st for the 1st time in his career, leading his Sonics to 61 wins as the clear-cut best player. A well-deserving year for PG of the year for Payton. Tim Hardaway finishes runner-up again, this year was not as strong as last year though. He was All-NBA 2nd this year but went home in the 1st round. Stockton received another honorable mention making another trip to the NBA Finals.




1999

http://images.rcs.realclearpolitics.com/35552_1_.jpg

Jason Kidd

Runner-Up: T.Hardaway

Honorable Mention(s): G.Payton


The 1990s end with Jason Kidd winning his 1st PG of the year award. It seemed this maybe the start to a new era of Kidd. He was named All-NBA 1st while putting spectacular numbers. He even was efficient for himself both on the scoring and passing side of the game. He was also named All-Defensive 1st. Following Kidd was Tim Hardaway, for the 3rd straight year he was runner-up for this award. His season was similar to last year, high seed finish, but 1st round exit. Gary Payton had another solid year receiving an honorable mention though missed the playoffs.

[Gifted Mind]

2000s



2000

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/0f/9b/ae/0f9bae94bd9b695d512451a64142fa59.jpg

Gary Payton

Runner-Up: J.Kidd

Honorable Mention:


Gary Payton wins his 3rd PG of the year award of his career. He has now won every other year from 1996-2000. He was selected All-NBA 1st this year and took a helpless Sonics team to the playoffs which was an impressive feat in itself. Kidd, last years winner, had another solid season but his numbers fell from the year before. The overall competition though for this award was a little less than in recent times, besides for Kidd and Payton, stuck in not so great teams, there was really no one else.




2001

http://images.rcs.realclearpolitics.com/35552_1_.jpg

Jason Kidd


Runner-Up: G.Payton

Honorable Mention(s):


Jason Kidd wins his 2nd PG of the year award in a 3 year span. He was once again just good enough. He was named All-NBA 1st and All-Defensive 1st, struggled to get out of the 1st round, but such a season was still good enough. Gary Payton received another runner-up mention, he was once again solid in the regular season leading his team to 44 wins in a tough western conference but it was not good enough to make the playoffs.




2002

http://cronicasdelnuevomundo.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/kidd1.jpg

Jason Kidd

Runner-Up: G.Payton

Honorable Mention(s): S.Nash, B.Davis


Jason Kidd takes the PG of the year award back to back seasons. He is actually the 1st to accomplish this feat since Magic Johnson. This was probably the best season of his career. He was All-NBA 1st, All-Defensive 1st, runner-up Finals MVP, and turned the Nets around and took them to the NBA Finals. Really one superb year for a PG and the best season we have had out of a PG in a while. Gary Payton once again was runner-up, it was very impressive how he was able to carry this Sonics team on his back and even get them into the playoffs. Nash and Davis both make their 1st entries into this thread with honorable mention seasons.



2003

http://cronicasdelnuevomundo.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/kidd1.jpg

Jason Kidd

Runner-Up: S.Nash

Honorable Mention(s): G.Payton


Jason Kidd wins his 3rd straight PG of the year award. He becomes the 1st PG to do this since Magjc Johnson. He was All-NBA 1st yet again and made a trip to another NBA Finals. This year the Nets were even better than last year and almost were able to upset the Spurs behind Kidd’s play. After Kidd this year was Nash, a rising PG was the leader of the Mavericks who won 60+ games. Gary Payton was solid again putting up 20/8 averages while making a playoff appearance but it was clear he was getting old.



2004

http://cronicasdelnuevomundo.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/kidd1.jpg

Jason Kidd


Runner-Up: C.Billups

Honorable Mention(s): S.Nash, S.Cassell


Though there was more debate about it this year, Jason Kidd once again wins another PG of the year honor. This is the 5th time in his career he has received this honor, joining Magic, Big O, and Cousy as the only PGs in history to win it this many times. Admittingly the competition hasn’t been too tough recently, Kidd wins it this year with another All-NBA 1st selection and leading his team to a division championship. Billups made it more interesting this year winning the Finals MVP as a PG, but he really had nothing else besides for that. Nash and Cassell also had solid seasons.




2005

http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/game-on/2012/07/04/stevenashx-inset-community.jpg

Steve Nash


Runner-Up: G.Arenas

Honorable Mention(s):



Steve Nash easily takes PG of the year honors in 2005. He was the MVP of the NBA, joining Cousy, Robertson, and Magic as the only PGs to every win this award. He quickly turned around the Sun’s franchise and helped guide them to the WCF. After Nash there was a huge drop but Arenas stood out the most. He was an all-star and All-NBA 3rd team member helping the Wizards out of the 1st round after quite some time.




2006

http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/game-on/2012/07/04/stevenashx-inset-community.jpg

Steve Nash


Runner-Up: C.Billups

Honorable Mention(s): G.Arenas


Steve Nash won back to back MVPs and also back to back PG of the year honors. There was once again no debate on which PG had the best season. He led his team to the WCF once again however they came up 1 series short of the NBA finals again. Billups was runner-up this year, finishing runner-up for the 2nd time in his career. He was All-NBA 2nd while being Top 5 in MVP votes leading the Pistons to a 64 win season. Arenas had another high scoring season leading all PGs in points.



2007: S.Nash

http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/game-on/2012/07/04/stevenashx-inset-community.jpg


Runner-Up: T.Parker

Honorable Mention(s): G.Arenas, C.Billups


Steve Nash wins 3 straight PG of the year awards. This year was closer than the past few, he was not able to win MVP and Tony Parker won the Finals MVP. Nonetheless, Nash’s season was just too much superior to Parkers and he still had the season edge. Tony Parker though was runner-up and is now part of this. Arenas and Billups again had solid seasons All-NBA 2nd and All-NBA 3rd respectively.




2008

http://www.repubblica.it/images/2011/12/09/122736253-1f766dc5-812e-4d9f-923d-a1c86dc97e4b.jpg

Chris Paul

Runner-Up: D.Williams

Honorable Mention(s): S.Nash


Chris Paul takes his 1st PG of the year award at age 22. He ends Steve Nash’s 3 year run of PGs with the best season. This was a very strong year by Paul. He was All-NBA 1st and Runner-Up MVP. The Hornets didn’t get too far in the playoffs but Paul played excellent. He also led the league in assists and steals both regular season and playoffs. Following Paul was the other young PG Deron Williams. He had a similar season but just not as good as Paul (All-NBA 2nd with a 2nd round exit). Steve Nash had another solid season and received an honorable mention.




2009

http://www.repubblica.it/images/2011/12/09/122736253-1f766dc5-812e-4d9f-923d-a1c86dc97e4b.jpg

Chris Paul

Runner-Up: C.Billups

Honorable Mention(s): T.Parker, D.Williams


The 2000s end with CP3 winning back to back PG of the year awards. This season wasn’t as great as the season before but it still was good enough for Paul to receive this honor due to the lack of any tough competition. Paul put up similar statistics to last year and was named All-NBA 2nd but the Hornets went home in the 1st round this year. Billups was the runner-up with an All-NBA 3rd and making a trip all the way to the WCF. This is now Billups 3rd runner-up. Tony Parker and Deron Williams also had 1st round exists in the playoffs.

[Gifted Mind]

2010

http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/game-on/2012/07/04/stevenashx-inset-community.jpg

Steve Nash

Runner-Up: D.Williams

Honorable Mention: R.Rondo


Steve Nash surprises everyone and wins 1 more PG of the year award. He was spectacular this year being named to All-NBA 2nd and acquiring more MVP votes than any other PG. He did not disappoint in the playoffs either leading his team to the WCF. Deron Williams takes a runner-up position this year also being a member of the All-NBA 2nd team and overall probably having the best season of his career thus far. Rondo receives an honorable mention with an all-star and finals apperance.




2011

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2011/0414/espnchi_g_rose_lbj_300.jpg

Derrick Rose

Runner-Up: R.Westbrook

Honorable Mention(s): R.Rondo, C.Paul, T.Parker


Derrick Rose wins his 1st PG of the year award in 2011. He also won MVP this year, joining Cousy, Robertson, Magic, and Nash as the only PGs to ever win this honor. Thus it’s safe to say, he was the clear winner for PG of the year this season. Following Rose was Russell Westbrook. He was selected to All-NBA 2nd this year and was part of a run for his team that ended in the WCF. Rondo, Paul, and Parker all had solid seasons but lacked somewhere to come behind Rose and Westbrook.




2012

http://www.sidelinepass.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/130103110756-chris-paul-clippers-single-image-cut.jpg

Chris Paul

Runner-Up: R.Westbrook

Honorable Mention(s): T.Parker, R.Rondo


After a 2 year break, Chris Paul takes his 3rd PG fo the year honors. Already he has had a great career at PG and is looking to be amongst the greatest PGs ever to play. He was All-NBA 1st again and helped quickly turn around the Clippers franchise making them relevant again. After CP3 this year was Westbrook who collected another runner-up. This year Westbrook was very close to winning it all as he took his team to the NBA Finals where they came up short against the Miami Heat. Parker and Rondo had solid seasons both coming up 1 series short of the NBA Finals.



2013

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-rWmZy7wkFhw/T82CS81Ec5I/AAAAAAAAALw/DYe4_jtLrmA/s1600/566045-tony_parker_large-200x300.jpg

Tony Parker

Runner-Up: C.Paul

Honorable Mention(s): R.Westbrook


This may surprise some at the end of the year but I thought Parker deserved these honors this year. It was obviously between him and Chris Paul. Paul was All-NBA 1st while Tony Parker All-NBA 2nd. Close, but advantage to Chris Paul in the regular season. However the Clippers disappointed in the playoffs going home in the 1st round while the Spurs went to the finals one game away from winning the championship. Furthermore, Paul’s statistics were down this year and quite comparable to Parker’s (16.9/9.7 vs. 20.3/7.6). There was no denying Paul was still the best PG in the NBA, but this year I felt Parker had a little better of a season when you put everything together. Westbrook also had a solid season receiving an honorable mention.




2014

http://www.sidelinepass.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/130103110756-chris-paul-clippers-single-image-cut.jpg

Chris Paul


Runner-Up: T.Parker

Honorable Mention(s): S.Curry



After arguably being snubbed last season, Chris Paul bounced back this season and won his 4th career PG of the year. The battle between Parker was similar. Like last year Paul was All-NBA 1st and Parker All-NBA 2nd. This year both went a series farther, Paul made it to the 2nd round while Parker won the NBA championship. However I still gave CP3 the edge, because this time their regular season statistics were not close and Chris Paul was clearly ahead of Parker after the regular season, while last year they were sort of comparable. After Parker and Paul Curry received an honorable mention. He was All-NBA 2nd and had a very solid individual season.



2015

http://photo2.ask.fm/920/071/184/-249996991-1t0mf6j-196segi6kg6ho0p/preview/file.jpg

Stephen Curry


Runner-Up: C.Paul

Honorable Mention(s):


Stephen Curry completed one of the greatest seasons ever by a PG easily taking home the PG of the year honors. He was named the NBA MVP and won a championship this year. There was really no debatable at all which PG had the best season. Chris Paul, last year’s winner, had a similar year from the season before and was good enough to receive runner-up honors. This is just Curry’s 1st time receiving this honor, the last MVP PG was Rose and he never won the PG of the year award again.

[Gifted Mind]

I did this initially out of a suggestion from a fellow poster. All in all it was a lot of fun doing this project. It was a lot of work, took months to complete. But it gave me a much better perspective amongst having examined the position closely in each year of the history of the game. I feel better equipped for those various "Top ___ PGs of All-Time" lists. Maybe sometime I will make my 1st cross-time thread rather than going year-by-year. We'll see.

In the meantime if you have any other ideas, suggestions, comments, questions, or criticisms, feel free to leave them.

[Gotterdammerung]

Looking forward to your posts above, but can you really designate anyone as a point guard before that specific position was created and isolated from the other guard position? In other words, how far back are you going with that analysis, if the concept is more of a retrospective or retrojection of later notions?

Sure, there were ball-dominant guards who carried the rock across halfcourt and got their teams in offensive sets, but that doesn't mean they were the point guards if there wasn't a consistent position league-wise.
:confusedshrug:

[Gifted Mind]

Looking forward to your posts above, but can you really designate anyone as a point guard before that specific position was created and isolated from the other guard position? In other words, how far back are you going with that analysis, if the concept is more of a retrospective or retrojection of later notions?

Sure, there were ball-dominant guards who carried the rock across halfcourt and got their teams in offensive sets, but that doesn't mean they were the point guards if there wasn't a consistent position league-wise.
:confusedshrug:


I left a quick note in relation to this in my OP:


With all that said, a few more notes. Obviously there will be debate "was this player a PG". I am choosing to ignore those debates and go with the general consensus for which position a player is considered for their entire career. I don't want to divert this thread from its actual purpose and turn this into a positional debate. Thus, in the best PG year-by-year, only players that are considered PGs general consensus will be considered. Same for the best season. However, I will call out the "actual PG of the year". It seems a bit odd to not give the "PG of the year" award to a player who played PG all season and had the best season. So it will be called out, but again the season series is still really considering players that are considered PGs.

In general, I know this is a gray area for such an analysis and I have gone back and forth with myself many times on how to handle this issue. I have decided to go with the general consensus position of a player for their entire career. This was the simplest solution but the main reason I took it is because I don't want this thread to turn into a positional debate. Thus, in the best PG analysis, only players who are considered PGs career-wise will be considered and same for the best season analysis.

Even though I may have taken the simplest solution for this topic and used the general consensus position, that does not mean I did not do my research to figure out which player played more PG vs. SG (using the modern definition) all the way back from 1950. I know there are players who clearly played PG for a given season yet are not even going to be considered in this thread. That is a consequence I am willing to live with. I have made one exception and that is to reward such players by calling out the "Actual PG of the Year" in the best season analysis. The reason being, I felt the player who played PG for a given season should be rewarded in some manner.

But ultimately the main reason I chose to use the general consensus career position rather than their actual position in a given season, is at the end of this and future analysis (SGs, SFs, etc.) I want to get a good idea of how the games greatest so-classified PGs compare against each other. Like in an All-Time ranking. If we mixed say SGs into the PG analysis, not only will we be mixing them here, but later those same SGs won't be present in the SG analysis thread. This is a situation I wanted to avoid.

If anyone wants I can add "Actual Best PG" to this thread similar to the way there is the "Actual PG of the Year" (calling out the best PG who actually played PG for a given season rather than using their career designation). Again, I have already gone through and identified such players. The reason I only decided to do "Actual PG of the Year" because it would seem odd if such an award existed not to give it to the player who had the best season at PG just because their career classification was something else.

[IceMan2]

Looking forward to seeing this

[JtotheIzzo]

better see lots of Nash in the aughts.

[Gifted Mind]

Thread will be updated tomorrow morning.

[Gotterdammerung]

In general, I know this is a gray area for such an analysis and I have gone back and forth with myself many times on how to handle this issue. I have decided to go with the general consensus position of a player for their entire career. This was the simplest solution but the main reason I took it is because I don't want this thread to turn into a positional debate. Thus, in the best PG analysis, only players who are considered PGs career-wise will be considered and same for the best season analysis.
I understand that you don't want to get into positional debates, but I fear that this list will be little more than an exercise in anachronism, unless you clear up what exactly you mean by "general consensus position."

Whose consensus? The player in question's peers, those who played with him? Sportswriters, basketball historians? Fans? ISH authorities? :confusedshrug:

If you determine "general consensus position" by the player's peers or the experts of the day, then you can't go further back than the 70s. If it's modern-day fans or ISH authorities, then I have nothing further, your honor. :cheers:

[Gifted Mind]

I understand that you don't want to get into positional debates, but I fear that this list will be little more than an exercise in anachronism, unless you clear up what exactly you mean by "general consensus position."

Whose consensus? The player in question's peers, those who played with him? Sportswriters, basketball historians? Fans? ISH authorities? :confusedshrug:

If you determine "general consensus position" by the player's peers or the experts of the day, then you can't go further back than the 70s. If it's modern-day fans or ISH authorities, then I have nothing further, your honor. :cheers:
I guess I am referring to basketball historians. Most these "All-Time" lists you see have a general pattern for which player is considered what position. I am going to follow that general consensus. Again, main reason being I don't want this thread to turn into a positional debate.

[Gifted Mind]

Thread officially updated

[LAZERUSS]

1970s


http://s14.postimg.org/q8tnv0c29/1970_974.jpg
http://s16.postimg.org/vfyhd3th1/1975_1979.jpg





1970: W.Frazier


2. O.Robertson

3. L.Wilkens



The 1970s start with Walt Frazier at the top for PGs. This ends Robertson’s long 9 year run as the best PG in the NBA. Frazier was a great scorer and playmaker for the Knicks along with being an absolute defensive force. To this point he was the best defensive PG in the history of the NBA. After Frazier came the familiar Robertson remaining a Top 3 PG. The last spot was once again between Bing and Wilkens, and I gave the edge to Wilkens again as his leadership and playmaking skills were more important to helping a team succeed than Bing’s great scoring ability.









1971: W.Frazier


2. O.Robertson

3. D.Bing




Walt Frazier remained the top PG for back to back seasons. He was still young and therefore going to be in this discussion every year now. Part of what made him so special was he could impact the game in so many ways since he was a game changer on defense as well. Robertson remained the 2nd best PG, even at 32 he was actually still very effective guiding the Bucks to become the top offense. Bing took the 3rd spot this year playing better than ever especially on the scoring end.





http://www.alphahacks.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Walt-Frazier-236x300.jpg






1972: W. Frazier

2. T.Archibald

3. O.Robertson



4.2 - 4.0 - 3.3


Walt Frazier was the top PG for the 3rd straight year. He remained great at what he did and that was not going to change anytime soon. He was given some competition this year by Archibald, a rising star in the NBA able to score at will and was also a great passer. Tiny was arguably a better scorer and passer at this point but Frazier had a significant defensive edge. Robertson was getting older every year but remained a Top 3 PG for another season.






1973: T.Archibald


2. W.Frazier

3. L.Wilkens



The battle raged between Archibald and Frazier for the top PG spot. They were really neck to neck again, Archibald being the more impressive scorer and playmaker while Frazier had the huge defensive advantage. This year Tiny Archibald was just too amazing to ignore, he was unstoppable at scoring leading the league in points and continued to amaze passing wise leading the league in assists. He also had great stamina night in night out playing nearly 46mpg and just no PG has looked this good on offense since a prime Robertson. Frazier though secured the 2nd spot. Wilkens was a Top 3 PG again, he really has shown some spectacular longevity still playing at a high level at age 35. His basketball IQ was just very high and he could still score well and was still one of the best playmakers in the game.






1974: W. Frazier

2. C.Murphy

3. D.Bing




With Archibald battling injuries, West and Robertson practically gone, Frazier had no competition and was the best PG in 1974. He continued to play at a steady high level and this actually was one of the easiest years to select the Top PG. After Frazier it got tough, Murphy, Bing, and Norm had arguments. Murphy was the best scorer at this point out of the 3 and had solid handling and playmaking skills, while Bing still was a solid PG even now. Van Lier was a defensive stud but his lack of offensive threat left him behind Murphy and Bing. Jo Jo White was nearly good as Bing but just lacking a little.






1975: W. Frazier


2. T.Archibald

3. J.White




Walt Frazier remained the best PG in 1975. He was still one of the most feared scorers at PG and still played terrific defense. The Knicks had gotten worse progressively, but Frazier was still playing at a high level with only minimal dropping. After Frazier it was familiar Tiny Archibald who was once again healthy and producing. He remained a force on offense. The last spot was once again between Bing, Murphy, and Jo Jo. They were all very close but I gave Jo Jo White the edge, he was more capable of stepping his game up in the postseason, which he has done numerous points upto now.








1976: T.Archibald


2. J.White

3. W.Frazier



Tiny Archibald was once again the Top PG in the game. He played at a similar dominant level as last year and Clyde slipped battling injuries and just getting older. After Archibald it was Jo Jo White, who was once again solid in the regular season and stepped up in the playoffs. He played his best in the finals and was named Finals MVP. Frazier remained a Top 3 PG in the NBA despite having slown down and battling injuries. He still was solid all-around and too good to leave out. Calvin Murphy just missed the cut for Top 3.






1977: J.White


2. W.Frazier

3. C.Murphy



The competition for Top PG was as weak as it has been in a while and Jo Jo White was able to steal some of the spotlight. He was once again solid this season with his score-1st approach and once again stepped up his game in the NBA playoffs. After White comes Frazier, who was a little out of his prime but still good enough for Top 3 when healthy in this era. Murphy comes in 3rd, he remained a consistent scoring threat but was maybe too small to dominate. Overall the 70s has not been as PG dominated as the past decade was by the Big O.





1978: C.Murphy


2. K.Porter

3. D.Buse




After a few Top 3 selections Calvin Murphy was finally the best PG in the NBA in 1978. He was finally given the freedom to do what he wanted in Houston this season and he showed the NBA he could be one of the best scorers when he wanted to be. He actually played SG this year but is still considered a PG overall thus got the best PG title this season. After him was Kevin Porter, who was probably the best passer in the NBA at this point and could do a decent job scoring. Lastly we had Don Buse. The best defensive PG today and similar to KC Jones from the 60s. This was arguably the least competitive year for PGs in the NBA historically.








1979: D.Johnson

2. G.Williams

3. N.Nixon






The NBA got a little more competitive again in 1979 with rising PG stars such as DJ, Gus Williams, Norm Nixon, and Phil Ford. All these players were non-factors the year before but became more than relevant in 1979. It was also very close to call who the best PG in the NBA was in 1979. DJ, Gus, and Norm were the top 3, but all were about equal. I gave Dennis Johnson the edge as general consensus in 79 said he was the best player out of the 3. He was hadn’t developed his playmaking abilities yet, but was a great scorer and arguably the best defensive player in the game. After Johnson was his teammate Gus Williams. He was probably the best scoring PG in the game right now but also hadn’t developed his playmaking abilities yet. Norm Nixon came 3rd, he was a great passer and could score as well but he wasn’t as good on defense or explosive as DJ or Gus.

Jerry West led the NBA in assists in 71-72, ad Gail Goodrich was their "SG.".

[Gifted Mind]

Jerry West led the NBA in assists in 71-72, ad Gail Goodrich was their "SG.".

I know this as a fact. Please read me OP on PG positions. I gave West the 1972 PG of the year under best seasons.

In general, especially the best PG section, is meant to be which PG (as determined by career general consensus) was the best not which player was the best playing the PG position for a given year. So yes, this thread is focused around players classified as PGs. The best amongst them are chosen here.

[Duggrr]

Holy balls dude, nice work. Would you ever consider doing one of these for another position? Maybe SG or PF

[Gifted Mind]

Holy balls dude, nice work. Would you ever consider doing one of these for another position? Maybe SG or PF

Sure...someday. I had been requested to do such a thread for point guards. The other position I had been requested to do next was centers. You will probably see that next...someday.

[L.A. Jazz]

1) so Magic came in the NBA and was the best PG from the start? i didnt know this.

2) it seems so long ago when D.Will was really good and played CP3 better than anyone. in 2010 i was sure D.Will will be the better player careerwise.
:(


EDit: i forgot to thank you for your work. great thread.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Great work :applause:

Some thoughts (didn't read til the end yet though)

-You're giving a bit too much credit to Tiny, he was playing on losing teams where the coach let him do everything, call it inflated stats or something and even he said the same... Not that it's not simply amazing what he was doing, even playing all those big minutes, especially when he led the league in points and assists, incredible.

-You can say West was the Lakers' PG in the early 70's.

-You're selling Gus Williams short in some of those years, overall he was probably the best PG in the 80's after Magic and Isiah. DJ was (more of) a SG at 1st, only started to play more at PG with Phoenix and then full-time with the Celtics after 1984. Even when he played with Gus, you can't call them both PG's... If anything Gus was the PG and Dennis the SG, so 1979 should've been Gus.

-Fat Lever should be top3 in 1987 imho.

[Gifted Mind]

Great work :applause:


-You're giving a bit too much credit to Tiny, he was playing on losing teams where the coach let him do everything, call it inflated stats or something and even he said the same... Not that it's not simply amazing what he was doing, even playing all those big minutes, especially when he led the league in points and assists, incredible.

I agree Tiny's stats are a bit inflated. There is no doubt. But which year in particular do you disagree with? I had him as the best PG in the NBA in 1973 and 1976. 76 was the year he led the league in points and assists. Even if you move past the stats, you will have to admit Tiny had the exceptional ability to score and pass. He was easily ahead of Frazier in both of those skills, which are the two most important for a PG to have. The ball domination got him a lot of assists, but he also did have inherent playmaking ability. He showed that later in his career as well in Boston being a primary playmaker averaging over 8apg multiple seasons without dominating the ball. He was also very tough to stop from scoring. He could hit the mid-range jumpshot but really excelled at getting to the hoop and averaged nearly 10 FT attempts per game. I still think it's rather close between him and Frazier that season, but what Archibald's advantages in scoring and playmaking while playing 46mpg were too much to overcome. Walt Frazier was my pick for PG of the year in 1973 though.

Much of his prime he was injured but 1973 he played 80 games. In 1976 he was also able to stay relatively healthy, and with Frazier falling off a bit he was my pick again for best PG.


-You can say West was the Lakers' PG in the early 70's.


I agree along with some years in the 60s. But as I mentioned in the 3rd paragraph of my OP, this thread is only for PGs (career position general consensus). Thus, each year was picked amongst the best PGs rather than best player who played PG. Nonetheless, I gave Jerry West and other players who played PG but were generally considered another position acknowledgement in the Best Season section with the "Actual PG of the Year" recognition.



-You're selling Gus Williams short in some of those years, overall he was probably the best PG in the 80's after Magic and Isiah. DJ was (more of) a SG at 1st, only started to play more at PG with Phoenix and then full-time with the Celtics after 1984. Even when he played with Gus, you can't call them both PG's... If anything Gus was the PG and Dennis the SG, so 1979 should've been Gus.


Once again you are spot-on that Dennis Johnson was the SG in Seattle while Gus was more of the PG. But again, DJ is still considered a PG for his career and thus is eligible to become the best PG in every year in this thread. I did give Gus Williams the 1979 "Actual" PG of the year recognition because even though DJ may have had a better overall season (winning Finals MVP), it was Gus Williams who actually played PG for the Sonics.

To me Gus Williams was an underrated player. He was always a good scorer, improved his passing ability as time went on to become strong there, and was an underrated defender. He also stepped up his game come playoff time through the course of his career. I had him Top 3 PG in 1979, in 1981 he did not play at all, and I also had him as a Top 3 PG from 1982-1984. He was a stud in that stretch. Taking that season off actually may have helped him as he came back as a stronger passer than ever before surpassing DJ and Michardson for me (in 1980 I gave DJ and MRR the edge, after that it was all Gus).



-Fat Lever should be top3 in 1987 imho.

He was close, but Cheeks was another player I felt is underrated. In terms of needing to win, it doesn't get better than an efficient scorer and excellent passer who plays phenomenal defense at the PG position. Lever was a solid player who came close. I think Cheeks was a better pure passer and defender. While Lever could score better, I think Cheek's efficiency makes it closer. Ultimately, the type of PG Cheeks was the one I would want on my team.

[nathanjizzle]

explain how you think chris paul was better than d rose in 2011. and dont say "rose isnt a true pg"

[ArbitraryWater]

Paul wasn't the best PG in 2012 and 2013... that's just going with the general opinion and reputation to avoid any questions...
Especially Parker in 2013

[ArbitraryWater]

explain how you think chris paul was better than d rose in 2011. and dont say "rose isnt a true pg"

Paul showed a lot of his greatness in the playoffs... played as perfect as a PG could and had 2 masterful games to beat the Lakers virtually by himself.

33/7/14 on 61% with elite D in stunning Game 1 Win @ LA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVosM5foJxs

27/13/15 on 50% with elite D in Game 4 Win to tie the series

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xWqdhAumXI

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[Pointguard]

explain how you think chris paul was better than d rose in 2011. and dont say "rose isnt a true pg"
It has to be peer pressure of these boards. Paul still doesn't know how to control the pace of a game til this day. He over controls the game and alienates should be superstars on his team. We all didn't see how his absence got Blake back to his superstar ways after being hidden for two and a half years. His leadership is crap. He panics and, unfortunately, usually he always looks better than his team. OP has him as the best PG for six years without his teams doing much at all. What maybe one run where his team overachieved. And because he looked healthier he was better than the MVP? Really?

Paul definitely wasn't healthy enough to play hard every game til the end like Rose. Flip 20 games in the fourth quarter. Didn't take games off or wonder what's he doing? Sorry, healthier doesn't make you a better point guard.

What does Westbrook have to do? Totally destroy CP in a playoff series for people to see the distance between them. When Westbrook wanted to score he just did a layup. No moves, fakes or anything. CP3 wasn't an obstacle. You have to let your obvious favoritism go sometimes. CP4 has a lot of great PG qualities, maybe as many as any outside of Magic. But he clearly wasn't the best PG in those years.

[SHAQisGOAT]

I agree Tiny's stats are a bit inflated. There is no doubt. But which year in particular do you disagree with? I had him as the best PG in the NBA in 1973 and 1976. 76 was the year he led the league in points and assists. Even if you move past the stats, you will have to admit Tiny had the exceptional ability to score and pass. He was easily ahead of Frazier in both of those skills, which are the two most important for a PG to have. The ball domination got him a lot of assists, but he also did have inherent playmaking ability. He showed that later in his career as well in Boston being a primary playmaker averaging over 8apg multiple seasons without dominating the ball. He was also very tough to stop from scoring. He could hit the mid-range jumpshot but really excelled at getting to the hoop and averaged nearly 10 FT attempts per game. I still think it's rather close between him and Frazier that season, but what Archibald's advantages in scoring and playmaking while playing 46mpg were too much to overcome. Walt Frazier was my pick for PG of the year in 1973 though.

Much of his prime he was injured but 1973 he played 80 games. In 1976 he was also able to stay relatively healthy, and with Frazier falling off a bit he was my pick again for best PG.

Yea, he was playing for losing teams and doing what he wanted too, still very impressive nontheless. Looking at what the competition was doing, in those years, you're probably right about the rankings. 73 was the year he led the league in points and assists (not 76) but he didn't even make the post-season, for example, while Frazier had a great playoff run and was champion...
I don't know about the passing-game between him and Frazier, Tiny was a dude that overhandle the ball a lot, while Clyde played primarly in a team-first system where the ball was always moving and everybody got their touches, as far as pure passing I'd call it wash probably. As far as scoring, Tiny had the handles and was quick like crazy, great penatrator/finisher and before injuries taking the lift out of his jumpshot he could kill teams with shooting... He was sorta like AI of the 70s.
Yea Archibald was still a solid asset in his Boston days, despite being a shell of his former-self still managed to do it even after one ruptured achilles and a tore one. Even then he was still overhandling a lot though.





I agree along with some years in the 60s. But as I mentioned in the 3rd paragraph of my OP, this thread is only for PGs (career position general consensus). Thus, each year was picked amongst the best PGs rather than best player who played PG. Nonetheless, I gave Jerry West and other players who played PG but were generally considered another position acknowledgement in the Best Season section with the "Actual PG of the Year" recognition.

Oh, ok.


Once again you are spot-on that Dennis Johnson was the SG in Seattle while Gus was more of the PG. But again, DJ is still considered a PG for his career and thus is eligible to become the best PG in every year in this thread. I did give Gus Williams the 1979 "Actual" PG of the year recognition because even though DJ may have had a better overall season (winning Finals MVP), it was Gus Williams who actually played PG for the Sonics.


To me Gus Williams was an underrated player. He was always a good scorer, improved his passing ability as time went on to become strong there, and was an underrated defender. He also stepped up his game come playoff time through the course of his career. I had him Top 3 PG in 1979, in 1981 he did not play at all, and I also had him as a Top 3 PG from 1982-1984. He was a stud in that stretch. Taking that season off actually may have helped him as he came back as a stronger passer than ever before surpassing DJ and Michardson for me (in 1980 I gave DJ and MRR the edge, after that it was all Gus).

I don't know if I'd consider DJ a PG for his career, he only became a full-time PG and playing more as one since 1985 or so. He spent his early prime as a SG, then at his peak was like a combo guard but still more of a SG.
Yea Gus is very overlooked, like I've said he's probably the greatest PG of the 80s, overall, after Magic and Zeke. He was really fast and could score in different ways, master with the floaters, really good scorer, also a nice passer, good at playing the passing lanes on defense. We can't forget that Gus was by far the best scorer in the 1979 Finals, with 29 ppg on 49% FG, DJ "only" got FMVP because of his all-around game (played terrific defense while averaging 23/6/6, big minutes too) and clutchness.




He was close, but Cheeks was another player I felt is underrated. In terms of needing to win, it doesn't get better than an efficient scorer and excellent passer who plays phenomenal defense at the PG position. Lever was a solid player who came close. I think Cheeks was a better pure passer and defender. While Lever could score better, I think Cheek's efficiency makes it closer. Ultimately, the type of PG Cheeks was the one I would want on my team.

Cheeks is a very underrated player yea, always loved him as player. I just think that in 1987, Lever (also very underrated) should be above him.




.....

[joeyjoejoe]

Paul wasn't the best PG in 2012 and 2013... that's just going with the general opinion and reputation to avoid any questions...
Especially Parker in 2013

Paul was a beast in 11/12 hit multiple game winners some over great defenders iggy sef/lbaka and can't remember the other one but could find out, had great stats went further in playoffs then most had them going, no one thought they'd top memphis that year

Edit: the other game winner was vs Portland layup over hickson

[ZaaaaaH]

Great job :applause:

But where is LeBron?

[Meticode]

Great job :applause:

But where is LeBron?
He can play the point guard position, but that's not his position.

[Gifted Mind]

Yea, he was playing for losing teams and doing what he wanted too, still very impressive nontheless. Looking at what the competition was doing, in those years, you're probably right about the rankings. 73 was the year he led the league in points and assists (not 76) but he didn't even make the post-season, for example, while Frazier had a great playoff run and was champion...
I don't know about the passing-game between him and Frazier, Tiny was a dude that overhandle the ball a lot, while Clyde played primarly in a team-first system where the ball was always moving and everybody got their touches, as far as pure passing I'd call it wash probably. As far as scoring, Tiny had the handles and was quick like crazy, great penatrator/finisher and before injuries taking the lift out of his jumpshot he could kill teams with shooting... He was sorta like AI of the 70s.
Yea Archibald was still a solid asset in his Boston days, despite being a shell of his former-self still managed to do it even after one ruptured achilles and a tore one. Even then he was still overhandling a lot though.


I agree with most of your views here. I do think Archibald was a better pure passer, even without his athleticism he was able to be a very effective passer. But you are right Frazier played in a more team orientated offense most of his career, nonetheless Tiny was stuck with not so great teammates most of his career. Overall I agree Archibald did dominate the ball too much and struggled to get his teammates involved. Even in years he was healthy (1972) I put Frazier over him. And in 1973 Tiny had his magical season but Frazier was still my pick for PG of the year. 1975 Archibald made playoffs but I still had Frazier as the better PG. Only in 1976 when Frazier had declined had Archibald surpassed him in my eyes. So I suppose even you would agree the rankings are fair season by season and I am not over crediting Archibald.



I don't know if I'd consider DJ a PG for his career, he only became a full-time PG and playing more as one since 1985 or so. He spent his early prime as a SG, then at his peak was like a combo guard but still more of a SG.
Yea Gus is very overlooked, like I've said he's probably the greatest PG of the 80s, overall, after Magic and Zeke. He was really fast and could score in different ways, master with the floaters, really good scorer, also a nice passer, good at playing the passing lanes on defense. We can't forget that Gus was by far the best scorer in the 1979 Finals, with 29 ppg on 49% FG, DJ "only" got FMVP because of his all-around game (played terrific defense while averaging 23/6/6, big minutes too) and clutchness.


It's not really about what I think or actuality, it's about the general consensus among NBA historians. As you will see most have Dennis Johnson amongst their All-Time best PG lists rather than SG, based exclusively on that Johnson is a PG in this thread. Yes Gus Williams is underrated for sure. He was always a dangerous scorer but by 1982 he was a dual threat. For a modern-day comparison he was as good or better than Deron Williams in Utah (who was the best PG in 2010 in my eyes). It's actually unfortunate for Gus his peak came at the same time Magic and Isiah were playing.



Cheeks is a very underrated player yea, always loved him as player. I just think that in 1987, Lever (also very underrated) should be above him.


Yes Lever was also underrated. One of the rare all-around PGs. But yes just Cheeks superior abilities playmaking and stingy defense gave him the edge for me.

[SHAQisGOAT]

I agree with most of your views here. I do think Archibald was a better pure passer, even without his athleticism he was able to be a very effective passer. But you are right Frazier played in a more team orientated offense most of his career, nonetheless Tiny was stuck with not so great teammates most of his career. Overall I agree Archibald did dominate the ball too much and struggled to get his teammates involved. Even in years he was healthy (1972) I put Frazier over him. And in 1973 Tiny had his magical season but Frazier was still my pick for PG of the year. 1975 Archibald made playoffs but I still had Frazier as the better PG. Only in 1976 when Frazier had declined had Archibald surpassed him in my eyes. So I suppose even you would agree the rankings are fair season by season and I am not over crediting Archibald.


Yea, like I've said, looking at his competition in those certain years I guess I probably agree with your rankings.
That's a fair point but I'd probably call it a wash in terms of pure passing, maybe a slight edge to Tiny. Scoring-wise I'd give it to Archibald even though Frazier could fill it up but at their best, overall, I'd definitely go with Frazier who was also a much better defender, better floor general and even rebounder.






It's not really about what I think or actuality, it's about the general consensus among NBA historians. As you will see most have Dennis Johnson amongst their All-Time best PG lists rather than SG, based exclusively on that Johnson is a PG in this thread. Yes Gus Williams is underrated for sure. He was always a dangerous scorer but by 1982 he was a dual threat. For a modern-day comparison he was as good or better than Deron Williams in Utah (who was the best PG in 2010 in my eyes). It's actually unfortunate for Gus his peak came at the same time Magic and Isiah were playing.


I don't know if that's the general consensus but whatever.
Looking at today's players, at their best, Tony Parker is most likely the best comparison (to Gus Williams, back in the day)... Lots of similarities in their games.
Yea, Gus is really overlooked these days.





Yes Lever was also underrated. One of the rare all-around PGs. But yes just Cheeks superior abilities playmaking and stingy defense gave him the edge for me.

At their very best, it's really hard to pick one tbh... Lever was miles ahead as a rebounder, and he was also a better scorer even though MO could also score (and efficiently); Cheeks was the better defensive player, passer and floor general but Fat could also play defense and pass. Lever also a bit taller but Maurice a bit more overall athletic and overall intangibles I'd give it to Cheeks also.

[Pointguard]

:cheers:
On the Rose change.

[ZaaaaaH]

He can play the point guard position, but that's not his position.

So Magic is a PG but LeBron who brings up the ball and dominates the ball just as much is not?


LBJ is a PG some years for sure.

[russwest0]

westbrook missed time this year (as did Paul, from his own flop nonetheless) but do you not account for playoffs here?

you are overrating chris paul wayy too much

[houston]

interesting thread

[joeyjoejoe]

westbrook missed time this year (as did Paul, from his own flop nonetheless) but do you not account for playoffs here?

you are overrating chris paul wayy too much

the second list includes playoffs and paul had a decent run this year, wbrook outplayed parker every game in wcf but only outplayed paul twice with Paul getting the better of wbrook twice and the other cpl games being about even, just because your team wins doesn't mean you outplayed your cover or one could say parker played better then wbrook which clearly wasn't the case.

Great read op, I do think rose should be #1 on both lists for 10/11

[Gifted Mind]

explain how you think chris paul was better than d rose in 2011. and dont say "rose isnt a true pg"

Derrick Rose was an impressive PG. He was one of the best scorers we've seen at the PG position. Overall a tremendous player who made great impact on the floor. However, Chris Paul was literally better at everything else. He was a much superior passer, better defender, had more intangibles, and for what its worth rebounded the ball better as well. The Chicago Bulls also completely relied on Rose on offense, similar to the Hornets used to do with Chris Paul. So both played under favorable systems. I just think CP3's greater ability to create for his team and far better defense while still having the ability to take over a game with his scoring was more valuable than Rose's stop me if you can approach.

It was still very close as Chris Paul still wasn't completely himself prior to the surgery (though he looked like it come playoff time) and Rose was once again amazing (being the 2nd best PG in 2011 is no small feat). I did give Rose the PG of the year in 2011.




[QUOTE=GiftedMind]
2011

http://static.tendenarium.com/im/245000/244603.jpg

Derrick Rose

Runner-Up: R.Westbrook

Honorable Mention(s): R.Rondo, C.Paul, T.Parker


Derrick Rose wins his 1st PG of the year award in 2011. He also won MVP this year, joining Cousy, Robertson, Magic, and Nash as the only PGs to ever win this honor. Thus it

[Gifted Mind]

Paul wasn't the best PG in 2012 and 2013... that's just going with the general opinion and reputation to avoid any questions...
Especially Parker in 2013

I don't think so. Was Tony Parker better this season also? Or did CP3 just happen to get better at age 28 and Parker decline. Parker may have had a better season in 2013 (I would agree with that), however players don't get better or worse so easily, their surroundings and season does.

[ZaaaaaH]

Where is LeBron?

[Gifted Mind]

Where is LeBron?
At 1st I wasn't sure if you were serious, but please read the 3rd paragraph of my OP. In short, this thread is for PGs only. It doesn't even matter if you played PG for a given season, if your career position general consensus is a different position (I think we can agree LeBron is a SF), then his name will not be present in this thread.

This thread is really meant to be a comparison amongst the PGs from the history of this game.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Bball reference has Magic listed as a SG for 80-83 :oldlol:

[tmacattack33]

I'd say that Anfernee Hardaway was not only the "best" PG in 1995 and 1996, but also the "greatest".

His success was not due to just his team. He was great individually. And in 1996, when Shaq was out, he lead a pretty mediocre squad to a 20-5 record.

[Gifted Mind]

westbrook missed time this year (as did Paul, from his own flop nonetheless) but do you not account for playoffs here?

you are overrating chris paul wayy too much

Of course playoffs are taken into account. Chris Paul did miss some time this year (20 games), but Russell Westbrook missed nearly half the season (36 games). If healthy Westbrook would have been a Top 2 PG. But I thought he just missed too many games and would probably have finished 4th or 5th for 2014. I don't think it would be justifiable to take Westbrook for 46 games over even John Wall for 80 games, often that much missed time is the difference between even making playoffs for teams and missing them.

[Pointguard]

Derrick Rose was an impressive PG. He was one of the best scorers we've seen at the PG position. Overall a tremendous player who made great impact on the floor. However, Chris Paul was literally better at everything else. He was a much superior passer, better defender, had more intangibles, and for what its worth rebounded the ball better as well. The Chicago Bulls also completely relied on Rose on offense, similar to the Hornets used to do with Chris Paul. So both played under favorable systems. I just think CP3's greater ability to create for his team and far better defense while still having the ability to take over a game with his scoring was more valuable than Rose's stop me if you can approach.

It was still very close as Chris Paul still wasn't completely himself prior to the surgery (though he looked like it come playoff time) and Rose was once again amazing (being the 2nd best PG in 2011 is no small feat). I did give Rose the PG of the year in 2011.

You missed a lot of the point guard's main responsibilities:
Keeping the team on the same page,
leadership,
control of the game and pace,
getting the most out of his team,
being the engine of the team,
knowing how to compensate when players don't play,
rally the troops,
take over the game if he has to,
penetrate and cause chaos,
get to the rim,
secure the win,
And staying on the attack - being aggressive.

That means far more than being a better passer and rebounder. I notice you said some intangibles - without staying aggressive, which Paul has always had trouble sustaining, the intangibles don't mean much.

When Chris Paul is fully healthy Rose is better than him in most of those categories, and in 2011 Rose was doing better than 90% without a doubt. That should be a great team in Clipperland. And it should have been great the year before that.

Blake should have been a top three player the previous year, nevermind this year. When Chris Paul couldn't play guess who came out of their shell? DJ had a lot of promise before Chris got there. The sixth man of the year provided great shooting and super clutch shooting. Barnes and Reddick hitting threes. Collison as solid backup. That team is a PG's dream. Solid defensive players in DJ, Barnes and Collison.

Rose took a much younger, inexperienced team, much less talented team to the best record in the league and the conference finals. Paul's not doing that, has never done that. And the Bulls dominated the elite in the West that year. Rose handed OKC, Mavs and SA their heads when they really needed those games for playoff positioning.

Oh and you did mentioned Paul had better defense which is simply not true. Rose held all of the elite PG's in check. His team also had the best perimeter defense. Rose also held a healthy Wade as good as I ever seen anybody guard him ever. Different if Paul had something similar on his resume in his nine or ten year career but he doesn't. Paul was a more consistent defensive player over most of his career and got a lot of steals. The defensive scheme of Chicago was to close out on shooters and keep them out of the paint. Not one elite guard had a great game on Rose. Even Lebron and Dwight Howard did not fair as good as Rose in playing the elite at their position, despite there being two or three scoring centers!

[SexSymbol]

It's a huge travesty to have Chris Paul above Tony Parker in the last three years at least.

[joeyjoejoe]

All the pg fans of Parker, westbrook and rose hating on Paul lol, atleast rondo and dwill fans are humble, im surprised rose still has fans

[Young X]

CP3 has been the best PG since '08. Only years it's been debatable were '10 and '11 because he was injured. No other PG has the all around package that he has.

[Legends66NBA7]

CP3 has been the best PG since '08. Only years it's been debatable were '10 and '11 because he was injured. No other PG has the all around package that he has.

Not saying he does it at the level Chris Paul, but Lowry's the only one who comes to mind at PG with a similar all-around package.

Would you agree ?

[Young X]

Not saying he does it at the level Chris Paul, but Lowry's the only one who comes to mind at PG with a similar all-around package.

Would you agree ?Yup, him and Wall. Lowry performed better than Parker last season. IDGAF who disagrees.

[Graviton]

How was Westbrook not the best PG in 2014? Idk why regular season is so important when literally nobody tries hard, besides the guy trying to get MVP. Everyone just plays run n gun offense and lazy defense. Playoffs are when best players step up and pretenders get exposed, *cough* Harden, Curry.

And we saw what a beast Westbrook was basically winning games on his own, with some amazing defensive plays and sheer will. The way he single handedly took games off Spurs on their own home court was something else. Never seen Parker dominated so hard that makes Pop go to a random scrub Corey Joseph.

I have a lot of respect for Paul but I keep saying this isn't 2008, Westbrook is basically 2011 Rose with better defense, rebounding and mental strength.

I guess you can say Paul is the "better PG" but Westbrook is the best player at PG position and probably the best guard in the NBA. :confusedshrug:

[iamgine]

How was Westbrook not the best PG in 2014? Idk why regular season is so important when literally nobody tries hard, besides the guy trying to get MVP. Everyone just plays run n gun offense and lazy defense. Playoffs are when best players step up and pretenders get exposed, *cough* Harden, Curry.

And we saw what a beast Westbrook was basically winning games on his own, with some amazing defensive plays and sheer will. The way he single handedly took games off Spurs on their own home court was something else. Never seen Parker dominated so hard that makes Pop go to a random scrub Corey Joseph.

I have a lot of respect for Paul but I keep saying this isn't 2008, Westbrook is basically 2011 Rose with better defense, rebounding and mental strength.

I guess you can say Paul is the "better PG" but Westbrook is the best player at PG position and probably the best guard in the NBA. :confusedshrug:
Westbrook can be a beast sometimes, but a lot of times he's pretty bad. Both offensively and defensively.

Shooting 38% in the Memphis series and 41% in the SAS series.

Plus he missed a chunk of the regular season.

CP's just much more consistent overall.

[Graviton]

Westbrook can be a beast sometimes, but a lot of times he's pretty bad. Both offensively and defensively.

Shooting 38% in the Memphis series and 41% in the SAS series.

Plus he missed a chunk of the regular season.

CP's just much more consistent overall.
Both Durant and Westbrook played like shit vs Memphis but picked it up as the series went on, that's what great players do. W But why exactly are you only bringing up FG%? Why not use something that takes into account everything like this...

http://i60.tinypic.com/2lavt6u.jpg


Even the stat geeks can't deny it no more, Westbrook was the 2nd best player in the playoffs behind Lebron. But that wasn't even that impressive, just watching the games you could see him pushing his team to wins and doing everything on the court. Even when he shoots like shit he still plays elite defense, rebounds like a big man and sets his teammates up. Russ is a walking triple double threat and a matchup nightmare for any PG. And he is always aggressive, which is Paul's biggest issue.

Consistency is irrelevant if you choke games away and play passive in the 4th quarters and just lose. That's what the box score can't measure.

[Gifted Mind]

I'd say that Anfernee Hardaway was not only the "best" PG in 1995 and 1996, but also the "greatest".

His success was not due to just his team. He was great individually. And in 1996, when Shaq was out, he lead a pretty mediocre squad to a 20-5 record.
Anfernee Hardaway is another forgotten PG, right in his 2nd and 3rd season in the NBA he was among the Top 3 PGs along with HOFs Stockton and Payton. It's just tragic injuries prevented him from having a HOF career. I had him below Gary Payton both of those years. The main reason being, they were comparable on offense, however, the defense difference was too great. Hardaway was not a bad defender, but Gary Payton was arguably the greatest defensive PG of all-time. That swayed the result in his favor.

As for seasons, Hardaway was my pick for PG of the year in 1995. In 1996 I felt Gary Payton had slightly a better season with a stronger playoff-run, though it was once again pretty close.

[iamgine]

Well PER is not the one all be all. It's close anyway. Scorers like Westbrook usually have higher PER than non scorers while not necessarily better performance. i.e Dennis Rodman always have low PER.

Consistency is always relevant. Westbrook is a great player and great competitor. No one denies that. He's just inconsistent with both offense and defense.

[ZaaaaaH]

Seriously Where is LeBron?

[Graviton]

Well PER is not the one all be all. It's close anyway. Scorers like Westbrook usually have higher PER than non scorers while not necessarily better performance. i.e Dennis Rodman always have low PER.

Consistency is always relevant. Westbrook is a great player and great competitor. No one denies that. He's just inconsistent with both offense and defense.
When was Westbrook inconsistent in the playoffs? He had a couple bad games but made an impact regardless, same as Paul. You can use any other meaningful stat you like, Westbrook was overall the 2nd best player in the playoffs. The consistency issues were back in 2011. Nowadays it's like 70% Goatbrook, 20% Westbrick, 10% Chuckbrook but always 100% effort. Paul has his own 70% CP3, 20% CP360 and 10% Ghost moments and his passive issues. Nobody is ever perfect.

Inconsistent are guys like Harden, Curry and Parker. Westbrook is the model of consistent effort because he always finds a way to make an impact regardless of his shooting success. Hence why him and Paul are a tier above the other PGs.

[iamgine]

When was Westbrook inconsistent in the playoffs? He had a couple bad games but made an impact regardless, same as Paul. You can use any other meaningful stat you like, Westbrook was overall the 2nd best player in the playoffs. The consistency issues were back in 2011. Nowadays it's like 70% Goatbrook, 20% Westbrick, 10% Chuckbrook but always 100% effort. Paul has his own 70% CP3, 20% CP360 and 10% Ghost moments and his passive issues. Nobody is ever perfect.

Inconsistent are guys like Harden, Curry and Parker. Westbrook is the model of consistent effort because he always finds a way to make an impact regardless of his shooting success. Hence why him and Paul are a tier above the other PGs.
Yes Westbrook has consistent effort. He's just inconsistent with his offense and defense, although he's improved compared to before. No one ever says any player's perfect.

Shooting 38% in the Memphis series and 41% in the SAS series makes him 2nd best player in the playoff? Why would that be the case? Why not Kevin Durant as 2nd best player?

[Graviton]

Yes Westbrook has consistent effort. He's just inconsistent with his offense and defense, although he's improved compared to before. No one ever says any player's perfect.

Shooting 38% in the Memphis series and 41% in the SAS series makes him 2nd best player in the playoff? Why would that be the case? Why not Kevin Durant as 2nd best player?
Jesus, you only bring up FG%. No talk of TS%, eFG%, rebounding, scoring, actual impact from attacking the defense and getting free throws. Defensive plays. Only brings up the FG% and doesn't even talk about his best series vs the CLippers, what a joke. Your only line is "inconsistent defensively and offensively", no actual evidence or facts, or REAL examples either. :oldlol:

Sounds like you didn't watch the playoffs because everyone who did had Westbrook as the 2nd best playoff performer and all advanced stats support that. But keep using FG% only because that adds extra wins.

He averaged 27/8/7 on 54% TS and had 2nd highest PER in the playoffs for anyone who played 10+ games. But all that is irrelevant and he is inconsistent because he didn't shoot the exact FG% you wanted right? You are either blind, dumb or both.

[iamgine]

Jesus, you only bring up FG%. No talk of TS%, eFG%, rebounding, scoring, actual impact from attacking the defense and getting free throws. Defensive plays. Only brings up the FG% and doesn't even talk about his best series vs the CLippers, what a joke. Your only line is "inconsistent defensively and offensively", no actual evidence or facts, or REAL examples either. :oldlol:

Sounds like you didn't watch the playoffs because everyone who did had Westbrook as the 2nd best playoff performer and all advanced stats support that. But keep using FG% only because that adds extra wins.

He averaged 27/8/7 on 54% TS and had 2nd highest PER in the playoffs for anyone who played 10+ games. But all that is irrelevant and he is inconsistent because he didn't shoot the exact FG% you wanted right? You are either blind, dumb or both.
As I said, Westbrook is a great player. He plays great like a great player should. But he's not perfect. And he's inconsistent defensively and offensively.

If by "all advanced stats" you mean PER, then sure. But as I said, PER is not end all be all. It favors scorers more.

[Graviton]

As I said, Westbrook is a great player. He plays great like a great player should. But he's not perfect. And he's inconsistent defensively and offensively.

If by "all advanced stats" you mean PER, then sure. But as I said, PER is not end all be all. It favors scorers more.
You have said "inconsistent defensively and offensively" like 5 times already and still did not bring up any actual evidence. :oldlol:

PER is at least better than just FG%. And it favors players who do it all, not just scorers, hence why Westbrook's is higher than Durant's genius.

You can use raw stats, the FACTS are in the playoffs Westbrook was 4th in scoring, 3rd in assists. 2nd in steals, led PGs in rebounding, free throws and PER. He also won games with defensive plays and hustle alone, on top of 3 triple doubles when nobody else had any.

But yea he is "inconsistent offensively and defensively". Please share more of your deep insights. :roll:

[joeyjoejoe]

Wbrook was getting some freethrow love from refs and seemed to be allowed to be more physical getting rebounds while jumping into ppls backs, as ts goes it favours players with a lot of fts, Paul shot 5.5 threes a game at over %45, cp didn't need 15 fts when he had his 12/14 night in 28 min imagine if he did, and next game surprise surprise pauls in foul trouble give minutes into the game

[Graviton]

Wbrook was getting some freethrow love from refs and seemed to be allowed to be more physical getting rebounds while jumping into ppls backs, as ts goes it favours players with a lot of fts, Paul shot 5.5 threes a game at over %45, cp didn't need 15 fts when he had his 12/14 night in 28 min imagine if he did, and next game surprise surprise pauls in foul trouble give minutes into the game

Yea man these refs rigging everything, forget the fact Westbrook is the most athletic PG in the league and can blow by anyone and get in the paint vs slow 30+ year old midgets like Paul/Parker. Those free throws were all legit, more legit than Durant flailing for them from mid range, or Paul flopping for them from anywhere. :oldlol:

[joeyjoejoe]

Yea man these refs rigging everything, forget the fact Westbrook is the most athletic PG in the league and can blow by anyone and get in the paint vs slow 30+ year old midgets like Paul/Parker. Those free throws were all legit, more legit than Durant flailing for them from mid range, or Paul flopping for them from anywhere. :oldlol:

Legit as in the refs said so lol, okc got more bs calls that series then I've seen in years

[iamgine]

You have said "inconsistent defensively and offensively" like 5 times already and still did not bring up any actual evidence. :oldlol:

PER is at least better than just FG%. And it favors players who do it all, not just scorers, hence why Westbrook's is higher than Durant's genius.

You can use raw stats, the FACTS are in the playoffs Westbrook was 4th in scoring, 3rd in assists. 2nd in steals, led PGs in rebounding, free throws and PER. He also won games with defensive plays and hustle alone, on top of 3 triple doubles when nobody else had any.

But yea he is "inconsistent offensively and defensively". Please share more of your deep insights. :roll:
Well...watch the games?

Of course it means scoring is favored more heavily in PER, which is why Westbrook has better PER than Pippen ever did. You're not suggesting he's a better player right?

It is also fact that WB's shooting was a problem, rebounding isn't that important for a PG, and he was inconsistent offensively and defensively.

[Graviton]

Well...watch the games?

Of course it means scoring is favored more heavily in PER, which is why Westbrook has better PER than Pippen ever did. You're not suggesting he's a better player right?

It is also fact that WB's shooting was a problem, rebounding isn't that important for a PG, and he was inconsistent offensively and defensively.
Ok I am convinced you are a bot. :oldlol:

[Pointguard]

How was Westbrook not the best PG in 2014? Idk why regular season is so important when literally nobody tries hard, besides the guy trying to get MVP. Everyone just plays run n gun offense and lazy defense. Playoffs are when best players step up and pretenders get exposed, *cough* Harden, Curry.

I have a lot of respect for Paul but I keep saying this isn't 2008, Westbrook is basically 2011 Rose with better defense, rebounding and mental strength.

I guess you can say Paul is the "better PG" but Westbrook is the best player at PG position and probably the best guard in the NBA. :confusedshrug:

Mental strength??? What are you talking about?

Surely you aren't talking about focus? Or controlling the game? Or controlling the pace? Being a leader? Making the team play your game? Watching the turnovers? What do you mean?

The Clippers should have had the best record in the league with OKC being the only team putting up much of a challenge. But neither of them were up to the task. OKC's core has been together for four years? The biggest case against Westbrook is that after the team got adjusted to him not being there they started to win more than with him. That and missing a few games. When he did play he did look like the best PG in the game, I agree with you there. But he doesn't control the game at all. He's too wild. And he's not a great mix for Durant.

[Dr.J4ever]

John Wall over Tony Parker? WTF

Clearly, this formula trying to get the best PGs year by year is flawed, since winning basketball is not measured so much, but probably based more on stats.

[Gifted Mind]

Been extremely busy recently. Going to try and reply to some of these posts one by one in order of arrival.


You missed a lot of the point guard's main responsibilities:
Keeping the team on the same page,
leadership,
control of the game and pace,
getting the most out of his team,
being the engine of the team,
knowing how to compensate when players don't play,
rally the troops,
take over the game if he has to,
penetrate and cause chaos,
get to the rim,
secure the win,
And staying on the attack - being aggressive.

That means far more than being a better passer and rebounder. I notice you said some intangibles - without staying aggressive, which Paul has always had trouble sustaining, the intangibles don't mean much.

Much of what you said is very similar to one another and most of it applies to Chris Paul as well. I've always thought of Chris Paul as aggressive when he needs to be and has the ability to completely take over games. I've seen countless number of times Chris Paul taking the game into his own hands all the way to the finish and winning the game. Derrick Rose is a score-first PG while Chris Paul is a pass-first PG, thus Rose often may look more aggressive than Paul. You could call Rose more aggressive than PGs like Stockton or Nash but that doesn't make him better than them.




When Chris Paul is fully healthy Rose is better than him in most of those categories, and in 2011 Rose was doing better than 90% without a doubt. That should be a great team in Clipperland. And it should have been great the year before that.

Blake should have been a top three player the previous year, nevermind this year. When Chris Paul couldn't play guess who came out of their shell? DJ had a lot of promise before Chris got there. The sixth man of the year provided great shooting and super clutch shooting. Barnes and Reddick hitting threes. Collison as solid backup. That team is a PG's dream. Solid defensive players in DJ, Barnes and Collison.

Rose took a much younger, inexperienced team, much less talented team to the best record in the league and the conference finals. Paul's not doing that, has never done that. And the Bulls dominated the elite in the West that year. Rose handed OKC, Mavs and SA their heads when they really needed those games for playoff positioning.


There is no doubt that Chris Paul has had a great supporting cast in LA and there was also no doubt Rose had a great cast in Chicago. The players and the system in Chicago complemented Rose's game perfectly. Making it to the conference finals in the East and West are two separate tasks and really neither team over achieved. You also have to appreciate how Chris Paul has completely turned around two franchises.




Oh and you did mentioned Paul had better defense which is simply not true. Rose held all of the elite PG's in check. His team also had the best perimeter defense. Rose also held a healthy Wade as good as I ever seen anybody guard him ever. Different if Paul had something similar on his resume in his nine or ten year career but he doesn't. Paul was a more consistent defensive player over most of his career and got a lot of steals. The defensive scheme of Chicago was to close out on shooters and keep them out of the paint. Not one elite guard had a great game on Rose. Even Lebron and Dwight Howard did not fair as good as Rose in playing the elite at their position, despite there being two or three scoring centers!

Are you suggesting Rose is an all-time level defender? That is simply not true. He may have had stretches where he played great defense but as you said Chris Paul is much more consistent. He is very quick on defense and a constant threat all game with his ability to steal the ball. Furthermore, Rose played in front of one of the best defensive centers in the game and coach Thibodeau has an excellent system implemented on defense for the Bulls. Again in some situations and players Rose maybe the better defender, but overall Chris Paul is the better defensive PG due to the level of consistency he plays defense. There is a reason he has been All-Defensive 1st multiple seasons.



Derrick Rose was without a doubt an amazing PG. He was a great leader, humble, and a role model for many. This may have made him seem likable by many. But let's not let personal bias cloud our judgment. As I mentioned earlier, Chris Paul was a better passer, shooter, rebounder, and defender. He was simply better at the game of basketball. Rose may be more successful on a team that severely lacks scoring, however Chris Paul would be better on just about any other team. He is pass-first but still superb at scoring the basketball and with the game on the line he presents a dual threat to the opposing team which makes him very dangerous. We saw how the Miami Heat were able to shut down Rose. A similar defense would be very tough to stop Paul because he will either find a way to get his teammates going or get himself going. Reasons like this just make him better.

I do concede in 2011 Rose had the better season and is my pick for PG of the year.

[Gifted Mind]

How was Westbrook not the best PG in 2014? Idk why regular season is so important when literally nobody tries hard, besides the guy trying to get MVP. Everyone just plays run n gun offense and lazy defense. Playoffs are when best players step up and pretenders get exposed, *cough* Harden, Curry.

And we saw what a beast Westbrook was basically winning games on his own, with some amazing defensive plays and sheer will. The way he single handedly took games off Spurs on their own home court was something else. Never seen Parker dominated so hard that makes Pop go to a random scrub Corey Joseph.

I have a lot of respect for Paul but I keep saying this isn't 2008, Westbrook is basically 2011 Rose with better defense, rebounding and mental strength.

I guess you can say Paul is the "better PG" but Westbrook is the best player at PG position and probably the best guard in the NBA. :confusedshrug:

The main reason Westbrook wasn't even Top 3 is because he missed too many games. Almost half the season. Sure he was healthy in the playoffs, but would I take 46 games of Westbrook over 82 games of John Wall? Probably not. Maybe not for the Thunder, but often if your start misses this much time that is enough to take you out of the playoffs.

Healthy Westbrook would have an argument for best PG which you have made. But he was not healthy in 2014.

[Gifted Mind]

John Wall over Tony Parker? WTF

Clearly, this formula trying to get the best PGs year by year is flawed, since winning basketball is not measured so much, but probably based more on stats.

Tony Parker was hurt most of the year and overall just did not play as well as John Wall. He missed 14 games and averaged less than 30mpg. Sure, much of that may have been due to Popovich's coaching. But a lot of it also had to due with Tony Parker just being hurt a majority of the season. On the other side, John Wall played all 82 games and was effective throughout the season. Parker may be a better pure scorer, but John Wall was more effective elsewhere. And Parker was not scoring as well hurt in 2014 anyways.

There is no formula here and it is definitely not all about stats. It is about your play of basketball. And Tony Parker just did not do as much as John Wall this year.

[Doctor K]

Great thread :cheers:

will we ever see a Top 10 PGs ever from you?

[Gifted Mind]

Great thread :cheers:

will we ever see a Top 10 PGs ever from you?

Possibly. Most my threads have not been cross-year. This could be the place to start however after analyzing the top PGs from every single season in the NBA.

[Gifted Mind]

Great thread! Glad to see rondo mentioned
Thank you. Glad to see a player fan content with what I have written on this thread. It's impressive considering he played in one of the tougher era for PGs. There are some years in the NBA he would be the best PG in the league.

[Gifted Mind]

Yea I feel this era, if you're not a scoring PG you do not get too much press. Rondo is a pure PG, does everything a PG should do at a high level, except shoot the ball. I'm content, and come to the realization that he will not get the respect he deserves.
Yes he is a bit underrated. And surely a rare breed of PGs. Hopefully he comes back strong from his injury and can establish himself as a Top 3 PG again.

[Gifted Mind]

Also I think this will be my last "Year-by-Year" analysis thread. When I 1st made one on ISH (Best players year-by-year) it was sort of new and original. But now these type of threads seem more common and not as interesting to people. I will continue to do such analysis on my own, because what better way is there to say evaluate a certain position all-time than going through the position for each year in NBA history, but just not be releasing the analysis to ISH like I have before.

Nonetheless, open to other type of thread ideas.

[Nowitness]

Great thread, glad you gave respect to GP. That 1999-2000 season was crazy. Averaging something like 24/9/7/2.5 mixed with elite defense. I agree with pretty much all of these.

[Gifted Mind]

Great thread, glad you gave respect to GP. That 1999-2000 season was crazy. Averaging something like 24/9/7/2.5 mixed with elite defense. I agree with pretty much all of these.
Thank you. Yes from 96-00 was Gary Payton's era amongst PGs. He had a remarkable season in 2000 indeed.

[Pointguard]

Hey Gifted, I do want to say you put in work and do understand the game. A disagreement is that and only that. I respect your work.

Been extremely busy recently. Going to try and reply to some of these posts one by one in order of arrival.

Much of what you said is very similar to one another and most of it applies to Chris Paul as well. I've always thought of Chris Paul as aggressive when he needs to be and has the ability to completely take over games. I've seen countless number of times Chris Paul taking the game into his own hands all the way to the finish and winning the game. Derrick Rose is a score-first PG while Chris Paul is a pass-first PG, thus Rose often may look more aggressive than Paul. You could call Rose more aggressive than PGs like Stockton or Nash but that doesn't make him better than them.

Point guards go from playing chess, to aggression, to control, to counter moves all the time. I think Chris Paul does a good 12 things better at the point than Westbrook, and definitely most things. But once Westbrook got aggressive he was noticeable the better player in that series. The two good games from Paul were when he was very aggressive. So Yeah, that one quality means that much. So I wouldn't undersell it at all. It can trump all the many traits, qualities and elements of the game pretty easily. Westbrooks aggression discombobulated Paul.



There is no doubt that Chris Paul has had a great supporting cast in LA and there was also no doubt Rose had a great cast in Chicago. The players and the system in Chicago complemented Rose's game perfectly. Making it to the conference finals in the East and West are two separate tasks and really neither team over achieved. You also have to appreciate how Chris Paul has completely turned around two franchises.
Rose didn't have great finishers, shooters or creators. A scoring point guard needs space. Sorry that's not a compliment to most point guards much less scoring ones. Paul had the ideal situation last year for a point guard. Rose team could not break a trap in the post season.



Are you suggesting Rose is an all-time level defender? That is simply not true. He may have had stretches where he played great defense but as you said Chris Paul is much more consistent. He is very quick on defense and a constant threat all game with his ability to steal the ball. Furthermore, Rose played in front of one of the best defensive centers in the game and coach Thibodeau has an excellent system implemented on defense for the Bulls. Again in some situations and players Rose maybe the better defender, but overall Chris Paul is the better defensive PG due to the level of consistency he plays defense. There is a reason he has been All-Defensive 1st multiple seasons.
I never said Rose was an all time defender. But what he did is something Paul never did even when the point guard position was much weaker. Rose prepares defensively better than any point guard. He reads the scouting reports a lot better than anybody at the position because he makes it look too easy. The elite points shot horrible against him. He was also the only guard I ever seen shut down a healthy DWade like that. In 2011 he was simply a better defender than Paul. I think you are measuring over a career and not by that year.




He was simply better at the game of basketball. Rose may be more successful on a team that severely lacks scoring, however Chris Paul would be better on just about any other team. He is pass-first but still superb at scoring the basketball and with the game on the line he presents a dual threat to the opposing team which makes him very dangerous. We saw how the Miami Heat were able to shut down Rose. A similar defense would be very tough to stop Paul because he will either find a way to get his teammates going or get himself going. Reasons like this just make him better.
Rose was shut down because the offense could not systematically crack a trap. Paul was just on a team with great finishers, great shooters and stellar creators and they still under performed. Paul on a team that couldn't break a trap would be a complete disaster. And Paul is in his peak right now.

[Gifted Mind]

Hey Gifted, I do want to say you put in work and do understand the game. A disagreement is that and only that. I respect your work.
Thank you and likewise I respect your opinion



Point guards go from playing chess, to aggression, to control, to counter moves all the time. I think Chris Paul does a good 12 things better at the point than Westbrook, and definitely most things. But once Westbrook got aggressive he was noticeable the better player in that series. The two good games from Paul were when he was very aggressive. So Yeah, that one quality means that much. So I wouldn't undersell it at all. It can trump all the many traits, qualities and elements of the game pretty easily. Westbrooks aggression discombobulated Paul.

Such aggressive also has negative consequences. We have especially seen this with Westbrook. Turnovers, selfishness, and ill-advised shot attempts. As much as Westbrook's aggressiveness helps, it also hurts his team. That is actually one of the top complaints for Westbrook. I'm not advising against aggressiveness, it surely helps in situations, but it shouldn't be the deciding factor amongst PGs.



Rose didn't have great finishers, shooters or creators. A scoring point guard needs space. Sorry that's not a compliment to most point guards much less scoring ones. Paul had the ideal situation last year for a point guard. Rose team could not break a trap in the post season.

Granted Chris Paul had a wonderful roster last year, but as you mentioned in your post, we are talking about 2011. Aside from Belinelli playing 24mpg, Chris Paul really did not have other shooting threats.



I never said Rose was an all time defender. But what he did is something Paul never did even when the point guard position was much weaker. Rose prepares defensively better than any point guard. He reads the scouting reports a lot better than anybody at the position because he makes it look too easy. The elite points shot horrible against him. He was also the only guard I ever seen shut down a healthy DWade like that. In 2011 he was simply a better defender than Paul. I think you are measuring over a career and not by that year.


Fair point, it could be argued defensively there was not much difference between the 2 in 2011.



Rose was shut down because the offense could not systematically crack a trap. Paul was just on a team with great finishers, great shooters and stellar creators and they still under performed. Paul on a team that couldn't break a trap would be a complete disaster. And Paul is in his peak right now.

Again in his Hornet days Paul did not play on such loaded teams yet still was very effective.




I still think the comparison is very close. What makes this closer is the fact, although Paul was healthier in 2011 than 2010, he still was not 100% and played with a knee-brace quite some of the year. He was still relatively healthy and played 80 games while playing up to his full potential in the playoffs. The question remains, not knowing anything else about my team...would I take Chris Paul or Derrick Rose at PG on my team in 2011. Eh...

[joeyjoejoe]

I've very much enjoyed this thread so thanks, also as a big cp3 fan im glad you haven't let the hate affect your analysis although I do disagree on your 2011 top pg as I also believe it was rose but all that aside a good read

[IceMan2]

Also I think this will be my last "Year-by-Year" analysis thread. When I 1st made one on ISH (Best players year-by-year) it was sort of new and original. But now these type of threads seem more common and not as interesting to people. I will continue to do such analysis on my own, because what better way is there to say evaluate a certain position all-time than going through the position for each year in NBA history, but just not be releasing the analysis to ISH like I have before.

Nonetheless, open to other type of thread ideas.

:cry:

can you still PM me your year by year analysis, they are still a great read and provide good knowledge

[ArbitraryWater]

Also I think this will be my last "Year-by-Year" analysis thread. When I 1st made one on ISH (Best players year-by-year) it was sort of new and original. But now these type of threads seem more common and not as interesting to people. I will continue to do such analysis on my own, because what better way is there to say evaluate a certain position all-time than going through the position for each year in NBA history, but just not be releasing the analysis to ISH like I have before.

Nonetheless, open to other type of thread ideas.

When you do them anyway, might as well share them :cheers:

Still 4 positions left :D

[Gifted Mind]

:cry:

can you still PM me your year by year analysis, they are still a great read and provide good knowledge

Haha sure



When you do them anyway, might as well share them :cheers:

Still 4 positions left :D

True, but it does take some effort to get into a reader-friendly format like in this thread.

[Gifted Mind]

I'm also all ears for other thread ideas.

Again I was in the process (though not very far) of making a similar thread to this but with centers. Why am I a fan of this yearly positional analysis? The best way to judge a position all-time is to actually have gone through the position for each year in its existence. I still plan on doing similar analysis, whether or not I post such analysis on ISH.

I am curious though would a more interactive year-by-year analysis be more interesting? By interactive I mean go year-by-year, but one year at a time and have posters on ISH play a major role in the selections each year. Might attempt this.

Again open to opinions.

[joeyjoejoe]

I'd like to see one for power forwards should be some good debating

[magnax1]

I'd say Nash deserves 1st in 08 and 10. Almost unmatched passing and efficiency all time still at that point.

[joeyjoejoe]

I'd say Nash deserves 1st in 08 and 10. Almost unmatched passing and efficiency all time still at that point.

paul was also very efficient in 08 while averaging over 21 a game, he also lead the league in steals and assists along with about 4.5 rbg and was a close second in mvp voting

[ArbitraryWater]

I'm also all ears for other thread ideas.

Again I was in the process (though not very far) of making a similar thread to this but with centers. Why am I a fan of this yearly positional analysis? The best way to judge a position all-time is to actually have gone through the position for each year in its existence. I still plan on doing similar analysis, whether or not I post such analysis on ISH.

I am curious though would a more interactive year-by-year analysis be more interesting? By interactive I mean go year-by-year, but one year at a time and have posters on ISH play a major role in the selections each year. Might attempt this.

Again open to opinions.

I'm not sure ISH is ready for that.. Would have a lot of trolls interfering I guess.. But if you dont decide to post them here, please, PM me as well..

[Rocketswin2013]

Chris Paul not getting MVP in '08.. I'm fuming.

[Duggrr]

I'd like to see one for power forwards should be some good debating
This. I feel like Power Forwards would be great through the 90's and into now. There'd be a lot of fun bitching for sure, including me if Aldridge got disrespect

[ArbitraryWater]

This. I feel like Power Forwards would be great through the 90's and into now. There'd be a lot of fun bitching for sure, including me if Aldridge got disrespect

Well Aldridge wouldn't have been the best PF yet, any year..

But there'd sure as hell be a lot of bitching at the PF spot.

I feel Dirk was the best PF in 2006, 2007, 2009, 2010, 2011... arguably 2012 as well.

[Gifted Mind]

I'd like to see one for power forwards should be some good debating
Sure I may do PFs. Any position imo would be interesting. Power Forwards of course from the 90s and 00s: Battles between Barkley and Karl Malone, extending to the 00s between KG, Duncan, and Nowitzki. Shooting guards would also be interesting, starting from the 60s runner-up behind West Sam Jones or Greer? And then of course seeing the transition from Jordan to Kobe to Wade? Small Forwards has interesting history throughout, Baylor vs. Havlicek, then Barry, then Dr.J and Bird and so on. And of course Centers. Russell vs. Wilt, Kareem to Moses, and then of course the battles in the 90s between O'Neal, Ewing, Robinson, and Hakeem.

Any position including PGs has interesting history. I'm just not sure I am even done with PGs. Is the current list entirely accurate? Now that I have analyzed each single season for PGs in NBA history, shouldn't there be a summary of an all-time ranking of the greatest PGs based on my analysis?

I really don't know which way to go from here, if anywhere.

[ArbitraryWater]

Sure I may do PFs. Any position imo would be interesting. Power Forwards of course from the 90s and 00s: Battles between Barkley and Karl Malone, extending to the 00s between KG, Duncan, and Nowitzki. Shooting guards would also be interesting, starting from the 60s runner-up behind West Sam Jones or Greer? And then of course seeing the transition from Jordan to Kobe to Wade? Small Forwards has interesting history throughout, Baylor vs. Havlicek, then Barry, then Dr.J and Bird and so on. And of course Centers. Russell vs. Wilt, Kareem to Moses, and then of course the battles in the 90s between O'Neal, Ewing, Robinson, and Hakeem.

Any position including PGs has interesting history. I'm just not sure I am even done with PGs. Is the current list entirely accurate? Now that I have analyzed each single season for PGs in NBA history, shouldn't there be a summary of an all-time ranking of the greatest PGs based on my analysis?

I really don't know which way to go from here, if anywhere.

SG's would actually be pretty easy... Although, it would definitely spark come conversation from 06-13...

05 is Wade rather easily
06? 07? 08 Kobe.. 09-11? 11 and 12 should be Wade too IMO... 13 I guess Kobe again? Slightly because of the pathetic defense.

[joeyjoejoe]

I think the alltime ranking would be good but would need to be updated if including active players

[Gifted Mind]

I think the alltime ranking would be good but would need to be updated if including active players
I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Is there anything different in terms of updating than this thread?

[Gifted Mind]

I'm not sure ISH is ready for that.. Would have a lot of trolls interfering I guess.. But if you dont decide to post them here, please, PM me as well..

Haha possibly. Maybe I'll try a sort of different thread idea to try interactively with ISH. We'll see how it goes. I like to work chronically (So start at 1950), thus I may just be talking to myself for 10-40 years.

[ArbitraryWater]

Haha possibly. Maybe I'll try a sort of different thread idea to try interactively with ISH. We'll see how it goes. I like to work chronically (So start at 1950), thus I may just be talking to myself for 10-40 years.

lmfaooo yea

[Gifted Mind]

I'd say Nash deserves 1st in 08 and 10. Almost unmatched passing and efficiency all time still at that point.
He did have great seasons in 2008 and 2010, but was he actually a better player? What happened in 2009? Did he magically get worse and then better or did he just have a better season? I don't really buy the argument that 35 year old Nash was getting better/worse as a player as opposed to having a better/worse season. Generally, season have greater variety year to year than your actual skill set.

I did however award Nash with the best season in 2010 and was the PG of the year in my list. Chris Paul was very impressive in 2008, as a poster pointed out Top 2 in MVP voting and was a much superior scorer and defender while at least comparing on the playmaking end.

[Gifted Mind]

So after some debate (mostly with myself) I decided I am going to skip out on any cross-year analysis (Like Top 10 PGs of All-Time), and continue on this route and do a similar thread but based on Centers. The reason I am choosing Cs rather than SGs or PFs is because I had already initiated the C project based on popular request. I will admit however I am not very far. Judging based on how long it took me to complete this thread, we are talking most likely a summer 2015 release.

I am still debating if I want to post my results on ISH but I think I most likely will. If anyone has any suggestions or feedback on the format of these projects (eg. whether it's text format, images, or best vs. greatness, anything) please provide it.


PS: As I look closer at each position I must admit some of my initial rankings from the grand best players thread (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=102569) may change. This is good as it means the thread will become better and more accurate.

[Gifted Mind]

I still plan to at some point start an interactive project (something different, unique, and interesting) with ISH where I go 1 year a time with ISH (Starting from 1950) to fill history in. There are 2 very good ideas in mind and will at some point start a thread on ISH to find out what they are more interested in.

[ArbitraryWater]

I would love for OP to do the other positions (although SG would provoke some emotions in 2006-2007-2009-2010)

[Myth]

I would love for OP to do the other positions (although SG would provoke some emotions in 2006-2007-2009-2010)

I too want to see the other positions. Are there any threads about it from the OP?

[ArbitraryWater]

I too want to see the other positions. Are there any threads about it from the OP?

Nah... He still has the best player / best season / thread of champions / DPOTY threads...

He plans on doing C next as he posts here ^ (summer 2015), but he wasn't sure yet.

[Gifted Mind]

The 2015 debate should be interesting. One of the more competitive years at the PG position.

[Young X]

How did Magic not have the best season in 1990? He won MVP, led the Lakers to 63 wins and although they lost in the 2nd round he still had a dominant series. I know the Pistons won the championship but Magic still clearly had a more dominant season.

[Gifted Mind]

How did Magic not have the best season in 1990? He won MVP, led the Lakers to 63 wins and although they lost in the 2nd round he still had a dominant series. I know the Pistons won the championship but Magic still clearly had a more dominant season.

I completely agree with you that Magic had the best season amongst PGs in 1990. Here is what I wrote in my analysis


[QUOTE]Finally, Isiah Thomas is awarded a PG of the Year award. Quite frankly, he did not deserve it over Magic this season. He had a great year, having a fine regular season, leading his team to the championship, and winning Finals MVP. However, Magic Johnson still probably had a better overall season winning MVP and just flat out playing better basketball. But I chose Isiah this year, for the reason often we see MVP going to 1 player over another, he just deserved one by now. Magic

[Young X]

I completely agree with you that Magic had the best season amongst PGs in 1990. Here is what I wrote in my analysis




So there is really not much disagreement in terms of which player had the better season amongst us. But unlike 'best' player which is more of a hard classification, the best 'season' as I explained is sort of like which PG would have won the "PG of the Year" at the end and is more award based. It's sort of like how Karl Malone or Kobe won MVPs later in their careers, there was sort of a 'he should have one by now' trend going around. The same was the reason Isiah was given the honors this year, he had a good season, a great career, and just won the NBA championship, etc. Not taking anything away from Magic, his season was still spectacular and the best, but I think Isiah would have taken the "PG of the Year" honors with his 2nd ring that season.Cool. Didn't realize their was a "best PG" list along with "best season" at first. Good thread, I agree with most of your selections.

[ninephive]

Chris Paul has been the best point guard in the league 6 out of the past 7 seasons and hasn't made it past the 2nd round with a great supporting cast, 4 years for chemistry to develop with the core of the team (Griffin, Paul, Jordan), and a championship coach? Meanwhile, Parker is not only sweeping him in the playoffs, but getting multiple rounds deeper every season. A Parker-led team (in terms of scoring & assists for the regular season and playoffs) wins championships while a Paul-led team watches on TV. Something's wrong with this picture.

[CP343]

This is a great break down. Not sure how I didn't see it earlier.

[Doctor K]

Curry 2015! :rockon:

[Gifted Mind]

Quite a competitive year in the PG department this time around. While it's quite clear which PG had the greatest season, the best PG is more debatable.

Would be open to hearing any opinions before I update

[warriorfan]

Alpha Male Curry

[ArbitraryWater]

Best PG would be between Paul/Russ for me, I've noticed with Curry this guy can basically take off stretches for games, and then sure, he does nice work in the 4th and all, but there have been larger streches this finals where he didn't do too much and the team was up... even last night he was like 2 of 7 at one point and they were up 10. Russ carries a harder load, even WITH KD in 2014 he was their Nr.1 guy in the playoffs, statistically proven or not, he was attacking, hustling defensively, took the late bailout shots, was vocal... he was in a much tougher predicament this year, just couldn't close games out, fatiqued to end them because he was their sole offensive option, really... well, at least star wise. Opposite of Curry's surroundings.

Paul looked like the playoff's top player for 2 rounds, he did everything for that team, always engaged and was also great defensively, sadly refs stopped their game 7 comeback in HOU, or I see them have a great chance against GSW.

Curry also has an argument, they're the holy trinity of PG's, I just probably prefer CP3/Russ.

[chazzy]

Curry

[HOoopCityJones]

Curry

[dontgetchoked]

steph

[Fork]

Westbrook

[Young X]

I don't care if I sound like a homer. I still think CP3 was the best. He led his team to the #1 offense again and kept them in the playoff race when it looked like they were gonna slip when Blake got injured. Then he played at the same level in the playoffs like he always does.

None of his teams flaws had anything to do with him. They played at a ridiculous level offensively when he was on the court. Their problems were that they completely collapsed when he sat on the bench. Also they were mediocre on defense which had nothing to do with CP since LAC was ranked 2nd at defending opposing PG's.

Curry doesn't have to deal with this because he has a great bench that can still hold onto leads when he leaves the floor and plays with much better defenders/role players that can bail him out when he doesn't have it going. He can have bad games and still win against playoff competition which is a luxury that Paul never had. The Warriors actually played better offensively when he was on the bench in the playoffs.

Curry pretty much had a better overall season - winning MVP and a championship but I don't think he was better than Paul's all around game.

[FKAri]

CP3

Clippers are like the 90's Sonics

[Rocketswin2013]

Quite a competitive year in the PG department this time around. While it's quite clear which PG had the greatest season, the best PG is more debatable.

Would be open to hearing any opinions before I update
Chris Paul is a better player than Stephen Curry. He was even in the playoffs.

[PsychoBe]

I don't care if I sound like a homer. I still think CP3 was the best. He led his team to the #1 offense again and kept them in the playoff race when it looked like they were gonna slip when Blake got injured. Then he played at the same level in the playoffs like he always does.

None of his teams flaws had anything to do with him. They played at a ridiculous level offensively when he was on the court. Their problems were that they completely collapsed when he sat on the bench. Also they were mediocre on defense which had nothing to do with CP since LAC was ranked 2nd at defending opposing PG's.

Curry doesn't have to deal with this because he has a great bench that can still hold onto leads when he leaves the floor and plays with much better defenders/role players that can bail him out when he doesn't have it going. He can have bad games and still win against playoff competition which is a luxury that Paul never had. The Warriors actually played better offensively when he was on the bench in the playoffs.

Curry pretty much had a better overall season - winning MVP and a championship but I don't think he was better than Paul's all around game.

you are horrible stop it. what happened to paul during the epic meltdown at home against the rockets?

and you are retarded if you think curry wouldn't love to play with another superstar in blake griffin. you must be out of your cotton picking mind. yes curry's team had depth, but the starting core unit was not as good as paul's. at all. not even close. bogut was useless, barnes is too raw, klay gets assisted on like 60% of his shots and green literally can't do sh*t unless birdfed. when curry played with iggy, livingston, lee, and etc then he would really shine with the team.

just open your eyes cp3's reign of terror is over. give westbrook his team and they wouldn't have had that ridiculous meltdown. give curry that team and they definitely wouldn't have melted down either.

at some point you just have to accept that this is all cp3's fault. the only constant is him. because he is not a winner. now enjoy your first round ring while the rest of us discuss relevant pg's.

[Rocketswin2013]

you are horrible stop it. what happened to paul during the epic meltdown at home against the rockets?

and you are retarded if you think curry wouldn't love to play with another superstar in blake griffin. you must be out of your cotton picking mind. yes curry's team had depth, but the starting core unit was not as good as paul's. at all. not even close. bogut was useless, barnes is too raw, klay gets assisted on like 60% of his shots and green literally can't do sh*t unless birdfed. when curry played with iggy, livingston, lee, and etc then he would really shine with the team.

just open your eyes cp3's reign of terror is over. give westbrook his team and they wouldn't have had that ridiculous meltdown. give curry that team and they definitely wouldn't have melted down either.

at some point you just have to accept that this is all cp3's fault. the only constant is him. because he is not a winner. now enjoy your first round ring while the rest of us discuss relevant pg's.
Paul dominated game 7 vs Houston. He was best player on the court. And was fantastic in the game 6. The game 6 was luck shit. Curry also has a better roster than Paul. Not debatable. Griffin coasts in the regular season and runs out if gas in second halves BTW. Not reliable in the 4th. Paul, even when hobbled, backpacked Griffin in clutch situations.

[navy]

Curry. Although CP3 and Russ cant be ignored.

[PsychoBe]

Paul dominated game 7 vs Houston. He was best player on the court. And was fantastic in the game 6. The game 6 was luck shit. Curry also has a better roster than Paul. Not debatable. Griffin coasts in the regular season and runs out if gas in second halves BTW. Not reliable in the 4th. Paul, even when hobbled, backpacked Griffin in clutch situations.

no, he didn't. he had 26 points in 45 minutes, shot 9-20 from the field and 2-6 from three and had a +/- of -6.

in game 6, in the 4th quarter when the game mattered the most....the "best pg" in the league made an amazing....astonishing, truly legendary and hofer worthy 2 field goals :roll: :roll: :roll:

put curry with blake or westbrook with blake (someone who can stay relatively healthy) and it wouldn't have happened to them. cp3 has lot's of weapons, from griffen to jordan to reddick to crawford, the clippers when hot are literally the deepest team in the league bar none. i can't blame cp3 for doc's awful rotations but it is what it is. curry had to work with a prime andrew bogut in the finals while bran had a 30-10 mozgov.

[warriorfan]

no, he didn't. he had 26 points in 45 minutes, shot 9-20 from the field and 2-6 from three and had a +/- of -6.

in game 6, in the 4th quarter when the game mattered the most....the "best pg" in the league made an amazing....astonishing, truly legendary and hofer worthy 2 field goals :roll: :roll: :roll:

put curry with blake or westbrook with blake (someone who can stay relatively healthy) and it wouldn't have happened to them. cp3 has lot's of weapons, from griffen to jordan to reddick to crawford, the clippers when hot are literally the deepest team in the league bar none. i can't blame cp3 for doc's awful rotations but it is what it is. curry had to work with a prime andrew bogut in the finals while bran had a 30-10 mozgov.

Yeah, Imagine CP3 with Draymond Green in the pick n roll instead of Blake Griffin. :oldlol:

[SexSymbol]

2015 - easily curry.

[PsychoBe]

Yeah, Imagine CP3 with Draymond Green in the pick n roll instead of Blake Griffin. :oldlol:

cp3 stans would have a heart attack :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[tragicbronson]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLxob_c1x6M

[Legends66NBA7]

rest of us discuss relevant pg's.

Who are the relevant PG's today ?

[Rocketswin2013]

no, he didn't. he had 26 points in 45 minutes, shot 9-20 from the field and 2-6 from three and had a +/- of -6.

in game 6, in the 4th quarter when the game mattered the most....the "best pg" in the league made an amazing....astonishing, truly legendary and hofer worthy 2 field goals :roll: :roll: :roll:

put curry with blake or westbrook with blake (someone who can stay relatively healthy) and it wouldn't have happened to them. cp3 has lot's of weapons, from griffen to jordan to reddick to crawford, the clippers when hot are literally the deepest team in the league bar none. i can't blame cp3 for doc's awful rotations but it is what it is. curry had to work with a prime andrew bogut in the finals while bran had a 30-10 mozgov.
Are you saying Mozgov is better than Bogut? What the ****? :oldlol:


Also, like I said, Game 6 was just luck shit. Josh Smith going back to his season mean in 3's at that random last 6 mins portion of the quarter. Brewer got really hot, and Terry. What would Curry do to stop that stuff, or even Westbrook and his bad defense this year?

Paul had 26/10/5/4 on 57 TS% in that game 7. I watched, I rooted against him in that game and he nearly willed a great comeback in the 4th. Harden drew some fouls and it was done.

No-one but Griffin showed up at the end of that series and Griffin disappeared in two straight 4th quarters.

Saying Paul had lots of weapon is overstating things. Reddick bricked good look after look and Crawford is an awful chucker. Deandre Jordan isn't even a factor in offensive ly for large stretches, and if anything he's a liability on that end outside of few rebounds and spontaneous dunks.

[KiiiiNG]

westbrook's all around game easily has him better than curry

curry was invisible for over half of the finals. i can't ever let that go, and i'll never rate him as a top 5 player.

westbrook
paul
harden(he's a pg, get over it)
irving
curry

[Young X]

you are horrible stop it. what happened to paul during the epic meltdown at home against the rockets?

and you are retarded if you think curry wouldn't love to play with another superstar in blake griffin. you must be out of your cotton picking mind. yes curry's team had depth, but the starting core unit was not as good as paul's. at all. not even close. bogut was useless, barnes is too raw, klay gets assisted on like 60% of his shots and green literally can't do sh*t unless birdfed. when curry played with iggy, livingston, lee, and etc then he would really shine with the team.

just open your eyes cp3's reign of terror is over. give westbrook his team and they wouldn't have had that ridiculous meltdown. give curry that team and they definitely wouldn't have melted down either.

at some point you just have to accept that this is all cp3's fault. the only constant is him. because he is not a winner. now enjoy your first round ring while the rest of us discuss relevant pg's.CP was the only one on his team who did anything in that 4th quarter. He can't single handedly stop a team from scoring 40 points in a quarter, he can't stop Josh Smith from turning into Ray Allen, and he can't stop Griffin from going 0-5 from the field.

And no CP didn't have the better starting core especially when you factor in defense.

You haven't rebuttalled anything I've said. Just a bunch of bullshit speculations. I could easily bring up how Curry went 5-23 and struggled to score on Delevadova only to be bailed out by his team. I could easily say that CP would've also won a championship if he faced the competition that Curry did in these playoffs. Shit is just speculation at the end of the day.

And you can't talk about Paul not being a winner than praise Westbrook when he missed the playoffs in his 1st year leading a team (not saying it was his fault but you can't bring up Paul's team's shortcomings when WB hasn't done any better leading his team yet).

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

CP wasn't better than Curry. I'm a fan of both he and the Clips, and Steph is clearly the better player at this point.

Guy had one of the biggest meltdowns I've ever seen in Game 6 vs Houston. I'm still reeling.

[Graviton]

Curry gets double teamed at halfcourt, only other PG I seen get that kind of attention was Rose in 2012. That's what opens up the floor for Golden State and allows them to dominate. That kind of impact doesn't show up in any stats.

Paul rarely draws double teams because EVERYONE knows he is gonna pass regardless, that makes the job of the opposing defense much easier when you know exactly how he is gonna play every game. It's why his team struggles even when he has a great game, they let Paul do whatever and live with scrubs like Crawford, Barnes and Reddick shooting 3s. Being a pass first PG doesn't get you anywhere, they have no pressure.

Westbrook can go off and destroy a team for a game or two, but again he won't be getting double teamed at the 3 point line, especially not with Durant. He too has a predictable game focused on attacking the paint and breaking down the defense, getting free throws and scoring. Again, this allows the opposing defense to gameplan against him.

Now Curry, you can't gameplan against GOAT level shooting, all you can do is double team him and expect his teammates to vanish but as shown in these Finals you won't win 4 games out of 7 with that strategy. Curry's impact when he is on the floor is on another level, even if Paul/Westbrook are better overall players they can never have his unique ability.

Paul/Westbrook are the "best" PGs, but Curry is clearly the greater player on the court. :confusedshrug:

[Young X]

^ If Curry's impact is on another level then why didn't his team's offense perform at a higher level than Paul's team despite facing depleted competition? Do you mean that he's a more impactful defender?

The Warriors didn't play any better offensively than the Clippers in the playoffs, they won because they held teams to a 100.5 ORtg.

The Clippers on the other hand held teams to a 107.1 ORtg.

Does that difference have anything to do with Curry or is it because the Warriors had Iggy, Green, Bogut, Thompson, etc?

[warriorfan]

^ If Curry's impact is on another level than why didn't his team's offense perform at a higher level than Paul's team despite facing depleted competition? Do you mean that he's a more impactful defender?

The Warriors didn't play any better offensively than the Clippers in the playoffs, they won because they held teams to a 100.5 ORtg.

The Clippers on the other hand held teams to a 107.1 ORtg.

Does that difference have anything to do with Curry or is it because the Warriors had Iggy, Green, Bogut, Thompson, etc?


Look at Paul's teammates from an offensive perspective...way better than Curry.

Offensively
DeAndre > Broken down Bogut
Griffin >>> Draymond Green
Barnes = Barnes
Reddick = Klay Thompson


Curry would kill it on the Clippers. Could you imagine if it was Blake Griffin instead of Draymond Green getting all those wide open passes 18 feet out with a huge lane? He would dunk it every single time or hit the elbow shot. Griffin would make it impossible to do the half court trap on Curry and if they can't trap Curry at half court he is going to score 30+ on elite efficiency.

[Young X]

Look at Paul's teammates from an offensive perspective...way better than Curry.

Offensively
DeAndre > Broken down Bogut
Griffin >>> Draymond Green
Barnes = Barnes
Reddick = Klay Thompson


Curry would kill it on the Clippers. Could you imagine if it was Blake Griffin instead of Draymond Green getting all those wide open passes 18 feet out with a huge lane? He would dunk it every single time or hit the elbow shot. Griffin would make it impossible to do the half court trap on Curry and if they can't trap Curry at half court he is going to score 30+ on elite efficiency.Matt Barnes is HORRIBLE, you can't be serious thinking he's equal to Harrison Barnes. Look at Matt's numbers especially in the playoffs. It's a joke. He literally can't do anything besides finish plays. Everytime he tries to create something it's an automatic turnover.

And Klay is definitely better offensively than Redick. I don't think it really needs to be debated. Klay is an all star...hell he even started in the AS game over CP3 and Westbrook :lol

They both play with similar level teammates on offense but the Clippers were better offensively with Paul on the court in comparison to the Warriors with Curry on the court. Difference is the Warriors don't crumble when he sits on the bench and he plays with better defenders and role players.

[Gifted Mind]

Ok time for some updates, let's start out by announcing the PG of the Year, this is the easier one. Not necessarily the best PG, but the PG who had the greatest season...



2015

http://photo2.ask.fm/920/071/184/-249996991-1t0mf6j-196segi6kg6ho0p/preview/file.jpg

Stephen Curry


Runner-Up: C.Paul

Honorable Mention(s):


Stephen Curry completed one of the greatest seasons ever by a PG easily taking home the PG of the year honors. He was named the NBA MVP and won a championship this year. There was really no debatable at all which PG had the best season. Chris Paul, last year

[Gifted Mind]

Now as for best PG...

This was a very tough year to decide. Three main candidates, Paul, Westbrook, and Curry. I thought Paul, compared to 2014 Paul, was just as good. Which is saying a lot, for me his ability at PG is ideal and think he has been the best PG for the last 6 out of 7 years. He still was a great scorer at the PG position, the best playmaker in the league, and played tough defense. He was selfish and unselfish at the right times. No matter what team is around him, he would do what it takes to win, which is the most important thing to be called the

[Gifted Mind]

So with all that said the best PG is...




2015: S.Curry


2. C.Paul

3. R.Westbrook



A very very competitive year for PGs this year. After being called the 2nd best PG in the NBA last year, Steph Curry improved his game even more to surpass Chris Paul as the best PG in the NBA. His playmaking ability stayed about the same, but he became an even better scorer than ever before. He also improved on defense. Chris Paul remained about the same player as the season before but that was only good enough for #2. Westbrook was healthy again unlike the season before re-entering the Top 3, but stayed behind Paul, who just had a more team orientated winning style of play at PG than Westbrook.



OPs updated

[ArbitraryWater]

[QUOTE=Gifted Mind]Now as for best PG...

This was a very tough year to decide. Three main candidates, Paul, Westbrook, and Curry. I thought Paul, compared to 2014 Paul, was just as good. Which is saying a lot, for me his ability at PG is ideal and think he has been the best PG for the last 6 out of 7 years. He still was a great scorer at the PG position, the best playmaker in the league, and played tough defense. He was selfish and unselfish at the right times. No matter what team is around him, he would do what it takes to win, which is the most important thing to be called the