Who wins the World Cup? Brazil, Germany, Netherlands, or Argentina

[1987_Lakers]

I got Germany.

[Sakkreth]

I predicted exactly this final four with same matchups(as all of the teams won their groups), sticking with my prediction on Netherlands over Germany in finals.

[kc16]

I'm picking Germany but I can see anyone of these four winning the World Cup.

[Sakkreth]

I'm picking Germany but I can see anyone of these four winning the World Cup.

Yep, ultimate top 4 of the tournament. Brazil lost Neymar but playing at home.

[Bosnian Sajo]

I just hope Argentina loses.

[alenleomessi]

its surely up for grabs

bwin odds

germany 2.25
brazil, argentina 2.75
NL 3.25

[kc16]

Yep, ultimate top 4 of the tournament. Brazil lost Neymar but playing at home.
True but even without the home field advantage and the loss of Neymar and Silva, they still have a quality team to win the World Cup. This is going to be a fun and exciting semifinals that's for sure.

[TheMan]

I just hope Argentina loses.

:mad: My wife is from Argentina

I'm rooting for them but I think the Dutch finally break through for their first WC.

[Jasi]

Germany


However, if Argentina wins it all, one cannot leave out Messi from Top 4 alltime conversation anymore

[alenleomessi]

Germany


However, if Argentina wins it all, one cannot leave out Messi from Top 4 alltime conversation anymore
come on jasi

if he wins with the way argentina's been playing, pele will need to walk all the way from the stands to the pitch and kneel before him in the middle of maracana

[BasedTom]

Argentina vs Germany final

Germany wins in penalty kicks

[Jasi]

come on jasi

if he wins with the way argentina's been playing, pele will need to walk all the way from the stands to the pitch and kneel before him in the middle of maracana

You bit it ;)

Yeah I honestly mean GOAT conversation.
Still 27 by the way.

[brownmamba00]

Brazil or Holland

[raprap]

Would be great to see argentina vs brazil in the final.

[deja vu]

Germany are slight favorites in my opinion. Won't even be surprised if the Netherlands win it all.

[fsvr54]

Netherlands

Called it from the first stage

[zoom17]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BrzhLDnCUAAICVK.jpg

[MavsSuperFan]

no real underdogs to root for, and I am not personally invested in any team.

I would be ok with any team other than germany winning

[Ratnik]

Netherlands

[Gr]

no real underdogs to root for, and I am not personally invested in any team.

I would be ok with any team other than germany winning

:)

[dunksby]

Germany winning it all.

[dr.hee]

Germany winning it all.


:banana:

[Gr]

#WirF

[alenleomessi]

if you are neutral the germans are surely your best bet since all of the odds are pretty close.. they are by far the healthiest

no neymar, silva and probably willian for brazil
no dimaria, aguero for argentina
no de jong for netherlands

the best two players for brazil, best two players other than messi for argentina, a very important player for the netherlands..

[StephHamann]

and with reus our best players is missing the whole tournament

:coleman:

[dr.hee]

and with reus our best players is missing the whole tournament

:coleman:

Also

[Nick Young]

and with reus our best players is missing the whole tournament

:coleman:
Muller is your best player. One of the only guys on the team who has the old school German murder instinct.

[Gr]

[QUOTE=dr.hee]Also

[Gr]

Muller is your best player. One of the only guys on the team who has the old school German murder instinct.

:sleeping

[Booz Vivic]

WTF? Germany aint gone win shits. They did good getting this far from a group with Ghana and Portugal they were never supposed to qualify.

They will lose 4-0 to Brazil then win Netherlands in 3rd place play-offs.

Brazil gone win it in ET vs. Argentina.

[dr.hee]

[QUOTE=Gr

[BlazerRed]

Netherlands. Duh.

[kurple]

I predicted exactly this final four with same matchups(as all of the teams won their groups), sticking with my prediction on Netherlands over Germany in finals.
you predicted costa rica to win theirs group?

[kurple]

come on jasi

if he wins with the way argentina's been playing, pele will need to walk all the way from the stands to the pitch and kneel before him in the middle of maracana
di maria > messi this WC

winning a WC helps his case, but he isnt the GOAT yet

would still take Zidane over Messi any day of the week

[ArbitraryWater]

Oh shit, gotta put some huge money on germany

[Andrew Wiggins]

di maria > messi this WC


do you actually believe that or are you letting your biases get in the way?


would still take Zidane over Messi any day of the week

:roll:

[Marlo_Stanfield]

Muller is your best player. One of the only guys on the team who has the old school German murder instinct.
http://cdn.niketalk.com/2/2f/350x700px-LL-2ff5111e_michael-jordan-laughing.gif

[lakers_forever]

come on jasi

if he wins with the way argentina's been playing, pele will need to walk all the way from the stands to the pitch and kneel before him in the middle of maracana

A 19 year old Messi could not even start for his NT and lost the World Cup in 06.

Pele at 17 was winning the World CUp, scoring a hat trick in the semi-final and 2 goals in the final.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

do you actually believe that or are you letting your biases get in the way?



:roll:
what your dumb ass loving about??

[alenleomessi]

di maria > messi this WC

winning a WC helps his case, but he isnt the GOAT yet

would still take Zidane over Messi any day of the week
di maria has been VERY VERY inconsistent this WC..

zidane in 1998 had a much worse WC than messi right now up to the 1/2 final


why am i even replying though. you just went full retard

[Andrew Wiggins]

what your dumb ass loving about??

is that english? :roll:

[alenleomessi]

A 19 year old Messi could not even start for his NT and lost the World Cup in 06.

Pele at 17 was winning the World CUp, scoring a hat trick in the semi-final and 2 goals in the final.
pele wasnt a starter in the group stage either for brazil but the tournament was so talentless that even a 17yo kid could dominate.. michael owen at the age of 18 pretty much dominated the 1998 WC in a very tough era.. i wouldnt be surprised if he could do what pele did in the 60s.. and thats only michael owen..
every professional player can REALLY play football right now.. its not like in the 60s

anyway, messi was injured in 2006 and barely made the squad..

[lakers_forever]

pele wasnt a starter in the group stage either for brazil but the tournament was so talentless that even a 17yo kid could dominate.. michael owen at the age of 18 pretty much dominated the 1998 WC in a very tough era.. i wouldnt be surprised if he could do what pele did in the 60s.. and thats only michael owen..
every professional player can REALLY play football right now.. its not like in the 60s

anyway, messi was injured in 2006 and barely made the squad..

Yeah right. Michael Owen... :lol :lol And how the hell did Owen dominate the 1998 wc? Dude scored 2 goals and could not even reach the quarter final. :rolleyes:

Messi was not injured. He started against the Dutch and even scored one goal (his only one) against Serbia. He was not that great at 19, not enough to start for his NT. Pele at 19 was considered the best player in the world. The brazilian Ronaldo in the 90's was also better than Messi at 19 (Ronaldo was the best player in the world at 20).

[lakers_forever]

Messi is a genius. No one denies that. But to act like he would be the undisputed GOAT and that Pele would "need to walk all the way from the stands to the pitch and kneel before him in the middle of maracana" is insane. Pele's achievements are out of this world and most would still regard him as the greatest ever.

And most people who saw Pele, think he was the greatest, inclluding those among the very best players of all time like Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Di Stefano, Puskas, Zico and Platini:



- Johan Cruyff: "Pele was the only footballer who surpassed the boundaries of logic."

- Bobby Moore: "Pele was the most complete player I've ever seen, he had everything. Two good feet. Magic in the air. Quick. Powerful. Could beat people with skill. Could outrun people. Only 5ft 8in tall, yet he seemed a giant of an athlete on the pitch. Perfect balance and impossible vision. He was the greatest because he could do anything and everything on a football pitch. I remember Saldhana the coach being asked by a Brazilian journalist who was the best goalkeeper in his squad. He said Pele. The man could play in any position."

- Ferenc Puskas: "The greatest player in history was Di Stefano. I refuse to classify Pele as a player. He was above that."

-Sir Alex Ferguson: "Question: Best player you ever saw? -AF: Pel

[KingBeasley08]

^ Ok Jlauber... time to end this thread hijack


I'm hoping either Brazil or Argentina can end up winning but Germany will probably win

[knickballer]

A 19 year old Messi could not even start for his NT and lost the World Cup in 06.

Pele at 17 was winning the World CUp, scoring a hat trick in the semi-final and 2 goals in the final.

Yea, cause I remember that world cup in 1958 vividly while watching it from my beautiful 58 inch screen plasma TV oh wait... None of us have seen Pele play besides some youtube highlights and at this point he's probably became more of a urban legend of the past.

As far as I'm concerned Messi > Pele regardless is Messi crashes out this WC.

[Akrazotile]

Lets wait until Messi can pass prime Landon Donovan before we break out the Pele comparisons, hm?

[lakers_forever]

Yea, cause I remember that world cup in 1958 vividly while watching it from my beautiful 58 inch screen plasma TV oh wait... None of us have seen Pele play besides some youtube highlights and at this point he's probably became more of a urban legend of the past.

As far as I'm concerned Messi > Pele regardless is Messi crashes out this WC.

Actually I have seen several complete games of the 1958 World Cup. You can easily find it online.

And no, not some youtube highlights. I have seen dozens of Pele complete games. Urban legend from the past? :lol The World Cup from 1970 was broadcasted live all over the world.

[lakers_forever]

Messi's scoring numbers are insanse. But Pele's was even greater.


http://placar.abril.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/pele-messi-campeonatos.jpg


This brazilian magazine did that research in december of 2012. Comparing Pele to Messi at the same age.

Only counting official games:

Goal average from 58 to 65 - 3,41 per game
Pele's average - 1,28 per game - 38,4% of goals scored per game.

Goal average from 2004 to 2012 - 2,64 per game
Messi's average - 0,68 per game - 28,8% of goals scored per game.

As you can see, even when we adjust the numbers, comparing only the % of goals scored in the era, Pele still comes on top.

[RagaZ]

Messi has never scored in a World Cup Knock out match.

Those are the games where he needs to shine if he wants to be on the same level as Pele or Zidane.

[alenleomessi]

pele is very f*cking accomplished. no one denies that. but to act like the football in the 60s was the same as today.. thats pretty f*cking stupid.. brazil were so stacked during those years that pretty much anyone from their squad would have been a top 3 player for the rest of the nations.. they were winning games on talent alone.. pele wouldnt catch a breath in today's football.. im laughing at the thought of him going against a mou-led team.. 6'3 strong and well built defenders, fast and actually skilled

[Im Still Ballin]

Who cares?

Soccer ****ing sucks

[Overdrive]

pele is very f*cking accomplished. no one denies that. but to act like the football in the 60s was the same as today.. thats pretty f*cking stupid.. brazil were so stacked during those years that pretty much anyone from their squad would have been a top 3 player for the rest of the nations.. they were winning games on talent alone.. pele wouldnt catch a breath in today's football.. im laughing at the thought of him going against a mou-led team.. 6'3 strong and well built defenders, fast and actually skilled

So you're saying a 173cm guy head and shoulders above a squad that talented, would suck (comparably) today, because of bigger defenders and that's the reason Messi, 169cm, is better?

You know if the level of everyone was raised Pel

[dr.hee]

pele is very f*cking accomplished. no one denies that. but to act like the football in the 60s was the same as today.. thats pretty f*cking stupid.. brazil were so stacked during those years that pretty much anyone from their squad would have been a top 3 player for the rest of the nations.. they were winning games on talent alone.. pele wouldnt catch a breath in today's football.. im laughing at the thought of him going against a mou-led team.. 6'3 strong and well built defenders, fast and actually skilled

Why is it not acceptable to you that your favorite player might only be the 2nd best player of all time? Are you that insecure?

:oldlol:

[alenleomessi]

[QUOTE=Overdrive]So you're saying a 173cm guy head and shoulders above a squad that talented, would suck (comparably) today, because of bigger defenders and that's the reason Messi, 169cm, is better?

[B]You know if the level of everyone was raised Pel

[lakers_forever]

pele is very f*cking accomplished. no one denies that. but to act like the football in the 60s was the same as today.. thats pretty f*cking stupid.. brazil were so stacked during those years that pretty much anyone from their squad would have been a top 3 player for the rest of the nations.. they were winning games on talent alone.. pele wouldnt catch a breath in today's football.. im laughing at the thought of him going against a mou-led team.. 6'3 strong and well built defenders, fast and actually skilled

Sure. Like people in the future would laugh at how a 5'7 Messi could dominate football in the 2010's?

And funny you say that when Pele cleary and visibly physically stronger than Messi.

He could do this to Beckenbauer, I think he could cope against Belgium and Swiss defenders:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFGoVXtgNHc

Pele like any genius athlete trascends his own and could be great at any era. Consideret tat when Pele retired, Zico was already being named later in the same year the best player in Brazil. The same Zico who regarded by most as the best player in the world in the early 80's. And who was still a great player when guys like Romario (who dominated the 90's and was still a great player untill 2002) were already shining.

[Overdrive]

no i dont no one does

So you say Pel

[lakers_forever]

[QUOTE=Overdrive]So you're saying a 173cm guy head and shoulders above a squad that talented, would suck (comparably) today, because of bigger defenders and that's the reason Messi, 169cm, is better?

You know if the level of everyone was raised Pel

[lakers_forever]

no i dont no one does

Football changed a lot from 1958 to 1970 and Pele remained the best in the world. That's a pretty big sign that he could adapt.

[RagaZ]

They kicked Pele all the time.

We dont see teams kicking Messi today. Chelsea in 06' under Mourinho only team i recall who did it.

Watch 0:05, 0:15, 1:30:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OtnR06Z3EY

[ArbitraryWater]

Cristiano Ronaldo is the GOAT...

Damn, I thought we went through this already?

Messi didn't even have a better season than Neymar or Valdez with Barcelona :facepalm

He was their 3rd most important figure

This isn't some bullshit, you had Barcelona fans mad at Messi throughout the whole year... Of course american peeps who never cared like moe wouldn't know shit

http://i.gyazo.com/5e845b76980c1ab74ac7deffac36bd83.png

Ronaldo had thoroughly outplayed him the whole year, but now the World Cup comes around, and we get these casuals coming in saying "Messi > Ronaldo doe" "Messi is by far the best" Ughhhh ok

[alenleomessi]

They kicked Pele all the time.

We dont see teams kicking Messi today. Chelsea in 06' under Mourinho only team i recall who did it.

Watch 0:05, 0:15, 1:30:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OtnR06Z3EY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0gS5CshUDE

[alenleomessi]

[QUOTE=Overdrive]So you say Pel

[lakers_forever]

They kicked Pele all the time.

We dont see teams kicking Messi today. Chelsea in 06' under Mourinho only team i recall who did it.

Watch 0:05, 0:15, 1:30:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OtnR06Z3EY

Yep. And notice that after he got injured in the 2:05 mark, he could not even run and anymore started to use only his left foot (he main foot was the right one) and did some pretty passes... :bowdown:

[Overdrive]

Cristiano Ronaldo is the GOAT...

Damn, I thought we went through this already?

Messi didn't even have a better season than Neymar or Valdez with Barcelona :facepalm

He was their 3rd most important figure

This isn't some bullshit, you had Barcelona fans mad at Messi throughout the whole year... Of course american peeps who never cared like moe wouldn't know shit

http://i.gyazo.com/5e845b76980c1ab74ac7deffac36bd83.png

Ronaldo had thoroughly outplayed him the whole year, but now the World Cup comes around, and we get these casuals coming in saying "Messi > Ronaldo doe" "Messi is by far the best" Ughhhh ok

Ronaldo surely played better, but Barca is on the verge of a rebuild with Messi being the guy clueing young and old guys. Real just keeps buying players for surreal amounts of money every year.

PS.: I don't like either player, but saying CR is goat, because this season was better is absurd. CR just won his 2nd UCL and he wasn't even that crucial as a player of his caliber should be. Not his fault, Real's offense is stacked to the max, but still if he's that better than his pears he should outshine them against CL teams. Levante, Osasuna etc are no benchmarks for greatness.

[Overdrive]

well thats more complicated that it seems.. pele could be another freddy adu for all we know(given today's hype, social media and stuff and im not sure about the HGH history ( i think athletes started using it in 80s) so in the 60s messi could have been too short to play.. im hurting my argument here but it is what it is

Is there a trustworthy source for Messi's projected height?

[Im Still Ballin]

LOL at anyone who wastes their time on this ping pong sport. Garbage.

[Andrei89]

Nobody discusses how weak CONCACAF region is? Beyond terrible :applause:

[KingBeasley08]

Did someone just CR7 is the GOAT?? Dude isn't even the best player named Ronaldo ever :lol

[Andrew Wiggins]

Nobody discusses how weak CONCACAF region is? Beyond terrible :applause:

why concacaf? asia didn't win a SINGLE game and africa only advanced one team to the second round

no on expected costa rica to the make the quarterfinals and most expected usa and mexico to not advance. successful tournament for that region

[Akrazotile]

why concacaf? asia didn't win a SINGLE game and africa only advanced one team to the second round

no on expected costa rica to the make the quarterfinals and most expected usa and mexico to not advance. successful tournament for that region


USA gonna win it all next year :rockon:

[Uncle Drew]

USA gonna win it all next year :rockon:
What's there to win next year? Gold Cup or something?

[RagaZ]

What's there to win next year? Gold Cup or something?
Do you prefer to lose vs Argentina or be 0 for 4 in Finals?

[Andrei89]

Do you prefer to lose vs Argentina or be 0 for 4 in Finals?


Shut up England fan.

Your team is absolute shit and is beyond terrible throughout history.

[Uncle Drew]

Do you prefer to lose vs Argentina or be 0 for 4 in Finals?
I'd prefer my team to get out of the group stage.

[Gr]

The referees are the reason England isn't 0-1 in finals.

[RagaZ]

I'd prefer my team to get out of the group stage.
Like 2 years ago?

[Im Still Ballin]

Soccer
:oldlol:

[Uncle Drew]

Like 2 years ago?
Exactly. Rather go out early, than winning it all with major home cooking.

[Gr]

Like 2 years ago?

England has only been to 1 final and that was with home advantage and then they won because the referee gifted them 2 goals.

That game wasn't even the worst though. The England vs Portugal semi final in that world cup is one of the most rigged matches ever.

:roll:

[RagaZ]

[QUOTE=Gr

[Akrazotile]

What's there to win next year? Gold Cup or something?


I was bein satirical-like :cletus:

[Gr]

Germany are 0 for 1.

Not our fault England is too garbage to give us a chance to revenge that rigged game in a world cup final. :confusedshrug:

[The_Yearning]

Pele ain't shit.

Dude isn't even charismatic. All his interviews and commercials sucks.

[Mr.Kite]

Brazil shouldn't win jack. No Neymar and Silva is a wuss. the captain asking to be last to shoot a penalty kick

That's bran level shit right there.

The way Robben played against Mexico and costa rica, he should win the golden foot.

[Shade8780]

I'm gonna stick with my prediction at the start of the tournament, and say Argentina.

[Gr]

I'm gonna stick with my prediction at the start of the tournament, and say Argentina.

I hope that sour grapes brigade doesn't win the world cup. Watch them start a fight when they lose.

[RagaZ]

[QUOTE=Gr

[J.101]

Just wanna see more close games and see who steps up in the clutch. Have a feeling it'll be a Netherlands/Germany final.

[alenleomessi]

hopefully at least one of the next 3 matches is epic and memorable

[Gr]

hopefully at least one of the next 3 matches is epic and memorable

Germany beats Argentina on penalties. Argentinian sour grapes start another fight.

Memorable enough.

[b1imtf]

hopefully at least one of the next 3 matches is epic and memorable
All of them will be. I hope.

[alenleomessi]

[QUOTE=Gr

[RagaZ]

im thinking more like
- the germans lead 2-0 and dominate like in 2010, neuer provokes messi after couple of saves, he gets angry and scores a hatrick in the last 20 minutes.. the germans start crying like the little fakkits they are, merkel gets a heart attack
The sad thing is that the Germans would it if that happened.

[StephHamann]

The sad thing is that the Germans would it if that happened.

i would celebrate ****ing merkel bitch

[Gr]

im thinking more like
- the germans lead 2-0 and dominate like in 2010, neuer provokes messi after couple of saves, he gets angry and scores a hatrick in the last 20 minutes.. the germans start crying like the little fakkits they are, merkel gets a heart attack

We should start Mertesacker again to shut Messi down like in 2010.

[alenleomessi]

[QUOTE=Gr

[Gr]

yeah good idea.. start him over hummels and put lahm back in the midfield while you are at it

Lahm--Mertesacker aka Messi's daddy--Hummels--Boateng

[B-hoop]

Messi's scoring numbers are insanse. But Pele's was even greater.


http://placar.abril.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/pele-messi-campeonatos.jpg


This brazilian magazine did that research in december of 2012. Comparing Pele to Messi at the same age.

Only counting official games:

Goal average from 58 to 65 - 3,41 per game
Pele's average - 1,28 per game - 38,4% of goals scored per game.

Goal average from 2004 to 2012 - 2,64 per game
Messi's average - 0,68 per game - 28,8% of goals scored per game.

As you can see, even when we adjust the numbers, comparing only the % of goals scored in the era, Pele still comes on top.

:bowdown: :bowdown:

The man is the GOAT, hands down.

[Lamar Doom]

I see German vs Argentina final with the krauts winning.